Virtual airlines: what's the point?
Henri H. Arsenault
them, and you get routes to fly (at home with your simulator) and you have
to report the flights to the site. You have to get the specific aircraft
that the VA flies along with their colors, none of which seem to be the
ones that come with FS2000. You get promotions and more important routes
as you gain experience. OK, I get that.
Now I began to play with flight simulators even before they existed. When
I was eight years old, we nailed a plank to a box to serve as a propeller
and made believe we were flying a plane. An older neighborhood boy used to
crank the propeller yelling "contact" while he let out noisy farts,
raising his knee in the air. Later, when I was walking, I used to imagine
that I was in a plane and that the snmall plants on the ground were large
trees. I still walk today with my head turned to the ground.
When the first MS Flight Simulator came out, I used to go to the store
every day to see if the Mac version had arrived yet, while I imagined how
great it would be to fly "for real". I later got a PC when the Mac games
were too far between, and I have bought almost every FS on the market,
including FS 98, Fly!, FU 1 and III, and FS 2000.
So I have no lack of imagination nor of interest in flight sims. But the
virtual airlines thing puzzles me. I guess it must be the positive
reinforcement from getting promotions and so on, otherwise why go to the
trouble?
Has anyone ever written an article about simmers who participate in
virtual airlines? Maybe like the psychiatrist who wrote "Chess and the
Dance of Death" claiming that all serious chess players are ready to be
locked up in the funhouse? (Chess is another one of my hobbies...). I
would like to read stories about virtual airlines. I have been to a number
of VA sites, but all I find there are instructions about how to join,
lists of routes, etc, all clearly written for people already familiar with
the hobby. Didn't anybody ever write about virtual airlines? How did this
hobby get started? Who participates in it? How many? Who are the top
pilots? How many succeed? Why? And so on...
Any opinions?
Henri
Steve
I have often pondered on the very same questions myself. I have been simming
and flying for real for some years now, and I find the whole VA concept
curious at the very least. Its almost as if VA's attempt to bring a new
dimension to flight simulation by simulating the human/social/commercial
aspects involved in flying aeroplanes.
Are VAs any different in concept to multiplayer online games, where skill is
rewarded with someform of "league table" and/or peer recognition.
I sometimes wonder if the the VA pilots go out and buy pilot uniforms with
gold stripes and sit in front of their pc's wearing caps etc. Perhaps they
also pressurize their computer rooms, and ask their wifes/partners to act as
stewardesses. Perhaps they also have a little area in the room with little
microwave ovens in, and refer to it as "the galley". Yes, I am now poking
fun at VAs, but there must be a point where such concepts could be regarded
as being "sad". Airline politics, monotony, tight schedules and similiar
real world concepts/issues dont belong in a flight simulator..they're not
fun!
Jared Mathes
It is rather curious, isn't it?
I design scenery for Flight Simulator. Currently, I am working on Alberta
Canada using photorealistic aerial photographs and the like. I have found
that designing the scenery is almost more entertaining for me than playing
with the simulator. I have a friend who cannot fly the sim worth a crap,
yet he just loves modifying and painting the aircraft, slewing them into
cool positions and taking screen shots. You could almost look at it like
someone who builds scale models or someone who enjoys building model
railroad dioramas (yep, they even wear the little engineer hats!)
I guess there comes a point where your average flight simmer feels that
there must be more to the game. I guess different folks take different
approaches. Some abandon the game and move on to fighter games where they
can blow things up. Others have the resources to go and get their real
pilots license. There is the online aspect like participating in the zone.
There is the whole SB, PC community out there. And then there are virtual
airlines.
