Merlin vs. Litespeed vs. Moots
VeloJon
frame builders. I am not interested in design elements, components,
etc. just quality and workmanship on the frames and only on their Ti
models. Feel free to include other manufacturers than the 3 above.
P.S. I know Merlin and Litespeed are part of the same company, but
many still prefer one over the other. Thanks, VJ
russell...@yahoo.com
I have a Litespeed. Rides fine. Welds look tidy and small. Presume
they have the proper penetration. You can (or could) usually find a
Litespeed frame from a prior year at a decent enough price. Not as
likely with Merlin and I doubt at all possible with Moots. I would
not be afraid to buy any of the three brands if the price and want was
right. Moots has more of a cache since there are many fewer of them
around. Everyone knows you paid full retail for it. Merlin above
Litespeed in the name department due to history as opposed to today's
ownership situation. Litespeed you see on every single ride, just
like Trek. But for non bicyclists, they would be more likely to know
Litespeed than the others.
Can you even get poor quality or workmanship on an upper level frame/
bike today? If you buy a road bike or frame/fork above $1000 from an
official bike shop, can you buy a poor quality bike or frame/fork?
Even if you try? You can overpay. But what you are buying will still
be good quality.
For the original question asker, are you afraid if you make the wrong
choice among these brands that your bike will break the day after the
warranty ends?
Chris Nelson
Beware the integrated headset. I think the new model Litespeeds did
away with the integrated headset, but if you are buying used, stay
away from Litespeeds of 2-4 years old.
Chris
Bill Lloyd
I've owned a Merlin (from 1991, when they were independent -- in fact I
still have it), and 2 Moots.
I'd say the build quality is similar -- but now that Merlin has been
bought I'm not as up on what the latest bikes are like. I would expect
it would still be good enough quality wise -- though I'll say that I
think their move to "integrated headsets" was a very bad one. You look
at bikes like the Cielo, and while they have a 15 cm head tube, the
downtube and top tube pretty much touch at the joint because there is
about 1" on the top and bottom of space for the bearings. Not sure if
they've moved away from this crap design -- it's worth checking into.
I can only say good things about the Moots (I have a YBB and a
Vamoots). Build quality is excellent, ride is excellent, etc. The YBB
is from 1999 but only has about 200 rides on it. The Vamoots is from
2003 and has about 40,000 road miles on it... other than some scuffs
from fenders in the winter, it looks new when I clean it.
If it were me, I'd go with the Moots. Smaller builder, nice group of
guys, and when I ordered a custom bike my experience with Kent (the
founder) was fantastic.
FYI Kent has now moved on to his own company -- Eriksen Cycles:
Morten Reippuert Knudsen
Thats because their designs are different. All Merlins are designed by
Tom Kellog, none of the Litespeeds are.
BTW i bougght a Merlin Works CR 2.5/3 last year. The craftmanship is
outstanding; at 1190g (56.5cm top tube/144mm headtube) its lighter
than any Ti frame outt here but the Giasello witch i find stupid
light; its stiff enough for my 96kg; more comftable than the Battaglin,
Moser and Pinarello steel frames i've owned the past 15 years; its
perfectly balanced.
Last but not least the tubes are all seamless plain gauge (however
tapered and ovalized) and it seems to be a very solid construction.
I wouldn't trade it for _any_ frame out there, maybee exept form a
custum Spectrum Ti (Tom Kellogs own brand, also build by Merlin)
<http://merlinbikes.com/2006/works/tech_tubing.aspx>
<http://www.spectrum-cycles.com/21.htm>
The only thing i'd like to improve is the Real Design fork wich i
might replace with a woundup fork.
--
Morten Reippuert Knudsen :-) <http://blog.reippuert.dk>
Merlin Works CR-3/2.5 & Campagnolo Chorus 2007.
Morten Reippuert Knudsen
> I'd say the build quality is similar -- but now that Merlin has been
> bought I'm not as up on what the latest bikes are like. I would expect
> it would still be good enough quality wise -- though I'll say that I
> think their move to "integrated headsets" was a very bad one.
Neither Merlin or Litespeed does stupid things like carbon or
integrated headsets anymore.
Pat
Henrik Münster
"Pat"<P...@starrynight.com> wrote:
> I keep waiting for somebody to mention Seven. Why not?
Because Seven ate nine.
--
Med venlig hilsen
Henrik Münster
Esbjerg
sally
@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com:
> I am soliciting opinions on the basic build quality of the major Ti
> frame builders.
