Hollywood Realism
Marc
Just saw that movie about the hijacking with Kirt Russell (and steven
segal). In the end (big surprise) the pilots get killed and he has to land
the 747. Pulling out the handy POH, he finds the normal landing procedure
and manages to bring the plane down (with only a few hours of flight
training in a Cessna).
The movie seemed fairly accurate in its representation of landing
procedures (maybe not for a 747). But, are the questions-
1) How far fetched would it be for a low time private pilot used to flying
single engine Cessna's to be able to pull this off? How different are these
airplanes in terms of control? You constantly hear how smooth the heavy's
are, but I just wonder if they are really THAT smooth.
2) How do you flare a jumbo when you are like 40 feet above the runway? Or
do you flare at all? It always looks like large jets are flown right onto
the runway...but I am probably wrong.
Anyway, decent movie, especially after Segal died...
Marc
Chris Durrant
Marc wrote:
>
> 1) How far fetched would it be for a low time private pilot used to flying
> single engine Cessna's to be able to pull this off? How different are these
> airplanes in terms of control? You constantly hear how smooth the heavy's
> are, but I just wonder if they are really THAT smooth.
>
> 2) How do you flare a jumbo when you are like 40 feet above the runway? Or
> do you flare at all? It always looks like large jets are flown right onto
> the runway...but I am probably wrong.
>
I would say it would end in a ball of flame, especially without guidance
over
the radio. It would be too easy to trip the autopilot. Hand flying a
heavy
without prior experience tends to result in huge height excursions and
pilot
induced oscillations on approach. The aircraft needs to be flown
smoothly and
with plenty of anticipation but it can be suprisingly agile in inept
hands.
If you get the chance try a full motion airliner simulator, plenty
realistic
enough to get you sweating.
Chris
Bcbond
>Anyway, decent movie, especially after Segal died...
>
>
Amen to that.
George R Patterson
Marc wrote:
>
> 1) How far fetched would it be for a low time private pilot used to flying
> single engine Cessna's to be able to pull this off? How different are these
> airplanes in terms of control? You constantly hear how smooth the heavy's
> are, but I just wonder if they are really THAT smooth.
Flying magazine did an article on that some time back. A typical private
pilot could not even figure out how to change frequencies on the radio.
The delay between application of throttle and response of a jet will
eventually kill you. The first attempt to lose altitude is very likely
to result in a speed increase that could cause strutural damage. There
was more.
George Patterson, N3162Q.
Kevin Vap
I seem to remember at the beginning of the movie he was training in a
low-wing retractable, like a Bonanza.
Considering the role they used Segal for (just to get a paying audience to
show up), it seems likely this was a low-budget, low-research (but high
profit) type movie.
Marc wrote in message <01bd730f$320f2940$57621ed1@tefen-usa>...
>Just saw that movie about the hijacking with Kirt Russell (and steven
>segal). In the end (big surprise) the pilots get killed and he has to land
>the 747. Pulling out the handy POH, he finds the normal landing procedure
>and manages to bring the plane down (with only a few hours of flight
>training in a Cessna).
>
>The movie seemed fairly accurate in its representation of landing
>procedures (maybe not for a 747). But, are the questions-
>
>1) How far fetched would it be for a low time private pilot used to flying
>single engine Cessna's to be able to pull this off? How different are these
>airplanes in terms of control? You constantly hear how smooth the heavy's
>are, but I just wonder if they are really THAT smooth.
>
Robert M. Gary
Reece R. Pollack wrote:
>
> On Wed, 29 Apr 1998 00:47:08 -0400, George R Patterson
> <grpp...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> >Marc wrote:
> >>
> >> 1) How far fetched would it be for a low time private pilot used to flying
> >> single engine Cessna's to be able to pull this off? How different are these
> >> airplanes in terms of control? You constantly hear how smooth the heavy's
> >> are, but I just wonder if they are really THAT smooth.
> >
> >pilot could not even figure out how to change frequencies on the radio.
> >The delay between application of throttle and response of a jet will
> >eventually kill you. The first attempt to lose altitude is very likely
> >to result in a speed increase that could cause strutural damage. There
> >was more.
