Checklists
Zach Rogers
one I can edit and made for IFR flights.
Thanks,
Zach
Alan K. Gideon
Doug
enhancements you want. I used Microsoft Word, in the mode that prints on
half a sheet of paper. I printed it out and laminated it. I also made an IFR
checklist with the additional items needed on it.
Works well, and it is customized to me and my plane. Once you have it
formated, it is easy to edit it and change it for other aircraft or
situations.
"Zach Rogers" <fsw...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:FGvg8.311221$eS3.23...@bin3.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com...
Herb Martin
little kit with "spiral" binding, pre-punch covers and paper.
You test print on regular paper -- I run three columns.
Use a knife to score and split the spiral into three pieces.
(I even bought an el-cheapo paper cutter for about $8 --
it only does three or four pages at a cut, but it works great
for this sort of low volume stuff.)
Cut an 11" tall paper and cover in thirds, you get about 3 1/2",
and you cut the 8" side down to about 5" or so. Makes
a great shirt pocket spiral bound book.
I laminated (some of) the pages for the first one, but found
that after about 3 months (45 hours), I had changes and the
pages withno lamination were still fine, so the second time
the lamination seemed a waste of time.
The little kit for the spiral has a "sealing tool" which will open
and close the spiral for re-use.
I added VORs and NDBs the last time. Also, I did a cheesy
job of making the pages in the middle longer, and putting
"footer labels" on the bottom for easy thumb reference.
Herb Martin, PPL
(...and still a student pilot)
Try ADDS for great Weather too:
http://adds.aviationweather.noaa.gov/projects/adds
"Doug" <anoth...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:tbwg8.33621$0C1.2...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
Eric Rood
: one I can edit and made for IFR flights.
What year/model?
I scan the appropriate portions of the POH, OCR them and cut and paste
into a word processor document.
For printing/use, I prefer 5x8 blank cardstock. Can be purchased at any
office supply store in packs of 100 or 500.
Set your word processor document margins to:
top: 0.75
bottom: 3.25
left: 2.25
right: 2.25
I use a laserprinter. Cards can be printed on both sides.
To bind, you can do one of the following:
- punch three or four holes 0.38 inch from the top and retain with
hinged rings (also purchased from the office supply store)
- purchase the the four hole punch and approach binder or rings from Sporty's
(costs more, but is faster and easier than doing things individually).
The 5x8 format fits a standard kneeboard. Depending upon your age and
eyesight, you can print large or small font and multiple columns. You can
also use different colored cardstock for quick referencing sections
(emergency, normal procedures, etc).
--
Eric Rood
eric...@gcfn.org
Kalle
the checklist is to be made by the manufacturer, importer, or owner in
cooperation with one of those, or a FI. The rules are probably the same in
all JAR countries but I would not be surprised if there are differences in
USA, (and off course Russia).
Regards
K-A Edén
"Doug" <anoth...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:tbwg8.33621$0C1.2...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
Mark Kolber
>There might be different requirements in different countries but in Sweden
>the checklist is to be made by the manufacturer, importer, or owner in
>cooperation with one of those, or a FI.
That's interesting to know. In the US, many of us have found that the
official manufacturer's checklists are often cumbersome and contain
too much information, too little information, or be in an order that
makes no sense logically or ergonomically.
So, many of us adapt the official POH checklist to our real flying
needs and end up with ones that have more detail to cover things we
want to remember (one of my students added "Controls --- Crosswind
Taxi Position after Touchdown" to his pre-landing checklist to remind
himself what he needs to do when landing in a cross-wind) less detail
but in a more useful format, simply move them to conform (and confirm)
to a flow pattern, or add information pertinent to the location we
fly.
-
Mark Kolber
APA, Denver, Colorado
www.midlifeflight.com
=========
email? replace "spamaway" with "mkolber
Kalle
"Mark Kolber" <spam...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:a3p68ug6ssk2c99gk...@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 04 Mar 2002 08:07:07 GMT, "Kalle" <k.e...@home.se> wrote:
>
> >There might be different requirements in different countries but in
Sweden
> >the checklist is to be made by the manufacturer, importer, or owner in
> >cooperation with one of those, or a FI.
>
> That's interesting to know. In the US, many of us have found that the
> official manufacturer's checklists are often cumbersome and contain
> too much information, too little information, or be in an order that
> makes no sense logically or ergonomically.
>
Well, it is not uncommon with privately designed checklists in Sweden
either. Just to insure myself of critique from authorities if the worst
happens I keep an approved checklist in the plane even if I use my own.
Kalle
> Just to insure myself of critique from authorities if the worst
> happens
I mean FROM critique off course
Dan Truesdell
particulars for your airplane. I made one for my 172 that is basically
a small (1/4 page size) 5-page book. THe reason for the five pages is
that I have a progressive checklist on the right page, starting from
page one, and the emergency checklist on EVERY left page. It is bound
with 4 or 5 rings, and each page is in it's own clear plastic sheath.
THe reason for putting the emergency checklist on every left page is
that, when using the checklist, no matter what page of the checklist
I've left it, I can immediately flip the "book" over and get the
emergency checklist.
