Boom tube repair
Dragon
failure. The plane hit fairly hard and flipped over on its top. Very
little damage occured from the mishap. During the course of ambulance, fire
department, police, and the farmer who owned the field... the farmer decided
he wanted it out and now! The pilot suffered a bloody nose and was thought
to be hurt. Off in the ambulance he went. The fire department, police and
farmer couldn't figure how to move the plane because of its size....
wouldn't fit on the trailer in any direction.... The fire dept had an idea
and with an ax cut the boom tube off at the bulk head and there you have it.
My question is how to repair the boom tube SAFELY?
mark smith
> before, with dents and such from prop strikes. However, the Buc aircraft have
> 2 lower longeron tubes which connect the boom tube at the rear making a strong
> structure. The Hawk being a cantilevered structure at the rear, is the only
> thing supporting the tail. Remember, The Pilots life will depend on it!
> However, I am not an engineer, so, Chuck do you wish to comment on this one?
> Jim
>
> Jim Ratte
> Recreational Mobility
> www.recreationalmobility.com
> Jim Ratte
I suggest a good lawyer write a nice letter to the county body under
which the fire company acted when cutting the plane up for hauling.
This was stupid,,,,,,,
Chuck will supply the people with a price including shipping.
Don't push the point about labor to install.
I'm sure the pilot expexted more than what he got. Perjaps a carbon copy
to the farmer to remind him where he spent 400 dollars of tax money.
just a guess on the 400 chuck, sorry,,,
--
Mark Smith mailto:tri...@trikite.com
Tri-State Kite Sales
1121 N Locust St
Mt Vernon, IN 47620 http://www.trikite.com
Dragon
my plea.... I realize this is somewhat shakey business and I'm sure there is
a safe way to repair it. Depending on the cost of repairs I may opt to get
a new one. Are there any used hawks out there? Cheap (yea right... anyone
that owns a hawk or has flown one - its like getting a lepracon off the gold
he is sitting on) Any way I appreciate all the comments on this matter.
Thanks to all who posted!
Ulflyer1
build a new one!!
charlie
IFLYAMPHIB
Richard B.
"Dragon" <Dra...@theDen.com> wrote:
> Here is the story..... A CGS Hawk went down in a field because of
engine
> failure.
I would wonder where were the police while the vandalism of cutting the
aircraft up was done. However, I can't possibly see any way that that
tube could have been cut with an axe without major damage on both sides
of the cut. Being the tail boom, any denting is going to cause a
weakness that will sooner or later have to be dealt with. Not being
familiar with the Hawk, I don't know if the boom can be replaced easily
or not, but that would probably be the easiest way, and quite likely,
the cheapest. Any repairs would require "splints" both inside and
outside the tube, and any welding on it will destroy it's temper in that
area. It's possible that telescoping tubing both inside and out, and
welding with rather deep "fishmouthing" on the splints would be strong
enough, but from the description, it's at a stress point to begin with.
Richard.
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ULAV8R
just slip inside tube. Attach tube to solid shaft firmly. Weld shaft
at right angle to 60 feet of 16 inch I beam. If you can get it to move,
pour about 50 yards of concrete over I beam. Once it sets up, it should
be safe. Otherwise, replace entire tube with new tube. Will be
lighter, but not quite as safe.
Dragon wrote:
>
> Here is the story..... A CGS Hawk went down in a field because of engine
mark smith
,,,,, I don't know if the boom can be replaced easily
> or not, but that would probably be the easiest way, and quite likely,
> the cheapest. Any repairs would require "splints" both inside and
> outside the tube, and any welding on it will destroy it's temper in that
> area. It's possible that telescoping tubing both inside and out, and
> welding with rather deep "fishmouthing" on the splints would be strong
> enough, but from the description, it's at a stress point to begin with.
>
> Richard.
again, try the lawyer approach on the vandals,
BTW, this tube on the hawks that I remember was curved slighlt,
complicating any possible sleeving operation.
mark smith
>
> Remove 2 feet either side of cut, use 8 feet of solid 4130 that will
> just slip inside tube. Attach tube to solid shaft firmly. Weld shaft
> at right angle to 60 feet of 16 inch I beam. If you can get it to move,
> pour about 50 yards of concrete over I beam. Once it sets up, it should
> be safe. Otherwise, replace entire tube with new tube. Will be
> lighter, but not quite as safe.
Cute, but I did see a couple of 'good ole boys' repair the front boom
tube section on a Teeman Monofly with a solid bar of junkyard aluminum.
Some machining and some pop rivets and it was 'good as new'.
Funny though, they thought they could fly it 'cause they were pilots,
crashed it, and then repaired it the way they thought an ultralight
would get repaired,,,
wrong on both counts,,,mark
BGaffney
>
> Here is the story..... A CGS Hawk went down in a field because of engine
> failure. The plane hit fairly hard and flipped over on its top. Very
> little damage occured from the mishap. During the course of ambulance, fire
> department, police, and the farmer who owned the field... the farmer decided
> he wanted it out and now! The pilot suffered a bloody nose and was thought
> to be hurt. Off in the ambulance he went. The fire department, police and
> farmer couldn't figure how to move the plane because of its size....
