painting epoxy
Peter Beer
over epoxy with good quality domestic paint, for boat interiors.
I'm into the final stretch of a project to build a 32' cutter, and my
experience of painting epoxy is zero.
Any suggestions/comments/experiences gratefully received.
Happy sailing..
Peter Beer
KernHend
Any suggestions/comments/experiences gratefully received.<<
____________________________
Some alkyd enamels (one part "oil based" paints) will not dry properly
over cured epoxy resins. This is both a function of the epoxy formulation
as well as the drier system in the paint. Since you can't control either
you should do a little test to make sure that you don't have a problem
with what you select:
Prepare a 3 inch square area of the epoxy by sanding, etc. and coat this
area with the paint you intend to use. At the same time coat an inert
surface like glass or aluminum. Check both surfaces several times while
drying to see it there is any difference. (Make sure the film thickness
is the same on both). When the paint on the inert surface has dried,
scratch the epoxy surface with your finger nail to see if it has dried all
the way through.
If it hasn't and is otherwise different than the inert surface then the
epoxy is interferring with the organometallic driers and you ought to
check another brand of paint. If the two are substantially the same then
check the paint for good adhesion on the epoxy surface:
Take a razor blade and make about an eight line tic-tac-toe pattern on the
painted surface with the lines about 1/8" (3mm) apart. Lightly brush any
paint crumbs off. Apply some clear packaging adhesive tape pressing it
down well with your thumbnail. Jerk pull it off. If the paint pulls off
or some of the little squares you have an adhesion problem and the paint
will likely blister in time.
If the adhesion is good then you are home free.
Kern Hendricks
System Three Resins, Inc.
Seattle, WA
pfiffner
high quality marine varnish with uv inhibitors. Each summer I need to
re-varnish because the old varnish peels off in spots ranging from half
inch to over 2 inches. I have put several thin coats on, but it still seems
to peel. Any ideas to prevent my problem from reoccuring? I suspect my
problem lies in the west system epoxy.
Tom
KernHend
It may be the varnish/epoxy combination. I answered a painting question
on the newsgroup recently that might shed some light on your problem. It
should be still around. I'd take a look at another varnish. I've had
great success with Z-Spar Captains Varnish. Their Flagship Varnish is
even better - on a par with Interlux Clipper Clear. The epoxy/varnish
combination ought to last at least 3 years with continuous exposure in
northern latitude conditions.
Brian Dixon
West System tech support also recommends Z-Spar Captains Varnish.
Brian
ANDERMAR
orange peeling. Problem solved by better attention to surface preparation
by washing with vinegar to remove blush before and after sanding.
Mark
Ande...@ohsu.edu
Brian Dixon
Would it be possible to say what brand resin and hardener was used and which
specific hardener in particular. And how long ago was your experience? The
only way to guess that I may have to be VERY VERY careful is if I know
whether or not I'm in the same situation...
BD
Paul R. LaBrie
wrote:
> It may be the varnish/epoxy combination. I answered a painting question
> on the newsgroup recently that might shed some light on your problem. It
> should be still around. I'd take a look at another varnish. I've had
> great success with Z-Spar Captains Varnish. Their Flagship Varnish is
> even better - on a par with Interlux Clipper Clear. The epoxy/varnish
> combination ought to last at least 3 years with continuous exposure in
> northern latitude conditions.
>
I agree with Kern's comments. I have a strip-built canoe (WEST System)
that is about 8 years old. I've also used both Flagship and Captains
Varnish with good luck and have gone 3-4 years between coats before seeing
any peeling or flaking. (FWIW -- I prefer Captain's Varnish, it's a bit
less expensive and , to my mind, it seems to flow on better than Flagship
-- probably not as good in the UV dept, however).
- paul -
paul.r...@unh.edu 603.862.3684
telecomm center -- university of new hampshire
Dan Dunphy
>I made a solo canoe using west system and varnished the exterior
with
>high quality marine varnish with uv inhibitors. Each summer I
need to
>re-varnish because the old varnish peels off in spots ranging from
half
>inch to over 2 inches. I have put several thin coats on, but it
still seems
>to peel. Any ideas to prevent my problem from reoccuring? I
suspect my
>problem lies in the west system epoxy.
> Tom
Did you sand the gloss off the epoxy before you varnished?
Dan
Dan DoD #281 My advice is probably worth what you paid for it.
dun...@rmii.com
Scott Truesdell
> >re-varnish because the old varnish peels off in spots ranging
> >from half inch to over 2 inches.
>
> West System tech support also recommends Z-Spar Captains Varnish.
You've probably already done all this, but here goes anyway...
Steps to get varnish to adhere well:
1. Wash the 'amine blush' off the cured epoxy. I use a ScotchBrite
pad with just a dab of dishwashing detergent and lots of running
water. Rinse very well.
2. Sand with no finer than 220 grit paper. You can use finer grits
between subsequent coats of varnish.
3. Rinse off the sanding dust. Dry. Wipe down with thinner. dry.
4. After any thinner has 'gassed off' (I usually wait 12 hours
or so, but you can be the judge of when dry is "dry.") I give
a final wipe-down with the palm of my clean hand.
5. "Z-Spar Captains Varnish" is what I use, too. It levels well
and is tough and glossy. If you get any 'too thick' spots,
though, you'll need to shave them off and really bake them dry
before you can sand and put on another coat.
--scott
P.S. I amused myself the other day by explaining to a non-sailing friend
about the aesthetics of varnish. ("Is that real wood? How'd you get it so
smooth?") It went something like this:
In the past, before there was any plastic, the ideal to strive for in
exterior brightwork was a look of artificial smoothness and gloss. The
people doing the work had no idea of what plastic is, but that is the look
they strived for. They wanted it to look 'fake.'