Seven is the best.
Jay Beattie
> VeloJon <jprest...@comcast.net> wrote in news:1182367136.033960.236670
Is this a troll? -- Jay Beattie.
Jay Beattie
Ah, checked the preceeding posts. Now I see. I thought this would be
my opportunity to rant about Sevens, their ungodly price and claims to
magical characteristics. I guess I will have to leave that for
another time. -- Jay Beattie.
Mark
Strong
Indy Fab
Spectrum (Kellogg)
Lynskey (founders of Litespeed)
Eriksen (founder of Moots)
Of the three you mention I have affinity for the Moots. Everyone I
know with one would get another. The other builder of Ti that I really
like is Carl Strong. If I went Ti it would be one of these two
builders. Nothing wrong with the others though.
Mark
Tim McNamara
Henrik Münster <hen...@muenster.dk> wrote:
> In article <5dtqa0F...@mid.individual.net>
> "Pat"<P...@starrynight.com> wrote:
>
> > I keep waiting for somebody to mention Seven. Why not?
>
> Because Seven ate nine.
I thought six turned out to be nine.
dusto...@mac.com
Colin Campbell
respected builder, and the bike developed a crack at the seat tube /
bottom bracket junction. They quickly repaired and completely repainted
the frame, and I had no further problems with build quality.
On the other hand, the frame was a 63cm, and made with Scandium tubing,
and it would vibrate like a piano wire sometimes on fast downhills. I
now look at, but no longer ride, that frame. Maybe the builder could or
should have known that Scandium wasn't robust enough in that frame size,
and for my weight.
Qui si parla Campagnolo
Finest welds are Moots, hands down. Strong engineering go into tube
design as well, from the 3 main to the strays. For a small company
that 'does one thing and does it well'(ti frames), I don't think you
can find a nicer ti frame. No eyeweash, gadgets(carbon plugs are just
plain dummmm), no big decals or funny shapes that do nuthin'...BUT I'm
biased as I have been selling Moots for almost a decade, could sell
many others, but choose Moots.
russell...@yahoo.com
I'd attribute the crack to random chance. Not build quality. Do you
expect the builder to do some kind of x-ray procedure on each piece of
steel looking for microscopic cracks in the tubes? Spokes will break
for Mr. Brandt too if they have an internal flaw.
>
> On the other hand, the frame was a 63cm, and made with Scandium tubing,
> and it would vibrate like a piano wire sometimes on fast downhills. I
> now look at, but no longer ride, that frame. Maybe the builder could or
> should have known that Scandium wasn't robust enough in that frame size,
> and for my weight.- Hide quoted text -
Maybe the builder should have known this problem. Not much point
building a quality frame that performed poorly. But did you ask/
request/demand a super lightweight frame? Hard for a service provider
to refuse a customer.
>
> - Show quoted text -
andre...@aol.com
We are all such traitors. As soon as he quits the website we forget
about him. i know that he was a stubborn Bush supporter but, hell
nobody is perfect. Check out habanero cycles. Everyone here has very
high regards for those ti frames which, incidentally, are very cheap.
Andres
Lou Holtman
Jay Beattie
Like $2K below most of the designer Ti frames. Seems like a no-
brainer for a normal person. Normal meaning a non-racer who is not
narcissistic or deluded about his needs. -- Jay Beattie.
russell...@yahoo.com
>
> - Show quoted text -
For Carl Strong, yes since he is a one man shop. For Spectrum/Tom
Kellogg, NO. He tells you what size a bike you need and sends the
dimensions to the Litespeed factory (now building Merlin too) for
their robots/people, etc. to weld. I would doubt it with Lynskey.
His family ran the titanium tubing company that started making the
Litespeed frames decades ago as an after thought/addition to the main
aerospace military business. I think he was an owner/manager, not an
owner/welder. Doubt he was on the factory floor welding Litespeed
bikes together. He just sold them and told his factory welders to
weld them, cut the tubing, etc. Independent Fabrications is a small
factory, like Seven, Serotta. Many different people doing different
operations.
russell...@yahoo.com
But if you can buy a Litespeed for the same price as a comparable
Habanero, which would you buy? I made my choice.
Moots, Litespeed, Merlin, Seven, Serotta, etc. are probably not
considered side by side with Airborne, Habanero, etc.
Pat
>
> Moots, Litespeed, Merlin, Seven, Serotta, etc. are probably not
> considered side by side with Airborne, Habanero, etc.
Explain?
