PW-5 - any opinion ?
Cezary Olszewski
If you were flying PW-5 (World Class) glider - tell me some opinion about
this bird.
CharlieFox
To limit the bandwidth consumption to reasonable amounts please use one of
the following.
PW5 - Yes
PW5 - No
Fence sitters ( PW5 maybe ) will be punished by the withdrawl of their
thermalling rights.
Ps where is the r.a.s FAQ? does anyone know? This has got to be an all time
winner for that list.
More seriously though
point your browser to
http://www.deja.com/group/rec.aviation.soaring
Enter PW5 into the search discussions box, bottom centre on the page
Select the 'Search only in: rec.aviation.soaring' radio button and check
that the scroll box has 'All' selected.
This will currently return you around 500 messages posted to this forum
concerning the PW5. After reading all of this you will be no better off! Go
out to the nearest club that flies the PW5, arrange a trial flight. Talk to
the people who are at the field, the clique who fly them. If you like one or
both of the experiences. Beg, Steal, Borrow or Buy one!
Ian
Gary Boggs
Cezary Olszewski wrote in message <8nvu94$d2m$1...@news.onet.pl>...
José Barriga
At the begining had some problems with coordination, but after a fiew turns
I overcame the problem.
It is very light, very reactive to inputs and it climbs very, very well (I
manage to climb in very wek thermals that other gliders tried and couldn't).
It's very easy to fly.
During the aerotow it needs some attention as it is very light it tends to
assume a high tow position if one thermals during tow. It needs some forward
stick position it this case.
During the free flight it's very easy to fly it. As it is light it is easily
affected by turbulence, although this doesn't bring any kind of problem as
it reacts very fast to the pilots inputs. In thermals I used the speed of 80
to 85 Km/h and this way I could climb in very very weak thermals like 0,5
m/s.
The stall is very incipient almost only noticed by low speed, higher sink
rate than expected and lower airelon effectiveness.
The best glide ratio speed is around 95 Km/h and it cruises very well at
this speed. It sinks a lot at high speeds.
Landing is also easy, very strong airbrakes that allow very short landings.
One must pay attention on strong crosswind landings - it tends to turn to
wind direction during the ground run and it is very dificult to turn it in
another direction, I think this is due to low direction effectiveness at low
speeds. Th owner also told me it's because it puts two wheels on ground
(main wheel and nose wheel) immediatly after touchdown.
The pros I experienced:
- Very easy to fly and land
- Very reactive to inputs
- Very good climber
- Climbs in very weeks thermals allowing to extend flight while others land.
The cons:
- Difficult to progress in the terrain when gliding agains wind
- Crosswind landings
My conclusion
Apprecited the flight very much. I'm going to fly it again.
José Barriga
Al
in view of saving bandwidth please visti www.dejanews .com
and do 2 searches one on PW5 and the other on Bovine sex.
and yes I have flown one..
"Cezary Olszewski" <ce...@friko2.onet.pl> wrote in message
news:8nvu94$d2m$1...@news.onet.pl...
Walt Konecny
news:sq80q8...@news.supernews.com...
> Where do I begin.....
>
> in view of saving bandwidth please visti www.dejanews .com
> and do 2 searches one on PW5 and the other on Bovine sex.
>
> and yes I have flown one..
>
> Al
Er....which one? The PW or the Bovine? I understand L/D is about the
same.....
wk
Al
Al
Walt Konecny <wkon...@uswest.net> wrote in message
news:zgUo5.96$oz4.1...@news.uswest.net...
Brent Sullivan "PQ"
I hope this translates well into Polish: "Opinions are like a**holes,
everybody's got one". And trust me, with this question in this forum you'll
see lots of opinions and at least one or two a**holes.
My OPINION is that the PW5 does what it was intended to do well, ie it is a
easy to fly, easy to land glider of modest performance for beginner pilots.
It is not an asw27.
