DG200
Isotopo
I've never flown this glider before, and I'd like
your impressions, especially about flying in rain!
Thank you!
Luca
Mike Lindsay
writes
the first one off) We like it a lot.
Previously I had a Skylark 4 (wooden ship, L/D=37) for 20 years I was a
bit concerned because I had to learn to use the flaps and retractable
wheel on the DG.
Also glass gliders need more precise speed control, (the Skylark had
very effective airbrakes) but the first time I flew it I felt so
comfortable with it I did a mini X country (12 miles O/R to my home)
There isn't much room for all the bits and pieces I used to take in the
Skylark, and the instrument panel is very cramped. Rigging the controls
is a bit fiddly, but again, gets easier with practice.
Rain will degrade the performance, but not by very much. We try to keep
clear of the wet.
So, go for it. You'll find its a great glider.
--
Mike Lindsay
Isotopo
Thanks! I'm sure I'll enjoy it!
Luca (Italy)
Richard Brisbourne
As glass gliders go, very pleasant and easy to fly. Also excellent
approach control, good for confidence when struggling on cross country
over small fields.
Performance typical of flapped 15m gliders of its generation, maybe a
bit worse than the ASW20 which was the best at the time. You won't stay
with the modern 15m ships.
I'm intrigued by your question about rain: sounds like you make a habit
of flying in it. Actually, again, it's typical of designs of the
period, in my experience performance in rain is dreadful! Modern,
carbon-fibre gliders with thin wings are mostly better, but my advice to
anyone in a 1970's vintage glass glider is to avoid rain wherever
possible.
Only negatives are mechanical, and not too serious:
Waterballast: The arrangement using twin choke cables (one to each wing
tank) is unreliable. Correct operation depends on the outer cable being
gripped in a clamp while the inner is pulled through it (just like the
choke on your car). Trouble is the outer works loose in the clamp, and
the water doesn't dump, or, more interestingly, dumps from one wing
only. Luckily the only time I landed with one wing full and one empty
was on a runway: one of those plastic plates on the wingtip finished up
about a quarter of an inch shorter than the other. On another occasion
I landed in a field having, unknown to me, failed to dump water (I just
wondered why the landing was a bit heavy). We only realised when
attempting to de-rig. This was fixed on the 202.
The instrument panel is small, and by modern standards not easy to work
on.
Some people (not me) have had problems with the undercarriage retracting
on the ground run for no obvious reason.
The otherwise excellent gel coat tends to crack easily from the corners
of the brake boxes, and needs going over every 5 years or so.
However the big mechanical plus is a nice durable finish: I've never
seen the crazing you get on some 15-20 gliders.
On the whole, good value for money, especially recently.
--
Richard Brisbourne
Finbar
I'd love to get your first impressions when you fly it. I expect to
be getting going in a -202 before long, and am looking forward to it!
Richard Brisbourne <ric...@rbris.demon.co.uk> wrote in message news:<JHGChAAt...@rbris.demon.co.uk>...
Isotopo
> I'm intrigued by your question about rain: sounds like you make a habit
> of flying in it. Actually, again, it's typical of designs of the
> period, in my experience performance in rain is dreadful! Modern,
> carbon-fibre gliders with thin wings are mostly better, but my advice to
> anyone in a 1970's vintage glass glider is to avoid rain wherever
> possible.
I'm worried about rain!
I mean that I've never been in heavy rain conditions before and when I was
in "light" rain I was with an ASK21, which is generous aircraft in many
ways...
We (me and my syndacate) are not going to buy this DG200, but only to manage
it for 2002 instead
of its owner, who hasn't flown it for 2 years.
As a matter of course, we were happy when he offered us to use it almost for
free..
But we were also told that the DG hlves its L/D ratio when in rain..
The only performing single seat I've tried before was a standard Cirrus (I'm
a rookie...) and it seemed to me
that it was a little unrelialable in certain conditions (turning at low
speed spinning
is very close); maybe this is due to its particular airfoil; older laminar
airfoils are in serious trouble in rain.
I've read about rain drops running from the trailing edge up to 20% of chord
and then spurt upward
(I mean in quite normal flight conditions, not in stall..)
Thus I asked for your authoritative opinion about the worst (as far as I
know) charateristic of DG200....
> Waterballast:
[cut]
>. This was fixed on the 202.
Thank you, I won't forget it!
I hope that my english was understandable!
Luca
Isotopo
Finbar <finbar...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
bdff18c1.0204...@posting.google.com...
> Luca,
>
> I'd love to get your first impressions when you fly it. I expect to
> be getting going in a -202 before long, and am looking forward to it!
Wait for a complete report from me and my fellows!
Just wait a few weeks...
Ciao,
Luca
RON W
Funny you all should be talking about subject of DG200's and RAIN !
May I share an experience in my DG200 that Ihad TODAY?? I bought it
last season, and fought it out with gear that would not raise (solved
by a new gas tube), release that would not stay closed on tow...
