The stupidity of Mike's Bikes

[Tom Kunich]

Although this is a chain, it seems like every one of them I go into there is some moronic child running the place.

This was so bad in the bay area where they were handling Trek that Trek opened factory stores where they had proper mechanics.

Yesterday I was in Pleasanton on a 40 mile ride and the rubber rubbed off of my sidewall from the flat the other day began bothering me so I went off to Mikes Bikes to buy some tires.

Alameda County Supervisors, those people with the superior medical knowledge have decided that you have to wear masks everywhere again. Why? Who the hell knows. (https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/5/19-0994_article) The Delta Variant has NO measurable effect and that comes directly from the CDC statistics if you know how to seek them out and read them. Anyone with half a brain should know that wearing a mask into a restaurant and then sitting down and removing it confers NO magic protection from the mask since covid-19 is an aerosol and is spread simply by breathing and the particulate size is 200 times smaller than that of the breathing pores of even an N95 mask.

In any case I went into Mike's Bikes not wearing a mask and they almost jumped out of their pants with fear. Get this - four people who have all been vaccinated are afraid of someone not wearing a mask. Exactly how would you suppose that would work?

Well, the 20 year old or younger manager told me if I wouldn't wear a mask they wouldn't sell me anything. So I came home and ordered the tires and tubes on-line for a fraction of what it would have cost me in their store and paid $140 or so.

Now this is more than they are making on the sorts of bikes that they can actually stock these days. So these morons were so stupid they were more than willing to turn down a large sale for exactly what reason? Because I wasn't willing to conform. And no other reason. This doesn't bode well for Mike's Bikes if they continue to hire people that no doubt have a college education that they have to pay off.

[Lou Holtman]

Had a haircut this morning. At the door I asked 'what is the deal currently?'. The barber (old high school friend) said 'I cut your hair and you pay after that'. End of discussion. If he had said 'you have to wear a mask' I would have said 'OK' also end of discussion.

Lou

[Tom Kunich]

How do you have the hair on your nose or a mustache trimmed if you're wearing a mask? Or are you still too young to be having hair growing every place but on top of your head?

[Tom Kunich]

On Friday, September 3, 2021 at 10:56:47 AM UTC-7, lou.h...@gmail.com wrote:

I should add that here in California San Francisco Bay area, there is absolutely NO NEED for masks, totally aside from CDC papers (abstract - “evidence from 14 randomized controlled trials of these measures (masks, social distancing and frequent hand washing) did not support a substantial effect on transmission of laboratory -confirmed influenza.”

Page three: “our systematic review found no significant effect of face masks on transmission of laboratory – confirmed influenza”

Page four: “face masks have not demonstrated protection against laboratory-confirmed influenza”

Also a paper by Dr. Jim Meehan MD”

Covid 19 is about viral transmission. Surgical and cloth masks do nothing to prevent viral transmission”) but we have a younger generation that absolutely loves the idea of being enslaved.

There is a simple cure for this: reinstitute the draft so that these same children will have their own lives on the line as the Democrats start war after war after war. When it is their own butts on the line perhaps civil rights will be more important.

[jbeattie]

If the sign says "no shoes, no shirt, no service" do you march in shirtless and demand service? It's a f****** private business. It can make you take off your shoes, like my local Japanese restaurant. If you don't want to wear a mask, go elsewhere -- like the Alt-Right Lunatic Bike Shop that has bikes with My Pillow saddles. BTW, the medical community disagrees with you. https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2776536

-- Jay Beattie.

[Tom Kunich]

Civil Rights act of 1964. You MAY NOT discriminate against anyone for reasons of race, sex, age or medical conditions. This offered these shop people no personal danger since they were vaccinated so this was nothing more than illegal discrimination.

What does this have to do with wearing a shirt or not?

[AMuzi]

On 9/3/2021 2:40 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
> On Friday, September 3, 2021 at 12:02:53 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
>> On Friday, September 3, 2021 at 11:32:55 AM UTC-7, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> On Friday, September 3, 2021 at 10:56:47 AM UTC-7, lou.h...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>> On Friday, September 3, 2021 at 7:27:37 PM UTC+2, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>> Although this is a chain, it seems like every one of them I go into there is some moronic child running the place.
>>>>>
>>>>> This was so bad in the bay area where they were handling Trek that Trek opened factory stores where they had proper mechanics.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yesterday I was in Pleasanton on a 40 mile ride and the rubber rubbed off of my sidewall from the flat the other day began bothering me so I went off to Mikes Bikes to buy some tires.
>>>>>
>>>>> Alameda County Supervisors, those people with the superior medical knowledge have decided that you have to wear masks everywhere again. Why? Who the hell knows. (https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/5/19-0994_article) The Delta Variant has NO measurable effect and that comes directly from the CDC statistics if you know how to seek them out and read them. Anyone with half a brain should know that wearing a mask into a restaurant and then sitting down and removing it confers NO magic protection from the mask since covid-19 is an aerosol and is spread simply by breathing and the particulate size is 200 times smaller than that of the breathing pores of even an N95 mask.
>>>>>
>>>>> In any case I went into Mike's Bikes not wearing a mask and they almost jumped out of their pants with fear. Get this - four people who have all been vaccinated are afraid of someone not wearing a mask. Exactly how would you suppose that would work?
>>>>>
>>>>> Well, the 20 year old or younger manager told me if I wouldn't wear a mask they wouldn't sell me anything. So I came home and ordered the tires and tubes on-line for a fraction of what it would have cost me in their store and paid $140 or so.
>>>>>
>>>>> Now this is more than they are making on the sorts of bikes that they can actually stock these days. So these morons were so stupid they were more than willing to turn down a large sale for exactly what reason? Because I wasn't willing to conform. And no other reason. This doesn't bode well for Mike's Bikes if they continue to hire people that no doubt have a college education that they have to pay off.
>>>> Had a haircut this morning. At the door I asked 'what is the deal currently?'. The barber (old high school friend) said 'I cut your hair and you pay after that'. End of discussion. If he had said 'you have to wear a mask' I would have said 'OK' also end of discussion.

>>> I should add that here in California San Francisco Bay area, there is absolutely NO NEED for masks, totally aside from CDC papers (abstract - “evidence from 14 randomized controlled trials of these measures (masks, social distancing and frequent hand washing) did not support a substantial effect on transmission of laboratory -confirmed influenza.â€
>>>
>>> Page three: “our systematic review found no significant effect of face masks on transmission of laboratory – confirmed influenzaâ€
>>>
>>> Page four: “face masks have not demonstrated protection against laboratory-confirmed influenzaâ€
>>>
>>> Also a paper by Dr. Jim Meehan MDâ€
>>>
>>> Covid 19 is about viral transmission. Surgical and cloth masks do nothing to prevent viral transmission†) but we have a younger generation that absolutely loves the idea of being enslaved.