>
doug....@gmail.com
Heh-heh -- that person is riding a nishiki or centurion.
Mark
> > Indy Fab
> > Spectrum (Kellogg)
> > Lynskey (founders of Litespeed)
> > Eriksen (founder of Moots)
>
> Are those guys welding the frames themselves?
> Lou
Strong does. I don't know if Eriksen wields his own torch but he did a
nice job getting good welders at Moots so imagine he'll do the same
for his new endeavor. Kellogg shops out his Ti but the bikes are still
quite nice.
The other shops have multiple guys that work on each frame but that
isn't a big deal to me. For welding Ti what you really want to know is
proper penetration of the structural pass. The stuff you see on the
outside that everyone goo-goos about is the cosmetic second pass which
is meant only to look pretty. Anyway, if it's important to know that
one guy did all the work on a frame of any material then the choices
get pretty small and you are going to pay artisan prices.
Strong has quite a following and the frames I've seen from his shop
are quite nice and the owners seem very happy with them. He also has
some nice tooling from his days as a medium throughput builder for
other brands. His Ti work isn't cheap but you know who to complain to
if you are not happy. Again, if it were my money in Ti it would be
Moots or Strong. I'm riding carbon (Calfee) right now but when it is
time for the next bike it'll be one of these two shops that gets the
nod. Unless I go back to steel and ask Peter Weigle build another one
for me. I kind of miss the beauty and road feel of properly lugged
steel.
Good luck to the OP with his Ti quest.
Mark
Mark
in a while. Clark-Kent is another name from way back. The Colorado
gang would remember them.
Mark
bfd
"Pat" <P...@starrynight.com> wrote in message
news:5e0blrF...@mid.individual.net...
>
>>
>> Moots, Litespeed, Merlin, Seven, Serotta, etc. are probably not
>> considered side by side with Airborne, Habanero, etc.
>
> Explain?
>>
Johnny Sunset
> ...
> We are all such traitors. As soon as he [Mark Hickey] quits the website we forget
> about him. i know that he was a stubborn Bush supporter but, hell
> nobody is perfect. Check out habanero cycles. Everyone here has very
> high regards for those ti frames which, incidentally, are very cheap.
Er, this is a Usenet group, not a website.
I understand Habanero's pull strongly to the right. :)
On a more serious note, for what its worth, Habaneros are built in a
totalitarian fascist county (that pretends to be communist).
If I get a new upright road bike, it will cost and weigh a bit more
and be made out steel, but it will be made by people who are almost my
neighbors: <http://www.gunnarbikes.com/>.
--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful
Colin Campbell
absolutely no hesitation about fixing it. I wasn't bothered by the
occurrence except for the few days I had to ride an older bike.
>
>
>> On the other hand, the frame was a 63cm, and made with Scandium tubing,
>> and it would vibrate like a piano wire sometimes on fast downhills. I
>> now look at, but no longer ride, that frame. Maybe the builder could or
>> should have known that Scandium wasn't robust enough in that frame size,
>> and for my weight.- Hide quoted text -
>
> Maybe the builder should have known this problem. Not much point
> building a quality frame that performed poorly. But did you ask/
> request/demand a super lightweight frame? Hard for a service provider
> to refuse a customer.
>
when I was ready for "something newer and better", Scandium is what he
suggested to me. I'm on good terms with the man, who is now
semi-retired. That bike, by the way, came out at 20.25 lbs. I think
the previous steel bike was around 22.5 lbs, so I was pretty happy.
I bought a Trek 5200 in 2003 which I upgraded to the Campy Record
components and Campy / Mavic wheels I had put on the Scandium bike, and
it weighed 19.75 lbs. A Trek 5200 I bought last August was also
upgraded to Campy Record Triple, but uses Campy compatible Bontrager
wheels, and it weighs 18.6 lbs.
That 1995 steel bike with Chorus is still the fastest bike I've owned,
however...
None of these bikes has a strong enough engine!
steveb
Yes, there are bad frames around.
<russell...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1182368140....@q69g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
Donga
>
> - Show quoted text -
Meh, I've done even better pricewise - three Litespeeds and an
Airborne second-hand. I figure I'm better off with a used Ti frame
that will keep on lasting, than a new one of another material that
will go downhill from the time of purchase. All are lovely to ride and
look very fine. I especially like the bling detailing of the chainstay
yoke on the Airborne Black Widow. The welds aren't as nice as the
Litespeed, but I really don't care, as I doubt it has a real effect
for my needs.
