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Skysight weather on Oudie N
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Doug Levy
Mar 18, 2022, 2:08:04 PM3/18/22
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I've been using Skysight convergence and wind info for years on my Oudie 2. After the connector failed on my Oudie 2 I purchased an Oudie N. I have the N set up with Skysight information and linked to my iPhone and home wifi.
The weather shows up fine for a few hours but then goes away later in the flight. The weather showed up longer on Navigator on the phone but it later disappeared as well. My last flight was 5 hours. The Oudie N lost weather after about 2 hours, the phone after about 4 hours.
I've seen the same issue when driving with the Oudie N in my car without an internet connection.
On the Oudie 2, I would download the weather in the morning for the day. Connecting the Oudie N to the Naviter updater does not work, it requires a WIfi connection. I have it connected to my phone and home wifi.
I've sent Naviter support for advice and help but have not heard back from them.
Has anyone had similar experiences or advice?
The weather shows up fine for a few hours but then goes away later in the flight. The weather showed up longer on Navigator on the phone but it later disappeared as well. My last flight was 5 hours. The Oudie N lost weather after about 2 hours, the phone after about 4 hours.
I've seen the same issue when driving with the Oudie N in my car without an internet connection.
On the Oudie 2, I would download the weather in the morning for the day. Connecting the Oudie N to the Naviter updater does not work, it requires a WIfi connection. I have it connected to my phone and home wifi.
I've sent Naviter support for advice and help but have not heard back from them.
Has anyone had similar experiences or advice?
Eric Bick (DY)
Mar 19, 2022, 9:37:52 AM3/19/22
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I have been in regular correspondence with Naviter re Oudie N for several months testing the software. It is taking a few days for them to respond right now, as they are working to get additional features added (such as the polar for my AMS Carat, which is now there). Here is their response to my query for the Oudie N unit re what you wrote:
“Yes, currently weather data will be loaded only with a good Internet connection. In the future, we will also add the possibility to download weather data for offline use upfront.
Note you can also follow the development roadmap in this comparison table:
https://naviter.com/compare-oudie-n“
I tested this, like you did, on a long road trip. The current map, via cell connection (I put my phone SIM in the Oudie N) was fine so long as the SIM card was inserted. After taking out the SIM card, the convergence/winds/wave info faded as we moved to the next time epoch. I don’t know whether it will update the maps on the fly if you are using a hotspot via your iPhone. Their info says to put the SIM card in the Oudie N, I believe. I’m hoping to fly with it sometime in the next month or so.- once we get some decent weather in Moriarty.
“Yes, currently weather data will be loaded only with a good Internet connection. In the future, we will also add the possibility to download weather data for offline use upfront.
Note you can also follow the development roadmap in this comparison table:
https://naviter.com/compare-oudie-n“
I tested this, like you did, on a long road trip. The current map, via cell connection (I put my phone SIM in the Oudie N) was fine so long as the SIM card was inserted. After taking out the SIM card, the convergence/winds/wave info faded as we moved to the next time epoch. I don’t know whether it will update the maps on the fly if you are using a hotspot via your iPhone. Their info says to put the SIM card in the Oudie N, I believe. I’m hoping to fly with it sometime in the next month or so.- once we get some decent weather in Moriarty.
Doug Levy
Mar 26, 2022, 12:15:35 AM3/26/22
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Doug Levy
Mar 26, 2022, 12:28:55 AM3/26/22
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On Saturday, March 19, 2022 at 6:37:52 AM UTC-7, Eric Bick (DY) wrote:
Hi Doug,
sorry to keep you waiting for answers!
USA SkySight weather display issue is well noted on our end. I have added your case to our internal issue for this as well. We will certainly notify you when it is troubleshot!
> I like to fly with polarized sunglasses. The display on the Oudie N appears black with my sunglasses on. Can the display be changed to landscape instead of portrait mode?
Using polarized sunglasses with LCD displays is, unfortunately, no go.
This is a physical limitation - most modern LCDs use a polarizing filter to help you see the screen in bright sunlight. But so do polarized sunglasses, meaning the two essentially cancel each other out, causing your LCD screen to appear dark or completely black when you look at it.
> I have a Phoenix motor glider. Can a polar be made for it and added to the list of aircraft?
Of course!
Please send us the following information for the specific glider polar:
Best glide ratio and speed,
Minimum sink rate and minimum sink speed,
Reference Weight for which the above values are correct,
Link to the manufacturer's web page.
Kind regards,
Jost Napret
Enabling pilot excellence
Note: I did get to fly again on March 24. I did see the Skysight convergence during the 5-hour flight. Jost's message was received on 3/23. I have not heard back from them yet.
