Since he retired, he purchased a boat (50 foot Hatteras convertible)
and went to see the DEP about getting the required Boating Operation
Certificate. He took all his Master's documents down to DEP HQ in
Lyme, CT and was refused - he has to take a boating course.
So I looked it up. As silly as this is, here is the official
statement on previous experience.
13 - I have a valid Coast Guard Operating License. Do I need the Safe
Boating Certificate to operate my boat?
If you have a current master, mate, or pilot license issued through
the Coast Guard, you do not need the Connecticut Safe Boating
Certificate to operate your boat. You must keep the valid license with
you at all times. You cannot use the valid Coast Guard License to
obtain your Connecticut Safe Boating Certificate. You would have to
take a boating course or provide us with proof that you have taken an
approved boating course to obtain a safe boating certificate.
Now I ask you - does that seem even reasonable? He doesn't want to
keep his documents with him at all times - not when a small, wallet
sized card is available from the state.
"The 'ol man says I can't drive the car untill I learn to drive, so's
hows I supposed to learn to drive the 'ol mans car unless he lets me
Sounds like the State of CT wants its various assorted fees for taking
the test, issuing the documents, etc...
It also sounds like he could be teaching the course.
When I was merchant marine, the CG issued a laminated ID much like my
military ID. Had my rating (Fireman/Watertender) on the card. Still
have it buried in a drawer somewhere.
Seems they would issue the same for a master, mate or pilot, but maybe
they don't - then or now.
Charlie, I really don't think there's "crying" going on, but rather
laughing at the irony of the whole scenerio.
Here's a guy that is licensed to command major tonnage, but yet will
be requiered to take a safety course to pilot a boat that could
probably fit in the tankers galley.
i won't disagree. You could have a point.
> Big deal. Stop crying and do what you have to do. This is not worth
> about. If you can't deal with this minor thing, then you probably are NOT
> equipped to handle a boat safely.
Brilliant logic, and proof that special education is well worth the
Dear Governor Rell:
You are cordially invited to the next monthly meeting of the Deep Mud
Sportsman's Club. Each year, we choose a state law that we know to be
absurd, and pick a high ranking official to be lampooned in the press, many
members of which will be present at this gala event. We'll be discussing the
plight of a guy who, for the past 20 years has piloted ships half the size
of Fishers Island, but has to take a silly test to operate a 10 foot sailing
dinghy. Perhaps you'd like to attend! Bring a dish to pass. Dress is casual.
Billy Bob Stickbait
>Here's a guy that is licensed to command major tonnage, but yet will
>be requiered to take a safety course to pilot a boat that could
>probably fit in the tankers galley.
Let's just say that the reasoning is...well, arcane.
Plus it seems that while he's qualified to teach the class or a
USPS/USCG class without additional qualifications, he still need to
have taken either course or the State 8 hour course to qualify for the
CT now offers a special endorsement to the Operater's Certificate
denoting that you can actually navigate with paper charts and such.
Minor thing actually, but I was curious if I qualified based on my
Turns out I don't - I have to take the course that I taught for three
years as a state instructor to qualify for the certificate or take the
USPS/USCG navigation course which is about three levels below my
Put another way, I can teach the course, but I don't qualify for the
certificate sticker unless I take the course and pass.
Don't you just love bureaucrats?
***** Hope your day is better than decent! *****
Had the same thing happen when trying to register a motorcycle at Fort
Belvoir. I had a Motorcycle Safety Foundation (MSF) instructor's card, but
to register the bike I had to have either the basic rider's course or
advanced rider's course card. Both are well below the instructor level.
MA has a pretty good rule regarding new motorcycle license applicants. If
you successfully complete an approved course of instruction the registry
waives the requirements of a formal road test and issues the motorcycle
endorsement. My son did this a couple of years ago and although I've had a
motorcycle endorsement for many years (obtained the old fashioned way), I
decided to take the course with him, just for the fun of it. It was very
worthwhile and I'd recommend it to even the most seasoned of riders.
>Don't you just love bureaucrats?
To understand the reasoning you have to remember that it's all about
Charlie Morgan wrote:
I'd recommend the MSF course to anyone who hasn't taken it. I took it with
my wife after many years of riding, and it *was* worthwhile.
Virginia DMV had a rep there for the last day, and he issued the motorcycle
endorsement to all the students who completed the course.