For a full discussion see rec.aviation.soaring.pw5suxdoesnotdoestoodoesnot
Brent
John Wren
> One must pay attention on strong crosswind landings - it tends to turn to
> wind direction during the ground run and it is very dificult to turn it in
> another direction, I think this is due to low direction effectiveness at
low
> speeds. Th owner also told me it's because it puts two wheels on ground
> (main wheel and nose wheel) immediatly after touchdown.
>
> - Crosswind landings
??????????? I don't know where this comes from. I have owned one for two
year ( An LS4a, ASW15, & Skylark 3 before that). The PW5 tracks quite well
in a good cross wind and has a good rudder. Because it has a nose wheel it
is correct that its course is pretty much set once your on the front wheel,
but then that's true with all other gliders with nose wheels. The glider
tends to go on to the nose wheel quicker (It is not true that the glider
"immediately" goes on to the front wheel), but that's because it slows
quicker because there is no mass and the thing stops on a dime (American
currency). Of course my PW5 is a virgin and has not been raped by a bull.
JW
Cezary Olszewski
José Barriga
experience I will handle this situation.
I've landed on completly crosswind conditions (wind about 25Km/h). I made
the approach at around 100Km/h with 3/4 airbrakes. The nose wheel touched
down just 1 or 2 seconds after the main wheel and it turned right (wind
direction). I applied full left rudder but it went on in a 30 degree angle
with runway. It stopped about 7 meters on the side of the runway without
problems. The runway is asfalted about 30 meters wide with some space on its
sides.
JB
John Wren wrote in message ...
John Wren
I did not jump in to correct you, I'm sure your a good pilot and I hope you
enjoyed your fight in the PW5. What I was hoping to correct was for those
who might jump onto RAS once or twice, see one or two messages and go away
thinking (and telling others) " Hey, the (fill in the glider type) is really
bad in a cross wind, I saw it on the internet....."
--
John Wren
"José Barriga" <jose.b...@tmn.pt> wrote in message
news:8o2sp7$ijf$1...@venus.telepac.pt...
Charles Yeates
60 ships in USA and 16 in Canada --- all pilots having fun!!
David Griffiths
> "Cezary Olszewski" <ce...@friko2.onet.pl> wrote in message
> news:8nvu94$d2m$1...@news.onet.pl...
> > Hi all !
> > If you were flying PW-5 (World Class) glider - tell me some opinion
about
> > this bird.
> >
I have only started flying 3 months ago. The PW-5 is the first and only
single seater I have flown.
I did all my initial training in a Blanik then moved up to a twin astir.
Both now seem very heavy after flying the PW-5.
It is fun to fly. The visibility is great. I love it.
José Barriga
of times if possible, even in crosswind conditions.
John Wren wrote in message ...
Tim Daniel
I flew the Invermere Soaring PW-5 for 4.5 hours on my first flight and around
2 hours on my second. My impressions (I am a low-time pilot at 140 hours):
Pro
Very, very comfortable, great to have a relief tube
Controls very light and responsive
Excellent visibility
Docile even in strong thermals, no tendency to drop a wing when thermalling
Climbs well, easy to thermal
Nice to have glass wings (vs. an L33 say) to absorb the bumps
Excellent brakes (air and wheel)
Excellent control during take-off and landing roll, even in a strong
crosswind.
Con
Canopy jettison located in same place as Blanik L-13/23 release - important
for clubs considering it as a transition ship
Seems to go down pretty fast above 65 knots or so
Seemed to fly a bit nose up on tow like a Grob 102
I didn't like the push-button trim knob - this is minor
I landed once in moderate turbulence - it got kicked around the sky pretty
well, but was very controllable. Made me wonder what the wing loading was.
Overall, I had a blast flying this ship, and would fly it again tomorrow if I
could! I felt that on a good day, even with my moderate flying abilities, I
could do a 300 in this aircraft.
