Amprius' "world's highest density" batteries with energy density of 450 Wh/kg and 1,150 Wh/l may enable sustainable electric aircraft

[Larry Dighera]

Amprius' "world's highest density" batteries with energy density of 450
Wh/kg and 1,150 Wh/l may enable sustainable electric aircraft

It's encouraging to see light weight, high energy density battery
development progressing. NASA thought so highly of Amprius, that they help
fund them: https://www1.grc.nasa.gov/wp-content/uploads/5.-Amprius.pdf
=============================================================================

https://newatlas.com/energy/amprius-450-wh-kg-battery

Amprius ships first batch of "world's highest density" batteries
By Loz Blain
February 13, 2022

Amprius has delivered some 450-Wh/kg cells to its first customer, the
highest-density cells currently availableAmprius
VIEW 3 IMAGES

Californian company Amprius has shipped the first batch of what it claims
are the most energy-dense lithium batteries available today. These silicon
anode cells hold 73 percent more energy than Tesla's Model 3 cells by
weight, and they take up 37 percent less volume.

Tesla's current Model 3 cells serve as a state-of-the-art comparison, and
hold around 260 Wh/kg and 730 Wh/l, according to Enpower. The new Amprius
cells are a significant step up, both in specific energy and energy density,
holding 450 Wh/kg and 1,150 Wh/l – and the company says that the undisclosed
number of cells just delivered to "an industry leader of a new generation of
High-Altitude Pseudo Satellites" give it bragging rights for "the highest
energy density cells available in the battery industry today."

Amprius says the batteries' impressive performance is due to its silicon
nanowire anode technology. When you charge up a lithium-ion battery, you're
effectively pulling an electron off each lithium atom sitting happily at the
cathode, and moving them across to the anode via external wiring, since
electrons can't pass through the electrolyte or separator between the anode
and cathode. Their negative charge pulls the positively-charged lithium ions
across through the electrolyte and separator, where they each find an
electron and become embedded in what's typically a graphite lattice at the
anode.

Silicon nanowire electrodes can store more lithium than a typical graphite
lattice, and Amprius says they last long enough to be competitive with
current technology

Silicon nanowire electrodes can store more lithium than a typical graphite
lattice, and Amprius says they last long enough to be competitive with
current technologyAmprius

Amprius has replaced that graphite lattice with silicon nanowires. Silicon
can store some 10x more lithium than graphite, but it tends to swell and
crack, drastically reducing cell life. Amprius says that when you form the
silicon into porous nanowires, arranged as a kind of forest of longer wires
with shorter ones in between, the silicon is able to tolerate swell and
resist cracking, extending the life of the cell to the point where silicon
anodes can become a competitive technology.

The company says the silicon nanowires are rooted right into the substrate
of the anode, so conductivity (and thus power) is high. It says the cell
cycle life is "excellent" and "continually improving," although it doesn't
put any numbers on it, and it also says the anode is the only part of the
battery that changes; the rest can be produced using existing manufacturing
methods and components.

Obviously, the world is ready and waiting for next-gen battery cells that
can store more energy in less size and weight – everything from smartphones
to electric vehicles would benefit either from a weight or space reduction,
and emerging technologies like electric VTOL aircraft are crying out for
batteries that can improve their range and capabilities.

The Amprius cells significantly outperform current lithium batteries on
energy density by weight and volume --Amprius

And of course, energy density and specific energy are just two metrics on
which a battery needs to compete. Thermal performance, safety,
charge/discharge rates and cycle life will all play a big part, as indeed
will price. The fact that Amprius's first customer is in advanced aerospace
and making satellites would suggest that at this point, these cells aren't
going to compete on price.

The company will soon choose a site, on which it'll start building a mass
production facility, which will bring economies of scale that might make
this technology relevant in the EV market and elsewhere. By the time that
factory's up and running, we should also be able to put some exact
performance metrics on another advanced electrode manufacturer we've been
reporting on: Nawa Technologies says it's developed a way to cheaply
manufacture vertically aligned carbon nanotube electrodes, claiming these
could lead to 300 percent improvements on today's lithium batteries. We
shall see.

Source: Amprius:
https://amprius.com/2022/02/amprius-technologies-ships-first-commercially-available-450-wh-kg-1150-wh-l-batteries


Loz Blain
Loz has been one of our most versatile contributors since 2007, and has
since proven himself as a photographer, videographer, presenter, producer
and podcast engineer, as well as a senior features writer. Joining the team
as a motorcycle specialist, he's covered just about everything for New
Atlas, concentrating lately on eVTOLs, hydrogen, energy, aviation,

12 COMMENTS

vince FEBRUARY 13, 2022 10:56 PM
UTS will get bragging rights soon with 11,700 Wh/Kg. Check out University of
Technology at Sydney discovery.