I happen to be pretty good friends with the folks who run a local airline
here in Lethbridge, Alberta. They have just been operational for over a
year now. They have a King Air 100 and a Piper Navajo. They do charter
flights and have a sched twice daily from CYQL to CYXD. I have had the
opportunity to come along for the ride on many occasions, getting to wear
the third headset. They always go over everything and answer all of my
questions. If it wasn't for the lousy pay, I'd consider a career change
myself. Even though you could look at the job as being an over glorified
bus driver (not that there's anything wrong with that), I am just so
fascinated with the whole industry. And in the back of my mind I just think
to myself, 'Hey Self, you can fly the exact same route with the exact same
plane in Flight Simulator'
From a scenery designers point of view, I have found the Virtual Airline to
be something that has helped my customers get more enjoyment out of the
scenery I have made. It lets them fly to places that they normally wouldn't
think of at times that they wouldn't normally choose. It gives them a
chance to explore all of the little surprises that I place in the scenery.
For instance, in my Alberta 2000 scenery, I am planning on creating some
auto accident easter eggs in the scenery throughout Alberta. Some of the VA
flights will involve helicopter air ambulance flights to these accidents and
then to the hospitals helo landing pad. Little things like that to make it
more enjoyable.
I'm not sure about other virtual airlines and their motives, but for me, it
has helped my scenery customers get more out of their product if they
choose. To each his/her own.
Steve <postings@no_spamaviata.com> wrote in message
news:i9_R3.482$03.4...@typ11a.deja.bcandid.com...
Henri H. Arsenault
<steve.sma...@bigpond.com> wrote:
> If someone really wanted to get to know the British Isles, or Alaska (or
> Australia for that matter) then the VA system may appeal. Folks are
> more likely to exchange expertise with others in those less hostile (VA
> specific or website specific) forums with generally appreciative folks
> rather than run the flame suit gauntlet of the ng :)
>
Are there any VA-specific websites?
Henri
mart...@my-deja.com
who had just started a VA.It had clearly cost him a lot of time and
money judging by his web site.His occupation?-First officer with AA.
You would wonder why he would want to start a VA when he was already
part of an RA.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Rez Manzoori
Like you, I have wondered about the appeal of the VAs. I even came close to
signing up for one but realised I would not be able to commit enough time to
it.
Now what I do find vaguely amusing are the stories from the virtual
airlines, of people trying to book flights with them, and persisting with it
despite being told in no uncertain terms that they have contacted a VIRTUAL
airline!!!
People.... you've gotta wonder how we made it this far!
--
Rez Manzoori
(www.manzoori.demon.co.uk)
ICQ# 17763861
Henri H. Arsenault <ars...@phy.ulaval.ca> wrote in message
news:arseno-2810...@descartes.phy.ulaval.ca...
Matt Senecal
something realistic to *do* when you're using the simulator. Instead of
aimlessly flying around you have goals that you can meet, and all that.
I don't know about the rest of you, but when I fly a simulator, it's
like I'm actually *in* the cockpit. VAs are just another part of
imagination.
I've often thought that VAs were a little strange, but who am I to
point? My thing is ATC simulators, and I can sit four hours in front of
my monitor in a darkened room, the healthy green glow on my face,
uttering phrases my wife complains she can't understand.
---Matt
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Daily Affirmation: I will be a good JNI programmer when this is over.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Matt Senecal
Inter-National Research Institute
E-mail: msen...@inri.com
Web: http://members.tripod.com/~msenecal/
Phone: (619)-553-1115
Braniff CEO
Arsenault) wrote:
--cut--
>Has anyone ever written an article about simmers who participate in
>virtual airlines? Maybe like the psychiatrist who wrote "Chess and the
>Dance of Death" claiming that all serious chess players are ready to be
>locked up in the funhouse? (Chess is another one of my hobbies...). I
>would like to read stories about virtual airlines. I have been to a number
>of VA sites, but all I find there are instructions about how to join,
>lists of routes, etc, all clearly written for people already familiar with
>the hobby. Didn't anybody ever write about virtual airlines? How did this
>hobby get started? Who participates in it? How many? Who are the top
>pilots? How many succeed? Why? And so on...
