prostate problems and road bikes
Greg
cutout, and have never had problems with numbness. Lately, I have been
riding a Litespeed (more stiff), and have had slight pain, and I have
been messing around with different saddles and position. On Sunday, I
took out my hybrid, more upright position and a squishy seat, and
rode it 2 hrs like a road bke. Now I think I have hurt the prostate.
It's not numbness, it's a low level burning sensation down there, and
it's been there for 48 hrs. Urologists call it referal pain. I am
going to the urologist Monday, but I'm afraid he will tell me to quit
riding. I'm 52 yrs old, and ride about 150 miles a week on the road
bike. I don't think it's as simple as a perinial artery problem. Any
ideas? Anybody else struggle with this? Any good saddles that don't
pressure the prostate?
Diablo Scott
> I normally ride a TREK carbon fiber bike with Koobi saddle with
> cutout, and have never had problems with numbness. Lately, I have been
> riding a Litespeed (more stiff), and have had slight pain, and I have
<snip>
> Any ideas?
Go back to riding the Trek?
big...@backpacker.com
there". You will be able to focus better.
big...@backpacker.com
there". You will be able to focus better.
Mike Jacoubowsky
At the very least, that does sound like the obvious experiment.
--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
Sorni
> I would suggest Castration. There will be no more problems "down
> there". You will be able to focus better.
Focus better? Maybe on detesting you and your hateful (not to mention
stoooooopid) drivel...
BS
Leo Lichtman
<big...@backpacker.com> wrote: I would suggest Castration. There will be no
Focus has to do with eye-balls. Castration has to do with I-balls.
David L. Johnson
> I normally ride a TREK carbon fiber bike with Koobi saddle with
> cutout, and have never had problems with numbness. Lately, I have been
> riding a Litespeed (more stiff),
/pedantic stiffer, please /endpedantic
> and have had slight pain, and I have
> been messing around with different saddles and position.
get the position consistent with the other bike. Why not use the same
saddle?
On Sunday, I
> took out my hybrid, more upright position and a squishy seat, and rode
> it 2 hrs like a road bke. Now I think I have hurt the prostate. It's not
> numbness, it's a low level burning sensation down there, and it's been
> there for 48 hrs. Urologists call it referal pain.
Urologists might call it many things. Are you one? If not, don't decide
what the cause is. Even it is is prostitis, that does not mean it is
caused by riding.
> I am going to the
> urologist Monday, but I'm afraid he will tell me to quit riding.
There are other urologists. Some of them ride. Don't give it up without
a second opinion. Riding also keeps your weight and cholesterol down, and
provides great cardiovascular exercise. A good doctor will balance all of
this against a possibly inflamed prostate. he might also find something
else causing the pain, and you might have to deal with that. Again,
though, it would not necessarily have anything to do with cycling.
> I'm 52
> yrs old, and ride about 150 miles a week on the road bike. I don't
> think it's as simple as a perinial artery problem. Any ideas?
Why are you trying to diagnose the problem? The urologist will use a
number of things to examine you before he decides what it is. You don't
have that diagnostic equipment available, so don't try to make the
diagnosis. But, also, don't worry in advance about what he will
recommend, or what you should do about it.
> else struggle with this? Any good saddles that don't pressure the
> prostate?
Of course. Mine doesn't press against my prostate. But your butt is
different, and you need to find the saddle that works for you.
--
David L. Johnson
__o | When you are up to your ass in alligators, it's hard to remember
_`\(,_ | that your initial objective was to drain the swamp. -- LBJ
(_)/ (_) |
David L. Johnson
> I would suggest Castration. There will be no more problems "down
> there". You will be able to focus better.
That usually leaves the prostate intact.
--
David L. Johnson
__o | And what if you track down these men and kill them, what if you
_`\(,_ | killed all of us? From every corner of Europe, hundreds,
(_)/ (_) | thousands would rise up to take our places. Even Nazis can't
kill that fast. -- Paul Henreid (Casablanca).
(PeteCresswell)
> Now I think I have hurt the prostate.
>It's not numbness, it's a low level burning sensation down there, and
>it's been there for 48 hrs. Urologists call it referal pain. I am
>going to the urologist Monday, but I'm afraid he will tell me to quit
>riding. I'm 52 yrs old, and ride about 150 miles a week on the road
>bike. I don't think it's as simple as a perinial artery problem. Any
>ideas? Anybody else struggle with this? Any good saddles that don't
>pressure the prostate?
