What to do with my well-worn Steve Bauer Chinook?

[Ed Treijs]

Steve Bauer Chinook, an upper-mid-level sport bike from 1987. Looks
the '80s as well, with a salmon frame (ha ha it's a Chinook, get it?)
and yellow bar tape and water bottle/cage. Cyndi Lauper would be all
over this.

It's been in pretty hardcore commuter duty the past decade or so,
sometimes in crappy conditions. Some maintenance has been done, but
nothing comprehensive.

I tore it down (as far as I could) over the weekend and got pretty
depressed.

1. Front wheel:hub is brinelled. Oddly, the bearing balls in the front
wheel are a size smaller than the bearings in the rear wheel. Huh?
This wheel/hub is original 1987, I think the hub is Shimano and the
rim is definitely Araya.

2. Bottom bracket (an SR item), with the chain removed, spins freely
with a pronounced growl. It's never been overhauled, so undoubtedly is
dry.

3. Derailleur jockey wheels have worn to have basically sharp, pin-
like protusions instead of teeth

Headset and rear hub/bearing seem in good shape. Oddly, the chain has
only stretched about half a rivet's width: one end of my 12" ruler is
in the middle of the rivet, then at the other end it's just touching
the edge of the rivet. I am assuming that my freewheel and chainrings
can be reused after cleaning.

Other known issues/irritants:
1. Downtube shifters, already replaced once, are not working that
well, and some bit fell out of the front shifter a while back that
lets it slip and thus grind the front derailleur after every bump.
Rear indexed shifter is still indexed, but dodgy.
2. Quill pedals have bad bearing seals and get the grease washed out
very easily--they also spun easily with growling
3. Brake hood gum rubber covers are disintegrating, and I don't like
the black rubber replacements I'm offered--would ruin the '80s bright-
colour vibe of the bike
4. Shimano side-pull brakes work very poorly in the wet, despite
adjustment and the use of Kool-Stop salmon pads....not so great on a
commuter bike that travels through congested downtown traffic
5. Avocet Touring II saddle....originally purchased for my Bianchi in
the early 1980s....leather has peeled off the sides, though top is
still comfy.

So I see four choices here:
1. Pay to get everything fixed up....I imagine that means replacing
the bottom bracket and front wheel and a set of downtube shifters.(ha
ha, need seven-speed--bike was originally a six-speed, and that became
obsolete, so it's been fitted with seven-cog rear)
2. Get a new bike that may be more commute-friendly (I am envisioning
disc brakes and multispeed hub)
3. Grease/oil what I can and just ride on the bad bearings, it's not
like they can get much worse and I am not aware of catastrophic
failure modes--if there are any, please let me know!
4. Find a better/less-ridden Chinook and do some parts swapping.

(Idea #4 prompted by the comments at
http://www.canadiandesignresource.ca/officialgallery/sport/steve-bauer-chinook-road-bicycle/
)

I don't mind the riding position, and I like the light weight of the
bike. I am always the fastest person off the red light--downtube
shifter goes snick-snick-snick every second or two and I'm up to
speed.

[landotter]

> (Idea #4 prompted by the comments athttp://www.canadiandesignresource.ca/officialgallery/sport/steve-baue...

> )
>
> I don't mind the riding position, and I like the light weight of the
> bike. I am always the fastest person off the red light--downtube
> shifter goes snick-snick-snick every second or two and I'm up to
> speed.

If you're in love with the frame, get a donor bike from Craigslist.
Reads like the thing is worn out from stem to stern. Could also be an
option for a quick and dirty single speed conversion. Or get a cheap
used replacement commuter.

[Sir Ridesalot]

> (Idea #4 prompted by the comments athttp://www.canadiandesignresource.ca/officialgallery/sport/steve-baue...

> )
>
> I don't mind the riding position, and I like the light weight of the
> bike. I am always the fastest person off the red light--downtube
> shifter goes snick-snick-snick every second or two and I'm up to
> speed.

Hi.

If there's a bicycle co-op or bicycle recycling facility near you, you
might be able to get the parts you need inexpensively. If the front
hub is shot consider getting another one like it and respoking the
rim.

What general geographic area are you in? I might know of a shop that
may be able to help you locate some old parts.

Sometimes an old steel bike frame is worth keeping just for its
sentimental value and pleasing ride.

Cheers

[Ed Treijs]

On Feb 21, 10:22 pm, Sir Ridesalot <i_am_cycle_pat...@yahoo.ca> wrote:

> If there's a bicycle co-op or bicycle recycling facility near you, you
> might be able to get the parts you need inexpensively. If the front
> hub is shot consider getting another one like it and respoking the
> rim.

The front rim is 25 years old but does seem to be surviving well.

> What general geographic area are you in? I might know of a shop that
> may be able to help you locate some old parts.

Toronto. Specifically, I work downtown and live in Long Branch.

> Sometimes an old steel bike frame is worth keeping just for its
> sentimental value and pleasing ride.

I'm looking for efficiency, environmental and financial. Also, any
bike used for commuting will soon become non-pristine.

What would happen if I just squirted in some oil into the bottom
bracket and greased up the brinelled front hub? I know it's not good,
but what will happen exactly? What's the mode of failure for worn
parts like these? Can they possibly seize up or break off thus causing
injury?

If the wheel hub is toast, I'm not losing much by lubricating as I can
and continuing to ride, and I think I'm not risking much either?

....Ed

[David Scheidt]

Ed Treijs <ed.to...@gmail.com> wrote:

:On Feb 21, 10:22 pm, Sir Ridesalot <i_am_cycle_pat...@yahoo.ca> wrote:

:> If there's a bicycle co-op or bicycle recycling facility near you, you
:> might be able to get the parts you need inexpensively. If the front
:> hub is shot consider getting another one like it and respoking the
:> rim.

:The front rim is 25 years old but does seem to be surviving well.