>
>Any opinions?
The first VA I am aware of was SUNAIR Express that was created to
fly with ATP in 1992. Noble Air, considered the grandaddy of FS
virtual airlines, was started in 1994, IIRC. The attrition rate of
VAs can be as bad as it is in the real world. Sometimes the cost of
maintaining a site puts them under, sometimes the operators just get
bored and stop running the airline (although they leave their sites up
and ignore their pilots, which pisses me off), or sometimes other
concerns (family, work) cause the CEO to shut down the airline, as
happened recently with VTWA.
Who participates in VAs? Well, people from all walks of life. At
Braniff, we have pilots who worked for the real airline (including
real pilots) and like being able to fly schedules and aircraft flown
by the real carrier. It's a means of re-living the past and living
vicariously for those of us who never got the chance to work for the
real carrier.
We're a bit different, we don't assign flights or aircraft - we
allow the pilots to choose where and what they want to fly. Our focus
is on the historical aspects of Braniff Airways, we see our VA as
preserving the spirit and heritage of Braniff through the use of
Flight Simulator. We've gone to great lengths to document the history
of every aircraft in out fleet. We tell you when it arrived in the
fleet, what other color schemes it wore (Braniff had a multi-colored
fleet from 1965-82), and when it left the fleet.
Our roster currently consists of around 50 pilots, and we receive
applications every day. Currently, we have schedules from 1930, 1973,
and 1981. We will soon be adding ones from 1952, 1955, and 1957.
We've been pretty successful, although we receive no money for the
work we do - nor would we accept any. We built the airline out of
love for the real airline, not to make money.
Kristopher R. Crook
Chairman and CEO,
Braniff International Virtual Airways
http://members.tripod.com/BIVA_2/BIVA.html
"When you've got it - flaunt it!"
Chuck Kandler
> Hi Henri,
>
> I don't know there answer to that, but there must be a VA directory
> somewhere .....
>
> Anyone ?
>
> rgds
> .....
> Steve Small
> Canberra, Australia
Well, first let me start off by recommending the VA I have flown for,
which is ACE. They supply adventures for FS that are completed for pay
(virtual $), and you can use that money to upgrade your plane, buy
another one, etc. A real blast!! http://www.flyace.com is the URL.
As for the main question, you can go to Avsim, http://www.avsim.com.
There, in the main menu at the top, is a drop-down menu entitled VA
World. Within that menu is the VA Registry. You can also go to
http://www.simflight.com/linkmaster/Virtual_Airlines/ for another
listing.
Hope this helps ya!!
--
Chuck Kandler #70
ChuckK or KS70 on Won.net
K&S Racing
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/thepits/195
The box said "Windows 95 or better", so I installed LINUX!
Brian Sommers
try this link:
http://www.vadu.com/english/vai/
that will get you to a VA index but it has tons of other stuff on it.
i have been flying for WestWind Airlines, but im now moving on and im flying
with Pier Glass Aviation which uses FUIII, i've gotten rid of FS98, i just
use FUIII exclusively , i just love the "feel" of flying it gives me with
the great graphics.
to me the only way i fly my flight sim. is through/for a VA, to me it helps
me to have "meaning" to just flying pt a to pt b. yes, i know thats what im
really doing anyhow but its more fun cause you get virtual pay and your
hours posted etc. kinda like a reward thing
its just FUN PLAYING BUSH PILOT!!
yes, im 34
thankyou
BrianS
Braniff CEO
<R...@NOSPAM.Manzoori.Demon.Co.UK> wrote:
>Henri,
>
>Like you, I have wondered about the appeal of the VAs. I even came close to
>signing up for one but realised I would not be able to commit enough time to
>it.
>
>Now what I do find vaguely amusing are the stories from the virtual
>airlines, of people trying to book flights with them, and persisting with it
>despite being told in no uncertain terms that they have contacted a VIRTUAL
>airline!!!