>>>
>>> There is a simple cure for this: reinstitute the draft so that these same children will have their own lives on the line as the Democrats start war after war after war. When it is their own butts on the line perhaps civil rights will be more important.
>> If the sign says "no shoes, no shirt, no service" do you march in shirtless and demand service? It's a f****** private business. It can make you take off your shoes, like my local Japanese restaurant. If you don't want to wear a mask, go elsewhere -- like the Alt-Right Lunatic Bike Shop that has bikes with My Pillow saddles. BTW, the medical community disagrees with you. https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2776536
>
> Civil Rights act of 1964. You MAY NOT discriminate against anyone for reasons of race, sex, age or medical conditions. This offered these shop people no personal danger since they were vaccinated so this was nothing more than illegal discrimination.
>
> What does this have to do with wearing a shirt or not?
>

1964 Civil Rights Act?
You missed an opportunity to self-identify as Rachel Dolezal
and sue them for racial discrimination. Million dollar lawsuit!

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

[Frank Krygowski]

We've had the "pleasure" of being in four different medical facilities
in the past two weeks. (Fortunately, nothing was serious - so far.)
Every one of them demanded masks, even for people sitting in waiting
rooms. It was beyond "No shirt, no shoes, no service." It was "No mask,
no entry," sometimes with a security guard to enforce it.

The only objection was from a young punk at the ER, apparently on some
"work release" program. His guard had to tell him to pull his mask back up.

Those in charge of these facilities seem unaware of Tom's wisdom.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Tom Kunich]

So, it is your opinion that some "medical community" (which is a complete bullshit term) disagrees with the CDC (and not me as you intended to use as some sort of sword) I gave you the citations and I will also tell you that a corona virus is 200 times smaller than the breathing pores in an N95 mask with is the best. What's more, corona virus illnesses are spread via AEROSOLS - these are essentially the single virus particles that float in the air like a cloud. Anyone and everyone that walks through that cloud is exposed. The major cause of spread is NOT coughing up flehm or sneezing snot into the air which falls immediately to the floor in any case. If you can breath through a mask, you could spread the illness IF you have an active case.

Stop your bullshitting about things that you know not one fucking thing about. I worked in this stuff and you didn't. You don't have to believe me one bit but you HAVE to believe the CDC because they and not some medical group that theorizes. The CDC has actual long term studies to back up their statements.

[Tom Kunich]

Maybe you don't recall Lord Fauci saying that masks might make you feel protected but didn't do anything. That was before he changed his mind after investing in the Chinese company that supplies most of the masks in the world.

[Tom Kunich]

The Civil Rights people no longer believe in civil rights. Remember BLM and CRT? Where did the rights go of the citizens of this country?

[jbeattie]

Quit whining and move to Florida. https://www.tampabay.com/news/health/2021/09/02/twelve-hours-in-a-florida-covid-19-icu/

-- Jay Beattie.

[Tom Kunich]

On Friday, September 3, 2021 at 1:09:50 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:

Here is the actual testing that you could have found found yourself, but you much prefer your false beliefs: https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-1342?fbclid=IwAR1arBfDNIfUrfr1rn4C44Nuekv0b8LbtC94JbCP5on-TuRlHCm532xwSzU&

[Tom Kunich]

I will ask you again Jay, WHAT in the hell do you know about medicine? In case you're unaware, fentanyl is contra-indicated by breathing problems. They said the woman presented days before. With WHAT? Gee isn't it easy to not show the facts? Those AT RISK for any influenza are those with pre-existing conditions such as serious circulatory conditions. Flu's such as covid-19 are respiratory diseases.

[Frank Krygowski]

I stopped reading when I saw the notice "This Article has been Retracted."

But how lucky we are to have the World's Foremost Expert on virus
transmission here in our little bicycle discussion group! Way smarter
than Fauci (who actually _did_ graduate from high school!), way more
knowledgeable than the best trained and experienced medical researchers
in over 150 countries! Able to "prove" his assertions conclusively by
simply saying "I have shown..."

Given our incredible luck, we should all chip in for a lottery ticket.


--
- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

On 9/3/2021 5:39 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
>
> I will ask you again Jay, WHAT in the hell do you know about medicine?

... says the high school dropout with oft-admitted and demonstrated
memory problems.

Astonishing!

--
- Frank Krygowski

[John B.]

Here (Thailand) it is even worse. they take your temperature BEFORE
they will let you in the door (:-)
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

Just as the fellow on the road to Damascus was struck by a blinding
light and all was reveled to him so Tommy Boy fell on his head on the
road to San Leandro and in his delusions believes that he knows
everything..
--
Cheers,

John B.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Fri, 3 Sep 2021 14:27:19 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Here is the actual testing that you could have found found yourself, but you much prefer your false beliefs: https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-1342?fbclid=IwAR1arBfDNIfUrfr1rn4C44Nuekv0b8LbtC94JbCP5on-TuRlHCm532xwSzU&

This article has been retracted. See Notice of Retraction.
<https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/L20-0745>

--
Jeff Liebermann je...@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

[sms]

On 9/3/2021 12:02 PM, jbeattie wrote:

<snip>

> If the sign says "no shoes, no shirt, no service" do you march in shirtless and demand service? It's a f****** private business. It can make you take off your shoes, like my local Japanese restaurant. If you don't want to wear a mask, go elsewhere -- like the Alt-Right Lunatic Bike Shop that has bikes with My Pillow saddles. BTW, the medical community disagrees with you. https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2776536

Kudo's to Mikes Bikes for enforcing common-sense Covid-prevention
measures. Fortunately Tom just left without incident. Other covidiot
anti-maskers have been physically removed from stores like Walmart.
<https://youtu.be/f456x1Zvz3U>
<https://twitter.com/i/status/1292306240287248384>

I met the founder of Mike's Bikes once, Ken Martin, good guy.

Years ago, I recall leading a weekend ride from San Francisco out to
Point Reyes when one person on the tour had some sort of failure, I
can't recall what it was but it was more than just a failed tire. We
stopped by Mike's Bikes in Sausalito, which is right on the multi-use
path, and the first bicycle shop you come to in Marin County after you
cross the Golden Gate Bridge. They were super-helpful and were kind
enough to do repairs while we waited.

From Tom's experience of being thrown out for behaving like an idiot,
Mike's Bikes seems like a well-run store that we should all patronize.
They don't care that he bought a tire somewhere else.

We'd be done with Covid by now if we didn't have Covidiots like Tom
running around behaving like morons, and ignoring all the science.

Bccing Ken Martin, the CEO of Mike's Bikes.