Tim
>
Bruce Bartley
I recommend you to look at http://members.netscapeonline.co.uk/k6plt/
for info on PW5 and others.
Cheers,
Bruce Bartley
Cezary Olszewski wrote in message <8nvu94$d2m$1...@news.onet.pl>...
OscarCVox
PW5 very light so lively to fly
Only problems experienced by the 40 odd members having trial flights at our
club was off the winch.
It has a problem of pitching up when accelerating on the ground run resulting
in it rotating round the tail wheel into the full climb position.Problem is
greater with very powerfull winches as we have a Lasham. Potentially dangerous
if the winch then fails as you would not have time to recover. Using full
forward stick for the first few feet on the ground run helps but it is not
really suitable for inexperienced pilots.
I believe that launching in the US is almost exclusivly aerotow so it wont be a
problem for you.
Incidentaly I also fly a K6e regulary. Similar glide angle, similar climb
performance, half the price and twice the maintenance.
Enjoy yourself
Charles Yeates
any more vice than the two K8 machines that we have launched for many years.
Throttle opening speed by winch driver is a factor.
dl...@my-deja.com
Peak Soaring in Colorado during two vacations. Peak Soaring
is a really nice outfit.
I like the glider. It's a total hoot. Super nimble,
great climb rate, extremely easy to land, roomy/comfortable
cockpit.
If what I wanted to do was mostly hang out fairly near
the airport, this one would keep me smilin'.
On the other hand... it's polar is pretty marginal.
Kick up the speed a notch or two and you really pay
for it.
Good luck!
David
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Brent Sullivan "PQ"
<dl...@my-deja.com> wrote in message news:8oe1nt$dg3>
> If what I wanted to do was mostly hang out fairly near
> the airport, this one would keep me smilin'.
>
> On the other hand... it's polar is pretty marginal.
> Kick up the speed a notch or two and you really pay
> for it.
>
My goal this year was to fly from Soaring Club of Houston to Fault Line
Flyers, north of Austin. Been there, done that.
My goal next year is to do a Gold Distance in the PW5--others have done so
already.
I'll grant you that I'm having difficulty flying fast, the polar does fall
off pretty rapidly around 65-70 kts. That said, my first 110+ nm flight
speed averaged about stall speed but my 127nm flight this weekend was done
at best L:D, on average. In making that flight, I've learned things that
will help me fly faster next time. On flights of 40-60 nm I've been able to
average in the high 50's to low 60 kts.
You can't 'buy' any badges with a PW5, but you can earn 'em.
Brent
PQ
Janusz Kesik
Class I think too...
Finally I did my 300 golden (and diamond) distance in Junior but I have to
do it in PW-5 again,
I wish You 500K in "Egg on stick" ;)
Janusz Kesik
Aero Club of Czestochowa, Poland
lan...@polbox.com
http://www.soaring.enter.net.pl
Martin
Janusz Kesik <lan...@polbox.com> wrote in message
news:_Rxq5.1878$IK4....@news.tpnet.pl...
> Finally I did my 300 golden (and diamond) distance in Junior but I have to
> do it in PW-5 again,
>
You like pain, don't you?
Martin ;-)
Janusz Kesik
1) I haven't enough money for Nimbus 4 or Schleicher's 22
2) 300 in Junior is bigger satisfaction for me than the same in above types
3) This task learns me more in low performance glider (why there are so many
guys in their 1-26's?)
4) Junior is the most comfortable glider I've ever flown so where the pain
is? (It's much more comfortable than Cobra I've usually flown this year)
Try to do 500K triangle in Polish climate using Junior...
I want to see it... :))
Last Year we've about 10 pilots below 25yrs of age who did it in my
country...
Best regards and I wish You 5000K flight in Your ASW 27 ;)
Janusz Kesik
Aero Club of Czestochowa, Poland
lan...@polbox.com
http://www.soaring.enter.net.pl
Martin napisał(a) w wiadomości: ...
