Banana peels, biodegradable?
T...@slacvm.slac.stanford.edu
after he tossed it on the ground. Soon there was a full blown out discussion
on banana peels. Anyone know for sure if banana peels are biodegradable?
-tom
Doug Dreger
>Soon there was a full blown out discussion
>on banana peels. Anyone know for sure if banana peels are biodegradable?
Of course they are biodegradable.
This fact does not negate the negative impact trash has nor, the potential
slipping hazard of banana peels.
Doug
andrew cooke
just like track erosion and jumping lights, old banana peel isn't
going to hurt people in the Grand Scheme of Things. but i
guess it will upset the same people and cause the same problems.
fwiw someone told me that calorie per square foot of land, bananas
were the best food available. so maybe if you throw a bit of banana
away too, the seeds will make more trees + end global famine, with
everyone living hapily ever after ;-)
andrew
j...@woodlab.mech.ubc.ca
>In article <94207.1...@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> <T...@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> writes:
>>Soon there was a full blown out discussion
>>on banana peels. Anyone know for sure if banana peels are biodegradable?
>Of course they are biodegradable.
*snip*
I've had one (whole banana) biodegrade on my kitchen counter once.
Was hidden behind odds and ends. Finally found it after tracing the
source of a mysterious liquid and smell.
Yuck.
John
---
email: koi...@unixg.ubc.ca
bruce brodersen
: One of the cyclist in our group picked up the banana peel of another cyclist
: after he tossed it on the ground. Soon there was a full blown out discussion
: on banana peels. Anyone know for sure if banana peels are biodegradable?
: -tom
Where is your little smiley face :-) after your question?
Phillip N Price
|> >Soon there was a full blown out discussion
|> >on banana peels. Anyone know for sure if banana peels are biodegradable?
Few people realize that the banana was the product of early radiation
experiments in the South Pacific in the late 1940's. These experiments
were conducted on the Bikini Atoll, later the site for a hydrogen
bomb explosion, and were conducted under the auspices of the
Bikini Atoll Native Plantain Mutation Assignment, BANPAMA, in an
effort to produce an edible fruit for the army, that would not
decay or degrade with age. The Plantain was selected since it has
a tough outer cover that provides protection for the fruit;
unfortunately, it is not very palatable when raw. The BANPAMA
project was not particularly successful, as the resulting fruits
were found to bruise easily. However, they were still fed to
unsuspecting natives and servicemen, where they became something
of a hit. Introduced to the U.S. as "Banamas" in 1951, by former
military scientists who saw there was more money in agriculture
than in early attempts at genetic engineering, they immediately
became something of a rage. By 1958, "Bananas", as they were known
by then, were grown throughout central and south america to feed the
hungry U.S. market.
This would be a happy story of a great new food, if it weren't
for the sinister secret that was brought to light in 1978 in early
studies of "Garbology" (the study of garbage) by scientists from
the University of Arizona: the military's original project was
not a complete failure after all---although the fruit of the
banana is quite vulnerable, the peel contains enzymes that render
it impervious to virtually all biological action. In short, every
banana peel ever grown is still in existence. This discovery by
Arizona scientists led to a series of startling and bizarre
revelations, including the fact that since the late 1950's the
U.S. military, in a surprisingly successful attempt to cover up
their introduction of this non-degradable peel, has had a veritable
army of specially trained Banana Peel Retrieval Specialists arrayed
across the country. Using infrared satellite images to locate
suburban compost piles, these commandoes would strike in the dark
of night, removing banana peels and replacing them with degradable
facsimilies made from wheat, soy, marigold petals, and corn silks.
Army experiments attempting to train racoons and possums to do the
retrieval were fairly successful, and these methods replaced the
manual retrieval method over much of the country by the early 1970's.
The 1978 revelation, and the accompanying outcry, led to a crash
program by the Department of Agriculture to develop a "Green"
banana. By 1981 the program was deemed a success, having produced
a banana that degraded slowly but completely, and then-President
Ronald Reagan was able to unveil the new banana to coincide with
a meeting with heads of state from several Central American
countries. Reagan's comment that "I love these things, and I
consider myself a Banana Republic-an", was considered in poor taste
and hushed up by the then-malleable press.