My uro put it a little less harshly. Something like "You know there's a strong
correlation between bicycle riding and prostate problems...".
Your symptoms sound exactly like mine when I know I've got an infection.
Get on an antibiotic ASAP and don't listen to any BS about "well, there aren't
any cells visible in the urine..." Those tests are unreliable.
My uro says that most prostate infections get the bacteria from lymph ducts that
are connected to the lower digestive tract. Elevated intra-abdominal pressure
can force the little beasties through the ducts into your prostate. He says
that chronic prostatitis is endemic among power lifters, for instance. Based
on that, I try to avoid spurts of maximum effort - especially when attacking
hills.
I've been around and around with chronic infections most of my life. I credit
racing Honolulu traffic for 2-3 hours per day on a saddle that was much too high
with the initial infection.
Needless to say, the saddle's got to be wide enough to support you sit bones
instead of driving a wedge between them. There are subtle degrees of
insufficient width between a good fit and a flat-out butt hatchet.
For prostatitis, soft is bad. You want a nice firm saddle so your sit bones
take the hits and not your perineum. I've got a broad butt, so I use a Brooks
B-17 - which gives maximum usable width for a the saddle's overall width.
Also, I'd consider a micro/continuously-adjustable seatpost to be mandatory. You
probably have one already, but if you don't and you get one, you'll be amazed at
how big a diff can be made by how small a change in angle.
Getting out of the saddle as often as possible seems to help - not to sprint,
just to give my nether regions a little breathing room..
Finally, find your optimal seat height and then lower it by something like an
eighth or a quarter inch. Moves some of the stress from your pelvis to your
legs if you stay on the pedals enough and don't sit.
--
PeteCresswell
Mike DeMicco
news:ruco329eus41b2nkj...@4ax.com:
I'd try a saddle with more of a depression (cup) in the middle of it. I
had that problem a while ago. Switching saddles solved it. I think
squishy saddles make it worse because you sink in more. Also make sure
your bike fit is correct. That can make a huge difference independent of
the saddle.
--
Mike DeMicco <blast...@comcast.net>
RonSonic
>I normally ride a TREK carbon fiber bike with Koobi saddle with
>cutout, and have never had problems with numbness.
So don't change.
>Lately, I have been
>riding a Litespeed (more stiff), and have had slight pain, and I have
>been messing around with different saddles and position. On Sunday, I
>took out my hybrid, more upright position and a squishy seat, and
>rode it 2 hrs like a road bke.
Don't ride stupid bikes with stupid saddles like that.
>Now I think I have hurt the prostate.
>It's not numbness, it's a low level burning sensation down there, and
>it's been there for 48 hrs. Urologists call it referal pain. I am
>going to the urologist Monday, but I'm afraid he will tell me to quit
>riding. I'm 52 yrs old, and ride about 150 miles a week on the road
>bike. I don't think it's as simple as a perinial artery problem. Any
>ideas? Anybody else struggle with this? Any good saddles that don't
>pressure the prostate?
No. I don't ride bikes with saddles that don't fit the bits.
Get back on the Trek, even if they are corporate and evil and soul-less or
whatever the heck's supposed to be wrong with them.
Ron
41
(PeteCresswell) wrote:
> Per Greg:
> > Now I think I have hurt the prostate.
> >It's not numbness, it's a low level burning sensation down there, and
> Your symptoms sound exactly like mine when I know I've got an infection.
> G et on an antibiotic ASAP and don't listen to any BS about "well, there aren't
> any cells visible in the urine..." Those tests are unreliable.
> I've been around and around with chronic infections most of my life. I credit
> racing Honolulu traffic for 2-3 hours per day on a saddle that was much too high
> with the initial infection.
Hold on a minute. The prostate is behind the pubic bone:
<http://www.anatomy-resources.com/human-anatomy/sh436.htm>
You can't sit on it. If it could be pressured from the outside, you
wouldn't have to do a rectal exam to feel it. I don't believe or see
how anyone could get such an infection by riding on a saddle that was
too high.
Prostate infection is rarely revealed by simple urine test. But it's
fairly easily identified by the symptoms. Doctors' complaints about
bicycling and "men's health", such as they are, are about penile
numbness, not prostatitis.
