Mr. Vaughters
Mike
people write about the french cuffed cashmere turtleneck king -
Jonathon Vaughters - and his firing of Matt White and alleged
"blackmailing" by Lowe and I have to ask all of you if everyone
involved in pro bike racing are insane weird paranoid schizos. The
worst is the "writers" defending Vaughters as this smart square
glasses wearing, french cuff shirted professional, when the guy is
really a disgraced 90's era notorious and quasi-admitted doper. His
IM's with Andreu were great, like "wow we all took dope, and Lance
took the most didn't he? "
The cycling media - like Velonews - blame Lowe too, I mean who wants
to get PAID for working according to a contract mutually signed?
Vaughters is pontificating about his "pedantry" that involves the
stupid dot-com era buzzword TRANSPARENCY and his PROFESSIONALISM...
But on Bicycling.com, he is talking about FRYING and EATING his own
testicles, how professional is that image?
He fired a well respected director and family man for an
administrative era that he admits that he also made - despite
Vaughters claiming they had "team doctors" the riders were told to
hire any crazy Dr. Mabuse type character they could find for BLOOD
TESTS, Vaughters just looked at the data and missed the letterhead,
except for when he wanted to make an example of White...
Vaughters is doing all this because he was mad about Australian
poaching, and just still super mad that Wiggins was poached by SKY.
Vaughters couldn't afford Wiggins, he needs to hire local Boulder
dopers to fill his roster.
When Vaughters rode for Comptel he was known as the skinniest dope
taking climber in the USA. Today he is the voice of morality - weird.
Now he is the voice of morality, how is this saga not properly
analyzed more closely by anyone who ever race a bike beyond the cat. 3
level?
What happened to his Boulder based real estate empire scam that he
started when he "quit" cycling?
Yes, he looks super nerdy, intelligent and sophisticated in a bow tie,
but anyone who knows this guy has realized his is a paranoid freak
with a chip on his skinny ass shoulders.
Ask Mike Creed or Matt Decanio about Vaughters.
The US cycling establishment is still drinking the LA/JV/Johan
Bruyneel KOOL-AID,
despite over a decade of evidence that they are all the main culprits
in transforming pro cycling into a very poor imitation of WWF
professional wrestling.
If you're gonna throw Landis under the bus and overboard to the
sharks, let's include these other sinners too, or just call it even.
Boycott Garmin.
Seriously, Vaughters is a freaking psycopath. He threatened to fry and
eat his own testicles on bicycling.com, like some weird German
personal ad ball-eater - that dude wore a black turtleneck too.
Brad Anders
about psychopaths.
ilan
I didn't appreciate Vaughter's actions because it appears that he
waited for the end of the Tour Down Under to fire White, if he was as
intransigent as he claimed, he would have done it in the middle of the
race. So, he still used White to his own ends, when it suited him.
Secondly, there is a question of American vs. European approach to
employment. Here in Europe, firing someone is a big deal because you
understand that you are cutting someone off from his livelyhood,
someone who may have to support a family, so it should not be taken
lightly. For that reason, I don't agree with Vaughters' statement that
every rule violation should lead to the most extreme sanction. Maybe
the current doping inquisition hysteria is to blame.....
-ilan
Choppy Warburton
training alone allows the mind to wander and fantasize and the time
spent training with others allows the memes to propagate.
Fred on a stick
> Secondly, there is a question of American vs. European approach to
> employment. Here in Europe, firing someone is a big deal because you
> understand that you are cutting someone off from his livelyhood,
> someone who may have to support a family, so it should not be taken
> lightly.
Dumbass,
Here in the US, cutting someone off from his livelihood is considered a
feature, not a bug.
rickhopkins
> Try reading your posting back to yourself the next time you're musing
> about psychopaths.
You sure Mike is not Landis - the psychosis appears weirdly similar.
Fred Flintstein
Check out his work here:
http://bicycling.com/blogs/boulderreport/2011/01/26/lowe-point-for-garmin/
Fred Flintstein
Fred Flintstein
As I read this I thought about Alexi Grewal coming out of retirement.
I went and read some of the stuff on his blog. Some of it is pretty
cool. Some of it is... pretty interesting stuff that you would expect
from a guy like him. Especially when he veers off into religion.
I wonder if Lafferty has been spending a lot of time training alone.
Fred Flintstein
Beloved Fred No. 1
> I wonder if Lafferty has been spending a lot of time training alone.
Is training alone a new euphemism ?
Mike Jacoubowsky
news:68ednV-weoyyZ9_Q...@giganews.com...
The article in question seems to support Vaughters, but then backtracks in
the final paragraph. Ultimately, Vaughters is doing the same thing Trek did
in dealing with Greg LeMond, when Greg threatened to expose all manner of
shady things relating to Lance. Trek did the nuclear option, putting
everything out in public first. The good, the bad, everything. Completely
pulled the rug out from under Greg's attempt to gain the upper hand.
Doing so systematically helps prevent further such issues down the road.
The fact that Vaughters may be hypocritical based upon his own past is
irrelevant. He has said this is how things are going to run on his team, and
that's what he's doing .Vaughters has never claimed that he's looking for
redemption of past sins. All he's doing is running a team, with relative
transparency and strict rules.
=========
I commend Garmin for its commitment to following its team rules. I realize
it's a slippery slope from little omissions or coverups to big ones. And
certainly, once Hardie made money demands that's the end of polite
negotiations; it's now down to the lawyers.
But as a sage once said, "What's so funny 'bout a little peace, love and
understanding?" A dash of that, on both sides, could've prevented this whole
sorry episode. Failing that, an alternate solution: Whitey, JV, Lowe and
Hardie. Locked room. And four of these. At least they can work out their
frustrations.
=========
--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
Frederick the Great
<1b147475-b772-41c8...@a28g2000prb.googlegroups.com>,
Mike <mtsch...@gmail.com> wrote:
[...]
Great rant. Could have been edited and formatted
for clarity and ease of reading. Nobody likes JV.
His children call him Coke bottle. His wife calls
him `Oh, it's you.'
--
Old Fritz
Frederick the Great
"Mike Jacoubowsky" <Mi...@ChainReaction.com> wrote:
> "Fred Flintstein" <bob.sc...@sbcremoveglobal.net> wrote in message
> news:68ednV-weoyyZ9_Q...@giganews.com...
> > On 1/28/2011 11:02 AM, rickhopkins wrote:
> >> On Jan 28, 6:28 am, Brad Anders<pband...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> Try reading your posting back to yourself the next time you're musing
> >>> about psychopaths.
> >>
> >> You sure Mike is not Landis - the psychosis appears weirdly similar.
> >
> > Check out his work here:
> >
> > http://bicycling.com/blogs/boulderreport/2011/01/26/lowe-point-for-garmin/
> >
> > Fred Flintstein
>
> The article in question seems to support Vaughters, but then backtracks in
> the final paragraph. Ultimately, Vaughters is doing the same thing Trek did
> in dealing with Greg LeMond, when Greg threatened to expose all manner of
> shady things relating to Lance. Trek did the nuclear option, putting
> everything out in public first. The good, the bad, everything. Completely
> pulled the rug out from under Greg's attempt to gain the upper hand.
>
> Doing so systematically helps prevent further such issues down the road.
>
> The fact that Vaughters may be hypocritical based upon his own past is
> irrelevant. He has said this is how things are going to run on his team, and
> that's what he's doing .Vaughters has never claimed that he's looking for
> redemption of past sins. All he's doing is running a team, with relative
> transparency and strict rules.