>
>People.... you've gotta wonder how we made it this far!
LOL! I once received a rather mean e-mail from somebody pissed off
because we left him and his family stranded in 1982 when we went
under. I had to explain that we are not the real Braniff Airways,
which doesn't exist anymore, anyway - but a virtual reproduction of
it.
Kristopher R. Crook
Chairman and CEO,
Braniff International Virtual Airways
http://members.tripod.com/BIVA_2/BIVA.html
"When you've got it - Flaunt it!
Rich Heimlich
Here's my dilemma. I .... LOVE the CONCEPT of flight sims. Always have. I've
owned every version of Flight Simulator and most of the other standard flight
sims. However, I always burn out on them quickly. I get in, fly around with no
specific purpose, buy a book or two, buy an add-on or two (I own CoPilot 2.0,
ProFlight 98, MegaPNW and San Diego). But then the thrill disappears to such a
degree that I forget virtually everything about them.
As you can see in the current listing of headings, I'm back now and have several
posts here asking VERY basic questions, for about the 10th time! It always ends
the same way. I sit there thinking, "Gee, if only I had somewhere to go. Some
plan. Some reason for flying."
For example, I saw a post here in a thread on why FS2000 probably stinks and it
listed a challenge to fly from Klamath Falls International in Oregon over Crater
Lake to see if FS2000 added an actual crater there instead of flat terrain in
previous versions. While this example was used to push a point about FS2000
possibly not being worth the upgrade, for me it was something entirely
different. I had a purpose! I hopped in, set it up, flew out there eagerly
waiting to see what there was to see and gladly informed the fellow that,
surprise, Microsoft finally has added realistic terrain to the area. I landed
nearby and realized that the whole experience was just what's been missing for
me. I've often thought about just coming on here and asking people to give me
some ideas.
The idea of a VA saying, "We have a route we need flown from X-to-Y and within
this timetable" sounds oddly appealing to me. Perhaps it's my type of
personality that fits this mold. I won't know until I try it, but then again, if
it's all time driven, I may not have enough free time to make it worthwhile.
I see myself more as the Harrison Ford-type in Six Days, Seven Nights; Flying
that old prop plane with a few passengers between islands as the need arises.
Meanwhile, flying the big jumbos doesn't currently interest me in the least! I
want to enjoy the scenery.
Rich Heimlich
>I've often thought that VAs were a little strange, but who am I to
>point? My thing is ATC simulators, and I can sit four hours in front of
>my monitor in a darkened room, the healthy green glow on my face,
>uttering phrases my wife complains she can't understand.
DITTO! I show ATCC to people like it's a drug and they think I'm out of my mind.
Their comment is always the same, "Man, that's just too much work." I find it
entirely challenging and ultimately refreshing and stress reducing. When I'm
done with ATCC, every problem I had on my mind is GONE.
Steve Small
striking up transient associations through newsgroups. That's certainly
been my experience.
To associate more closely with a group of like-minded enthusiasts in a
VA with common aspirations or interests (be they geographic, operational
... whatever) on a more regular basis is probably far more rewarding
than exchanging blows in a ng where the level of supportive exchange
varies considerably. As, may I add, the motivation for and the quality
of feedback.
If someone really wanted to get to know the British Isles, or Alaska (or
Australia for that matter) then the VA system may appeal. Folks are
more likely to exchange expertise with others in those less hostile (VA
specific or website specific) forums with generally appreciative folks
rather than run the flame suit gauntlet of the ng :)
rgds,
Steve Small
I don't know there answer to that, but there must be a VA directory
somewhere .....
Anyone ?
rgds
Graham
>Perhaps they also pressurize their computer rooms, and ask their wifes/partners
>to act as stewardesses.
There was a post some time ago where the guy was explaining how he
gets his wife to serve drinks and what-not, then gets her to stand
behind his seat during a landing and "shake" the chair to simulate
touchdown.....hehe!