To which the person admiring my [small bit of] brightwork commented,
"Well, it looks fake allright."
Gregg Germain
: des...@aol.com (DESLONG) wrote:
: >If you would like a clear coating which does not blush to begin with try
: >Matrix Adhesive Systems Resin #718 and Curing agent #2072 and use the
: >varnish of your choice. I have had good results on a few bright canoes
: >which live on the roof of my car. I hate redoing varnish and like my time
: >on the water away from the sanding paper and thinner.
: Geez I get tired of people hanging around trying to sell stuff here. Just
: in case you haven't caught on yet, there's a perfectly good place for your
: advertisement: rec.boats.marketplace. That newsgroup was created to divert
: all sales and advertising *away* from this newsgroup.
Brian,
How did you arrive at the conclusion that deslong is a sales rep for
the product he suggests? Looks to me like a user giving his
experience.
--- Gregg
Saville
gr...@hrc2.harvard.edu #29 Genie
Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics #1762 CRIS
Phone: (617) 496-7713 "A Mig at your six is better than
no Mig at all."
Brian Dixon
>If you would like a clear coating which does not blush to begin with try
>Matrix Adhesive Systems Resin #718 and Curing agent #2072 and use the
>varnish of your choice. I have had good results on a few bright canoes
>which live on the roof of my car. I hate redoing varnish and like my time
>on the water away from the sanding paper and thinner.
Geez I get tired of people hanging around trying to sell stuff here. Just
in case you haven't caught on yet, there's a perfectly good place for your
advertisement: rec.boats.marketplace. That newsgroup was created to divert
all sales and advertising *away* from this newsgroup. BTW, what you suggest
is a bad idea...leaving epoxy uncoated on canoes in the sun that is. You
should know why. It seems misleading and like false advertising for you to
try to tell people here that your epoxy can be used as a final clear coat
in sun-exposed boats. Are you trying to say that your epoxy is so miraculous
that it won't experience UV breakdown? Or are you just trying for quick
sales? Ever sell used cars before?
Brian
Brian Dixon
>: Geez I get tired of people hanging around trying to sell stuff here. Just
>: in case you haven't caught on yet, there's a perfectly good place for your
>: advertisement: rec.boats.marketplace. That newsgroup was created to divert
>: all sales and advertising *away* from this newsgroup.
>
>
> How did you arrive at the conclusion that deslong is a sales rep for
>the product he suggests? Looks to me like a user giving his
>experience.
>
He had 2 other posts, one of which said he was a formulator for the company.
All of his posts had remarks in them selling the Matrox products. The post
that I responded to was not an answer to the original question, merely a
thinly vieled excuse for sales efforts.
Brian
Mark T. Parker
>des...@aol.com (DESLONG) wrote:
>>If you would like a clear coating which does not blush to begin with try
>>Matrix Adhesive Systems Resin #718 and Curing agent #2072 and use the
>>varnish of your choice. I have had good results on a few bright canoes
>>which live on the roof of my car. I hate redoing varnish and like my time
>>on the water away from the sanding paper and thinner.
>Geez I get tired of people hanging around trying to sell stuff here. Just
>in case you haven't caught on yet, there's a perfectly good place for your
>advertisement: rec.boats.marketplace. That newsgroup was created to divert
>all sales and advertising *away* from this newsgroup. BTW, what you suggest
>is a bad idea...leaving epoxy uncoated on canoes in the sun that is. You
>should know why. It seems misleading and like false advertising for you to
>try to tell people here that your epoxy can be used as a final clear coat
>in sun-exposed boats. Are you trying to say that your epoxy is so miraculous
>that it won't experience UV breakdown? Or are you just trying for quick
>sales? Ever sell used cars before?
>Brian
FLAME ON!!
The post (which you quote) clearly recommends 'varnish of your
choice'. Others, unrelated to MAS have also commented on the lack of
amine bluch from this product. Since the blush is water soluble I
don't see what the big deal is, but or flame was misdirected.
Mark T. Parker
73 Prospect Hill Pax vobiscum,
Hancock, NH 03449 frater mei.
(603)525-3438
Chris Crandall
In article <Pine.SUN.3.91.960214073327.20150A-100000@engr> you wrote:
: On my Charlotte canoe I varnished the sheer strake; the wood is ever so
: slightly lighter in color where epoxy touched the wood, as opposed to
: where varnished was applied directly, due to the epoxy sealing the
: wood, preventing the varnish from penetrating as deeply
: Short of coating the entire strake with epoxy, what can I do?
: Seal the wood? With what?
Why not take the simplest and most straightforward route.
Sand away the epoxy. Epoxy does not penetrate the wood deeply.
You can feather away the epoxied site, and varnish along with
the rest of the boat.
-Chris
Randall W. Ober
Wilde" <dbw@engr> wrote:
>> Time to order paint for my new "Charlotte" canoe. I really like Pettit
>> and need to mail order some.
>> Who has a good selection of their Easypoxy paints?
>> Who has the best prices?
>> Names and 1-800 numbers much appreciated.
>>
>> WoodenBoat has few ads. I ordered from Defender in the past and was
>> pleased with their service.
>>
>> Doug Wilde
>> d...@engr.uar.edu
Doug
Have you tried Jamestown Distributors? Call 1-800 information for the
location closest to you (RI or NC).
R W Ober
--
Psychiatrists say that one out of four people are mentally ill.
Check with three friends; If they are all right --- you're it.