>
> ATOP (Airline Training Orientation Program) class, which is held at
> the United Airlines training facility in Denver, Colorado. You learn a
> tremendous amount about the B-737-200,
Cool! How much does something like that cost? Do you end up with
a type endorsement????
--
Robert Gary
email: rober...@osi.com
Reece R. Pollack
>Marc wrote:
>>
>> 1) How far fetched would it be for a low time private pilot used to flying
>> single engine Cessna's to be able to pull this off? How different are these
>> airplanes in terms of control? You constantly hear how smooth the heavy's
>> are, but I just wonder if they are really THAT smooth.
>
>Flying magazine did an article on that some time back. A typical private
>pilot could not even figure out how to change frequencies on the radio.
>The delay between application of throttle and response of a jet will
>eventually kill you. The first attempt to lose altitude is very likely
>to result in a speed increase that could cause strutural damage. There
>was more.
This is another reason I don't subscribe to Flying. I did the two-day
ATOP (Airline Training Orientation Program) class, which is held at
the United Airlines training facility in Denver, Colorado. You learn a
tremendous amount about the B-737-200, and get an hour in a procedures
trainer. The climax is an hour in a Cat-D, landing-approved, full-
motion simulator. I shot two ILS's, the first in VMC ending in a T&G,
the second to 200 and 1/2 in light turbulence, ending in a full-stop
landing. Neither was a squeaker, but I've seen worse by professional
pilots. My partner, a CFI, squeaked her landings.
The biggest thing either of us had flown before was a Beech Baron.
--
Reece R. Pollack
CP-ASMEL-IA -- N1707H Piper Arrow III (based GAI)
Mike500188
>I seem to remember at the beginning of the movie he was training in a
>low-wing retractable, like a Bonanza.
>
>Considering the role they used Segal for (just to get a paying audience to
>show up), it seems likely this was a low-budget, low-research (but high
>profit) type movie.
>
>
>Marc wrote in message <01bd730f$320f2940$57621ed1@tefen-usa>...
>>Just saw that movie about the hijacking with Kirt Russell (and steven
>>segal). In the end (big surprise) the pilots get killed and he has to land
>>the 747. Pulling out the handy POH, he finds the normal landing procedure
>>and manages to bring the plane down (with only a few hours of flight
>>training in a Cessna).
>>
>>The movie seemed fairly accurate in its representation of landing
>>procedures (maybe not for a 747). But, are the questions-
>>
>>single engine Cessna's to be able to pull this off? How different are these
>>airplanes in terms of control? You constantly hear how smooth the heavy's
>>are, but I just wonder if they are really THAT smooth.
>>
I kind of liked the part where they fit a squad of commandos in an F-117, and
got it to fly w/out the engines (look where they were sitting...)
Ron Natalie
Wendy B G wrote:
>
> I forget the name of the movie where a Cessna student pilot
> transitions, seamlessly and effortlessly, into an F-14.
Iron Eagle (and it's sequels), started out without too bad
of a plot (the flying stuff is completely silly) but gets
really out of hand in the sequels (culminating with some
kid landing a C-130 single handedly in the last one).
Now how about Good movies. Anybody remember a movie
with Bette Davis as a flight instructor with a paraplegic
girl student?
JT
>This is another reason I don't subscribe to Flying. I did the two-day
>ATOP (Airline Training Orientation Program) class, which is held at
>the United Airlines training facility in Denver, Colorado. You learn a
>tremendous amount about the B-737-200, and get an hour in a procedures
>trainer. The climax is an hour in a Cat-D, landing-approved, full-
>motion simulator. I shot two ILS's, the first in VMC ending in a T&G,
>the second to 200 and 1/2 in light turbulence, ending in a full-stop
>landing. Neither was a squeaker, but I've seen worse by professional
>pilots. My partner, a CFI, squeaked her landings.
>
>The biggest thing either of us had flown before was a Beech Baron.
Ah, but you flew a Baron! I see that you have an MEL rating and that makes
quite a difference. PLUS you learned a lot about the 737 first and got time
in a sim with an instructor. All those factors together and yes, I think
any pilot could fly a jet. I just took a guy who only flies C-150s and
Champs in a Beechjet 400 sim (T-1 actually) and with some help from me and
quick, very quick, explanations of how things work he flew and landed rough,
but capably.
