Off road hazards

[Frank Krygowski]

And off road hazard:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/bicyclists-captured-video-being-attacked-131210101.html

Joerg, is that you?

--
- Frank Krygowski

[funkma...@hotmail.com]

On Wednesday, February 16, 2022 at 1:20:32 PM UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> And off road hazard:
>
> https://www.yahoo.com/news/bicyclists-captured-video-being-attacked-131210101.html
>
> Joerg, is that you?

I saw that on MTBR. Scary stuff.

[Frank Krygowski]

It's an interesting counterpoint to "I only want to ride off road,
because it's too dangerous to ride around cars."

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Jeff Liebermann]

Be sure to look over your shoulder during your next group ride. You
never know what might join your group:
<https://www.google.com/search?q=bear+riding+bicycle&tbm=isch>

I seem to recall their motto is "To Bear the Unbearable".
--
Jeff Liebermann je...@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

[John B.]

On Wed, 16 Feb 2022 19:52:44 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>
wrote:

>On Wed, 16 Feb 2022 19:23:58 -0500, Frank Krygowski
><frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>>On 2/16/2022 4:44 PM, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>> On Wednesday, February 16, 2022 at 1:20:32 PM UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>>> And off road hazard:
>>>>
>>>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/bicyclists-captured-video-being-attacked-131210101.html
>>>>
>>>> Joerg, is that you?
>
>>> I saw that on MTBR. Scary stuff.
>
>>It's an interesting counterpoint to "I only want to ride off road,
>>because it's too dangerous to ride around cars."
>
>Be sure to look over your shoulder during your next group ride. You
>never know what might join your group:
><https://www.google.com/search?q=bear+riding+bicycle&tbm=isch>
>
>I seem to recall their motto is "To Bear the Unbearable".

I watched the "bull video" and frankly I thought it primarily
portrayed the ignorance of the cyclists. Any "country boy" will tell
you that male animals, and some female, will defend "their" territory,
often with considerable diligence.

Ah well, I'll tell you the story about the "rabbit berries" another
time, but while certainly the country boy may be at loss in the big
city certainly the "city slicker" will be equally at a loss in the
country. And if one is going to ride a bicycle in an area where there
might be unfenced cattle one might better learn the differences
between the "boys" and the "girls" :-)
--
Cheers,

John B.

[Roger Merriman]

Even in London’s royal parks if one pushes your luck with the deer, ie too
close to bucks during the rut, or doe’s if they have young.

Generally dogs that take the brunt ie killed. As their owners are ignorant
of all the warnings the deer give.

Roger Merriman

[Frank Krygowski]

On 2/17/2022 6:43 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:

> John B. <sloc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I watched the "bull video" and frankly I thought it primarily
>> portrayed the ignorance of the cyclists. Any "country boy" will tell
>> you that male animals, and some female, will defend "their" territory,
>> often with considerable diligence.
>>
>> Ah well, I'll tell you the story about the "rabbit berries" another
>> time, but while certainly the country boy may be at loss in the big
>> city certainly the "city slicker" will be equally at a loss in the
>> country. And if one is going to ride a bicycle in an area where there
>> might be unfenced cattle one might better learn the differences
>> between the "boys" and the "girls" :-)
>
> Even in London’s royal parks if one pushes your luck with the deer, ie too
> close to bucks during the rut, or doe’s if they have young.
>
> Generally dogs that take the brunt ie killed. As their owners are ignorant
> of all the warnings the deer give.

On one bike tour, we left the Georgetown neighborhood of Washington D.C.
and began riding the C & O Towpath Trail. At the time, there were dozens
of Canada Geese aside the trail, with goslings about a foot high. The
geese were amazingly aggressive, charging at us hissing and flapping.

There's been a goose population explosion for at least ten years around
here. They're picturesque flying at a distance, but ugly poop generators
up close, fouling park lands all around. I'm astonished they're still
protected.


--
- Frank Krygowski

[Tom Kunich]

On Wednesday, February 16, 2022 at 7:52:53 PM UTC-8, jeff.li...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Feb 2022 19:23:58 -0500, Frank Krygowski
> <frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
> >On 2/16/2022 4:44 PM, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> >> On Wednesday, February 16, 2022 at 1:20:32 PM UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> >>> And off road hazard:
> >>>
> >>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/bicyclists-captured-video-being-attacked-131210101.html
> >>>
> >>> Joerg, is that you?
>
> >> I saw that on MTBR. Scary stuff.
>
> >It's an interesting counterpoint to "I only want to ride off road,
> >because it's too dangerous to ride around cars."
> Be sure to look over your shoulder during your next group ride. You
> never know what might join your group:
> <https://www.google.com/search?q=bear+riding+bicycle&tbm=isch>
>
> I seem to recall their motto is "To Bear the Unbearable".

Jeff, latest papers in the Journal of the American Medical Association are showing over a doubling of the chance of a heart attack for anyone that took the mRNA vaccines. This is a permanent disability. And an almost unbelievable increase of 8,400% increase in the chance of endomyelitis (arrhythmia) within days of mRNA vaccinations.. Although they didn't study that long enough to ascertain the chances of that being permanent I can tell you that my 90 year old friend recently started having arrhythmia after a booster.

You hinted that you have been having health problems lately and if you've had vaccinations perhaps you should have a heart specialist consult with you. I mention this for no other reason than your personal health.

[Tom Kunich]

Why the geese congregate around the bay trail I don't know. Certainly there aren't any small fish in that area. But they are aware enough of bicycles that they avoid them. Though children are another matter.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Thu, 17 Feb 2022 10:35:58 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Jeff, latest papers in the Journal of the American Medical Association

Which article?
<https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/currentissue>

>are showing over a doubling of the chance of a heart attack for anyone that took the mRNA vaccines. This is a permanent disability. And an almost unbelievable increase of 8,400% increase in the chance of endomyelitis (arrhythmia)

There's no such thing as endomyelitis:
<https://www.google.com/search?q=endomyelitis>
Endo means within, "inner, absorbing, or containing". Myelitis is the
inflammation of the spinal cord.

>within days of mRNA vaccinations.. Although they didn't study that long enough to ascertain the chances of that being permanent I can tell you that my 90 year old friend recently started having arrhythmia after a booster.

Arrhythmia covers a broad range of "irregular heart beat" problems. I
have a history of PVC (premature ventricular contractions) which is a
form of arrhythmia. I monitor my situation with several heart
monitors. I saw no change after the first Pfizer vaccination and
after the booster. However, I did see an increase in the degree of
irregularity a few hours afterwards, which faded back to normal by the
next day.

>You hinted that you have been having health problems lately and if you've had vaccinations perhaps you should have a heart specialist consult with you. I mention this for no other reason than your personal health.

I have an appointment with my cardiologist every 6 months. I also run
my own blood tests prior to each visit.

Thanks for your concern.

[AMuzi]

On 2/17/2022 12:06 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> On 2/17/2022 6:43 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
>> John B. <sloc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> I watched the "bull video" and frankly I thought it
>>> primarily
>>> portrayed the ignorance of the cyclists. Any "country
>>> boy" will tell
>>> you that male animals, and some female, will defend
>>> "their" territory,
>>> often with considerable diligence.
>>>
>>> Ah well, I'll tell you the story about the "rabbit
>>> berries" another
>>> time, but while certainly the country boy may be at loss
>>> in the big
>>> city certainly the "city slicker" will be equally at a
>>> loss in the
>>> country. And if one is going to ride a bicycle in an area
>>> where there
>>> might be unfenced cattle one might better learn the
>>> differences
>>> between the "boys" and the "girls" :-)
>>

>> Even in London’s royal parks if one pushes your luck

>> with the deer, ie too

>> close to bucks during the rut, or doe’s if they have young.

>>
>> Generally dogs that take the brunt ie killed. As their
>> owners are ignorant
>> of all the warnings the deer give.
>
> On one bike tour, we left the Georgetown neighborhood of
> Washington D.C. and began riding the C & O Towpath Trail. At
> the time, there were dozens of Canada Geese aside the trail,
> with goslings about a foot high. The geese were amazingly
> aggressive, charging at us hissing and flapping.
>
> There's been a goose population explosion for at least ten
> years around here. They're picturesque flying at a distance,
> but ugly poop generators up close, fouling park lands all
> around. I'm astonished they're still protected.
>
>

+1 on the geese.

Could be worse.

Here, besides geese, The Powers That Be reintroduced actual
wolves after the citizenry had successfully eliminated the
threat. Now that they have bred for a few years, there are
something well over 1000*. The 'target population' is 350.
And yet, like geese, can't kill the things.

* no one actually knows, State DNR (experts!!) says between
1000 and 1400. Maybe.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

[Tom Kunich]

My mistake, that was a typo which you always find so appalling Endocarditis

[John B.]

Dogs are very territorial. I walk in the morning for exercise and at
one end of my route a number of dogs will come roaring out when I get
close but they run up to a certain corner in the road and go no
further as apparently that is the limit of "their" territory.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Thu, 17 Feb 2022 12:10:13 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>
wrote:

Some months ago, when I had my last appointment with my cardiologist
and he asked me whether I had been vaccinated and pointed out that
both I and my wife, being elderly, were eligible for free vaccination
and he strongly recommended that "older persons" have it.

I would also point out that this was at one of the largest hospitals
in Bangkok and he is the senior cardiologist...

--
Cheers,

John B.