> wouldn't fit on the trailer in any direction.... The fire dept had an idea
> and with an ax cut the boom tube off at the bulk head and there you have it.
> My question is how to repair the boom tube SAFELY?
Call Chuck and order a new one...
--
Bart Gaffney
aka Bartman [E-mail] <mailto:BK...@pitnet.net>
EAA Ultralight Chapter #1 President <http://www.eaaul1.org>
Wisc. Ultralight/Light Aviation Advisory Counsel President
Co-Chair Ultralight Operations AirAdventure-Oshkosh
Rob
>
> My question is how to repair the boom tube SAFELY?
I'm afraid you will have to order a new one. You'd just be digging a
hole if you tried to repair it.
I know of a guy who crashed his Flightstar and it kinked the boom tube
at the center uprights. He spliced it with some beefy tube halves and
used cherry max rivets. It was similar to what we called ABDR (aircraft
battle damage repair) in the Air Force. It worked, but it is in a place
where it is supported on both sides with tubing. On the Hawk, it just
comes off the fuselage with no other supports. I think the Hawk boom is
glued and riveted at the base, so it will be a very big job I'm sure,
but it's the only way that I see to do it right. Have you ever watched
how the tail wobbles in flight on a Hawk or similar type ultralight? It
would scare you to death.
... Rob
steve spring
jig at Chuck,s , not an easy task! [ plus the stiffeners that go
inside the tube! ]
Talked to him a few months ago on this
and were about 1,300 bucks for a new one [2pl ]
steve
Bill Cook
Rob <fly...@micron.net> wrote in message
news:37592B7B...@micron.net...
> Dragon wrote:
> >
> > My question is how to repair the boom tube SAFELY?
>
>
process to give it its strength is a 3 step, very precise process. Any
welding will destroy the temper of the tube and cause to lose up to 60% of
its strength, UNLESS YOU HEAT TREAT IT AGAIN!!!. If its 4130 crmo tubing,
then it can be cut and welded with the correct procedure and filler
material. Of course you would want to sleeve the joint internally unless you
are going to X-ray the weld to make sure there are NO defects in it as well
as a Magnetic Particle on the outside of the weld to find minute cracks that
X-ray may miss. It's possibly your life you are playing with on a repair
like this. How much is it worth to you?
Bill of the Jungle
Rich T
up and carry it off the field? It probably weighs what,300lbs?
Rob
>
> I can't help but wonder- how many guys would it have taken to just pick it
> up and carry it off the field? It probably weighs what,300lbs?
Yea, what a shame! I can't imagine the fire department taking an AX to
the plane! Even if the land owner was screaming to get it off his
property. I would think they would have more respect for the owner of
the plane. The area in which we fly ultralights if very ultralight
friendly and an incident like this would never happen.
... Rob
ChuckSlusarczyk
says...
> The fire dept had an idea
>and with an ax cut the boom tube off at the bulk head and there you have it.
>
>before, with dents and such from prop strikes. However, the Buc aircraft have
>2 lower longeron tubes which connect the boom tube at the rear making a strong
>structure. The Hawk being a cantilevered structure at the rear, is the only
>thing supporting the tail. Remember, The Pilots life will depend on it!
>However, I am not an engineer, so, Chuck do you wish to comment on this one?
Hi Jim
Sorry for not responding sooner but I've been out of town.Some boom damage can
be repaired,but the discription above has only one safe answer "replace it".
Damage in the gear area can usually be fixed but when chopped in half with an
ax,forget it . I would also like to remind everybody with boom equiped aircraft,
to contact the manufacturer of your plane before undertaking a boom repair.I
certainly won't make you buy a new one if the old one can be safely repaired.
Is your life worth saving a few bucks??? Never take that chance.Good luck.
Chuck Slusarczyk
CGS Aviation
ChuckSlusarczyk
> Have you ever watched
>how the tail wobbles in flight on a Hawk or similar type ultralight? It
>would scare you to death.
>
>... Rob
I respectfully disagree with that remark as far as the Hawk is concerned.
The tail will shake on the ground during run ups as does the C-130 that I was
watching at the Cleveland Air Show.Once airborne the tail sits steady as a rock
if someone has a Hawk that the tail wobbles in the air call me at 440-632-1424
to discuss it, because somethings wrong.I have flown along side of,behind of ,on
top and bottom of Hawks in flight and have never seen the tail wobbling.Just
wanted to clarify things.
Chuck Slusarczyk
mark smith
maybe they were talking about the tail on Chuck, not his plane,,,,,,
mikepatt...@spammindspring.com
laughter...<vbg>
Mike
mark smith <ma...@trikite.com> wrote:
>ChuckSlusarczyk wrote:
>>
>> In article <37592B7B...@micron.net>, Rob says...