Not worth rebuilding it.

:> What general geographic area are you in? I might know of a shop that

:> may be able to help you locate some old parts.

:Toronto. Specifically, I work downtown and live in Long Branch.

:> Sometimes an old steel bike frame is worth keeping just for its
:> sentimental value and pleasing ride.

:I'm looking for efficiency, environmental and financial. Also, any
:bike used for commuting will soon become non-pristine.

:What would happen if I just squirted in some oil into the bottom
:bracket and greased up the brinelled front hub? I know it's not good,
:but what will happen exactly? What's the mode of failure for worn
:parts like these? Can they possibly seize up or break off thus causing
:injury?

Worst case, they get so awful you can't turn them. not likely to
happen suddenly. I'd put new balls in the front hub, pack it up with
grease, and ignore it for a while. Maybe keep an eye out for a new
wheel. I'd spring for a new bottom
bracket, though (or rebuild the one you have, it's quite possible that it's
still in good shape and just needs new balls and grease). A nice
square taper IRD bottom bracket is 25 bucks.



--
sig 64

[Ed Treijs]

On Feb 22, 11:48 am, David Scheidt <dsche...@panix.com> wrote:

> :What would happen if I just squirted in some oil into the bottom
> :bracket and greased up the brinelled front hub? I know it's not good,
> :but what will happen exactly? What's the mode of failure for worn
> :parts like these? Can they possibly seize up or break off thus causing
> :injury?
>
> Worst case, they get so awful you can't turn them.  not likely to
> happen suddenly.  I'd put new balls in the front hub, pack it up with
> grease, and ignore it for a while.  Maybe keep an eye out for a new
> wheel.  I'd spring for a new bottom
> bracket, though (or rebuild the one you have, it's quite possible that it's
> still in good shape and just needs new balls and grease).  A nice
> square taper IRD bottom bracket is 25 bucks.

Well, I got some further bad news. My chainrings are worn, the large
one especially. They're 144mm diameter. The tech at Duke's Cycle said
"Oooh, gonna be expensive. Campagnolo makes some."

The project then turns into replacing the bottom bracket and crankset,
or forking out lots of money on hard-to-find chainrings.

I'm getting more inclined to greasing/lubing everything, throwing on a
new chain, and seeing how bad it skips.

More's the pity riding season has about started here.

[Sir Ridesalot]

Hi.

Northwest of you in Guelph there is a shop called Backpeddling that
has all sorts of vintage stuff. Some of it dates back to the late
1800s. It may not be the cheapest but they probably have what you'd
need for a vintage restoration. Unfortunately you pretty well need to
go there and root through bins of stuff to see if they have what you
want.

As far as your wheel and bottom bracket bearings go. Both of those are
most likely caged unitsin that a metal cage holds a certain number of
bearings. If you take out the caged bearings and put in new loose
bearings you'll get sn extra bearing or so in there and that often
helps smooth things out for a bit.

If your chainrings are badly worn a new chain might skip on them when
pedalling under load. Ah, rereading your comments shows that you are
aware of that. If the chain does skip maybee reversing the chainrings
would eliminate it for a while. You *MIGHT* be able to get some used
or new chainrings for a reasonable price off Evil Bay. I'd be more
inclined to just get a new or used crankset unless you reaqlly want to
keep the bike components as original as you can.

I hope this is of some help to you.

Good luck and cheers

[Jay Beattie]

Anyone over the age of 40 probably has a box of 144mm chain rings.
They were the standard -- Shimano, Sugino, Campagnolo, Ofmega, Zeus,
SunTour, etc., etc. Check eBay.

These days, though, you can buy an entire square drive crank -- one
nicer than the one you have.

http://www.universalcycles.com/shopping/product_details.php?id=46859&category=62

[Ed Treijs]

On Feb 22, 7:04 pm, Sir Ridesalot <i_am_cycle_pat...@yahoo.ca> wrote:

> Northwest of you in Guelph there is a shop called Backpeddling that
> has all sorts of vintage stuff. Some of it dates back to the late
> 1800s. It may not be the cheapest but they probably have what you'd
> need for a vintage restoration. Unfortunately you pretty well need to
> go there and root through bins of stuff to see if they have what you
> want.

I could make a trip out there. It's too bad Duke's burned down; I'm
sure they had all sorts of stuff squirreled away, and it's a lot
easier to get to.

> As far as your wheel and bottom bracket bearings go. Both of those are
> most likely caged unitsin that a metal cage holds a certain number of
> bearings. If you take out the caged bearings and put in new loose
> bearings you'll get sn extra bearing or so in there and that often
> helps smooth things out for a bit.

No, the wheel bearings for sure are loose balls, with cones on the
axle. If just the cones were brinelled, that would be easy. The "cup"
is brinelled, and that appears to be entirely integral to the hub.

As for the bottom bracket, I got the nut off the spindle on the chain
side, but am unable to budge it on the other side. I am guessing it is
RH thread, but am not sure. Doesn't move in either direction. I have
no idea what the bottom bracket bearings are linke. And then I don't
have the tools to pull the crank off the spindle. Would have to take
it to a bike shop.

> If your chainrings are badly worn a new chain might skip on them when
> pedalling under load. Ah, rereading your comments shows that you are
> aware of that. If the chain does skip maybee reversing the chainrings
> would eliminate it for a while. You *MIGHT* be able to get some used
> or new chainrings for a reasonable price off Evil Bay. I'd be more
> inclined to just get a new or used crankset unless you reaqlly want to
> keep the bike components as original as you can.

It's not so much a question of originality, although I do like the
fact that I have distinctively '80s bike such as would fit in with a
MuchMusic video. At some point, I have to wonder if it would make more
sense to just replace the entire bicycle with something a bit more
suitable for commuter duty. Except....I want a fast light commuter.
And it has to have fenders. And I can't really affort an upright
riding position, since 90% of my 20 km route is along the Lake Ontario
shoreline and headwinds are plentiful. So a Dutch-style bike is out of
the question (never mind that those seem to be mostly ridden by
stylish women in their '20, on which criteria I fail utterly).