[Tom Kunich]

Remember when I related seeing a wolf running full out across the side of Mt. Hamilton (highest peak in the bay area) and had nothing but screams that there were no wolves in California? Obviously these people are naturalists and are always damned sure about everything they write. I noted that before when one of them spied a snake on the road and started screaming, "KILL IT KILL IT" and almost went into shock when I picked it up and moved it over so that it could escape into the fenced off undergrowth. It was nothing more than a completely harmless common garter snake.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Thu, 17 Feb 2022 14:43:49 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>My mistake, that was a typo which you always find so appalling Endocarditis

Endocarditis might be a real problem, but not this time:
<https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/endocarditis/symptoms-causes/syc-20352576>
I had that problem on Sept 27, 2021. Symptoms were a very mild and
continuous chest pain centered around the heart. Nothing else. After
3 days of mostly ignoring the problem, I was kidnapped by some friends
and dropped off at the Dominican Hospital ER (emergency room) at
around midnight. I spent 16 hrs getting tested for most everything
possible, including covid-19 antibodies, but nothing was found. They
were going to continue until something could be found when my
cardiologist arrived and rescued me from might have turned out to be
endless testing. Over the next 4 days, the pains slowly diminished
and eventually disappeared not to return. At this time, I have no
clue what caused it or any certainty that it was endocarditis.

Of course, I asked the hospital doctor and my cardiologist if this was
in any way connected my previous covid-19 vaccination shots on Apr 3
and May 1, 2021. Unlikely because they were 6 months ago. I received
the booster shot on Dec 5, 2021, which is also unlikely unless you
believe reverse time shift causality inversion.

What I find appalling is that you can't even write a one line
correction without also insulting the person who found your mistake.
Everyone makes typo and spelling errors, which would rarely need
public attention. However, 100% wrong batting average and amazing
wrong facts deserves some attention in the vain hope that you might do
something to fix the problem.

Incidentally, you forgot to provide a link to the JAMA article you
mentioned.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Thu, 17 Feb 2022 15:10:44 -0600, AMuzi <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote:

>Could be worse.
>
>Here, besides geese, The Powers That Be reintroduced actual
>wolves after the citizenry had successfully eliminated the
>threat. Now that they have bred for a few years, there are
>something well over 1000*. The 'target population' is 350.
>And yet, like geese, can't kill the things.
>
>* no one actually knows, State DNR (experts!!) says between
>1000 and 1400. Maybe.

The higher numbers might be because they're also counting werewolves.
<http://members.cruzio.com/~jeffl/nooze/werewolf.txt>

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Fri, 18 Feb 2022 05:58:26 +0700, John B. <sloc...@gmail.com>
wrote:

>Some months ago, when I had my last appointment with my cardiologist
>and he asked me whether I had been vaccinated and pointed out that
>both I and my wife, being elderly, were eligible for free vaccination
>and he strongly recommended that "older persons" have it.
>
>I would also point out that this was at one of the largest hospitals
>in Bangkok and he is the senior cardiologist...

Thanks. I've had similar advice some another doctor. The greatest
risks of both Covid fatalities and adverse reactions are among
seniors.

Unfortunately the medical profession is very much adverse to taking
risks. If there's the slightest chance that things might go wrong,
they will refuse to do the work or approve the treatment[1].
Currently, rDNA is all new, with plenty of unknowns involved. I
wouldn't blame the doctor for taking a "safe" position on vaccination.

I don't know how malpractice insurance works in Thailand, but in
California, it has forced many changes, such as many independent
practitioners joining medical groups so as to have an effective
defense against lawsuits. I'm seeing some medical decisions being
made based heavily on legal exposure.


[1] I've had this problem when my urologist wanted to have kidney
stone surgery outsourced to a clinic in order to save money.
Everything was approved and blessed by the clinic several weeks in
advance. The day before the scheduled operation, someone at the
clinic discovered that I had a heart problem which was thought to be
too much of a risk. Surgery was cancelled at the last moment. My
guess(tm) is that the doctors didn't have a problem, but the lawyers
hired by the clinic were paranoid.

[Tom Kunich]

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/circ.144.suppl_1.10712 Abstract 10712: Mrna COVID Vaccines Dramatically Increase Endothelial Inflammatory Markers and ACS Risk as Measured by the PULS Cardiac Test: a Warning

Or you can get a better explanation of the paper from Dr. Campbell. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEBGl8MVE-c&t=102s

Also see http://indepthnh.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/COVID-Report-from-Rep.-Weyler-3.pdf

"VAERS data from the American CDC shows that as of September 17, 2021, already 726,963 people
suffered adverse events, including stroke, heart failure, blood clots, brain disorders, convulsions,
seizures, inflammations of brain & spinal cord, life-threatening allergic reactions, autoimmune
diseases, arthritis, miscarriage, infertility, rapid-onset muscle weakness, deafness, blindness,
narcolepsy, and cataplexy. Besides the astronomical number of severe side effects, the CDC reports
that almost 15,386 people died as a result of receiving the experimental injections. However, a CDC
healthcare fraud detection expert named Jane Doe investigated this and came to the shocking
discovery that the number of deaths is at least five times higher than what the CDC is admitting. In
fact, in her initial communications to professor in medicine Dr. Peter McCullough, this whistleblower
said that the number of deaths is ten times higher. The CDC health fraud detection expert signed an
affidavit, in which she stated her findings. She carefully chose the wordings '...under-reported by a
conservative factor of at least five', but as she revealed initially, the factor could also be ten. Here
is an excerpt of the affidavit: 1
'I have, over the last 25 years, developed over 100 distinct healthcare fraud detection
algorithms. ... When the COVID-19 vaccine clearly became associated with patient death and
harm, I was inclined to investigate the matter. It is my professional estimate that VAERS (the
Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System) database, while extremely useful, is under-reported
by a conservative factor of at least 5. ... and have assessed that the deaths occurring within 3
days of vaccination are higher than those reported in VAERS by a factor of at least 5.'
The CDC is also vastly underreporting other adverse events, like severe allergic reactions
(anaphylaxis). The Informed Consent Action Network (ICAN) reported that a study showed how the
actual number of anaphylaxis is 50 to 120 times higher than claimed by the CDC.2, 3 On top of that, a
private researcher took a close look at the VAERS database, and tried looking up specific case-ID’s"

[John B.]

On Thu, 17 Feb 2022 16:40:32 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>
wrote:

The hospital and doctor I mentioned are "Government Hospitals". We
have both Government and Private hospitals here. the major difference
is that for a Thai citizen, they pay 30 baht - about 1 hour's minimum
wages, per visit and anything that the doctor in the Government
Hospital prescribes is covered by that 30 baht. The so called Private
hospitals charges are as much as 10 times, or more, higher.

So... malpractice suits, would entail, in most cases essentially suing
the government so one's chances of winning such a case is, well...
negligible.

But lets be honest, liability cases in the U.S. have reached the point
of the ridiculous, if not the bizarre. I just read that Remington just
paid several million to settle a clam that they had sold a rifle which
was then used to kill someone.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[AMuzi]

Messy case, one from which snappy 'just-so' conclusions
ought not be drawn.

As with suing Ford for a drunk-driving crash, normal
liability isn't relevant here.

In a normal case, since the weapon was stolen and the owner
was murdered, liability chain would have been broken.

For Remington Arms, the charges alleged incitement in their
advertising, an unique CT statute and I agree it was poorly
done (although I didn't see it as criminal, merely stupid. I
am not a CT legislator).

Trouble is, Remington Arms is in bankruptcy (a regular
process in the boom-bust arms industry) so the four
insurance carriers decided it was in their best interests to
settle. I do not know their analyses. Nor do you.

Interesting side note: The AR-15 style rifle was chambered
.22LR.

[John B.]

True and I wonder whether the pay off might not have been done simply
to get a claim off the books.

The company I worked for in Indonesia got sued for some sort of labor
claim in a California court and the company paid the claim - it was in
thousands of dollars in those days (:-). I complained to management
that the guy was guilty and I could prove it and management asked me
if I knew how much it would cost to go to court? It would have cost
more to fight the case and win then to just give the guy the money.

>Interesting side note: The AR-15 style rifle was chambered
>.22LR.

--

Cheers,

John B.

[Frank Krygowski]

On Thursday, February 17, 2022 at 5:45:20 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote:
>
> The hospital and doctor I mentioned are "Government Hospitals". We
> have both Government and Private hospitals here. the major difference
> is that for a Thai citizen, they pay 30 baht - about 1 hour's minimum
> wages, per visit and anything that the doctor in the Government
> Hospital prescribes is covered by that 30 baht. The so called Private
> hospitals charges are as much as 10 times, or more, higher.

Whoa. I had to look that up, but 30 baht is almost one U.S. dollar for the visit
plus all medications!

And private hospitals charge nearly $10 per hospital visit? You know, here in
the U.S. those charges are a bit higher.

- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

On Thursday, February 17, 2022 at 6:34:14 PM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
>
> For Remington Arms, the charges alleged incitement in their
> advertising, an unique CT statute and I agree it was poorly
> done (although I didn't see it as criminal, merely stupid. I
> am not a CT legislator).
>
> Trouble is, Remington Arms is in bankruptcy (a regular
> process in the boom-bust arms industry) so the four
> insurance carriers decided it was in their best interests to
> settle. I do not know their analyses. Nor do you.
>
> Interesting side note: The AR-15 style rifle was chambered
> .22LR.

Fired fast enough, .22 LR can kill a lot of kids.

- Frank Krygowski

[John B.]