[sms]

On 9/3/2021 4:16 PM, John B. wrote:
> On Fri, 3 Sep 2021 16:09:46 -0400, Frank Krygowski

<snip>

>> Those in charge of these facilities seem unaware of Tom's wisdom.
>
> Here (Thailand) it is even worse. they take your temperature BEFORE
> they will let you in the door (:-)

We've had some stores in my area doing that, a Japanese supermarket and
a Japanese variety store, Daiso (also in Thailand apparently). Also
medical facilities take your temperature at the door.

With vaccination effectiveness decreasing over time, and breakthrough
infections occurring, the Mike's Bikes store was very smart for
protecting both the employees and the other customers, from covidiots.

[William Crowell]

"Mike's Bikes store was very smart...."

Not smart enough to garner my business, though. I agree with Tom. I'm done with trying to appease the scardey-cat sheeples. I don't patronize any establishments that make me wear a mask or take my temperature. How long is this bullshit going to continue before the dummies realize that the government is simply using Covid as an excuse to control our lives, so that we will be more willing to accept more stringent government controls in the future?

[jbeattie]

On Saturday, September 4, 2021 at 4:53:47 AM UTC-7, William Crowell wrote:
> "Mike's Bikes store was very smart...."
>
> Not smart enough to garner my business, though. I agree with Tom. I'm done with trying to appease the scardey-cat sheeples. I don't patronize any establishments that make me wear a mask or take my temperature. How long is this bullshit going to continue before the dummies realize that the government is simply using Covid as an excuse to control our lives, so that we will be more willing to accept more stringent government controls in the future?

You need to move to Idaho. https://www.yahoo.com/news/idaho-hospitals-nearly-buckling-relentless-051151355.html And aren't masks required in all retail locations in California? I think Mikes is just following the law, which is what good conservative, law-abiding people do.

-- Jay Beattie.

[jbeattie]

On Friday, September 3, 2021 at 11:38:27 PM UTC-7, jeff.li...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Fri, 3 Sep 2021 14:27:19 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
> <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >Here is the actual testing that you could have found found yourself, but you much prefer your false beliefs: https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-1342?fbclid=IwAR1arBfDNIfUrfr1rn4C44Nuekv0b8LbtC94JbCP5on-TuRlHCm532xwSzU&
> This article has been retracted. See Notice of Retraction.
> <https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/L20-0745>

It was rejected in other respects early on as noted in the comments. Its also a year old, which is a lifetime with COVID-related public health research. The most recent data indicates mask-use slows community spread. Masks are not perfect or 100% effective, and neither is most PPE.

-- Jay Beattie.

[AMuzi]

Right you are.

Or, in the best traditions of our nation, move one's self,
home and business to a less pernicious jurisdiction.

[sms]

Correct. Here is Alameda County's web page on masks
<https://covid-19.acgov.org/face-masks>: "Everyone 2 years of age and
older must continue to wear a mask, regardless of their vaccination
status, in indoor public settings and businesses."

The business could have gotten in trouble if they allowed people to
violate the mask requirement. Very few people have actually been
arrested for this sort of thing, most leave the business peacefully if
they won't mask up, a few need to be forced to leave or are arrested.

As I said in a previous post, I bcc'd the CEO of Mike's Bikes, Ken
Martin, on my followup in this thread. That was at 4:17 a.m. PDT. Much
to my surprise, at 4:28 a.m. he responded to me via e-mail saying "I’m
not familiar with this incident, and the attachment didn’t come through.
Can you send it again, or a link to the post?" So I sent him a link to
this thread
<https://groups.google.com/g/rec.bicycles.tech/c/7MGs55w41Qc>. He
replied again at 4:36 a.m., but I think I'd better keep that reply
confidential, but he did thank me. I was impressed that the CEO of a
company would take the time to reply at 4:28 a.m.!

[William Crowell]

I take your point about Alameda County, Jay, but my county of residence (El Dorado, CA) doesn't require customers of most businesses to wear masks, let alone to have their temperature taken.

[sms]

On 9/4/2021 7:51 AM, AMuzi wrote:
> On 9/4/2021 9:31 AM, jbeattie wrote:

<snip>

>> You need to move to Idaho.
>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/idaho-hospitals-nearly-buckling-relentless-051151355.html
>> And aren't masks required in all retail locations in California?  I
>> think Mikes is just following the law, which is what good
>> conservative, law-abiding people do.
>>
>> -- Jay Beattie.
>>
>
> Right you are.
>
> Or, in the best traditions of our nation, move one's self, home and
> business to a less pernicious jurisdiction.

Absolutely! Those that want to be jerks just need to find a state with
prohibitions on mask mandates combined with ICUs that still have
available capacity.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sat, 4 Sep 2021 07:51:22 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie <jbeat...@msn.com>
wrote:

I read some of the reader comments. The big problems were that the
study was centered around a tiny test population of four patients. In
the Table, much of the data appeared as ND (no data). The findings
had little to do with the tests conducted. The procedures used were
badly described or missing. In a subsequent posting, the authors
somewhat agreed with the retraction, but then offered to perform
damage control by reporting additional test results, presumably in the
same manner.

My guess(tm) is that Tom didn't read the article or either missed or
ignored the retraction.

[William Crowell]

On Saturday, September 4, 2021 at 9:13:03 AM UTC-7, sms wrote:
> On 9/4/2021 7:51 AM, AMuzi wrote:
> > On 9/4/2021 9:31 AM, jbeattie wrote:
> <snip>
> >> You need to move to Idaho.
> >> https://www.yahoo.com/news/idaho-hospitals-nearly-buckling-relentless-051151355.html

Those that want to be jerks...."

I don't think you can possibly be aware of the gross violations of personal liberty that were practiced by public health officials during the 1918 flu epidemic, because if you were you wouldn't say that.

[jbeattie]

On Saturday, September 4, 2021 at 9:10:45 AM UTC-7, William Crowell wrote:
> I take your point about Alameda County, Jay, but my county of residence (El Dorado, CA) doesn't require customers of most businesses to wear masks, let alone to have their temperature taken.

Isn't there a state-wide mask mandate for all retail? https://covid19.ca.gov/masks-and-ppe/
-- Jay Beattie.

[Tom Kunich]

Another Fauci lover, that is all this world needs. A lover of a man who looks right in the camera and lies. Everyone believes him and then he reverses his position and people like you believe him. The mental illness of people like you shows exactly what you and your opinions are worth.

[Tom Kunich]

So you believe that people like you should be able to command people to do things for absolutely nothing don't you? You don't fucking care one wit what the truth is, what Constitutional rights of people are or what the actual law says. You are like all of the little power grubbing cock suckers that will eventually be taught a lesson so loudly that you cannot fail to hear it.

https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/5/19-0994_article

Can you tell us why Fauci says one thing and the CDC at the height of the pandemic says something altogether differently? Or is it your worship of someone that financed the development of this pandemic that you admire?