So, the answer to the question is: yes, for the past 13 years
banana peels have been biodegradable. Banana peels from before
1981 are not degradable, and most of them are still in existence,
buried in huge dumps at Hanford, WA and Oak Ridge, TN. Pilot
incineration programs have been launched, and if all goes well the
non-degradable banana peels will have been disposed of by
the year 2005.
--Phil Price
Michael Dolenga
wrote:
> So, the answer to the question is: yes, for the past 13 years
> banana peels have been biodegradable. Banana peels from before
> 1981 are not degradable, and most of them are still in existence,
> buried in huge dumps at Hanford, WA and Oak Ridge, TN. Pilot
> incineration programs have been launched, and if all goes well the
> non-degradable banana peels will have been disposed of by
> the year 2005.
At a cost of several billion dollars, according to the General Accounting
Office.
Mike
--
"It is all very well to play for a while with fools ... but fools must be
changed fairly often or the entertainment becomes tiresome." - Sartre
Ken Lee
|> >Soon there was a full blown out discussion
|> >on banana peels. Anyone know for sure if banana peels are biodegradable?
|>
|> Of course they are biodegradable.
Its probably not as simple as that. "Biodegradable" is a very loosely
defined term. Given a sufficient amount of time, water, heat, and
bacteria, all organic material will biodegrade. For very fiberous stuff
like orange peels, this may take years. Banana peels are probably not
as bad, but can still last quite a while.
--
Ken Lee, ken...@esd.sgi.com
Chris Vernell
Yup. Just don't leave one where Elmer Fudd might slip on it.
--
Chris Vernell
Gabriel D. Underwood
biodegradable? T...@SLACVM.SLAC.STANFORD (290)
-tom
Is this guy serious? Has urban man gotten so out of touch with nature?
Jeez, you outta log out sometime and take a walk through the woods.
The "gedankin experiment" to show that bananas are biodegrable is this:
Imagine what Ecuador would look like, after millons of years of banana
tree evolution, if banana's *didn't* decay in nature.
But in the name of total and complete verifiability, here's an experiment:
Buy a banana. Let it sit on your kitchen counter under direct sunlight
for about a month. Lo and behold, it has degraded.
To really see the magic of nature in action, put it on your lawn or
someplace, where you can take a look at it every day and where it won't
get blown or washed away. After about a week or so, there will be no
more banana.
Gabe "Toss 'em into the compost heap" Underwood
--
Gabriel Underwood
ga...@cmu.edu
WWW stuff: "http://www.cs.cmu.edu:8001/afs/andrew/usr/gu02/www/home.html"
"Handcrafted with pride in the United States by non-exploited, entrepreneur-
type craftspeople who ride their bikes a lot"
J.A. Peters [Jim]
banana's are organic material, whether they are organic or a dole-
chemically-treated-unnatural-act is another issue. if he tossed it
in an urban environment vs a country road i would call it littering.
the littering issue is a bit touchy when mountain biking, i consider
the hikers credo "carry out what you carry in". an interesting story
about the mountain of feces on everest comes to mind. most trailheads
have trash receptacles.
banana peels don't decompose very well due to their oil content, i
don't think they are fit for composting. as for apple cores i consider
myself a modern day johnny appleseed ;).
cheers,
james, jape...@dal.mobil.com
Mr D.M. Whittle
And banana peel and apple cores can take 3 years to fully decompose.
dave
Glenn_F...@qm.sri.com
I have been conducting an experiment on banana peel decomposition since
Sunday when I tossed one onto the floor of my car. After 5 days of
sitting in a closed car in 70-80 F heat, the peel is completely, black,
shrunken, and dehydrated, weighing about 1/5 its original weight. It now
seems to have reached a steady state with
little additional degradation. At this point, it has lost all
slipperyness and smell.
As you can tell, I really respect my car.