Well there is a difference in income too (:-)

Here minimum salary is 300 baht a day but it is nearly impossible to
get a Thai to work that cheaply now. Current daily salary seems to be
-about- 400 baht a day for what one would call unskilled labor.

But comparing hospital prices. I've had two pacemakers, the first one
got infected and had to be removed and in order to get the leads that
go to the heart out they had do some fairly extensive cutting on my
chest and I ended up with an "L" shaped wound about 4 inches on a
side. As the original problem had been an infection the doctor
suggested that I have the bandage changed every day and the wound
cleaned and checked. In the Government Hospital it was costing me 70
baht a day. One day, I don't remember why, we elected to go to a
Private Hospital and it cost 1,000 baht.

--
Cheers,

John B.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Thu, 17 Feb 2022 17:12:49 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich

That's from AHA, not from JAMA. I'm interested in the JAMA article
you mentioned because it allegedly claims:
"... latest papers in the Journal of the American Medical Association

are showing over a doubling of the chance of a heart attack for anyone
that took the mRNA vaccines."

I wanted to read all about this doubled risk, not about failed wonder
drugs and treatments from other sources. If you're going to cite an
unspecified article in JAMA, the least you could do is find the
article so others can appreciate your amazing findings.

Here's the AHA correction to the above AHA article:
<https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIR.0000000000001053>
No numbers:
"No statistical comparison was done in this observational study."
The alarmist warnings have been removed from the abstract due to lack
of sufficient data to demonstrate anything.

>Or you can get a better explanation of the paper from Dr. Campbell. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEBGl8MVE-c&t=102s

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Campbell_(YouTuber)>
See section on his COVID-19 misinformation:
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Campbell_(YouTuber)#COVID-19_misinformation>

>Also see http://indepthnh.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/COVID-Report-from-Rep.-Weyler-3.pdf

Dr Vladimir Zelenko is not a good source for Covid-19 information:
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladimir_Zelenko>
His claim to fame was that he was one of the early promoters of the
failed hydroxychloroquine treatment for COVID-19.

"Has Dr. Zelenko Successfully Treated 669 Coronavirus Patients?"
<https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/zelenko-669-coronavirus-patients/>
Conclusion: Unproven.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Thu, 17 Feb 2022 15:25:12 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>
wrote:

>On Thu, 17 Feb 2022 14:43:49 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
><cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>My mistake, that was a typo which you always find so appalling Endocarditis

>Endocarditis might be a real problem, but not this time:
><https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/endocarditis/symptoms-causes/syc-20352576>
>I had that problem on Sept 27, 2021.

Oops, my mistake. I was diagnosed with pericarditis, not
endocarditis. Paracarditis is the inflammation of the sac around the
heart, while endocarditis is the inflammation of the inner lining of
the heart chambers and valves. There's also myocarditis, which is the
inflammation of the heart muscle. Sorry for the confusion.

[John B.]

I think that is a fundamental difference between the U.S., today, and
some other countries.

About a year an Thai Army Sergeant checked a M-16 out of the armory
and went into Korat City and first went to a Buddhist Temple and shot
some people and then went to a large shopping complex and shot some
more. The final score was 30 dead and (I believe) 50 wounded.

And nobody even mentioned the rifle, rather the entire blame was
placed squarely on the shoulders of the guy that did the shooting. In
the U.S., as in the case of the Remington Rifle, the blame seems to be
somehow attributed to the inert object rather then the human that
actually did the deed.

And this attributing a crime to an inert object instead of the
individual that actually carried out the act seems to be a relatively
recent phenomena, When I was growing up we didn't have a lot of
shootings but I do remember one as I went to school with the policeman
that did the shooting.The "victim" attacked the Cop with a garden hoe
and the cop shot him. There was a big to-do and a Grand Jury and the
newspapers were full of it and never a mention of a gun at all.

The old saying that "guns don't shoot people, people shoot people"
really is true.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[Roger Merriman]

This shouldn’t be a issue as the parks are big neutral areas, it’s
generally that folks let the dogs get too close to the fawns and the mum
will defend, but like sheep etc, they warn repeatedly if folks choose to
look….

The stags is generally humans getting too close or in the way, probably as
most of the times the Stags are very placid and not bothered by humans, but
the Rut they are single minded as you’d expect. And pumped full of hormones
and with no food and not much sleep!

But again easy enough if one takes a modicum of care, ie give them space!

Roger Merriman.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

On Thursday, February 17, 2022 at 12:36:03 PM UTC-6, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, February 16, 2022 at 7:52:53 PM UTC-8, jeff.li...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Wed, 16 Feb 2022 19:23:58 -0500, Frank Krygowski
> > <frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> >
> > >On 2/16/2022 4:44 PM, funkma...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > >> On Wednesday, February 16, 2022 at 1:20:32 PM UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> > >>> And off road hazard:
> > >>>
> > >>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/bicyclists-captured-video-being-attacked-131210101.html
> > >>>
> > >>> Joerg, is that you?
> >
> > >> I saw that on MTBR. Scary stuff.
> >
> > >It's an interesting counterpoint to "I only want to ride off road,
> > >because it's too dangerous to ride around cars."
> > Be sure to look over your shoulder during your next group ride. You
> > never know what might join your group:
> > <https://www.google.com/search?q=bear+riding+bicycle&tbm=isch>
> >
> > I seem to recall their motto is "To Bear the Unbearable".
> Jeff, latest papers in the Journal of the American Medical Association are showing over a doubling of the chance of a heart attack for anyone that took the mRNA vaccines.

https://www.healthline.com/health/covid-vaccine-heart-attack
No Tommy.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/safety/myocarditis.html
https://www.mskcc.org/coronavirus/what-know-about-covid-19-vaccines-linked-heart-problems-young-people

> This is a permanent disability. And an almost unbelievable increase of 8,400% increase in the chance of endomyelitis (arrhythmia) within > days of mRNA vaccinations..

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-021-01630-0
"In contrast, we found no evidence of an increase in the risk of pericarditis or cardiac arrhythmias following vaccination, except in the 1–28 days following a second dose of the mRNA-1273 vaccine. Second, in the same population, there was a greater risk of myocarditis, pericarditis and cardiac arrhythmia following SARS-CoV-2 infection."

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

Tommy, you got to do a better job of lying than that.
https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2021/oct/01/blog-posting/report-shares-wildly-unfounded-claims-covid-19-vac/
"A 52-page report from a pair of anti-vaccine advocates claims to present the truth about COVID-19 vaccines. However, it does just the opposite.

The website Stop World Control published the so-called Vaccine Death Report in September 2021, and it was shared across Facebook, including in this Sept. 26 post. It is written by David Sorenson and Dr. Vladimir Zelenko, a New York doctor who made headlines for prescribing hydroxychloroquine to treat COVID-19 even though health authorities cautioned against it.

The report claims that "millions have died from COVID injections" around the world, and includes narratives from the United States, the United Kingdom, Israel and Brazil to back up this claim.

On top of that, it claims that half a million people within the United States have suffered severe side effects such as strokes, heart failure, brain disorders, convulsions and more.

"The data shows that we are currently witnessing the greatest organized mass murder in the history of our world," the report states.

The alarming findings cite databases like the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System and others. But the report misinterpreted the data to draw unfounded conclusions about the vaccines.

The Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System, also called VAERS, is an official public government database where anyone can submit any potential adverse health effect following a vaccine. However, the reports are not verified, and the system itself warns that reports can contain information that is incomplete, inaccurate, coincidental or unverifiable. When used improperly, VAERS can be a source for misinformation."

Reports of death after COVID-19 vaccination are rare. And the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention has not verified any deaths as a result of the vaccines approved in the United States."

Tommy, please try to fact check and assess the quality of the "support documents" you use for your wild claims.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

John did also say "they pay 30 baht - about 1 hour's minimum wages,"

So $1 per hour is the minimum wage in Thailand. Here in the US of A it is $7.25. I suspect many folks would be dancing in the streets if they could only get a charge of $72.50 for a doctor office visit.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

I am assuming your second "paragraph" above should be "About a year ago a Thai Army Sergeant..."

Thailand (you ae in Thailand right?) has about 70 million people. A little under one fourth the USA population of 330 million. A year ago you had a big mass killing. In the USA we have had a similar mass killing every few years. Double yours in 2017. One and half times more in 2016. Equal to yours in 2007, 2012, 2017. And half or so in many other years.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_shootings_in_the_United_States

Looking at the number of mass killings in the USA, and the body count at each, I'd bet the USA is still way ahead of Thailand in mass killing events. And because the USA is so far ahead of Thailand, we look at why that is so. Is it real easy to do a mass killing in the USA because its so easy to get a good gun to go mass killing with? I bet if Thailand has one or two or three of similar mass killings every single year, then Thailand would also look at why its so easy to do these mass killings. And if its determined that all the perpetrators are using M-16 rifles, then the government might restrict the access to these good mass killing guns. Also, because your mass killing was an Army Sergeant using an Army M-16 rifle, focusing on the gun would be analogous to focusing on the speed or racing car in a crash at the Indianapolis 500 race. The Army M-16 rifle used in wars by soldiers is too good at killing people? Why would you have any questions about the rifle? Access to it by an Army Sergeant? No. Ability to take it off base without lots of checks and balances and paperwork and explanations? Yes.

