Google Groups no longer supports new Usenet posts or subscriptions. Historical content remains viewable.
Dismiss

Life Insurance for Glider Pilots

176 views
Skip to first unread message

Larry D. Goddard

unread,
Jan 3, 1996, 3:00:00 AM1/3/96
to
I am anticipating a hassle with my life insurance carrier over the fact
that I fly gliders. Can anyone point me toward good 'official'
mortality rate data that will help me in my negotiations? I have heard
or read about studies that showed that the mortality rate of glider
pilots was identical to that of non-flying but active adult males.

Can anyone help?

Larry Goddard
"01" LS-3a USA


Cynthia Glover

unread,
Jan 3, 1996, 3:00:00 AM1/3/96
to

I know this is not what you asked for, but likly your insurance carrier
will simply place an exclusion for an occurance while you are acting as
PIC. (i.e they don't pay if you are killed in an aviation accident when
you are PIC) This is actually fairly common, and you may already have it
in your policy. Another possible route for this is to accept the exclusion
in your current policy, and purchase a supplimental one from someone else
who specializes in such things. I think policies are available thorugh a
deal from the SSA or from AOPA. -RAG "80"

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Richard Glover: |"You can lead people to the truth, but you
RGL...@GONZAGA.EDU | can't make them understand it."
RGL...@ON-RAMP.IOR.COM |
http://www.biap.com/rglover/ | -Bill Watterson, "Calvin and Hobbes"
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

SoarStan

unread,
Jan 4, 1996, 3:00:00 AM1/4/96
to
I once guessed there are about half a million glider flights in the USA
every year. Since the mortality rate from glider accidents is of the order
of 5 per year...it has varied recently between 3 and 10, your risk of
death from gliding is about one per hundred thousand flights, or one in a
hundred thousand per year. Since the overall risk of dying from all
causes is about one in a thousand, your insurance company should not be
worried. But they probably will be!! And take heart...at my age my risk
of death from all causes is one in a hundred!! I'm probably at LESS risk
while I'm flying!! (just kidding!)

SoarStan

unread,
Jan 4, 1996, 3:00:00 AM1/4/96
to
I think the following figures are roughly correct. There are about
500,000 glider flights annually in the USA. The death rate has varied
between 3 and 10 in recent years...for simplicity, lets assume 5 deaths
per year. Then your risk of death from gliding is about 1 in a hundred
thousand per year. I believe the average risk of death from all causes in
the USA is about 1 in a 1000 per year, so your extra risk from soaring is
about 1%.
So your insurance shouldn't worry, and mine certainly hasn't up to now.
Take heart; at my age my risk of dying is about 1 in a hundred. So I'm
much safer while flying a glider!! (Just kidding!)

hel...@isl.stanford.edu

unread,
Jan 4, 1996, 3:00:00 AM1/4/96
to
In <4ce79b$r...@crl12.crl.com>, lar...@crl.com (Larry D. Goddard) writes:
>I am anticipating a hassle with my life insurance carrier over the fact
>that I fly gliders. Can anyone point me toward good 'official'
>mortality rate data that will help me in my negotiations? I have heard
>or read about studies that showed that the mortality rate of glider
>pilots was identical to that of non-flying but active adult males.
>
>Can anyone help?
>
>Larry Goddard
>"01" LS-3a USA
>

Larry,

I had a similar problem with my "umbrella" insurance policy,
and wrote the following letter to my insurance agent. It
didn't cut any wax, and I ended up buying more liability
coverage through my aviation insurance broker. Life insurance
is another matter though, and I would recommend looking for
a carrier which doesn't limit coverage for aviation. My group
policy (through my professional work, IEEE or Institute of
Electrical and Electronics Engineers) has no such restriction.

---- letter to my insurance agent follows ----

As we agreed in our last conversation, I am sending you this letter with
some statistics that might help Allstate's underwriter deal with covering
my flying gliders under my umbrella policy.

