Removing cranks with reverse threads
Dre
to remove.
The problem is the threads that you screw your standard crank puller into
are reverse threaded. So my crank pullers wont fit. I had a look on the
internet but couldn't find much info on reverse thread crank pullers. I've
emailled Deity but they havn't replied as yet.
Does anyone know of or has anyone seen a reverse threaded crank puller???
Anything other than a standard crank puller (3 prong puller for example)
wont work as the crank to axle fit is a *bloody* tight fit...
Cheers Dre
AMuzi
If it's m22x1 reverse then just use a Campagnolo C-Record
puller or see any competent LBS which commonly services
bicycles.
--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
Hank
No idea if the threading is the same, but Campy C-Record and Croce
d'Aune with self-extractors had LH thread.
Biketoolsetc normally stocks that tool, but they're out right now.
http://tinyurl.com/camplhtool
You see them pop up on ebay sometimes, too. I'd check with a shop that
does a lot of Campy, if you just need them pulled to work on the BB.
Hank
Wait..it looks like these come with self-extractors. Was there a
dustcap that you removed before the bolt? If so, put both back on,
tightening the dustcap as much as possible, and unscrew the bolt with
the dustcap still in place. That should pull off the arms.
Dre
news:h81on2$tlq$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
Thanks I'll check it out. All the LBS's in my area went WTF when I asked
them...
Cheers Dre
Dre
news:e604b287-6963-4dfc...@2g2000prl.googlegroups.com...
-----------------
Hi, thanks for the info re the Campy puller, I'll check it out.
And yes, they do come with dust caps...BUUUUUUUUUT the dust caps are made of
aluminium and the crank to axle fit is sooooo tight that as soon as I put
any force on my allen key, the dust caps just blew apart, the threads on
them simply sheared off in one piece. There is no way a small aluminum cap
like that can take the force of that crank/axle fit. Its incredibly bloody
tight. I've never ever had to fit a crank that tight (the manual states
this and I did fit it correctly).
I've now spoken to a few bike mechanics and they have all come to the
agreement that the axle needs to be knocked out. The earlier version of
thse cranks came with a tool that screws into the crank arm and has a pin
running through it. You hit the bejeesus out of the pin and it knocks the
axle out of the crank. Thats what I'm looking at atm unless Deity come back
with something else...
Cheers Dre
AMuzi
>>> Hi all, I have a set of Deity Vendetta cranks fitted to my Riot which I
>>> need to remove.
>>> The problem is the threads that you screw your standard crank puller into
>>> are reverse threaded. So my crank pullers wont fit. I had a look on the
>>> internet but couldn't find much info on reverse thread crank pullers.
>>> I've emailled Deity but they havn't replied as yet.
>>> Does anyone know of or has anyone seen a reverse threaded crank puller???
>>> Anything other than a standard crank puller (3 prong puller for example)
>>> wont work as the crank to axle fit is a *bloody* tight fit...
> "AMuzi" <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote
>> If it's m22x1 reverse then just use a Campagnolo C-Record puller or see
>> any competent LBS which commonly services bicycles.
Dre wrote:
> Thanks I'll check it out. All the LBS's in my area went WTF when I asked
> them...
> Cheers Dre
Where? Near me or Peter Chisholm or John Dacey perhaps?
Dre
Ummmm, not quite, I live in Australia :)
No one near me does anything Campy so thats probably why they had no idea...
Cheers Dre
Hank
> "Hank" <h...@wirtznet.net> wrote in message
Well, they sell spare dustcaps AND the tool to tighten them down. Any
time I've run into a stripped puller thread, it's because it wasn't
tight enough.
Dre
http://deitycomponentsstore.com/cranksets.html
----------------
That tool wont tighten them down any more than a standard pin spanner/wrench
which I used to *totally* bottom them out on the threads. If you
knew/experienced how much force I had to put on the allen key to get the
crank onto the axle you would instantly see that those little aluminium caps
have absolutely no chance against a tight fit between a chromoly axle and
the chromoly crank arms. These aren't aluminium cranks here, they are
chromoly and the fit is incredibly tight.