Hope that helps.
BTW, I just print on the top (or it is bottom) corner of the page, then
rerun the same paper through again to get the emergency stuff on it
(again printed in the top 1/4). Then the whole page is folded into
quarters (leaving the emergency and regular text on the front and back),
and stuffed into the plastic sheaths.
john price
There's one in Woed format on my web page...
http://home.att.net/~jm.price
John Price
CFII/AGI/IGI
john price
There's one in Woed format on my web page...
http://home.att.net/~jm.price
John Price
CFII/AGI/IGI
Herb Martin
When I first began my lessons, I asked explicitly
if the existing checklist from the POH or that the
school provided was required, if my own list could
be used instead.
I was encouraged to create my own list. In adopting
the existing list(s) it became clear that the POH and
the school supplied list for each plane were not exact
matches.
The POH was focused on the particular airplane model,
while the school list was focused on "flying". Each of
course had most elements of the other, but neither
had everything that I wanted to list for "flying this model
of airplane."
Examples:
The POH had no entry for "transponder to ALT" or "radio
checks." The school list had no mention of "checking the
heater or air conditioner."
On my check ride the DE kept turning up the heat. The DE
was obviously chilled due to our unusual cold. By the standards
of Sweden, Canada, or even the northern US it was almost
balmy, but for us it seemed very cold yesterday.
Even though the DE had on a coat, gloves, and hat, the cabin
could not be warm enough. I was flying in a short sleeve summer
"fishing shirt" -- no t-shirt underneath and this fishing shirt is
vented in the back to help keep you cool in summer. My vent was
wide open at first.
Then the DE started bugging me to "close my vent"; at first I thought
this was the infamous 'distraction'. <grin>
By the way, the DE commented favorably on my homemade checklist.
Herb Martin, PPL
(...and still a student pilot)
Try ADDS for great Weather too:
http://adds.aviationweather.noaa.gov/projects/adds
"Kalle" <k...@h.se> wrote in message
news:GpKg8.22857$n4.43...@newsc.telia.net...
Zach Rogers
together the one I want for my aircraft. One last question, does anyone
actually use checklists for instrument appraoches? Or do the 5 T's and GUMPS
work fine?
"Zach Rogers" <fsw...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:FGvg8.311221$eS3.23...@bin3.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com...
Doug
I have to do an instrument approach
It is on one of those 1/2 pages, laminated.
"Zach Rogers" <fsw...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:KWVg8.60734$nz4.5...@bin4.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com...
Eric Rood
: together the one I want for my aircraft. One last question, does anyone
: actually use checklists for instrument appraoches? Or do the 5 T's and GUMPS
: work fine?
I would recommend that you use the checklist to prepare for the approach.
Maybe 30 - 15 minutes prior to entering the terminal area, use the
checklist to get ATIS, appropriate approach plates, clean up the cockpit,
stopwatch ready, etc.
--
Eric Rood
eric...@gcfn.org
Judah
were not actually in the airplane, like cowl flaps, gage checks for gages
that weren't there, and stuff like that, IIRC.
So the school published a checklist of their own. Seems _they_ ommited the
oil check, and changed the sequence for some electrical checks and stuff.
<g>
So I made my own.
My checkride was at the end of the fall, and the first really cold day.
The linesman told me he pre-heated the engine and I should use the "hot-
start" checklist. Of course, this was incorrect information, but I wasn't
smart enough to know the difference at the time. I tried to hot-start the
engine according to the POH (basically it says, "don't prime") and it
vapor locked. The DE pink slipped me, and said that if I would have used
the POH it would have been a "Cannot Continue" instead of a fail.
Interestingly enough, he also told me that I should never try to start the
engine without at least one prime, even though it says so in the POH.
Next day I used the POH for all my checklists, and he got annoyed at me
because during startup there was like a page worth of bogus stuff that
didn't apply, and frankly I wasn't used to. But I started reading through
it anyway because I didn't want to get busted again. About halfway through
he said, "OK. Come on, I get the point, let's go..."
Actually, the guy was a good guy. And I wasn't trying to bust his chops -
frankly I was now extra super nervous and somewhat confused.
But the POINT of all that is that if I was using the POH, I would have
saved myself at least one lecture from my instructor! (Boy was he upset!)
<g>
Incidentally, the guy turned out to be a really good guy, and made me feel
much less nervous very quickly... He even passed me! <g>
Judah
"Herb Martin" <He...@LearnQuick.Com> wrote in
news:X6Mg8.57066$0y2.2...@typhoon.austin.rr.com:
Herb Martin
Herb Martin, PPL
(...and still a student pilot)
Try ADDS for great Weather too:
http://adds.aviationweather.noaa.gov/projects/adds
"Judah" <Ju...@spamfree.com> wrote in message
news:Xns91CC8138D...@66.114.74.35...
Peter Duniho
> much less nervous very quickly... He even passed me! <g>
He may have turned out to have a good personality, in your opinion, but he
sure doesn't sound like the kind of DE I'd be interested in having a
checkride with. He *failed* you for having trouble starting the engine?