I was thinking about flipping the chainrings, will have to see if it's
feasible. The chainrings are Salsa (already had to replace them once)--
but I don't see the size in Salsa's catalogue any more.

....Ed

[Dan O]

I commuted a lot of miles on an '86 Trek 400. It rains a lot here,
the original 80's hubs needed frequent servicing, and the rear cups
eventually pitted badly enough to rumble.

I replaced both wheels - rear got a nice (if esoteric) Mavic 500
cartridge bearing hub; the front got a Phil Wood cartridge bearing
hub. Ahhhhhhhh... so nice.

But then I got a new bike anyway - a Surly Long Haul Trucker. The
modern sealed hub bearings stand up extremely well to the weather.
The front hub has over 10,000 miles on the original grease. I have
never touched the cartridge bottom bracket, either. An expensive way
to go for decidely commodity character, but it serves me very well.
(The handling is kind of tank-like, but it's a bike, and I'm getting
used to it enough that thrashing is exhilerating.)

> I was thinking about flipping the chainrings, will have to see if it's
> feasible. The chainrings are Salsa (already had to replace them once)--
> but I don't see the size in Salsa's catalogue any more.
>

I hesitated to weigh in earlier, as you seemed torn between spending
money on a new bike or making do. Personally, I can't see making do
to such an extent as oiling a rumbly hub and not thinking about it,
but bicycling means an awful lot to me.

[Ed Treijs]

On Feb 23, 9:45 pm, Dan O <danover...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I hesitated to weigh in earlier, as you seemed torn between spending
> money on a new bike or making do.  Personally, I can't see making do
> to such an extent as oiling a rumbly hub and not thinking about it,
> but bicycling means an awful lot to me.

The problem is that when I start fixing up one thing, I will have to
fix up more things. I've put up with the crappy bearings, rattling
fenders, and slipping shifters for thousands of kilometres in the past
couple of years. In fact I didn't really notice the bearings, although
I had my suspicions about the front wheel bearings whenever I had the
wheel off to patch the tire.

Now, I haven't shopped for a bicycle since 2001.

But....I see lots of expensive high-end bikes for sale. And I see
"city" bikes with upright riding position and weatherproof components.
And I see "Duch" style bicycles. None of these are really suitable for
my needs.

What I am not sure I can find is a relatively simple, relatively light
bicycle like my this old Steve Bauer. It was a better-than-average
"racing bike" from the later days of the sport bike boom. It isn't so
nice that I would be scared to ride in the rain or on warmer winter
days when there is road salt about. It isn't so fragile that I am
scared of bumps, potholes, and streetcar tracks, all of which are
plentiful (hey, the front wheel is original....the orignial rear wheel
was taco'd in a stupid crash, or maybe it would have lasted too). It's
not so upright that I would give up riding on head-windy days. It's
light enough that I can move off stops quickly, and it's light enough
to carry easily when needed.

Maybe I should visit a fiew bike stores.

In the meantime, a colleague at work gave me the name of a shop that
did his bottom bracket for reasonable money; I will check them out.

[Sir Ridesalot]

On Feb 23, 9:09 am, Ed Treijs <ed.toro...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Feb 22, 7:04 pm, Sir Ridesalot <i_am_cycle_pat...@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>
> > Northwest of you in Guelph there is a shop called Backpeddling that
> > has all sorts of vintage stuff. Some of it dates back to the late
> > 1800s. It may not be the cheapest but they probably have what you'd
> > need for a vintage restoration. Unfortunately you pretty well need to
> > go there and root through bins of stuff to see if they have what you
> > want.
>
>

> As for the bottom bracket, I got the nut off the spindle on the chain
> side, but am unable to budge it on the other side. I am guessing it is
> RH thread, but am not sure. Doesn't move in either direction. I have
> no idea what the bottom bracket bearings are linke. And then I don't
> have the tools to pull the crank off the spindle. Would have to take
> it to a bike shop.
>

snipped
>
> ....Ed

A new square taper cartridge bottom bracket can be quite inexpensive
depending on which level you get. MEC has some at very low prices.

Did you remove the lockring on the adjustable left hand cup of your
bottom bracket?

Cheers

[Ed Treijs]

On Feb 24, 2:54 pm, Sir Ridesalot <i_am_cycle_pat...@yahoo.ca> wrote:

> A new square taper cartridge bottom bracket can be quite inexpensive
> depending on which level you get. MEC has some at very low prices.
>
> Did you remove the lockring on the adjustable left hand cup of your
> bottom bracket?

I got as far as getting the chain side crank nut off. Other side nut
doesn't want to come off. Is it RH or LH thread?

Niether do I have a puller to pull the cranks off the axle.

Not sure if it's worth buying the tools to do this.

[Dan O]

I can totally relate. I loved my '89 Miyata (too much to take it out
in the rain).

(I tacoed the Trek's original front wheel in a stupid crash, but then
wound up with the sweet, sweet Phil Wood / Mavic Module 3
replacement. All's well that ends well, right?)

> Maybe I should visit a fiew bike stores.
>

The Surly LHT complete bike wasn't cheap, but is smooth and capable
and reliable and not afraid of the rain.

> In the meantime, a colleague at work gave me the name of a shop that
> did his bottom bracket for reasonable money; I will check them out.

A good LBS is a glorious thing.

I lucked out and got tools for that stuff in a big package deal
including workstand and lots of ~vintage spare parts (wasn't cheap,
but... ) (Not sure what all's left any good after the garage flooded,
though - will find out by spring when I have to start building up kids
bikes again, I guess.)

