Amazes me what LBS do for service

[Mark Cleary]

I just did a tune up on the lady's bike. She has a Trek Lexa and wanted me to go over it. It needed washed and lubed. It actually shifts ok Shimano Claris. I ended up replacing the rear derailleur cable and housing. Since I use good stuff and brass ferrules it now shifts perfect. I also put on new bar tape.

I am trying to decide what to charge so I look at the LBS cost for services and really it is ridicules in what they do. They offer to clean and wash your bike? Who would not simply wash their bike with soap a water. They adjust brakes and clean and lube the drive train and wash the whole bike for $100. These are things anyone can do? I don't get it but maybe folks pay for this.

Granted I actually did take the wheels off and put them on truing stand. The front was dead true. The rear required exactly 1 spoke turn on the non drive side. I then of course indexed the gears, put air in the tires, and it is ready to go.

I did not change any other housing or cables as the front shifts perfect. The brakes work fine they are not complicated. The groupset is dated but it all works fine. I suppose bike not worth more than $325 but you could not replace it for that kind of money.

I am not suggesting the LBS is charging too much at all I am just surprised at what riders do not do to maintain there own bikes. To me if you ride any at all you have to be able to change a flat, put on a new tire, index your shifting. I could see that maybe putting on a new chain for completely changing cables might be more than many want to do. Certainly truing wheels and new components on the bike are more complicated.

In any case the bar tape is $20, cable & housing $5. I have about 90 minutes at least in the bike. I am going to say $85 for everything including the materials. I just wonder what the LBS would charge.
Deacon Mark

[Frank Krygowski]

On 8/5/2023 3:43 PM, Mark Cleary wrote:
> ... I am just surprised at what riders do not do to maintain there own bikes. To me if you ride any at all you have to be able to change a flat, put on a new tire, index your shifting.

I agree those skills and some others should be normal. I'd add properly
clamping a quick release axle, checking and adjusting clearance on rim
brakes (it's just turning a nut), checking tightness of fasteners (at
least, for metal not carbon components), the "ABC Quick" check, etc.

But there really are people whose mechanical aptitude is not up to those
tasks. To me, that's a case for simpler bikes. I think many of those
folks would be better served by something closer to a Dutch city bike,
maybe with a geared hub. I think most of them don't ride distances on
varied terrain anyway.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Roger Meriman]

They may not want a simpler bike or solution, sometimes a more complicated
but more reliable solution is better, for me that’s tubeless on the gravel
bike, load of maintenance and stuff realistically I’m letting the bike shop
do as I’m not doing that in the kitchen…

But it means I’m not getting multiple punctures, so for that bike makes
sense.

Also folks technical abilities and interest in kit are not related as you
where, ie folks with lovely kit that they do like and have chosen but need
the bike shop for most stuff and so on.

Get the whole range at the club, for example from folks who have a shed and
enjoy fixing stuff be that their bikes or others for some beer! To folks
who can’t change a tube and everyone in between!

Roger Merriman

[Catrike Rider]

On Sun, 06 Aug 2023 01:00:32 GMT, Roger Meriman <ro...@sarlet.com>
wrote:

I'm not inclined to argue with the risk/reward decisions other people
make that don't directly affect me. If someone is not willing to take
the time and effort to be able to remedy a bicycle breakdown and risk
being stranded, it's not my problem unless I choose to make it so. I'm
generally willing to stop and assist those folks, but I'm not willing
to rely on others doing that for me.

[AMuzi]

We could start with airing tires. Rare among cyclists.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

[Roger Meriman]

The only ride ending mechanicals have been derailleurs x3 and some glass
embedded in a tubeless tire that cut a gash over few days and then went
soft to flat on a ride, luckily near a train station. Or close enough.

My fault with tubeless glass in particular will still wreck lightweight
tires gunk or not I’d ridden it few day’s previously though some.

I do think that certainly with tubes considering the high probability if
road tires at least that being able to change yourself is certainly wise,
as you’d risk getting stranded.