---I am shocked to find my riders going to strange blood doctors.
---Your winnings, Sir.
--
Old Fritz
Mike
> Try reading your posting back to yourself the next time you're musing
> about psychopaths.
Hi Brad,
Thanks for the advice.
You don't know me, but I rode with you a few times in the late 90's,
maybe an Alto Velo ride, or BBC ride,
Maynard Hershon was there - he was way cooler than you, you struck me
as a total douchebag then, talking about how you were friends with
Hampsten or something like that as you got dropped on the first climb.
I never saw you after the first three miles of a ride.
Today, I'm sure you are the same, probably bragging about how you know
Mr. 90210 sideburns and cashmere turtleneck man Vaughters these days,
I'm sure of that. You made me laugh though, one of these cycling
"hanger-ons" that felt self-important by simply knowing a pro
cyclist.
Keep on keeping on, maybe in ten years you can talk about knowing
Taylor Phinney, but you have to be at least 94 years old by now..Did
you ever actually race a bike or do you just like guys in spandex?
Mike
RicodJour
Hey, Mick. I couldn't get by the visual assault of your air-sucked-
out-of-the-room, who-needs-white-space style in your first post, and
the second is no better. Though it is shorter (thanks!). Since your
posting visuals leave me feeling like somebody poked me in the eyes
with a stick, I couldn't drum up the intestinal fortitude to read
whatever it is you wrote. Sorry. I'm sure they were fine posts.
Please revise and resubmit, dumbass.
R
Mike
> Hey, Mick. I couldn't get by the visual assault of your air-sucked-
> out-of-the-room, who-needs-white-space style in your first post, and
> the second is no better. Though it is shorter (thanks!). Since your
> posting visuals leave me feeling like somebody poked me in the eyes
> with a stick, I couldn't drum up the intestinal fortitude to read
> whatever it is you wrote. Sorry. I'm sure they were fine posts.
> Please revise and resubmit, dumbass.
Professor,
Thanks for the literary advice,
you called me out on my grammar and writing style - RBR is a little
like the New Yorker.
My postings, you read them all, stop lying.
I am half Irish, thanks for the unintentional racial slur.
My name is
Mike, not Mick,
but I'm positive I can drink you under the table.
The dumbass is not so original, I got that since the mid 90's when the
maestro of dumbass - Kurgin Gringo-oni called me out as a newbie and I
had to
remind that I'm nobody new around here. Ken Papai was another one I
had to remind that I saw him doing the Cat 4/5 master crits with his
belly
hanging out and he was nobody to be calling me out.
So let's compare resumes shall we professor?
- I was a mediocre cat. 1 for five years - what races did you do? I
won a pro race. How many Belgian kermesses have you suffered through?
- I was high school english teacher for four years. Your paragraph is
lovely, but my rant is much much better. Maybe you can remind Jose
Saramago that you need to break a paragraph ever 2 sentences for
retards like you who can't read, much less write. I bet you like
literature
like the DaVinci code with the one page chapters too, much easier to
pretend to read.
- I have written multiple at the backs for velonews and pieces for
PEZ. Have you written anything but dumbass postings on RBR and other
troll-i-rific venues that allows any fred to pretend he understands
pro cycling?
- I'm a professional translator, translating four novels and dozens of
articles and essays. I cut paragraphs for a living, I leave my own
alone.
So let's stop talking about me, and talk about you,
Let's see:
you learned how to write dumbass on RBR, highly original,
but who are you? Are you anonymous, or are you a stupid old Fred like
Brad Anders, that I had to listen to droning on in group rides about
his winery rides in Italy and his connections with Hampsten and
Armstrong. Ick.
Before commenting, race a bike and get off Vaughters FRIED BALLS, like
the Lance-o-philes of the past, you make real cyclists uncomfortable
with your ridiculous sycophantic paragraphs.
Finally, my postings aren't visual, and the image of Vaughter's fried
balls are obviously something
poking YOU in the eye - I bet you've had some balls poking you in the
eyes before - which is weird and uncomfortable for me to even
address, but whatever,
people like bike racing for all kinds of reasons I guess.
Your friend forever,
Mike Schatzman
Fred Flintstein
> - I was high school english teacher for four years.
Jesus Fucking Christ!
We have people here that write better than you in their
second language.
Fred Flintstein
A. Dumas
Hey! I resemble that remark.
Phil H
wrote:
http://www.pezcyclingnews.com/?pg=fullstory&id=7015&status=True&catname=Latest%20News
The other part of that is, how long would they last up in front of 30
high school students 5 days a week?
Phil H
RicodJour
> On Jan 29, 6:43 am, Fred Flintstein <bob.schwa...@sbcREMOVEglobal.net>
> wrote:
>
> > On 1/29/2011 1:28 AM, Mike wrote:
>
> > > - I was high school english teacher for four years.
>
> > Jesus Fucking Christ!
>
> > We have people here that write better than you in their
> > second language.
>
> > Fred Flintstein
>
>
> The other part of that is, how long would they last up in front of 30
> high school students 5 days a week?
>
> Phil H
Oh, so the guy can write well (when the editor rewrites it). Nice to
know.
R
Fred
> - I was a mediocre cat. 1 for five years - what races did you do? I
> won a pro race. How many Belgian kermesses have you suffered through?
> Your friend forever,
> Mike Schatzman
A mediocre cat 1 in Albuquerque back in the day?? Wow... here's a
tip: you shouldn't exactly expect anyone to be impressed. Okay,
maybe your mom is proud, but other than her, n'ah.
Fred
Mike Jacoubowsky
Hi Brad,
Thanks for the advice.
You don't know me, but I rode with you a few times in the late 90's,
maybe an Alto Velo ride, or BBC ride,
Maynard Hershon was there - he was way cooler than you, you struck me
as a total douchebag then, talking about how you were friends with
Hampsten or something like that as you got dropped on the first climb.
I never saw you after the first three miles of a ride.
Whew. I was worried I was next, then noticed the time line. Way after I was
dead & gone from racing.
Nice rant, a bit long-winded, a bit personal, maybe a bit over the top.
Naming names, this is reminding me of the days Roger (someone help me out
here, blanking on his last name, strong rider, tall, opinionated even by rbr
standards... last name started with an S?) hung out here.
Many of us are fighting the mental battle of figuring out if we're a
has-been or never-was. Nobody's immune, and noboy here can really claim to
have been at the very top. Well, except that somebody said BL believes Lance
monitors cesspools like this. Lance, if you're listening, first, you may or
may not be doping but you certainly are a dope for hanging out here. Second,
unless you're going to post binaries of your mom, at least half the people
here won't care that you're here.
--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA
"Mike" <mtsch...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:7adedd98-085a-495c...@q40g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
Phil H
>
> - Show quoted text -
There wasn't an editor when he took his content teaching cert exam.
Probably more correct than anything you'd see in pez but hey. I'm
assuming you're picking on someone else due to the Lafferty-free
weekend.
Phil H
Plano Dude
Phil,
It wasn't exactly unprovoked.
Phil H
>
> - Show quoted text -
This is rbr, it isn't possible to write anything without provoking
someone. He fits right in and that's why I hang out here and not
rec.bike.sunday school :)
Phil H
Fred Flintstein
I think English is Ilan Vardi's second language. Not
certain about that though.
With you it could be your third or fourth. Same with
BART, although he hasn't been around recently.
I checked my copy of The Sweat of the Gods to see if
Benjo did his own translation. He didn't. But he could
write for Pez.