[Sir Ridesalot]

Ah that explains a lot. I suggest you take th bike to a friendly bike
shop that will show you what need to be done. Pedler used to do that
for me many years ago. If you are only going to do it once it's not
worth the cost of the tools needed to do the job. This is where
bicycle co-ops are a real blessing.

The left hand nut hasthe same thread as the right hand nut does but
even if you get it off you need a crank puller, a lock ring tool and a
bottom bracket tool in order to gain access to the bearings. If you
decide to go with a sealed cartridge bottom bracket you also need a
fixed cup wrench. A square taper cartridge bracket uses hust one tool
for both sides. The shop might install the new unit for around $25.00
or so. That's what a shop in Kitchener charged me to swap a Veloce
square taper bottom bracket with a square taper unsealed one like
yours plus they installed my new crnkset for me. That was a few years
ago so I don't know if Toronto pricesare similar. You can call around
and ask.

I have an old mid-1980's black Miele that I too really like the ride
of. It originally had 27" wheels but I swapped them out for 700C x
30mm and full fenders. Last year I had True North Cycles ( Belwood
just north of Guelph) braze on rear rack mounts, cantilever brake
bridge and brake bosses and a pair of water bottle cage mounts under
the down tube. Hugh Black said he could and he did the work in an hour
whilst I waited so I wouldn't have to make a special trip just to pick
up the frame. Now the bike has been rebuilt with some slightly more
modern components and has many more years of life in it.

I haven't lived in Toronto for at least 20 years so I'm now unfamiliar
with which shops do what for how much. However, any decent shop will
tell you how to do something. In return for such advice i buy my parts
or tools from that shop. I dealt with Pedler for years and was very
pleased with their service.

Good luck and I hope you get your faithful steed road worthy again.

Cheers

[John B.]

Why the agony? It appears that the choices you are imposing on
yourself is (1) fix the old one, or (2) buy a new one. But you also
seem unsure that if you buy a new one it will be as comfortable to
ride as the old one.... so fix the old one. My guess is that it will
be cheaper then buying a new one.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[Frank Krygowski]

I was in the "fix the old bike" camp until this post of yours. Now I
think you have too little experience to pull this off in a reasonable
time.

It sounds like the bike is worth approximately zero on the open market.
So don't sell it or trade it in. Stash it in your basement and just
get yourself a decent bike to ride now.

Then slowly start taking this bike completely apart, greasing it where
applicable, and putting it back together. Don't even spend money on
replacement parts; put the money instead into a good book on fixing
bikes, plus the necessary tools. Use the bike to learn bike mechanics,
and once it's more or less fixed, either keep it for emergencies or
loans, or give it to a kid who has no bike.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[kolldata]

rebuilt a Raleigh '78 ? to contemporary specs with Deore, double
Sunrims...exellent touring equipment at February prices.....Nashbar
donated....
cost $700 ? Shop in XX was selling duplicates for $3
eyeyehahahhahawhooopshhhhh !

[Jay Beattie]

On Feb 24, 6:55 pm, Frank Krygowski <frkrygowREM...@gEEmail.com>
wrote:

I wouldn't make the investment in tools for a thirty year old bike --
not if I were going to get a modern road bike. Headset wrenches, BB
tools, crank puller, cone wrenches, etc., etc. Most of that stuff is
totally unnecessary with a modern road bike with boxed wheels. You
can fix a modern road bike with a pocket tool.

-- Jay Beattie.

[Dan O]

On Feb 24, 6:55 pm, Frank Krygowski <frkrygowREM...@gEEmail.com>
wrote:

> Ed Treijs wrote:
> > On Feb 24, 2:54 pm, Sir Ridesalot<i_am_cycle_pat...@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>
> >> A new square taper cartridge bottom bracket can be quite inexpensive
> >> depending on which level you get. MEC has some at very low prices.
>
> >> Did you remove the lockring on the adjustable left hand cup of your
> >> bottom bracket?
>
> > I got as far as getting the chain side crank nut off. Other side nut
> > doesn't want to come off. Is it RH or LH thread?
>
> > Niether do I have a puller to pull the cranks off the axle.
>
> > Not sure if it's worth buying the tools to do this.
>
> I was in the "fix the old bike" camp until this post of yours. Now I
> think you have too little experience to pull this off in a reasonable
> time.
>
> It sounds like the bike is worth approximately zero on the open market.
> So don't sell it or trade it in. Stash it in your basement and just
> get yourself a decent bike to ride now.
>
> Then slowly start taking this bike completely apart, greasing it where
> applicable, and putting it back together. Don't even spend money on

> replacement parts; put the money instead into a good book...

http://sheldonbrown.com/

> ... on fixing

> bikes, plus the necessary tools. Use the bike to learn bike mechanics,

There are coops and what not with tools and parts and help springing
up in some places. (Not coincidentally, infrastructure is also
springing up in these same places.)

> and once it's more or less fixed, either keep it for emergencies or
> loans, or give it to a kid who has no bike.
>

"Emergencies"? But he *loves* the bike (damn rare thing these days).
(I guess maybe you meant keep it as a backup. I can see that.)

[kolldata]

if you enjoyed your bike, you will enjoy riding the rebuild 10X more
so

a Shimano puller is an artful device, low cost and repays immediately
against LBS labor costs.

You need a propane blowtorch for heating nuts held on with rust or
locktite.

Utube may have a rebuild tutorial....

now is the time for buying rebuild and summer stock-tubes/tires/chains/
deray pulley wheels- parts from Nashbar, Jenson, Universal Cycles

[kolldata]

ach !

Loosescrews




biketoolsect

[Frank Krygowski]

I'd consider the purchase of some tools to be worth it on educational
grounds, similar to asking students to buy their own multimeter,
micrometer, etc. Yes, some of the tools needed to work on old bikes
might not be needed on a 2012 model; but I'd say a person who couldn't
pull a square taper crank (for example) isn't a competent bike
mechanic. Odds are the next bike he'd encounter with a BB problem
would have a square taper. Until those completely go away, the tool
is worth having.