>
> And this attributing a crime to an inert object instead of the
> individual that actually carried out the act seems to be a relatively
> recent phenomena,

No. In the USA the government banned machine guns from civilians back in 1934 with the National Firearms Act. The federal government thought that inert object (machine gun) was too deadly for non military to have at their disposal. Mobsters back in the 1920s and 30s thought machine guns were real good at killing people. And they were. Government thought they could reduce the ease of killing by banning that inert object.

When I was growing up we didn't have a lot of
> shootings but I do remember one as I went to school with the policeman
> that did the shooting.The "victim" attacked the Cop with a garden hoe
> and the cop shot him. There was a big to-do and a Grand Jury and the
> newspapers were full of it and never a mention of a gun at all.
>
> The old saying that "guns don't shoot people, people shoot people"
> really is true.

True. Except its also true that people can shoot LOTS of people if they have a gun that shoots lots of bullets real fast.




> --
> Cheers,
>
> John B.

[Rolf Mantel]

Am 18.02.2022 um 06:50 schrieb Jeff Liebermann:
> On Thu, 17 Feb 2022 15:25:12 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 17 Feb 2022 14:43:49 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
>> <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> My mistake, that was a typo which you always find so appalling Endocarditis
>
>> Endocarditis might be a real problem, but not this time:
>> <https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/endocarditis/symptoms-causes/syc-20352576>
>> I had that problem on Sept 27, 2021.
>
> Oops, my mistake. I was diagnosed with pericarditis, not
> endocarditis. Paracarditis is the inflammation of the sac around the
> heart, while endocarditis is the inflammation of the inner lining of
> the heart chambers and valves. There's also myocarditis, which is the
> inflammation of the heart muscle. Sorry for the confusion.

Right, and Myocarditis is the one known statistically relevant adverse
effect of the vaccine: Amongst males in the age group below 30, it hits
one in 500,000. A Covid-19 infection triggers Myocarditis about 10
times more often; in bost cases the myocarditis can be avoided by a
couple of weeks rest.

This was the main reason why the Moderna Vaxxine in Germany is not
recommended for people below the age of 30, and it is also the reason
why originally, the German Health Service recommended Covid-19
vaccinations in the age groups below 30 "only for risk groups".
With the Omicron wave, the risk of Covid-19 in fection has risen above
10%, so now the German Health service recommend the vaccination for
everybody.

Rolf

[Tom Kunich]

Jeff, why don't you pull a John on us and look it up on Google? I realize that would be a bit novel but you could probably find it down 100 pages since Google does not want real information out in the public.

[Tom Kunich]

Russell, you're free to believe anything you like. Fauci is saying that all of the states opening up are wrong and you should still be double masking with masks that the CDC studies say do not work. Be yourself and hug the fear closely.

[Tom Kunich]

There is a serious problem with their statistics. They are claiming that if you are vaccinated and less than 16 days have gone by, you are not vaccinated and any death is laid at the door not of the vaccine but of covid-19. I have shown that they have no means of positively detecting covid-19 because they have never isolated the virus. How do you test for something you don't even know exists?

Leanard Lee just put out another video saying that he was self isolating because he tested positive for covid-19. What were his symptoms? A slight fever and a slight tightening in his chest. In other words the same symptoms as a cold. It is winter after all though perhaps people in England have a problem telling the difference in the seasons since it is always raining, cold and nasty.

[Ralph Barone]

I’d be quite pissed off at the sudden increase in cost.

[Frank Krygowski]

On 2/18/2022 12:56 AM, John B. wrote:
> On Thu, 17 Feb 2022 20:04:26 -0800 (PST), Frank Krygowski
> <frkr...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Thursday, February 17, 2022 at 6:34:14 PM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
>>>
>>> For Remington Arms, the charges alleged incitement in their
>>> advertising, an unique CT statute and I agree it was poorly
>>> done (although I didn't see it as criminal, merely stupid. I
>>> am not a CT legislator).
>>>
>>> Trouble is, Remington Arms is in bankruptcy (a regular
>>> process in the boom-bust arms industry) so the four
>>> insurance carriers decided it was in their best interests to
>>> settle. I do not know their analyses. Nor do you.
>>>
>>> Interesting side note: The AR-15 style rifle was chambered
>>> .22LR.
>>
>> Fired fast enough, .22 LR can kill a lot of kids.
>>
>> - Frank Krygowski
>
> I think that is a fundamental difference between the U.S., today, and
> some other countries.
>
> About a year an Thai Army Sergeant checked a M-16 out of the armory
> and went into Korat City and first went to a Buddhist Temple and shot
> some people and then went to a large shopping complex and shot some
> more. The final score was 30 dead and (I believe) 50 wounded.
>
> And nobody even mentioned the rifle, rather the entire blame was

> placed squarely on the shoulders of the guy that did the shooting. ...

So a Thai Army Sergeant checked an M-16 out of the armory to do a mass
shooting. How often does that happen?

I gather that Thailand's gun restrictions are quite a bit tighter than
those of the U.S. Here in the U.S., if someone wants to do a mass
shooting, they don't bother with an Army armory. Almost anyone can buy a
compact, rapid fire highly modifiable combat-optimized gun and blast
away. That's partly why U.S. gun deaths are many times more common than
those in Thailand.

Somehow, most Thais seem to do fine with tighter gun restrictions. I
assume you do as well. Have you ever needed a gun for self defense?

Do you own an AR-style or AK-style rifle?


--
- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

But Real Americans don't want none of that socialism! We LIKE giving
our money to maintain the Health Care executive yachts!

So what if our health is way worse than so many other countries? WE'RE
NUMBER ONE! (In costs.)


--
- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

On 2/18/2022 4:35 AM, russell...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>
> Tommy, please try to fact check and assess the quality of the "support documents" you use for your wild claims.

But that did pass Tom's quality standard! According to Tom, _any_ far
right source is _automatically_ correct.

Tom's a Q-Anon sucker.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

On 2/18/2022 8:24 AM, Rolf Mantel wrote:
>
> Right, and Myocarditis is the one known statistically relevant adverse
> effect of the vaccine: Amongst males in the age group below 30, it hits
> one in 500,000.  A Covid-19 infection triggers Myocarditis about 10
> times more often; in bost cases the myocarditis can be avoided by a
> couple of weeks rest.
>
> This was the main reason why the Moderna Vaxxine in Germany is not
> recommended for people below the age of 30, and it is also the reason
> why originally, the German Health Service recommended Covid-19
> vaccinations in the age groups below 30 "only for risk groups".
> With the Omicron wave, the risk of Covid-19 in fection has risen above
> 10%, so now the German Health service recommend the vaccination for
> everybody.

IOW, the health officials gathered and examined data, then acted on that
data. As conditions and resulting data changed, they adjusted policies
and actions.

A lot of people here could never understand that.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Tom Kunich]

Nothing but complaints that after spending your life not having to work, you don't have anything to show for it. Jobst did very well for himself. What was the reason you decided to go into a fiend that had poor pay and even more poor benefits?

[Frank Krygowski]

:-) HA HA HA HA HA!

Ah, Tom, you're a riot!

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Roger Merriman]

I’ve been assured by American colleague’s of my wife over the years that
we’d of lost the house after the brain Injury, ie lots of scans high
intensity wards, rehabilitation over the years and so on!

That essentially be bankrupt the idea of keeping one’s job let alone the
house…

Roger Merriman

[AMuzi]

I saw some disconnect between the lawsuit's emphasis on the
word 'combat' in the ad (no assertion that Ms Lanza ever saw
that ad) and the actual firearm with a .22 rimfire format.
Interesting side note only.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

And you make this statement based on what evidence? Did you personally know Jobst Brandt? Talk to him in person for many years? Brandt was famous in certain circles. He wrote a highly acclaimed book on wheel building. I do not know if this generated an enormous amount of money or not. I am associating money with "well". Bicycle wheel building books probably are not flying off the shelves at book stores or Amazon. He was a college professor and likely had engineer jobs outside of academia too. Did these provide success, joy? Did he have a family? Friends? Judging whether someone did "very well" takes a lot of information.

One more question Tommy. How did Jobst Brandt get added into this thread? Was this thread about wheel building? Was this thread about touring the Alps using only a Carradice bag as a luggage carrier?

George Washington was the greatest general in US history!!!!!! Ooh Ooh Ooh!!!!! I just did a Tommy and added in a completely irrelevant topic!!!!!!

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

Well......the M-16 and many of the AR-15 style rifles is chambered in .223 (5.56 NATO). So it is sort of the exact same diameter bullet. .22 compared to .223. Almost identical diameter bullet. There are of course one or maybe even two other differences between a .22 rimfire (short or long or long rifle or Magnum) and a .223 center fire.

[John B.]

The current exchange rate (just looked it up) is 32,25 baht = 1
dollar. Minimum wage here has been 300 baht a day for several years.
However the work day is not specified as 8 hours but it is an
approximation of what many people work so yes a visit to a Public
Hospital is abbot 1 hour's wages. and for the elderly, over 60, it is
free.

But having said that I might add that the average tip to a bloke who
pushes your supermarket cart out to your car and unloads it for you is
about 20 baht.

So, in those terms 30 baht is just a bit more then you would tip the
"carryboy".
--
Cheers,

John B.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

You better not come back to the USA John. The grocery cart boy pushing the cart out to the car and unloading it is NOT done in the USA anymore. At least not at any grocery store I have ever visited. Maybe it might still be done for ancient grandma in one or two very rural towns out in the hinterlands. But not in 99.99% of towns and cities. There are no full service gas stations anymore either. No one but you pumps your gas to your car.

[John B.]