[Tom Kunich]

You have to read Jay to believe that a lawyer would say that they are following the law. Tell us Jay, what LAW is that?

[Tom Kunich]

Apparently you cannot read - they got POSITIVE transmission detectable on a petri dish. They CANNOT retract the results because of complaints that the test didn't have a larger group. I will ask you again Jeff. What have you ever done in the medical field? How many patients did you sit there and interview while they were dying in an effort to attempt to find the cause of their illness so that we could STOP it?

You and Frank are in exactly the same boat, you have a fist full of criticisms from a position of nothing.

[Tom Kunich]

If you give Satan a chance Jay will stand there and obey with every once of his strength.

[Tom Kunich]

I hate to point this out to you Jay, but the Legislature makes laws, NOT the governor.

[AMuzi]

Ditto Wisconsin; county by county daily life varies greatly.

Ancient expression, 'The mountain is high and the emperor is
far away.'

[jbeattie]

Uh, this one: https://covid-19.acgov.org/covid19-assets/docs/shelter-in-place/21-03-face-coverings-eng.pdf Pursuant to these ones: CALIFORNIA HEALTH AND SAFETY CODE SECTIONS 101040, 101085, AND 120175, available here: https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=HSC&sectionNum=120175.

Rage, Tom . . . rage against the oppression of the nanny state. Tear up your Social Security check! Reject Medicare! Stop being a whining welfare slag! Rip off your cloth face shackle and be a leader of men!

-- John Galt.

[jbeattie]

I suspect that one impediment to your getting a HS diploma was missing civics -- particularly the day the teacher talked about the authority of the executive branch, delegated by the legislature and the people of California. Go read Cal. Government Code sections 8567, 8627 and 8665. Sing it! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nauLgZISozs&ab_channel=Movieclips

-- Jay Beattie.

[Tom Kunich]

As I've shown you - the CDC shows that masks, social distancing and frequent hand washing do NOT slow or prevent the spread of influenza which is spread by aerosols and so NO state health officer has any right to rule otherwise.

Of course you can pretend that some moronic fool on the fourth floor of the janitorial service knows better.

[Tom Kunich]

I suspect that you will say absolutely anything to try and win an argument. The California governor MAY NOT make any laws, he can only approve or not laws made by the legislature or not. And THEN he can still be overridden just as the President can.

But you are welcome to continue arguing as if you didn't know that to begin with and only made that argument as if people didn't know any better.

[William Crowell]

Isn't there a state-wide mask mandate for all retail? https://covid19.ca.gov/masks-and-ppe/
> -- Jay Beattie.

You need to read the link you cited. The face mask requirement in retail establishments applies only to unvaccinated people, and businesses don't ask you to prove that you are vaccinated. I've NEVER been asked, and if I were, I would definitely lie about it. Fuck the bastards!

[William Crowell]

... the authority of the executive branch, delegated by the legislature and the people of California.
> -- Jay Beattie.

You haven't contradicted Tom's point. Prove to us that the legislature delegated this authority to the governor, please.

[William Crowell]

Summarizing, then, Mike's Bikes has its head totally up its ass when it demands that all of its customers wear masks because the statewide requirement only applies to unvaccinated people. The Alameda County ordinance cannot require vaccinated people to wear a mask because, in the interests of uniformity among the counties, the State of California has pre-empted the field of regulation.

[Sir Ridesalot]

On Saturday, September 4, 2021 at 4:49:58 p.m. UTC-4, William Crowell wrote:
> Summarizing, then, Mike's Bikes has its head totally up its ass when it demands that all of its customers wear masks because the statewide requirement only applies to unvaccinated people. The Alameda County ordinance cannot require vaccinated people to wear a mask because, in the interests of uniformity among the counties, the State of California has pre-empted the field of regulation.

And just how are the staff of any business to know if someone is vaccinated or not?

Cheers

[jbeattie]

I cited the statutes -- which you snipped. Read them. Start here: https://codes.findlaw.com/ca/government-code/gov-sect-8627.html https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displayText.xhtml?lawCode=GOV&division=1.&title=2.&part=&chapter=7.&article=3.

The oppositional defiant disorder set needs to do some reading. If a governor is acting beyond his delegated power, rest assured that his opponents would be filing injunctions, quo warranto, mandamus or whatever else they could whip up.

And you would lie about your vaccine status? Lying doesn't strike me as a Christian or conservative value, particularly lying to merchants in your community. I respect my local merchants and comply with their requests.

-- Jay Beattie.

[Ralph Barone]

Thank you for living in the US, safely away from me.

[jbeattie]

On Saturday, September 4, 2021 at 1:49:58 PM UTC-7, William Crowell wrote:
> Summarizing, then, Mike's Bikes has its head totally up its ass when it demands that all of its customers wear masks because the statewide requirement only applies to unvaccinated people. The Alameda County ordinance cannot require vaccinated people to wear a mask because, in the interests of uniformity among the counties, the State of California has pre-empted the field of regulation.

Wrong. A county health official may impose more rigorous restrictions to meet the needs of the county. Read this section of California law: https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displayText.xhtml?lawCode=HSC&division=105.&title=&part=1.&chapter=3.&article= See also Article XI, section 7 of the California Constitution and Suter v. City of Lafayette https://casetext.com/case/suter-v-city-of-lafayette

And Mikes can demand that its customers wear wooden shoes if it wants -- unless that policy violates the public accommodations laws, like discriminating against people with hammer toes, although hammer toes probably does not count as a disability. Mikes are great shops, but you are entirely free not to shop there.

Personally, I'm protesting against stop signs, which significantly impair my God-given right to go. Oh, never mind. https://tinyurl.com/ycur28z3

-- Jay Beattie.

[William Crowell]

Wrong. A county health official may impose more rigorous restrictions to meet the needs of the county. Read this section of California law

Touche, but it is exactly thinking like that which made the Alameda County "tattle-tale police" possible during the 1918 pandemic. The public health authorities rather arbitrarily decided that everybody who contracted the flu was going to die, so they urged all "good citizens" to report their friends and neighbors to the government when they discovered that anyone they knew had the flu. If your father got the flu, because he wanted to be a good citizen your neighbor would report him to the government, even though your mother was nursing him back to health just fine at home. Then 2 public health officials and a cop would knock on your door and, against your will, take your father out of your house and over to the open-air pergola at Lake Merritt to let him die with the other flu sufferers.

[Frank Krygowski]

On 9/4/2021 4:12 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
>
> As I've shown you...

Tom has a very rich fantasy life.


--
- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

It's Tom. He more likely forgot.


--
- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

> Another Fauci lover...