Glenn
David Casseres
Naw, it's a terrible problem in places like Costa Rica and Ecuador and
Hawaii and Southeast Asia, where every house has a banana tree in the
back yard and people eat bananas all the time. The peels pile up and
since they are not biodegradable there is basically a layer of banana
peels several yards deep all over the inhabited parts of these places.
It's pretty bad. The only good part is that being non-biodegradable they
don't decay at all -- they just sort of dry out and then lie there
forever.
-------------
David Casseres
Exclaimer: Hey!
don schiller
>I've had one (whole banana) biodegrade on my kitchen counter once.
>Was hidden behind odds and ends. Finally found it after tracing the
>source of a mysterious liquid and smell.
>Yuck.
>John
>---
>email: koi...@unixg.ubc.ca
Banana wine isn't very good, glad you threw it rather then trying to ferment
more of them.
Don
*Just a hardware guy in a software world.*
*Few things are more enjoyable then sitting in the hot tub*
*with a nice glass of wine and something good to nibble.*
Disclaimer: All above is my opinion, not the opinion of 3M Company,
or anyone else as far as I know.
Steve Fouts
>
>banana peels don't decompose very well due to their oil content, i
>don't think they are fit for composting. as for apple cores i consider
>myself a modern day johnny appleseed ;).
>
The composting process is carried out by a variety of organisms. My pile has a
stunning variety of insects and an occasional toad or gecko, apparently attracted
by the easy source of bugs. Banana peels break down quickly and easily in this
environment, where they are kept warm and moist. If sun dried on the side of a
hill somewhere, they might last for quite a while. In my opionion, it is much
better to toss it off of the trail where the earth will eventually assimilate
it, than to wrap it in a plastic bag and throw it in a landfill somewhere.
---
_______________ _____
/ ___ __/__\ \ / / _\ Steve Fouts
/___ \| | ___\ | / __\ sfo...@ellison.sc.ti.com
/ / \ | \ / \
/_______/__|_______\_/________\ "She understood, as he did, that all writing
was infernally boring and futile, but that it had to be done out of respect
for tradition" --Stanislaw Lem
R Glenn Stauffer
Banana peels turn into hardened black fibrous things a mere fraction of their
original bulk. Probably as harmful to the environment as leaves.
I guess it is best to toss them in a trashcan, but then you could raise the
question as to whether it is environmentally friendly to throw organic matter
into trashcans where they end up buried in landfills and do no good whatsoever
or should organic matter be composted instead? And, if composting is the
preferred outcome, isn't tossing the peels off the side of the road a mini
form of composting.
If you don't want to litter, just toss the peels into the yard of a house
as you pass. But don't let anyone see you - wouldn't want to give cyclists
a bad name.
Unknown
Glenn Stauffer among others) writes:
[snips]
>..>
>..> Its probably not as simple as that. "Biodegradable" is a very loosely
>..> defined term. Given a sufficient amount of time, water, heat, and
>..> bacteria, all organic material will biodegrade. For very fiberous stuff
>..> like orange peels, this may take years. Banana peels are probably not
>..> as bad, but can still last quite a while.
>..>
>..
One vital ingredient in the biodegradation mix that I have not seen mentioned
yet (forgive me if I missed it) is oxygen. This process is most definately an
aerobic one (use the Conconi test, I guess). Wrapping a peel in a plastic bag
(or not) and putting it your landfill will indeed preserve it for future
archaeologists. A composte heap must be turned over every few days to allow
oxygen in, something that doesn't happen in a landfill.
>..Banana peels turn into hardened black fibrous things a mere fraction of
their
>..original bulk. Probably as harmful to the environment as leaves.
Very, very true.
[snip]
>.. And, if composting is the
>..preferred outcome, isn't tossing the peels off the side of the road a mini
>..form of composting.
True again. What I find common (and surprising) is the number of banana peels
dropped at the roadside rather than tossed into the underbrush well off the
side of the road. Is it a sign to following riders that "I was here!"?
>..
>..If you don't want to litter, just toss the peels into the yard of a house
>..as you pass. But don't let anyone see you - wouldn't want to give cyclists
>..a bad name.
God lord, I do hope you are saying this peel-in-cheek.
