Reviving the Avocet 25 bicycle computer

[BCDrums]

I've had an Avocet 25 mounted on the bar of my '96 Gary Fisher MTB since 1996. The battery has been dead since before the turn of the century, but I rarely rode the bike and didn't care. Recently I have been riding the bike daily, taking the third-grader to school, and I am spiffing it up.

The Avocet is powered by a 675, 1.4 volt button cell. These are sold today as hearing-aid batteries. But I had an LR44 in the drawer, which is the right diameter though somewhat lower in height. It is also 1.5v, but it fit in the battery well and works perfectly.

I checked the file with all my bike stuff and found the original instructions! A miracle. Also found the sales receipt, $29.95 plus tax.

I really don't much care about data when I ride this bike, but knowing how far we've gone will motivate the little guy. It was fun to see this old toy light up again.

[Frank Krygowski]

I like keeping old hardware running, and Avocets are still my favorite cyclometers. But I've had some trouble choosing replacement batteries. The original batteries (at least, in some models) contained too much mercury and were taken off the market. Some of the replacements I've used lasted far less than a year. Hope yours works for you.

- Frank Krygowski

[Dan]

Frank Krygowski <frkr...@gmail.com> writes:

<snip>

>
> I like keeping old hardware running,

Just out of curiosity, what's the oldest computer (talking
about general purpose "data processing" or "personal computers"
here) you have kept running? (Bonus if it's still in ~regular
use).

<snip>

[raa...@gmail.com]

On Wednesday, October 2, 2013 11:36:10 AM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
I like keeping old hardware running, and Avocets are still my favorite cyclometers. . - Frank Krygowski

I am curious, may I ask why ? I had one way back, I think it was a 40- kinda big, but I did not like the magnetic ring on the hub much, I could never install it parallel to the pick up and understanding the reading depended on the frequency of the magnets influencing the coil in the pick up, I often felt this deviation resulted in an inaccurate reading. With a sinhle magnet-reed switch combination, we know that every single pass is counted and equaled x distance traveled- that seemed to be a certaintude,

One other thing too, is that as I was commuting a same route daily, I was well aware of a deviation with the avocet whereas any other reed switch comp gave me a result I recall was within 2% (the avocet varied much more)

[Jay Beattie]

I bought an Avocet cyclometer from the first production (from the company at PAB). Great for the era and the only game in town - apart from some Huret mechanical abomination, but I've become fond of cordless. When it comes to electronics, new stuff is generally better and cheaper, at least until you get in to the bells and whistle models that have lie detector functions and GPS and send phone messages.

-- Jay Beattie.

[Frank Krygowski]

On Wednesday, October 2, 2013 8:55:18 PM UTC-4, raa...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, October 2, 2013 11:36:10 AM UTC-4, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>
> I like keeping old hardware running, and Avocets are still my favorite cyclometers. . - Frank Krygowski
>
> I am curious, may I ask why ?

Part of it may be just familiarity But I like the relative simplicity, at least regarding the operator interface. I like the strong tactile response of the buttons, the small size of the unit, and what seems to me a very logical "command set," if I can call it that: click one button to go from speed to distance to time, click the other for details. Calibration and things like setting the clock are also very logical, ISTM.

For contrast: The Cateye Wireless on one other bike has lost miles in cold weather, the buttons are tiny and "soft," and I'm still confused about some of its operating and calibration functions. I've had to write notes on its instruction sheet to make it through the annual battery change.

- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

On Wednesday, October 2, 2013 10:25:50 PM UTC-4, Jay Beattie wrote:
>
>
> I bought an Avocet cyclometer from the first production (from the company at PAB). Great for the era and the only game in town - apart from some Huret mechanical abomination, but I've become fond of cordless. When it comes to electronics, new stuff is generally better and cheaper, at least until you get in to the bells and whistle models that have lie detector functions and GPS and send phone messages.

Speaking of the very broad field of electronic devices, newer stuff is cheaper and much more capable. But ISTM that operator interfaces have gotten worse on many devices. Or maybe it's more accurate to say that they haven't figured out ways to make an operator interface that is simple, yet handles the functions of the devices.

Microwave ovens can now do dozens of tricks. But every time I'm in front of a different one, it takes me five minutes to figure out how to heat a cup of hot water. Seems there should be some top level "simple" function, analogous to the old mechanical dial on the first ones.