I have photocopied a page from "Sailplane Safety" published by the
Soaring Safety Foundation which shows a moving average of approximately
8 gliding fatalities nationwide per year. In response to my phone call, the
journal's editor, Mr. Gene Hammond, told me that there are approximately
64,000 licensed glider pilots in the country, for a rate of one fatality per
8,000 licensed pilots per year. While I do not have as precise figures for
automobiles, I believe the rate there is on the order of one fatality per
5,000 licensed drivers per year (based on estimates of 35,000 fatalities
per year and 175 million licensed drivers). I hope these figures will help
your underwriter see that Allstate's exposure due to my gliding activity
is less than if we added another licensed driver to our household. I also
should note that the graph shows the average number of fatalities over
the last five years is more like one per 15,000 licensed pilots per year,
possibly due to the SSA safety program mentioned in column 1 and that
started in 1988.

The same page also shows that there are approximately 50 glider
accidents per year nationwide, for an accident rate of one per 1,300
licensed pilots per year. While I have not yet been able to find the
average financial loss per accident, preliminary indications are that
it is usually limited to "hull damage" to the glider and is in the range
of $1,000 to $10,000. While there are rare larger losses, the above
fatality rates indicate that these occur with a frequency comparable
to that for automobiles on a per licensed pilot basis.

------- end of letter -----

There is uncertainty because not all licensed glider pilots are
active, with the BFR being the big question. But, based on
SSA's membership being about 15,000 if memory serves me,
I think it's safe to say there at least 30,000 active pilots
(about half the licensed group), which would keep the
fatality numbers comparable to auto driving.

A second point, of course, is that the fatality probabilities
are only comparable (within a factor of two roughly) on
an ANNUAL basis. If the typical pilot flies 50 hours per year
(I'm guessing here) and drives 500 hours per year (a more
educated guess, since he/she probably drives about 15,000
miles at an average speed of about 40 mph, giving a number
in the 500 hour range), then the fatality rate per hour
of activity is 10x as high for soaring. But your life insurace
company should care about their annual exposure, since
they charge you by the year, not by the hour flown. I also
believe that pilots who fly more probably do not have
a much higher annual fatality rate -- and in fact wouldn't
be surprised if it were lower since lack of recent experience
seems like a key accident causing factor.

Hoping this helps.

Martin Hellman


Albin O. Schreiter

unread,
Jan 5, 1996, 3:00:00 AM1/5/96
to hel...@isl.stanford.edu
Try one of the large Canadian companies represented in the US. None of
them rate glider pilots other than students with less than 50 hrs of
experience.


AL SCHREITER

unread,
Jan 6, 1996, 3:00:00 AM1/6/96
to

Larry, none of the large Canadian life companies charge any extra
premium for glider pilots, or put waivers in their policies. Most of the
also operate in the US. For example, Sun Life of Canada, Manufacturers
Life, National Life of Canada, North American Life, Mutual Life of
Canada and many more. Use them as an example if one of your US companies
wants to rate your policy. Lots of green air!

LD> @FROM :lar...@crl.com
LD> @N SUBJECT:Life Insurance for Glider Pilots
LD> @N UMSGID :<4ce79b$r...@crl12.crl.com>
LD> @N UNEWSGR:01rec.aviation.soaring
LD>N Path:
LD>noc.tor.hookup.net!hookup!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!gatech!psuvax1!uwm.edu!
chi
LD>-
LD>news.cic.net!newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.reston.ans.net!nntp.crl
.co
LD>m!crl12 .crl.com!not-for-mail
LD>From: lar...@crl.com (Larry D. Goddard)
LD>Newsgroups: rec.aviation.soaring
LD>Subject: Life Insurance for Glider Pilots
LD>Date: 3 Jan 1996 07:27:39 -0800
LD>Organization: CRL Dialup Internet Access (415) 705-6060
LD>[Login: guest] Lines: 11
LD>Message-ID: <4ce79b$r...@crl12.crl.com>
LD>NNTP-Posting-Host: crl12.crl.com
LD>X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]

LD>I am anticipating a hassle with my life insurance carrier over the
LD>fact that I fly gliders. Can anyone point me toward good 'official'
LD>mortality rate data that will help me in my negotiations? I have
LD>heard or read about studies that showed that the mortality rate of
LD>glider pilots was identical to that of non-flying but active adult
LD>males.

LD>Can anyone help?

LD>Larry Goddard
LD>"01" LS-3a USA
---
* CMPQwk #1.42* UNREGISTERED EVALUATION COPY


John Crawford

unread,
Jan 15, 1996, 3:00:00 AM1/15/96
to
I got a policy with Northwestern Mutual without an aviation rider.

-John


0 new messages