>> > Have you ever watched
>> >how the tail wobbles in flight on a Hawk or similar type ultralight? It
>> >would scare you to death.
>> >
>> >... Rob
>>
>> I respectfully disagree with that remark as far as the Hawk is concerned.
>> The tail will shake on the ground during run ups as does the C-130 that I was
>> watching at the Cleveland Air Show.Once airborne the tail sits steady as a rock
>> if someone has a Hawk that the tail wobbles in the air call me at 440-632-1424
>> to discuss it, because somethings wrong.I have flown along side of,behind of ,on
>> top and bottom of Hawks in flight and have never seen the tail wobbling.Just
>> wanted to clarify things.
>>
>> Chuck Slusarczyk
>>
>> www.cgsaviation.com
>
>
>maybe they were talking about the tail on Chuck, not his plane,,,,,,
Mike Patterson - Deacon Blues
EAA #523920 NRA #920202222 ICQ #7161589
"Sharing the things I know and love with those of my kind..."
*
In memory of Gunnery Sgt.Carlos N.Hathcock II
"Long Tra'ng" - Semper Fidelis - Feb.23rd,1999
I never knew him, but I consider him an American hero.
*
con?sult'ant n. 1. one who gives professional or technical advice 2.
mental prostitute
Dragon
call today and still got a message from Nancy about the vacation 9am monday
morning huh???? Ok chuck how much is that boom tube in the window??? Then
one with the waggly tail. HaHa
Hope your vacation went well and relaxing. Now back to the grind (or
bending )which ever the case
Ed at Fun Flight.
I figured this thread would shake up a few people. That is what happened to
the plane but I had not even considered repairing it other than putting a
new tube in the bulkheads. Also have a bent one from about a year ago.
ChuckSlusarczyk <ChuckSl...@newsguy.com> wrote in message
news:7jh572$2m...@drn.newsguy.com...
Scrappman
I was under a Hawk once,although on top of would be prefered(claws
and all),,,,,,,or from the front....(hehehe!!!!) I've flown nex to the
green Hawk at osh. many times didn't see anything mov'n.And ask the
pilot,,,,I was close enough to see!!!!!!! I have seen
many,,,,,,,many,,,,,,in fact I don't think I ever saw a challanger that
didn't have a waggely tail,,,,,,,,,,,,
Just my pennies worth
See ya at osh......
Scrappman
Skyraider 007 is now on floats,,,,zenair 750s,,,,,,,do you
guys realize how many sun bathers there are out on the
lakes????????????????
Really would like to see the super 8s again chuck,,,,,,,,,,,
William Gleason
a little wobblie :) Too much Mountain Dew.... My club has at least 12
Hawks, none of them have that problem.....
ChuckSlusarczyk
>maybe they were talking about the tail on Chuck, not his plane,,,,,,
>--
Gee Mark I don't know about that,I never saw "my" tail from the rear :)
See ya
Chuck S
ChuckSlusarczyk
ChuckSlusarczyk
>
> Skyraider 007 is now on floats,,,,zenair 750s,,,,,,,do you
>guys realize how many sun bathers there are out on the
>lakes????????????????
Yeah !! and do you know how many are female??? Oh how I love the summer...
> Really would like to see the super 8s again chuck,,,,,,,,,,,
I'll probably bring them to Oshkosh this year along with some new ones... See
ya
Chuck
>
ChuckSlusarczyk
>
>Hey Chuck, it must have been the "boom tube" in the pilots seat that was
>a little wobblie :) Too much Mountain Dew.... My club has at least 12
>Hawks, none of them have that problem.....
>
Mountain Dew ??? "Boom tube" in the pilots seat??? Oh !!! you don't mean the
main boom, but the pilots "boomlet" that was wiggling ... :)
mark smith
>
> In article <375C50...@trikite.com>, mark says...
>
> >maybe they were talking about the tail on Chuck, not his plane,,,,,,
> >--
>
I have, and it was wagging,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
William Gleason
> main boom, but the pilots "boomlet" that was wiggling ... :)
Rich T
Please keep the ultralight ng updated on this story. I've got a feeling
there's a lot of pilots who'd love to see that fireman get the poop
beaten
out of him.
Rich T.
Dragon wrote in message <7j9kpi$b...@newsops.execpc.com>...
>Here is the story..... A CGS Hawk went down in a field because of engine
>failure. The plane hit fairly hard and flipped over on its top. Very
>little damage occured from the mishap. During the course of ambulance,
fire
>department, police, and the farmer who owned the field... the farmer
decided
>he wanted it out and now! The pilot suffered a bloody nose and was thought
>to be hurt. Off in the ambulance he went. The fire department, police and
>farmer couldn't figure how to move the plane because of its size....