You are rationalizing things. But, if you wish to do that then:

Using your reference there have been, from 1949 until 2018 some 442
killed in mass shootings while during the same period there were
51,613 killed while riding bicycles.

If you want to talk about devices that kill people I do believe that
you really do need to consider bicycles... 116.77 times as many deaths
as deaths in mass shootings. and on an annual basis in 2018 rifles
killed 305 while bicycles killed 854.

I and certainly Andrew have pointed out that homicides committed with
these incredibly dangerious semi-automatic rifles is only a bit more
then half those committed with hands and feet.
https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2019/crime-in-the-u.s.-2019/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-8.xls

But, of course, that wasn't the point at all. I was pointing out the
fallacy, in the U.S. of pointing at some inanimate object and saying,
"Gee if we just get rid of those dangerious things, why, there'd be no
crime at all."

>
>>
>> And this attributing a crime to an inert object instead of the
>> individual that actually carried out the act seems to be a relatively
>> recent phenomena,
>
>No. In the USA the government banned machine guns from civilians back in 1934 with the National Firearms Act. The federal government thought that inert object (machine gun) was too deadly for non military to have at their disposal. Mobsters back in the 1920s and 30s thought machine guns were real good at killing people. And they were. Government thought they could reduce the ease of killing by banning that inert object.

Nope, they didn't ban machine guns. Read the act. They required a $100
license to poses a "machine gun"

> When I was growing up we didn't have a lot of
>> shootings but I do remember one as I went to school with the policeman
>> that did the shooting.The "victim" attacked the Cop with a garden hoe
>> and the cop shot him. There was a big to-do and a Grand Jury and the
>> newspapers were full of it and never a mention of a gun at all.
>>
>> The old saying that "guns don't shoot people, people shoot people"
>> really is true.
>
>True. Except its also true that people can shoot LOTS of people if they have a gun that shoots lots of bullets real fast.
>
>
>
>
>> --
>> Cheers,
>>
>> John B.

--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Fri, 18 Feb 2022 07:35:08 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich

Well, Tommy, Google, or Wikipedia to be more exact, is, I find, a
rather useful research tool as anyone can post to it. If you believe,
for example, that the earth is flat you are welcome to post such a
statement on "the Wiki"...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth

Of course, there is one weak point, from your viewpoint... That Damned
Wiki wants you to post a reference for every one of the "facts" that
you post, which would be a real handicap for people like you.

For those that care, I find that the facts posted on Wikipedia are
generally correct but the supposition drawn from the facts is
sometimes not quite what I believe it should be (:-)
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

As usual you dance, adroitly, around the theme. I pointed out that in
the case of a Thai Army Sergeant who shot and killed some 30 people
not a single news report, or for that matter, individual I talked to,
ever even mentioned the type of weapon used. Both the News and
individuals commented only of the fact that "the guy must have been
insane", or words to that effect.

As for not bothering with the Armory? Well, if you are a Senior
Sergeant in the army I suspect that the armory is a very logical place
to find a gun.

But yes, there are stringent rules about gun ownership in Thailand
which doesn't seem to bother the criminals a bit. In fact just the
other day there was a very professional "hit" carried out on an
individual initially referred to as a "foreign businessman" who it
turned out had been in organized crime, in Canada, I believe. The
police have now identified two Canadians who apparently flew in,
acquired pistols, shot the guy and flew back out.

My precis still is that rather then face reality, USians try to
rationalize the facts. No, it really wasn't because the perpetrator
was a rotten, no good, little SOB who tortured cats as a hobby, it was
because he found a gun. "See, it was all the gun's fault!"
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

I recently looked up the U.S. costs of a broken arm and the article
stated some costs and then went on to say that it "might be as much as
$10,000".
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

Disregarding the ".22 caliber", my own choice would be a 12 gauge
shotgun, either pump or automatic and probably loaded with "buck shot"
as I believe that I can injure, incapacitate, whatever, more people
per round fired then is possible with an AR-whatever.

Wyatt Earp, who probably knew more about firearms then the average
"modern USian" used a shotgun in several of his shootings.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

OK. Its $200 for the National Firearms Act stamp. And a whole lot of federal forms and investigation too.
https://www.therange702.com/blog/can-you-legally-own-a-machine-gun/

But the USA licenses and regulates explosives too. Everyone buying, selling, using explosives has to have federal license. Why do we do that? Shouldn't everyone have the right to use explosives whenever they want? Isn't it a constitutional right? Explosives are inert objects too. Why should they be regulated and controlled? I don't recall anytime in history where the bad guys were blowing everyone and everything up with dynamite. FREEDOM to BLOW things UP!!!!!!!!!!!
https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/fact-sheet/fact-sheet-explosives-united-states

Or did some freedom hating government bureaucrat decide to take that freedom away from Americans? He thought blowing things up was not a good thing for the average Joe on the street to do. Even though explosives are an inert object. And do lots of good things in activities like mining. Kind of like M-16 and AR-15 are appropriate for the military to have and use because they are good at killing people. Which the military does. But do bums walking on the street need to be able to kill people so easily? Or blow people and things up easily with explosives?

[Ralph Barone]

Whereas my daughter’s broken arm a number of years ago cost me $30 (for
parking at the hospital).

[AMuzi]

Maybe for a simple fracture (wrap and cast) at some
independent rural hospital. Maybe.

This plate and some screws cost $23,000 in 2006:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/WRISTNU.JPG

The entire adventure door-to-door took about 3 hours
including the excruciating entry & paperwork process.

[AMuzi]

Well, then! Glad to know the regulatory system and all the
experts are saving us from dynamite:

https://www.fox43.com/article/news/nation-world/atm-explosions-thefts-philadelphia/507-bb610727-636c-4d54-ba70-87350a7a99af

Works about as well as the century old worldwide Heroin ban.

Arresting the guy (link above) is good policy. Death by
paperwork for innocent mining engineers isn't all that helpful.

[AMuzi]

On 2/18/2022 8:39 PM, Ralph Barone wrote:
> John B. <sloc...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Fri, 18 Feb 2022 17:38:43 -0000 (UTC), Roger Merriman
>> <ro...@sarlet.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Frank Krygowski <frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> On 2/18/2022 10:52 AM, Ralph Barone wrote:
>>>>> russell...@yahoo.com <ritzann...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Thursday, February 17, 2022 at 10:01:31 PM UTC-6, frkr...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>> On Thursday, February 17, 2022 at 5:45:20 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The hospital and doctor I mentioned are "Government Hospitals". We
>>>>>>>> have both Government and Private hospitals here. the major difference
>>>>>>>> is that for a Thai citizen, they pay 30 baht - about 1 hour's minimum
>>>>>>>> wages, per visit and anything that the doctor in the Government
>>>>>>>> Hospital prescribes is covered by that 30 baht. The so called Private
>>>>>>>> hospitals charges are as much as 10 times, or more, higher.
>>>>>>> Whoa. I had to look that up, but 30 baht is almost one U.S. dollar for the visit
>>>>>>> plus all medications!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And private hospitals charge nearly $10 per hospital visit? You know, here in
>>>>>>> the U.S. those charges are a bit higher.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> - Frank Krygowski
>>>>>>
>>>>>> John did also say "they pay 30 baht - about 1 hour's minimum wages,"
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So $1 per hour is the minimum wage in Thailand. Here in the US of A it
>>>>>> is $7.25. I suspect many folks would be dancing in the streets if they
>>>>>> could only get a charge of $72.50 for a doctor office visit.
>>>>>>
>>>>>

>>>>> IÂ’d be quite pissed off at the sudden increase in cost.

>>>>
>>>> But Real Americans don't want none of that socialism! We LIKE giving
>>>> our money to maintain the Health Care executive yachts!
>>>>
>>>> So what if our health is way worse than so many other countries? WE'RE
>>>> NUMBER ONE! (In costs.)
>>>>
>>>>

>>> IÂ’ve been assured by American colleagueÂ’s of my wife over the years that
>>> weÂ’d of lost the house after the brain Injury, ie lots of scans high

>>> intensity wards, rehabilitation over the years and so on!
>>>

>>> That essentially be bankrupt the idea of keeping oneÂ’s job let alone the
>>> houseÂ…

>>>
>>> Roger Merriman
>>
>> I recently looked up the U.S. costs of a broken arm and the article
>> stated some costs and then went on to say that it "might be as much as
>> $10,000".
>

> Whereas my daughter’s broken arm a number of years ago cost me $30 (for
> parking at the hospital).
>

Were you a cash customer? Probably not.
I'll assume the actual billing was over $30 to someone.

[John B.]

On Fri, 18 Feb 2022 16:12:34 -0800 (PST), "russell...@yahoo.com"

Here the (I'm translating here) "carryboys" are actually the guys who
are running around the parking area collecting the carts to wheel them
back to the front of the store. Very likely minimum wage people who
are making a "bit on the side".

And "Filling Stations", they all have people to pump your gas and the
first thing that they do is put a big sign on the hood saying
"SERVICE" I assume to influence you NOT to drive off before the hose
is out of the tank. And just as soon as they put the cap on the tank
they are standing at the driver's window with their hand out (:-) And,
for some reason, a lot of them are girls.

>>
>> So, in those terms 30 baht is just a bit more then you would tip the
>> "carryboy".
>> --
>> Cheers,
>>
>> John B.