BTW, I've got an Android phone. It's a replacement for a Palm that I carried for years. It's much more powerful - yet every organizer function on the Palm was easier to access, had a clearer visual interface, had a better and more consistent "help" function if I needed it, etc. And the Palm had a physical keyboard, which greatly reduced typos.

The trend toward non-tactile on-screen "buttons" is just wrong, IMO.

- Frank Krygowski

[Jay Beattie]

That is the downside of cutting edge technology -- it tries to do too much and is sometimes frail. OTOH, I'm just an old dog who doesn't like new tricks, and what is a novelty, never-used function to me is a must-have to my friends, e.g. pulse, cadence, various biometrics and elevation.

I have become accustomed to delaying the start of every ride while my friends get their satellite links established. It looks like tax season at H&R Block with everyone tapping away at their screens as I circle in the street.

Then they go home and down load all the data, which usually generates anguish and feelings of inadequacy -- pulse rate was too high, average speed too low, watts pathetic, last year I did this ride 2x faster, etc. I don't need a cyclometer to tell me that I feel like crap or that I'm getting slower. But then again, I'm not racing or pretending to train for anything.

-- Jay Beattie.

[Sir Ridesalot]

My sister does the exact same thing with some gizmo that logs her walking distances. Sometimes it's 10 minutes fiddling with the thing before she actually starts walking. Very annoying when you're ready to go and someone holds you up whilst fiddling with some device. For bicycles i like a nice simple computer that starts itself when the bike is moving. I just want distance for the trip and the distance for the tour if I ride a multi-day one. Even a simple Odometer and Trip Distance works for multi-day touring; just use the Trip Distance each dayto log your day's ride and reset it at night for the next day. I just set everything at zero including the odometer before setting out on tour.

Cheers

[Frank Krygowski]

On Thursday, October 3, 2013 12:29:27 PM UTC-4, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
> On Thursday, October 3, 2013 11:44:52 AM UTC-4, Jay Beattie wrote:
>
> > I have become accustomed to delaying the start of every ride while my friends get their satellite links established. It looks like tax season at H&R Block with everyone tapping away at their screens as I circle in the street.
>
> > Then they go home and down load all the data, which usually generates anguish and feelings of inadequacy -- pulse rate was too high, average speed too low, watts pathetic, last year I did this ride 2x faster, etc. I don't need a cyclometer to tell me that I feel like crap or that I'm getting slower. But then again, I'm not racing or pretending to train for anything.
>

> ...For bicycles i like a nice simple computer that starts itself when the bike is moving. I just want distance for the trip and the distance for the tour if I ride a multi-day one. Even a simple Odometer and Trip Distance works for multi-day touring; just use the Trip Distance each dayto log your day's ride and reset it at night for the next day. I just set everything at zero including the odometer before setting out on tour.

That's about right for me, too. I'll admit that when I first got an electronic cyclometer (as opposed to the click-click-click mechanically driven one) it probably did get me in better shape. It motivated me to ride faster. But these days I pay much less attention to speed. And download data to analyze? Heck, I already _know_ I'm getting older and slower. I don't need any more data on that than the calendar provides.

P.S. I just thought of an "OTOH." At various times over the years, our club has had minor problems with people showing up for rides that were a very bad match for their personal riding speed. I suppose if people had a good idea of their average speeds, they might be less likely to try to do a "brisk" ride at 9 mph, or to wonder why people on the "leisurely" ride aren't cranking at a nice, easy 20 mph.

- Frank Krygowski

[Duane]

Used to agree with you until I started doing group leader duties. We
have rides in areas that I don't know (Like Ontario...) and it's a pain
to deal with a map while riding and leading a group. Got a Garmin 800
for a present and use that. The maps we use are available in Garmin
format. I load the map at home before the ride. I turn it on and it
syncs the satellites in the parking lot. Generally takes less than a
minute. Gives me turn by turn directions during the ride and dipslays
what I care about - speed, cadence and time. Oh, and % grade.

Added benefit is that it records everything I want to know about a ride.
UI is a bit strange but I don't need it to do much when I'm riding. I
like data so it's nice to upload the ride info and track my progress.
Not that a basic computer isn't sufficient. I've used either a Cateye
Vectra or a Mavic for years and they were fine.