No, Tom. I'm a science lover and a lover of learning. That's why I
actually completed high school and college. That's also why I have
little patience for uneducated blowhards who spout unscientific nonsense
and can't understand what it means for a study to be retracted.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[John B.]

On Sat, 4 Sep 2021 04:24:22 -0700, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>

wrote:

>On 9/3/2021 4:16 PM, John B. wrote:
>> On Fri, 3 Sep 2021 16:09:46 -0400, Frank Krygowski
>
><snip>
>
>>> Those in charge of these facilities seem unaware of Tom's wisdom.
>>
>> Here (Thailand) it is even worse. they take your temperature BEFORE
>> they will let you in the door (:-)
>
>We've had some stores in my area doing that, a Japanese supermarket and
>a Japanese variety store, Daiso (also in Thailand apparently). Also
>medical facilities take your temperature at the door.
>
>With vaccination effectiveness decreasing over time, and breakthrough
>infections occurring, the Mike's Bikes store was very smart for
>protecting both the employees and the other customers, from covidiots.

Here anti Covid action is mandated by the government and the penalty
for any deviation is a substantial fine, and according to the news
they are catching people and they are fining them. And, apparently
contrary to Tom's attitude the population is all for anything that
might limit infections. I have even been admonished, by a passerby,
for not wearing a mask just walking down the road (:-)
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Sat, 4 Sep 2021 04:53:45 -0700 (PDT), William Crowell
<retrog...@gmail.com> wrote:

>"Mike's Bikes store was very smart...."
>
>Not smart enough to garner my business, though. I agree with Tom. I'm done with trying to appease the scardey-cat sheeples. I don't patronize any establishments that make me wear a mask or take my temperature. How long is this bullshit going to continue before the dummies realize that the government is simply using Covid as an excuse to control our lives, so that we will be more willing to accept more stringent government controls in the future?

But, the government already "controls your life", all governments do.
You want to argue? Try not paying your taxes.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Sat, 4 Sep 2021 12:33:25 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich

<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Saturday, September 4, 2021 at 9:26:20 AM UTC-7, jeff.li...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Sat, 4 Sep 2021 07:51:22 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie <jbeat...@msn.com>
>> wrote:
>> >On Friday, September 3, 2021 at 11:38:27 PM UTC-7, jeff.li...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >> On Fri, 3 Sep 2021 14:27:19 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
>> >> <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >Here is the actual testing that you could have found found yourself, but you much prefer your false beliefs: https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-1342?fbclid=IwAR1arBfDNIfUrfr1rn4C44Nuekv0b8LbtC94JbCP5on-TuRlHCm532xwSzU&
>> >> This article has been retracted. See Notice of Retraction.
>> >> <https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/L20-0745>
>>
>> >It was rejected in other respects early on as noted in the comments. Its also a year old, which is a lifetime with COVID-related public health research. The most recent data indicates mask-use slows community spread. Masks are not perfect or 100% effective, and neither is most PPE.
>> >-- Jay Beattie.
>> I read some of the reader comments. The big problems were that the
>> study was centered around a tiny test population of four patients. In
>> the Table, much of the data appeared as ND (no data). The findings
>> had little to do with the tests conducted. The procedures used were
>> badly described or missing. In a subsequent posting, the authors
>> somewhat agreed with the retraction, but then offered to perform
>> damage control by reporting additional test results, presumably in the
>> same manner.
>>
>> My guess(tm) is that Tom didn't read the article or either missed or
>> ignored the retraction.
>
>Apparently you cannot read - they got POSITIVE transmission detectable on a petri dish. They CANNOT retract the results because of complaints that the test didn't have a larger group. I will ask you again Jeff. What have you ever done in the medical field? How many patients did you sit there and interview while they were dying in an effort to attempt to find the cause of their illness so that we could STOP it?
>
>You and Frank are in exactly the same boat, you have a fist full of criticisms from a position of nothing.

Well why not a little truth then.

Of the larger countries in the world, say 250 million population or
greater, the U.S, has the highest rate of Covid infection and the
highest death rate from the disease.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[sms]

On 9/4/2021 5:32 PM, John B. wrote:

<snip>

> Of the larger countries in the world, say 250 million population or
> greater, the U.S, has the highest rate of Covid infection and the
> highest death rate from the disease.

The U.S. has the highest percentage of Covidiots like Tom. It's a
side-effect of Trump. These people won't listen to scientists and
doctors, but they'll listen to their high school dropout friends that
flunked science. See <https://i.imgur.com/nTbXzYm.jpg>.

[John B.]

On Sat, 4 Sep 2021 19:01:17 -0700, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
wrote:

What I find interesting is that, as far as I know, every state in the
U.S. makes vaccination(s) mandatory and has for, probably 100 years or
more, and I don't hear anyone screeching and screaming about that.

In fact, if Tom actually was in the Air Force he received quite a
number of immunization "shots". I believe that the U.S. Military
currently has some 17 different vaccines available which are
administered in various numbers depending on where you will be
serving. And I might add that refusal would be construed as "Failure
to obey a lawful order" and make one subject to court martial
--
Cheers,

John B.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sat, 4 Sep 2021 12:33:25 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich

<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Saturday, September 4, 2021 at 9:26:20 AM UTC-7, jeff.li...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Sat, 4 Sep 2021 07:51:22 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie <jbeat...@msn.com>
>> wrote:
>> >On Friday, September 3, 2021 at 11:38:27 PM UTC-7, jeff.li...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >> On Fri, 3 Sep 2021 14:27:19 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
>> >> <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >Here is the actual testing that you could have found found yourself, but you much prefer your false beliefs: https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-1342?fbclid=IwAR1arBfDNIfUrfr1rn4C44Nuekv0b8LbtC94JbCP5on-TuRlHCm532xwSzU&
>> >> This article has been retracted. See Notice of Retraction.
>> >> <https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/L20-0745>
>>
>> >It was rejected in other respects early on as noted in the comments. Its also a year old, which is a lifetime with COVID-related public health research. The most recent data indicates mask-use slows community spread. Masks are not perfect or 100% effective, and neither is most PPE.
>> >-- Jay Beattie.
>> I read some of the reader comments. The big problems were that the
>> study was centered around a tiny test population of four patients. In
>> the Table, much of the data appeared as ND (no data). The findings
>> had little to do with the tests conducted. The procedures used were
>> badly described or missing. In a subsequent posting, the authors
>> somewhat agreed with the retraction, but then offered to perform
>> damage control by reporting additional test results, presumably in the
>> same manner.
>>
>> My guess(tm) is that Tom didn't read the article or either missed or
>> ignored the retraction.
>
>Apparently you cannot read - they got POSITIVE transmission detectable on a petri dish.