Fred Flintstein
Frederick the Great
<26eb4b34-f378-45fe...@8g2000prb.googlegroups.com>,
Phil H <phol...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jan 29, 10:45 am, RicodJour <ricodj...@worldemail.com> wrote:
> > On Jan 29, 12:08 pm, Phil H <pholma...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > On Jan 29, 6:43 am, Fred Flintstein <bob.schwa...@sbcREMOVEglobal.net>
> > > wrote:
> >
> > > > On 1/29/2011 1:28 AM, Mike wrote:
> >
> > > > > - I was high school english teacher for four years.
> >
> > > > Jesus Fucking Christ!
> >
> > > > We have people here that write better than you in their
> > > > second language.
> >
> > > > Fred Flintstein
> >
> > >http://www.pezcyclingnews.com/?pg=fullstory&id=7015&status=True&catna...
> >
> > > The other part of that is, how long would they last up in front of 30
> > > high school students 5 days a week?
> >
> > > Phil H
> >
> > Oh, so the guy can write well (when the editor rewrites it). Nice to
> > know.
> >
> > R- Hide quoted text -
> >
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> There wasn't an editor when he took his content teaching cert exam.
Then why does he not make the effort here? Slumming?
> Probably more correct than anything you'd see in pez but hey. I'm
> assuming you're picking on someone else due to the Lafferty-free
> weekend.
We need excuses now?
--
Old Fritz
Brad Anders
Anton Berlin
> Many of us are fighting the mental battle of figuring out if we're a
> has-been or never-was. Nobody's immune, and noboy here can really claim to
> have been at the very top. Well, except that somebody said BL believes Lance
> monitors cesspools like this. Lance, if you're listening, first, you may or
> may not be doping but you certainly are a dope for hanging out here. Second,
> unless you're going to post binaries of your mom, at least half the people
> here won't care that you're here.
good point Mike
I think a lot of riders have come in here historically - including me
- that thought that others would be impressed with what they
accomplished in cycling but let's be realistic - I was not as good as
Sunny or J-me didn't race as long as Tilford, Moninger,Frey and
Bostick (know and trained, raced with them all) and none of those guys
are like my connections in LU where I can ride and hang out with some
of the top riders in the world - who admittedly aren't like the guy we
can't discuss for another 24 hours.
But then again who gives a fuck? Even if he was my best friend and
not the cheating self centered prick he is - that's him and I'm me.
And without the help of a needle and turning back the hands of time 2
decades cycling is just something fun to do. My VO2 max and power is
where these guys do recovery rides at and I'd still be dropped
today.
Just got back from 2 hour ride - 75ish in Texas and my gf is worn out
and sleeping on the couch. I'll make homemade pizza tonight (i'm
really damn good at it ) and watch a movie on the home theater.
Life is good.
Brad Anders
Leave Mike alone, just another angry ex Cat 1. Let him vent.
RicodJour
>
> Just got back from 2 hour ride - 75ish in Texas and my gf is worn out
> and sleeping on the couch. I'll make homemade pizza tonight (i'm
> really damn good at it ) and watch a movie on the home theater.
> Life is good.
My English muffin mini pizzas are the stuff of legend.
Life is good.
R
PS You can't call it a home theater unless it has over 20 seats and a
popcorn concession cart, you AV club poser. :)~
H. Fred Kveck
RicodJour <rico...@worldemail.com> wrote:
> On Jan 29, 5:01 pm, Anton Berlin <truth_88...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > Just got back from 2 hour ride - 75ish in Texas and my gf is worn out
> > and sleeping on the couch. I'll make homemade pizza tonight (i'm
> > really damn good at it ) and watch a movie on the home theater.
> > Life is good.
>
> My English muffin mini pizzas are the stuff of legend.
http://www.theawl.com/2010/01/half-baked-how-to-make-a-pizza
Brad Anders
> Mike, I remember you too. Kisses.
Thought you were someone else. No idea of who you are, other than
being someone psychotically concerned with Vaughter's turtleneck,
glasses, and facial hair.
Mike Jacoubowsky
news:30c2e3cf-0c71-47b3...@f36g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
You know what I accomplished while racing? The same thing I accomplish now
when I'm on my bike. Fun. I love being on a bike. Racing was an excuse for
spending time on a bike. That plus it was the only sport I wasn't completely
inept at. I think it's a normal thing to try and re-live and reinvent your
past as we get older, but instead of that being a bad thing, maybe we're
just trying to create a continuity in our lives, a connection between the
fun we had back then and the fun we should be having on our bikes now.
Doesn't that sound better than a bunch of middle-aged guys dreaming about
better days?
Besides, some things do get better as we get older. Strategically we've got
it all over the young punks. We know where to position ourselves, we know
exactly how a given rider telegraphs what he's about to do before he
actually does it, we understand that, if you don't start the ride out
strongly, you're likely to ride into it, while the young punks never seem to
recover from something going wrong. Basically, we're smarter and more
resilient. People associate getting older with being less able to cope with
adversity, but I think that's 100% wrong.
--
derf...@gmail.com
> No idea of who you are, other than
> being someone psychotically concerned with Vaughter's turtleneck,
> glasses, and facial hair.
Damn ... you should have led with that one. Only thing worse than
being an old, mediocre ex-cat 1 is being a completely forgettable,
old, mediocre, ex-cat 1.
Fred Fredburger
It's entertaining, but is it good pizza?
Anton Berlin
My screen is 120" - 4000 watts of JBL make it a neighborhood surround
system and although we've entertained as many as 40 at a time - it's
almost always just us.
( PS: popcorn carts are gay just as limited life size editions of
Marvel characters are)
As far as the pizza goes there's no way to argue the point via the
internet but other pizzaiolo and my travels have me thinking that I
make some of the best pizza in the world. (there's always opinion and
preference of course) Of the last 20 people that had my pizza 14 of
them said these exact words "this is the best pizza I've ever had in
my life" 5 of them said the same thing in as many words. One person
had tears in their eyes and was basically speechless. I get phone
calls and text messages at all odd hours from people that go back to
their favorite pizza place after having mine and are now angry at me
for ruining their enjoyment of pizza. Some of have accused me of
doing this intentionally and they're right. I sometimes cook for
people I don't like just to fuck up their pizza expectations for life
(cruel prick - i know )
The secret as any pizzaiolo will tell you is the dough. I've been
making bread for 20 + years from a parisian culture that was 153 years
old when I got it. I've been trained by one of the most well known
artisan bakers in the world only to advance my ability to make
pizza.
In the last month I've been to NYC twice to try several of the tier 1
makers with friends - Luzzo's, Modern Apizza, Una, Patsy's Frannys,
John's, Lombardi's and Di Fara - imho - none of them were within 20%
of mine. We went to Italy in the fall and out of the most well know
pizza places in the world only 1 in Naples ( Da Michele ) had
something more interesting than mine - mainly the sauce - the dough
like most neopolitans was undercooked and we left a huge amount of pie
on the table. They only make a marinara and the margarita (and I saw
a local get a bianco but it's not on the menu.) Additionally we found
a coal fired place north of Rome that makes an incredible non-napoli
style pizza. (closest to what we know as detroit style but very high
heat)
I've been making pizza in one form or another since I was a teenager -
25 years ago I was making it on pita bread and english muffins. It's
a long road - in the 10,000+ pizzas I've ever made or had I'd say that
I've had less than a dozen perfect 'bites'. 3 of them from two pizzas
I made about 2 months ago (margs) a few at Da Michele in Naples, two
weeks ago from a pie I made that's closest to an Alsatian tart, and
from memory a place in Sperlonga Italy and another in Milan.