[Lou Holtman]

I go to my garage.
Pick a bike.
Click my garmin 810 in and turn it on.
While putting on my shoes or inflating my tires it is says Gps syncened .
Check.
Still while putting on my shoes it says bluetooth connection with my phone
established. Check.
After filling my waterbottle I start the Garmin and start my ride.
When I finished my ride I stop the Garmin and push the store button(touch
screen).
The data is automatically uploaded to my phone which uploads it to Garmin
connect online. No user action needed.
Take a shower and make some sandwiches.
Lying on the couch I start a Ipad app that syncs with Garmin connect and
presents the data in a pleasant format.
Browse through the data while eating my sandwiches.
Put Ipad away and carry on...

What hassle? Riding log is automatically updated with all the data. No
messing aroud with spreadsheets. No more map staring on every corner in
unfamiliar places or abroad. What is there not to like? Best gadget I have
ever bought. Is it a necessity? Hell no. Is it nice to have? Hell yes.
--
Lou

[datakoll]

YEAH I HAVE an older Cateye. Simplicity, compactness and truth arrow into bullseye.

SUPER. ahhhhh no switches, no candle , no kerosene, n coal...well not here but maybe over there.

Cmon Frank...WEEZ GOIN SWITCHLESS !!!!! WE GOT COLOR TV !!!! SAT RADIO WITH TWERPS...

I have a new doghouse computer for GPS road and marine. Need a double zillwager ? MiFi !!!!!!....bad weather NOAA RADAR ! eyeyyeahhahhahha no shitto Dude

PASS THE KEVLAR VINYLESTER GORETEX CF....

But this IPAD thing...there's a texting limit where you should be 'paying attention' not playing with the Iwhatever.

Still, State Farm hasn't begun screaming in Colorado or WA.

Here's muh piece on marine GPS:


aha ! how find the CSX floats ?

if you have not, read Burch - FUN DEMENTALS OF KAYAK NAVIGATION

and go dhow

See the seams on your GPS ? Wipe clean with dilute dishsoap, rinse and wipe with isopropyl. Cover seams with 3M 33 electrical tape.

Now on the Florida coast after buying West Coast Garmin charts of 6 years ago, I shelled out more for the East Coast.

I'm pleased. The maps are cheaper

Paddling near bottom countours via Garmin's NOAA maps is more fun here in low tideland than on high velocity Haro Strait with sea mounts an variable overfalls. The wee bit of extra velocity here exposes your experience directly onto nature's watercourse.

Big Carlos, east of Sanibel Island, described as a 'lake' is not. BC flows down around water hills, thru choppy channels, and downhill ! As experienced from the kayak and a Garmin charts equipped Csx. Where you may gradually develop a sense of place without Garmin, with Garmin and pretrip laptop planning, you are there right off the ramp.

If you need electronic reality, a pretrip track used for routing on water brings a Csx screen, 2 screens, with several windows of info each screen; eg distance made good, distance to go, time of arrival (or not), time to sundown, time to dinner, average speed when in motion....time to the next Cigarette....
Combining Burch, Garmin, and Google Earth with Goretex and Kevlar/CF....incroyable

and Burch.

Burch deepens your sensitivity to where, how and who you may be as a kayak mariner. A quality the GPS merely alludes.

.....

[Frank Krygowski]

On Thursday, October 3, 2013 4:31:29 PM UTC-4, Lou Holtman wrote:
> ...
> What hassle? Riding log is automatically updated with all the data. No
> messing aroud with spreadsheets. No more map staring on every corner in
> unfamiliar places or abroad. What is there not to like? Best gadget I have
> ever bought. Is it a necessity? Hell no. Is it nice to have? Hell yes.

Well, if you're into keeping data on every ride, and don't mind buying the various hardware, that's fine. And don't mind the government recording your every move, so they know where to send the black helicopters... ;-)

Seriously though, I often prefer using paper maps instead of a GPS. Why? Because when I've got turn-by-turn directions, I end up with much less knowledge of where I've actually been! A map engages my attention and puts things in context, giving me the big picture. It also allows me more spontaneity. I very frequently say "Hmm, I haven't been down that road for a while," or "Look! Fresh smooth pavement that way!"

To be fair, after completing a club ride that someone else has led, I frequently have to think hard to understand where we went. But on those occasions, my objective is more about social interaction. On solo rides, it's more about exploring.

- Frank Krygowski

[John B.]