Martin
>
> 4) Junior is the most comfortable glider I've ever flown so where the pain
> is? (It's much more comfortable than Cobra I've usually flown this year)
>
I was refering to the peewee
> Try to do 500K triangle in Polish climate using Junior...
> I want to see it... :))
Try 500 km in the Netherlands with any type
>
> Best regards and I wish You 5000K flight in Your ASW 27 ;)
>
I'll go for the 1000 km in down under :-)
cheers
Martin
xrdlab
PW5 632km at an average speed of 133kph. No more pain than in any other
ship. ;-)
Martin wrote:
> Janusz Kesik <lan...@polbox.com> wrote in message
tonys...@my-deja.com
The club to which I belonged purchased a PW5 as
the 'first single aircraft' for new pilots. At
the time I had just gone solo and so flew the
glider as the first solo glider. I had
previously trained on L23s and a Puchacz. The
PW5 was supposedly similar to the Puchacz.
After flying twin seat gliders I found the glider
too different, especially for a low hours pilot.
The aircraft was relitavly unstable when compared
with a puchacz. As for its cross country
performance there is little to say. Its one
redeeming feature is the way it will climb in
weak thermals.
I fail to see a use for the PW5. Its low price
is truly reflected in its performance, and I am
sure most pilots would opt. for an cheap older,
but perhaps better performance glider over the
PW5.
Tony Slaven
Brad
> I fail to see a use for the PW5. Its low price
> is truly reflected in its performance, and I am
> sure most pilots would opt. for an cheap older,
> but perhaps better performance glider over the
> PW5.
Not so the Russia AC4-C, the only thing these gliders share is a short
span and a low price........my Russia can keep up with an LS-1, can a
PW-5?.....bwahahhahahahahahahahahahahah...........oh, and did I mention,
my Russia rigs in 5 minutes, handles great, outsinks the LS-1, outclimbs
the LS-1 and damn near runs with it......and the LS-1 driver is a no
slouch pilot!
Brad
Brent Sullivan "PQ"
<tonys...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:8oqumm$e2n$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> After flying twin seat gliders I found the glider
> too different, especially for a low hours pilot.
> The aircraft was relitavly unstable when compared
> with a puchacz.
Do you mean aerodynamically unstable? If so that's incorrect. Are you
confusing its lightness w/instability? It will bounce around a bit in rough
air because it is light--that's not instability. It is an extremely stable
ship. It will pop out of a stall or spin if you just take your hands and
feet off the controls. I have recovered from a spin w/out applying opposite
rudder, I just took my hands and feet off the controls (BUT I'M NOT
RECOMMENDING THIS!!! USE THE RECOVERY METHOD IN THE MANUAL!!!).
>As for its cross country
> performance there is little to say.
Balderdash! I'm just a newbie and I've done 200km XC flights. How would
you explain the following from Charles Yeates' email?
Canada 637.7km Free 3TP Distance
USA 635.2 " Straight Distance
Poland 591.2 " Free 3TP Distance
USA 590.0 " Free 3TP Distance
Germany 580.3 " Out & Return
USA 574.5 " Distance to Goal
Australia 513.2 " Triangle Distance
Australia 110.0kph 100km Triangle
USA 91.7 " 300km Triangle
Australia 76.4 " 500km Triangle
Germany 67.7 " 500km O & R
So Tony, if you just plain don't like the ship that's fine. We're all
entitled to our preferences. But to say that it can't do XC and is unstable
is demonstrably inaccurate.
Brent "I Love My PW5" Sullivan
Robert Ehrlich
>
> <tonys...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
> news:8oqumm$e2n$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
>
>
> >As for its cross country
> > performance there is little to say.
>
> Balderdash! I'm just a newbie and I've done 200km XC flights. How would
> you explain the following from Charles Yeates' email?
