Best kickstand for a touring bicycle?

[Bruce W.1]

What is the best kickstand for a touring bicycle?

On a recent tour my ESGE/Pletscher kickstand broke. One leg just
snapped off. Guess the aluminum was too soft. That and its mount was
forever loosening. I'm sure it's a good kickstand for most bikes but
apparently it can't handle a 100-pound fully-loaded touring bike.

I'd like to try a Japanese-style kickstand. You know the kind that
attaches to both of the rear wheel mounts and loops behind the rear tire
when in the "up" position, but I can't find one. Does anyone know a
dealer in the USA where these are sold?

Or does anyone have any other recommendations?

Thanks for your help.

[Ted Bennett]

"Bruce W.1" <so...@noDirectEmail.com> wrote:

My first recommendation is to forego the stand. Leaning the bike
against a wall, pole, tree etc. is more reliable. Simply laying the
bike down on the ground harms nothing and is even more reliable.

But if you really want a stand, get a Greenfield.

--
Ted Bennett

[landotter]

http://tinyurl.com/2mpwna

If you can fit such a stand--it's your best bet, as you're better off
not leaning the bike with a load on it. There are a couple variations
on this if you search Amazon.

[Rootworker]

these look like they might work:

http://www.bikemannetwork.com/biking/p/KI5000

Joe
http://www.rootwerx.com

[DougC]

Bruce W.1 wrote:
> ....

> I'd like to try a Japanese-style kickstand. You know the kind that
> attaches to both of the rear wheel mounts and loops behind the rear tire
> when in the "up" position, but I can't find one. Does anyone know a
> dealer in the USA where these are sold?

> ......

These are not "Japanese" strictly speaking, because some of the Pashley
bikes come with them.

I have seen -some- website that offered Euro city bikes to US customers,
the kickstands were available separately but the page said they'd only
fit the intended bikes (which were all single-speed or geared hubs, not
derailleurs).
~

[damyth]

The best kickstands come from Hebie (model 605 or 690). Unfortunately
these are no longer available in the US because the importer/
manufacturer no longer finds that it makes business sense to pay for
exorbitant liability insurance premiums to justify the low volumes
that they might sell in the US.

At least that was the line I was given.

http://www.hebie.de/html/en/detail_staender.php?id=0605_NL_E1
http://www.hebie.de/pdf/info_stands_04.pdf

[Bruce W.1]

landotter wrote:
> http://tinyurl.com/2mpwna
>
> If you can fit such a stand--it's your best bet, as you're better off
> not leaning the bike with a load on it. There are a couple variations
> on this if you search Amazon.
>

==========================================================

That might work. The design is similar to the Pletscher kickstand but I
hope the alloy is stronger. Can you compare it to the ESGE/Pletscher
kickstand?

[landotter]

I have only used a Swedish variation of that model, not that exact
brand. Seemed to be very tough. You can get an even tougher model in
steel if you are really paranoid.

[R Brickston]

On Sat, 16 Jun 2007 10:54:28 -0700, landotter <land...@gmail.com>
wrote:

My personal take is that if the bike does go over off a stand, there
is a bigger chance of things breaking. I like the lean on something
method. ymmv, of course.

[landotter]

On Jun 16, 5:22 pm, R Brickston <rb20170REMOVE.yahoo.com@> wrote:
> On Sat, 16 Jun 2007 10:54:28 -0700, landotter <landot...@gmail.com>

The chances that a bike on a center stand will fall is pretty small
compared to a bike leaned up against something. I've had a couple
bikes with them. You might as well suggest I lean my motorcycle
against a tree in lieu of using its stand as well. ;-)

[datakoll]

ugh! zeee bike stand she eeesss noah good furah two ring: nada. u
veeeel bee ah soreee!
hoe hoe evair!
zeee moe tore cycle grave yard! Wallah! in zeee smell disss place ment
cata gorreeee say 2 liter?
uha may find zeee u shaped stand recoverablee? no ?
moehnt aluminum plate on zeee cycle, moehnt salvaged 90cc stand on
zeee plate: plate matchaze bolt holes no problema! eg 454ci-360cc
subaruh
then lean zeee suckeair against a tree. no?
zee problem is zat she pivot and fall. you see this no? ugh
zeee motor cycle she no pivot she fall straight ovair on zeee hot tar.
hehehehe.maybe break the crazy assholes leg, no?
zeee mount spot she maybe aft of zeee normal position, no?
ah no u gotta ur own rig but to stablies uneedah fork lock, no?
recentleee, my pipe she ah pivot straight into glass door during
squall! $20" foot! sacre blue!
where u leave? mojave?

