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Wave camps?
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Lawrence Spinetta
Dec 6, 2022, 3:12:19 PM12/6/22
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Any wave camps that soaring pilots would recommend?
Dan Marotta
Dec 6, 2022, 6:46:36 PM12/6/22
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No camps that I know of at Moriarty but, if you have a self launcher,
there's plenty of wave here. Tows are getting scarce here except for
the club on weekends.
Dan
5J
there's plenty of wave here. Tows are getting scarce here except for
the club on weekends.
Dan
5J
Jim Lee
Dec 6, 2022, 6:59:42 PM12/6/22
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We fly wave every week or two here at the home of the Minden Wave Cowboys, as the Europeans call us. We would be happy to give a tutorial of the Sierra wave, and help any visitors all that we can. Tows are available every day of the week all year by Soaring NV. Rather than looking for a wave camp at a preset date, it might be better to look at the weather and schedule a trip during a wave period.
Lawrence Spinetta
Dec 7, 2022, 9:26:19 PM12/7/22
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Lawrence Spinetta
Dec 7, 2022, 9:27:57 PM12/7/22
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On Tuesday, December 6, 2022 at 5:59:42 PM UTC-6, Jim Lee wrote:
> We fly wave every week or two here at the home of the Minden Wave Cowboys, as the Europeans call us. We would be happy to give a tutorial of the Sierra wave, and help any visitors all that we can. Tows are available every day of the week all year by Soaring NV. Rather than looking for a wave camp at a preset date, it might be better to look at the weather and schedule a trip during a wave period.
Thanks, Jim. Appreciate you highlighting Minden. Apologies for the novice wave question but when are wave periods?
> We fly wave every week or two here at the home of the Minden Wave Cowboys, as the Europeans call us. We would be happy to give a tutorial of the Sierra wave, and help any visitors all that we can. Tows are available every day of the week all year by Soaring NV. Rather than looking for a wave camp at a preset date, it might be better to look at the weather and schedule a trip during a wave period.
Jim Lee
Dec 7, 2022, 11:57:06 PM12/7/22
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Hi Lawrence,
Wave periods are 1 day prefrontal when we have west winds perpendicular to the north/south orientation of the Sierra mountains.
You should buy Dancing with the Wind by Clement to better understand the mechanics.
Wave is not for everyone. You have to be willing to put up with extreme turbulence for the pay off of the best visuals on the planet and amazing flights.
Going up and coming down in a wave box is pretty standard. Flying cross country in wave is anything but. When it is going well, you are on top of the world. When you fall into the rotor you wonder if the wings will stay attached and it goes to hell in an instant. I have flown wave with people who have said "so that's what it's all about. I don't want anything further to do with it."
So tell me again why you want to do this?
cheers,
Jim
Wave periods are 1 day prefrontal when we have west winds perpendicular to the north/south orientation of the Sierra mountains.
You should buy Dancing with the Wind by Clement to better understand the mechanics.
Wave is not for everyone. You have to be willing to put up with extreme turbulence for the pay off of the best visuals on the planet and amazing flights.
Going up and coming down in a wave box is pretty standard. Flying cross country in wave is anything but. When it is going well, you are on top of the world. When you fall into the rotor you wonder if the wings will stay attached and it goes to hell in an instant. I have flown wave with people who have said "so that's what it's all about. I don't want anything further to do with it."
So tell me again why you want to do this?
cheers,
Jim
Eric Greenwell
Dec 8, 2022, 10:03:41 AM12/8/22
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I am turbulence adverse (AKA "CS"), what percentage of XC wave days have low turbulence;
ie, "easy to stay behind the tow plane"?
--
Eric Greenwell - USA
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications
Dan Marotta
Dec 8, 2022, 12:15:56 PM12/8/22
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We get wave year round but mid-to late fall until around mid-spring are
when wave can be expected most often. I wouldn't come here during
"normal" soaring season with the expectation of wave flying, but then
the thermal soaring will get you up to Class A altitudes.
If you use Skysight, you can look at the wave forecasts around Moriarty
on a daily basis. There's a bit of wave forecast today a little west of
Moriarty that would be reachable with a high tow, easily with a self
launcher. Check a bit north of Moriarty and up into Colorado...
Dan
5J
when wave can be expected most often. I wouldn't come here during
"normal" soaring season with the expectation of wave flying, but then
the thermal soaring will get you up to Class A altitudes.
If you use Skysight, you can look at the wave forecasts around Moriarty
on a daily basis. There's a bit of wave forecast today a little west of
Moriarty that would be reachable with a high tow, easily with a self
launcher. Check a bit north of Moriarty and up into Colorado...
Dan
5J
Nicholas Kennedy
Dec 8, 2022, 1:03:45 PM12/8/22
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Wave novice here.
Back in Minden in the early 2000's the line man is hooking up the rope to my Asw 20 on a wave day.
He's says to me " Stay on the rope unless the tug rolls inverted or is pointing back at you"
My whole 1:30 flight was pretty radical.
Nick
T
Back in Minden in the early 2000's the line man is hooking up the rope to my Asw 20 on a wave day.
He's says to me " Stay on the rope unless the tug rolls inverted or is pointing back at you"
My whole 1:30 flight was pretty radical.