And incidentally, I wouldn't necessarily buy a complete set of bike
tools (although my son-in-law chose to do that). Instead, I'd buy
just the quirky tools with no work-arounds. I was completely
disassembling my bikes before I bought a headset wrench or a bottom
bracket wrench, for example, because I could get by with general
purpose tools I already owned. But I couldn't adjust hubs without
cone wrenches, and I couldn't pull cranks without a crank puller...
once I'd moved away from cottered cranks, that is!

- Frank Krygowski

[Dan O]

Must every bicyclist be a "competent bike mechanic"? Where in this
thread does it indicate that as an objective. (And I think the OP
indicated that he *could* pull the crank if he had the tool, and
having tools is not a competency.)

(Sorry, but you were being supercilious again.)

> Odds are the next bike he'd encounter with a BB problem
> would have a square taper. Until those completely go away, the tool
> is worth having.
>

Worth having - certainly. But is it worth buying? I got lucky and
scored a full complement of tools in one (not inexpensive, but very
valuable) purchase. But I was lucky.

> And incidentally, I wouldn't necessarily buy a complete set of bike
> tools (although my son-in-law chose to do that). Instead, I'd buy
> just the quirky tools with no work-arounds.

Then you'd be constantly stymied again and again until you got around
to getting that tool. Your "learning to work on bikes" would be
severely impeded, and you'd spend a lot more buying tools when the
demand side of supply and demand was most pressing.

> I was completely
> disassembling my bikes before I bought a headset wrench or a bottom
> bracket wrench, for example, because I could get by with general
> purpose tools I already owned.

I got the impression that the OP is similarly "competent".

> But I couldn't adjust hubs without

> cone wrenches...

What, no file to make your own cone wrench? :-)

[Frank Krygowski]

On Feb 26, 12:49 am, Dan O <danover...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Must every bicyclist be a "competent bike mechanic"?  Where in this
> thread does it indicate that as an objective.  (And I think the OP
> indicated that he *could* pull the crank if he had the tool, and
> having tools is not a competency.)
>
> (Sorry, but you were being supercilious again.)

And you're being stupidly argumentative again. Did I _say_ that every
bicyclist must be a competent mechanic? Did I even say that the
original poster must become a competent mechanic? No! I simply
recommended learning.

Obviously, there are plenty of people who see no need to learn _any_
bike mechanics, even though they ride bikes. I've saved dozens of them
from calling taxis or walking miles pushing their bikes.

You may think those folks are brilliant. Fine. But my recommendation
stands: I think this stuff is good to learn if you're going to ride a
bike. Anyone, including you and the OP, is free to choose otherwise.

BTW, your further comments on tools were even more foolish, and thus
not worth response.

- Frank Krygowski

[Dan O]

On Feb 25, 10:15 pm, Frank Krygowski <frkry...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Feb 26, 12:49 am, Dan O <danover...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>

(Wherein Frank bemoans yet another perceived lack of "competency".)

>
> > Must every bicyclist be a "competent bike mechanic"? Where in this
> > thread does it indicate that as an objective. (And I think the OP
> > indicated that he *could* pull the crank if he had the tool, and
> > having tools is not a competency.)
>
> > (Sorry, but you were being supercilious again.)
>
> And you're being stupidly argumentative again. Did I _say_ that every
> bicyclist must be a competent mechanic? Did I even say that the
> original poster must become a competent mechanic? No! I simply
> recommended learning.
>
> Obviously, there are plenty of people who see no need to learn _any_
> bike mechanics, even though they ride bikes. I've saved dozens of them
> from calling taxis or walking miles pushing their bikes.
>

What a hero.

> You may think those folks are brilliant. Fine. But my recommendation
> stands: I think this stuff is good to learn if you're going to ride a
> bike. Anyone, including you and the OP, is free to choose otherwise.
>
> BTW, your further comments on tools were even more foolish, and thus
> not worth response.
>

Whjeeeee! :-)

[Dan O]

On Feb 25, 10:15 pm, Frank Krygowski <frkry...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Feb 26, 12:49 am, Dan O <danover...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Must every bicyclist be a "competent bike mechanic"? Where in this
> > thread does it indicate that as an objective. (And I think the OP
> > indicated that he *could* pull the crank if he had the tool, and
> > having tools is not a competency.)
>
> > (Sorry, but you were being supercilious again.)
>
> And you're being stupidly argumentative again. Did I _say_ that every
> bicyclist must be a competent mechanic? Did I even say that the
> original poster must become a competent mechanic? No! I simply
> recommended learning.
>

You recommended the purchase of tools. Your reasoning was that a

person who couldn't pull a square taper crank (for example) isn't a
competent bike mechanic.

> Obviously, there are plenty of people who see no need to learn _any_
> bike mechanics, even though they ride bikes. I've saved dozens of them
> from calling taxis or walking miles pushing their bikes.
>
> You may think those folks are brilliant.

I really couldn't say; they're *your* dozens.

> Fine. But my recommendation
> stands: I think this stuff is good to learn if you're going to ride a
> bike.

I thought you were a bicycling advocate. Now you think they all ought
to be competent mechanics?)

<snip>

[Lou Holtman]

Op 21-2-2012 18:58, Ed Treijs schreef:

> http://www.canadiandesignresource.ca/officialgallery/sport/steve-bauer-chinook-road-bicycle/

> )
>
> I don't mind the riding position, and I like the light weight of the
> bike. I am always the fastest person off the red light--downtube
> shifter goes snick-snick-snick every second or two and I'm up to
> speed.
>

There are 2 reasons to fix a bike with so many issues:
1. you take pride in fixing it. Buy the tools and parts and go for it,
2. financial reasons.

It is wrong to think that you can't have a new bike with the same
(riding) properties.