I think the point of this thread asked could a guy like that just hop in and
do it in a REAL airplane under powered flight. I doubt it, and the reason
why is STRESS. The reason people blow checkrides for stupid things they
just screw up, the reason VFR pilots spiral out of the sky 120 seconds after
they go IMC, even though they can fly under the hood for hours, etc. If you
put a guy in an unfamiliar aircraft (VASTLY unfamiliar) with multiple
engines, spool time lag, 4 radios, hydraulic controls (small delay) wind,
turbulence, and just the idea that it's NOT a sim and I can kill myself....
I just don't see it. Even guys who are T-37 pilots (the weaker ones) make
some BAD approaches and need to be rescued by the IP until they get used to
the bigger weight. Hollywood is Hollywood, and reality is reality.
-John
Jack Cullen
Marc wrote:
[snip]
>
> 2) How do you flare a jumbo when you are like 40 feet above the runway?
> Marc
=====================================
... at that point you might as well sit back and relax and wait for the
crash crews to arrive -- unless it's on fire!
;-) (-:
--
Jack Cullen
West Chatham, Cape Cod, Massachusetts, USA
Please Reply-To: JJoeJack "at" aol "dot" com
Brad Benson
Ron Natalie <r...@sensor.com> wrote:
Yes! I remember seeing it; she taught the paraplegic girl how to fly
and then the girl went on to fly Christian Eagles (or something
similar). Great flick.
Cheers,
Brad
replace "spamtrap" with "benson" in my reply address
George R Patterson
Ron Natalie wrote:
>
> Now how about Good movies.
Check out "The Edge". Got to have the best line in history - "Never feel
sorry for a man who owns an airplane".
George Patterson, N3162Q.
Gorman
Ron Natalie wrote:
> Now how about Good movies.
Last time this dangerous question was asked, Brian Hausknecht offered up
the following list of airplane movies.
As far as "good" goes, I'll put a three of Jimmy Stewart movies at the
top of my list. "Spirit of St. Louis" and "Flight of The Phoenix" have
to be about as realistic as an airplane movie can be. "No Highway In
The Sky" is more about an absent-minded professor on a mission to prove
that an airliner is in danger of falling out of the sky than about
piloting, but it's still a wonderful film.
-Jim
Above and Beyond 1953
Ace of Aces 1933
Aces High 1976
Aces: Iron Eagle III 1992
Aerial Gunner 1943
Afterburn 1992
Air America 1990
Always 1985
Air Cadet (UK "Jet Men of The Air") 1951
Air Force 1943
Air Strike 1955
Angels One Five 1952
Apocalypse Now 1979
Arise My Love 1940
Aurora: Operation Intercept 1995
Bail Out at 43,000' 1957
BAT*21 1988
Battle Hymn 1957
Battle of Britain 1968
Battle of Eagles ? Yugoslavian
"Battle Squadron Lutzow" 1941 Luftwaffe- Propaganda piece.
Battle Stations 1956
Battle Taxi 1955
The Beginning or the End 1947
Best Years of our Lives 1946
Biggles: Adventures in Time (UK "Biggles") 1986
Big Lift 1950
The Blue Max 1968
Body and Soul 1931
Bombardier 1943
Bombers B-52 (UK "No Sleep Until Dawn") 1957
Bomber's Moon 1943
Born to Love 1931
Breaking the Sound Barrier (US "The Sound Barrier") 1947
A Bridge Too Far 1977
Bridges at Toko-Ri 1954
By Dawn's Early Light 1990
Call to Glory ?