Out of a population of 4 patients. I suggest you read re-read the
"Methods and Findings" section and show me where it says something
about transmission. What they more likely got was positive
contamination to a petri dish with an unknown number of Covid-19
patients in a closed (negative pressure) room.

However, if you believe the results, I just flipped a coin. It came up
heads 3 out of 4 times. I can therefore conclude that heads are more
likely than tails by a ratio of 3:1.

>They CANNOT retract the results because of complaints that the test didn't have a larger group.

But the publishers did retract the report. They can do so because of
insufficient sample, vague methodology description, a creative
conclusion, and failure to understand the LOD (limit of detection) of
the reverse transcriptase polymerase chain reaction, something which
you are allegedly familiar with having working with the inventor of
the PCR technique. As I recall, Dr Mulligan warned against using his
PCR technique as a virus test due to the problem of amplifying both
the virus and any associated errors. Oddly, you didn't mention that
in reference to the report you cited. Did you really read the report
that you cited?

"Notice of Retraction: Effectiveness of Surgical and Cotton Masks in
Blocking SARS-CoV-2"
<https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/L20-0745>
See 2nd paragraph.

>I will ask you again Jeff. What have you ever done in the medical field?

I've done nothing in medical the medical field, unless you consider
reading far too many medical research papers trying to deal with my
own medical problems qualifies. Also, helping with research into the
biological effects of RF (radio frequencies) on various animals.
Please inform the assembled multitudes what my medical research
experience has to do with the publishers of medical research
retracting the publication of a report containing procedural,
statistics, and analytical deficiencies? Are you suggesting that only
a person with experience in medical research can understand such
reports? Are you an elitist?

>How many patients did you sit there and interview while they were dying in an effort to attempt to find the cause of their illness so that we could STOP it?

Zero. However, since you are apparently immune to Covid-19 by virtue
of your support of ideas which claim that "it's nothing but a bad
flu", I assume that you volunteered to interview patients. Thank you
for your service.

>You and Frank are in exactly the same boat, you have a fist full of criticisms from a position of nothing.

Well, you are entitled to an opinion, even if it's wrong. It would
seem that you don't share that entitlement with others who have
different positions.

--
Jeff Liebermann je...@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sat, 04 Sep 2021 23:12:29 -0700, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>
wrote:

>As I recall, Dr Mulligan warned against using his
>PCR technique as a virus test due to the problem of amplifying both
>the virus and any associated errors.

Sorry. That should be Kary Mullis.

[sms]

On 9/4/2021 8:10 PM, John B. wrote:
> On Sat, 4 Sep 2021 19:01:17 -0700, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On 9/4/2021 5:32 PM, John B. wrote:
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>>> Of the larger countries in the world, say 250 million population or
>>> greater, the U.S, has the highest rate of Covid infection and the
>>> highest death rate from the disease.
>>
>> The U.S. has the highest percentage of Covidiots like Tom. It's a
>> side-effect of Trump. These people won't listen to scientists and
>> doctors, but they'll listen to their high school dropout friends that
>> flunked science. See <https://i.imgur.com/nTbXzYm.jpg>.
>
> What I find interesting is that, as far as I know, every state in the
> U.S. makes vaccination(s) mandatory and has for, probably 100 years or
> more, and I don't hear anyone screeching and screaming about that.

For children to attend public school they must be vaccinated, with some
limited exceptions. But anti-vaxxers are more likely to send their kids
to religious schools or home school.

Covid has become political, thanks to Trump. He made being stupid
something to be proud of.

[jbeattie]

Parents who refuse standard vaccines for their children are a very disparate group and existed long before Trump. It's hippies to far-right conspiracy theorists to religious objectors. Education levels are all over the map. I defended an uncertified class action involving a bunch of parents suing various drug manufacturers, claiming vaccines caused autism, and specifically a preservative used in vaccines -- Thimerosal. The level of junk science was staggering, and hysteria was fueled by plaintiffs' attorneys trying to make a big buck. Those cases ended up in vaccine court and were ultimate dismissed because [drum roll please] vaccines don't cause autism. This case: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-autism-vaccine/u-s-court-rules-again-against-vaccine-autism-claims-idUKTRE62B41820100312 Spend a day reading the special master's report: http://www.uscfc.uscourts.gov/sites/default/files/opinions/Campbell-Smith%20Mead%20Autism%20Decision.pdf

COVID antivaxers are a different group, but they are similar in that they believe what the believe, regardless of the science. The amazing thing to me about the COVID antivaxers is that they're willing to risk their health or lives by taking fish-tank cleaner, horse de-wormers or whatever Alex Jones is recommending that day. They listen to their doctors, unless their doctors tell them to get vaccinated -- and then their doctors are idiots and don't know anything. We are seeing the birth of a bizarre and selfish new populist religion with a lay clergy sermonizing from the internet.

-- Jay Beattie.

[Tom Kunich]

As a science lover explain exactly why you never did a thing in science while I did everything from help discover the cause of AIDS to work for Laurence Livermore Laboratories to build boards to put on the International Space Station for NASA. You spend an awfully lot of time looking like the fool you are science lover without a credential.

[Tom Kunich]

I see you have the perfect term for yourself after I have shown everyone the CDC's actual statistics. I have shown that after the New York Times and the rest of the Lame Stream Media claim that there has been 600,000 covid-19 deaths that the mortuary business lost money. I have used the CDC's own statistics to show that there hasn't been any cases of ANY deaths in any category above the 10 year norm except dementia in 2021. I have shown that the CDC published a study at the height of the covid "pandemic" saying that none of the things that Fauci was touting have ANY effect.

But YOU call me a covidiot. It is plain who is the idiot.

[Tom Kunich]

So you've never done anything in the medical field but you want to argue that you know more about it than the people who have. You always have an interesting point of view in which you are always right about things you know not the slightest thing about. Congratulations.

[Tom Kunich]

On Sunday, September 5, 2021 at 5:36:21 AM UTC-7, sms wrote:

Tell us how Trump made this political?

[Tom Kunich]

Jay, aren't you the one that quoted a California law that said absolutely NOTHING that you thought it did? The ONLY emergency power it gave the governor was that to assign money and local authorities (county boards of supervisors) could spend that money any way they wished and could take ANY actions they wished and people like you wish they would put you in the chains you believe you lived in under Trump.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sun, 5 Sep 2021 09:21:36 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>So you've never done anything in the medical field but you want to argue that you know more about it than the people who have. You always have an interesting point of view in which you are always right about things you know not the slightest thing about. Congratulations.

When you are unable to debate the merits of your claims, you
invariably attack the credibility of those who disagree with you. If
that fails, you attack Dr Fauci, attack Prez Biden, or simply change
the topic. Well, at least you're consistent.

