Winner-Pro Freewheel advice
fra...@cruzio.com
Hi.
I have a SunTour (tm) Winner-Pro freewheel mounted on my Phil Wood
48 spoke rear wheel (the only wheel thus far which I have been un-
able to break).
Of course, the threads were lightly greased before installing the
freewheel. A spoke guard was installed beforehand as well.
I have been informed that to properly lube a Winner-Pro freewheel
that it should be removed and lubricant introduced to the small hole
which can be seen in about the midpoint of the threads. Herein lie
my problems.
Problem 1) Applying my removal tool, Phil Wood other-side-dohickey-to-
prevent-bearing-egress and placing in my vise, I *cannot*
muscle the little beauty off. I am your normal "250 pound
weakling" and attempted about 85% of my maximum possible
turning force.
It seems to me that some way to transmit a vibration to the assembly
whilst I'm applying torque (I *am* going the correct direction, BTW.)
such as an orbital sander or some such. Any ideas on this?
Problem 2) Recommended lubricants once I *do* succeed in removing
the freewheel have included the following, going from
lighter to heavier:
transmission fluid, 3-in-1 oil, 30wt motor oil, 90 wt
gear oil and grease.
Does anyone have a *definitive* answer to this? I have no faith
in the local bike shops since they were the ones to supply this
collection of answers!
Thanks for any advice.
--
Frank & Rosy Shields
pH & Beck
Fra...@cruzio.com
Rollrbladz
I like quiet freewheels so I use plenty of 90wt oil to lube mine. Any
excess will just slowly leak out (watch out if you store your tandem over
your car!)
Because of the difficulty removing freewheels (especially on tandems!), I
use anti-sieze compound or a think grease fortified with Molydenum
Dilsulphide (sp) to lube the threads.
Good Luck on that freewheel!
Ming
Jobst Brandt
> I have been informed that to properly lube a Winner-Pro freewheel
> that it should be removed and lubricant introduced to the small hole
> which can be seen in about the midpoint of the threads. Herein lie
> my problems.
Only the New winner pro FW has a labyrinth seal that prevents oiling
from the outside. This is apparent by the thin brass line that can be
seen between the outer cone and the rotating body. If you don't have
one of these, you can oil it from the outside by cleaning away all
dirt by careful wiping.
> Problem 1) Applying my removal tool, Phil Wood other-side-dohickey-to-
> prevent-bearing-egress and placing in my vise, I *cannot*
> muscle the little beauty off. I am your normal "250 pound
> weakling" and attempted about 85% of my maximum possible
> turning force.
That is the correct way but if you alternately apply the torque by
pushing with the right side of the wheel only and then pulling on the
left side you can creep up on the thread friction. It takes much force.
Another reason why cassette hubs are taking over.
> It seems to me that some way to transmit a vibration to the assembly
> whilst I'm applying torque (I *am* going the correct direction, BTW.)
> such as an orbital sander or some such. Any ideas on this?
This has never worked for me and I don't believe it will.
> Problem 2) Recommended lubricants once I *do* succeed in removing
> the freewheel have included the following, going from
> lighter to heavier:
> transmission fluid, 3-in-1 oil, 30wt motor oil, 90 wt
> gear oil and grease.
Freewheels don't need a lot of lubrication because they do their main
work locked up so to speak. In rotation they carry hardly any load
and have no need for exotic lubrication. Use 30W motor oil or
equivalent. Heavier oil only gets hard in winter. The oil hole is
small and is located on a New Winner Pro is inside the main thread
that fits on the hub.
Jobst Brandt <jbr...@hplabs.hp.com>
Mark Irving
> I have a SunTour (tm) Winner-Pro freewheel mounted on my Phil Wood
> 48 spoke rear wheel (the only wheel thus far which I have been un-
> able to break).
> Of course, the threads were lightly greased before installing the
> freewheel. A spoke guard was installed beforehand as well.
and wants to remove this.
I've removed freewheels that others couldn't shift, thus. Leave the
tyre on the wheel. Don't use a vice to hold the removal tool -
instead, use a properly-fitting ring spanner [box wrench in USA
English? I'm not sure]. Mine is 15/16" one end, 1" the other, and
is about 14" long. Hold the wheel against the ground with both
hands and one foot, with the spanner roughly horizontal, and use
your free foot to stamp down on the end of the spanner, hard.