[DougC]

landotter wrote:
>
> http://tinyurl.com/2mpwna
>
> If you can fit such a stand--it's your best bet, as you're better off
> not leaning the bike with a load on it. There are a couple variations
> on this if you search Amazon.
>

The problem these dual-kickstands would seem to have though is that a
great load on them will spread the legs, as there's nothing keeping them
together at the bottom.
~

[jo...@phred.org]

In article <Eesdi.61$DS6...@newsfe02.lga>, dci...@norcom2000.com
says...

At least for bicycles, I would consider that a theoretical problem. It
hasn't happened with the twin-leg ESGE stand on our full-loaded touring
tandem.

The legs are reasonably stout, the joint is much larger than the legs,
and the angle between them isn't so great that they have a very strong
spreading force.

--
jo...@phred.org is Joshua Putnam
<http://www.phred.org/~josh/>
Updated Bicycle Touring Books List:
<http://www.phred.org/~josh/bike/tourbooks.html>

[datakoll]

with tandem experience, would a chainstay wide plus U flip down stand
elevating the rear wheel off the ground as possibly found on a low
displacement motorcycle give better stability than the ESGE?

[biketo...@gmail.com]

Velo Orange has a nice Porteur Double Kickstand
http://store.velo-orange.com/index.php/porteur-double-kickstand.html
and more information on the Pletscher Double Kickstand
http://www.biketourings.com/3/post/2013/07/pletscher-two-leg-kickstand-for-bike-touring-and-commuting.html

[T0m $herman]

On 9/2/2013 2:04 PM, biketo...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Monday, June 18, 2007 5:18:54 PM UTC-5, datakoll wrote:
>> with tandem experience, would a chainstay wide plus U flip down stand
>> elevating the rear wheel off the ground as possibly found on a low
>> displacement motorcycle give better stability than the ESGE?

In case gene is still wondering more than 6 years after posting, yes.
And with a proper pivot point it is quite easy to lift 300+ pounds of
motorcycle (and acceptable effort to lift 600+ pounds), so even a heavy
bicycle with touring load would require minimal effort to get up on the
stand.

However, unlike a motorcycle, it would not be advisable to sit on the
bike while up on the stand.

--
T0m $herm@n

[datakoll]

your choice


https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&site=imghp&tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1152&bih=587&q=stone+wall&oq=stone+wall&gs_l=img.12..0l10.2932.6597.0.9780.10.9.0.1.1.0.216.1266.1j7j1.9.0....0...1ac.1.26.img..1.9.1143.jdqETCzTT90

[datakoll]

On Monday, September 2, 2013 4:04:36 PM UTC-4, datakoll wrote:
> your choice
>
>
>
>
>
> https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&site=imghp&tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1152&bih=587&q=stone+wall&oq=stone+wall&gs_l=img.12..0l10.2932.6597.0.9780.10.9.0.1.1.0.216.1266.1j7j1.9.0....0...1ac.1.26.img..1.9.1143.jdqETCzTT90

/T\

Too heavy

Long time passing.

A dry straight grained 3 quarter red oak board appeared.
Two tripod leg truncated legs were cut.

Waiting for a poss ball joint swivel connector’s appearance, the two were tentatively attached to the top of my Raleigh’s 1958 plywood, rack yawl seen hereabouts, behind the seat post

good search now in GooImages.

Those legs trail backward down passed the rear axle when ‘knot in use.’
Not cut but mocked up…2 horizontal brace legs either side running from axle to bottom top forward legs.

The rig needs a fork lock.

So done, the parked Raleigh with load fron and rear stays put.

Leaving problem of people tripping over the truncated top legs n suing.
Figured a foldout with legs dayglo nylon would do it as ‘wet floor’ for slip n falls at WalMart.

There are plans for riding parts of the CDT’s lower third. Maybe one leg and a steering lock.

Anyone with ideas for cobbling a steering lock ?

There’s a nice lock on the market, I frogot on what frame, something just below Waterford maybe aha! Its White !

[John B.]