Robt FEBRUARY 14, 2022 02:01 AM
UTS website discusses a new molecule that could very significantly improve
battery anode performance etc. etc.
However they haven’t so much as built a lab prototype
A bit early for bragging rights

Chase FEBRUARY 14, 2022 06:53 AM
It would be lovely to finally get the weight down on these battery packs in
vehicles. Between the weight savings and the reduced need for capacity due
to the reduced weight, this could cut the battery weight in half (about
500lbs off in a Model 3 LR) and shave 14% off the total weight of the car. I
still wouldn't buy a Tesla (because I hate the ADAS-is-LIFE design), but
huge reductions in weight are a great way to get me interested in an EV.

notarichman FEBRUARY 14, 2022 07:24 AM
i notice that amprius doesn't mention how many cycles/years the battery will
last.

BlueOak FEBRUARY 14, 2022 08:38 AM
“ It says the cell cycle life is "excellent" and "continually improving,"

Talk is cheap, but actual, proven, performance specs are what lives in the
real world.
guzmanchinky FEBRUARY 14, 2022 08:41 AM

I am so excited for electric motorcycles with huge range, or one of those
flying Jetson thingees with an hour flight time!
noteugene FEBRUARY 14, 2022 08:58 AM

Hope next yrs cell phones will utilize this tech but that's doubtful. Not
enough of a time frame to scale up for production one would think.
WB FEBRUARY 14, 2022 09:28 AM

been reading these for over a decade now... and non zero zip nada ever made
it anywhere, still stuck on the good old standard lithium ion...
joe46 FEBRUARY 14, 2022 03:51 PM

so how much do these things cost ? and how many charge cycles do you get out
of them ?
MarkGovers FEBRUARY 14, 2022 08:08 PM
We are one step closer to all electric everything!
LOAD MORE
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https://amprius.com/2022/02/amprius-technologies-ships-first-commercially-available-450-wh-kg-1150-wh-l-batteries
AMPRIUS TECHNOLOGIES SHIPS FIRST COMMERCIALLY AVAILABLE 450 Wh/kg, 1150 Wh/L
BATTERIES
February 8, 2022
Deployment of industry-disrupting battery cell in advanced aerospace
application affirms Amprius as the leading provider of the highest energy
density cells available

Fremont, CA – FEBRUARY 08, 2022 — Amprius Technologies, Inc., the leader in
Silicon Anode Li-Ion battery cells with its Si-NanowireTM platform, today
announced the shipment of the first commercially available 450 Wh/kg, 1150
Wh/L lithium ion battery cells to an industry leader of a new generation of
High-Altitude Pseudo Satellites (HAPS). Amprius Technologies’ high energy
density battery cells have enabled groundbreaking capabilities in long
endurance, communications, and high-resolution imaging to cutting-edge
stratospheric platforms since 2018.

This shipment represents the culmination of collaborative development and
testing for this latest design win. The deployment of this
industry-disrupting battery cell in an advanced aerospace application
affirms Amprius Technologies as the leading provider of the highest energy
density cells available in the battery industry today.

“This advancement from the 405 Wh/kg product, previously announced on
November 8, 2021, highlights the acceleration of our roadmap towards
delivering products with unrivaled performance,” said Jon Bornstein, COO of
Amprius Technologies. “Our proprietary Si-NanowireTM platform and the
comprehensive solutions we have developed enable unparalleled performance
and continue to sustain our product leadership.”

The newest product release from Amprius, which has been in commercial
manufacturing since 2018 at its Fremont, CA facility, represents another
proof point in the company’s unique ability to deliver breakthrough
performance that enables optimal business cases for its customers. To
support surging demand, Amprius Technologies, Inc. has embarked on
constructing its first high volume manufacturing facility located in the
United States. A mass production site will be selected in the first quarter
of 2022.

About Amprius Technologies

Amprius Technologies is a leading manufacturer of high-energy and
high-capacity lithium-ion batteries producing the industry’s highest energy
density cells. The company’s corporate headquarters is in Fremont,
California where it maintains an R&D lab and a pilot manufacturing facility
for the fabrication of silicon nanowire anodes and cells. Please go to
Amprius.com for more information.

###

For more information, please contact:

Renee Maler
Philosophy PR + Marketing
510.499.9746
re...@philosophypr.com

INTERESTED? LET’S TALK
Contact us to learn more about Amprius Technologies 100% Silicon Nanowire
Technology.

Amprius
ISO 9001-2015 Certified
1180 Page Ave, Fremont, CA 94538 USA
Phone: 800.425.8803
Email: inq...@amprius.com
--------------------------------------

https://amprius.com/technology

TECHNOLOGY
The world needs better batteries!
01
THE PROBLEM
Why is battery technology evolving so slowly?
The main reason for the slow pace of battery improvement is chemistry. In
conventional lithium-ion batteries the anode is made of carbon in the form
of graphite, and graphite has reached its energy density limit.

A new anode material is required to improve battery performance, and that
material is silicon. Silicon can store up to 10 times more lithium compared
to graphite which enables batteries to have much greater energy. But silicon
swells dramatically when it is charged with lithium and that can cause it to
crack and stop working.


02
THE AMPRIUS’ SOLUTION
Amprius’ 100% Silicon nanowire technology
In 2007, scientists at Stanford University discovered a solution to the
swelling problem of silicon anodes. Silicon nanowires were shown to tolerate
swell and resist cracking. Amprius has perfected this technology and the
result is the world’s first 100% silicon nanowire anode for lithium-ion
batteries.