Canal Zone 1942
Captain Eddie 1945
Captain Newman, M.D. 1963
Captains of the Clouds 1942
Captive of the Land 1991 (filmed in Russia)
Captured 1933
Catch-22 1970
Chain Lightning 1950
China Doll 1958
China's Little Devils 1945
Clipped Wings 1953
Coast Guard 1939
Command Decision 1948
The Courage and the Passion 1978
Court Martial of Billy Mitchell (UK "One Man Mutiny") 1958
Crimson Romance 1934
Crowded Sky 1960
"D.III-88: The German Air Force Attacks" 1939 Luftwaffe- Propaganda
drama The Dam Busters 1954
Dangerous Moonlight (US "Suicide Squadron") 1941
Darling Lili 1970
D.A.R.Y.L. 1985
Dawn Patrol 1938
Desperate Journey 1942
Destination 60,000' 1957
Devil Dogs of the Air 1935
Devil's General 1955
Dirigible 1931
Dive Bomber 1941
Dragonfly Squadron 1954
Dr. Strangelove: Or How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb
1964
Eagle and the Hawk 1933
Eagle Squadron 1942
Empire of the Sun 1987
Enola Gay: The Men, The Mission, and the Atomic Bomb 1980
The Eternal Sea 1955
Fail Safe 1964
Fate is the Hunter 1964
Ferry Pilot 1941
Fighter Attack 1953
Fighter Squadron 1948
Final Approach 1991
Final Countdown 1980
Firebirds 1990
FireFox 1982
Flaming Sky 1940
Flat Top (UK "Eagles of the Nest") 1952
Flight ?
Flight Command 1940
Flight Commander (This was originally "Dawn Patrol". It was retitled
after the second version
came out in 1938) 1930
Flight from Ashiya 1963
Flight Into Darkness (French "L'Equipage", The Woman I Love") 1935
Flight Nurse 1954
Flight of the Black Angel 1991
Flight of the Intruder 1991
Flight of the Phoenix 1966
Flying Cadets 1941
The Flying Fleet 1928
Flying Fortress 1942
Flying Leathernecks 1951
"Flying South in His Plane" 1943 Japanese
Flying Tigers 1942
Forced Landing 1941
For the Moment 1994
Francis Gary Powers: The True Story of the U-2 Incident: 1976
Gathering of Eagles 1963
"Goal in the Clouds" (Ziel Inden Wolken) 1939 Luftwaffe- Propaganda
drama.
God is My Copilot 1945
The Great Santini 1979
The Great Waldo Pepper ?
A Guy Named Joe 1943
Hanover Street 1979
Hell's Angels 1930
Hell Divers 1931
Hell's Horizon 1955
Her's to Hold 1943
High Barbaree 1945
High Flight 1958
Hot Shots 1991
The Hunters 1958
Hurricane 1974
"I Bombed Pearl Harbour" 1972
Interceptor ??
International Squadron 1941
Into the Sun 1992
Iron Eagle 1986
Iron Eagle II 1988
Iron Eagle IV (Not Yet Released)
Island in the Sky 1953
It's In the Air 1940
I Wanted Wings 1941
Jet Attack (also "Jet Squad") 1958
Jet Job 1952
Jet Pilot 1957
Journey Together 1945
Jungle Patrol 1948
Keep em' Flying 1941
Ladies Courageous 1944
Lady Takes a Flyer 1958
Last Flight of Noah's Ark 1980
Layfayette Escadrille (UK "Hell Bent for Glory") 1958
"Legion Condor" 1938 Luftwaffe- Propaganda piece on the Spanish Civil
war.
Liliac Time (UK "Lone Never Dies") 1928
The Lion has Wings 1939
The Malta Story 1954
The Marines Fly High 1940
The McConnell Story (UK "Tiger in the Sky") 1955
McHales Navy Joins the Air Force 1965
Memphis Belle 1990
Men of the Fighting Lady 1954
Men with Wings 1938
Midway (UK "Battle of Midway") 1975
Mission Batangas 1969
Mission over Korea (UK "Eyes in the Sky") 1953
"Moscow Squadron" 1945 Russian AF- drama of Yak fighters
Mosquito Squadron 1969
Murphy's War 1970
Navy Born 1936
Never So Few 1959
1941 1979
No Time for Sergeants 1958
Not With My Wife You Don't 1966
On an Island With You 1948
One of Our Aircraft is Missing 1942
On The Threshold of Space (??) 1956
Operation Crossbow/"The Great Spy Mission" 1965
Operation Haylift 1950
A Perfect Hero 1990
Piece of Cake 1988/89
Pilot No. 5 1943
"Pour le Merite" 1938 German- propaganda piece, biography of Baron Von
Richthofen.