--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Fri, 18 Feb 2022 18:24:16 -0800 (PST), "russell...@yahoo.com"

My mistake. I had thought it was $100

>
>But the USA licenses and regulates explosives too. Everyone buying, selling, using explosives has to have federal license. Why do we do that? Shouldn't everyone have the right to use explosives whenever they want? Isn't it a constitutional right? Explosives are inert objects too. Why should they be regulated and controlled? I don't recall anytime in history where the bad guys were blowing everyone and everything up with dynamite. FREEDOM to BLOW things UP!!!!!!!!!!!
>https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/fact-sheet/fact-sheet-explosives-united-states

While your reference is certainly true in part is it true in dealing
with gun powder? Does one require a license to poses or use gun power
either Black or smokeless?

As an aside, as a kid I and a buddy used to make nitroglycerine,
generally unsuccessfully. We used to put the "nitroglycerine" in empty
rifle cases and throw them down into an abandoned mine... and every
once in a while one of them would go "bang". Note: "bang" not "!BANG!"

>Or did some freedom hating government bureaucrat decide to take that freedom away from Americans? He thought blowing things up was not a good thing for the average Joe on the street to do. Even though explosives are an inert object. And do lots of good things in activities like mining. Kind of like M-16 and AR-15 are appropriate for the military to have and use because they are good at killing people. Which the military does. But do bums walking on the street need to be able to kill people so easily? Or blow people and things up easily with explosives?

Well, the M-16's being capable of full-automatic firing are banned or
at least you need a $200 license to own one and the AK's not being
anything but a "semi-automatic" require no license. But why should
they. After all, semi automatic firearms, to my knowledge, have been
available for more then 100 years - the Remington Model 8 was first
sold in 1905.

And "big Magazines" Oh Horrors!
But of course the Luger pistol had a 30 round magazine way back in WW
I days and several current pistols, the Glock 18 comes standard with a
20 round capacity and 31 round magazines are available and the Glock
17 can also be fitted with a 30 round magazine, and the Kel-Tec PMR 30
has a standard capacity of 30 rounds.

So, apparently semi automatic rifles aren't inherent scary and 30
round magazines aren't scary so why when you combing a small bore semi
automatic rifle with a 30 round magazine does it become such a
fearsome weapon.

I might comment that a full length magazines for a 12 gauge shotguns
are available. In fact the "Century Arms Catamount Fury II" is a 12
gauge shotgun that comes standard with a 30 round magazine, and I'm
pretty sure that 30 rounds of 12 gauge buckshot is are more lethal
then 30 rounds of .22 bullets.

My own supposition is that those who rush about waving their hands in
the air and screaming "Oh! My God! an AR! are people who, in fact,
know very, very, little or nothing at all, about firearms.

As Andrew mentions, there are something like 20 million AR type rifles
in the U.S. If they were inherent dangerous then we should have a
substantial number of rifle homicides each year and in fact the FBI
tells us that we have about 300. Which is, I might add, some .0015% of
the AR's or about 1 out of every 66,666 AR's . Or maybe another way of
putting it might be that in 2018 there were 305 murders committed with
all types of rifles and 854 died on bicycles.

Danger! Danger!
--
Cheers,

John B.

[Ralph Barone]

Oh, it probably cost much more than $30, but it was spread over a large
number of people over a large amount of time. It’s quite possible that over
my lifetime, I may have spent more on healthcare than the average American,
but it sure hurt less to amortize it across everybody’s lifetime.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

But Andy, your story is about someone who was arrested for selling home made dynamite. I am not a chemist, but I assume a competent chemist could acquire the various chemicals needed to make dynamite. Not sure if that is regulated under the federal laws or not. Maybe it only applies to corporate manufactured explosives.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

I am sure NO. Since ammunition reloading is a hobby of some shooters in the USA. They buy gunpowder at the local gun shop. I am sure the store selling it has to be licensed. And probably as part of that license it explicitly says you are legally required under liability to notify the government if anyone buys a suspicious amount of gunpowder. Such as if someone buys 100 pounds of nitrocellulose at once or in a small amount of time. Something suspicious.

[Roger Merriman]

The other issue with insurance based systems is what they will cover and
length of time.

There is a myth within the brain Injury (world?) about no more recovery
after 2 years as that’s when the funding stops.

I’d imagine same goes for a number of things as well.

Roger Merriman

[Frank Krygowski]

On 2/18/2022 8:05 PM, John B. wrote:
>
> If you want to talk about devices that kill people I do believe that
> you really do need to consider bicycles... 116.77 times as many deaths
> as deaths in mass shootings. and on an annual basis in 2018 rifles
> killed 305 while bicycles killed 854.
>
> I and certainly Andrew have pointed out that homicides committed with
> these incredibly dangerious semi-automatic rifles is only a bit more
> then half those committed with hands and feet.
> https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2019/crime-in-the-u.s.-2019/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-8.xls

Advantages vs. disadvantages, John. Advantages vs. disadvantages.

Bikes offer a big advantage as simple transportation that provides life
saving exercise. I can post citations to at least five research papers
that concluded the benefits of bicycling greatly outweigh its risks.
Some of those were very specific in stating that biking saves many more
lives than it loses.

The disadvantages of AR style rifles are obvious: dozens of school
children killed, dozens of night club attendees, dozens of concert
goers, plus hundreds of others in smaller attacks, plus increased risk
to law enforcers rushing to shooting incidents.

What are the advantages of AR style rifles compared to traditional
rifles? Letting guys pretend they could be just like Rambo if "those
other people" invade?

--
- Frank Krygowski

[AMuzi]

Hmmm. If they are only half as useful as bicycles they're of
roughly similar comparative lethality (~450 rifle homicides
vs ~750 bicycle deaths).

I have to note that 'utility' is necessarily subjective. For
me a bicycle (OK, at least two, summer & winter) is an
absolute necessity. To others, not so much. See also rifles,
pickup trucks, handlebar bags, usenet access...

[Frank Krygowski]

On 2/19/2022 12:16 AM, John B. wrote:
>
> And "big Magazines" Oh Horrors!
> But of course the Luger pistol had a 30 round magazine way back in WW
> I days and several current pistols, the Glock 18 comes standard with a
> 20 round capacity and 31 round magazines are available and the Glock
> 17 can also be fitted with a 30 round magazine, and the Kel-Tec PMR 30
> has a standard capacity of 30 rounds.
>
> So, apparently semi automatic rifles aren't inherent scary and 30
> round magazines aren't scary so why when you combing a small bore semi
> automatic rifle with a 30 round magazine does it become such a
> fearsome weapon.
>
> I might comment that a full length magazines for a 12 gauge shotguns
> are available. In fact the "Century Arms Catamount Fury II" is a 12
> gauge shotgun that comes standard with a 30 round magazine, and I'm
> pretty sure that 30 rounds of 12 gauge buckshot is are more lethal
> then 30 rounds of .22 bullets.

Your argument does not prove high capacity magazines are perfectly fine.
I'd say it indicates the need for laws against high capacity magazines
on any firearm.

Advantages vs. disadvantages, John! A disadvantage of a high capacity
magazine is that it enables mass shootings and rapid fire gun battles,
including between gang members and against cops.

What are the advantages of high capacity magazines for non-criminal gun
users? Do hunters really need to put more than (say) ten bullets into a
rabbit or deer? Do target shooters really need fewer pauses to reload?

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

If "not a single news report" even mentioned the type of rifle, how did
you find out about it?

> As for not bothering with the Armory? Well, if you are a Senior
> Sergeant in the army I suspect that the armory is a very logical place
> to find a gun.

In the U.S., it's certainly NOT the most logical place to find a gun.
And that's a serious disadvantage of our gun policy.

Having all combat style rifles in armories could well be a trademark of
a "well regulated militia" as intended by this country's founders. What
we have is a largely unregulated pile of gun fans calling for ever less
regulation, and a gun fatality rate greatly exceeding almost all nations
on earth. It's absolutely ludicrous.

> But yes, there are stringent rules about gun ownership in Thailand
> which doesn't seem to bother the criminals a bit.

I submit the stringent rules DO "bother criminals" and DO reduce gun
violence. How else do you explain the huge difference between Thai and
U.S. firearm death rates?

> In fact just the
> other day there was a very professional "hit" carried out on an
> individual initially referred to as a "foreign businessman" who it
> turned out had been in organized crime, in Canada, I believe. The
> police have now identified two Canadians who apparently flew in,
> acquired pistols, shot the guy and flew back out.

Let's see: That's one killing you're citing. Nobody could type fast
enough to cite all the U.S. gun killings as they came in.

> My precis still is that rather then face reality, USians try to
> rationalize the facts. No, it really wasn't because the perpetrator
> was a rotten, no good, little SOB who tortured cats as a hobby, it was
> because he found a gun. "See, it was all the gun's fault!"

_Nobody_ uses that phrase. Try instead: "We shouldn't let crazy people
have guns."


--
- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

On 2/18/2022 9:03 PM, John B. wrote:
>
> Disregarding the ".22 caliber", my own choice would be a 12 gauge
> shotgun, either pump or automatic and probably loaded with "buck shot"
> as I believe that I can injure, incapacitate, whatever, more people
> per round fired then is possible with an AR-whatever.

And I agree. A shotgun is much more logical than an AR for home defense
- not that I need either for that purpose.

But shotguns don't make a guy feel like Rambo.


--
- Frank Krygowski

[AMuzi]

Ahem.
Fixed gear riders are certain that you are dragging around a
bunch of extraneous gearing.

[AMuzi]

On 2/19/2022 11:29 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:

How do you know what other men feel?

