Macready values in Kts for PW-5
Graham Wardell
kts. I have the vario and the ring fitted but need to know the values to
draw or paint onto the ring.
Many thanks,
Graham Wardell,
New Zealand.
--
Graham Wardell
P.O. Box 22133, Otahuhu
Ph 09 6389305,
FAX 09 6389033 (by arrangement only please)
Al
-1ft/s fly60knots
0ft/s fly60knots
climbing fly 35knots.
DO NOT EVER EVER EVER fly any faster than 60knots....it has the penetration
of a wet brown paper shopping bag.
Al
"Graham Wardell" <gwar...@ihug.co.nz> wrote in message
news:3A778672...@ihug.co.nz...
Janusz Kesik
We say it flies like newspaper :)
Great in thermal and great by the wind :)
No mention about against the wind...
In true, the Macready from Puchacz, or maybe Junior could help.
--
Janusz Kesik
Aero Club of Czestochowa, Poland
jant...@interia.pl
www.soaring.enter.net.pl
Al <acro...@www.silentflight.com> wrote in message
news:t7f8hi5...@news.supernews.com...
Charles Yeates
worked well for me for three years.
BTW, the Williamson 35:1 whiz wheel makes a great final glide calculator --
flew a 55km final glide in 42 min at the NZ nationals for Sports and PW5
CY
Al
land '-)
In all seriousness my time in the PW5 is limited to 3 hours and about 100Km
of XC in the damn thing.
If you fly it about 60knots it worked well enough. over 60knots and it would
fall out like a rock.
Climbed real nice real slow though.
Al
"Charles Yeates" <yea...@ns.sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:3A781B93...@ns.sympatico.ca...
Ian Spence
> -2ft/s fly60knots
> -1ft/s fly60knots
> 0ft/s fly60knots
> climbing fly 35knots.
>
> DO NOT EVER EVER EVER fly any faster than 60knots....it has the penetration
> of a wet brown paper shopping bag.
>
> Al
More nonsense from Al. For an informed opinion, ask Trevor
Florence at Invermere (holder of present PW5 World 3TP distance
record of 638 km which, incidentally, I OO'd). Trevor flew much
of his flight at 80 kts or better.
I have also flown the PW5 (and more than 40 other types)
and I found that it's OK up to about 70-75kts, after which the sink
rate does get unacceptably high. If you are interested, read my
article on Invermere and the PW5 in Free Flight. Go to:
Then get the Oct/Nov issue (you need Adobe Acrobat Reader,
which you may download for free.)
Al is just too spoiled by 60:1--he needs to get out and rely on
pilot skills for his X-C performance, instead of the glider ;-)
Ian Spence, WW
airg...@my-deja.com
hill and take another launch.....
"Al" <acro...@www.silentflight.com> wrote:
> I thought with a PW5 you looked between your feet and thats where
your gonna
> land '-)
Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/
Al
Ian after reading your article I now totaly understand your views!!
Being a flat lander from the frozen north a PW5 might well suit your
conditions. But the $20,000 Jantar you kept comparing the PW5 to would kick
its ass out here in NV. your entire article rants on about not buying a
Jantar etc.
As for speed to fly I found in the one PW5 I flew anyting over 60-65knots
was a waste of time I got better XC speed just cruising at 60 inter thermal.
flying faster lost too much height.
As for big wings and pilot skills I suggest you come down here and play
before going on about pilot skill etc..
Looking forwrd to flying with you some time.
Al
"Ian Spence" <spe...@psych.utoronto.ca> wrote in message
news:3A783365...@psych.utoronto.ca...
Bruce Bartley
Here's the numbers I use;
1 kt 53
2 kt 59
3 kt 64
4 kt 67
5 kt 71
6 kt 73
7 kt 76
8 kt 78
These are the interthermal speeds I use normally, BUT always constrained by
the requirement that the next lift must be within reach!
Kaimai ridge 90-105 kts
The PW5 with its shorter wings has a higher Cl wing section, and thus a
greater pitch angle change between speeds. It does look severe at higher
speeds but the glider is not actually flying down where it seems to be
pointing. It "looks down" but "goes along". This fools most of the long
wing
guys for a while, thus the non-sensible postings that you'll frequently see.
If youre going to rely on the mechanical PZL vario I have to tell you that
the one in my glider has an error of about 50%!! ie A 6 knot Actual climb
will show a as a 4 knot climb on the PZL.
Bruce Bartley
2 x NZ PW5 Champion
"Janusz Kesik" <jant...@interia.pl> wrote in message
news:958pme$37k$1...@news.tpi.pl...
Ian Spence
> Here we go...
>
> Ian after reading your article I now totaly understand your views!!