Ken Manning
usually: Asst. Prof. Mechanical Engineering
Norwich University, Northfield VT
unusually: Visiting Staff Engineer
General Electric Corporate Research & Development
Schenectady NY
Opinions are my own, otherwise they'd be much more deeply considered.
Hakuna Matata (tm)
T...@slacvm.slac.stanford.edu
I took the banana peel from the banana that I just ate (delicious by the way)
and placed it on our lawn outside. I've been checking the banana peel everyday
since I put it there, so far 4-days total. The peel has turned black and
the grass under the peel is still green and healthy looking. I figure it this
way, if the grass dies under the banana peel than it's not biodegradable, simpl
e test.
-tom
Don Demuth
In another four days, that patch of grass will probably be the healthiest
patch on the entire lawn. I'm a bit surprised that some critter of the night
hasn't run off with your peel yet. Continue your test, but a banana peel is
certainly bio-degradable. Now, whether you want a zillion banana peels in
various stages of decay littering your favorite cycling route is another question
entirely. Perhaps this is why your friend was a little upset.
DRD
_________________________________________________________________________________
dem...@biochem.dental.upenn.edu
Bob Bayn
> ... And, if composting is the
> preferred outcome, isn't tossing the peels off the side of the road a mini
> form of composting.
NO. (details upon request)
--
Robert Bayn http://www.usu.edu/Org/Offices/OCS/People o
Computer Services Welcome to Cache Valley; please set your \__^\=*
Utah State University chronometer back 20 years and ten minutes. (O)""""o
Gordon D. Renkes
>I also ran a test, don't know if it's a good one, but this is what I did.
>I took the banana peel from the banana that I just ate (delicious by the way)
>and placed it on our lawn outside. I've been checking the banana peel
>everyday
>since I put it there, so far 4-days total. The peel has turned black and
>the grass under the peel is still green and healthy looking. I figure it this
>way, if the grass dies under the banana peel than it's not biodegradable,
>simple test.
> -tom
Are you going to perform this test with several hundred peels, in order
to get a statistically valid result? Several recent contributers to r.b.*
have insisted that this should be the only way to get believable conclusions.
Gordon Renkes renk...@osu.edu
THE Ohio State University
120 West 18th Avenue
Columbus Ohio 43210
USA "Just the FAQ's, Ma'am"
William Beers
: well, if this is for serious...
[snip]
: fwiw someone told me that calorie per square foot of land, bananas
: were the best food available. so maybe if you throw a bit of banana
: away too, the seeds will make more trees + end global famine, with
: everyone living hapily ever after ;-)
Seeds? What seeds? You have some kind of special banana with seeds?
Triploid chromosomes in bananas prevent the development of seeds, but
that's a discussion for sci.bio.*.
Anyway, experiments performed in my kitchen while I was away on vacation
confirm the degradability of bananas, peel and fruit included. Complete
decay with three weeks, but the smell lingers for some time, and then
there's the danger of radiation.
Unless, of course, it's one of those small red Jamaican bananas. I have
one sitting on my desk here that's at least three weeks old and hasn't
even ripened yet. (Unripe Jamaican bananas have the consistency of balsa
wood.)
Still, is it really that much trouble to bring a small baggie to carry
your trash home? Biodegradable does not necessarily equal
environmentally friendly, and it's so hard to clean banana gook from the
cables on the down tube.
--
just one more guy named bill
br...@instep.wimsey.bc.ca
However, they will tend to look messy on the trail since they won't decompose
quickly enough so that another trail user sees it.
As a rule, pack out what you pack in, or bury it if it's small and organic.
--
Brad Head <br...@instep.wimsey.bc.ca>
Software Developer, InStep Mobile Communications Inc.
Vancouver, British Columbia CANADA
N J Doye
Hi all,
fascinatingly enough, this topic came up on vegan-l once. I recommended to a
fellow cyclist that bananas were an excellent food, and came in their own
biodegradable wrapper. (I stole this line from some UK mag.)
Well some guy (a bit of a fruitcake) wrote back and said that disposing of
bananas in the contryside was not enviro-freindly due to all the chemicals
that they spray on banana skins, to stop them from going off. As far as I
recall, he claimed that the crates bananas are shipped over in, are not
allowed to be reused because of this.