Places I have yet to try but from friends comparisons I have been told
I am better - A16 in SF and Bianco in Phoenix.
I may not live up to Johnny's in Mt Vernon - some say Antico is
better than Varasano some not. Either way I've been compared better
than Antico 2x in the same week by different people.
I like pizza and am determined to continue to try to make the best in
the world. Someday I may go commercial but there are a lot of
challenges to doing what you can do for a dozen people to doing it for
hundreds. (day after day)
Apologies for the ramble - I've become like old fritz because the
subject became pizza. (grin)
Anton Berlin
<FredFredF...@Where.Are.The.Nachos> wrote:
> On 1/29/2011 3:11 PM, H. Fred Kveck wrote:
>
> > RicodJour<ricodj...@worldemail.com> wrote:
>
> >> On Jan 29, 5:01 pm, Anton Berlin<truth_88...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >>> Just got back from 2 hour ride - 75ish in Texas and my gf is worn out
> >>> and sleeping on the couch. I'll make homemade pizza tonight (i'm
> >>> really damn good at it ) and watch a movie on the home theater.
> >>> Life is good.
>
> >> My English muffin mini pizzas are the stuff of legend.
>
> >http://www.theawl.com/2010/01/half-baked-how-to-make-a-pizza
>
> It's entertaining, but is it good pizza?
I doubt that it could be too good. Good pizza involves a complicated
dough process - a live culture (like those used in sourdoughs) as an
example my dough goes through 5 distinct processes that take 4 days.
If i want pizza on Friday I start making the dough Monday night.
Lastly good pizza needs much higher heat than listed in the article.
Could it be better than the commercial mass produced stuff ? Yes
perhaps - worth the effort? Probably better to try something local
then to hassle with a bad recipe.
Brad Anders
it the best? Who knows? But it's definitely worth the trip. My other
favorite place to eat here is Barrio Cafe, the best Mexican restaurant
I've been to.
Simply Fred
>> No idea of who you are, other than
>> being someone psychotically concerned with Vaughter's turtleneck,
>> glasses, and facial hair.
derF...@gmail.com wrote:
> Damn ... you should have led with that one. Only thing worse than
> being an old, mediocre ex-cat 1 is being a completely forgettable,
> old, mediocre, ex-cat 1.
All of which is contributing to Amit's seminal flu.. er thesis on the
role of sports in self esteem in fatty masters societies.
Simply Fred
> I doubt that it could be too good. Good pizza involves a complicated
> dough process - a live culture (like those used in sourdoughs) as an
> example my dough goes through 5 distinct processes that take 4 days.
> If i want pizza on Friday I start making the dough Monday night.
> Lastly good pizza needs much higher heat than listed in the article.
> Could it be better than the commercial mass produced stuff ? Yes
> perhaps - worth the effort? Probably better to try something local
> then to hassle with a bad recipe.
The prototypical rbr FM would be thinking of food while Paris Hilton was
giving him a handjob.
Simply Fred
> Leave Mike alone, just another angry ex Cat 1. Let him vent.
Portrait of rbr as a primal scream therapy room.
Simply Fred
> Lafferty-free
Sounds vaguely organic.
Anton Berlin
Chris Bianco is a legend - many say his is the best. I love his
interviews - he's very straight forward.
http://www.gourmet.com/restaurants/2009/05/chris-biancos-pizza-philosophy
-------------------------
(On any topic you want to get into, Bianco dispenses profane folk
wisdom like a vending machine.
On eating local: “People ask for clams on the pizza,” he said. “Show
me some fuckin’ water in Phoenix and I’ll put fuckin’ clams on your
pizza.” )
-------------------------
When I come to Phoenix to try Bianco - I'll add Barrio to the list.
One can't eat pizza all of the time - Thanks for the rec.
Frederick the Great
<fa4968bf-c311-4ed1...@u11g2000prk.googlegroups.com>,
Anton Berlin <truth...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> The secret as any pizzaiolo will tell you is the dough. I've been
> making bread for 20 + years from a parisian culture that was 153 years
> old when I got it. I've been trained by one of the most well known
> artisan bakers in the world only to advance my ability to make
> pizza.
153 years old. I can get a first rate sour dough
culture going in a month. Any baker can.
--
Old Fritz
Fredmaster of Brainerd
> In article
> <fa4968bf-c311-4ed1-a9dd-c2fe97112...@u11g2000prk.googlegroups.com>,
> Anton Berlin <truth_88...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > The secret as any pizzaiolo will tell you is the dough. I've been
> > making bread for 20 + years from a parisian culture that was 153 years
> > old when I got it. I've been trained by one of the most well known
> > artisan bakers in the world only to advance my ability to make
> > pizza.
>
> 153 years old. I can get a first rate sour dough
> culture going in a month. Any baker can.
Dumbass,
If you didn't keep killing your sourdough culture
you wouldn't need to be so good at getting it
started in a month.
My dad made his own sourdough starter and it's
now old enough to do Masters races. It probably
rises faster than the average Masters racer as well,
so to speak.
Kneadmaster Ben
Anton Berlin
> In article
> <fa4968bf-c311-4ed1-a9dd-c2fe97112...@u11g2000prk.googlegroups.com>,
>
> > The secret as any pizzaiolo will tell you is the dough. I've been
> > making bread for 20 + years from a parisian culture that was 153 years
> > old when I got it. I've been trained by one of the most well known
> > artisan bakers in the world only to advance my ability to make
> > pizza.
>
> 153 years old. I can get a first rate sour dough
> culture going in a month. Any baker can.
>
> --
> Old Fritz
Age isn't everything - but these older cultures do have a remarkable
way of staying alive after dormancy. I keep several others and steal
versions where ever I am able. Many of them I throw away after a
month or so because they don't proof out to be better than anything I
already have and there is a risk from them infecting one of my prized
cultures that I keep 2 separate samples of at all times and pull and
store a dry sample from once every year.
I have a 300 yr old version that sleeps for 6 months in the fridge and
after 3 or 4 feedings it ferments like a teenager.
But as a baker will tell you it's not just the yeast but the symbiosis
between the yeast and the bacteria. What ever is in my culture known
as "Paris A" and "B" is unique to any breads I've ever had. Even
the 800 yr old + breads in Prague and Paris don't have the complexity
that this one has.
Lastly Fritz - your wrong in generalizing that just access to the
ingredients is enough to make good bread - just as access to a Colnago
doesn't make one a good cyclist.
I have been making bread for 20+ years and each year I learn more
about it than all of the previous years put together. Understanding
finer points such as 'falling number' extensibility, hydration
impacts, alpha amylase activity, impacts of autolysing, retarding ,
temperature manipulations and their interactions have gone to make
some of the best breads (and pizzas) I've ever made but still I have a
lot to learn.
Anton Berlin
> My dad made his own sourdough starter and it's
> now old enough to do Masters races. It probably
> rises faster than the average Masters racer as well,
> so to speak.
>
> Kneadmaster Ben
What kind of breads does he make? Where did he capture the culture?
derf...@gmail.com
well now ... as I'll be in Phoenix in a few weeks, will have to check
those out. thanks for the tip.
Brad Anders
Both don't take reservations. For Bianco, you just have to show up
early and wait in line. Barrio Cafe isn't quite so hard to get into,
unless it's the weekend.