Lou

[kolldata]

add f

yeah but beyond the visible...rebuild equals understanding in a deeper
psychological sense where the uh energy sum of bicycle system' begins'
only begins mating or meshing with the rider's system.

from this plateau, if sympatico develops, if, caws you may not climb
up right off, you and bicycle system can move forward, upward to new
areas of thought,, activity, riding, awarenss of riding
environment....basically deeper satisfaction from this life's
experience.

the simplicity access here is one of the bicycle system and motorcycle
system's significant experience advantage over the motorcar
experience, which has become not so simple in any category, time
money, space,

our RBT attitude is if you donnah try it .....

[Sir Ridesalot]

> (Idea #4 prompted by the comments athttp://www.canadiandesignresource.ca/officialgallery/sport/steve-baue...

> )
>
> I don't mind the riding position, and I like the light weight of the
> bike. I am always the fastest person off the red light--downtube
> shifter goes snick-snick-snick every second or two and I'm up to
> speed.

Hey Ed. Is it okay if I send you an email? I have apossible solution
to offer.

Cheers

[Ed Treijs]

On Feb 24, 9:55 pm, Frank Krygowski <frkrygowREM...@gEEmail.com>
wrote:

> I was in the "fix the old bike" camp until this post of yours.  Now I
> think you have too little experience to pull this off in a reasonable
> time.

Zippo experience in bottom brackets or headsets. I have accumulated
various cone wrenches and freewheel pullers, so that's not so bad. I
also invested in a bike stand because I have gotten tired for working
on bicycles suspended from chairs and such. I have full sets of metric
and SAE wrenches, sockets, hex drives, etc etc., mainly geared to
automotive mechanics.

I completely agree that the first time I do something, it takes ages
and mistakes can triple the time required (because taking it all apart
can be as hard as putting it together wrong).

> It sounds like the bike is worth approximately zero on the open market.
>   So don't sell it or trade it in.  Stash it in your basement and just
> get yourself a decent bike to ride now.
>
> Then slowly start taking this bike completely apart, greasing it where
> applicable, and putting it back together.  Don't even spend money on
> replacement parts; put the money instead into a good book on fixing
> bikes, plus the necessary tools.  Use the bike to learn bike mechanics,
> and once it's more or less fixed, either keep it for emergencies or
> loans, or give it to a kid who has no bike.

My goal is not to become a bike mechanic, my goal is to have a bike to
ride. I have purchased exactly three bicycles in the past 25 years,
and I still own and ride them. (Okay, I haven't been on my nice light
mountain bike in a couple of years.) I don't need a "spare" bike; any
more than I need a "spare" car to drive.

If I purchased a new bike, I'd donate this or otherwise dispose of the
Steve Bauer. I tinker too much already. (Wasted Sunday afternoon doing
a nice job installing a stereo in my car, discovered that I had
confused left and right channels, and now I have to redo everything.)
While it probably would make a nice fixie as somone suggested, I have
no desire to own a fixie and my knees would not thank me if I tried to
ride on.

On the other hand, taking this existing bicycle to a shop that's
willing to completely overhaul and fix everything, source better-
working downtube shifters, etc. etc. will leave the bike out of
commission for a long time and will cost a silly amount. If the
various parts weren't obsolete or hard-to-find (such as gum rubber
brake boots) I would be more keen on fixing everything, but again I
don't really want to become a connoisseur of vintage bicycle parts.
And after a restoration, would I want to ride it in commuter
conditions?

But, there's something nice about snicking through the gears on an
indexed downtube shifter. Beats the various Shiman rapidfire rigs on
my two other bikes. I don't know how well I'd like brifters, which I
suppose is what I'd be left with. I guess I need to visit some bike
shops and do some test rides. I do know I won't miss the poor braking
system.

[Ed Treijs]

On Feb 26, 1:15 am, Frank Krygowski <frkry...@gmail.com> wrote:

> And you're being stupidly argumentative again.  Did I _say_ that every
> bicyclist must be a competent mechanic?  Did I even say that the
> original poster must become a competent mechanic?  No!  I simply
> recommended learning.
>
> Obviously, there are plenty of people who see no need to learn _any_
> bike mechanics, even though they ride bikes. I've saved dozens of them
> from calling taxis or walking miles pushing their bikes.
>
> You may think those folks are brilliant.  Fine. But my recommendation
> stands: I think this stuff is good to learn if you're going to ride a
> bike. Anyone, including you and the OP, is free to choose otherwise.

Frank, this is the first bottom bracket issue I'm faced with in 30+
years of riding. I am happy to have shop which has the correct tools
and expertise to deal with it.

Granted, I may have run this bike into the ground, but I have never
had to take a taxi or walk with this bicycle that I can recall. When a
shifter cable snaps, well that's what the other gears are for. Flat
tire? No problem, fix on the spot and continue. I can't imagine any
situation where I would even want to adjust the hub bearings, let
alone do a bottom bracket overhaul on the side of the road.

[Ed Treijs]

On Feb 26, 10:20 pm, Sir Ridesalot <i_am_cycle_pat...@yahoo.ca> wrote:

> Hey Ed. Is it okay if I send you an email? I have apossible solution
> to offer.
>
> Cheers

Sure,
ed
<dot>
toronto
<at>
gmail
<dot>>
com

Do spammers still bother harvesting from Usenet???

I'll watch for an email. Happy to hear of solutions.

....Ed

[Frank Krygowski]

Ed Treijs wrote:
> On Feb 26, 1:15 am, Frank Krygowski<frkry...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> And you're being stupidly argumentative again. Did I _say_ that every
>> bicyclist must be a competent mechanic? Did I even say that the
>> original poster must become a competent mechanic? No! I simply
>> recommended learning.
>>
>> Obviously, there are plenty of people who see no need to learn _any_
>> bike mechanics, even though they ride bikes. I've saved dozens of them
>> from calling taxis or walking miles pushing their bikes.
>>
>> You may think those folks are brilliant. Fine. But my recommendation
>> stands: I think this stuff is good to learn if you're going to ride a
>> bike. Anyone, including you and the OP, is free to choose otherwise.
>
> Frank, this is the first bottom bracket issue I'm faced with in 30+
> years of riding. I am happy to have shop which has the correct tools
> and expertise to deal with it.