Power Dive 1941
A Prize of Gold 1955
Project X 1987
Purple Heart 1944
The Purple Plain 1955
The Purple Twilight 1982
The Purple V 1943
Q-Planes (US "Clouds over Europe") 1939
Reach for the Sky 1956
Red Flag: The Ultimate Game 1981
The Right Stuff 1983
Sabre Jet 1953
Sayonara 1957
The Sea Shall Not Have Them 1954
Ships with Wings 1941
Shootdown 1988
Sink the Bismark 1960
633 Squadron 1964
Sky Commando 1953
Sky Devils 1932
Sky Pirates 1986
The Sky Raider 1931
"The Sky Raiders" 1969 Czech-made movie.
The Sky's the Limit 1943
Slattery's Hurricane 1949
Sole Survivor ??
Soldaat van Oranje (US-"Soldier of Orange") 1979
Son of Lassie 1945
Spitfire (UK "First of the Few") 1942
Squadron Leader "X" 1943
Squadron 992 1940
Stairway to Heaven 1946
Star of Africa (?) 1950?
Starfighter 1963
Starlift 1951
Steal the Sky 1988
Story of Vernon and Irene Castle 1939
Stranger in My Arms 1959
Strategic Air Command 1955
"Stukas" 1941 Luftwaffe propaganda piece. Ju 87B's.
Supercarriers 1988
Suzy 1936
Swing Shift Maisie 1943
Tailspin: Behind the Korean Airline Tragedy 1989
Target for Tonight 1941
Task Force 1949
Test Pilot 1937
This Man's Navy 1945
Thousand Plane Raid 1969
Thunder Birds 1942
Thunderbirds 1953
Thundering Jets 1958
Top Gun 1986
Tora! Tora! Tora! 1970
"Torpedo Squadrons Move Out" 1944
Toward the Unknown (UK "Brink of Hell") 1956
Twelve O'Clock High 1959
20,000 Men a Year 1939
Twilight's Last Gleaming 1977
Von Richthofen and Brown (UK "The Red Baron") 1971
Wake Island 1941
The War Lover 1962
The Way to the Stars (US "Johnny in The Clouds") 1945
West Point of the Air 1935
We've Never Been Licked (also called "Remember Pearl Harbor!") 1943
Wild Blue Yonder (UK "Thunder in the Pacific") 1951
Wild in the Sky 1972
A Wing and a Prayer 1944
Winged Victory 1944
Wings 1927
Wings for the Eagle 1942
Wings of Fire 1957
Wings of the Eagle (UK "Wings of the Eagles") 1957
Wings of the Navy 1939
Wings of Victory 1941 Russian- Bio of test pilot Chkalov.
Wings Over Honolulu 19937
Wings Over the Pacific 1943
The Women I Love 1938
"Wunschkonzert" 1940 Luftwaffe- Propaganda piece.
X-15 1961
A Yank in London (UK " I Live in Grosvenor Square") 1945
A Yank in the RAF 1941
You Came Along 1945
Young Joe, The Forgotten Kennedy 1977
Zeppelin 1971
Zero Pilot 1983
Victoria Deaton
<snip re: good movie list>
I'd like to add Fandango, which came out in the mid-80's. Great little
flick about a bunch of kids on a road trip during the 70's, most of whom
were about to be shipped out to Viet Nam.
At one point they decide to send the rather uptight ROTC kid on a flight
to do some skydiving. The almost-deserted airport is the first indicator
that it's gonna be fun. Wrecked planes everywhere, the fuselage of one
hapless plane stuck in the windows of the hanger. The pilot of the
skydiving plane looks like he's five minutes from his last bong hit.
They walk out to what appears to be the world's most beat up 172 (?)
which is resting on its spinner and main gear...yank it down by the
tail, and off they go. When they rotate, you can hear the bottles
clattering to the back of the airplane. That scene in and of itself is
worth the price of rental.