Paul Remde
Mar 27, 2022, 6:38:46 PM3/27/22
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Hi,
The previous SkySight weather issue in SeeYou Navigator was fixed in the latest beta version. It is working well now on my Oudie N. I think the iPhone and Android beta versions with the fix are also available now.
Best Regards,
Paul Remde
Cumulus Soaring, Inc.
The previous SkySight weather issue in SeeYou Navigator was fixed in the latest beta version. It is working well now on my Oudie N. I think the iPhone and Android beta versions with the fix are also available now.
Best Regards,
Paul Remde
Cumulus Soaring, Inc.
Dirk_PW
Mar 27, 2022, 10:25:22 PM3/27/22
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> > > I have a Phoenix motor glider. Can a polar be made for it and added to the list of aircraft?
> > Of course!
> >
> > Please send us the following information for the specific glider polar:
> >
> > Best glide ratio and speed,
> > Minimum sink rate and minimum sink speed,
> > Reference Weight for which the above values are correct,
> > Link to the manufacturer's web page.
Are you saying the Oudie N will not allow entering of custom polar data (via coefficients) like other computers?
> > Of course!
> >
> > Please send us the following information for the specific glider polar:
> >
> > Best glide ratio and speed,
> > Minimum sink rate and minimum sink speed,
> > Reference Weight for which the above values are correct,
> > Link to the manufacturer's web page.
Paul Remde
Mar 28, 2022, 7:59:21 AM3/28/22
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Hi Dirk,
At this time, it is not possible to enter customer glider polar coefficients into SeeYou Navigator. I think Naviter is trying to keep it simple for pilots, perhaps with the added benefit of increasing their glider polar database - to the benefit of owners of somewhat unique or rare sailplanes. Naviter is quick to add new gliders to the database once complete data has been received. I don't know if they plan to add customer polar data coefficient support in the future.
Best Regards
Paul Remde
At this time, it is not possible to enter customer glider polar coefficients into SeeYou Navigator. I think Naviter is trying to keep it simple for pilots, perhaps with the added benefit of increasing their glider polar database - to the benefit of owners of somewhat unique or rare sailplanes. Naviter is quick to add new gliders to the database once complete data has been received. I don't know if they plan to add customer polar data coefficient support in the future.
Best Regards
Paul Remde
Michael N.
Mar 28, 2022, 11:14:27 AM3/28/22
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On Sunday, March 27, 2022 at 6:38:46 PM UTC-4, pa...@remde.us wrote:
> Hi,
>
> The previous SkySight weather issue in SeeYou Navigator was fixed in the latest beta version. It is working well now on my Oudie N. I think the iPhone and Android beta versions with the fix are also available now.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Paul Remde
> Cumulus Soaring, Inc.
> On Friday, March 25, 2022 at 11:28:55 PM UTC-5, Doug Levy wrote:
On my Android device I am not seeing an option in the Play Store to install the Beta of SeeYou Navigator?
> Hi,
>
> The previous SkySight weather issue in SeeYou Navigator was fixed in the latest beta version. It is working well now on my Oudie N. I think the iPhone and Android beta versions with the fix are also available now.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Paul Remde
> Cumulus Soaring, Inc.
> On Friday, March 25, 2022 at 11:28:55 PM UTC-5, Doug Levy wrote:
How do I set my Android device up to use the Beta releases? I thought this was supposed to show as an option but I am not seeing it.
I'm currently running an Oudie 2 with SeeYou and am exploring the possibility of moving to SeeYou Navigator on Android.
Mike N.
Eric Greenwell
Mar 28, 2022, 11:30:48 AM3/28/22
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What was the previous weather issue? Does the beta version allow downloading the Skysight
forecasts for offline use during the flight?
Eric
--
Eric Greenwell - USA
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications
forecasts for offline use during the flight?
Eric
Eric Greenwell - USA
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications
Dan Marotta
Mar 28, 2022, 12:22:54 PM3/28/22
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Oh great! Now I have another reason to keep my head inside the cockpit
rather than outside. AND, if I have to bail out over the mountains, my
cell phone battery will be depleted. Seriously, I'll give it a look on
my Android phone but I doubt I'll use it in flight.
But more seriously, in the past week or so, a local man took a walk a
mile or two from where he parked his car and got lost. He had cell
coverage and called family to tell them he was lost. They found his
body a few days later...
People who are going to be away from city streets should really develop
the ability to navigate without the use of electronics.
Dan
5J
rather than outside. AND, if I have to bail out over the mountains, my
cell phone battery will be depleted. Seriously, I'll give it a look on
my Android phone but I doubt I'll use it in flight.