Qui si parla Campagnolo
Bike fit is the jkey, not saddle design. Riding upright with all your
weight on a soft saddle will put pressure 'down there' Upright
positions are NOT the fix for what you are seeing. Road geometry, with
a rather firm saddle and GOOD BIKE FIt is the key.
Derk
>Now I think I have hurt the prostate.
> It's not numbness, it's a low level burning sensation down there, and
> it's been there for 48 hrs. Urologists call it referal pain.
Ok, the following is not a joke: I once had prostatitis. you could have the
same problem,I'm not a doctor and I don't know but your urologist will tell
you so. It's an inflammation of the prostate and it's cause can be either
bacterial or unknown. If it's bacterial, you're lucky, because it can be
treated with anti-biotics. therefore it's very important to have it
diagnosed. If you are not lucky , it will go on gor ages and every time you
think you got rid of it, it will come back. I consulted a urologist and he
said to be patient, since it wasn't bacterial and he said it would
eventually go away. I tried everything imaginable without success, until I
started the "broccoli treatment" :
http://www.prostatitis.org/broccindex.html
I don't know if this stopped it, but it did stop hurting only after this
therapy. It's now about 10 years ago I had this and I have ridden my bike
every day since without any pain.
Greets, Derk
Michael Press
Derk <nob...@invalid.org> wrote:
Congratulations for curing yourself.
Apparently the `21 day treatment' lasts 27 days. Yes?
`During the Broccoli Treatment, spice is absolutely
forbidden, you should avoid from consuming all kinds of
coffee and animal fat.'
What protocol did you institute to comply with this rule?
That is what all did you remove from your diet? Did you
continue to ingest foods that may be considered to
contravene this rule? A formal study would attempt to
separate the effect of this rule.
--
Michael Press
oilfreeandhappy
problem with this. Knock on wood, right. If it is cycling related,
another option would be to get a recumbent. I really enjoyed test
riding these, and I'm thinking of getting one for a family bike.
Jim Gagnepain
http://home.comcast.net/~oil_free_and_happy/
Derk
> Apparently the `21 day treatment' lasts 27 days. Yes?
I really don't remember, since it's 10 years or so ago. I think there are 2
three day periods you don't take it.
As I said, I tried every remedy known to man and nothing helped. The
symptoms disappeared slowly after I started the broccoli "treatment", but
maybe it was just a coincidence. We'll never know, but since it's the
cheapest treatment there is and since broccoli is good for you, I don't see
why you shouldn't try it. Believe me, if you ever get this, you'll try
anything to get rid of it, since it's EXTREMELY painful.
John Hopkins University did research on Broccoli and patented seeds if I'm
not mistaken. If you Google "john hopkins university and broccoli sprouts",
you'll get all the info you want and some more.
> `During the Broccoli Treatment, spice is absolutely
> forbidden, you should avoid from consuming all kinds of
> coffee and animal fat.'
I continued drinking coffee and eating spicey foods. These things were by
the way also forbidden by the urologist.
> That is what all did you remove from your diet? Did you
> continue to ingest foods that may be considered to
> contravene this rule?
I surely did. I just drank that Broccoli drink that has awful taste twice a
day. I still don't like eating broccoli any more after drinking the juice,
whilst I used to love the stuff.
Gr, Derk
(PeteCresswell)
>I don't believe or see
>how anyone could get such an infection by riding on a saddle that was
>too high.
I can't document the mechanics, but I'd guess it has something to do with
transmitting shock via whatever's between the perineum and the prostate.
I've been knocked unconscious when a surfboard was driven into the front of my
pelvis. A similar phenom, I'd guess....since none of my CNS is exposed in my
pelvis.... but the shock probably was transmitted to my spinal cord or
something.
To me, there's no doubt whatsoever that saddle pressure is a significant factor
in prostatitis. The effect is worst when applied directly to the perineum - but
it's also there when it's just pounding on the sit bones.
How or why, I dunno...
--
PeteCresswell
(PeteCresswell)
>It's an inflammation of the prostate and it's cause can be either
>bacterial or unknown. If it's bacterial, you're lucky, because it can be
>treated with anti-biotics. therefore it's very important to have it
>diagnosed. If you are not lucky , it will go on gor ages and every time you
>think you got rid of it, it will come back.
If it were me, I'd do a course of prostate-specific antibiotic no matter what.