The 100% silicon nanowire anode is a direct replacement for graphite anodes.
The rest of the battery components and manufacturing methods leverage the
established global supply chain for lithium-ion batteries.

Benefits of Using Nanowires

Nanowires tolerate volume expansion and are rooted to the substrate
Nanowires have micro and macro porosity that accommodate swell
Nanowires improve Solid-Electrolyte-Interphase & cycle life
Anode thickness is reduced to half of a graphite electrode thickness

Advantages of Amprius’ 100% Silicon nanowire batteries
Highest content active silicon material – 100% silicon: Because silicon is
the best material for energy density, using 100% silicon means that we can
provide lithium-ion batteries with the highest energy density.

High conductivity and connectivity: Silicon nanowires are connected directly
to the substrate with no binders. This means that there is nothing to block
the flow of current. Our nanowire technology enables the highest ratio of
energy to power.

Excellent Cycle Life: Amprius Technologies 100% Silicon Nanowire Batteries
have excellent cycle life that is continuously improving. This has been
demonstrated in real world use with multiple organizations including US
National Labs and major aerospace companies.


03
PRESENT AND FUTURE
Revolutionizing battery technology
Amprius Technologies’ 100% silicon lithium-ion batteries are game-changers.
Having the highest energy density in the industry, our batteries can
substantially improve the performance of electric vehicles, aircraft,
drones, and wearables.

Notes:

Urban Air Mobility – estimated flight time based on customer models

Soldier Power – real data based on Conformal Wearable Battery developed for
US army

Smartwatch – customer-reported data

Electric Vehicle – estimated relative to Tesla Model 3 long-range battery
specifications


OUR ROADMAP
The future of batteries
Going forward, Amprius Technologies has an extensive product roadmap that
further leverages 100% Silicon Nanowire anodes. We are actively scaling
silicon anode manufacturing to allow more industries to take advantage of
our products. Our high performance lithium-ion batteries are currently being
used in premium and mission critical applications and will soon expand to EV
and consumer applications as our manufacturing capacity grows.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

https://www.futureflight.aero/news-article/2021-12-07/amprius-claims-game-changing-battery-recharge-rate

AMPRIUS CLAIMS GAME-CHANGING BATTERY RECHARGE RATE
CHARLES ALCOCK
DECEMBER 7, 2021
Amprius Technologies has announced what it describes as a breakthrough in
battery charging rates that could significantly boost the performance of
electric vehicles, including eVTOL models. The U.S.-based start-up says that
using its proprietary Si-Nanowire anode platform, it achieved a 0 to 80
percent charge rate for silicon anode Lithium-Ion battery cells in just six
minutes.

The company says the result of the trial has been independently verified by
Mobile Power Solutions and meets the U.S. Advanced Battery Consortium’s goal
of achieving an 80 percent charge in less than 15 minutes by 2025. It claims
that an unnamed Fortune 100 company is now evaluating the Si-Nanowire
technology.

Amprius, which is already providing battery cells for several drone
applications, intends to offer the technology to companies developing larger
electric aircraft. It is moving to achieve mass production rates for its
cells of hundreds of megawatt-hours per year and expects to initiate a major
ramp-up in 2024.

“These results confirm the significant benefits of our Si-Nanowire anode for
electric vehicle applications, where fast charge and high energy density are
essential,” said Amprius’s chief operating officer, Jon Bornstein. “The need
to shorten charge times extends well beyond the rapidly growing electric
vehicle market and into broader electric mobility markets, including
micro-mobility and aviation.”

According to Amprius, its battery cell has a specific energy of 370 Wh/kg
and supports applications that need very high sustained power. The fast
charge capability is already available for some in-production cells,
including those being used for power-intensive drone applications.

In October, ABB E-mobility announced plans to develop MegaWatt-class
fast-charging equipment for Lilium’s seven-seat eVTOL aircraft. The
Switzerland-based power and automation specialist will provide the
infrastructure in time to support its planned launch of commercial flights
of up to 155 miles in Florida, Germany, and Brazil in 2024.

The charging points are intended to be capable of fully recharging batteries
in around 30 minutes, or charging up to 80 percent in 15 minutes. The German
manufacturer says this will allow each of its Lilium Jets to make between 20
and 25 daily flights across its planned network of vertiports.
------------------------------------------------------------------

https://www1.grc.nasa.gov/wp-content/uploads/5.-Amprius.pdf

High Energy Density Lithium-Ion Cells with Silicon Nanowire Anode Technology
Ionel Stefan
CTO, Amprius Technologies, Inc.
1180 Page Ave., Fremont, CA

2020 NASA Battery Industry Day
AMPRIUS TECHNOLOGIES, INC.
COMPREHENSIVE PLATFORM
Technology platform includes entire ecosystem for optimal performance:
BEST PERFORMANCE
Highest energy density lithium-ion cells Silicon nanowire anode
manufacturing