I've used a Pletscher two leg kick stand and it works very well.
However... it mounts to the chain stays just behind the bottom bracket
and with the common thin steel tubes usually used as chain stays it is
possible to tighten the mounting bolt tight enough to crush the chain
stays.

It appears to me that even if tightened carefully the chain stays
gradually get compressed, the mounting bolt tightened, the chain stay
compress even more......

If the frame was made with a kick stand plate then of course the
Pletscher works wonderfully well.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[T0m $herman]

On 9/2/2013 5:47 PM, datakoll wrote:
> On Monday, September 2, 2013 4:04:36 PM UTC-4, datakoll wrote:
>> >your choice
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&site=imghp&tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1152&bih=587&q=stone+wall&oq=stone+wall&gs_l=img.12..0l10.2932.6597.0.9780.10.9.0.1.1.0.216.1266.1j7j1.9.0....0...1ac.1.26.img..1.9.1143.jdqETCzTT90
> /T\
>
> Too heavy

Yeah, I have not taken them off and weighed them, but I think some of my
moto center-stands are heavier than a complete straight-gauge 4130
Cro-moly frame and fork.

--
T0m $herm@n

[datakoll]

.....


you collect stands ?

[T0m $herman]

Right now I have Honda Elite 110 and NT700V, Kawasaki Ninja 250R
(pre-gen) and Modern Classic™ Triumph Bonneville center-stands - only
one I paid extra for is on the Bonnie.

--
T0m $herm@n

[Sir Ridesalot]

It will void a Surly warranty too. At least that's what I read on their site when I was considering the LHT.

Cheers

[John B.]

I knew that Surly forbid kick stands but I thought it was the ones
that attach to a chain stay with a brace up to one seat stay.

Nope, I just went and read their site and their "warning" is fairly
ambiguous. They warn about the danger of crushing the chain stays
behind the bottom bracket and then mention the type that clamps to the
seat and chain stays. Then they tell you that won't work either :-(

Then they say that "We recommend the use of two leg kickstands such as
the Pletscher", which, of course, attaches to the chain stays at the
bottom bracket that they have just warned you not to use.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[sms]

Used to be that kickstands were no problem, but with changes in frame
tubing, you need to be extremely careful about kickstands, which
typically clamp down on the tubing pretty hard.

I like the Flickstand, which at least keeps the front wheel from turning
when a loaded touring bike is leaned against something. Of course you
can't get them anymore since the company that made them is out of
business. But I did see one on eBay for $58.99.

[Sir Ridesalot]

A toe strap or velcro strap wrapped around the front brake lever does the same thing and can be used as pant leg holder too.

Cheers

[Frank Krygowski]

On Tuesday, September 3, 2013 11:04:40 AM UTC-4, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
>
> A toe strap or velcro strap wrapped around the front brake lever does the same thing and can be used as pant leg holder too.

I've used a sort of wedge in my front brake lever for that purpose. The wedge is plastic, and sort of stepped. It's attached by a thin string when stowed away.

Blackburn used to sell a version, but it existed long before then. I learned the trick at a League national rally in 1978.

You can buy a Blackburn version on Ebay
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Blackburn-SB-1-Stop-Block-Brake-Lever-Parking-Brake-fits-Dia-Compe-others-NIP-/180976467111

or you can take a piece of plastic scrap (I use 1/4" plexiglass) and saw out your own. (But STI calls for a different design.)

- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

On Tuesday, September 3, 2013 1:47:55 PM UTC-4, Phil W Lee wrote:
>
>
> I also have a stand adapter plate, supplied by the bike manufacturer,
> which attaches to the left rear drop-out. Once fitted, any single
> kickstand of the correct length can be installed.
>
> The only difficulty is deploying the stand from the seat - the whole
> point is that I need to keep my weight on the seat until I can
> retrieve my crutches from behind it.
> I'm still trying to figure out a way of operating the stand remotely,
> and I'm open to suggestions.

Hmm. Do you need the stand to go both directions (up and down) remotely? If it's only one way (say, down) I can imagine arranging a spring to extend it, with a pretty simple cable operated latch to keep it up.

- Frank Krygowski

[Sir Ridesalot]

On Tuesday, September 3, 2013 1:47:55 PM UTC-4, Phil W Lee wrote:

> Frank Krygowski <frkr...@gmail.com> considered Tue, 3 Sep 2013

> I have a sprung push-button on my front brake lever, which can be
>
> depressed when the brake is on, and which then holds the brake in
>
> engagement until it is squeezed harder, when the button pops out
>
> again.
>
> Fairly common on trikes, I believe.