(solved by new release), and BRAKES THAT WERE @#%*ing USELESS
(beautifully solved by Mike Morse of Vintage Brake, Sonora, CA)
Today, there was rain in the area, but our gliderport was dry thru the
AM. Ceiling was a bit better than 1200' , and just checked by the tow
pilot. We had just gotten done installing our new brake shoes from
Vintage Brake, and we were all wondering IF the system would at last
work. (These brakes had become the "club project" for over a month...
and we were all pumped to see the big conclusion). We decided to put
her together, and get a tow for a quick landing shot. We did not tape
her up... Our gliderport is perched on a 750 foot ridge; you are
towed off the runway and you are suddenly at 750 over the valley.....
and almost right above our 1/2 mile long emergency field. Can you see
where the story is heading?? :) No sooner than the towplane began
to roll, it started to rain... I'm normally off the runway at 40
kts... but I'm running with the stick all the way to the aft stop...
we're doing 55 kts... nothing... I'm rolling. No time left to abort,
so I throw in +4 degrees flap. I pop off the runway, and we're away
and towing about 60 kts. as the ridge drops away. Although 60 kts. is
usually fine, I'm finding that I'm occasionally bumping the stick
against the aft stop, and still having a bit of trouble keeping the
towplane on the horizon, but the tow is basically fine. All of the
sudden it's really pouring and the canopy is getting a bit foggy...
not too bad, but I'm a little concerned. Soon, we're at 800 AGL over
our normal IP, and I release (have to stay legal, you know).
Normally, This is PLENTY of altitude to have a stress-free pattern.
The moment I release, she pitches over a few degrees... what's THIS?
I decide to speed up to 65 kts.and only then try a turn back to the
field. ( The manual states that approach speed is 51 Kts. I have had
no problems to date with this speed IN DEAD AIR.) So now I'm sinking
like a file cabinet with only 4 degrees of flap, and I'm afraid to go
back to 0, haulin' at 65 kts. My dive brakes must be open, or
something... Nope. The vario is pegged, and the audio is going
DOOOOOO..! (the first sylable of "du-fus", I believe) I crank it
onto downwind happy to be AT 500' over the field and angle in to keep
it closer, but by the time I'm ready to turn base from this already
SHORT downwind, I'm WAY to shallow to make the field! Remember, the
purpose of this flight was to test my brakes...which have been useless
till now. I cannot afford to cut in too soon and risk landing long. I
cannot shoot a 65Kt. approach in any event, and stop without brakes,
either!! Our runway is 1000' long and would have gone by pretty
quickly. The only option was to bail to the emergency field, which is
what I did. I flew the approach at 65 Kts ALL THE WAY DOWN roundout.
When I had the field made, I dumped in full flap, which is only 12
degrees on my 200.. Even with the added airspeed, I was still much
closer to the aft stop for my liking in roundout. "Normal" approach
speed may well have made a DG lawn dart out of me. I only have 25
hours in the ship to date, and THIS was her first outlanding. NOT a
good occasion to manage both the outlanding WHILE figuring out how to
manage this flying brick in the rain. You bet I flew the straightest
yaw string man has ever seen in those pattern turns... :) Now for
the good news. The brake shoes provided by Mike Morse of Vintage
Brakes worked to perfection. I was stopped in 270 feet in wet grass
(I paced it out where the grass first showed my wheel marks to the
stopping point) The brakes did NOT have the least bit of fade, and I
did manage to ineptly pick the tail off the ground momentarily.
Lessons learned: 1) DG200 is a disaster in rain!! Corallary to
lesson 1: DON'T even THINK about launch/landing operations with this
ship near rain. I"m sure a pass thru a shower would no big deal. Now
for other good news. During dry weather, she is a real joy to fly,
and I feel very good about her handling characteristics. Tows
easily... Nice trim system resists airspeed changes, so it doesn't
tend to run away from high performance glass beginners like me, should
your attention get diverted on approach. Stalls are docile and
preceeded by plenty of warning. It shows no tendency to suddenly drop
a wing. I'm a heavier pilot, and therefore in the forward part of the
CG envelope. I've done a number of weeny spin entries, but I have not
let them develop. Top rudder puts her back to flying in a flash. The
forward CG certainly helps. In short, now that I have the mechanical
issues fiinally managed, I look forward to having a ton of fun in my
200 this season. DRY FUN, that is... Any readers that are interested
in info about increasing their TOST drum brake performance, call this
guy: Mike Morse Vintage Brakes 209-533-4346. Mike is a real
gentleman, and he delivered. My totally useless 5"TOST wheel now
actually feels like a disc... :)
RON WACLAWIK Harris Hill Elmira NY
cernezzi
just fly very very slowly, and with positive flap setting (Landing flap
= +15 degrees is excellent for this).
Tested many times, on purpose.
For no reason, ever, fly faster (mc cready). It would be like flying
fast with an open tail parachute! You are not tryng to escape a
descending airmass: it's the aircraft itself wich is creating a lot of
drag, increasing with the square of the speed.
IMHO.
Happy landings
Aldo Cernezzi (DG400)
Finbar
keep the nose up.
Ron W's note would be consistent with the wing having a lower lift
coefficient when wet (which I'm sure it does). This would would have
a similar effect on the trim speed as flying with negative flaps
(okay, it's different, but at least not unrelated) - the trim speed
would increase because the "longitudinal dihedral" (the effective
angle-of-incidence difference between the wing and the tailplane)
would be effectively decreased. Maintaining a low speed would require
increasing that angle again, by holding the elevator up, but the
effectiveness of full up-elevator would be less than normal.
Positive flap settings will increase the lift coefficient of the wing,
and give the aircraft a larger "longitudinal dihedral", so it should
help. However, it will also increase the nose-down pitching moment of
the wing itself, reducing the nose-up effect or even contributing a
nose-down tendency. In most aircraft the nose-up effect wins, and
flaps reduce the trim speed. Not having flown a DG-200 I don't know
which effect wins out there, but the effect should be much the same as
in a -400, I'd think, since they have very similar geometry.
What have you found?
cernezzi <cern...@tiscalinet.it> wrote in message news:<3CBB110A...@tiscalinet.it>...