Frederick the Great
<5af5595a-f5bc-4568...@r19g2000prm.googlegroups.com>,
Well---some gotta prove how long they can keep it up.
--
Old Fritz
Frederick the Great
<bd3b1006-f072-4b7c...@o39g2000prb.googlegroups.com>,
Anton Berlin <truth...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Jan 30, 1:18 pm, Frederick the Great <rub...@pacbell.net> wrote:
> > In article
> > <fa4968bf-c311-4ed1-a9dd-c2fe97112...@u11g2000prk.googlegroups.com>,
> > Anton Berlin <truth_88...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > > The secret as any pizzaiolo will tell you is the dough. I've been
> > > making bread for 20 + years from a parisian culture that was 153 years
> > > old when I got it. I've been trained by one of the most well known
> > > artisan bakers in the world only to advance my ability to make
> > > pizza.
> >
> > 153 years old. I can get a first rate sour dough
> > culture going in a month. Any baker can.
>
> Age isn't everything - but these older cultures do have a remarkable
> way of staying alive after dormancy. I keep several others and steal
> versions where ever I am able. Many of them I throw away after a
> month or so because they don't proof out to be better than anything I
> already have and there is a risk from them infecting one of my prized
> cultures that I keep 2 separate samples of at all times and pull and
> store a dry sample from once every year.
>
> I have a 300 yr old version that sleeps for 6 months in the fridge and
> after 3 or 4 feedings it ferments like a teenager.
> But as a baker will tell you it's not just the yeast but the symbiosis
> between the yeast and the bacteria. What ever is in my culture known
> as "Paris A" and "B" is unique to any breads I've ever had. Even
> the 800 yr old + breads in Prague and Paris don't have the complexity
> that this one has.
>
> Lastly Fritz - your wrong in generalizing that just access to the
> ingredients is enough to make good bread - just as access to a Colnago
> doesn't make one a good cyclist.
No reason for you to infer that from what I said.
> I have been making bread for 20+ years and each year I learn more
> about it than all of the previous years put together. Understanding
> finer points such as 'falling number' extensibility, hydration
> impacts, alpha amylase activity, impacts of autolysing, retarding ,
> temperature manipulations and their interactions have gone to make
> some of the best breads (and pizzas) I've ever made but still I have a
> lot to learn.
Yes. I dabble and wing it; but am good with growing things
so my efforts work out well. I appreciate that you put the work
into the finer points, and do not expect to match it.
One of my revelations was how sweet sourdough flapjacks can be.
--
Old Fritz
Fredmaster of Brainerd
He just makes a basic sourdough bread.
It's not as aggressively sour as a typical
store bought sourdough bread, I think.
He learned to bake when I was about 5 or so
and has been baking the bread about 2 or 3
times a week ever since (excepting travel
and so on), over 35 years. So we always had
fresh baked bread. I can bake bread, but don't
do it regularly enough, so whenever I buy a loaf
of store bread I die a little inside. That's also
why I don't have some of his starter, although
you prompt me to realize that at the least, I ought
to take a sample and preserve it.
He lives in Pittsburgh - I never thought about if
he started the culture from wild yeast though.
I assumed he started it with commercial yeast,
although it may have incorporated wild yeast over
the years.
I live in Toostoned, AZ now (Tucson) and my home
brewer friends all say that the local wild yeast isn't
any good for brewing - and probably not for baking.
Apparently it just doesn't taste good.
A funny thing about my dad's baking. If you do
something 2-3 times a week for over 30 years, of
course you pretty much have it down, but also
you have a few fuckups. Most of these are harmless -
bread rises too much, or not enough - but a
memorable one was when he forgot the salt. It's
just a couple teaspoons or so. But bread without
salt, although it did rise, doesn't taste like bread
minus salt (whatever that would be). It's unspeakably
awful, like metallic water. It doesn't taste like food.
It might be that the sourdough is especially strong
tasting without salt, because salt regulates (inhibits)
fermentation, if I understand correctly. Anyway, it's
remarkable what a difference such a small amount
of salt makes. I had never seen a saltless bread
recipe; Googling reveals there is such a thing,
although it seems like a trying-too-hard exercise, sort
of like running while carrying a bicycle.
Sorry for the rant. I have strong feelings
about bread.
Fredmaster Ben
Fredmaster of Brainerd
By the way have you ever seen this:
Look at the brochure, the "About Carl" etc
to figure out what it's about.
Fredmaster Ben
Mike
>
> > Mike, I remember you too. Kisses.
>
> Thought you were someone else. No idea of who you are, other than
> being someone psychotically concerned with Vaughter's turtleneck,
> glasses, and facial hair.
Hello Brad,
Let's not make it personal, I don't really know you, and I don't care
if you know me, I raced all over and met much more interesting people
than you, a name-dropping awkward kind of poser that always made me a
little sick.
I think I maybe spent four seconds looking at you struggling to ride
within your AT on a bicycle while name-dropping all the pros you know
at the same time, it was an uncomfortable sight.
You do know me though, let's see, my brother raced for Alto Velo on
the track at Hellyer for a few years, he warned
me you were an obnoxiously pretentious hanger-on who never won a town
sign sprint in your life.
He said you were a likable kinda person with many friends in the local
community, but ultimately a poser. Nothing
to feel ashamed about.
No shame in the game Brad: if you get to say that my musings are
psychotic, I get to say you are a poser fan-boy.
Maybe we're both right. I don't want to seem hostile, you said that my
criticisms of Vaughters was psychotic, but he
is the one firing people and being hypocritical, he never suffered a
day on a bike without dope since he was 18, so firing people for an
administrative error - to bolster the "cleanliness" of his team - is a
little hard for me to swallow, but by all means - feel free to ignore
my psychotic rantings.
Mike
RicodJour
Alright. Time's up. Judges, please take a few moments to review your
notes, and then cast your vote as to what type and quantity of drugs
Mark has consumed. Candyassing will not be allowed, so votes of
'tainted' and 'enormous' are not permitted. Thank you.
R
Fredmaster of Brainerd
Dude,
Smack talk is de rigeur for RBR, but what's
with all the "Let's not make it personal ...
I don't want to seem hostile" stuff?
It's like you don't mean it or something.
You gotta stop flavoring the stew with these
little gobbets of nicety if you want to fit in
with us idiots.
Thanks,
Fredmaster Ben
Mike
> I like pizza and am determined to continue to try to make the best in
> the world. Someday I may go commercial but there are a lot of
> challenges to doing what you can do for a dozen people to doing it for
> hundreds. (day after day)
>
> Apologies for the ramble - I've become like old fritz because the
> subject became pizza. (grin)
No way! You guys are just like me!
I love pizza too, but I can't make it. That is pretty much for women
or greasy Italian guys in wife beater tank tops.
I'm a cat. 5 pizza maker, I can make a badass Digiorno (seriously),
and a decent bagel pizza if my wife went shopping recently.
I ate some pretty good pizza and calzones after I quit racing, but of
course pizza is really pretty much food for fat people - the thin
crust northern Italian style is ok, but still - I mean how much do you
guys weigh?
I build homemade hifi tube amplifiers (I prefer 6v6 or El84 tubes) and
furniture in my garage, I am very good at hours and hours or mindless
sanding, wet or dry, orbital/belt, rub the wood with some linseed
oil...
I also like..oh wait, nobody cares.