>
> Being a flat lander from the frozen north a PW5 might well suit your
> conditions. But the $20,000 Jantar you kept comparing the PW5 to would kick
> its ass out here in NV. your entire article rants on about not buying a
> Jantar etc.
The reasons were not based on performance--and you know that since
you probably read the article with your usual care and attention to detail ;-)
> As for speed to fly I found in the one PW5 I flew anyting over 60-65knots
> was a waste of time I got better XC speed just cruising at 60 inter thermal.
> flying faster lost too much height.
No way you'll beat Trevor's record with that strategy!
> As for big wings and pilot skills I suggest you come down here and play
> before going on about pilot skill etc..
I've flown Minden several times, including flying in Ameriglide 90
(pre-worlds), where I placed 14th in Standard Class. We flew
lots of 500+ tasks with some speeds over 135 kph, so I don't think
that my pilot skills are too lacking ;-)
> Looking forwrd to flying with you some time.
Come to Invermere this summer and we'll race PW5s ...
<snip>
Ian Spence, WW
Al
Been talking with Ernie about it for a while
Doing the Ely NV camp this summer have to see how vacation time plans out.
regards
Al
"Ian Spence" <spe...@psych.utoronto.ca> wrote in message
news:3A787AF9...@psych.utoronto.ca...
Janusz Kesik
JK
Janusz Kesik
Why might I buy PW-5 (in right order):
- Low price for new glider (no overhauls in near future)
- Easy to fly (You don't be very current as it has very docile
characteristics)
- I would buy it if I plan spending >90% of my time in air as DMAAS
(Driving My Ass Around Sky = local flying)
- The last one is flying monotype in contest.
Why might I buy Jantar Std.
- Low price per L/D in a glass form.
- Good runner in a XC flights and You may get 750km in it not only in
Australia, NZ or SA.
- Well checked design.
- Polish standard class contests uses unoficially Jantar as a monotype.
My friend who usually flies Jantar (v. 41a) described his 300km try in PW in
good weather with words "it was permanent circling".
For me Jantar Standard (3 or 2 with modified one piece canopy) will always
beat the PW-5. PW will be better in ridge and in 0.5m/s climbs, but who
flies XC in those days?
But it doesn't mean that PW is BAD, AWFUL, and the worst glider of the
world. It's just totally different to the Jantar, targeted to the totally
different user (less experienced, the glider really for all classes of
pilots). And due to those differences they shouldn't be compared.
Personally I would like the most to buy Cobra.
Best regards,
--
Janusz Kesik
Aero Club of Czestochowa, Poland
jant...@interia.pl
www.soaring.enter.net.pl
Al
Its a screaming day out here in NV you have 4 planes to choose from ...
a PW5.
a Cobra
a Jantar 3
an SZD59 with the short tips on.
what do you take?
Me the 59... cos over 100knots its better than the 15M version of the Jantar
3 plus you can pull G's till you puke.
In its short span it still kicks PW5's in the nuts with 36:1 LD ;-)
Aint nothing better than a good acro session. except maybe 100mile final
glides '-)
Al
"Janusz Kesik" <jant...@interia.pl> wrote in message
news:95ad8h$4uh$1...@news.tpi.pl...
EWSFLY @ Yahoo
calculation as I could imagine you couldn't do the math.
Fooling around at 60 kts on a good day here in Invermere will get you sucked
into the cloud. We don't have these 18,000 ft + cloud bases you get in the
sierras down there.
Ernie
"Al" <acro...@www.silentflight.com> wrote in message
news:t7f8hi5...@news.supernews.com...
EWSFLY @ Yahoo
that we will have two on line for renting this year. And beside that - we
already have some guys aiming for the 750 km in the PW5 up here. And Trevor
is just back from NZ and getting ready for the season as well.
Would be a blast to have Ian and Al give it a run in the PW5's.
I'll buy the beer and the BBQ for that evening -
Ernie
"Al" <acro...@www.silentflight.com> wrote in message
news:t7h1i5p...@news.supernews.com...
Al
Al
"EWSFLY @ Yahoo" <ews...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:eu9e6.1072$ge.25...@news.randori.com...
Al
Sage brush isnt very forgiving to any glider even a little one.
Al
"EWSFLY @ Yahoo" <ews...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:lp9e6.1041$ge.21...@news.randori.com...
ina...@my-deja.com
comments that not only lack information, but have no other intent than
to get a reaction out of someone that otherwise just wants assistance.
Comments that, Al, you seen only capable of producing.
The PW-5 plane, by design, is produced for competition. Any competitor
wants to extract the best performance from the vehicle they compete
with, be it a glider, car, or their own body. As such, I responded to
the originator of this posting with real information.
The usenet is for anybody to say anything, I understand. But when I
see posts that include 'stfu', as in the "Yawn" thread, I can contain
my silence no more.