Nick
T
Dan Marotta
Dec 8, 2022, 7:13:19 PM12/8/22
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There was a little wave at Moriarty today. Since I just got my Stemme
out of annual inspection, I needed a test flight. Wave was around 2 -
2.5 kts and I got into a little rotor.
I didn't have the patience to climb at such a low rate so I cut it short
at 1.3 hours. Still, it was fun!
Dan
5J
out of annual inspection, I needed a test flight. Wave was around 2 -
2.5 kts and I got into a little rotor.
I didn't have the patience to climb at such a low rate so I cut it short
at 1.3 hours. Still, it was fun!
Dan
5J
George Haeh
Dec 8, 2022, 7:57:36 PM12/8/22
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The really good waves seem to have really vigorous rotors aka mechanical bulls. Even more fun for instructors with a student in front. Make sure your shoulder straps are super tight to avoid headaches.
If you are wondering why you ever took up gliding, that's a common sentiment in rotors
If you are wondering why you ever took up gliding, that's a common sentiment in rotors
Dan Marotta
Dec 9, 2022, 12:21:04 PM12/9/22
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On the day that I completed my Diamond Badge I flew the tow plane for a
dozen or so flights before getting into the glider. I recall so much
turbulence on the climb that my only points of contact with the Pawnee
were the harness, my right hand on the stick and my left hand on the
overhead fuselage tubing. I saw the glider off my right wing.
It was similar when I was on the back end of the rope except I now had
the additional task of trying to stay in position behind the tug. Then
there was the wonderful silky smoothness of the wave after topping the
rotor!
My flight was in December, IIRC, and it was cold in the Colorado
Rockies, so I limited my time to getting up and getting down. My wave
flights are now limited to about 17,700' MSL. I never want to go that
high again without heat!
Dan
5J
dozen or so flights before getting into the glider. I recall so much
turbulence on the climb that my only points of contact with the Pawnee
were the harness, my right hand on the stick and my left hand on the
overhead fuselage tubing. I saw the glider off my right wing.
It was similar when I was on the back end of the rope except I now had
the additional task of trying to stay in position behind the tug. Then
there was the wonderful silky smoothness of the wave after topping the
rotor!
My flight was in December, IIRC, and it was cold in the Colorado
Rockies, so I limited my time to getting up and getting down. My wave
flights are now limited to about 17,700' MSL. I never want to go that
high again without heat!
Dan
5J
AS
Dec 9, 2022, 8:19:35 PM12/9/22
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Check out their operation: https://www.easternsoaringcenter.com/
And yes, it gets cold! The day I flew my Diamond altitude, the pointer of a friend's OAT hid behind the cover, which meant it was well below -40C. But the view from up there plus looking down onto the airliners going into the Baltimore/DC area and seeing them getting vectored around the wave box made up for it.
Uli
'AS'
Piet Barber
Dec 9, 2022, 10:56:26 PM12/9/22
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> To the O.P.: wave-flying is not confined to the Rockies and west of it! There are several wave flying sites in the east as well. I flew my Diamond altitude over Petersburg, WVa.
> They have a wave window to FL230 and because one can release low and climb through the rotor to connect, there is plenty of altitude gain to meet the requirements.
I'm sad to say that at present, there is no wave window available in Petersburg, WV. As far as I know, I'm the last one to successfully climb into the wave window at Petersburg in 2013. (and I didn't get the diamond altitude because the Nano3 decided to not write a signature on the flight log. Ever since that day, that third diamond has been my nemesis! I rue the day!)
I've been working with the FSDO and ATC for the past 2 years to get a wave window established there.
Yes. Literally. 2 years.
My persistence is paying off. I'm really close to having one before March 2023.
At present, it's not clear if we'll be able to have gliders that aren't transponder and ADS-B equipped in the wave window. Right now, it looks like you'll have to be equipped to do this wave window. It's also not clear as to if the gliders have to be equipped with 1090ES. QQ is equipped in such a manner, but I don't know many other gliders around here that are. It might just be me who makes use of this new wave window.
Skyline Soaring club used to have another wave window in the Shenandoah valley, just west of New Market, VA. It was canceled by the FAA in 2020. It was in the one spot in the entire valley that had no wave at FL180 when the wind was coming from the northwest. It's really cool: Get a plot of SkySight on a wave day, show FL230, and draw a box where that wave window was. You'll never find any red in that box. No wave there. Just to the south there's wave galore! But not in that box. There's only been one person to get the diamond altitude in that wave window from 1993 to 2020. (Sounds like a crappy place to put a wave window if ya ask me). I had several examples of climbing under that wave window to 16,500, 17,000; and that was always a long slog at 0.1 knots.
Tony
Dec 9, 2022, 11:15:13 PM12/9/22
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Dan Marotta
Dec 10, 2022, 10:22:09 AM12/10/22
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I did not have an OAT gauge in the L-23 but I recall using my knit cap
in a futile attempt to clear a hole in the frost on the inside of the
canopy! The ability to see light above and dark below was sufficient to
keep the glider upright. Well, that and the natural stability of the
glider.
Dan
5J
in a futile attempt to clear a hole in the frost on the inside of the
canopy! The ability to see light above and dark below was sufficient to
keep the glider upright. Well, that and the natural stability of the
glider.
Dan
5J
AS
Dec 10, 2022, 11:08:23 AM12/10/22
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I hope you get the window reopened - it is in such a unique setting.
Uli
'AS'
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