Well, sod that, I'm not carrying aroung some squishy banana skin in my
jersey for the rest of a ride. And let's face it, the reason that it is going
squishy is because it is rotting/biodegrading.
Er, sorry for rambling...
nic.
Chris West
Phil Price's story is one caused from smoking too many banana peels
instead of throwing them away.
FYI, banana peels are biodegradable under the proper circumstances.
Their major problem is that they are rather unsightly until they have
been decomposed or consmed by the local fauna.
C.West
Steven L. Sheffield
Just make sure you toss the peel well off the road side. I nearly
crashed on Saturday when I accidently ran over a banana peel dropped
directly in my path.
It took an amazing amount of self-restraint to keep from either
1) sticking my pump in the guy's front spokes when I caught up
with him
AND/OR
2) beating him about the head and shoulders with that same pump.
--
Steven L. Sheffield Disclaimer? I don't need no
(BOB #1765/IBOB #3) stinking disclaimer.
Internet: biki...@netcom.com __o
Voice: (415) 296-9893 _`\<;
Fax: (415) 597-9849 (*)/(*) Cars suck. Ride yer bike.
Adam David
>said that disposing of
>bananas in the contryside was not enviro-freindly due to all the chemicals
>that they spray on banana skins, to stop them from going off. As far as I
>recall, he claimed that the crates bananas are shipped over in, are not
>allowed to be reused because of this.
This is true (except it is insecticide not preservative). Read the nice
warnings on banana boxes sometime. This is not stuff that you want left
on your hands without washing them immediately after handling the skins.
>Well, sod that, I'm not carrying aroung some squishy banana skin in my
>jersey for the rest of a ride. And let's face it, the reason that it is going
>squishy is because it is rotting/biodegrading.
In that short time, it is more likely to be going squishy due to squashing.
Assuming that the banana is going to be eaten during (not before) the ride,
there would seem to plenty of opportunity for the banana to go squishy even
before it is peeled and eaten.
Bananas need more often than not to be peeled with both hands and cleaned
up somewhat before eating. On one ride with a small group I saw 2 unpeeled
bananas hit the ground because of riders who had not mastered the deftness
of peeling them with one hand.
Since there are often bruises and other areas of spoilage on most bananas
that have reached any degree of ripeness to make them ready for eating,
I would find it far more agreeable to peel and prepare the bananas in advance
(cutting out any bad parts) and even mash them, then put them in some kind
of handy reusable dispenser for the road. So long as they are used the same
day, they would not deteriorate beyond usability. I visualise a kind of tube
or syringe that could squirt the banana mash into the mouth. There is the
added advantage that it is possible to know exactly how many cm^3 of banana
is being ingested, which is a more accurate measure than the number of bananas,
which can vary considerably in size and weight.
Even if banana peels were suitable for composting, it would make better sense
to dispose of them in an area set aside for that purpose than to throw them to
the winds. They do decompose, but I would not put them in a compost heap that
is used to nourish a food garden. They would have to go in the other heap.
Alternatively, dried bananas are good for cycling. They are not sprayed with
insecticide in the same way as fresh-shipped bananas, but they do need to be
picked over to remove occasional grit and bits of skins. Also, because of the
lower moisture content, it is more important to precharge the stomach with
water and chew the dried bananas thoroughly. In case anyone gets the wrong
idea, I mean the sticky "dead mans fingers" kind of dried banana, not the
more common crunchy banana chips.
--
Adam David <ad...@veda.is>
Gabriel D. Underwood
biodegrad.. Mr D.M. Whittle@liverpoo (549)
> dave
In a vacuum, a banana peel will never decompose. In a compost heap, a
few weeks is sufficient. For your average banana peel tossed off the
side of the trail, it's totally dependant on weather, climate, etc.
Gabe "Chiquita" Underwood
Paul Havemann
> up somewhat before eating. On one ride with a small group I saw 2 unpeeled
> bananas hit the ground because of riders who had not mastered the deftness
> of peeling them with one hand.