>
>
>
> I also have a stand adapter plate, supplied by the bike manufacturer,
>
> which attaches to the left rear drop-out. Once fitted, any single
>
> kickstand of the correct length can be installed.
>
>
>
> The only difficulty is deploying the stand from the seat - the whole
>
> point is that I need to keep my weight on the seat until I can
>
> retrieve my crutches from behind it.
>
> I'm still trying to figure out a way of operating the stand remotely,
>
> and I'm open to suggestions.

A cable fastened to the leg, run trough some clamp guides on the bicycle and then ending in a loop handle? Pull the cable to lower the kickstand.

Cheers

[David Scheidt]

John B. <sloc...@gmail.com> wrote:
:On Mon, 2 Sep 2013 22:56:46 -0700 (PDT), Sir Ridesalot

Well, sure. They're too cool for kickstands, and adding the proper
plate would cost them money, so it's better for them to spread
kickstands suck propoganda.

--
sig 32

[John B.]

Well, a penny saved is a penny saved :-)
--
Cheers,

John B.

[Frank Krygowski]

On Wednesday, September 4, 2013 4:58:46 PM UTC-4, Phil W Lee wrote:
>
> I'll have to take some photographs to illustrate the layout and stick
> them online so that I can link to them.

That would help. I'm having a hard time visualizing your situation.

But is there a chance a front wheel kickstand would help? Here's one designed to attach to low rider racks:
http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/reviews/board/message/?thread_id=233326&page=1&nested=0

This is supposed to be super-stable, but no telling if we could rig a way to operate it remotely:
http://www.albabici.com/ursus/kickstands/ursus-kickstand-80.htm

There's this very different alternative:
http://www.click-stand.com/

And there are (or have been) various kickstands in the form of rectangular U-shapes, that swing down, like the Dutch one shown at top right at
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kickstand (until it gets Wiki-edited away, I suppose).

ISTR seeing photos of an old porteur bike with a huge front rack or basket, and a swing-down kickstand attached at the front. I wonder if that's the way for you to go? If the kickstand supported the front wheel instead of the rear, it could be much easier to reach and operate, perhaps with a built-in extension rod of some sort.

I'll be watching for links to photos.

- Frank Krygowski

[Sir Ridesalot]

On Wednesday, September 4, 2013 5:03:30 PM UTC-4, Phil W Lee wrote:
> Sir Ridesalot <i_am_cycle...@yahoo.ca> considered Tue, 3 Sep 2013

> That's kind of what I had in mind, but there is nowhere below and in
>
> front of the stand pivot to fit the cable guide to.
>
> See my reply to Frank.
>
>
>
> Phil

Can you rig tubes to the front of the bike to hold your crutches? That make getting at them a lot easier.

Cheers

[Joe Riel]

Sir Ridesalot <i_am_cyc...@yahoo.ca> writes:

> Can you rig tubes to the front of the bike to hold your crutches? That make getting at them a lot easier.

I used to lash a hockey stick length-wise to the frame of my Moulton
when riding to practice. The handle would jut out well past the
head tube, the blade was below the rack. The small wheels made
this convenient, it didn't interfere with operation of the bike,
though required dismounting to untie. How 'bout folding crutches?
Or do they already fold?

--
Joe Riel

[John B.]

A crutch holster. see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:1942_Indian_Scout_500cc_v_twin_2.jpg

(O.K., it isn't a bicycle but the idea is the same.. also note the
front and rear panniers :-)
--
Cheers,

John B.

[T0m $herman]

On 9/5/2013 3:38 PM, Phil W Lee wrote:
> [...]
> But I can't start or stop on that anymore, never mind mount and
> dismount, so I'm hoping to get some strength back in my legs by riding
> a recumbent. This has the advantage of being able to prop up the bike
> at stops with one leg, while most of my weight is still on the seat.
> My knees are too bad to consider dropping the saddle on an upright to
> the point where I could do that.
>
I can put a foot down while seated on my CF (crank-forward) RANS Mini,
and still have proper extension while pedaling seated.

<http://rans.com/bicycles/mini.html>

--
T0m $herm@n