Later on, the kids need to get one of their buddies married, but to get
the bride there, they need a pilot. Who do they call? Their skydiving
pilot. The guy does the classic IFR ("I follow roads") routine)...and to
get to the girl's house, evading a police chopper; he lands, hits an
exit ramp, extends his hand to give turn signals...well, you get the
picture. This is all real flying. No special effects.
It's actually a wonderful little movie that has nothing to do with
aviation, but the flying scenes are a major hoot.
Victoria
Mark Rogers
Reece R. Pollack <re...@his.com> wrote in article
<3562c25a....@news4.his.com>...
>I shot two ILS's, the first in VMC ending in a T&G,
> the second to 200 and 1/2 in light turbulence, ending in a full-stop
> landing. Neither was a squeaker, but I've seen worse by professional
> pilots. My partner, a CFI, squeaked her landings.
>
Not to take anything away from your experience, there is something we say
about those sims:
'Getting a nice landing in the simulator is like kissing your sister' :)
--Mark Rogers
(They just don't simulate the low speed regime, ground effect, etc. very
well to be useful in comparing nice landings)
> The biggest thing either of us had flown before was a Beech Baron.
>
Ron Parsons
In article <354B4550...@ix.netcom.com>, Gorman
<Gor...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>
>As far as "good" goes, I'll put a three of Jimmy Stewart movies at the
>top of my list. "Spirit of St. Louis" and "Flight of The Phoenix" have
>to be about as realistic as an airplane movie can be.
The Jimmy Stewart movies are always good in no small part to him being a
fine pilot and Air Force officer.
If you take careful note of the Spirit takeoff in the movie, you will note
that it caught a wire, but kept flying, that was not part of the original,
so goes a bit beyond recreation.
Phoenix had to be realistic as Mantz was killed on the second takeoff for
what turned out to be an unnecessary retake.
I'll just edit down your lenghty list for the ones I really like.
>Air America 1990
>Always 1985
>Bridges at Toko-Ri 1954
>Flying Tigers 1942
>Gathering of Eagles 1963
>Island in the Sky 1953
>Memphis Belle 1990
>Strategic Air Command 1955
>The Right Stuff 1983
>Top Gun 1986
>Twelve O'Clock High 1959
and add two more: Forever Young and On a Wing and a Prayer.
No doubt that real pilots make a difference like Jimmy Stewart, Cliff
Robertson or Mel Gibson.
All of Ernie Gann's stories are great except for the movie titled Fate is
the Hunter which had zero in common with the book of that name.
Not much interest in Hollywood for those from Richard Bach.
Rob Serling (brother of Rod) has done some nice books too.
Ron
Jack Cullen
Gorman wrote:
>
> Ron Natalie wrote:
>
> > Now how about Good movies.
>
> Last time this dangerous question was asked, Brian Hausknecht offered up
> the following list of airplane movies.
===============================================
That's a pretty good list (although, I can't understand how rubbish like
"Fate Is The Hunter" got on it. In his autobiography, "A Hostage To
Fortune", Ernie Gann has some very enlightening comments about that
whole episode.), but how did it miss "30 Seconds over Tokyo" and "Only
Angels Have Wings" (circa 193something)?
And as long as we're in this vein, I've been trying to get a VHS video
copy of "Island In The Sky" for probably 10 years or more, but nobody
seems to know what I'm talking about! I find that hard to believe
considering the cast lineup -- headed by none other than John Wayne --
and the quality of the telling of the story not to mention the
photography!
Everyplace I've asked, I always get the same reply -- "It's never been
put on video!"
Is that true?
If it is, does anybody know why?
Capt. Doug
Jumbo's do flare, but not full-stall like a single-engine. The non-flying
pilot calls off the reading from the radio altimeter every ten feet so that
the flare is done correctly. When the main wheels hit, the cockpit is 30
feet or more in the air, depending on type. I wouldn't suggest it for the
non-trained anywhere outside of Hollywood.
D.
Capt. Doug
"Fandango" is great. I don't see it played much anymore, maybe because of
the current 'just say no' campaign.
There was a sleeper movie a while back with John Lithgow, Kathy Bates,
Darryl Hanna, and others called "At Play in the Fields of the Lord". I
remember it mostly because of some scenes showing a Maule flying next to
the Andes mountains at sunrise. The wingtip vortices were twirling the
morning fog. It was absolutely beautiful photography.