The instructions warn about this tight fit and stress to use as much grease
as you can, which I did. I was still amazed at how much force I had to put
on the bolt to get them on in the first place. I'm talking close to half a
meter (40cm) of leverage on the allen key to get the cranks onto the axle,
and even then I was really putting serious muscle onto the extension bar.
Think the tightest stuckdest cranks you have ever had, then times that by 10
:)
Cheers Dre
Chalo
>
> Dre wrote:
> >
> > Does anyone know of or has anyone seen a reverse threaded crank puller???
> > Anything other than a standard crank puller (3 prong puller for example)
> > wont work as the crank to axle fit is a *bloody* tight fit...
>
> If it's m22x1 reverse then just use a Campagnolo C-Record
> puller or see any competent LBS which commonly services
> bicycles.
Why in Zarathustra's hallowed name would anybody use a LH thread for
an extractor? It's like the punchline to some esoteric joke made at
the expense of Italian engineers.
Chalo
Dre
news:2172e105-e9f6-4227...@q7g2000yqi.googlegroups.com...
I know, I totally agree. If I had know these cranks had reverse threaded
extraction threads I would have steered clear by a long shot. I certainly
didn't think I had to check for this when I bought them...
I absolutely guarantee that from now on when I ask if the cranks I'm about
to buy have reverse threads the people selling them are all going to look at
me like I'm an idiot!
Oh well, live and learn. At the end of the day if I cant bash em off, I'll
bloody grind em off and send them back for lifetime warrenty (inc crash
damage) and tell them I crashed into a running angle grinder :)
Cheers Dre
Chalo
>
> If you
> knew/experienced how much force I had to put on the allen key to get the
> crank onto the axle you would instantly see that those little aluminium caps
> have absolutely no chance against a tight fit between a chromoly axle and
> the chromoly crank arms. These aren't aluminium cranks here, they are
> chromoly and the fit is incredibly tight.
48-spline chromoly cranks like that can have highly variable
interference fits. I have some that I can push on and extract without
tools, and others from the same manufacturer (Profile) that take a lot
of torque on a well-greased fastener to install.
For what it's worth, Profile cranks have no extractor threads. They
furnish a shoulder bolt-like tool that is screwed all the way into the
spindle bolt hole and then pounded with a mallet to drive the spindle
out of the crank spline. Obviously this is not ideal for the bottom
bracket bearings, but in most cases it seems to work OK.
You could use an 8mm bolt with the same threading as your BB spindle,
plus a stack of washers, to accomplish a similar feat with your
cranks. It sounds like it would probably be too much to ask of your
bottom bracket bearings in this particular case.
There were many mechanical virtues sacrificed by BMX manufacturers in
the rush to adopt "Euro" threaded BB shells instead of the traditional
American/OPC shell. One of those virtues was the ability to use big,
strong bearings that can take serious axial loads.
Chalo
Dre
Chalo
-----------------
What you have just described is the same type of tool that Deity used to use
with the first generation of Vendetta cranks. This is what I was
recommended to try by my local bike shops. It does sound bad but atm thats
the only thing I can think that will do it. I'm thinking I put the drive
side bottom bracket cup (its got a lip) onto as solid piece of wood as I
can, brace the rest of the frame so it doesn't hit or scratch anything.
Then hit the shit out of the axle which *should* knock the whole drive side
crank with attached axle out the drive side. Its going to sound nasty but
hey, I might be able to save the crank this way. If it doesn't move one bit
after some really solid hits, I get the grinder out and death to the
Vendetta :)
Re the highly variable interferace fits, I think I have a bloody tight one
:) It doens't help that the crank arms have been spray painted very thickly
and I think that is adding to it. The pedals were hard to get started too,
hard to put a far bit more pressure on the axle as normal.