I recently bought a Cateye that shows "carbon" savings as well as how
many calories I've burned. A perusal of the instructions shows that
the calorie count is "estimated" and the carbon is the amount of
exhaled breath I may have made. Real vital and accurate information.

But I suppose that 12 functions justify a higher price then 10
functions even though the added functions are only a line or two of
code burned into the firmware and likely cost the maker nothing.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[David Scheidt]

John B. <sloc...@gmail.com> wrote:

:But I suppose that 12 functions justify a higher price then 10

:functions even though the added functions are only a line or two of
:code burned into the firmware and likely cost the maker nothing.

One of the problems with tech devices. Once the software is written,
it costs nothing, or nearly nothing, to add it to devices. It costs
the user, by providing a more complicated device, and by providing a
new place for bugs. The last cycle computer I had was a cheap cheap
thing from Bell or Schwinn or someone. It replaced a visually
identical computer (fit in the same mount, used the same sensor). In
between the two, the software had changed. The new one had a bunch of
modes to show things that I didn't care about, but had lost the
ability to display the thing I cared about, speed an current time
together.

--
sig 11

[Duane]

Yeah, basically my experience with it. Except that I have the 800 which
doesn't connect to my phone. So when I plug it into the computer to
charge I have to click a couple buttons on the PC the load it into
Garmin Connect. Like I said, the best part for me is not having to
consult a map when I'm trying to lead a group but the stats are cool too.

[datakoll]

On Saturday, October 5, 2013 3:05:32 AM UTC-4, Phil W Lee wrote:
> Duane <duane....@group-upc.com> considered Fri, 04 Oct 2013

> I wouldn't dream of leading a ride without riding it solo in the week
>
> before. Just too much risk of roadworks and similar impediments.
>
> So any map or gps would only be in case of unplanned diversion.


<<<<<<<<<0>>>>>>>>>>>>


Lee plans his diversions ?

but seriously, a cyclocomputer not showing time/speed is prob improperly operated. No one in Asia produced a CC not showing time/speed. The poss of that is like a shift's rims going 702. Just beyond compre. Try the default button coupla times.

wow ! here comes Lee !

[Frank Krygowski]

On Saturday, October 5, 2013 3:05:32 AM UTC-4, Phil W Lee wrote:
>
> I wouldn't dream of leading a ride without riding it solo in the week
> before. Just too much risk of roadworks and similar impediments.

That's been my policy too, with only detail differences. Sometimes I'd have ridden it perhaps a month before, and perhaps used my motorcycle to scout any critical parts during the week before. On some rides I've thought of as "expeditions" - real challenges due to distance and terrain - I figure those likely to attend would be able to handle any adversity imposed by unplanned route changes.

Those changes did come up once or twice. I handled them by looking at maps. But then, I've always loved maps.

- Frank Krygowski

[Jay Beattie]

Like I said, some people get good use out of sophisticated cyclometers, and that's fine with me. I do use my iPhone for mapping sometimes, but in general, I just jump on my bike and ride some well worn route in to the country. I raced for 20 years and never kept a riding log, and now in my semi-decrepitude, it's unlikely that I would pay any attention to down-loaded data -- except maybe elevation, but that would just be for fun and not later study. I also do not post to Strava. Biometrics would just tell me that my power output sucks and that I should spin more. My friends will do that for free.

My cyclometer does track mileage, and I have a watch, which often tells me that it is time to go home and mow the lawn.

-- Jay Beattie.

[markhar...@gmail.com]

I have a full mount for avocet 25. Including the magnet. Not the computer. It is effectively new. Let me k ow if anyone wants it.

[Frank Krygowski]

On 4/16/2015 5:34 PM, markhar...@gmail.com wrote:
> I have a full mount for avocet 25. Including the magnet. Not the computer. It is effectively new. Let me k ow if anyone wants it.
>

Thanks, but no. I've got a couple extra Avocet mounts.

The only reason I'm replying is to say I spent yesterday reviving an
Avocet 30. I popped it open and cleaned contacts between the LCD screen
and the circuit board, and re-flexed the battery contacts. I also
cleaned up any nicks and imperfections that might have been preventing
the two halves of the body from closing completely. It had been getting
a little wonky, with the display dimming from time to time; then it
conked out completely on one ride.

Finicky work indeed. But I did it because I've still got Avocet mounts
on five bikes. I swap the computer between them.

--
- Frank Krygowski