D.
Tallman
I agree! Excellent movie! You could've snipped the extraneous (non-av)
stuff and it would still have been pretty good.
Victoria Deaton wrote:
>
> <snip re: good movie list>
>
> I'd like to add Fandango, which came out in the mid-80's. Great little
> flick about a bunch of kids on a road trip during the 70's, most of whom
> were about to be shipped out to Viet Nam.
Greg Boston
I have one on tape from the 80's that I'd like to see on the list. It's
called "Cloud Dancer" starring David Carridine, Jennifer O'Neil, and
some other well knowns. Great movie about the aerobatic flying world and
it has some cameos by real aerobatic pilots(Hint: Charlie Hilliard plays
one of the competition judges). Great story with sub-plots and both
humorous and non-humorous moments.
-gb-
Gorman
Actually, when I reposted Brian's list, I didn't mean to imply that it was of
"good" movies. Just "movies."
"Fate Is The Hunter" and "Flight of The Intruder" are two of the best examples
I've seen of riveting books turned into horrible movies.
Even though it's more work, maybe we should ask about the best flying books?
I'd put "Fate Is The Hunter" up towards the top of that list.
And along with listing "Spirit of St. Louis" as one of my favorite flying
films I'd say the same thing about the book.
Flight of The Intruder is a fascinating look into the world of Vietnam War
Aviation.
Also was surprised at how much I enjoyed Richard Bach's "Biplane". One of my
favorite lines from the book: "Okay, little airplane, what are you going to
teach me today?"
Bob Hoover's "Forever Flying" isn't great literature, but it's sure an
interesting read.
I've got a lot of other good flying books packed away (including several about
bush pilots). If anyone's interested, I'll dig up the titles.
-Jim
> Gorman wrote:
> >
> > Ron Natalie wrote:
> >
> > > Now how about Good movies.
> >
> > Last time this dangerous question was asked, Brian Hausknecht offered up
> > the following list of airplane movies.
Tina Marie
In article <354B81...@explornet.org>,
Victoria Deaton <vde...@explornet.org> wrote:
>At one point they decide to send the rather uptight ROTC kid on a flight
>to do some skydiving. The almost-deserted airport is the first indicator
>that it's gonna be fun. Wrecked planes everywhere, the fuselage of one
>hapless plane stuck in the windows of the hanger. The pilot of the
>skydiving plane looks like he's five minutes from his last bong hit.
I believe he fixed that by smoking a joint while flying.
My boyfriend at the time had me watch it the night before my first jump.
"Fandango" is actually a remake of an original student film project
called "Proof". Copies of "Proof" are very hard to find (I've never
seen one), but supposedly it's got the Pecos Parachute School
scenes without a lot of the other plot (I, personally, found the
rest of the plot pretty bad).
>They walk out to what appears to be the world's most beat up 172 (?)
>which is resting on its spinner and main gear...yank it down by the
>tail, and off they go. When they rotate, you can hear the bottles
>clattering to the back of the airplane. That scene in and of itself is
>worth the price of rental.
*laugh* I think it was a 182. There's a story at one of the local
drop zones that one year for the drop zone operator's birthday,
the jumpers got together, and painted the 182 to look just like
the plane from "Fandango". The DZO didn't mind too much, until
he took the plane to Dallas one day that week. He hit some light
rain going into Love Field. That's when he discovered that the
jumpers had used _water based_ paint. Trouble was, there was
only enough rain to smear the paint job, not wash it off entirely.
He said he'd never been so embarrased to be seen with an airplane.
Tina Marie
--
Love is...pretending you're the one who wanted to order dessert.
I refuse to give in to spammers - my return address is real!
skydiver - PP-ASEL - http://www.neosoft.com/~tina
Robert M. Gary
When I was out in Seattle I got to see some of the spec sheets for the
777. As long as you don't have too much fuel (not too heavy) you can
certainly land a 777 with a 500 ft/min (seems like it may have been more
like 800) fall with no flare and not
destroy the plane. You probably make most passengers pee their pants
and if you are a *REAL* 777 pilot, you may no longer have a job,
but the plane is designed to withstand it.
