Which diesel engine?
Conor Crowley
thought was a "good" engine, will apparently cost in the neighborhood
of $5000 to make well. Its a Volvo Penta MD17c. The transmission that
came with it is not the correct one and the cylinders have "some bad
scarring" etc, etc
For just over $6000 I could get a new Volvo Penta, so this obviously
is not economically sensible unless I do the work myself and can
locate some good, cheap parts. I know where I can get another engine
which is the exact same model engine, albeit in an unknown condition,
but running and with transmission, for $1000...... so perhaps with
two of the same model I could cannibalize one to end up with one good
one, and a bunch of spare parts. Maybe....
The problem, I suppose, is that one never knows about the quality of
the innards of a used engine until one takes it apart, and since I
have never worked on marine diesels before, this can expensive. In
fact the most ambitious automotive project I've undertaken is
replacing a water pump or an alternator in my car, so perhaps I should
not realistically consider cannibalizing marine diesels and making a
big'ol mess in my landlord's garage.
I've been on the water long enough to know that engines can be
temperamental things, often at exactly the wrong moment, and I have to
wonder if I really want to mess around with second-hand engines at
all. Especially since I would constantly be questioning the quality of
my work every time the engine had a problem. OTOH, this D-I-Y route
would eventually turn me into a pretty competent diesel mechanic.
Of course I would rather spend my time sailing instead of messing
around in the engine compartment, so I'm tempted to just pony up the
six Gs and get a new one. The question is which one? My current Penta
weighs something like 700 pounds, which for a 40' tri' is acceptable,
but there are probably better options than a similar size new Penta.
I've been told I can get a lot smaller (turbo-charged?) engines that
weigh a lot less and will give the same power (~30 horse) for less
money.
Any recommendations would be much appreciated.
..Conor
Steve
engines to be well built and reliable.. Only gross neglect could render them
worthless or beyond repair..
The MD17c is a very nice compact little engine.. 2 years ago I found a good
used one for a friend and installed it in her boat.. This used engine was
running in another boat and was demostrated to start and run properly.. Cost
$1700 on the dock with all the controls.. The installation cost was another
$400 since we had to change the engine bed and shaft coupling, prop, control
and piping arrangement. (Previous engine had been a gas and right hand
rotation)...
So for $2100 this little engine has been running flawlessly for, now, about
200 hours.
This is not to say that every used engine is going to be this good.. If your
going to purchase a used engine, it would be best to purchase one that is
still in operating condition, in a boat.. So you can see that it starts
easy, runs smooth and doesn't smoke when under load....
Rebuilding your old engine could be expensive since any part you have to get
from Volvo is going to be very,very, very expensive. (their way to get you
to purchase a new engine)
Since your engine has both cylinders combine in one casting, you would have
to replace the unit.. But all you would normally need then is standard rings
(assuming the pistons are still ok).. Gasket set and rod bearings, to make
it a worth while effort.
It is possible to have the cylinder honed if the wear isn't excessive and
just put new rings in.. That would be a cheapo fix..
What I'm speaking of is doing it yourself...The manual is very clear on
these procedures.. If you have to hire a mechanic or shop to do this for
you, the labor and the parts will be more than a new engine..
If you want a good replacement engine, watch the ads, check with the New
Engine retailer, for a good 'trade-in'.. Sure, he wants to sell you a new
engine, but he has many opportunities to obtain used engines that may still
be in good order.
Try to stay with the same engine you have, since it will save you a
additional $1000 for someone to change your engine bed and shaft, etc.
--
My opinion and experience. FWIW
Steve
S/V Good Intentions
Jere Lull
>I have a dilemma whereby the engine I purchased with my boat, and
>thought was a "good" engine, will apparently cost in the neighborhood
>of $5000 to make well. Its a Volvo Penta MD17c. The transmission that
>came with it is not the correct one and the cylinders have "some bad
>scarring" etc, etc
>
>For just over $6000 I could get a new Volvo Penta, so this obviously
>is not economically sensible unless I do the work myself and can
>locate some good, cheap parts. I know where I can get another engine
>which is the exact same model engine, albeit in an unknown condition,
>but running and with transmission, for $1000...... so perhaps with
>two of the same model I could cannibalize one to end up with one good
>one, and a bunch of spare parts. Maybe....
>
We repowered, but didn't have such nice options. Couldn't even rebuild
the original.