Granted, it would have been better if you were more familiar with the engine
starting procedures, but you DID use the POH (just the wrong part), and
being a new pilot you had every reason to trust the linesman (I'm assuming
this was the first time you'd started a plane that had been preheated).
On top of that, he may be giving you bogus information on starting the
engine. A warm engine probably does NOT need any priming. The C172
checklist even says "0-3 times" for the primer...why would they write zero
rather than one if one should never try to start the engine without priming?
(I say "he may be" because you don't say what plane you were using for the
checkride; I'm not aware of any planes that ALWAYS need priming for start,
but I'm sure they're out there and maybe you were using one for the
checkride).
Seems to me on the first checkride he should have waited to see how you
dealt with the situation, and assuming you eventually got the engine started
without too much fuss and trouble, that should have been fine. Since it was
a brand new situation you'd never been exposed to before, IMHO it would be
much more important from an examiner's point of view HOW you deal with the
situation rather than whether you get it perfectly right on the first try.
Pete
Herb Martin
> dealt with the situation, and assuming you eventually got the engine
started
> without too much fuss and trouble, that should have been fine. Since it
was
> a brand new situation you'd never been exposed to before, IMHO it would be
> much more important from an examiner's point of view HOW you deal with the
> situation rather than whether you get it perfectly right on the first try.
>
That's the truth.
Original poster never did mention if the "no prime"
was the only starting attempt.
Heck, I try that some of the time -- if it doesn't work, then I
prime.
Did Judah just give up, or did Judah get failed without a
chance to try another method of starting? The latter is
totally unreasonable...and has nothing to do with 'safe flight.'
Herb Martin, PPL
(...and still a student pilot)
Try ADDS for great Weather too:
http://adds.aviationweather.noaa.gov/projects/adds
> Pete
>
>
Judah
wasn't the point of my story, so I abbreviated...
After I couldn't get it to start with no prime, I tried priming it and
cranking again, with no success. Then I tried to do the failed start
checklist. Although I didn't realize it at the time, the failed start
procedure is really to clear flooding and was probably useless, or even
detrimental at that point. (Actually, I've learned quite a bit about
engine starting since that episode..)
Still no go.
Then he said "That's it. I'm outta here. You just failed."
In retrospect, I did the failed start procedure from memory - it wasn't on
my checklist. I haven't thought about that until now. But the point of my
story is that if I would have used the POH instead of my own checklist, I
wouldn't have failed.
Now I strongly believe in using the POH checklists (or facsimiles) instead
of my own. I photocopied the POH into a reduced size so that it fits more
like a pocket-booklet instead of a 4x5 3-ring binder, and it makes it much
easier to deal with. I also trimmed pages so that it's easy to quickly
open to the right page. And I write notes on it for anything that I need
to add for my own edification. But the truth is, there is info in the POH
that is easy to "gloss over" during a copy session, that you won't need
until it's an emergency, and then it's too late...
So maybe something positive came out from it after all... (Hey - I can't
help it, I'm an optimist!)
Judah
"Herb Martin" <He...@LearnQuick.Com> wrote in
news:pPui8.65067$6j2.3...@typhoon.austin.rr.com:
James M. Knox
news:Xns91CCC5FE667DFju...@66.114.74.35:
> So maybe something positive came out from it after all... (Hey - I
> can't help it, I'm an optimist!)
If something positive came out of it, then it was beneficial (if only that
it taught you to accept those parts of life you can't control).
Another thing you learned is that lineboys don't know much about aircraft
engines, and CFI's usually know even less! [No "smilie" here...]
The "checklist" issue is interesting (and often emotional). There is no
regulatory requirement for a checklist on an aircraft and flight such as
yours (much less what kind or how it is used)... yet the PTS clearly
requires the DE to grade you on such. So... go with the flow, use the
checklist (it's not a bad idea anyway).
Yours or the POH? Personally, I recommend making your own, unique to the
aircraft (and it should be identified as such). [I get tired of my Piper
checklist always reminding me on a hot Texas summer day (anything over 140+
in the cockpit <G>) that I don't even HAVE an airconditioner to be turned
off!] Making your own is not just to shorten it, sometimes the opposite.
For instance, lots of them just have "Avionics - Set". You may find
yourself taking off on a nice VFR day with someone else's squawk code still
in the transponder. So if it happens more than once, you may want to add
that specific check to the checklist. Whatever.
Now, what would have been the "ideal" scenario?
"Mister DE, sir... In the interest of efficiency and safety I have made up
my own checklists that still include everything from the POH checklist
**that is relevant to this particular airplane**, and added a few
additional things I feel I need special reminding on. Would that checklist
be acceptable to you, or would you like me to go through the entire POH
checklist?"
But heck, you could still get some guy that has had a bad day, and yells at
you because you are supposed to be PIC and he feels you shouldn't have
asked. Don't let it get to you...
-----------------------------------------------
James M. Knox
TriSoft ph 512-385-0316
1109-A Shady Lane fax 512-366-4331
Austin, Tx 78721 jk...@trisoft.com
-----------------------------------------------