But more seriously, in the past week or so, a local man took a walk a
mile or two from where he parked his car and got lost. He had cell
coverage and called family to tell them he was lost. They found his
body a few days later...
People who are going to be away from city streets should really develop
the ability to navigate without the use of electronics.
Dan
5J
Eric Greenwell
Mar 28, 2022, 12:42:40 PM3/28/22
to
If you are really worried about keeping your head in the cockpit, sell the Stemme and get
a Std class glider with fixed gear! But seriously, it becomes part of the instrument scan
and doesn't add a significant amount to head-down time. A glance at the Skysight screen
every few minutes is plenty.
Your cell phone battery is not a problem: you should not be using it in-flight, as it is
safety equipment. Use a dedicated device, instead:
- get a separate phone for the Skysight display, only $100-$200 for an good used one.
- connect that phone to the glider battery with a USB charger ($5-15) or 5V battery pack,
(you can do this with your personal phone, of course, and always have a fully charged
phone in-flight)
- get a flight computer that can display Skysight, like the Oudie-N, LXNav
Eric
...
a Std class glider with fixed gear! But seriously, it becomes part of the instrument scan
and doesn't add a significant amount to head-down time. A glance at the Skysight screen
every few minutes is plenty.
Your cell phone battery is not a problem: you should not be using it in-flight, as it is
safety equipment. Use a dedicated device, instead:
- get a separate phone for the Skysight display, only $100-$200 for an good used one.
- connect that phone to the glider battery with a USB charger ($5-15) or 5V battery pack,
(you can do this with your personal phone, of course, and always have a fully charged
phone in-flight)
- get a flight computer that can display Skysight, like the Oudie-N, LXNav
Eric
Dan Marotta
Mar 28, 2022, 12:59:03 PM3/28/22
to
I guess the sarcasm was missed.
I neither need nor want an in-cockpit real time weather display. But I
am considering parting with the Stemme in the next year or so.
Different strokes...
Dan
5J
I neither need nor want an in-cockpit real time weather display. But I
am considering parting with the Stemme in the next year or so.
Different strokes...
Dan
5J
Michael N.
Mar 28, 2022, 1:07:53 PM3/28/22
to
On Monday, March 28, 2022 at 12:42:40 PM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
> If you are really worried about keeping your head in the cockpit, sell the Stemme and get
> a Std class glider with fixed gear! But seriously, it becomes part of the instrument scan
> and doesn't add a significant amount to head-down time. A glance at the Skysight screen
> every few minutes is plenty.
>
> Your cell phone battery is not a problem: you should not be using it in-flight, as it is
> safety equipment. Use a dedicated device, instead:
>
> - get a separate phone for the Skysight display, only $100-$200 for an good used one.
> - connect that phone to the glider battery with a USB charger ($5-15) or 5V battery pack,
> (you can do this with your personal phone, of course, and always have a fully charged
> phone in-flight)
> - get a flight computer that can display Skysight, like the Oudie-N, LXNav
>
> Eric
Just FYI:
> If you are really worried about keeping your head in the cockpit, sell the Stemme and get
> a Std class glider with fixed gear! But seriously, it becomes part of the instrument scan
> and doesn't add a significant amount to head-down time. A glance at the Skysight screen
> every few minutes is plenty.
>
> Your cell phone battery is not a problem: you should not be using it in-flight, as it is
> safety equipment. Use a dedicated device, instead:
>
> - get a separate phone for the Skysight display, only $100-$200 for an good used one.
> - connect that phone to the glider battery with a USB charger ($5-15) or 5V battery pack,
> (you can do this with your personal phone, of course, and always have a fully charged
> phone in-flight)
> - get a flight computer that can display Skysight, like the Oudie-N, LXNav
>
> Eric
This is what I am testing for an Android device to put SeeYou Navigator on:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/133851697021
It is a Samsung 8.7" Galaxy Tab A7 Lite 32GB with 8.7 inch diagonal screen.
I've got a home made mount in my Ventus in place of my Oudie2 mount location.
Works well, and I tested sitting in the cockpit with full sunlight, and display is was quite readable under full sunlight.
The screen brightness of this tablet seems to be very good, but I have yet to actually fly with it.
I also purchased a Naviter Bluetooth dongle for my S80 vario. https://kb.naviter.com/en/kb/bluetooth-dongle-for-lxnav-user-port/
I installed the dongle and powered up the S80 vario and SeeYou Navigator on the tablet connected to the vario via bluetooth and was able to display vario data.