>
> Since there are often bruises and other areas of spoilage on most bananas
> that have reached any degree of ripeness to make them ready for eating,
> I would find it far more agreeable to peel and prepare the bananas in advance
> (cutting out any bad parts) and even mash them, then put them in some kind
> of handy reusable dispenser for the road. So long as they are used the same
> day, they would not deteriorate beyond usability. I visualise a kind of tube
> or syringe that could squirt the banana mash into the mouth. There is the
> added advantage that it is possible to know exactly how many cm^3 of banana
> is being ingested, which is a more accurate measure than the number of bananas,
> which can vary considerably in size and weight.
While that would works, it seems rather messy. One _could_, however,
blend up a tasty, high-energy banana shake. (Umm, and perhaps a dash of
rum? ;)
=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Paul Havemann (pa...@hsh.com)
David R Givers
conditions. The point of not tossing your peels relates to volume, the
assimilative capacity of ecosystems, and aesthetic values.
One peel no big deal.
Tony Tortorelli
Original posting in tor.general by pbm...@io.org (Paul B. Moore) follows:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
For Friday Night Help Cafe Surfers
From: pr...@carla.lbl.gov (Phillip N Price)
Subject: Re: Banana peels, biodegradable?
Few people realize that the banana was the product of early radiation
experiments in the South Pacific in the late 1940's. These experiments
were conducted on the Bikini Atoll, later the site for a hydrogen
bomb explosion, and were conducted under the auspices of the
Bikini Atoll Native Plantain Mutation Assignment, BANPAMA, in an
effort to produce an edible fruit for the army, that would not
decay or degrade with age. The Plantain was selected since it has
a tough outer cover that provides protection for the fruit;
unfortunately, it is not very palatable when raw. The BANPAMA
project was not particularly successful, as the resulting fruits
were found to bruise easily. However, they were still fed to
unsuspecting natives and servicemen, where they became something
of a hit. Introduced to the U.S. as "Banamas" in 1951, by former
military scientists who saw there was more money in agriculture
than in early attempts at genetic engineering, they immediately
became something of a rage. By 1958, "Bananas", as they were known
by then, were grown throughout central and south america to feed the
hungry U.S. market.
This would be a happy story of a great new food, if it weren't
for the sinister secret that was brought to light in 1978 in early
studies of "Garbology" (the study of garbage) by scientists from
the University of Arizona: the military's original project was
not a complete failure after all---although the fruit of the
banana is quite vulnerable, the peel contains enzymes that render
it impervious to virtually all biological action. In short, every
banana peel ever grown is still in existence. This discovery by
Arizona scientists led to a series of startling and bizarre
revelations, including the fact that since the late 1950's the
U.S. military, in a surprisingly successful attempt to cover up
their introduction of this non-degradable peel, has had a veritable
army of specially trained Banana Peel Retrieval Specialists arrayed
across the country. Using infrared satellite images to locate
suburban compost piles, these commandoes would strike in the dark
of night, removing banana peels and replacing them with degradable
facsimilies made from wheat, soy, marigold petals, and corn silks.
Army experiments attempting to train racoons and possums to do the
retrieval were fairly successful, and these methods replaced the
manual retrieval method over much of the country by the early 1970's.
The 1978 revelation, and the accompanying outcry, led to a crash
program by the Department of Agriculture to develop a "Green"
banana. By 1981 the program was deemed a success, having produced
a banana that degraded slowly but completely, and then-President
Ronald Reagan was able to unveil the new banana to coincide with
a meeting with heads of state from several Central American
countries. Reagan's comment that "I love these things, and I
consider myself a Banana Republic-an", was considered in poor taste
and hushed up by the then-malleable press.
So, the answer to the question is: yes, for the past 13 years
banana peels have been biodegradable. Banana peels from before
1981 are not degradable, and most of them are still in existence,
buried in huge dumps at Hanford, WA and Oak Ridge, TN. Pilot
incineration programs have been launched, and if all goes well the
non-degradable banana peels will have been disposed of by
the year 2005.
---
ş SLMR 2.1 ş