Cheers Dre
bjwe...@gmail.com
I *think* that the idea is that for a normal
self-extractor, you are turning the crank bolt
left (counter-clockwise) to back it out, pushing
against the extractor cap to remove the crank.
If there is more frictional torque between the bolt
and cap than between the cap and the crank,
backing out the bolt will unscrew a RH-thread
extractor cap rather than removing the crank.
A LH-thread cap doesn't have this "problem."
I don't think this happens often in practice (at least
not if you remember to grease the bolt-cap interface)
and LH-thread extractor caps seem like one of those
things that happen when you let engineers
over-optimize a design. Somebody comes up with
a design that is more theoretically perfect, but in
actual service it causes more problems than it
solved.
Cranks that have to be put on so tight that they
can't practically be pulled without hammering off
also strike me as an engineering problem.
The square taper interface has many failings, but
"improvements" on it aren't always. Sometimes
I think designers should have to take the paraphrase
of the Hippocratic Oath: "First, do no harm."
Ben
AMuzi
>>> Does anyone know of or has anyone seen a reverse threaded crank puller???
>>> Anything other than a standard crank puller (3 prong puller for example)
>>> wont work as the crank to axle fit is a *bloody* tight fit...
> AMuzi wrote:
>> If it's m22x1 reverse then just use a Campagnolo C-Record
>> puller or see any competent LBS which commonly services
>> bicycles.
Chalo wrote:
> Why in Zarathustra's hallowed name would anybody use a LH thread for
> an extractor? It's like the punchline to some esoteric joke made at
> the expense of Italian engineers.
Specifically for a self extractor system it wasn't unreasonable.
Michael Press
wrote:
[...]
Dre, Outlook Express must be told explicitly to quote properly;
that is, to put a quote character in the first column to
indicate that the quoted text was written by the person
in the associated attribution line. Find the preference
for quoting in OE and set it.
If you are not sure about what I describe, read some
of your messages in this thread, and attempt to
distinguish your writing from your interlocutor's.
--
Michael Press
Kerry Montgomery
"Michael Press" <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:rubrum-E8EA73....@news.albasani.net...
That would be:
Tools
Options
Send
Plain Text Settings
check the box in front of "Indent the original text with"
Dre
"Kerry Montgomery" <kamo...@teleport.com> wrote in message
news:kqqdnU0Z2IAE6DjX...@earthlink.com...
and that would be set allready. For some reason some of the posts I reply
to dont indent properly...
Cheers Dre
Tom Kunich
news:h8443p$kb5$1...@aioe.org...
>
> and that would be set allready. For some reason some of the posts I reply
> to dont indent properly...
That's because some people are posting in HTML instead of plain text.
There's a fix out there somewhere but I don't remember where.
Dre
news:RoSdnf0QXv9cCDjX...@earthlink.com...
Ahhh, thats probably it. You can use the outlook quote fix which I have now
installed so it shouldn't happen again...
Cheers Dre
bjwe...@gmail.com
> "Dre" <andreas.bai...@gmail.com> wrote in message
No they aren't. Nobody in this thread has posted a
message in HTML.
As far as I can tell, Dre's software screwed up quoting
Hank Wirtz's posts, possibly because they contained the
header line
"Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable"
which OE may incorrectly assume means the post
contains some kind of HTML-like formatting. Other people's
posts that he quoted correctly don't have that line. However,
Wirtz's posts are just ordinary plain text. Look on
Google groups and click "show original" if you need
to verify. I don't use OE, so I can't verify that header
line is the problem, but it's not HTML.
This is all OE's fault. Nobody else's. Google "oe quote fix"
if you need to fix it (see, it wasn't that hard to find).
Ben
Hank
wrote:
Fine, blame me! :-)
Coincidentally, I used to be a support tech lead for Outlook & OE. Six
years removed, I have no recollection of how those protocols work.