I'm really waiting for the SeeYou Navigator update that will allow Flarm data to pass through from the S80 / Power Flarm core, which does work in SeeYou on the Oudie 2 but has yet to be released on SeeYou Navigator
I'm not selling my Oudie 2 yet (probably keep it for a while anyway), but SeeYou Navigator on an 8.7" tablet is looking promising to date.
Eric Greenwell
Mar 28, 2022, 2:10:43 PM3/28/22
to
On 3/28/2022 9:58 AM, Dan Marotta wrote:
> I guess the sarcasm was missed.
It just sounded like the normal you :^)
> I guess the sarcasm was missed.
>
> I neither need nor want an in-cockpit real time weather display.
So far, I've used it only for blue wave in areas where I haven't flown wave. It was
> I neither need nor want an in-cockpit real time weather display.
terrific for that situation. I look forward to using it in other situations, like
convergence, which is often not marked well in my usual area.
But I am considering
> parting with the Stemme in the next year or so.
Dan Marotta
Mar 28, 2022, 7:12:09 PM3/28/22
to
Haven't decided. I got the Stemme because my wife wanted to fly with me
and didn't want a tandem. I think she now prefers the Cessna 180 and
the gyro.
With apologies to Bob Y., if I get a single seater, it'll have to be
self launch. It appears the local operation will be closing down soon,
perhaps this year.
What's the word on the Jeta?
Dan
5J
and didn't want a tandem. I think she now prefers the Cessna 180 and
the gyro.
With apologies to Bob Y., if I get a single seater, it'll have to be
self launch. It appears the local operation will be closing down soon,
perhaps this year.
What's the word on the Jeta?
Dan
5J
Paul Remde
Mar 29, 2022, 7:52:39 AM3/29/22
to
Hi Eric,
The issue was that PFD maps weren't working in my region. All the SkySight maps are working well now.
It is not possible yet to download SkySight maps before flight. However, on my iPhone I can do that in the Safari browser in the SkySight website. On my Android TRIPLTEK I can do that in SkySight in Google Chrome.
Best Regards,
Paul Remde
_________________________
The issue was that PFD maps weren't working in my region. All the SkySight maps are working well now.
It is not possible yet to download SkySight maps before flight. However, on my iPhone I can do that in the Safari browser in the SkySight website. On my Android TRIPLTEK I can do that in SkySight in Google Chrome.
Best Regards,
Paul Remde
_________________________
Eric Greenwell
Mar 29, 2022, 8:37:12 AM3/29/22
to
What model iPhone do you have? It doesn't work on my iPhone 6.
On 3/29/2022 4:52 AM, Paul Remde wrote:
> Hi Eric,
>
> The issue was that PFD maps weren't working in my region. All the SkySight maps are working well now.
>
> It is not possible yet to download SkySight maps before flight. However, on my iPhone I can do that in the Safari browser in the SkySight website. On my Android TRIPLTEK I can do that in SkySight in Google Chrome.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Paul Remde
...
On 3/29/2022 4:52 AM, Paul Remde wrote:
> Hi Eric,
>
> The issue was that PFD maps weren't working in my region. All the SkySight maps are working well now.
>
> It is not possible yet to download SkySight maps before flight. However, on my iPhone I can do that in the Safari browser in the SkySight website. On my Android TRIPLTEK I can do that in SkySight in Google Chrome.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Paul Remde
Paul Remde
Mar 29, 2022, 8:42:12 AM3/29/22
to
Hi Eric,
I have an iPhone 13 Pro Max. If I remember correctly, an important step in getting it to work was to use Safari, not Google Chrome, and to save the link to the homepage of the iPhone - as if it was an app.
Best Regards,
Paul Remde
I have an iPhone 13 Pro Max. If I remember correctly, an important step in getting it to work was to use Safari, not Google Chrome, and to save the link to the homepage of the iPhone - as if it was an app.
Best Regards,
Paul Remde
Jason Leonard
Mar 29, 2022, 8:24:01 PM3/29/22
to
Matthew Scutter
Mar 29, 2022, 10:38:35 PM3/29/22
to
To clarify - there is no App in the App Store on iOS or Android. On both devices you can instead "install" the website via your browser Settings -> Add to Homescreen. This enables the offline functionality.
Dan Marotta
Mar 30, 2022, 1:11:05 PM3/30/22
to
My XCSoar device is a Dell Streak 5 running Android 3. I doubt Skysight
will run on that, but it's worth a look.
Dan
5J
will run on that, but it's worth a look.
Dan
5J
Doug Levy
Apr 7, 2022, 12:37:03 PM4/7/22
to
It was a short flight as I didn't find lift. On the ground I had to restart the Oudie to get Skysight weather to come back.