Roger Merriman

[Catrike Rider]

On Sun, 06 Aug 2023 14:54:25 GMT, Roger Meriman <ro...@sarlet.com>

wrote:

>Catrike Rider <sol...@drafting.not> wrote:
>> On Sun, 06 Aug 2023 01:00:32 GMT, Roger Meriman <ro...@sarlet.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Frank Krygowski <frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> On 8/5/2023 3:43 PM, Mark Cleary wrote:
>>>>> ... I am just surprised at what riders do not do to maintain there own
>>>>> bikes. To me if you ride any at all you have to be able to change a
>>>>> flat, put on a new tire, index your shifting.
>>>>
>>>> I agree those skills and some others should be normal. I'd add properly
>>>> clamping a quick release axle, checking and adjusting clearance on rim
>>>> brakes (it's just turning a nut), checking tightness of fasteners (at
>>>> least, for metal not carbon components), the "ABC Quick" check, etc.
>>>>
>>>> But there really are people whose mechanical aptitude is not up to those
>>>> tasks. To me, that's a case for simpler bikes. I think many of those
>>>> folks would be better served by something closer to a Dutch city bike,
>>>> maybe with a geared hub. I think most of them don't ride distances on
>>>> varied terrain anyway.
>>>>
>>>
>>> They may not want a simpler bike or solution, sometimes a more complicated

>>> but more reliable solution is better, for me that?s tubeless on the gravel
>>> bike, load of maintenance and stuff realistically I?m letting the bike shop
>>> do as I?m not doing that in the kitchen?
>>>
>>> But it means I?m not getting multiple punctures, so for that bike makes

>>> sense.
>>>
>>> Also folks technical abilities and interest in kit are not related as you
>>> where, ie folks with lovely kit that they do like and have chosen but need
>>> the bike shop for most stuff and so on.
>>>
>>> Get the whole range at the club, for example from folks who have a shed and
>>> enjoy fixing stuff be that their bikes or others for some beer! To folks

>>> who can?t change a tube and everyone in between!

>>>
>>> Roger Merriman
>>
>>
>> I'm not inclined to argue with the risk/reward decisions other people
>> make that don't directly affect me. If someone is not willing to take
>> the time and effort to be able to remedy a bicycle breakdown and risk
>> being stranded, it's not my problem unless I choose to make it so. I'm
>> generally willing to stop and assist those folks, but I'm not willing
>> to rely on others doing that for me.
>>
>The only ride ending mechanicals have been derailleurs x3 and some glass
>embedded in a tubeless tire that cut a gash over few days and then went
>soft to flat on a ride, luckily near a train station. Or close enough.
>
>My fault with tubeless glass in particular will still wreck lightweight
>tires gunk or not I’d ridden it few day’s previously though some.
>
>I do think that certainly with tubes considering the high probability if
>road tires at least that being able to change yourself is certainly wise,
>as you’d risk getting stranded.
>
>Roger Merriman

I once stopped to put a woman's chain back on her chainring. A few
weeks ago, I myself, had a chain break because a rivet come came out.
Yes, it was a rivet I'd put in, but I was able to fix it out on the
trail.

[Roger Meriman]

Not for a while as I go less busy places but I’ve certainly popped chains
even tires etc for all sexes be that fellow sportive riders or just well
folks I’ve passed.

Most of the time it’s simple fixes or at least diagnostics ie can fix x or
no that’s snapped off!

Roger Merriman

[Joy Beeson]

On Sat, 5 Aug 2023 12:43:07 -0700 (PDT), Mark Cleary
<deaco...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I am just surprised at what riders do not do to maintain there own bikes.

I find having the Trailhouse change my tubes is a lot cheaper than
doing it myself. Their mechanic works a lot faster than I do, and he
has more than two working hours in his day.

(I have to do a *lot* of maintenance on the engine of my bike.)

--
Joy Beeson
joy beeson at centurylink dot net
http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/

[Joy Beeson]

I always take my bike to the Trailhouse to have a tube changed -- it's

cheaper than doing it myself.

I *have* repaired a flat while sitting on sharp gravel at ninety
degrees with not a speck of shade in sight. Nowadays, my only tool
kit is a cell phone.

But I do recall a group ride I was on once. The route came down a
very steep hill and made a sharp turn onto a side road that went
almost straight back up that same hill. I goofed the shift and
unshipped my chain.

Just as I got the chain back on the sprocket, another rider did
exactly the same thing. I said "There's no use both of us getting our
hands dirty.", walked across the road, and lifted her chaing back onto
the sprocket.

After the ride, she thanked me profusely for "repairing" her bike.

[Roger Meriman]

Joy Beeson <jbe...@invalid.net.invalid> wrote:
> On Sat, 5 Aug 2023 12:43:07 -0700 (PDT), Mark Cleary
> <deaco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I am just surprised at what riders do not do to maintain there own bikes.
>
> I find having the Trailhouse change my tubes is a lot cheaper than
> doing it myself. Their mechanic works a lot faster than I do, and he
> has more than two working hours in his day.
>
> (I have to do a *lot* of maintenance on the engine of my bike.)
>

For me it’s my brain doesn’t work way it used to, so more complicated stuff
even if stuff I used to do such as chain/cassette and so on.