Mike
Mike
>
> Alright. Time's up. Judges, please take a few moments to review your
> notes, and then cast your vote as to what type and quantity of drugs
> Mark has consumed. Candyassing will not be allowed, so votes of
> 'tainted' and 'enormous' are not permitted. Thank you.
>
> R
Is Mark me? My name is Mike, not Mick, or Mark (I prefer Mick)
Ok cool, You want to know what dope I consumed? Why didn't you ask me?
I'm not shy. Ok, instead of votes here we go, in order of
effectiveness:
1) Sostenon 250 (the best!)
2) Norandren 50 (nandrolone for horses, takes a long time to kick in,
this is a three month pre-season cycle)
3) Equipoise (a drug for debilitated horses like me, best for recovery
after stage races)
4) Clenbuterol (every day for three years - anti-catabolic, fat burner
and makes you want to ride for 8 hours straight)
5) Primobolan
5) Ephedrine (like candy. I did the ephedrine/caffeine/aspirin stack)
6) 3 grams of caffeine a day (french press helped)
7) DHEA/Androstenedione and other testosterone precursors - this was
literally candy, the veins were popping out all over my body on this
stuff.
8) Testosterone suspension - I stayed away from this stuff, too
strong, gave me back acne, also made me want to beat up my girlfriend
a little bit so I stopped.
If you want to win a tuesday night parking lot crit or thursday night
TT, this is pretty much the basics. Keep in mind I was a very light
doper, the pros were taking much much more than this. Some were
spending all their salaries on dope. They had briefcases full of their
supply.
I never blood doped, couldn't afford the EPO but I was offered it
regularly.
You can also win or at least get podium at local/regional 1-2 races
completely clean.
I was regularly hammered by dudes with a wife, a mortgage, and a few
kids watching that never touched a vitamin.
That is what cracked me and made me quit, so congratulations to them.
After I stopped and raced as a hobby I did almost as well locally -
clean - at few training TT's, but I could not have done the 5 day
stage races. I would wake up feeling like I had arthritis and was 90
years old.
I was 6'2'' 156 pounds, and my Vo2 Max and AT were abnormally high so
must of you suckers that actually race - instead of baking pizza -
have three options:
1) Quit
2) Dope
3) Race clean on your talent and hard work and get lumped up
regularly. There might be three of you reading this.
Finally you ask? What happens at dope tests? Well, I never won
anything that big, to get tested. But we all knew the rules followed
by Jonathon Vaughters at the 1998 Tour of the GIla: If you show up to
a race, and know you're gonna get top three,
and you see a USA cycling white doping van - you flee, and DNS.
DO NOT START.
The start list for the 1998 Tour of the Gila had JV (Postal) in first
place, at the top of the list - but it was the first time in years
with testing and Vaughters decided not to race...Why fly to
Albuquerque, then drive five hours to Silver City and then suddenly
decide not to race? Because he was riding dirty and assuming there
would be no testing. Why aren't these Mellow Johnny guys in Europe in
May during their TDF buildup? Exact same reason - fly under the radar
when you are riding dirty.
Go back and read the DNS at big randomly dope controlled races, it's
pretty much a list of the most notorious dopers in the USA. Remember
Trent Klasna? That dude was awesome.
But whatever, back to Pizza Enzymes and crusts and important bicycle
related stuff like that.
Brad Anders
thanks. I don't know you from Adam, and from what I can tell, nobody
else does, either. Yet you have a whole list of detailed things you
hold against me from 20+ years ago that seem to have stuck in your
craw, and despite your claim of not wanting to get "personal" about
it, spew it with as much venom as you can muster. Your posting about
Vaughters (a guy I exchanged a couple of emails with 20+ years ago,
that's my total connection with him, just for your record book of my
sins) reads the same way, with an obsession about a bunch of
irrelevant details on his appearance, and a ton of hatred. As with me,
I'm certain you don't actually know Vaughters, and he sure as hell
doesn't know you on a personal basis enough to give a shit about your
analysis of his appearance, any more than I give a shit about your
views of me as a cyclist or a person. So, please, not to be personal,
but why don't you just fuck off?
Fred Flintstein
> Hello Brad,
> Let's not make it personal, I don't really know you, and I don't care
> if you know me, I raced all over and met much more interesting people
> than you, a name-dropping awkward kind of poser that always made me a
> little sick.
Mike, I want to thank you for giving up on teaching English.
What this sentence tells me is that it wasn't a good career
choice for you.
Fred Flintstein
Fred Flintstein
> No way! You guys are just like me!
Dumbass,
Good comeback. Keep it up.
Fred Flintstein
Fred
You did all that and still couldn't make it past 'run of the mill cat
1 in NM'?
Just goes to show you, dope can't make a racehorse out of an ass.
Fred
Simply Fred
>> Let's not make it personal, I don't really know you, and I don't care
>> if you know me, I raced all over and met much more interesting people
>> than you, a name-dropping awkward kind of poser that always made me a
>> little sick.
Fred Flintstein wrote:
> Mike, I want to thank you for giving up on teaching English.
> What this sentence tells me is that it wasn't a good career
> choice for you.
Please can't we have some split infinitives to argue over.
Anton Berlin
> I build homemade hifi tube amplifiers (I prefer 6v6 or El84 tubes) and
> furniture in my garage, I am very good at hours and hours or mindless
> sanding, wet or dry, orbital/belt, rub the wood with some linseed
> oil...
> I also like..oh wait, nobody cares.
> Mike
Tube amps seem to be a good hobby - good ones cost a fortune.
Anton Berlin
wrote:
Salt errors go both ways - yes it's pretty bland without it but when I
first started out I misread the bakers percentages and calculated the
salt against the entire weight and not the flour. I couldn't taste
things for a week my mouth was so burnt by the salt.
It's the one thing I always still weigh out to the gram. Practice has
told me I can be + or - on the water and flour and there are so many
variables that I have to adjust for sometimes the flour takes the
water less or more so it's more of an eye as the dough is mixing.
I have strong feelings about bread too.
Your father has a valid sourdough culture - while one can feed a
commercial yeast for some time - sooner or later they exhaust
themselves due to no use. Next time you visit you should learn his
craft - great way to bond and something great to pass along.
While I won't share my Paris culture I will share my knowledge when it
comes to bread and can make some recs. One thing I really appreciate
is my Bosch mixer. Don't mess around with Kitchen Aids the cheap
gearboxes will fall apart the first time you go to make a decent batch
of grainy whole wheat.
jojo
>
>>
> There might be three of you reading this.
>
Mike Jacoubowsky
news:16c8eedf-acd7-4b17...@n2g2000pre.googlegroups.com...
On Jan 29, 11:24 am, Fred <fred.gar...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Jan 29, 12:40 am, Mike <mtschatz...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > - I was a mediocre cat. 1 for five years - what races did you do? I
> > won a pro race. How many Belgian kermesses have you suffered
> > through?
> > Your friend forever,
> > Mike Schatzman
>
> A mediocre cat 1 in Albuquerque back in the day?? Wow... here's a
> tip: you shouldn't exactly expect anyone to be impressed. Okay,
> maybe your mom is proud, but other than her, n'ah.
>
> Fred
>>Leave Mike alone, just another angry ex Cat 1. Let him vent.
Hey, at least he *was* a Cat-1. I had the indignity of being a Cat-2 at
a time when there really was no such thing as a Cat-2 race. Everything
was Cat-1/2, and I didn't have the time to train for 120 mile road
races. It sucked. Thankfully, I escaped the rat-race by dropping out
completely; downgrading wasn't even an option then (I think you had to
literally take a year off or petition the pope or something like that).