As a general rule in life, I try to make sure that "No place is left
worse off for me having been there". I rarely see a thread that is not
reduced in its ability to produce concise information to the original
posting, or immediate responses, by some inane comment.
I receive many e-mails from glider pilots. Their ability to
communicate in a positive light, providing assistance and support,
never ceases to impress me. It pains me to see that so many of our
public postings are either the pathetic ramblings of a person who gets
such enjoyment out of adding unimaginative diversions to otherwise
informative interactions, or ones like this, which are a response to
such behaviour.
I realize that I am perpetuating my own complaint, but after the 'stfu'
comment, I could contain this no longer.
Al, do you ever ask yourself "Does anyone other than me care about this
posting?"? And if you do, why does the answer "No" never appear in
your head? These, of course, are rhetorical questions. Alas, I waste
my breath.
Regards,
Ian Nadas
N2
====================================================================
In article <t7f8hi5...@news.supernews.com>,
Al
McCready thing to peices in here now!!
We are all suffering cabin fever and need something to keep us going through
the dark months.
As far as some of the recent posts I enjoy the retoric and banter it sparks
off to say the least.
If you dont like it dont read it...
Now about that variable McCready thing.... '-)
Al
<ina...@my-deja.com> wrote in message news:95ctnj$mku$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
EWSFLY @ Yahoo
in the valley is gone ... but I guess you really need a few good days flying
up here in a PW5 or in the Duo or whatever so next time you think about the
place the landout options isn't the first thing which comes to your mind
....
come up ... face the challenge ..
Ernie
"Al" <acro...@www.silentflight.com> wrote in message
news:t7j1lud...@news.supernews.com...
Bruce Hoult
> Just once, it would be nice to see a thread that is not polluted with
> comments that not only lack information, but have no other intent than
> to get a reaction out of someone that otherwise just wants assistance.
> Comments that, Al, you seen only capable of producing.
>
> The PW-5 plane, by design, is produced for competition. Any competitor
> wants to extract the best performance from the vehicle they compete
> with, be it a glider, car, or their own body. As such, I responded to
> the originator of this posting with real information.
Due to having been away down south (Omarama) and IHUG having just
dropped all the old articles on the floor (again) I'm coming to this
discussion late.
Here are some PW-5 polar numbers that I found on the net somewhere and
then extrapolated to my weight (a *ahem* little *ahem* over 110 kg).
They seemed to work OK at the recent NZ PW-5 Nationals. Due to my being
a bunny at competitions I landed out on all but one day out of the four
I flew, but I won that day so something must have been right :-)
The numbers I found were in km/h but I'm sure you can convert. I've
already converted the last column (speed @ my weight) to knots. Not
that that will help you much :-)
kmh @ 60 kg kmh @ 110kg kmh @ me kt @ me
stall 60 65 67 36
0 74 81 83 45
-1 90 97 99 54
-2 102 109 111 60
-3 112 120 122 66
-4 121 129 131 71
-5 129 137 139 75
-6 137 145 147 80
-7 144 152 154 83
-8 150 159 162 87
-9 156 165 168 91
-10 162 171 174 94
I didn't actually alter the ring in the (club) glider, but just
remembered to fly at 45 knots in zero sink, 55 in -1, and then add five
knots of forward speed for every extra knot down ... which should be
near enough. Those are final glide numbers. When expecting another
climb I added 5 - 10 knots depending on the strength of the lift and how
likely I thought I would be to get to the next lift with positive
altitude. But it really doesn't matter -- the theoretical penalties for
flying at slightly the wrong speed are very small and here in NZ the
conditions aren't anywhere near uniform enough to go around blindly
applying Macready theory anyway.
-- Bruce
Tomasz Sielicki
You have my full support. Sorry to have to state this, but Al's continuous
comments on each and every subject in this group, whether he really has
something of value to say, or not, do disturb me. It's all out of
proportion. Seems to want to dominate by force in r.a.s., just as if it
were his private yard. Saying: "If you don't like him, just don't read him"
helps nothing, especially seeing that he himself has the courage to write
to others something like that mentioned 'stfu'.
Tomasz
ina...@my-deja.com wrote:
> Just once, it would be nice to see a thread that is not polluted with
> comments that not only lack information, but have no other intent than
> to get a reaction out of someone that otherwise just wants assistance.
> Comments that, Al, you seen only capable of producing.
(...)
Bert Willing
soap operas doesn't help either?
If you click on the messages of anybody, including Al's nasty remarks on
PW5's, you obviously want to read it.
BTW, if Al would not persist in those remarks on these pewe things somebody
else would have to jump in ... :-)
Didn't want to read this either? Sorry.
--
---------------------
Bert Willing
Calif A21S
Come fly at La Motte du Caire in Southern France:
http://la-motte.decollage.org
Tomasz Sielicki <tsie...@tchr.org> a écrit dans le message :
3A7A8A9B...@tchr.org...
Tomasz Sielicki
You won't believe it - just check it with http://www.deja.com/ search
machine:
It gives a result of:
- 900 matching postings for "Al <acro...@www.silentflight.com>" as author in
this newsgroup in year 2000
- 130 postings between Jan 1, 2001 - 1 Feb 2001 alone.
No comment.
BTW, Bert. Your numbers are 60 and 8, respectively. Just for comparison.
Best regards,
Tomasz
Bert Willing wrote:
> So you mean to say that switching off the TV set because you can't stand
> soap operas doesn't help either?
>
> If you click on the messages of anybody, including Al's nasty remarks on
> PW5's, you obviously want to read it.
>
> BTW, if Al would not persist in those remarks on these pewe things somebody
> else would have to jump in ... :-)
> Didn't want to read this either? Sorry.
>
> --
> ---------------------
> Bert Willing
> (...)
Al
Just click on by if you see my posting.
Dont ever read what I say or post on here and you will lead a long and happy
life I am sure.
I guess freedom of speach on the internet isnt a reality after all.
Al
"Tomasz Sielicki" <tsie...@tchr.org> wrote in message
news:3A7A8A9B...@tchr.org...
Tomasz Sielicki
Things are not as easy as that. I am really interested in reading everything of
some value here and I would really miss many of your valuable postings. Just...
just don't feel compelled to reply to everyone and on every subject. Please...
Can you imagine this group is read from all over the world?
For me it's BASTA on this subject - and yes, I will be looking forward to any
interesting remarks/postings on r.a.s. from you.
Tomasz
Freddy Frenzy
you didn't loose all your humour during the last few hard winters, did you ?
Soon there will be flying time again and Al will post IGC files instead of
sarcastic remarks.
take it easy, the sun will get higher soon and melt the snow ...
Freddy
"Tomasz Sielicki" <tsie...@tchr.org> wrote in message
news:3A7ADAA8...@tchr.org...
Al
Al
"Freddy Frenzy" <noval...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:t0De6.1792$wa5.44...@news.randori.com...
Janusz Kesik
r.
Scenario 2: Take Cobra and run for the fast 500K, then take some full aerob
atics, (still with 15m wings) with barrels and other stunts, then land and g
o for a beer.
Scenario 3: Take PW-5, fly hard and slow 200K, then land and go for a couple
of beers to forget about lost, screaming day.
V 2.0 loox best for me. Good xcountry and acro without playing with short or
long things ;) And with Cobra inside. :)
If needed, the Jantar may be replaced with 15m version of "59". You may also
use short "59" as Cobra. If You're addicted to "59" of korrrz. :))
--
Janusz Kesik
Aero Club of Czestochowa, Poland
jant...@interia.pl
www.soaring.enter.net.pl
Al <acro...@www.silentflight.com> wrote in message news:t7hphh5ote9v3f@new
s.supernews.com...
Marc Silverman
the original thread,just answer the original posting and ignore Al.If you
answer Al you deserve what you get!
Sorry Al ,I enjoy your humor but sometimes your a pain in the ass.I know a
group of glider pilots that have plastic voodoo dolls of you on their panels
just like your plastic Jesus,except they stick another pin in the doll every
time they read another posting from you.Hope to meet you sometime.Marc
Silverman WV.
SoarNV
>From: "Marc Silverman"
<snip>
>Sorry Al ,I enjoy your humor but sometimes your a pain in the ass.Iknow a
>group of glider pilots that have plastic voodoo dolls of you on their panels
>just like your plastic Jesus
<snip>
Hey Al, maybe you should be offering the Al effigy on your website for Marc's
friends.
All proceeds to benefit the "Long Wing Redevelopment Program of Minden".
Al
Maybe a voodoo Al doll for PW5 drivers might work though.
Mind you someone said there would be market for 2000 of the damn things by
2001 in the US alone.
Guess their sales manager was on drugs or some other voodoo.
Aint no one gonna get rich peddling gliders from what I have seen so far.
However all donations are welcome for the "keep the 22 looking beautiful"
fund.
Al
long wing redeveloper.
Minden NV (home of the 100mile final glides.)
"SoarNV" <soa...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010208003630...@ng-bj1.aol.com...
Janusz Kesik
2000 PW-5's
vs
1 (one) Al's "22"
Nec Hercules contra plures...
Like the Luftwaffe in 1945 ;)
JK
> Maybe a voodoo Al doll for PW5 drivers might work though.
> Mind you someone said there would be market for 2000 of the damn things
by
> 2001 in the US alone.
> Guess their sales manager was on drugs or some other voodoo.