I'd go for the $1000 solution. That gives you at least $4k worth of
mistakes. A new engine will cost more if you have to change anything,
like the bed, shaft, prop and so forth. We couldn't use anything of the
old gas installation, so the job cost closer to $12k (in '92) -- double
the engine's cost.
If sailing season is near or here for you, I'd run one that worked while
I rebuilt the other one. Rebuilding the new one (which sounds like it
may be in better shape) saves a removal and installation, but I can't
tell whether the existing one is working. At a minimum, I'd waste a set
of gaskets and tear down the new one for an inspection before I trusted
it too far.
I'm interested that the old transmission isn't the right one. People
don't normally change out transmissions. Could it be that you need
different gearing to swing a small prop? In that case, you might be able
to change the new transmission's gearing to match while it's out of the
boat. Our engine had three factory gear settings. BTW, if you have the
space, switching to higher gearing and fitting a bigger prop will help
get the power delivered better. Since you're saving so much on the
engine, you could justify a feathering prop, which will significantly
improve your sailing speed.
Diesels aren't rocket science. Doing this job yourself -- with the help
of a few strong friends at times, knowledgeable friends and good books
always -- will help you along the way to self-sufficiency.
--
Jere Lull
Xan-a-Deux ('73 Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD)
Xan's Pages: http://members.dca.net/jerelull/X-Main.html
Our BVI FAQs (290+ pics) http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/
Rodney Myrvaagnes
wrote:
>
>Of course I would rather spend my time sailing instead of messing
>around in the engine compartment, so I'm tempted to just pony up the
>six Gs and get a new one.
Do it. If you can afford it, anything else will take away sailing
time.
>The question is which one? My current Penta
>weighs something like 700 pounds, which for a 40' tri' is acceptable,
>but there are probably better options than a similar size new Penta.
>I've been told I can get a lot smaller (turbo-charged?) engines that
>weigh a lot less and will give the same power (~30 horse) for less
>money.
700 lbs seems heavy for 30 horse. Are the alternatives cheaper if you
include new mounting? Another Penta would just bolt in, no?
I repowered about 8 years ago and it ended up costing about $8K, even
though I used the nearest I could get to the previous engine.
Rodney Myrvaagnes NYC J36 Gjo/a
"Happy is he that taketh thy little ones and dasheth them upon the stones." __Psalm 137
Mike Cobbe
That was the last marine engine produced by Volvo (they are marinised road
engines now), it's a fantastic piece of kit. Therefore I'd suggest you do
anything needed to rebuild it because a rebuilt MD17C will outlast and be
more reliable than any modern engine.
Steve said...
>Since your engine has both cylinders combine in one casting you would
>have to replace the unit.
Steve, I think that's wrong. The MD17C has 3 cylinders which can be taken
apart separately. i.e. he can take it apart, take it ashore and get the
work done.
Mike
Steve
>
> Steve, I think that's wrong. The MD17C has 3 cylinders which can be taken
>
I'll have to admit, I'm in error. I was thinking of and talking about the
little MD 16 hp engine that has 2 cylinders in a single cast assembly.. I
can't fined a handy reference, but it's was the larger bore, 16 hp version
of the Volvo MD6A.. About the most compact engine I have seen in that hp
range, but it wieghed 375lb (170 kg). Point being, a lot of iron in a small
package.
I have a hard time keeping the models clear on the MD series engines.
Sorry for the error..
BTW. I'm told that the MD2b and MD3b are still available in Europe..(perhaps
under a different designation but the same old design).
I agree that the current stuff offered by Volvo is 'light duty' comparied to
the old MD stuff. And it you get something with a turbo then you should only
count on about half the engine life.. Just the industries way to get more
work out of light duty machanical parts.
Gordon Wedman
I'm inclined to agree with the other posters when they suggest you check out
that $1000 engine. Generally these small boat marine diesels last a long
time and I think the old Volvos do have a good reputation. It could still
have a lot of life left in it. Get a marine diesel mechanic to check it
out. As Volvo parts are expensive it would be handy to have the spare
starter, alternator, etc. from your old engine. You could also take your
time and rebuild that engine yourself if you have a good work space. You
can do the disassembly/assembly yourself and save a lot. Just haul stuff to
the machine shop for the precision work. Good luck.
"Conor Crowley" <goo...@conorcrowley.com> wrote in message
news:5dc2ad5e.03012...@posting.google.com...