Might as well follow your example. Did you read the journal article
that you cited as justification for not wearing a mask at Mike's
Bikes?
<https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-1342>
How could you have missed the retraction at the top of the article?
There are plenty of other articles you could have chosen to backup
your claims. Unfortunately, I couldn't find anything recently
published that indicates face masks fail to reduce the spread of
Covid-19. In case you missed it, I wrote "reduce", not eliminate
Covid-19 transmission.

Of course, you'll want a more recent article.

"Do face masks work? Here are 49 scientific studies that explain why
they do" (Aug 7, 2021)
<https://www.kxan.com/news/coronavirus/do-face-masks-work-here-are-49-scientific-studies-that-explain-why-they-do/>

"Examining the interplay between face mask usage, asymptomatic
transmission, and social distancing on the spread of COVID-19"
<https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-021-94960-5> (Aug 6, 2021)

"Science Brief: Community Use of Cloth Masks to Control the Spread of
SARS-CoV-2" (May 7, 2021)
<https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/masking-science-sars-cov2.html>
Oddly, all the studies listed in the "table" show a favorable outcome
for wearing a mask.

Have a nice laborious holiday.

[28 minutes wasted]

[Tom Kunich]

These are not my claims, they are the CDC statistics available to anyone an which I have cited. But apparently that is beyond your understanding.
The opening paragraph of your citation is completely wrong. Influenza and almost ALL respiratory diseases are spread NOT though "inhalation of respiratory droplets generated when people cough, sneeze, sing, talk, or breathe." but via aerosols which are molecule size particles of virus that float in the air. When you wear glasses and put a mask on and breath, the fogging up of your glasses is the release of these aerosols into the air. Immediately upon being released into the air all moisture evaporates even in a humid atmosphere.

Why do you find this "study" convincing when it is entirely self reported? While ACTUAL studies say otherwise? https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/5/19-0994_article

I am perfectly satisfied that you believe every single "My Helmet Saved My Life" story

[John B.]

On Sun, 05 Sep 2021 10:13:50 -0700, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>
wrote:

As Julius Caesar was said to have stated "Men in general are quick to
believe that which they wish to be true."

--
Cheers,

John B.

[Tom Kunich]

On Sunday, September 5, 2021 at 10:14:01 AM UTC-7, jeff.li...@gmail.com wrote:

Tell me Jeff, exactly what merits do you think you have? When it is shown irrefutably that very few people died from covid-19 while the Lame Stream Media was claim massive amounts of deaths hence the need for election fraud which is being shown to have been committed in swing states simply by auditing the votes and discovering that up to 20% of the so-called majority votes do not exist - where is your merit?

I will repeat this so that even you should be able to understand it - the normal yearly deaths are 2.8 million. An increase of 600,000 would be a 21% increase. So perhaps you'd like to show your meritorious case of the mortuary business losing 1.1% in profits in 2020? https://www.statista.com/statistics/883227/revenue-of-funeral-homes-in-the-us/

Is it your position that this disease is so deadly that they could actually MEASURE the efficacy of masks simply by lying about infection rates and then showing that wearing of masks reduced infection rates that never existed to begin with?

So it is I who am arguing against reality and not you. This in my opinion is why you're a nobody and have never even gotten close to being successful.

[Frank Krygowski]

You may mean you "remember" helping discover the cause oF AIDS -
possibly by cleaning the desk of the people who actually did that
scientific work. You may "remember" working to put boards on the ISS -
perhaps by boxing them up for shipment.

You've never given us the least documented proof of any of your
supposedly stellar achievements. Instead, you've shown us that you
typically lasted only two years in any job, job after job. Your
employers didn't seem impressed enough by your genius to retain you.

If you have some legitimate, recognized proof to back up your claims to
glory, let's see it. We're not impressed by your fantasies or your
"memory."

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

On 9/5/2021 6:07 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
> ... aerosols which are molecule size particles of virus that float in the
air...

No, Tom. Aerosols are over 1000 times larger than virus particles. The
latter might be 5x10^-10 meters. Typical aerosols might be 2x10^-6
meters. That's 4000 times bigger.

You should be able to look this up. Google is your friend.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

On 9/5/2021 7:22 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
> ... very few people died from covid-19 ...

SMH


--
- Frank Krygowski

[John B.]

Don't forget, he also fell off his bike and thus discovered gravity.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sun, 5 Sep 2021 16:22:20 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Tell me Jeff, exactly what merits do you think you have?

No comment. Exactly the same response I've received when I asked you
a rather harmless question: Did you read the article that you cited

as justification for not wearing a mask at Mike's Bikes?
<https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-1342>

I believe I asked that question 3 times.

>I will repeat this so that even you should be able to understand it - the normal yearly deaths are 2.8 million. An increase of 600,000 would be a 21% increase. So perhaps you'd like to show your meritorious case of the mortuary business losing 1.1% in profits in 2020? https://www.statista.com/statistics/883227/revenue-of-funeral-homes-in-the-us/

Paywall. Statista wants $39/year for me to read the article. My
guess(tm) is that you also didn't subscribe and therefore haven't read
the article that you cited above.

>Is it your position that this disease is so deadly that they could actually MEASURE the efficacy of masks simply by lying about infection rates and then showing that wearing of masks reduced infection rates that never existed to begin with?

Amazing. You assume that my sources are lying and then ask if that's
my position? No, it is not my position. Any other questions where
you also provide the answer for me?

>So it is I who am arguing against reality and not you.

Arguing against reality? That means that your don't believe in
reality, or at least reported reality. Could you rephrase that
statement into something that makes sense?

>This in my opinion is why you're a nobody and have never even gotten close to being successful.

True. I do not seek global acclaim. I do not seek acclaim in this
newsgroup. However, you seem to be doing so as well as harvesting
attention. Today (Sept 5, 2021) I count that you've posted 16 out of
49 messages or 33% of the total message count. I suspect you posted
even more yesterday. I suspect that you are trying to gain the
attention of this newsgroup. No problem. That's your right. However,
I'm wondering if a successful political agitator really needs to be so
prolific. Are you really successful?

[14 minutes wasted]

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sun, 5 Sep 2021 15:07:00 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Why do you find this "study" convincing when it is entirely self reported? While ACTUAL studies say otherwise? https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/5/19-0994_article

That article was from May 2020. Couldn't you find something more
recent?

Under "Face Masks" your CDC article above declares:

"Most studies were underpowered because of limited sample size, and
some studies also reported suboptimal adherence in the face mask
group."

In other words, 15 month ago, there was insufficient research, an
insufficiently large test population, no data to demonstrate that
Covid-19 acts like influenza, and little or no control over the way
the face masks were used. I also note that there were no control
groups in any of the 10 randomized studies. Please read the articles
before you claim they substantiate your pontifications.