The CT law gives him a choice: He can carry his mater's certificate
with him or sit the exam and carry a card. He's exempt from carrying a
card as long as he carries his certificate. Sounds like the choice he
wants to make is "neither".
The law recognizes that as a master mariner he needn't demonstrate his
basic competency to operate a boat. Fine. But here's the problem;
suppose he gets stopped for inspection?
"Trust me officer, I really am a licensed master, unlimited tonnage,
and I don't need to carry a state card. Prove it? Why should I have to
prove it? Shouldn't my word be sufficient?"
What about the 200 other guys who use the same line, but are simply
The enforcement officer won't really know who's on the level.
Earning the merchant document exempts him from complying with the law
requiring him to take the test, but only if he carries the document
instead of a card.
Doesn't seem entirely unreasonable to me.
> Had the same thing happen when trying to register a motorcycle at Fort
> Belvoir. I had a Motorcycle Safety Foundation (MSF) instructor's card, but
> to register the bike I had to have either the basic rider's course or
> advanced rider's course card. Both are well below the instructor level.
> ***** Hope your day is better than decent! *****
> John H
Yeah but...when did you get that instructor's card... 1948 ??
If they are going to do the task that is being tested for, then I'd
BTW, not all Canadians share your unwillingness to read.
Yeah..right! Quote someone from Calgary which prides itself on being a
Alberta's premier once said 'Let the the Eastern bastards freeze in the
dark' when complaining about selling some of his oil below market value for
the good of the country.
Why should anyone sell their product below market value? If someone in
Newfoundland wanted to buy your boat below market value would you sell
it to them? They would appreciate it. My guess is you would tell them
to let the bastards die dry. grin
I quoted no one. I simply pointed out that *some* Canadians read...before
calling something 'lies'.
> Take the advanced rider course given at Americade. You'll be glad you did.
> Americade itself is a hoot.
Do you remember the older, rust orange colored Softail I had in Florida?
It's the one I used when we went for the ride out through sugar cane
country. Anyway, my son Steven has that bike now. Still looks like new.
I've been eyeballing the new Ultra Classics but I think I'll stick to the
one I have. Time for new tires though.
I still carry a motorcycle endorsement I received on after passing the road
test on my Honda 50 at age 16. My last drive was on a Kawasaki
750...............a fast machine.
>I still carry a motorcycle endorsement I received on after passing the road
>test on my Honda 50 at age 16. My last drive was on a Kawasaki
>750...............a fast machine
I can go you one better.
I have the motorcycle endorsement on my driver's license and I've
never owned a motorcycle in my life.
Never actually driven one either.
I give...........how did you do it?
I didn't. The DMV did.
When we moved from MA to CT, I applied, got my picture taken and
received a license with my (at the time) Class One with motorcycle
It's just followed me through every renewal. :>)
I guess the real point here is that if all he has to do is carry his current
documents in the boat, he should be able to bring those same documents in,
to get the ID card. He should probably still pay the testing fee, but that
should be it.
I agree with Tom, it's just silly.
"Chuck Gould" <chuckgou...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>I guess the real point here is that if all he has to do is carry his current
>documents in the boat, he should be able to bring those same documents in,
>to get the ID card. He should probably still pay the testing fee, but that
>should be it.
>I agree with Tom, it's just silly
Additionally, if you get stopped for whatever reason - say a safety
inspection - and they ask for your operater's card, you show them
Master's documents, expect to get the third degree and the most nit
picking safety inspection you could imagine.
It's happened to me - twice - once in RI and once in CT, once on the
second Contender and once on the Ranger.
I don't carry the Master's license anymore when I'm out unless I have
a client aboard.
Yes, everyone has to be treated the same and the lowest common denominator
in our society are idiots. So we all have to be treated like idiots. Makes
life interesting being treated like an idiot by your own government. IT
become more interesting when government employees are idiots too. They
can't be discriminated against and have to be fairly treated in hiring
I'm not talking IQ here just common sense.
IMO, common sense would dictate that when special conditions, such as
holding a master's license, exempt one from following a general
regulation in a specific jurisdiction it isn't unreasonable for the
person taking advantage of the exception to be prepared to document
I'll bet a dollar vs. a donut......(wait, aren't donuts more than $1
that the wallet card would be perfectly adequate "documentation". It
certainly is in WA.