Donga
Bruce Gilbert
"Donga" <idomybestw...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1182500883.7...@i13g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
Airborne met its demise due to really bad company management and policies.
The product was not the problem. In fact, for the price most Airborne were a
great value.
Bruce
Friday
I have a ti mountain bike frame made by Changda, Airbornes supplier, it
has performed flawlessly for several years. I've put it out to pasture
because I've finally moved on to disk brakes and the frame doesn't have
the mounts. Nothing wrong with Chinese ti.
Friday
russell...@yahoo.com
You actually need an explanation? Wow. Internet bicyclists.
Do people seriously shopping for a Lexus, BMW, Mercedes, Cadillac,
Jaguar, Volvo, Lincoln, Porsche, Audi consider buying a Chevy, Kia,
Hyundai, Mazda, Ford, etc.? If you are looking at houses priced at $Z
dollars, you don't look at houses priced at $ZZZ dollars. If you buy
your shoes at Wal-Mart, you don't look at Allen Edmond,
Johnston&Murphy, etc.
russell...@yahoo.com
And if the Airborne and Litespeed, used or new, are comparable design,
style, whatever and the same price, which will you choose?
> I figure I'm better off with a used Ti frame
> that will keep on lasting, than a new one of another material that
> will go downhill from the time of purchase.
Internet bicyclists have gotten it into their heads that titanium is
indestructible and will last forever. Titanium frames break too. I
would guess many frame builders with far more knowledge than you would
argue their older frames have not gone downhill. Does a Richard Sachs
or JP Weigle or Mooney frame go downhill? I don't think my Waterford
has gone downhill from me riding it.
All are lovely to ride and
> look very fine. I especially like the bling detailing of the chainstay
> yoke on the Airborne Black Widow. The welds aren't as nice as the
> Litespeed, but I really don't care, as I doubt it has a real effect
> for my needs.
Poor welds on the surface may be an indication of improper welding
technique and poor penetration. The joint may not be as strong as a
properly welded joint. Attention to the small details is the best
indication of the quality of the entire project.
>
> Donga- Hide quoted text -
Jay Beattie
What is an internet bicyclist?
You start with theoretical shoppers looking in a particular price
range, but you do not explain why they are looking in that price
range. Is it because the exceptional quality of the product justifies
its price, or is it just narcissim? Allen Edmond shoes, for example,
are not that expensive -- less than a pair of Sidis if you buy them on
sale at Nordstroms. And they last a long time, particularly if you re-
sole them a lot. (Hey, for me, these are like uniform shoes).
On the other hand, the people looking at Volvos and Jaguars should
look at Fords because they are about to buy one anyway. Or look at a
Toyota, Subaru or any number of other cars that are just as solid and
reliable and much less money and that hold their value (unlike Jags).
Thousands will be lost the moment a Jag drives out of the dealership.
Buying an uber-expensive bicycle is like buying a Jag instead of a
Camry or Subaru or some equally (or more) reliable and less expensive
car. If someone can show me that there is a significant weight
difference between a $4K Seven and a $2K Litespeed or a $1K Habanero
-- or some other significant difference (besides status or cachet)
that justifies the price, then I will stand corrected. Otherwise,
dropping that kind of dough on a Seven (for example) is just showing
off. I know that showing-off has been elevated to an art form in our
current society, but I am one of those people who still finds it
offensive. -- Jay Beattie.
Pat
>> > Moots, Litespeed, Merlin, Seven, Serotta, etc. are probably not
>> > considered side by side with Airborne, Habanero, etc.
>>
>> Explain?
>
> You actually need an explanation? Wow. Internet bicyclists.
>
> Do people seriously shopping for a Lexus, BMW, Mercedes, Cadillac,
> Jaguar, Volvo, Lincoln, Porsche, Audi consider buying a Chevy, Kia,
> Hyundai, Mazda, Ford, etc.? If you are looking at houses priced at $Z
> dollars, you don't look at houses priced at $ZZZ dollars. If you buy
> your shoes at Wal-Mart, you don't look at Allen Edmond,
> Johnston&Murphy, etc.
I buy for quality first. Price is 'way down the line. And, yes, people
seriously shopping for anything worthwhile look at the quality of it first.
Pat in TX
Donga
<russellseat...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Poor welds on the surface may be an indication of improper welding
> technique and poor penetration. The joint may not be as strong as a
> properly welded joint. Attention to the small details is the best
> indication of the quality of the entire project.