So, if you end up in the cockpit of a 777 and need to land it (ya,
right)
don't worry about the flare. You'd be more likely to kill everyone on
board by flaring too high then by not flaring.
Jack Cullen
Gorman wrote:
>
[snip]
> Even though it's more work, maybe we should ask about the best flying books?
>
> I'd put "Fate Is The Hunter" up towards the top of that list.
>
> And along with listing "Spirit of St. Louis" as one of my favorite flying
> films I'd say the same thing about the book.
=================================================
Whenever I get a student who really wants to learn to fly (as opposed to
one who just wants to learn how and when to to manipulate the controls
and follow the regs), and they ask me what books they can get to help
them learn more about it, instead of telling them to get the Kershner
books, or Stick and Rudder, or the Jeppesen/Sandersen videos, or etc.,
etc., I simply tell them to get "Fate Is The Hunter" and "The Spirit of
St. Louis".
If they read those two books, they will learn more about flying than I
could ever teach them and it'll leave me with the simple task of showing
them how and when to manipulate the controls and follow the regs.
Ron Parsons
>
>When I was out in Seattle I got to see some of the spec sheets for the
>777. As long as you don't have too much fuel (not too heavy) you can
>certainly land a 777 with a 500 ft/min (seems like it may have been more
>like 800) fall with no flare and not
>destroy the plane. You probably make most passengers pee their pants
>and if you are a *REAL* 777 pilot, you may no longer have a job,
>but the plane is designed to withstand it.
That's not really new for Boeing. My first one was the KC-135 and it could
be landed at takeoff weight but the recommended max landing weight was one
where it could take a 550 ft/min rate. When I was a young pup in flight
training with the first of the MAC crews getting C-135's for McQuire,
those old guys wrestled with the airplane for about two days and then
began putting the rear of the truck down and the lowering the weight on
the front.
When the airlines first got 707's, it was such a leap the word was to not
flare but let it bang in not unlike a Navy carrier landing, however it
didn't take long for more and more of those hard headed old captains to
start ignoring the "experts" and give the passengers a nice touchdown.
It's hard to imagine any pilot being ham fisted enough to bang on a 747.
With 16 main wheels all taking various turns at the concrete, no matter
what, it's soft.
The 727 however was a challenge. I often explained to new copilots that it
landed like 5 different airplanes. The only problem was out guessing which
one it was being today.
While outstanding in other areas, the 757 is rather unremarkable in landing.
Perhaps my favorite is the 767. With just the least amount of care, the
first sign of it being on the ground will be the spoiler handle moving
aft.
Ron
Ron Parsons
In article <354DD0E5...@ix.netcom.com>, Gorman
<Gor...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>
>I've got a lot of other good flying books packed away (including several about
>bush pilots). If anyone's interested, I'll dig up the titles.
In the non fiction area I'd recommend the back to back reading of Yeager's
autobiography and Mig Pilot.
Ron
Trond Hamnes
How about "Turbulence"
How the heck can you fly a 747-200 form New York to LA with only 11
passengers? Don't you lose quite a bit of money?
Can the 747 autopilot really land all by itself? Is this standard on all
modern large aircraft?
George R Patterson
Ron Parsons wrote:
>
> All of Ernie Gann's stories are great except for the movie titled Fate is
They also did one of "The Aviator", which wasn't very good. They made
some serious changes to the plot, making the little girl a young rebel
in her 20's, adding a psychotic wolf, and a few other things. In the
aviation changes, they have our star training pilots for WW I in a Tiger
Moth and using a Stearman instead of a Pitcairn mail plane. The later
change wouldn't be a problem except that they left in the line about how
troublesome its "OX-5 engine" was.
George Patterson, N3162Q.
Capt. Doug
The B-747 can be equipped with an auto-land feature.
D.
Jonathan Lowe
The tiggy gets used a lot to emulate WW1 planes:-)
--
Cheers,
Model Flyer
Ireland
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Capt. Doug wrote in message <01bd7b90$0b092e20$c62973cf@default>...