That surprises me. I started biking (avidly, as an adult, that is) in
1972 or '73. I probably worked on my first bottom bracket in 1974.

When you asked whether the left hand crank bolt might have left hand
threads, I figured you were completely new to bike mechanics. Since
you're not, I'll retract most of what I'd said.

In particular, you now said "I have accumulated various cone wrenches

and freewheel pullers, so that's not so bad. I also invested in a bike
stand because I have gotten tired for working on bicycles suspended from
chairs and such. I have full sets of metric and SAE wrenches, sockets,
hex drives, etc etc., mainly geared to automotive mechanics."

OK, heck, you're pretty much set. Get a crank puller; they're cheap!

You might want to check out http://www.parktool.com/blog/repair-help
Lots of useful information there.


--
- Frank Krygowski

[David Scheidt]

Ed Treijs <ed.to...@gmail.com> wrote:
:On Feb 24, 9:55 pm, Frank Krygowski <frkrygowREM...@gEEmail.com>

:wrote:

:> I was in the "fix the old bike" camp until this post of yours.  Now I
:> think you have too little experience to pull this off in a reasonable
:> time.

:Zippo experience in bottom brackets or headsets. I have accumulated
:various cone wrenches and freewheel pullers, so that's not so bad. I
:also invested in a bike stand because I have gotten tired for working
:on bicycles suspended from chairs and such. I have full sets of metric
:and SAE wrenches, sockets, hex drives, etc etc., mainly geared to
:automotive mechanics.

:I completely agree that the first time I do something, it takes ages
:and mistakes can triple the time required (because taking it all apart
:can be as hard as putting it together wrong).

You don't need much more than that. A crank puller, and a tool to install
a cartridge bottom bracket. Total cost about 30 bucks. Since you're
going to throw the old bb away, you can remove the adjustable side
with a punch, and the fixed side with a "sheldon tool"
(http://sheldonbrown.com/tooltips/bbcups.html), which is a bolt, a nut
and some washers.

New bottom bracket, tools, crankset, chain total cost about $!30 bucks
and a lazy afternoon.

:shops and do some test rides. I do know I won't miss the poor braking
:system.

A pair of modern double pivot sidepulls is about 65 bucks.


--
sig 22

[Dan O]

On Feb 27, 9:37 am, David Scheidt <dsche...@panix.com> wrote:

> Ed Treijs <ed.toro...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> :On Feb 24, 9:55 pm, Frank Krygowski <frkrygowREM...@gEEmail.com>
> :wrote:
>
> :> I was in the "fix the old bike" camp until this post of yours.  Now I
> :> think you have too little experience to pull this off in a reasonable
> :> time.
>
> :Zippo experience in bottom brackets or headsets. I have accumulated
> :various cone wrenches and freewheel pullers, so that's not so bad. I
> :also invested in a bike stand because I have gotten tired for working
> :on bicycles suspended from chairs and such. I have full sets of metric
> :and SAE wrenches, sockets, hex drives, etc etc., mainly geared to
> :automotive mechanics.
>
> :I completely agree that the first time I do something, it takes ages
> :and mistakes can triple the time required (because taking it all apart
> :can be as hard as putting it together wrong).
>
> You don't need much more than that.  A crank puller, and a tool to install
> a cartridge bottom bracket. Total cost about 30 bucks.  Since you're
> going to throw the old bb away, you can remove the adjustable side
> with a punch, and the fixed side with a "sheldon tool"
> (http://sheldonbrown.com/tooltips/bbcups.html), which is a bolt, a nut
> and some washers.
>
> New bottom bracket, tools, crankset, chain total cost about $!30 bucks
> and a lazy afternoon.
>

Well, he needs a new front hub (at least), too. In fact, the bike
could probably stand a stem-to-stern going over, at least.

[Sir Ridesalot]

Will send email shortly.

Cheers

[Jay Beattie]

On Feb 27, 8:58 am, Frank Krygowski <frkrygowREM...@gEEmail.com>
wrote:

> You might want to check outhttp://www.parktool.com/blog/repair-help

> Lots of useful information there.

If I owned this bike and was not motivated to fix it or paying to get
it fixed, I would sell it to a hobbyist who is -- then I would go and
buy a Kona or a Jamis or one of the real bang for the buck bikes that
has parts I can replace from current stock and can be fixed with a
pocket tool, plus or minus a tool or two (cassette tool, chain whip,
park chain plier). Go here. http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/road_bikes.htm
Buy cheap. Keep the economony strong!

[James]

On 28/02/12 11:11, Jay Beattie wrote:

<snip>

> park chain plier). Go here. http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/road_bikes.htm
> Buy cheap. Keep the economony strong!

I like the look of this one:

http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/motobecane/lechamp_teamti_10.htm

Even more so had it been equipped with Chorus or better.

Chalo would vomit at the wheels no doubt.

--
JS.

[Sir Ridesalot]

On Feb 28, 4:01 pm, James <james.e.stew...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 28/02/12 11:11, Jay Beattie wrote:
>
> <snip>
>

> > park chain plier). Go here.http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/road_bikes.htm

> > Buy cheap.  Keep the economony strong!
>
> I like the look of this one:
>
> http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/motobecane/lechamp_teamti_10.htm
>
> Even more so had it been equipped with Chorus or better.
>
> Chalo would vomit at the wheels no doubt.
>
> --
> JS.