Electrochemistry
High energy cell designs
1200 450
100% 50+
Wh/liter Wh/kg
Independent patent filings on nanowire technology and lithium ion cells
Silicon nanowire anode
Leader in Silicon Anode Technology
Highest Performance Li-Ion Cells in the Industry
2
ENABLING TECHNOLOGY
Pioneers and established leaders in silicon anode materials and high
energy density lithium ion batteries
2008 Company founded at Stanford
2009 Operations Started
2018 First Commercial Product
“Silicon Is Awesome and Inexpensive”- Tesla Battery Day 2020

PATENTED SILICON NANOWIRE ANODE CONSTRUCTION
A New Structure for 100% Silicon Based on Nanowires
KEY BENEFITS
- Micro & Macro porosity- prevents cracking and interference between
nanowires
- Tolerates Expansion, Nanowire Rootedmechanically and electrically
connected to substrate
- Stable Solid Electrolyte Interphase (SEI)- stabilized interaction with
electrolytes
- Conductive filament grown from substrate
- Bulk coating of low density, porous amorphous silicon
- Thin layer of high-density amorphous silicon
310
340
330
30 µm
8 µm
3

MANUFACTURING: ROLL-TO-ROLL FOR SILICON NANOWIRE ANODE PRODUCTION
Pilot Scale Manufacturing – demonstrated scalability with Pilot Tool
4
200 kWh per line
Bare Foil In and Finished Anode Out
• powder mixing
• slurry preparation
• roll coating (2X)
• drying
• calendaring
Replaces:
5
Products and Applications
HIGH ENERGY AND POWER CAPABILITY
Amprius’ cells enable the highest energy and power
Graphite
Anode Cell
maximum cell
body temperature
during discharge
ENERGY
POWER
Silicon Nanowire//LCO Ragone Plot
Proprietary and Confidential 6
Application
Dimensions
(T x W x H)
mm
Mass
g
Capacity
Ah
Energy
Wh Wh/L Wh/kg Capacity
Ah
Energy
Wh Wh/L Wh/kg
Charge-Discharge Rate: C/5-C/5 Charge-Discharge Rate: 1C-3C
HAPS 4.5 x 50 x 55 33.1 3.8 13.9 1125 420
Drones, High
Power 4.2 x 50 x 55 27.8 2.8 10.1 875 365 2.65 9.0 780 325
Drones, Long
Endurance 4.6 x 50 x 55 31.7 3.6 13.2 1040 416 3.4 11.5 870 360
High-Capacity
Cells 4.5 x 50 x 105 68.1 8.1 29.3 1240 430
Army Wearable
Pack 5.4 x 54 x 64 49.5 5.4 21 1125 425

PRODUCTS
High Power capability with highest energy density and specific energy
Operating temperature range: -20ºC to 55ºC. Cycle life 150-300 cycles,
depending on operating conditions
7
CHEMISTRIES WITH LONG CYCLE LIFE
Long Endurance Batteries
Si/LCO
80%
Cycling at C/5 for Long Endurance UAV applications
8
Si/NMC811
SILICON NANOWIRE ANODE ENABLES MUCH GREATER IMPROVEMENT
9
Flight Time Mission Time Talk Time Range
SoA Graphite Amprius SiNW
Urban Air Mobility Soldier Wearable
Power
Smartwatch BEV
Notes: UAM – estimated flight time based on customer models
Soldier Power – real data based on Conformal Wearable Battery developed for
US Army
Smartwatch – customer reported data
BEV – estimated relative to Tesla Model 3 long range battery specifications
Game-Changing Advantages in Advanced Applications
15 min
37 min
8.2 h
17.8 h
3.1 h
5.7 h
334 mi
602 mi
USE CASES
Energy Cells for High Altitude Drones Enable Longest Endurance
“The aircraft has achieved an altitude of 74,000 ft in Arizona
and, critically, has remained above 50,000ft at dawn, after a
night's flying with no sun to charge its batteries.”

10
USE CASES
Lightweight battery pack for Stratosphere
Target
87%
C/5 Cycling at 30 mBar (~78,000 ft)
• 406 Wh/kg battery pack
• Replaced incumbent Li/S
• Reduced battery size over 50%
• Light-weight, compliant compression system for stratosphere

11
x12
USE CASES
Power Cells for Urban Air Mobility – Long Endurance

12
USE CASES
Endurance Record for Multi-Rotor Drone with Amprius Power Cells

13
USE CASES
Long Endurance Power Batteries
• 415 Wh/kg at C/5, 370 Wh/kg at 2C ? doubles endurance
• Designed for eVTOL and multirotor drones 725 Wh, 5 lb (2.27 kg) Pack

14
HIGH POWER CELLS
Small, long endurance power drones
0%
20%
40%
60%
80%
100%
120%
Discharge Rate
Energy, % vs. C/5
• >80% relative energy to 6C rate
• Small temperature increase and within
operating limits to 10C rate
20
25
30
35
40
45
50
55
60
0 0.5 1 1.5 2 2.5 3
Temperature (
oC)
Discharge capacity (Ah)
6C
5C
4C
3C
2C
1C
15
PORTABLE POWER APPLICATION
Conformal-Wearable Battery – 2X Energy Content