I do change tires and tubes, though not the tubeless though that is
generally no maintenance until it needs its sealant replaced.

Quite a fight with the new tire for the MTB though as it’s a big burly
thing!

But equally for some folks it’s not health or otherwise but time and
effort, and that’s fine my local bike shop does a fine trade in puncture
repairs.

Roger Merriman

[Catrike Rider]

On Fri, 11 Aug 2023 23:00:02 -0400, Joy Beeson
<jbe...@invalid.net.invalid> wrote:

>On Sat, 5 Aug 2023 12:43:07 -0700 (PDT), Mark Cleary
><deaco...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I am just surprised at what riders do not do to maintain there own bikes.
>
>I find having the Trailhouse change my tubes is a lot cheaper than
>doing it myself. Their mechanic works a lot faster than I do, and he
>has more than two working hours in his day.
>
>(I have to do a *lot* of maintenance on the engine of my bike.)

I'm curious. How much does your bike shop charge to fix a flat, and do
they patch the tube or simply replace it?

[Ted Heise]

On Fri, 11 Aug 2023 23:01:57 -0400,
Joy Beeson <jbe...@invalid.net.invalid> wrote:
>
> I always take my bike to the Trailhouse to have a tube changed
> -- it's cheaper than doing it myself.
>
> I *have* repaired a flat while sitting on sharp gravel at

> ninety degrees with not a speck of shade in sight...

Yeah, no fun. For me, cold and wet is worse, because I have a
harder time getting the job done--especially if a tube needs
patched.

> But I do recall a group ride I was on once. The route came
> down a very steep hill and made a sharp turn onto a side road
> that went almost straight back up that same hill. I goofed the
> shift and unshipped my chain.
>
> Just as I got the chain back on the sprocket, another rider did
> exactly the same thing. I said "There's no use both of us
> getting our hands dirty.", walked across the road, and lifted
> her chaing back onto the sprocket.

Very thoughtful and pragmatic--well done!

--
Ted Heise <the...@panix.com> West Lafayette, IN, USA

[AMuzi]

Few shops patch now. When I was young a dozen or twenty
patches every day was normal, and the rate was less than a
new tube. Now tubes are cheap and labor is not.

In the same vein we advised 50 years ago that cyclists ought
to have bearings cleaned and serviced annually, using
cheap American labor to preserve their expensive imported
components. That changed too.

[Tom Kunich]

I just received and installed the BB30 in my Ridley. 5 minutes and sealed bearings which will last a long time.

[Catrike Rider]

Most of my tubes, have patches on them. I patch regularly, but not out
on the rides any more, although I used to do it. Had I not been able
to patch, I would have been lost on my first ride on the Florida Keys
trail. The dibres on the road and the bridges was terrible. There were
several bike shops, but I couldn't find a 20 inch tube.

[Frank Krygowski]

On 8/12/2023 9:20 AM, AMuzi wrote:
>
> Few shops patch now.  When I was young a dozen or twenty patches every
> day was normal, and the rate was less than a new tube.  Now tubes are
> cheap and labor is not.

I still patch mine, but I do it at home, after changing to a spare tube
on the road.

> In the same vein we advised 50 years ago that cyclists ought  to have
> bearings cleaned and serviced annually, using cheap American labor to
> preserve their expensive imported components. That changed too.

Once upon a time, hubs came with central oil holes covered by little
clips. I still have those on two utility bikes, one being the
Sturmey-Archer 3 speed. For those I follow S-A's advice to oil just a
little, but often. It seems to work.

And I remember reading an article advocating adding an oil port or
grease fitting to an old style bottom bracket. But I've never done that.

The bikes I ride most often have sealed bearings.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Sir Ridesalot]

Cold and wet or wet is why I started carrying two spare tubes on my commute and then on all me rides. It's far easier to take the punctured tube out of the tire and then check the tire for whatever puncture the tire to be sure that whatever it is is removed. Then I just put in the new tube, pump it up and continue my ride. Finding a pinhole in a tube especially in the rain at night is not pleasant.

Now I carry an old tubular tire to use on my clincher rim as that's even faster and my distances home are not so far as to cause that tubular tire to be damaged. I use a toe strap to secure the folded clincher tire to the underside of my saddle. The tubular tire is also a lifesaver, or at least saves a long walk home, if the clincher tire is badly damaged.

Cheers