[Tom Kunich]

On Friday, February 18, 2022 at 3:15:38 PM UTC-8, russell...@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Friday, February 18, 2022 at 11:06:39 AM UTC-6, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:

> > Nothing but complaints that after spending your life not having to work, you don't have anything to show for it. Jobst did very well for himself.
> And you make this statement based on what evidence? Did you personally know Jobst Brandt? Talk to him in person for many years? Brandt was famous in certain circles. He wrote a highly acclaimed book on wheel building. I do not know if this generated an enormous amount of money or not. I am associating money with "well". Bicycle wheel building books probably are not flying off the shelves at book stores or Amazon. He was a college professor and likely had engineer jobs outside of academia too. Did these provide success, joy? Did he have a family? Friends? Judging whether someone did "very well" takes a lot of information.
>
> One more question Tommy. How did Jobst Brandt get added into this thread? Was this thread about wheel building? Was this thread about touring the Alps using only a Carradice bag as a luggage carrier?
>
> George Washington was the greatest general in US history!!!!!! Ooh Ooh Ooh!!!!! I just did a Tommy and added in a completely irrelevant topic!!!!!!
> What was the reason you decided to go into a fiend that had poor pay and even more poor benefits?

Why would you speak on a subject you know nothing about? I know the sort of retirement pay that teachers get. My wife is a retired teacher and my son-in-law is presently a teacher who has told me what he will be getting when he retires. Do you believe that Frank's income from a no account university is going to be any better than that?

Frank could have worked as an engineer but he didn't. Jobst did and his retirement was like mine - he was independently wealthy. Far more than me since H-P offered a very substantial retirement pay on top of what he could save. I had to save my own retirement money.

[Tom Kunich]

On Friday, February 18, 2022 at 3:20:52 PM UTC-8, russell...@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Friday, February 18, 2022 at 12:39:32 PM UTC-6, AMuzi wrote:

> > On 2/17/2022 10:04 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> > > On Thursday, February 17, 2022 at 6:34:14 PM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
> > >>
> > >> For Remington Arms, the charges alleged incitement in their
> > >> advertising, an unique CT statute and I agree it was poorly
> > >> done (although I didn't see it as criminal, merely stupid. I
> > >> am not a CT legislator).
> > >>
> > >> Trouble is, Remington Arms is in bankruptcy (a regular
> > >> process in the boom-bust arms industry) so the four
> > >> insurance carriers decided it was in their best interests to
> > >> settle. I do not know their analyses. Nor do you.
> > >>
> > >> Interesting side note: The AR-15 style rifle was chambered
> > >> .22LR.
> > >
> > > Fired fast enough, .22 LR can kill a lot of kids.
> > >
> > > - Frank Krygowski
> > >

> > I saw some disconnect between the lawsuit's emphasis on the
> > word 'combat' in the ad (no assertion that Ms Lanza ever saw
> > that ad) and the actual firearm with a .22 rimfire format.
> > Interesting side note only.

> > --
> > Andrew Muzi
> > <www.yellowjersey.org/>
> > Open every day since 1 April, 1971

> Well......the M-16 and many of the AR-15 style rifles is chambered in .223 (5.56 NATO). So it is sort of the exact same diameter bullet. .22 compared to .223. Almost identical diameter bullet. There are of course one or maybe even two other differences between a .22 rimfire (short or long or long rifle or Magnum) and a .223 center fire.

Such as a bullet with four times the weight and a cartridge with 5 times the powder? Please quit talking about things you don't know about. The only difference between a .223 and a .308 is accurate range.

[Tom Kunich]

John, there is nothing wrong with looking things up on Google. But since Google has an extremely sharp political bias you are more likely to completely miss the story than get the one. My complaint is that you think that looking it up on Google somehow makes you an expert when most of the time it gives you no more than a hint of the truth.

[Tom Kunich]

Frank, everyone here has seen you comment on your opinion on high capacity magazines that aren't high capacity at all. And you are far more than a minority opinion. Most people couldn't care less if it was an infinite repeater as long as it was semiautomatic.

[Tom Kunich]

For just $300 you too can feel just like Rambo https://palmettostatearmory.com/jts-ak-12-ga-18-semi-auto-shotgun-black-m12ak.html?utm_medium=email&utm_source=daily_deals&utm_campaign=20220218&utm_term=morning&utm_content=5165458465

[Tom Kunich]

On Saturday, February 19, 2022 at 10:19:44 AM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
> On 2/19/2022 11:29 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> > On 2/18/2022 9:03 PM, John B. wrote:
> >>
> >> Disregarding the ".22 caliber", my own choice would be a
> >> 12 gauge
> >> shotgun, either pump or automatic and probably loaded with
> >> "buck shot"
> >> as I believe that I can injure, incapacitate, whatever,
> >> more people
> >> per round fired then is possible with an AR-whatever.
> >
> > And I agree. A shotgun is much more logical than an AR for
> > home defense - not that I need either for that purpose.
> >
> > But shotguns don't make a guy feel like Rambo.
> >
> >
> How do you know what other men feel?

He assumes what others feel because of what it does to him. He pisses his pants simply seeing a gun so he thinks guns make others feel brave.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Fri, 18 Feb 2022 07:35:08 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Jeff, why don't you pull a John on us and look it up on Google? I realize that would be a bit novel but you could probably find it down 100 pages since Google does not want real information out in the public.

I already did. You said:

>"... latest papers in the Journal of the American Medical Association
> are showing over a doubling of the chance of a heart attack for anyone
> that took the mRNA vaccines."

Using Google search, I found and posted a link to latest JAMA issue
at:
<https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/currentissue>
which allegedly contains an article verifying YOUR claim of increased
chance of heart attack risk. Since it was YOUR claim, YOUR reference
and YOUR allegation, I though it best if YOU would supply the
necessary URL so that I could read the article which inspired your
expert medical opinion.

Since you can't seem to find the JAMA article, and have only been able
to supply a rather different article from the AHA, it would seem to be
that the JAMA article is yet another one of your fabrications intended
to support one of your claims.

Please note that I'm not writing to verify YOUR claims. I write to
debunk them. You can do YOUR own research and provide YOUR own
substantiations and references.


--
Jeff Liebermann je...@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

[Tom Kunich]

On Saturday, February 19, 2022 at 2:32:14 PM UTC-8, jeff.li...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Fri, 18 Feb 2022 07:35:08 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
> <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >Jeff, why don't you pull a John on us and look it up on Google? I realize that would be a bit novel but you could probably find it down 100 pages since Google does not want real information out in the public.
> I already did. You said:
>
> >"... latest papers in the Journal of the American Medical Association
> > are showing over a doubling of the chance of a heart attack for anyone
> > that took the mRNA vaccines."
> Using Google search, I found and posted a link to latest JAMA issue
> at:
> <https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/currentissue>
> which allegedly contains an article verifying YOUR claim of increased
> chance of heart attack risk. Since it was YOUR claim, YOUR reference
> and YOUR allegation, I though it best if YOU would supply the
> necessary URL so that I could read the article which inspired your
> expert medical opinion.
>
> Since you can't seem to find the JAMA article, and have only been able
> to supply a rather different article from the AHA, it would seem to be
> that the JAMA article is yet another one of your fabrications intended
> to support one of your claims.
>
> Please note that I'm not writing to verify YOUR claims. I write to
> debunk them. You can do YOUR own research and provide YOUR own
> substantiations and references.

So I give you a more complete study from a more than reputable source and you cry because I didn't give you a much smaller study from JAMA because you don't know how to find it? Every posting shows your almost entire ignorance of anything and everything. https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2788346?resultClick=1

Strange that you say I fabricated a study when you are incapable of even finding the work of major studies. Why is that? Do you need you hand held and be led through everything there is? This is why I spent 50 years in major science and you spent time with "marine radios".

[Frank Krygowski]

On 2/19/2022 1:19 PM, AMuzi wrote:
> On 2/19/2022 11:29 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>> On 2/18/2022 9:03 PM, John B. wrote:
>>>
>>> Disregarding the ".22 caliber", my own choice would be a
>>> 12 gauge
>>> shotgun, either pump or automatic and probably loaded with
>>> "buck shot"
>>> as I believe that I can injure, incapacitate, whatever,
>>> more people
>>> per round fired then is possible with an AR-whatever.
>>
>> And I agree. A shotgun is much more logical than an AR for
>> home defense - not that I need either for that purpose.
>>
>> But shotguns don't make a guy feel like Rambo.
>>
>>
>
> How do you know what other men feel?

I talk to them, Andrew. I have friends who have invited me to machine
gun shoots, who bragged about doing things there like blowing up junk
cars and refrigerators. I have a non-gun-nut friend who talked about how
shooting an AR "really makes you feel cool."

What's this pot-bellied dude
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EW1LZKJmtbw
doing at 0:50 to 0:55 and 3:10 to 3:16 if not playing Rambo?



--
- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

On 2/19/2022 4:30 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
>
> John, there is nothing wrong with looking things up on Google. But since Google has an extremely sharp political bias...

It's worse than that. Reality itself has a sharp politically bias
against the far right!

--
- Frank Krygowski

[John B.]

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 00:17:30 -0800 (PST), "russell...@yahoo.com"

To make nitroglycerine you need Nitric acid (and I believe a bit of
sulphuric) and glycerine. To convert this to dynamite you simply add
some sort of "filler" such as diatomaceous earth, which, I believe is
used in commercial dynamite.