16
CONFORMAL-WEARABLE BATTERY
2X Energy Content

17
Specification CWB-150 (Fielded Model) Amprius “Flexible” battery
Energy (Pack) 148 Wh 320 Wh
Weight 2.6 lb 2 .6 l b
Dimensions 8.7” x 7.65” x 0.7” 8 .7 ” x 7 .65” x 0 .7 ”
Cells specific energy 201 Wh/kg 395 Wh/ kg
x 16
UN38.3 certified in 2020, confirmed performance in field test
USE CASES
EV – Future Market

18
EV CELLS
Exceed 2025 Goals
• Si/NCM811
• ISO form factor VIFB-/99/300
Model based on results to date:
• Capacity: 60 Ah at C/3 rate (30°C)
• Energy: 450 Wh/kg and 1200 Wh/L
• Peak Power: 1000 W/kg and 2650 W/L
• 80% capacity charged in 15 minutes
50% higher specific energy than best EV cells

19
EV PERFORMANCE TESTS
Cycle Life – Dynamic Stress Test (DST)
• DST pulse profile
• Constant energy discharged every cycle

20
>650 cycles, ongoing improvement to 1000
>100,000 miles with 200-mile range battery
EV PERFORMANCE TESTS
Calendar Life – 50°C at Full Charge
Equivalent to about 8 years, ongoing improvement to 10 years
• Reference Performance Test
verification every 32 days
• Calendar Life at 50°C equivalent
to about 4x Calendar Life at 30°C

21
EV PERFORMANCE TESTS
High Rate Charge
• Charge for 15 minutes at 3.2C rate
• 85% energy restored in 15 minutes
• 99.5% energy restored in
subsequent normal full cycle

22
Silicon nanowire anode is best for fast charging due to lower thickness
8 5 % E N E R G Y C H A R G E D I N 1 5 M I N U T E S
HIGH LOADING, HIGH
VOLTAGE LCO
HIGH LOADING, Ni-RICH
NMC
LARGE FORM FACTOR,
ADVANCED CATHODES
HIGH SILICON LOADING, ADVANCED
CATHODES, LARGE FORM FACTOR
ROAD MAP: SPECIFIC ENERGY
2019 2020 2021 2022 2023
300
WH/KG SPECIFIC ENERGY
350
400
450
500
550
600
650
ACTIVE MATERIALS IMPROVEMENT AND ACTIVE/INACTIVE RATIO INCREASE
SILICON NANOWIRE ANODE
GRAPHITE ANODE
Thank You

24
Ionel Stefan, (510) 512-5484, io...@amprius.com
Jon Bornstein, (408) 406-2671, jo...@amprius.com
Amprius wishes to acknowledge the funding received from
US Army C5ISR, DOE, USABC, and NASA
--------------------------------------------------

https://www.marketwatch.com/investing/private-company/amprius?mod=over_search
COMPANY OVERVIEW

FOUNDED
2008

NUMBER OF EMPLOYEES
11-50

FOUNDERS
Mark Platshon, Yi Cui

LAST FUNDING ROUND DETAILS
Funding Type Series C
Announced Date Jan 6, 2014
Money Raised $30,000,000

FEATURED TEAM

Kang Sun
CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER

Jon Bornstein
PRESIDENT & CHIEF OPERATING OFFICER

Yi Cui
CO-FOUNDER AND DIRECTOR

Mark Platshon
CO-FOUNDER & INVESTOR

William Deihl
CHIEF FINANCIAL OFFICER

Ionel Stefan
CHIEF TECHNOLOGY OFFICER

-------------------------------------------

https://insideevs.com/news/566876/amprius-ships-450whkg-battery-cells/

Join the discussion…


Avatar
jaxwins • 4 days ago
3-4 years in Musk`s time means 15-25 normal years.

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Tasslehoff jaxwins • 4 days ago
Well, the accurate quote is: "400 Wh/kg *with* high cycle life, produced in
volume (not just a lab) is not far. Probably 3 to 4 years."

Life cycle, volume and price were not mentioned in the article.

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Joseph Dubeau Tasslehoff • 4 days ago
Elon Musk had nothing to do with it. tweet, tweet

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wydeeyde Tasslehoff • 4 days ago
I would suspect that aerospace would equate to a lower load and a long life
cycle. Satellites can't be pulling into the Nio battery swap station every
12 months. Hauling stuff around in dense gravity on the other hand may
degrade the recycle life significantly. Tests required.

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Tasslehoff wydeeyde • 4 days ago
I agree. But it isn't mentioned still.

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Pitounet wydeeyde • 3 days ago • edited
"Pseudo Satellites".
A fancy word for very high altitude drones :).
They will come back on earth regularily. The advantage of the higher
gravimetric energy is those pseudo satellites can stay longer in the upper
atmosphere before going back. I think the upmost important part here is the
gravimetric energy. I don't really know the power requirement, depending the
type of drones, there could be requirements for short burst.
Also I wouldn't expect the cost to be a deciding factor here, for many of
those the performance is much more important than the cost.
As for cycle life, well it is nice to have a good one but not critical.

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4wheeler jaxwins • 3 days ago
Your comment has no factual basis; so it is just a snide remark, not
necessary in this thread.