The Bike Direct bikes look like good deaks but they do not ship to
Canada where the OP is. Having it shipped to the location recommended
by BD and then from there to Canada + the dutyand taxes would
significantly increas the cost of the package.

The OP and I have worked something out where it looks like his Chinook
will be restored to a satisfactory condition without costing a lot of
money.

Cheers

[Ed Treijs]

On Feb 27, 11:58 am, Frank Krygowski <frkrygowREM...@gEEmail.com>
wrote:

> Ed Treijs wrote:

> > Frank, this is the first bottom bracket issue I'm faced with in 30+
> > years of riding. I am happy to have shop which has the correct tools
> > and expertise to deal with it.
>
> That surprises me.  I started biking (avidly, as an adult, that is) in
> 1972 or '73.  I probably worked on my first bottom bracket in 1974.

Perhaps I'm just better at ignoring bad bottom bracket issues.

> When you asked whether the left hand crank bolt might have left hand
> threads, I figured you were completely new to bike mechanics.  Since
> you're not, I'll retract most of what I'd said.

I asked because of my esperience pulling pedals from the cranks. It
really does not help if you are inadvertently tightening the pedals
while thinking boy, this is really stuck, needs more force. I guess
the crank nut does not require backwards thread because there's no
epicycling motion.

> In particular, you now said "I have accumulated various cone wrenches
> and freewheel pullers, so that's not so bad. I also invested in a bike
> stand because I have gotten tired for working on bicycles suspended from
> chairs and such. I have full sets of metric and SAE wrenches, sockets,
> hex drives, etc etc., mainly geared to automotive mechanics."

It's a random selection of tools.

The coolest tool is something that looks like a miniature Henry Moore
sculpture, but I believe it's actually a Suntour freewheel remover.
It's a big rounded aluminum casting designed to be turned by a
seatpost or something. Not likely that I will ever need it again,
though. My Bianchi may have had Suntour, or maybe it was the Centurion
LeMans. Both the victims of frame injury back in the 1980s.

> OK, heck, you're pretty much set.  Get a crank puller; they're cheap!

Or get a bit of help from Sir Ridesalot.

Tackling it this Saturday....will let everyone know how it goes.

....Ed

[AMuzi]

"It's a big rounded aluminum casting ..."

It's probably Angel Rodriguez' Pocket Pro freewheel tool holder

[kolldata]

OBSOLETE TEN SPEED TOOL GRIEF-HANDWRINGING is surly offset by NOT
DOING IT AGAIN

[kolldata]

is Steve relation of Eddie ? If so, does the relationship show on the bike ?

[Ed Treijs]

On Mar 2, 1:19 pm, Ed Treijs <ed.toro...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Tackling it this Saturday....will let everyone know how it goes.

Right, so the verdict is, success.

Took two of us pretty much an entire Saturday, which included a trip
to a neighbouring town for parts.

Expense turned out to be around $70 plus a KMC chain that I purchased
a long time ago, plus some "High Temp Disc Brake Grease Suitable for
Marine Use Also" grease. Plus some large bearing balls I already had,
and some teensy ones for the pedals.

Bottom bracket turned out to be in good shape when disassembled,
though the grease had turned into a minimal bit of black putty. The
spindle had a bit of wear on the ring side (I think) but the cups and
bearings looked fine. Front and back wheels got new bearing balls and
cones. The front hub remains worn, but works smoothly enough with
fresh grease.

Derailleurs were removed and cleaned with new jockey pulleys
installed, new shifters and cables installed, and new chain went on.
Chainrings and freewheel kept.

Headset was judged fine and left as is.

So replacement parts would have been:
--Crank spindle
--Front and back wheel cones and bearing balls
--New chain
--Used Shimano SIS shifters, new cables, new housing (a nice feature
of downtube shifters is that the only cable housing is a very short
piece to the rear derailleur)
--Used rear derailleur jockey pulleys
--Extra bearing balls for the pedals to top up the count (every time I
had the pedals apart a few balls escaped and got lost)

Sunday I put everything together, cleaning up the rims and brake pads
and sort-of truing the rear wheel a bit.

The good news is that the chain does not skip in any gears, so the
ring and freewheel are fine. The front derailleur may require a bit of
adjustment, but the rear was spot on (or almost).

I think that I should just schedule a monthly cleanup for the bike.
With the bike stand, it's a lot easier to do. And annually, change the
chain and grease the bearings. Except the bottom bracket, it should
now be good for at least another decade or two (to judge by how it
lived through its first 25 years).

....Ed

[Frank Krygowski]

Congratulations!

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Ed Treijs]

On Mar 3, 11:44 pm, kolldata <datak...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> is Steve relation of Eddie ? If so, does the relationship show on the bike ?

Oh, now I get it.

No, Steve Bauer was a Candian cyclist who had a fair amount of success
in the 1980s and 1990s. A fair amount by Canadian standards, anyway.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Bauer

While the bike is made in Japan or Taiwan (I think), it's nice to have
a Canadian name on it. Being in Canada and all.

....Ed

[Sir Ridesalot]

The *ONLY* reason the shifters were change wasbecause they old ones
were 6 speed and the freewheel had 7 cogs.

It's a nice bike and is fairly light considering when it ws made. The
best thing is that for Ed the fit is nearly perfect.

Cheers

[Ed Treijs]

On Mar 5, 7:25 pm, Sir Ridesalot <i_am_cycle_pat...@yahoo.ca> wrote:

> The *ONLY* reason the shifters were change wasbecause they old ones
> were 6 speed and the freewheel had 7 cogs.

Mmm, not quite. The front shifter had some broken bits so it was
slipping and also could be pivoted forward below the tube at which
point it interfered with the steering crown (which I discovered the
hard way). The back shifter's click stops were not all that positive
and had a bit of play and could overshift. With the new shifter, it's
just "click" and no wiggling the lever around.

It does seem that the new shifters are heavier in action than the old
ones. I'll get used to that.

....Ed