When I was in grade school I and a Mate used to "make" nitroglycerine,
with our chemistry set, in the guy's cellar. We used to package it in
empty rifle cases and throw it down into an abandoned mine shaft...
and once in a while one you go bang.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 00:24:37 -0800 (PST), "russell...@yahoo.com"

I just looked it up (which I should have done earlier) and you are
correct any dealer in gun powder needs to have a license to do so.
https://www.mass.gov/how-to/apply-for-a-license-to-sell-black-or-smokeless-powder

--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

Yes Frank you keep making statements like that but it seems to be all
supposition.

You have never, at least I can't remember you mentioning it, actually
gone to the range with "those guys", or have you "talked with those
guys" or anything that would make anyone think that you know anything
about "those guys".

So we are left with the assumption that you, perhaps, may have driven
by a shooting range once, or maybe you saw something on Youtube.
And from that extensive experience you have formed your opinions.

In short, you are a bigot. And as you have no facts your bigotry is
based on your very vivid imagination.

bigot ~ a prejudiced person who is intolerant of any opinions
differing from his own

--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

And you know all this? How?

Are you an experienced target shooter? I am, USAF Rifle and Pistol
Teams, both Base and Major command. In later years I did considerable
Trap Shooting, and participated in many Trap Shooting computations (In
Ohio too).

You are an experienced hunter? I am, I've owned a rifle since I was 12
years old and hunted critters ranging from rabbets to Moose.

In addition I worked as a gun smith for a number of years and as a
result came in contact with a very large number of "shooters".

Now please do tell us your qualifications for your assertions about
"shooters".
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 13:22:30 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich

I really like that "like mine - he was independently wealthy"!

Yup, a bloke that lives in a cheap house, in a, as he describes it,
slum, whining about the cost of groceries.

What's the word I'm looking for? Idiotic? Yes I like that one:
"a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying
nothing."
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 13:30:43 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich

You are simply echoing what I said that, "the facts posted on

Wikipedia are generally correct but the supposition drawn from the
facts is sometimes not quite what I believe it should be"

As for looking things up, on any source, I suppose the difference is
that I do and you don't. Of if you do you quote someone who has a
reputation for false reporting, as Jeff so frequently points out.

No Tommy you simply prove Fancis Bacon correct, some 4 hundred years
ago, when he said "Fools believe only what they want to be true" or
words to the effect.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[Frank Krygowski]

I don't doubt that you've done what you say. Therefore, you should be able to answer my question!
What are the great advantages of 30 round magazines? Who needs them? Why?

(Besides people in combat or pretend combat, that is.)

The disadvantages seem obvious: abetting mass shootings. What are the real advantages?

Your answer?

- Frank Krygowski

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sat, 19 Feb 2022 15:27:35 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich

Thank you for the JAMA article titled:
"Myocarditis Cases Reported After mRNA-Based COVID-19 Vaccination in
the US From December 2020 to August 2021"
It didn't come from the "latest papers in the JAMA, but that's ok. It
also refers to myocarditis and not to myocardial infarction (heart
attack) which are very different maladies. The article is highly
speculative because its sole source is the VAERS "national passive
reporting system" and is therefore neither authoritative or reliable:
<https://vaers.hhs.gov/about.html>
"VAERS is a passive reporting system, meaning it relies on individuals
to send in reports of their experiences to CDC and FDA. VAERS is not
designed to determine if a vaccine caused a health problem..."
It would be helpful if you avoided using crowd sourced data to
substantiate your amazing claims.

Again, it is not my responsibility to search for a report upon which
you based one of your amazing claims. If you want to make a point and
back it up with a source, it's your responsibility to provide a link
to the source, not mine.

[ 20 minutes wasted ]

[John B.]

Well, I guess the most obvious answer is "because someone wants one".
Rather like the answer "why does someone want a plastic bicycle?" Or
Why does one want a bicycle at all?"

You argue that "big magazines abetting mass shootings" and yet
statistics don't seem to justify that statement.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/476409/mass-shootings-in-the-us-by-weapon-types-used/
Rifles were used in 26% of the shootings and pistols in 61%
So shouldn't you be crying about pistols.

Or FBI data which shows that in 2019 pistols were used in 62% of all
shooting homicides.
In fact the same statistics show that only 3% of shooting homicides
were carried out with rifles which might, or might not, have large
magazines.

As I said, you are becoming a Crotchety Old Man and rather then argue
facts you continue with these "delusions" - there is no other name for
them - just as Tom does.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

The Remington 870 pump shotgun ONLY allows a maximum of about 9 shells on a special model. 5 or 6 shells on most pump shotguns. Rambo would have had to spend half the movie reloading his shotgun instead of killing an endless line of people. If he was using a shotgun. And if you only have 5 or 6 shells in your pump shotgun, how are you going to kill the 7th killer breaking into your house to kill you? With an AR-15 you can get 20 or 30 round magazines. And everyone knows its far far far far far more likely that 7 people will come to kill you than it is for 21 or 31 people to come kill you.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

Tommy, did you personally know Jobst Brandt and had personal knowledge of his retirement, wealth, savings, etc.? You seem to speak about it a lot, for some reason.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

Tommy, a .22 rimfire bullet and a .223 center fire bullet have essentially the exact same diameter bullet. Little under 1/4 inch diameter.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

Frank did say "abetting mass shootings".
This from Wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_shootings_in_the_United_States
"Gun Violence Archive, frequently cited by the press, defines a mass shooting as firearm violence resulting in at least four people being shot at roughly the same time and location, excluding the perpetrator. Using this definition, there have been 2,128 mass shootings since 2013, roughly one per day."
"The United States has had more mass shootings than any other country."
"Several types of guns have been used in mass shootings in the United States. A 2014 study conducted by Dr. James Fox of 142 shootings found that 88 (62%) were committed with handguns of all types; 68 (48%) with semi-automatic handguns, 20 (14%) with revolvers, 35 (25%) with semi-automatic rifles, and 19 (13%) with shotguns. The study was conducted using the Mother Jones database of mass shootings from 1982 to 2018. High capacity magazines were used in approximately half of mass shootings. Semi-automatic rifles have been used in six of the ten deadliest mass shooting events."

Key points in the above quotes are (1) "High capacity magazines were used in approximately half of mass shootings." AND (2) "Semi-automatic rifles have been used in six of the ten DEADLIEST mass shooting events."

The best (worst) mass shooting in the USA was the Las Vegas concert hotel killing in 2017. 60 dead.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Las_Vegas_shooting
"Twenty-four firearms, a large quantity of ammunition, and numerous high-capacity magazines capable of holding up to 100 rounds apiece were found in the suite.[142][143] Fourteen of the firearms were .223-caliber AR-15-type semi-automatic rifles..........The others were eight .308-caliber AR-10-type rifles.............Paddock was found to have fired a total of 1,058 rounds from fifteen of the firearms: 1,049 from twelve AR-15-style rifles, eight from two AR-10-style rifles, and the round used to kill himself from the Smith & Wesson revolver."

Slightly humorous he used the revolver to kill himself.

[AMuzi]

Oh, full auto. I thought we were discussing AR-15.

Full auto rifles are vanishingly rare*. Not all ranges even
allow them. They're a distinct outlier. I have never fired
one but even non-firearms owners can't shut up about the
experience. (a photographer/cyclist I know was enthralled
and overwhelmed when the range officer at a nearby military
base offered her a session with an M4)

Out of roughly 12 million Ohioans, there are about 18,000
full auto (the bulk of which are owned by collectors).
http://metrocosm.com/map-of-federally-regulated-weapons/
(click your state on the interactive map)

p.s. The entire country has under a half million NFA full
auto rifles/pistols altogether:
https://www.nfatca.org/pubs/MG_Count_FOIA_2016.pdf

*And licensed are virtually unknown in crime. Even illegal
full auto rifles are extremely rare in crimes.

[Tom Kunich]

Frank, I'm truly sorry that you cannot face reality. I'm sorry that your opinion about guns was discussed by the founders of this country and your position was laughed off of the board. And the Supreme Court has been forced to review this several times and your position was found to have no merit whatsoever. The world is the way it is and you not only have not the least power to change it but you probably can't even influence your own wife.

[AMuzi]

Well, yes.
But as I noted to a woman looking for advice on a home
defense weapon, the sound of cycling a pump action riot gun
will clear a room. So there's that.

[Tom Kunich]

Jeff, you don't know a thing and yet you continue your idiotic attack. Do you even know what "passive reporting" means? The reporting form could be submitted by individuals but would promptly be thrown out since they couldn't possibly know the extremely technical terms for the many possible illnesses that could be responsible tor myocarditis or be responsible for the deaths of the children MOSTLY of military age that had the vaccines forced upon them by your mentally ill Democrats.

This means that the VAERS forms must be properly filled out by doctors or possibly by heart specialist nurses. It takes a lot of time that they don't have an so MOST of the cases go unreported. They were getting $50,000 per reported case of covid-19 and it was well worth their while to say that PCR tests showed positive for covid-19 despite the fact that it did no such thing.

But they are NOT doing this for myocarditis in young people.

So these cases are extremely under-reported. What's more, the statistics appear to include the entire vaccinated population when people over the age of 40 RARELY if ever get myocarditis. This means that the Israeli report of chances of myocarditis in the age group that is subject to it is far greater than the 133 times normal stated in the rather poorly done paper.

Your sickness is plainly getting the better of you and you will soon be leaving us for greener pastures in your hope but plainly it will be much warmer climes.