Would you by DG300 ?

[istvan...@yahoo.com]

I am not selling a DG300, actually thinking of buying one, but I would
like to ask opinions.
After discovery the famous main spar problem and restrictions is it a
save investment a DG300 ? As I can see the average DG300 price level
went down with approx. 5000 EUR and now is approacning my wallet size.
Do we expect more or the current price level already steady donw ? As
I can remenber one year ago a DG300 complete package from 1985-1990
with trailer was around 27-30000 EUR depending on instruments. Now
this is between 25-28000 EUR.
The operation limitations (not speaking about the Acro version) are
not serious, I could live with that.

[rocha]

Hi.

I just bought an ELAN with winglets, well equiped (lx5000, flarm, etc)
with a Komet trailer. I also had a look at the main spar problem, but
a change of 270 to 250kph max speed and 200 to 175kph in turbulence is
also not a serious problem for me. There is also a reduction in the
max weight from 525 to 450kg, meaning less ballast.

I managed to do a couple decent flights with it, and i love it. It's
easy to fly but performs very well. I'm used to flying Pegase and
there is quite a big difference. I love the view from the cockpit
thanks to the big canopy.

I'm not really into the works of the glider market, but comparing with
other gliders out there, i found it a good deal.

Ricardo

[J a c k]

istvan...@yahoo.com wrote:

> I am not selling a DG300, actually thinking of buying one, but I would
> like to ask opinions.
> After discovery the famous main spar problem and restrictions is it a
> save investment a DG300 ? As I can see the average DG300 price level

> went down with approx. 5000 EUR and now is approaching my wallet size.
> Do we expect more or the current price level already steady down ? As
> I can remember one year ago a DG300 complete package from 1985-1990

> with trailer was around 27-30000 EUR depending on instruments. Now
> this is between 25-28000 EUR.
> The operation limitations (not speaking about the Acro version) are
> not serious, I could live with that.

The DG-300 has, on paper, lost some of the advantages it enjoyed over
the Discus B and the ASW24. This is particularly true of the DG-300 Acro
versions, now that aerobatics in the type are prohibited in Europe and
recommended against in the USA.

The gliding performance is unchanged. The strength of the aircraft meets
the standards when operated as specified. It was stronger than necessary
before--it is at least as strong as necessary now, in other words. There
may be a very few DG-300/303's which are not quite as strong as they
were intended to be, and that the majority of the type actually are
still. The change in value reflects a reduction roughly equal to the
cost of finding out that a particular airframe is not affected and
establishing a basis for removing the restrictions.

See: http://www.dg-flugzeugbau.de/holm-dg300-e.html

The certification standard apparently requires a 6.4g loading. A
defective spar was tested and found to hold up to about a 9g load. So,
is the value of the DG-300/303 degraded? Apparently not very much, and
there is no reason to believe that any further drop in the market price
will take place.

Yes, I own a DG-303, but it is not for sale--sorry.

See http://tinyurl.com/32fkrr for the FAA SPECIAL AIRWORTHINESS
INFORMATION BULLETIN [CE-07-32] _recommendations_ concerning "reductions
of the operating limitations that enable safe operation of all DG 300’s
without repair of the spar caps."

"We recommend any DG 300 sailplane operating in the United States have
the actions outlined in DG Flugzeugbau Technical Note No. 359/24
incorporated."

DG Flugzeugbau Technical Note No. 359/24:

http://www.weberdata.de/~techdg/TN-DG/dg-300/dg-300elan/359-24/

Jack

[istvan...@yahoo.com]

What do you think about the current market value in Europe, of a DG300
with good shape, good, but not extrem instrumentation, simple basic
flight computer-vario, average
condition Cobra or Komet trailer (same aga like the glider) from the
mid 80's (1984-1988) ?

[Udo]

A quick servey reveals the following:
1) Elan 1985 Euro 26500
2) Elan 1985 28000
3) Elan 1985 27500
4) Elan 1986 with winglet 25000
the rest are: 1984 27000
1990 26000
1984 27000
1986 25000
check this site here http://www.segelflug.de/classifieds/

Regards
Udo

[istvan...@yahoo.com]

Thanks, I know the site, these are prices what can see in the adv. All
we know that the actual selling price is much lower, or do you think
that these are realistic prices ?
Would you buy DG300 for these price ?

[Udo]

I am not in that market, hence I can not help you, for that matter no
one else can. You must do the research. Assume you will have to pay
the median price. This in turn will set your budget. If you are able
to negotiate a better price you will be ahead.
Always have the money on hand when making an offer.
Udo

[SkyB...@gmail.com]

By definition something is worth what someone is willing to pay for
it. That goes for gliders, cars, houses, even a pack of gum. So like
Udo said, you're the only one who can decide what it's worth to you.

I have one also and think it's a very nice glider. They have good
performance, are comfortable and have great visibility. If you're
fishing for one to buy here because of the current exchange rate, at
the European prices in Euros you just may. But mine is not for sale
either. :(

I haven't seen any here for sale but the prices here may not have
changed much since we are not required to operate under the new
limitations. Most of the time I'm sure we do anyway. The FAA left it
up to the individual owners/pilots which is exactly where that
decision should lie. FAA, good on ya!

Bob

[David Sanchez]

I just but one! The dg300 never had a technical problem in flight in the
past 20 yrs (more than 500 flying around!); You can't compare to the Duo
(with a few dozen flying around since only 5-8 yrs!) which broke off in
flight; And the limitations are in fact probably only relevant for
competition pilots (and these fly nowadays LS-8 etc.), otherwise I can't
see how it could affect an avarage cross-country pilot in any way (when
do you fly at speeds >240km/h or with more than 100 kg water?); And
honestly, a Looping or a U-turn it could still easily bear, although
more complex (g-demanding) figures I'd be careful (and nowadays you fly
these on a fox or a B4 or similar)

[darry...@gmail.com]

I think you are referring to there being no known structural failures
of the wing in flight with the DG-30x. But claiming "never having a
technical problem in flight" is going pretty far. The DG-30x is not
immune to problems, and there most definitely have been "technical
problems in flight" including asymmetric deployment of spoilers (one
spoiler became disconnected), elevators partially effective (automatic
hookup not properly engaged) -- the design of DG's elevator hookup has
been problematic over the years, even with improvements it is still
possible if being very careless to assemble the elevators so the
elevator push rod in the fin is next to instead of inside the
"funnel").

I own a DG-303 Acro they are a nice standard class ship and fly well,
being an older design they are not a Discus 2 or LS8 or ASW-28.
Whether the amended ballast or airspeed limitations will be an issue
depends on where and how you fly. Personally in the Sierras and Great
Basin on the many strong days we have there I would fly my DG-303 at
max ballast. In these locations on good days many of the gliders going
XC will be fully ballasted. So for me the revised ballast limitations
(but not airspeed) are annoying (and somewhat non-intuitive to me
since the ballast weight is in the wings). The DG-303 Acro is also
fun ship to acro, very nice to fly and capable of snap rolls, tail
slides, etc. but technically now its an acro no more.

Regards

Darryl

On Oct 8, 12:57 pm, David Sanchez