Sounds like a very loving couple... but I never went as far as to
enquire whether they were members of the "Virtual - Mile High Club"
<G>
--
Regards
Graham
"Take-off does not mean having to lift-off your seat"
Graham
>Now what I do find vaguely amusing are the stories from the virtual
>airlines, of people trying to book flights with them, and persisting with it
>despite being told in no uncertain terms that they have contacted a VIRTUAL
>airline!!!
LOL!... what more can I say :))
Ed Medlin
I am not sure why we do what we do at VAs. I think it is, at least at
Nor-East-Express, more of a social club and a way to share experiences. We
don't get into the VA political stuff that tends to sour the experience. I
don't assign specific routes and AC to the pilots. They get virtual
promotions as soon as they reach a certain amount of hours, not by testing.
We have many real pilots who fly for us, even commercial pilots. In our VA
we also have AC designers, painters, panel designers and many other people
who contribute to the enjoyment of our hobby for all of us. I have over
1,000 hours flying with AirWest and Nor-East-Express, which are two of the
most friendly VAs I have had the opportunity to be involved with. NEX is
actually a subsidiary of AW, but operates independently of AW. It is a lot
of work for CEOs and Hub Captains keeping up with all the hours and doing
periodical Notams. I guess just being part of a team is genetically
imprinted on most of us and the VAs fill that need. There are many very good
VAs out there and more are starting weekly. At the simFlight Network
Affiliates Program I have had three new VAs apply in the last three days. It
is a section of our hobby that looks as if it will be here to stay and does
give us another option for us to enjoy with all the other aspects of the
hobby.
--
Regards,
Ed Medlin
e...@simflight.com
Nor-East Express
http://fly.to/Nor-East
simFlight Network Affiliates Program Supervisor
www.simflight.com
Keith
wrote:
>On Thu, 28 Oct 1999 22:00:38 +0100, "Rez Manzoori"
><R...@NOSPAM.Manzoori.Demon.Co.UK> wrote:
>
>>Henri,
>>
>>Like you, I have wondered about the appeal of the VAs. I even came close to
>>signing up for one but realised I would not be able to commit enough time to
>>it.
>>
>>Now what I do find vaguely amusing are the stories from the virtual
>>airlines, of people trying to book flights with them, and persisting with it
>>despite being told in no uncertain terms that they have contacted a VIRTUAL
>>airline!!!
>>
>>People.... you've gotta wonder how we made it this far!
>
> LOL! I once received a rather mean e-mail from somebody pissed off
>because we left him and his family stranded in 1982 when we went
>under. I had to explain that we are not the real Braniff Airways,
>which doesn't exist anymore, anyway - but a virtual reproduction of
>it.
>
>Kristopher R. Crook
>Chairman and CEO,
>Braniff International Virtual Airways
>http://members.tripod.com/BIVA_2/BIVA.html
>
>"When you've got it - Flaunt it!
We used to be a virtual airline named after a well known British
carrier. I was bombarded with requests for cheap fares, people
prepared to move house for what they thought were real jobs,
complaints about lost luggage, and one one guy wanted to sue me for
losing a pallet of goods in Los Angeles.
I highly recommend picking a fictional name for your VA.
Keith Hodson
President Sun International Airlines (VIRTUAL)
Adventure files that do make you work !
http://www.suninternational.freeserve.co.uk/
Golgo-13
>We used to be a virtual airline named after a well known British
>carrier. I was bombarded with requests for cheap fares, people
>prepared to move house for what they thought were real jobs,
>complaints about lost luggage, and one one guy wanted to sue me for
>losing a pallet of goods in Los Angeles.
>
>I highly recommend picking a fictional name for your VA.
I'm the hub captain for KLAS with AirWest. We have a fictional name, and we
STILL get people thinking we're a real airline.
American West = AirWest?
Go figure...