Life was a lot easier as a junior. These days, I look at U23 and think,
why didn't they have that back then? Glad they didn't. Racing wasn't
something you did, it was a lifestyle. I prefer my current lifestyle, on
the sidelines.
--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
Plano Dude
I assume you kept eating after the first bite. If so, why?
Anton Berlin
>
> I assume you kept eating after the first bite. If so, why?
>
Acclimatization - Once the tastebuds are scorched earth - you hardly
notice the salt from a taste point of view. We've all witnessed
people that over salt their food.
It was only when I shared that batch with other bakers that I realized
the mistake.
Plano Dude
Let me get this straight: You study finer points such as 'falling
number' extensibility, hydration impacts, alpha amylase activity,
impacts of autolysing, retarding, temperature manipulations and their
interactions but yet your palate is so whacked you can't tell when
you've massively oversalted your dough?
Phil H
Better yet, William Safires Rules for Writers....
Remember to never split an infinitive.
The passive voice should never be used.
Do not put statements in the negative form.
Verbs have to agree with their subjects.
Proofread carefully to see if you words out.
If you reread your work, you can find on rereading a great deal of
repetition can be by rereading and editing.
A writer must not shift your point of view.
And don't start a sentence with a conjunction. (Remember, too, a
preposition is a terrible word to end a sentence with.)
Don't overuse exclamation marks!!
Place pronouns as close as possible, especially in long sentences, as
of 10 or more words, to their antecedents.
Writing carefully, dangling participles must be avoided.
If any word is improper at the end of a sentence, a linking verb is.
Take the bull by the hand and avoid mixing metaphors.
Avoid trendy locutions that sound flaky.
Everyone should be careful to use a singular pronoun with singular
nouns in their writing.
Always pick on the correct idiom.
The adverb always follows the verb.
Last but not least, avoid cliches like the plague; seek viable
alternatives.
Phil H
Anton Berlin
The salt thing happened decades ago - those things I focus on now.
Up until now I thought you were lawboy but I detect no legal sense or
training in your line of interrogation.
Come to think about it --- you might be lawboy after all.
Anton Berlin
Let us know how it turns out and what other places you can compare it
to. What's your favorite now?
Anton Berlin
I believe he also runs out each day - so you can't slide in at 10pm
and get one because he's out of dough for the day.
Brad can verify - if not a call can but he's right - you have to plan
a good amount of time. At least a few hours from what I understand.
Anton Berlin
I am doing what I can to learn to grow things. Mainly basil, oregano,
thyme, rosemary and garlic.
I am confused as to what may be eating the leaves of my windowsill
basil. Never seen a single bug but a good 10% of the leaves look as
if grasshoppers ate them.
Anton Berlin
wrote:
I've heard of it about 5 years ago but never followed up to get it.
his directions are a little odd - bread has only flour water salt and
yeast (in my case culture) all of those feeding instructions seem
unnecessary - just clean water and flour should suffice. although
some culture prefer rye and whole wheat - mine likes KASL and bread
flour - but mainly because they are used to it.
They almost have a personality. ) pour the alcohol off if its been a
long time.
Anton Berlin
So Mike - let me get this straight - you feel proud that you beat some
other riders but you did it by loading up on drugs - so really you
didn't accomplish anything.
What's the point of berating Brad who I guess rode clean that he
couldn't hold the wheel of a doper. Big fucking deal - you might as
well been riding a Hayabusa.
I don't know you but I know guys that could know you but maybe not -
USA cycling doesn't show a single result for who you appear to be.
With all of that dope and lack of results you really should shoot your
parents for passing off such piss poor genetic material.
Fred Fredburger
> I mean how much do you
> guys weigh?
HEY! That's not a very polite question!
Mike
I don't feel "proud" at all, but I did accomplish what I wanted, I
wanted to see how good
I could get - and that involved doping - and I got pretty good, 9th at
Bisbee, shit like that,
but got hammered by local riders who worked at Intel, I'm not ashamed,
just realistic.
> What's the point of berating Brad who I guess rode clean that he
> couldn't hold the wheel of a doper. Big fucking deal - you might as
> well been riding a Hayabusa.
Brad was being a jerk, so I did the same thing, I don't have anything
against Brad,
he wrote some interesting stuff back in the day for Cycle Sport, he
shouldn't care what
I think of him and I didn't say anything that wasn't true.
> I don't know you but I know guys that could know you but maybe not -
> USA cycling doesn't show a single result for who you appear to be.
I quit racing in 1998, I can send you my race resume. I quit at age 28
when I
realized I wasn't going to make it. I wasn't very good, but I did win
pro races against
national champions.
Again, I have zero interest in what you think of me.
> With all of that dope and lack of results you really should shoot your
> parents for passing off such piss poor genetic material.
This is funny, my VO2 max and AT were abnormally high, and I am
extremely
handsome, with a great sense of humor. My hair is full and luxurious,
I thank my
parents every day of my life.
RicodJour
Something is certainly full of it, Mack.
R
Mike
Hmm, Vaughter's appearance and ridiculous dandy wardrobe are like his
actions - superficial, pretentious, corny and contrived.
You are no sinner I'm sure, but you were the one to make it personal
by questioning my mental health (and in my obviously psychotic mind -
you were defending Vaughters, who is obviously a sinner of the worst
kind - a hypocritical one).
I had to race against riders like Dylan Casey and Vaughters and they
were dope-i-rific, I appreciated their dope taking abilities, along
with the hard work and talent that goes along with being a pro.
I also did hundreds of group rides all over the country with Freds
like you, and many of them were charming interesting and almost always
very successful people off the bike.
I don't judge people by their ability to pedal a bicycle, but you
weren't my cup
of tea at all, you were a norcal poser, and I met dozens of you,
nothing personal, we really don't know each
other, but you were rather high profile for a person that never
seriously raced a bicycle, I remembered you,
you didn't remember me, I traveled around a lot and never won anything
major, so what?
I'm not friends with Vaughters, never pretended to be. His Jason
Priestley 90210 sideburns would be a real friendship deal breaker
anyway.
I don't know anything else about you - you annoyed me on a group ride
15 years ago, were quickly dispatched off the back, and that was that.
Goodbye, and continue being a pro cycling sycophant despite all the
evidence that your heroes are drug addicted junkies.
Mike
Agreed. The average cat 1 in NM was actually much faster than me, it's
very windy there.
I was a fast donkey for a few years, with very bad seasonal allergies.
That's why
I never won the TDF...
Mike
Thank you Strunk and/or White.
Anton Berlin
We're not finding the results buddy. I got a DQ, DNF and a consistent
22nd place for you some 10% slower than the fastest times on the same
course - same day. That's not even in the same ballpark as the
unknowns beating you.
If your metrics were as high as you claimed you wouldn't need the dope
and would have had better results with or without the drugs.
You blew your opportunity to know what you were capable of because you
wasted it on learning what you and drugs were capable of. I don't
know of anyone that respects that choice and no one that could respect
those results.
You were a bad doper and a worse cyclist - that's the only certainty
from the 30 minutes I've spent ferreting out the truth.
PS - and a poor English teacher - perhaps you inspired some youngster
to write a new version of the Wall.
William Fred
news:4d477803$1...@news.x-privat.org:
Tube amps? Check. Snotty demeanor? Check. Did it occur to anyone else
that you're all being trolled by Andre Jute?
Just saying ...