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Doggydogworld • 4 days ago
SES sold their Li-metal anode cells into this high altitude drone market at
least three years ago. IIRC they were around 450 Wh/kg. List price was
fantastical, something like $5k per cell. They also talked of scaling
production up, but it didn't happen.

Nanowires sound ridiculously hard to manufacture in volume. Let's hope I'm
wrong.

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JonesNL • 4 days ago
What is the price per kWh? That is one of the most important metrics...

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peapod JonesNL • 4 days ago
And number of cycles, and safety?

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Leo O'Connor • 4 days ago
Still waiting for you to make a Bjorn Nyland 1k km style chart but with
battery company, battery name, battery size, and Wh/kg and Wh/l (and when
they will/do produce those) so we can compare how good those stats are for
articles like this to others you have posted in the past.

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Tim Kulogo • 4 days ago
I did some math a few years back on what would be necessary for electric
aircraft and I came up with 440Wh/kg. This is really exciting.

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super390 Tim Kulogo • 4 days ago
This battery is definitely going to the aerospace/military market. The sky's
the limit on price over there.

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wydeeyde super390 • 4 days ago
No word play intended I presume.

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peapod Tim Kulogo • 4 days ago
440 Wh/kg at the cell (if it is even economically viable for aircraft
propulsion) is maybe 350 Wh/kg in aircraft grade battery pack. Kerosene is
over 13,000 Wh/kg and the fuel tank is the typically the actual wing
structure. Modern gas turbines are about half as efficient as
battery/inverter/electric motor. You are still talking about only 5% of the
effective energy density as jet fuel (or gasoline for a piston aircraft)
Actual existing packs for aircraft are well under 200 Wh/kg. Commercially
operated aircraft require fuel reserves that can easily eat up half or more
of the batteries capacity. A useful battery/electric aircraft remains a far
off dream.

Two person battery electric "sport" aircraft exist but have short useful
endurance (you don't land with zero "fuel" remaining) even without reserve
requirements reserves.

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Tim Kulogo peapod • 4 days ago
My numbers were for the cell level, and I had assumed non structural packs,
so if the batteries can be used structurally, that makes it easier. It was
purely an engineering exercise, so regulations that prevent the use of
electric aircraft will have to be fixed by lawmakers. I can't really defend
my work because it was years ago when I did it, and I no longer have the
data, but at the time, I felt pretty confident about it. I guess we'll have
to wait and see.

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OC Tim Kulogo • 3 days ago
I think your numbers are highly optimistic for all but the shortest trips
(e.g. airport shuttle flights currently done by helicopters and short inter
island flights).

Aeroderivative turbines aren't far off 50% efficiency for ELECTRICITY
production (i.e. with the additional losses from the generator). They are
VERY efficient thermal engines.

An ultra high bypass turbofan in a modern jet is very, very efficient at
creating thrust being over 40% efficient (chemical to kinetic). That doesn't
sound impressive but when you realise that a Cessna's propeller at cruising
speed only converts 73.5% of the mechanical energy provided by the prop
shaft into thrust you realise that unlike in an electric car there are
MASSIVE losses AFTER the conversion of chemical energy to rotational
mechanical energy.

1) Regulators will never remove the restrictions on fuel reserves as that's
what prevents aircraft falling out of the sky;

2) Working out practical range etc is a HIGHLY complex undertaking as
additional mass from a less energy dense carrier = more lift required = more
drag = more energy required for the flight. Worse more mass from batteries =
more structure to carry the mass / create the required lift = yet more mass
= yet more lift required = yet more drag created = yet more energy required;

3) This is made yet more difficult because liquid fuel gets burned during a
flight = mass reduces = less lift required = less drag is produced = less
energy required to move the aircraft through the air. A battery powered
aircraft does not have that benefit.

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Ripi Tim Kulogo • 4 days ago • edited
Fuel cells or biofuels seems like a better solution for aviation.

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Tim Kulogo Ripi • 4 days ago
Only if batteries can't be made to work. Fuel cells or bio-fuels would would
have a much higher operating cost, though both are preferable to using
fossil fuel.

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Ripi Tim Kulogo • 4 days ago
They will work. It's just that weight is incredibly important in airplanes.
Much moreso than ground transport.

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happosai Ripi • an hour ago
There isn't enough land to grow all the feedstock needed to transition
aviation to biofuels. That is, unless we claim more nature to crop fields
and/or we stop eating eating meat. The only scalable option is synthetic P2X
fuels. That is costly, so it will mean flight tickets 2-3x the current
prices.

Back to the good old times when flying was a luxury...

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Ripi happosai • an hour ago
That seems like bologna since roughly 10% of all gasoline in the US is
ethanol.

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JonesNL Tim Kulogo • 3 days ago • edited
No! No! No!

Please stop spreading lies and false rumours. Al things equal
(payload&range) Energy density needs to 15 times from the 440Wh/kg numbers
with the assumption of structural batteries which would always be the case
in Aerospace. Of all part on a 787 and A350, around 80% is structural. Ex
interior of course...

Assuming you are prepared to take a hit on range and you want a 737-7
150passenger plane to fly at 1000nm range, you need at least 7-10 times
improvement on the 440 number.

Electric planes will come, but not so fast and big as you try to hype it...

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Ripi • 4 days ago
What am I doing wrong on this website. Everything expands like crazy when I
start typing a comment.

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Edge Ripi • 4 days ago
I get that on my phone. After it jumps, start typing, and it should jump
back to the reply input.

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Ripi Edge • 4 days ago
I've noticed that works, but it still seems like everything is 900% normal
size, which means I can't see what I'm typing.

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Luka Edge • 4 days ago
Worst thing, I think that's Discord bug as it happens on other sites too...

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Focus • 4 days ago
Energy density is one attribute of a battery - but far from the only thing
of importance. You have to consider cost, lifespan, max charge rate,
temperature effects etc etc, and different types of batteries suit different
applications. What's optimal for a BEV is not necessarily so for an
aircraft.

It's possible these may represent a breakthrough for (say) electric
aircraft, but not be viable for (say) BEVs.

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Solarman • 4 days ago
Interesting, this 450Wh/kg claim puts Amprius Technologies at the precipice
of being able to directly replace all ICE components with a BEV drivetrain
while maintaining the same weight of the overall motorcycle. That's about
42% decrease in weight from current battery pack technologies to Amprius
battery technology. In a matter of a couple of years Amprius Technologies
could also meet or beat the DOE500 program goals for battery cells used in
UAV, airplane all electric flight and energy storage units used for utility
and residential energy storage systems.

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EV Pro • 4 days ago
Elon could have meant full-scale production. Lab batteries wise this seems
to be a breakthrough though. But electrolyte and cycle life are the bigger
questions.

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Pitounet EV Pro • 3 days ago
Those aren't lab batteries, those batteries are being shipped to customers.

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EV Pro Pitounet • 3 days ago
what about the electrolyte
and the cycle life?

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Ehsan • 2 days ago
The cycle life of the cell is only 150, so it is not applicable for EVs.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

https://seekingalpha.com/article/4478194-airbus-amprius-partnership-electric-aviation-advantage

Partnership With Amprius Gives Airbus Significant Advantage In Electric
Aviation
Jan. 06, 2022 6:50 AM ETAirbus SE (EADSF), EADSY1 Comment4 Likes
Summary
Airbus partnered with Amprius in 2019.
Amprius makes the highest energy density cells in the world.
Recent results from Amprius are spot-on for electric aviation.
Electric aviation is predicted to take off in the next several years.
Airbus European aerospace defense corporation corporate headquarters office
sign
krblokhin/iStock Editorial via Getty Images

Electric aviation

Source: ACS

Electric aviation is set to change the landscape first for short range air
travel (<150 km), then moving to regional air travel (150-800 km). The
batteries needed for short range air travel are similar to what is in a
Tesla today, but medium range requires more energy density. A group of
researchers at Carnegie Mellon University recently calculated the energy
density required for certain flight segments, and estimated that 450 Wh/kg
is the minimum needed to get to regional air travel. The graph here shows
the energy density required for different types of aircraft. Aircraft
designed specifically for electric travel could reduce the required energy
density. ICF, a major global consultancy, predicts that the cost of electric
air travel will be 80% lower than today's costs.

Since 2010, Airbus (OTCPK:EADSF) has had projects targeting electric
aviation, and in 2019 partnered with Amprius to develop the ultra-high
energy density batteries needed for regional air travel. Amprius cells at
the time were approaching 500 Wh/kg and continue to be the highest energy
density cells commercially available.

Amprius lithium battery energy density.

Source: Amprius

Two recent improvements announced by Amprius close the gap even further.
They are improvements in charge time and in safety, both critical for
economic air travel. Let's take them one at a time.

Charge Time
Amprius recently released results that showed their cells capable of
reaching 80% state of charge in under 6 minutes, and only 8 minutes to 90%
state of charge. In their press release, Amprius pointed out the significant
advantage that their silicon nanowires have over normal graphite anode -
they eliminate the inherent charge speed limitations present in carbon-anode
batteries. These cells are being used commercially in drones today.

For Airbus, this can give them a significant advantage for air taxies, which
are expected to travel up to 100 miles in an hour, and take on new
passengers in a matter of minutes. If the time between flights can be a
little as 10 minutes vs 30-50 minutes for conventional batteries, it would
double the utilization (assuming a 20-30 minute flight), greatly reducing
the cost of the air taxi ride. This is perfect for those who want to go from
the west side of Manhattan to LaGuardia or JFK, or from San Jose to SFO.

Safety
Amprius also recently shared results at the NASA Aerospace Battery Workshop,
an annual event that draws the who's who of advanced battery engineers. One
of the things they highlighted was safety, in which they were able to pass
the nail penetration test using two different techniques. For perspective,
the nail penetration test has been dropped from automotive safety standards
in China, and was never included in the US, because current EV batteries
cannot pass it.

The first technique, which was effective up to 70% state of charge, was to
use the aluminum film current collector technology available from Soteria
Battery Innovation Group consortium, of which Amprius is a member. (Author's
note: this is the company I co-founded in 2018, and which I am still CEO.)
Using this technology, the current collector melts and shrinks away from the
nail, reducing or eliminating the short circuit. Thus it provides protection
against internal short circuits, at least up to a certain size, and at
certain states of charge. At 80% state of charge and above in these very
high energy density cells, the cells still go into thermal runaway. See the
image below from their presentation at the NASA conference.