I wrote to Naviter;
I flew today and saw the Skysight information disappear about 1 hour from take off on both my Oudie N and on Navigator on my phone. Has any progress been made on the issue? When do you expect this to be resolved?
Thanks,
The reply;
Hi Doug,
We are treating this as a feature request. The SkySight weather maps are not loaded in advance at the moment, they expect to be downloaded on the fly while flying.
We will let you know when it is done, but it won't be in April.
Regards,
Andrej Kolar
Enabling pilot excellence
Ramy
Apr 8, 2022, 12:06:42 AM4/8/22
to
Although the subject is skysight, I noted Naviter response to your Polarized question.
I respectfully disagree with Naviter response. I’ve been flying for over 20 years with polarized sunglasses and had no issues with any other screen (unless I tilt my head significantly). You will only see black screen if your sunglasses polarization is wrong or the screen polarization is wrong. If both polarized correctly, they will not cancel each other. You may want to try another polarized glasses, and if the issue persists, then your Oudie has wrong polarization. You may need to rotate your display as you suggested.
I always fly with polarized glasses as it enhances wisps and faint clouds.
Ramy
I respectfully disagree with Naviter response. I’ve been flying for over 20 years with polarized sunglasses and had no issues with any other screen (unless I tilt my head significantly). You will only see black screen if your sunglasses polarization is wrong or the screen polarization is wrong. If both polarized correctly, they will not cancel each other. You may want to try another polarized glasses, and if the issue persists, then your Oudie has wrong polarization. You may need to rotate your display as you suggested.
I always fly with polarized glasses as it enhances wisps and faint clouds.
Ramy
Eric Bick (DY)
Apr 11, 2022, 10:07:09 AM4/11/22
to
For displays such as on Oudie N, it is a property of the screen type that the display is polarized (at an angle chosen by the instrument manufacturer). For displays that are only put into the panel one way, the manufacturer can orient it such that polarized sunglasses will not diminish the brightness (due to polarization) unless the pilot tilts his/her head significantly (as Ramy notes). (Note: sunglasses are polarized vertically, which cuts out horizontally polarized reflections, such as off the water.) For instruments that are made to operate in vertical or horizontal (portrait or landscape) orientation, the manufacturer is faced with a choice - if the polarization is set at either vertical or horizontal, the display will appear fine in one orientation and black in the other, (and varying degrees of darkness in between) through polarized sunglasses (unpolarized sunglasses have no effect). So, a compromise is to (optimally) set the polarization of the screen at 45 degrees. At 45 degrees, this will diminish the brightness by 50% for either instrument orientation (Transmitted intensity = incident intensity*cos^2(angle of polarization), but it will be readable with sunglasses, polarized or not. This is in addition to the reduction in brightness by the sunglasses due to lens tint.
In general, as Ramy says, polarized sunglasses will enhance sharpness. On the other hand, the military does not issue polarized sunglasses for pilots (according to my source) because it can eliminate the glare/sun flash off another airplane fuselages or wings - the same goes for glider pilots trying to spot other gliders in the area. It becomes a matter of choice for glider pilots as to which is more important. My experience is that I stopped using polarized sunglasses due to instrument display obscuration due to polarization since so many of mine can be oriented in the portrait or landscape position. My CN flight computer, which can orient either portrait or landscape, appears to be at about a 70 degree offset for output and I had to tilt my head slightly to read it when in portrait mode. I have experienced the same on other instruments that can go portrait or landscape for orientation, but not on instruments that have only one display orientation. Also, I do find it easier to find other gliders at a distance from their glint with non polarized sunglasses.
I will suggest that with greater use of FLARM, finding other gliders has become easier, and with ADS-B IN/OUT even easier. But visual identification is still paramount.
Eric
In general, as Ramy says, polarized sunglasses will enhance sharpness. On the other hand, the military does not issue polarized sunglasses for pilots (according to my source) because it can eliminate the glare/sun flash off another airplane fuselages or wings - the same goes for glider pilots trying to spot other gliders in the area. It becomes a matter of choice for glider pilots as to which is more important. My experience is that I stopped using polarized sunglasses due to instrument display obscuration due to polarization since so many of mine can be oriented in the portrait or landscape position. My CN flight computer, which can orient either portrait or landscape, appears to be at about a 70 degree offset for output and I had to tilt my head slightly to read it when in portrait mode. I have experienced the same on other instruments that can go portrait or landscape for orientation, but not on instruments that have only one display orientation. Also, I do find it easier to find other gliders at a distance from their glint with non polarized sunglasses.
I will suggest that with greater use of FLARM, finding other gliders has become easier, and with ADS-B IN/OUT even easier. But visual identification is still paramount.
Eric
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