Is there a combo ham/marine 2m rig?
PGSPersEng
(handy talkie) that handles the ham 2m FM band as well as the popular
marine frequencies.
If such a standard rig doesn't exist, have any of you modified a standard
set to accomplish this?
Thanks,
Paul Schreier, the Sea-Q (Portland, ME)
Craig Haggart, Accelerator Ops
> Is there a combo ham/marine 2m rig?...I'd like to have an HT
> (handy talkie) that handles the ham 2m FM band as well as the
> popular marine frequencies...If such a standard rig doesn't
> exist, have any of you modified a standard set to accomplish
> this?
I don't know if there is a commercially-available unit, but I can
assure you that at least one radio, the Icom 2SAT (tiny HT), can be
modified so that it receives all frequencies from 100 to 200mHz and
transmits in the marine VHF band as well as the ham 2M band.
This post is for informational purposes only. The ICOM 2SAT is not
FCC type-certified for marine broadcast, and if you *were* able to
find an Icom technician who would modify that radio for $100,
transmitting on marine VHF with a non-type-certified radio could only
be done in an emergency.
-Craig Haggart, KC6VHO
hag...@slac.stanford.edu
Lee Mairs
>
> Does such a thing exist? Which manufacturers? I'd like to have an HT
> (handy talkie) that handles the ham 2m FM band as well as the popular
> marine frequencies.
>
to use them thusly except in an emergency.
Captain Lee
Wallace Venable
>Subject: Re: Is there a combo ham/marine 2m rig?
>Paul Schreier (pgspe...@aol.com) asked:
> > Is there a combo ham/marine 2m rig?...I'd like to have an HT
> > (handy talkie) that handles the ham 2m FM band as well as the
> > popular marine frequencies...
>I don't know if there is a commercially-available unit, but I can
>assure you that at least one radio, the Icom 2SAT (tiny HT), can be
>modified so that it receives all frequencies from 100 to 200mHz and
>transmits in the marine VHF band as well as the ham 2M band.
>This post is for informational purposes only. The ICOM 2SAT is not
>FCC type-certified for marine broadcast, and if you *were* able to
>find an Icom technician who would modify that radio for $100,
>transmitting on marine VHF with a non-type-certified radio could only
>be done in an emergency.
And, technically, the Coast Guard (or other authority) might subject
you to several thousand dollars in "administrative penalties" if you were
caught with one, particularly if unlicensed. (in EITHER band)
BUY TWO RADIOS, get both licenses. That will give you twice the
chance that one will actually work.
Rod Mc Innis
It would be possible to get a ham radio modified to cover the marine band
for receive, however the performance might suffer. You would be
pushing the limits of the broadband circuits, unless they could be
retuned.
Getting simultaneous coverage of the marine and ham bands would be next
to impossible for a radio that wasn't designed that way in the first
place. Getting general coverage from 144 Mhz (the bottom of the ham 2
meter band) to 162 Mhz (the top ship recieve frequency) would be pushing
the limits of the tuned circuits.
Operating a transmittor that has been modified on the Marine bands would
be illegal. I doubt that the radio manufacturers will create such a
thing, as there are several key features that are different between the
two:
1) Frequency selection: Marine frequencies are "channelized" where the
ham bands are not.
2) Duplex splits: The standard ham split on a duplex frequency is 600
Khz. For Marine, is not constant, but seems to be around 4.5 Mhz. You
might find it a little hard to keep the splits straight on the marine
bands.
3) Controls: A handheld radio has limited control space. You would need
to have a set of Marine band controls and a different set of ham band
controls.
I doubt that you will ever see a radio as described. You would be much
better off going out and buying two different radios.
Rod McInnis
Douglas Vann
for out of band operation. Since these rigs would not be type approved,
they are not legal for use on Marine VHF frequencies.
Many of us in Hawaii us legitimate 2m ham radios for staying in touch
with each other while sailing interisland. We have an excellent
selection of repeaters, including
one set which is linked to allow communication throughout the main island
chain. Using the repeaters gives us excellent coverage well beyond the
best possible marine VHF, which is limited by line of sight. There is a
repeater on Haleakala that really has extended coverage--easily in excess
of 100 miles. Some of us have also have success with transmitting 2m
(144-148 MHz) through commercial marine VHF (156-158 and up MHz)
antennas since the wavelengths can be acceptably close. I highly suggest
careful testing and measurement of SWRs before doing this, however.
Surprisingly, I get good coverage using the Haleakala repeater and a
rubber duck antenna on my Alinco 580T.
BTW--since the ham VHF and UHF voice priviledges are now available without
code requirements, it is relatively easy to get the necessary ham license.
Doug
Brian Gilhuly VE3BGB
>
> In article <1995Jan21.121935.1@ssrl01> hag...@ssrl01.slac.stanford.edu (Craig Haggart, Accelerator Ops) writes:
> >Subject: Re: Is there a combo ham/marine 2m rig?
>
> >Paul Schreier (pgspe...@aol.com) asked:
>
> > > Is there a combo ham/marine 2m rig?...I'd like to have an HT
> > > (handy talkie) that handles the ham 2m FM band as well as the
> > > popular marine frequencies...
>
> And, technically, the Coast Guard (or other authority) might subject
> you to several thousand dollars in "administrative penalties" if you were
> caught with one, particularly if unlicensed. (in EITHER band)
> BUY TWO RADIOS, get both licenses. That will give you twice the
> chance that one will actually work.
Well, yeah but...
I agree that the simple answer to Paul's question is "no". But there
OUGHT to be such a dual-bander on the market and I for one think there
are enough ham boaters (amateur yachtpersons?) to make it worthwhile.
All of the major manufacturers in Japan (Icom, Standard, Kenwood, etc>)
sell type-approved marine HTs as well as a variety of dual- and multi-
band ham HTs. I think the market would support a low-volume variant
for the doubly-licenced. After all, it would say "marine" so they could
charge the big bucks. :-)
I'd buy one.
Brian
Rod Mc Innis
>Well, yeah but...
>
>I agree that the simple answer to Paul's question is "no". But there
>OUGHT to be such a dual-bander on the market and I for one think there
>are enough ham boaters (amateur yachtpersons?) to make it worthwhile.
>
>All of the major manufacturers in Japan (Icom, Standard, Kenwood, etc>)
>sell type-approved marine HTs as well as a variety of dual- and multi-
>band ham HTs. I think the market would support a low-volume variant
>for the doubly-licenced. After all, it would say "marine" so they could
>charge the big bucks. :-)
>
>I'd buy one.
>
>Brian
>
>
Have you compared the price of a "marine" VHF radio versus a comparable
"ham" radio? I think I would rather have the "marine" lable than the
"ham" or "comercial" lable.
We may get gouged when it comes to motor parts, but we are getting off
easy with electronics.
Rod McInnis
Wallace Venable
>Subject: Re: Is there a combo ham/marine 2m rig?
*>VEN...@coe.wvu.edu (Wallace Venable) wrote:
>>
>> In article <1995Jan21.121935.1@ssrl01> hag...@ssrl01.slac.stanford.edu (Craig Haggart, Accelerator Ops) writes:
>> >Subject: Re: Is there a combo ham/marine 2m rig?
>>
*> BUY TWO RADIOS, get both licenses. That will give you twice the
*> chance that one will actually work.
>I agree that the simple answer to Paul's question is "no". But there
>OUGHT to be such a dual-bander on the market and I for one think there
>are enough ham boaters (amateur yachtpersons?) to make it worthwhile.
>After all, it would say "marine" so they could charge the big bucks. :-)
My 2 meter ham HH cost twice what my marine HH now sells for.
My generaly inpression is that "cheap" ham gear costs what "good"
marine gear does. Of course, I also get the impression that the ham gear
has features equal or exceeding marine gear of the same price.
In other words, I don't think we pay a premium for "marine"
electronics. (On the other hand, price AIRCRAFT radios!!!!)
Terry Lisansky
>>OUGHT to be such a dual-bander on the market and I for one think there
>>are enough ham boaters (amateur yachtpersons?) to make it worthwhile.
problem of having to amplify two different frequency ranges. While many
2 meter tranceivers receive both bands, it's a little more difficult to
transmit them. Usually an amplifier works in a pretty narrow range to be
most efficient. While not out of the question, I think using one amp
with two different bands would be difficult without some method of tuning it.
Either automatic (expensive) or manual (difficult without instruments).
My daul-band ham radio has two amps, which makes it more expensive.
The other problem in antennas. The frequency range is too great for
one antenna to be efficient. You could tune it to be most efficient
between both bands, at the expence of not working very well on either.
Of course you could have two antennas with a switch between them.
I hope I made it clear that it's really an electronics and physics
problem to overcome, not to mention an FCC problem that someone else
mentioned.
Terry
--
Terry Lisansky
Give me a fast ship........
For I intend to go in harms way.
Bob Witte
: >>> >Subject: Re: Is there a combo ham/marine 2m rig?
:
(I told myself I was going to stay out of this discussion, but...)
The issue is not really technical in nature. As various people
have pointed out, your average 2 meter handheld radio can receive
marine freqs and (usually) can be modified to transmit on them.
Surprisely enough, even though this stretches the frequency range
of the radio, they actually work OK across this range (maybe not
stellar, but OK).
Unfortunately, the FCC takes a rather dim view of this.. like its
illegal. It all has to do with the notion of Type Acceptance (or
is it Type Approval, I'll have to look that up). Basiically, the
FCC wants the Marine radio service to be semi-goof-proof so they
insist on marine radios being "channelized" so the operator doesn't
have to know much about operating frequency, etc. Obviously, a
wide-banded ham rig violates this notion and is not approved for
use on the marine freqs (except in the case of emergency).
Bob Witte / bo...@col.hp.com / Hewlett Packard / PMO / KB0CY / (719) 590-3230
rkn...@bcm.tmc.edu
ad for the SGC brand of radio in Ocean Navigator. This radio is CG
type approved for SSB and ham enabled. It may be that Practical
Navigator took a look at this radio, but my copies are far removed
and I can't be certain
Jacob D. Spencer
I'd like to take a stab at this...
You CAN get a marine/2m rig. I have a kenwood TH-26 which
received very nicely over the marine band. I called kenwood
technical service and asked them what I could do to extend
the transmit range IF I was in MARS or CAP (therefore not
really lieing). The sent me a easy little instruction book
telling me how to remove a particular diode to disable the
XMT block on non-ham bands.
One word of caution: use low power. A ham antenna and
amp should center at 144 MHz, and marine is up around 162.
On a simple quarter wave vertical this is no problem, but
anything with a loading coil (1/8, 3/8) will have a narrower
frequency range, giving you unacceptable VSWRs in the marine
area, and potentially damaging the solid state 'finals' in
your HT or mobil rig. If you use a marine band antenna, this
should not be a concern. If this doesn't work, use a transmatch
or a stub.
Any solid state amplifier should be broadband enough to let
you hop over 20MHz without serious damage if power is reduced.
Watch how hot it gets the first couple times you try it.
jay
P.Bennett
>
>I'd like to take a stab at this...
>
>You CAN get a marine/2m rig. I have a kenwood TH-26 which
>received very nicely over the marine band. I called kenwood
>technical service and asked them what I could do to extend
Yes, many ham rigs can operate in the marine band (usually with modifications)
BUT they are not type approved for such operations, and you have to remember
the frequencies, rather than channel numbers.
I don't expect to see any _approved_ marine/ham VHF radios primarily for
regluatory reasons - a type approved marine VHF probably _must_ have "channel
selection" rather than frequency selection, and probably must only transmit on
the marine channels (Just guessing really, as I haven't see the Canadian or US
type approval requirements...)
Although those of us who are hams and boaters probably feel we would be a
significant market, the manufacturers probalby feel otherwise, and won't be
bothered with arguing about the type approval process.
Peter Bennett VE7CEI | Vessels shall be deemed to be in sight
Internet: ben...@triumf.ca | of one another only when one can be
Packet: ve7cei@ve7kit.#vanc.bc.ca | observed visually from the other
TRIUMF, Vancouver, B.C., Canada | ColRegs 3(k)