>
> Canada 637.7km Free 3TP Distance
> USA 635.2 " Straight Distance
> Poland 591.2 " Free 3TP Distance
> USA 590.0 " Free 3TP Distance
> Germany 580.3 " Out & Return
> USA 574.5 " Distance to Goal
> Australia 513.2 " Triangle Distance
>
> Australia 110.0kph 100km Triangle
> USA 91.7 " 300km Triangle
> Australia 76.4 " 500km Triangle
> Germany 67.7 " 500km O & R
>
> So Tony, if you just plain don't like the ship that's fine. We're all
> entitled to our preferences. But to say that it can't do XC and is unstable
> is demonstrably inaccurate.
>
> Brent "I Love My PW5" Sullivan
With sufficient lift, even the space shuttle will fly 500km cross country. But
not everybody enjoys booming conditions. I was checked for flying the club's ASW 24
on August 1st and had 18 flights on them (we have 2 of them) but was only able
to achieve 2 cross-country flights, and short ones (99 and 104 km). What would it
have been if I was flying a PW5 instead ...
John Wren
> With sufficient lift, even the space shuttle will fly 500km cross country.
But
> not everybody enjoys booming conditions. I was checked for flying the
club's ASW 24
> on August 1st and had 18 flights on them (we have 2 of them) but was only
able
> to achieve 2 cross-country flights, and short ones (99 and 104 km). What
would it
> have been if I was flying a PW5 instead ...
??????????? Perhaps in the hands of a good pilot, a lot more!
Sorry, you left yourself wide open for that one.
JW
Peter Ruelke
our 102 for a 24. As an aside, I think Karl Strideck proved it's not so much
the aircraft but the pilot making the most of the conditions, whatever they
may be, that can make even a lower performing glider shine.
Robert Ehrlich
I agree that the pilot is a major factor. Usually Francois-Louis Henry, the
winner of the French Nationals this year, who is flying in the same club, flies
the triple of the distance I fly on the same day. But he is a full time glider pilot,
being a retired airline pilot, and has been flying gliders since his early youth,
and won several nationals and world contests. I started flying gliders in 95 and
cross-country flight in 99. Nevertheless the best pilot cannot create a thermal
within your gliding range when none is available, and when class A airspace begins
2700 ft above your airfield, the difference in glide ratio between gliders may
make the difference between starting a cross-country flight or not. Of course
this depends on conditions. My third best cross-country flight this summer is a
170 km flight in an ASK23 which is just a little better than a PW5. But on most
days, for a pilot of my level, even an ASW24 was not sufficient.
You may think we are spoiled having two 24's, what would you say if I add that
we also have a Discus, a DG300, a LS6, four LS4 and four Pegase. This is not
exceptionnal for a club counting 170 members. None of these gliders were bought
new. This is the result of a wise policy of renewal of the fleet. When I started
in 95 we had only 2 LS4 and 1 ASW24, but 4 LS1f and 1 Astir that we sold, as well
as 2 wood/fabric/tube old gliders that were given to another club. At this time
the club had nearly 200 members, the decrease in the number of gliders followed
the decrease in the number of members.
Gregory S. Ellis
Janusz Kesik wrote:
> No. So why I did it???!!!!
>
> 1) I haven't enough money for Nimbus 4 or Schleicher's 22
>
> 2) 300 in Junior is bigger satisfaction for me than the same in above types
>
> 3) This task learns me more in low performance glider (why there are so many
> guys in their 1-26's?)
>
> 4) Junior is the most comfortable glider I've ever flown so where the pain
> is? (It's much more comfortable than Cobra I've usually flown this year)
>
> Try to do 500K triangle in Polish climate using Junior...
> I want to see it... :))
> Last Year we've about 10 pilots below 25yrs of age who did it in my
> country...
>
> Best regards and I wish You 5000K flight in Your ASW 27 ;)
>
> Janusz Kesik
> Aero Club of Czestochowa, Poland
> lan...@polbox.com
> http://www.soaring.enter.net.pl
>
> Martin napisał(a) w wiadomości: ...
> >