>I am perfectly satisfied that you believe every single "My Helmet Saved My Life" story

Try really hard to stay on topic. What does my believing or not
believing that a helmet might reduce head injuries have anything to do
with why you don't believe in wearing a mask while shopping at Mike's
Bikes? (See the title at the beginning of the this thread which you
started). It's about "The stupidity of Mike's Bikes" for demanding
that you wear a mask in the store.

[17 minutes wasted]

[Ralph Barone]

Frank Krygowski <frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> On 9/5/2021 7:22 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
>> ... very few people died from covid-19 ...
>
> SMH
>
>

As a percentage of all of humanity, perhaps so, but for a new way to die
that didn’t exist until a couple of years back, it’s a fuck of a lot of
people.

[Tom Kunich]

Google is your friend except you don't cite it. Is that because as usual you don't know what you're talking about? Large sized aerosols are associated with bacterial diseases such as measles or tuberculosis. Viral aerosols are the size of a virus and they are solitary and not clumped together. As I said, you would argue that I am wrong if I were trying to prevent your lynching. There is something dramatically wrong in your head and I suggest you see a shrink.

[Tom Kunich]

The fact is that I actually read the article. You did not. All you read was that this article was retracted. It does not say on what grounds it was retracted and the very fact that they proved transmission through a mask shows that any retraction was due to things other than the actual study itself. But as usual without a passing knowledge of anything, you shoot your mouth off.

[jbeattie]

Jeff linked the retraction statement from the authors. https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/L20-0745 Also read the comments to the original article and retraction statement. Then go to the recent research.

-- Jay Beattie.

[Tom Kunich]

Jay, go ahead and shiver in fear and shit your pants. Your death is upon you nonetheless.

[Tom Kunich]

Ralph, I think that this is your first rodeo. Pandemics occur every few years and depending on their targets, young or old, you are usually unaware of them. Most older people die from Pneumonia - this amounts to some 2 million people in the US every year. Or some 130 Million lives lost to it in the average lifetime. This is in the US alone and we have a longer lifespan on the whole so how many people would you think die each year from pneumonia alone? Pneumonia is the cause of most death in children under 5.

Any death is a loss to humanity, even those executed since they might have been another Einstein or Hawking in another reality. But man is born to die and the Democrats discovered a way to put your coming death into the forefront of your mind. Jesus was sent to this Earth to show you that man need not fear death. This is one of the reasons that socialism abhors religion. It removes one of the means of controlling a population.

If you look at the CDC statistical chart I showed Andrew in "https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/excess_deaths.htm" and look at the red lines, you will see that only some 2,000 people were killed by covid-19 directly. And the last case was in the last week of April 2020. There was another 12,000 or so that died from the EFFECTS of covid-19 but not from it. This is because these were all people close to death with circulatory illnesses. This is the final stages of life, you get serious circulatory diseases, become less and less able to move about, finally become bedridden and develop pneumonia. People in this condition are ripe for covid-19 CAUSING pneumonia.

As I showed Andrew, there are no deaths being caused directly from covid-19. Why does ever outlet of the Lame Stream Media continue to tell you that people are dying by the millions? Corona viruses are so common that most people (60% or so) have natural immunity. Another 20% or so are so nearly immune that if they catch the illness they are completely asymptomatic. All but a miniscule number of people suffer no worse than symptoms of a minor cold or the influenza which it is. That miniscule number of people that would DIE from any influenza pandemic are being used as a sword at your neck.

You ARE going to die and you have no control over that. Covid-19 is not going to be the cause of it. Masks will not in any way, shape or form, protect you any more than a foam helmet on your head would protect you from being killed by a car running you over at 40 mph.

Live your life and LAUGH at people that decry "anti-vaxxers". This people are insane and nothing is going to change that.

[William Crowell]

Why is it that the Democrats say the government can't tell a woman what to do with her body, even if it means murdering a viable child in utero, but that nobody else can decide whether they want to be forced to wear a mask, or be immunized? Clearly, it's all B.S. politics. Follow the science? But WHICH scientists should we follow? They all claim to be right. If you buy into a screwed-up value system like that merely because it makes you feel good, then you've got no moral or intellectual standing to criticize my decisions.

[Tom Kunich]

On Tuesday, September 7, 2021 at 4:17:14 AM UTC-7, William Crowell wrote:
> Why is it that the Democrats say the government can't tell a woman what to do with her body, even if it means murdering a viable child in utero, but that nobody else can decide whether they want to be forced to wear a mask, or be immunized? Clearly, it's all B.S. politics. Follow the science? But WHICH scientists should we follow? They all claim to be right. If you buy into a screwed-up value system like that merely because it makes you feel good, then you've got no moral or intellectual standing to criticize my decisions.

That is a very good argument for people that don't know the truth about what is going on. But like everything else, there isn't any way to argue to deniers that there isn't a pandemic now and hasn't been since May of 2020.

I just read a story off of Yahoo that is warning people about a new disease that they should be afraid for their lives from. No doubt that manager of Mike's Bikes will put it on his list of fears.

[Frank Krygowski]

On 9/7/2021 11:17 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:

> ... there isn't a pandemic now and hasn't been since May of 2020.

Wow.


--
- Frank Krygowski

[Tom Kunich]

On Tuesday, September 7, 2021 at 8:49:27 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> On 9/7/2021 11:17 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
>
> > ... there isn't a pandemic now and hasn't been since May of 2020.
>
> Wow.

Again and again no matter WHAT the statistics from the CDC say you are going to believe the Lame Stream Media over the actual data. This is precisely why no one wanted you as an engineer.

[Duane]

Why is it that republicans think that they can tell a woman what to do with
her body even if she’s 13 year old victim of rape but find it an invasion
of personal rights to demand wearing a mask or being vaccinated in order to
prevent transmitting a deadly virus to everyone around them?

[Tom Kunich]

So, allowing a woman to commit murder is telling her what to do with her body? In what world do you live in which babies may be legally murdered AFTER BIRTH if a woman doesn't want the baby? We have VIDEOS of the California baby abortion mill doing exactly that.

[William Crowell]

Right, Tom. I don't see why, if a woman has a constitutional right to kill her viable fetus, why doesn't she have a constitutional right to kill her children after they are born, if keeping them alive would arguably impact the way she can use her body?

[Tom Kunich]

On Wednesday, September 8, 2021 at 8:09:11 AM UTC-7, William Crowell wrote:
> Right, Tom. I don't see why, if a woman has a constitutional right to kill her viable fetus, why doesn't she have a constitutional right to kill her children after they are born, if keeping them alive would arguably impact the way she can use her body?

Yeah, it is pretty difficult to be a slut with a baby crying to be fed in the background.