Maybe maybe maybe. It depends on your risk aversion - spend a thousand
for a tiny risk, or point the wheels downhill and go for it? Far
greater risks arise in the riding than in the bike. Before buying, I
found no reports of Airbornes failing and that was good enough for me.
I'm not obsessed by mini-risks and perfection and in return, got a
great bike at a fine price.
Donga
Donga
> Airborne met its demise due to really bad company management and policies.
> The product was not the problem. In fact, for the price most Airborne were a
> great value.
>
> Bruce-
I was sorry to see them go. I found their website to be very useable
and I communicated with them about buying a new bike. They were
faultlessly responsive and cooperative. The range of options for the
frames left no gaps.
donga
John Forrest Tomlinson
wrote:
>I have a ti mountain bike frame made by Changda,
That's a great name.
--
JT
****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************
andre...@aol.com
Actually, the lower end lightspeed models that may have been priced
comparably with the habaneros did not seem to offer any advantage. The
high end lightspeed models offer "suppossed" advantages. The only
lightspeed model that I like is the classic.
I wonder if you were able to get one of the top lightspeed models for
the same price as an habanero. If so, I would consider the classic for
$700. I still wouldn't buy the other models cause I don't like the
bends.
I think that the classic is the only thing that lightspeed produces
that can compete with habaneros, but it is overpriced. I do like some
of the merlins though.
Andres
Donga
> On Jun 22, 7:04 am, "russellseat...@yahoo.com"
> I think that the classic is the only thing that lightspeed produces
> that can compete with habaneros, but it is overpriced. I do like some
> of the merlins though.
I've just built up a 2nd hand Classic as a singlespeed and it is
SWEET.
Donga
Donga
> would guess many frame builders with far more knowledge than you would
> argue their older frames have not gone downhill. Does a Richard Sachs
> or JP Weigle or Mooney frame go downhill? I don't think my Waterford
> has gone downhill from me riding it.
Check the paintjob - my 1995 polished Ti frame still passes for new.
Nor do I need to protect it from corrosion, let alone have a "rain"
bike.
donga
Ted Bennett
> What is an internet bicyclist?
>
> You start with theoretical shoppers looking in a particular price
> range, but you do not explain why they are looking in that price
> range. Is it because the exceptional quality of the product justifies
> its price, or is it just narcissim? Allen Edmond shoes, for example,
> are not that expensive -- less than a pair of Sidis if you buy them on
> sale at Nordstroms. And they last a long time, particularly if you re-
> sole them a lot. (Hey, for me, these are like uniform shoes).
>
> On the other hand, the people looking at Volvos and Jaguars should
> look at Fords because they are about to buy one anyway. Or look at a
> Toyota, Subaru or any number of other cars that are just as solid and
> reliable and much less money and that hold their value (unlike Jags).
> Thousands will be lost the moment a Jag drives out of the dealership.
>
> Buying an uber-expensive bicycle is like buying a Jag instead of a
> Camry or Subaru or some equally (or more) reliable and less expensive
> car. If someone can show me that there is a significant weight
> difference between a $4K Seven and a $2K Litespeed or a $1K Habanero
> -- or some other significant difference (besides status or cachet)
> that justifies the price, then I will stand corrected. Otherwise,
> dropping that kind of dough on a Seven (for example) is just showing
> off. I know that showing-off has been elevated to an art form in our
> current society, but I am one of those people who still finds it
> offensive. -- Jay Beattie.
I proudly stand beside Jay on that last-sentence comment, but then, I
also live in Portland. I have noticed that drivers of 100,000 dollar
cars and trucks do not take kindly to observations about shameful
displays of wealth.
Ted
--
Ted Bennett
dusto...@mac.com
> On the other hand, the people looking at Volvos and Jaguars should
> look at Fords because they are about to buy one anyway. Or look at a
> Toyota, Subaru or any number of other cars that are just as solid and
> reliable and much less money and that hold their value (unlike Jags).
> Thousands will be lost the moment a Jag drives out of the dealership.
"Smells better when new". And, being able to afford the repairs is
part of the braggin'. Come on, JB, get your status sensors in order
here!
> Buying an uber-expensive bicycle is like buying a Jag instead of a
> Camry or Subaru or some equally (or more) reliable and less expensive
> car. If someone can show me that there is a significant weight
> difference between a $4K Seven and a $2K Litespeed or a $1K Habanero
> -- or some other significant difference (besides status or cachet)
> that justifies the price, then I will stand corrected. Otherwise,
> dropping that kind of dough on a Seven (for example) is just showing
> off. I know that showing-off has been elevated to an art form in our
> current society, but I am one of those people who still finds it
> offensive.