Keep stamping. Now and again the wheel will twist out of your
grip. Pick it up and keep stamping. After only one to five
minutes' work, the freewheel will start to turn!
I'm 5'5" and weigh under 10 stone [140 pounds]: I think this
technique would work for somewhat smaller people than me. If
you're bigger it should definitely work. Don't do it without
shoes on!
I grease freewheel fixing threads. Heavy oil or grease is the
most likely lubricant to be still there when you come to remove
the freewheel in a few months or years time.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Mark Irving Mark Irving<Ma...@arc.ug.eds.com>
Cambridge, England Don't force it! Use a bigger hammer.
Dave Hayes
wrote:
> I've removed freewheels that others couldn't shift, thus. Leave the
> tyre on the wheel. Don't use a vice to hold the removal tool -
> instead, use a properly-fitting ring spanner [box wrench in USA
> English? I'm not sure]. Mine is 15/16" one end, 1" the other, and
> is about 14" long. Hold the wheel against the ground with both
> hands and one foot, with the spanner roughly horizontal, and use
> your free foot to stamp down on the end of the spanner, hard.
>
> Keep stamping. Now and again the wheel will twist out of your
> grip. Pick it up and keep stamping. After only one to five
> minutes' work, the freewheel will start to turn!
>
> ...
>
>-----------------------------------------------------------------
> Mark Irving Mark Irving<Ma...@arc.ug.eds.com>
> Cambridge, England Don't force it! Use a bigger hammer.
A bigger hammer indeed!
Mark's method apparently mimics the action of an impact wrench, and may
work well for internally splined FW bodies. But watch out if you're dealing
with a 2- or 4- pronged remover: the remover must be held securely by the
QR skewer, or you risk damaging the remover, the FW, and the Skewer.
I prefer a LARGE vise attached to a substantial bench.
Dave Hayes
Disclaimer:
"Actual mileage may vary. Quantities limited. Subject to prior sale. Price
does not include tax, title, license, or transportation. Some assembly
required. Each item sold separately. Batteries not included. Objects in
mirror are closer than they appear. If conditions persist, consult a
physician. Keep out of reach of children. Avoid prolonged exposure to
direct sunlight. For off-road use only. Keep in a cool dark place. Do not
try this at home. Void where prohibited. Some restrictions apply."
Eric House
> I have a SunTour (tm) Winner-Pro freewheel mounted on my Phil Wood
> 48 spoke rear wheel (the only wheel thus far which I have been un-
> able to break).
> Of course, the threads were lightly greased before installing the
> freewheel. A spoke guard was installed beforehand as well.
and wants to remove it for oiling.
After several years of struggling to remove my Winner Pro freewheels
for oiling and gear changes I've decided to take a different approach.
I'm just going to leave a body on the hub for as long as it lasts.
For gear changes I swap cogs rather than freewheels, much the way
one does with cassettes.
When it's time to oil, I loosen the gold-colored (black on Winner
models) adjustable race until there's a 1/4" gap, then pour oil in
and rotate the body until clean oil comes out the back, then leave
the wheel standing over newspaper for at least 24 hours. (Be sure
to angle the wheel so that the oil doesn't wind up all over your rim.)
The first time you loosen the race can be a challenge, as the Park
pin tool made for this purpose can be too flimsy. I've had to use
a punch and hammer on at least one stubborn race. Just be sure to
hit at both holes, and to turn it in the right direction (which I
can't remember, but it's clear from the threads onto which it screws.)
Eventually I'll probably have to remove the body, either to a) replace
a drive side spoke; or b) replace the drive-side cartridge bearing; or
c) replace the body itself. In your case, I'd expect that 48-hole
flanges are large enough that just removing the cogs is enough. If
the hub is pre-FSA you're going to have to have someone else replace
the bearings anyway; if it's FSA, you'll probably find that the drive-
side bearing lasts longer because it's shielded by the freewheel.
And when the body goes bad you can always remove the rotating part and
put the screwed-on core directly in a vice since you no longer care
about wrecking it.
Since experience says I can get at least 20,000 miles on a wheel without
any of these happening leaving the body on seems like the easiest thing
to do. I'd suggest you leave it on for oiling, and not remove it until
you really need to.
--
**************************************************************************
Eric House "My employer doesn't share its opinions with
Life after BMB? me, so I can share only mine with you"