I am now posting through Google, so I blame them.
someone
I think you are misguided, using an engineers hammer to provide shock
to release the grip of a fixture raises no cause for concern. With
metal components and fixture. This may exclude some 'bicycles' which
have been designed by the hopeful.
Using a hammer concentrates the energy into a short timespan so
preventing component distortion which may otherwise occur using
excessive stress levels. Using this method should help to prevent the
overtorquing of bolts upon removal allowing for subsequent re-use
without going through an extra fatigue cycle. Fasteners generally
fail through low cycle fatigue, minimising overtrque should assist in
the safe continuded use of a fastener much longer.
someone
> "Chalo" <chalo.col...@gmail.com> wrote in message
That paint will come off after heating the crank with a torch to
release its death grip.
Dre
> Hi all, I have a set of Deity Vendetta cranks fitted to my Riot which I
> need to remove.
>
> The problem is the threads that you screw your standard crank puller into
> are reverse threaded. So my crank pullers wont fit. I had a look on the
> internet but couldn't find much info on reverse thread crank pullers.
> I've emailled Deity but they havn't replied as yet.
>
>
> Anything other than a standard crank puller (3 prong puller for example)
> wont work as the crank to axle fit is a *bloody* tight fit...
>
>
An update...
The cranks are stuck. Tight.
LBS has now tried to hammer them out with a drift, they didnt budge one
microscopic bit. They also missed and I now have a dent in my down tube. I
haven't even riden this bike and its allready damaged :(
Deity have finally responded (allthough their response was no help
whatsover) and I have replied to them.
Tonight I get the angle gringer out as these cranks aren't coming off any
other way.
There is nothing I hate more than having to destroy parts like this.
Cheers Dre
someone
> "Dre" <andreas.bai...@gmail.com> wrote in message
Use a blow torch. The paint will be gone, but at least you will still
have the functioning part.
Dre
Dre wrote:
> Hi all, I have a set of Deity Vendetta cranks fitted to my Riot which
> I need to remove.
>
> The problem is the threads that you screw your standard crank puller
> into are reverse threaded. So my crank pullers wont fit. I had a
> look on the internet but couldn't find much info on reverse thread
> crank pullers. I've emailled Deity but they havn't replied as yet.
>
> Does anyone know of or has anyone seen a reverse threaded crank
> puller???
> Anything other than a standard crank puller (3 prong puller for
> example) wont work as the crank to axle fit is a *bloody* tight fit...
>
> Cheers Dre
Well good news!
Deity have come through. They are going to send me a replacement non-drive
side arm and 2 dust caps.
Now I can safely grind the crank arm off, and fix my crankset, hooray!
Before I finally attach the new non-drive side arm however I'm going to make
the fit less tight I can actually service this crankset in future.
Thanks all for any advice, its appreciated.
Cheers Dre
Dre
Not neccesary now. I'm getting a replacement arm sent out to me! Thanks
Deity!
Cheers Dre
Andre Jute
Vendettas on your bike. Do you recommend them?
I was looking at them here
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=30146
when I remembered your saga with the stuck cranks...
Andre Jute
The rest is magic hidden in the hub.
For rare hub gear bikes, visit Jute on Bicycles at
http://www.audio-talk.co.uk/fiultra/BICYCLE%20%26%20CYCLING.html
On Sep 7, 2:42 am, "Dre" <andreas.bai...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi all, I have a set of Deity Vendetta cranks fitted to my Riot which I need
> to remove.
>
> The problem is the threads that you screw your standard crank puller into
> are reverse threaded. So my crank pullers wont fit. I had a look on the
> internet but couldn't find much info on reverse thread crank pullers. I've
> emailled Deity but they havn't replied as yet.
>
> Does anyone know of or has anyone seen a reverse threaded crank puller???
>
> Anything other than a standard crank puller (3 prong puller for example)
> wont work as the crank to axle fit is a *bloody* tight fit...
>
> Cheers Dre