I've wondered at the smooth-but-slightly undercut welds present on
some of the 'spensive Ti bikes I've seen. That's a cosmetic second
pass? This old retired, formerly qualified production Mig/Tig sheet
metal welder (not tubing and not "aerospace") wonders at this
practice-- the Emperor needs to hire better welders? I read Peter's
comments on weld quality earlier in the thread; next time I see Mr.
Moots on a ride, I'll get my reading/inspecting glasses out and look
closer.
Well... art form? From the time-honored fancy lugs, dropouts, and
seatstay "clusters", to wiggledy chainstays, barber-pole seat tubes,
three-tube color schemes (and beyond), to oversized, ovalized, diamond
shaped, crimped, otherwise-tortured tubes and stays, and further, to
Newsboy-style curved Ti tubes (a real statement intended, there,
IMHO): artisans like to show off, too <g>.
I saw a true custom Seven seven or eight years ago, when people were
still impressed by Ti, that had tubing shape/size/length "exercises",
plus a non-traditional layout IRT stays and top tube. Not exactly
beautiful to behold, but certainly different (even from a distance),
and presenting, perhaps, the argument that it was built for function
("better bike engineering"), conventional framebuilding "limitations"
having been surpassed. At least, that's what I read into the
presentation <g>.
I don't know how it rode; it was a Record-equipped, low-mileage bike
shop owner's bike that was for sale <g>.
All moot (see above) now, farbon is better and more expensive, and
better. --D-y
A Muzi
>>>> considered side by side with Airborne, Habanero, etc.
>>> Explain?
>> You actually need an explanation? Wow. Internet bicyclists.
>> Do people seriously shopping for a Lexus, BMW, Mercedes, Cadillac,
>> Jaguar, Volvo, Lincoln, Porsche, Audi consider buying a Chevy, Kia,
>> Hyundai, Mazda, Ford, etc.? If you are looking at houses priced at $Z
>> dollars, you don't look at houses priced at $ZZZ dollars. If you buy
>> your shoes at Wal-Mart, you don't look at Allen Edmond,
>> Johnston&Murphy, etc.
Pat wrote:
> I buy for quality first. Price is 'way down the line. And, yes, people
> seriously shopping for anything worthwhile look at the quality of it first.
According to the radio ads we hear, many people look at "What can I get
for 349 per month" first.
drivechicago.com ads : "look for a car based on your monthly payment"
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
Mike Krueger
When Litespeed was refurbishing trade-ins and reselling them on their
pre-owned bikes website, I purchased a 1999 Classic with a LOOK fork
and a Chris King headset for $830. There wasn't a mark on it, and
Litespeed also supplied me with a lifetime warranty on the frame, just
as on a new bike. I have since put about 9,000 mi. on this bike in 2
years, and I think it was the best $830 I've ever spent.
A Muzi
>> I have a ti mountain bike frame made by Changda,
John Forrest Tomlinson wrote:
> That's a great name.
When Nick Andrade started Giant USA he came to visit with a great
ground-floor offer. I replied "Suburban mom comes home with bike in
station wagon, neighbor asks "what kind of bike?" "A Giant!" I was of
the opinion that would never fly, so I passed.
I was very wrong.
When Bevel Hogg explained that his new venture "Trek" means 'to be a
little hungry' in Afrikaans I also looked at him like he was nuts.
Henry Ford's neighbors probably felt the name of that Ford boy wouldn't
sell either.
Donga
>
> - Show quoted text -
Yes, even my Scottish friend bought a bike (Tuscany) through that
business - and he knows a good deal when he sees one!
Donga
Michael Warner
> When Nick Andrade started Giant USA he came to visit with a great
> ground-floor offer. I replied "Suburban mom comes home with bike in
> station wagon, neighbor asks "what kind of bike?" "A Giant!" I was of
> the opinion that would never fly, so I passed.
>
> I was very wrong.
I think it's a better name for a mountain bike than a road bike, but I've
gotten over it. What about "Felt"? Much worse.
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Home page: http://members.westnet.com.au/mvw
Mark
> I've wondered at the smooth-but-slightly undercut welds present on
> some of the 'spensive Ti bikes I've seen. That's a cosmetic second
> pass?
Here is a whole bunch of dialog on Ti welding and bike frames: