Vuelta a Espana

[Tom Kunich]

We have to wait all the way until Aug 26th for the start of the Vuelta. The courses on this grand tour look a hell of a lot more balanced than the Tour de France this year which appeared to be made so difficult that only two people were specialized enough to be able to win it. The Vuelta on the other hand appears to be more along the lines of a race that a large number of people will have a descent chance of winning.

And aside from a regular time trial, the Vuelta will have a Team Time Trial which is an additional test that was left out of the Tour de France this year.

If the Tour de France continues on its pathway to find the strongest racer rather than the best racer, la Vuelta a Espana may just take over title of the leading tour.

Of course my question will be who is going to cover it. NBC was pretty weak coverage this year perhaps handing to many of the slots to ex-pros. While I very much like the ex-pros and their commentary, there should probably be more from cycling aficionados since that is the real audience.

[Lou Holtman]

On Tuesday, July 25, 2023 at 11:35:50 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> We have to wait all the way until Aug 26th for the start of the Vuelta. The courses on this grand tour look a hell of a lot more balanced than the Tour de France this year which appeared to be made so difficult that only two people were specialized enough to be able to win it. The Vuelta on the other hand appears to be more along the lines of a race that a large number of people will have a descent chance of winning.
>

Huh?? Vuelta is always a tour for climbers. This years edition is no exemption. If you are a rider for the flats you are not winning the Vuelta. In the meantime we currently have the TdF for women going on and then we have the world championships before the Vuelta.

> And aside from a regular time trial, the Vuelta will have a Team Time Trial which is an additional test that was left out of the Tour de France this year.

That will be interesting.

>
> If the Tour de France continues on its pathway to find the strongest racer rather than the best racer, la Vuelta a Espana may just take over title of the leading tour.

No way. TdF will always be number 1 for the riders and teams. The Vuelta is a very interesting tour to watch though.

>
> Of course my question will be who is going to cover it. NBC was pretty weak coverage this year perhaps handing to many of the slots to ex-pros. While I very much like the ex-pros and their commentary, there should probably be more from cycling aficionados since that is the real audience.

We don’t have that problem. We can chose.

Lou

[Tom Kunich]

If you look at the course this year it looks a great deal more general purpose than the Tour did. I found the Tour this year rather boring. Let's see if the Vuelta turns out that way.

[Lou Holtman]

Boring? I must have seen a different one. You have to known where to look.

Lou

[funkma...@hotmail.com]

yeah, seven seconds separating the top two riders into the last week was "boring". What an idiot.

[funkma...@hotmail.com]

That's probably because you were watching some race with two guys named Vindegaard and Pogecar. For those of us watching the Tour de France with Vingegaard and Pogačar it was one of the more exciting editions in recent memory.

[Tom Kunich]

You are an incredibly stupid ass Flunky. EVERY Tour that Pogacar has been in he has at least one bad day. Anyone that could believe that he would have a perfect ride must be a fool. It was only a matter of pressing him hard as Jumbo-Visma did until he broke. But you being another pretend racer couldn't see that could you? Liebermann's height of engineering was with vacuum tubes, yours's is with horseshit. Sorry to say that but it is because of people like you that I never wanted for a high end engineering job.

[Lou Holtman]

Who said Pogačar would have a perfect ride? With all his ‘weaknesses’ he is still a two times TdF winner and up to now had a fabulous season.

Lou

[Tom Kunich]

Lou, perhaps you should go back and review those TdF wins. Roglic LOST only because the didn't consider Pogacar a threat.

[Lou Holtman]

And Pogačar lost the 2022 edition because he made a mistake in stage 11. You lose a race always for some reason.

Lou

[Tom Kunich]

Exactly what was a 3 1/2 minute "mistake"?

[Lou Holtman]

First tactical, second he forgot to eat and bonked.

Lou

[Tom Kunich]

Lou, will you get real please? Tactical perhaps but there's no way a pro can forget to eat. He is being given nutrition every 10 minutes through bottle carriers on road-side feeding stations. He one his first Tour by being underestimated and his second by a major mistake. Will this continue? Probably not. All he has to do is stay with Jumbo-Visma until the last kilometer and then he has a powerful uphill sprint that Vindegaard simply cannot match. But will Podagar be able to retain that sprint as he ages?

[Lou Holtman]

I am real, he admitted it himself in an interview after the Tour for Belgium television. He and his team made a mistake. A race can be so hectic that you just have no time to eat and/or drink. You also can miscalculate how much energy you already have used. When I saw him drop like that in that last climb after he was leading and even attacked the previous climb (Galibier) it was my first suspicion. JV drilled it in the descent of the Galibier and flat stretch to the last climb. The first tactical mistake was that he responded to Roglic attacks. He should have known that Roglic was not a treat anymore because of his crash in one of the previous day. Roglic left the Tour one of the days after. The second tactical mistake was leading/attacking the Galibier climb because he was over confident. If you are in the yellow jersey just follow your greatest threat, it was obvious that this was Vingegaard because he already dropped him in the Mont Ventoux stage a year before.

Lou

[Frank Krygowski]

On 7/27/2023 10:13 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
>
> But will Podagar be able to retain that sprint as he ages?

Who is this "Podagar" person?

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Lou Holtman]

Indeed, and who is:
Pogecar,
Henley,
Kwiakowski,
Vindegaard,
Pogachar,
Podacar,
Roglich,
Podecar,
Wout van Aart,
Henly,
Wout Pouls?

Lou

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Thu, 27 Jul 2023 10:05:40 -0700 (PDT), Lou Holtman
<lou.h...@gmail.com> wrote:

"Why misspelling a name is more of a problem than you realise"
<https://www.smartcompany.com.au/marketing/networking/why-misspelling-name-more-problem-than-you-realise/>
"Or in other words, our name is central to our identity, and so
mucking it up means you are attacking people at their core."

In other words, Tom is intentionally attacking these TdF racers, for
no obvious reason. Perhaps jealousy? Maybe he's marking them as his
territory, much like cats? I dunno.

"4 Dastardly Reasons People Make Typos On Purpose"
<https://proedit.com/intentional-typos/>
"People who make typos on porpoise always have an agenda."
1. Attract Traffic
2. Project (False) Authenticity
3. Make a Backhanded Statement
4. Deflect Attention
"If you want your fans to listen to you, write them a tweet. If you
want your critics to listen to you, write a tweet with a typo."

"How spelling names wrong became the ultimate dig"
<https://theface.com/life/spelling-names-wrong-miki-minach-dula-peep>
"It’s a common tactic used by playground bullies and a very effective
one for belittling and denigrating others"
(...)
"On the other hand, there’s a reason word plays are used in marketing
and advertising slogans - they stick in the brain"

--
Jeff Liebermann je...@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

[AMuzi]

from 2005 (geez, I look young! and heavier)

http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfromthepast/NAZI.JPG

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

[Lou Holtman]

I dunno. IIRC I asked him to pay attention to the spelling of the riders names the first time and then again saying that misspelling a riders name is disrespectful IMO. Since spelling of foreign names can be troublesome I suggested the copy/paste method from a sticky note were you wrote down the correct spelling. Than it became silly. I concluded that Tom wasn’t prepared to make an effort. I have a lot of colleagues from India. They have for a Dutch guy impossible longgggg names; to pronounce and to spell. I ask them if they have a short version and if I can use that. Most of the times they have. For writing I use the copy paste method for their full name. In my world it is just common curtesy. Dutch people are direct, that is true and for some people experience that as rude but we make an effort to spell peoples names correctly and we are not offended when people correct us when we made a mistake. People can also be direct to us. We appreciate that.

Lou

[Catrike Rider]

On Thu, 27 Jul 2023 13:06:41 -0700 (PDT), Lou Holtman
<lou.h...@gmail.com> wrote:

I write fast and I don't often look back. Later, I'll see that I
skipped some words, mispelled others, and sometimes added a few. I
figure most readers are smart enough to figure it out, and if not, I
don't worry about it. What bothers me though, is bad grammar, and
yes, I sometimes screw that up, too.

[Lou Holtman]

Everyone makes typos but I think misspelling names again and again is something different.
Nuff said now.

Lou

[Tom Kunich]

Well I think that we agree about the rather simple tactics if you're one of the top riders and in the Yellow. I don't remember a thing about the 2021 and 2022 Tours other than Pogecar having a really bad day in each. Didn't we have all of the announcing pros on NBC predicting that he would beat Vingegaard and instead he had yet another bad day.