--
Bill Fred
rickhopkins
I might also add to Anton's thoughtful list, Mike is very much in love
with himself (can we say narcissists, can of like Palin) - not sure
anyone else is, so I think Mike probably beats off like a fiend.
Rick
Simply Fred
> I might also add to Anton's thoughtful list, Mike is very much in love
> with himself (can we say narcissists, can of like Palin) - not sure
> anyone else is, so I think Mike probably beats off like a fiend.
Training alone is the key to success.
Brad Anders
> Goodbye, and continue being a pro cycling sycophant despite all the
> evidence that your heroes are drug addicted junkies.
Just another example of how little you know about me. I don't admire
any pro cyclists out there and haven't since about '95 when the extent
of their doping became obvious. I railed against it here and took a
ton of shit from people. You, instead, at about the same time, still
aspired to join their ranks. I leave it to others to judge who between
us admired those "drug addicted junkies" more.
Hope you enjoyed the ride that the club I co-founded organized, and I
hope the alphabet soup of drugs and crap you personally admitted to
taking, in order to cut it as a backmarker Cat 1, helped you in your
mid-20's to beat the shit out of a bunch of 40+ masters and cat 4/5's
on a casual training ride. If you're at all representative of what a
Cat 1 was or is in the the US, I'm only too glad that I wasn't your
peer on the bike, and instead, focused on my family and career. Given
your obvious bitterness and resentment of those who you aspired to,
looks like I made a good choice.
Brad Anders
> Brad was being a jerk, so I did the same thing, I don't have anything
> against Brad,
> he wrote some interesting stuff back in the day for Cycle Sport, he
> shouldn't care what
> I think of him and I didn't say anything that wasn't true.
Dimwit, I never wrote for Cycle Sport. I did have a column in Winning
for a short while, but that's the extent of my cycling journalism. I'm
beginning to think you've got me confused with Bruce Hildenbrand, who
is a close friend of Andy Hampsten, has written for Cycle Sport, and
told me around that time about doing a local ride with Maynard with
the BBC. Definitely more "high profile" to use your words. Bruce is
also a lot more glib than I am on the bike, as I spent most of my time
just trying to hang on. Maybe all that dope you were taking at the
time got you a little confused.
BTW, if it was Bruce and not me, thought I'd mention that he's been
retired from Sun Microsystems (18 year career) for over a decade and
is a successful cycling photojournalist, still writing for major
periodicals. He actually was at or near a Cat 1 level years ago,
again, looks like he made a good choice, too.
Fred
Simply Fred
> I'm beginning to think you've got me confused with Bruce Hildenbrand, who
> is a close friend of Andy Hampsten, has written for Cycle Sport, and
> told me around that time about doing a local ride with Maynard with
> the BBC. Definitely more "high profile" to use your words. Bruce is
> also a lot more glib than I am on the bike
According to Kunich he's not as glib as Albright.
marco_f...@yahoo.com
> ...Hope you enjoyed the ride that the club I co-founded organized, and I
> hope the alphabet soup of drugs and crap you personally admitted to
> taking, in order to cut it as a backmarker Cat 1, helped you in your
> mid-20's to beat the shit out of a bunch of 40+ masters and cat 4/5's
> on a casual training ride. If you're at all representative of what a
> Cat 1 was or is in the the US, I'm only too glad that I wasn't your
> peer on the bike, and instead, focused on my family and career. Given
> your obvious bitterness and resentment of those who you aspired to,
> looks like I made a good choice.
Brad- Speaking for myself and (presumptuously) for the other Cat 1s in
this thread... in NO WAY would I EVER want this bitter dope-taking guy
Mike to represent me. Instead it seems he represents a minority
contingent of bike racers who think way too much of themselves just
because they reached a level that allowed them to *enter* the same
race as some more highly accomplished bike racers. Notice I didn't say
"compete against" because in reality most of them have zero chance to
win. 9th at Bisbee in P/1 is not totally lame, but to use it as an
example of "being good" is quite lame. Doping as an amateur is just
pathetic.
Brad Anders
though he may think he is. Most of the Cat 1's and pros who rode with
us back in the '90's were good guys with a lot of talent, with
knowledge to share, who wouldn't resent a bunch of fat ass masters and
computer geeks who discovered cycling in their 30's, who were
enthusiastic about the sport. I did my first race in '72, and I
greatly appreciate those over the years with more talent and
perserverence than I, who backed off to ride with me and share their
training advice.
Frederick the Great
<14fe9246-83bb-48c4...@8g2000prb.googlegroups.com>,
Anton Berlin <truth...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I am doing what I can to learn to grow things. Mainly basil, oregano,
> thyme, rosemary and garlic.
>
> I am confused as to what may be eating the leaves of my windowsill
> basil. Never seen a single bug but a good 10% of the leaves look as
> if grasshoppers ate them.
It's a jungle out there.
Probably grasshoppers; maybe larvae.
Look under all the leaves.
--
Old Fritz
H. Fred Kveck
Brad Anders <pban...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jan 31, 8:38�pm, Mike <mtschatz...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Goodbye, and continue being a pro cycling sycophant despite all the
> > evidence that your heroes are drug addicted junkies.
> Hope you enjoyed the ride that the club I co-founded organized, and I
> hope the alphabet soup of drugs and crap you personally admitted to
> taking, in order to cut it as a backmarker Cat 1, helped you in your
> mid-20's to beat the shit out of a bunch of 40+ masters and cat 4/5's
> on a casual training ride.
That's the part that keeps me wondering: If the events happened as Mike described,
did anyone else know that it was a race?
Mike Jacoubowsky
news:jutk18-...@donald.homeip.net...
Isn't Greg LeMond proof that's not true?
--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com
RicodJour
wrote:
> Brad Anders <pband...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Jan 31, 8:38 pm, Mike <mtschatz...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Goodbye, and continue being a pro cycling sycophant despite all the
> > > evidence that your heroes are drug addicted junkies.
> > Hope you enjoyed the ride that the club I co-founded organized, and I
> > hope the alphabet soup of drugs and crap you personally admitted to
> > taking, in order to cut it as a backmarker Cat 1, helped you in your
> > mid-20's to beat the shit out of a bunch of 40+ masters and cat 4/5's
> > on a casual training ride.
>
> That's the part that keeps me wondering: If the events happened as Mike described,
> did anyone else know that it was a race?
To sum up - a loser-doper is pissed that a doper-winner fired somebody
without his permission. My brain hurts from just typing that and I
didn't even think about it.
But 20 years ago he did beat Brad to some town signs, or someone who
looked like Brad, or maybe not, but he did beat somebody somewhere who
may or may not have known it was a race. So it's settled - he's
really, really good.
R
RicodJour
wrote:
> "Simply Fred" <n...@mailinator.com> wrote in message
>
> news:jutk18-...@donald.homeip.net...
>
> > rickhopkins wrote:
> >> I might also add to Anton's thoughtful list, Mike is very much in
> >> love
> >> with himself (can we say narcissists, can of like Palin) - not sure
> >> anyone else is, so I think Mike probably beats off like a fiend.
>
> > Training alone is the key to success.
>
> Isn't Greg LeMond proof that's not true?
Greg should have been hunting alone.
R
Fred Flintstein
Maybe he beat Brad. Maybe it was Bruce.
I don't know about you guys but I get Karen Kurreck and Andy
Hampsten mixed up all the time. So I can understand the
difficulty in telling Brad/Bruce apart. Some guy named Br(*)
yammering about his friend the high level racer. Tough to keep
it all straight.
Fred Flintstein