The uro doesn't know whether it's an infection or not. He can guess...and
maybe he'll be right most of the time - but what percentage accuracy can he
claim? Does anybody even know what the average doc's percentages are? They'd
have to record the guess and then biopsy the patient - and do that on a few
hundred patients for each doctor and do it over for some statistically
significant number of doctors..... I don't think so.
Even if the doc's odds are in the nineties, I wouldn't consider the risk
acceptable.
As I (who has no medical training/experience whatsoever) understand it, part of
the problem with prostate infections is that the longer they go on, the more of
that spongy glandular tissue gets bacteria in it. After enough infection, you
wind up with areas of calcification which seem to harbor the little beasties
between infections and let them loose with the slightest irritation.
--
PeteCresswell
Tim McNamara
"(PeteCresswell)" <x...@y.Invalid> wrote:
> Per Derk:
> >It's an inflammation of the prostate and it's cause can be either
> >bacterial or unknown. If it's bacterial, you're lucky, because it
> >can be treated with anti-biotics. therefore it's very important to
> >have it diagnosed. If you are not lucky , it will go on gor ages and
> >every time you think you got rid of it, it will come back.
>
> If it were me, I'd do a course of prostate-specific antibiotic no
> matter what. The uro doesn't know whether it's an infection or not.
> He can guess...and maybe he'll be right most of the time - but what
> percentage accuracy can he claim? Does anybody even know what the
> average doc's percentages are? They'd have to record the guess and
> then biopsy the patient - and do that on a few hundred patients for
> each doctor and do it over for some statistically significant number
> of doctors..... I don't think so.
Your doc can easily check for bacterial infections of the prostate.
There's a fairly unpleasant technique for getting a sample that involves
no needles (biopsy is only necessary if prostate cancer is being ruled
out) but does involve "the position" and a rubber glove...
Derk
> If it were me, I'd do a course of prostate-specific antibiotic no matter
> what.
That's dumb, since this is the way to create resistent bacteria in the
future. There's no need to take them if they're no pathogenic bacteria
present.
> The uro doesn't know whether it's an infection or not. He can
> guess...and maybe he'll be right most of the time - but what percentage
> accuracy can he claim?
Of course he does and this is the ways he knows it: (and this is no fun
either) the urologists massages your prostate with a finger to get some
fluid out, which is then examined in the lab for presence of bacteria.
> As I (who has no medical training/experience whatsoever) understand it,
> part of the problem with prostate infections is that the longer they go
> on, the more of that spongy glandular tissue gets bacteria in it.
No, there is 50% chance there won't be bacteria.
Gr, Derk
Derk
> Your doc can easily check for bacterial infections of the prostate.
> There's a fairly unpleasant technique for getting a sample that involves
> no needles (biopsy is only necessary if prostate cancer is being ruled
> out) but does involve "the position" and a rubber glove...
yep. But it can be worse: I was told by the urologist that they sometimes
would use the following technique, that most men refuse: a (big) echo
device is inserted and then they can see an image of the prostate on a
monitor. They seem to do this mostly to examine enlarged prostates, but for
100% certainty they also like do this for examining prostatitis. I also
said "no thanks" to this btw.
Prostatitis is a very nasty thing that takes ages to cure if the cause isn't
bacterial. Since you have nothing to lose as a patient, I would take my
bike, ride to the market and stuff loads of broccoli in the bike-bags :-)
To th eoriginal poster: it could of course be a coincidence that prostate
pain begins after riding a new saddle. It looks like there's a relationship
when 2 things coincide, but it doesnt have to be that way.
Gr, Derk
(PeteCresswell)
>Your doc can easily check for bacterial infections of the prostate.
>There's a fairly unpleasant technique for getting a sample that involves
>no needles (biopsy is only necessary if prostate cancer is being ruled
>out) but does involve "the position" and a rubber glove...
Been there, done that. Better than a guess, but if it's negative it still
doesn't mean there is no infection - my conclusion, at least from repeated
situations where it was negative but a course of antibiotic stopped the pain.
It's happened too often to be a placebo effect.
--
PeteCresswell
Alex Rodriguez
says...
That you have had no problems riding your Trek means that you are having
some fit issues with the other bikes. Best bet is to get the same saddle
on all your bikes and adjust the to have the same height and tilt.
---------------
Alex
Alex Rodriguez
big...@backpacker.com says...
>
>
>I would suggest Castration. There will be no more problems "down
>there". You will be able to focus better.
Is your focus better now?
-------------
Alex