[Tom Kunich]

Heavier? You don't look heavy there so I assume you lost some weight for one reason or another.

[Tom Kunich]

Yes, it is a short term memory lapse that is caused by that concussion in 2009. Now maybe you think that it is going to get better but unless you simply cannot understand the people under discussion what in the hell does it matter?

[AMuzi]

Meh. I do that too; it happens.
Normal adults apologize and move on.

[funkma...@hotmail.com]

On Wednesday, July 26, 2023 at 3:23:36 PM UTC-4, Tom Kunich wrote:
> On Wednesday, July 26, 2023 at 11:24:09 AM UTC-7, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > On Wednesday, July 26, 2023 at 10:57:28 AM UTC-4, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > > On Wednesday, July 26, 2023 at 4:11:11 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > > On Wednesday, July 26, 2023 at 2:09:37 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > > > > On Tuesday, July 25, 2023 at 11:35:50 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > > > > We have to wait all the way until Aug 26th for the start of the Vuelta. The courses on this grand tour look a hell of a lot more balanced than the Tour de France this year which appeared to be made so difficult that only two people were specialized enough to be able to win it. The Vuelta on the other hand appears to be more along the lines of a race that a large number of people will have a descent chance of winning.
> > > > > >
> > > > > Huh?? Vuelta is always a tour for climbers. This years edition is no exemption. If you are a rider for the flats you are not winning the Vuelta. In the meantime we currently have the TdF for women going on and then we have the world championships before the Vuelta.
> > > > > > And aside from a regular time trial, the Vuelta will have a Team Time Trial which is an additional test that was left out of the Tour de France this year.
> > > > > That will be interesting.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > If the Tour de France continues on its pathway to find the strongest racer rather than the best racer, la Vuelta a Espana may just take over title of the leading tour.
> > > > > No way. TdF will always be number 1 for the riders and teams. The Vuelta is a very interesting tour to watch though.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Of course my question will be who is going to cover it. NBC was pretty weak coverage this year perhaps handing to many of the slots to ex-pros. While I very much like the ex-pros and their commentary, there should probably be more from cycling aficionados since that is the real audience.
> > > > > We don’t have that problem. We can chose.
> > > > >
> > > > > Lou
> > > > If you look at the course this year it looks a great deal more general purpose than the Tour did. I found the Tour this year rather boring. Let's see if the Vuelta turns out that way.
> > > Boring? I must have seen a different one. You have to known where to look.
> > >
> > > Lou
> > yeah, seven seconds separating the top two riders into the last week was "boring". What an idiot.
> You are an incredibly stupid ass Flunky. EVERY Tour that Pogacar has been in he has at least one bad day.

Really - tell me which stages in the two tours he won were his "bad" days. I watched both of them from start to finish and don't remember seeing him having a bad day. I wrote that there was 7 seconds separating them after two weeks this year. It was an exciting tour for those that actually understand bike racing, which explains why you thought it was boring.

> Anyone that could believe that he would have a perfect ride must be a fool. It was only a matter of pressing him hard as Jumbo-Visma did until he broke. But you being another pretend racer couldn't see that could you?

And yet, according to you, JV was so exhausted after two weeks that they had to use UAE for pacing - talk about being a fool....

> Liebermann's height of engineering was with vacuum tubes, yours's is with horseshit. Sorry to say that but it is because of people like you that I never wanted for a high end engineering job.

Yes skippy, we already knew you never had a high end engineering job, thank you for finally admitting your resume is a complete fabrication.

[funkma...@hotmail.com]

So, as usual, you type out of your ass.

> Didn't we have all of the announcing pros on NBC predicting that he would beat Vingegaard and instead he had yet another bad day.

No, we didn't. the pros commentators were split and leaning towards Vingo. Pay attention you fucking idiot.

[Tom Kunich]

When you have bullshit flowing out of your ears perhaps you should keep it to yourself. They all predicted that Pogecar was going to win. Legit asked them all and they all agreed that with 7 seconds in arrears he was going to win. And even my cat Daisy that sat and watched the Tour with me knows more than you about anything it is a good demonstration of how much you know.