Amprius lithium ion batteries using Soteria Battery Innovation Group
technology, passing nail penetration testing

The second technique was to add a gelling agent to the electrolyte. This
likely allows the electrolyte, which acts like a soft plastic, to smear onto
the nail as it enters the cell, preventing the short circuit. While this
technology prevented the occurrence of a short circuit due to the mechanical
damage, there is no proposed mechanism to protect against a short circuit if
one did occur. However, it did work up to 100% state of charge on the cells,
passing the nail penetration test. See the image below from their
presentation at the NASA conference.

Amprius lithium ion battery nail penetration test
Conclusions
Airbus appears to have chosen a great partner in Amprius to help them become
leaders in electric aviation. Electric aviation will take a long time to get
to long haul flights, but air taxis and regional flights are only a few
years away. Amprius's advances in safety and in fast charge position Airbus
to become a leader in this segment, which will be more and more important
over time.

This article was written by

Brian Morin profile picture
Brian Morin
528 Followers
Dr. Brian Morin is currently CEO of Soteria Battery Innovation Group, a
company has technology to make all lithium ion batteries inherently safe,
and is taking it to market through a consortium of companies who are
dedicated to lithium ion battery safety. Brian also serves as Director and
Vice President of the National Alliance for Advanced Technology Batteries.
Brian has a PhD in materials physics from the Ohio State University, and has
authored over 250 global patent applications on subjects including molecular
magnets, plastics additives, textiles, advanced fibers, textiles and lithium
ion batteries.
Show more
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

https://equityzen.com/company/amprius/

About Amprius Stock
Amprius's silicon anode technology was originally developed at Stanford
University and enables dramatic improvements in the energy density and
specific energy of lithium-ion batteries. Amprius is backed by some of the
world's leading investors, including Trident Capital, VantagePoint Capital
Partners, IPV Capital, Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers, SAIF Partners,
Chinergy Capital, Google Chairman Eric Schmidt, and Stanford University.

Investors
Chinergy Capital
Amprius

Innovation Endeavors
Plenty, Zymergen, Getaround, Freenome, Yotpo, Blockstream, HomeLight,
Mark43, Formlabs, Kong

IPV Capital
Genapsys, Amprius

Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers
Snap, AppDynamics, Spotify, Instacart, Magic Leap, Stripe, DoorDash, Epic
Games, Bloom Energy, Slack

SAIF Partners
One97, Rivigo, Swiggy, Goodera, Urban Company, Meesho, Amprius, CSS Corp

Trident Capital
Sojern, Amprius, Turn, AlienVault, Host Analytics, Jobvite, BrightRoll

VantagePoint Capital Partners
Amprius

Funding History
February 2009 $5.9M
February 2011 $25.0M
December 2013 $30.0M
November 2014 $16.0M
November 2014 $0
January 2019 $30.1M
March 2019 $51.2M
Management
Chief Executive Officer
Kang Sun

Chief Financial Officer
William Deihl

Chief Technology Officer
Ionel Stefan

Press
Silicon Anode Battery Market Capacity, Production, Revenue, Price, Cost,
Gross Margin Analysis 2020-2026
The Monitor - Dec, 21 2020

Stanford names cleantech pioneer Yi Cui new director of its Precourt
Institute for Energy
Stanford - Dec, 16 2020

Tesla teases nanowire technology in Battery Day announcement
Electrek - Aug, 24 2020

Outlook into the Global Silicon Battery Market to 2025
YahooFinance - Mar, 19 2020

Amprius Technologies Hosts Amprius Forum 2020
prnewswire - Jan, 20 2020

Airbus Partners with Amprius, Leader in High Energy Density Battery
Technology
Aviation Pros - Oct, 31 2019

The Race Is on to Build a Better Battery
Fortune - May, 24 2019

Amprius’ silicon nanowire Li-ion batteries power Airbus Zephyr S HAPS solar
aircraft
Green Car Congress - Dec, 5 2018
------------------------------------------------------

https://electrek.co/2020/08/24/tesla-teases-nanowire-technology-battery-day/

AUGUST 24, 2020

Tesla teases nanowire technology in Battery Day announcement
Fred Lambert

- Aug. 24th 2020 10:40 am PT

@FredericLambert


255 Comments
Tesla is teasing some sort of nanotechnology in a new Battery Day
announcement ahead of the presentation next month.

The automaker’s Battery Day and Shareholders Meeting have been pushed
several times.

Battery Day was delayed at first for unknown reasons and later they were
both pushed at the same time due to the COVID-19 pandemic as Tesla looked to
combine the events with limited in-person attendance.

Last week, Tesla announced that it will instead hold its Shareholders
Meeting virtually and Battery Day mostly virtually with some limited
in-person attendance for people randomly selected.

On the page where people can sign up to potentially be selected, Tesla has
an interesting background:


Here we isolated the image from Tesla’s website for a better look at the
background:


We also changed the contrast and exposure for a clearer look at the lines in
the image:


A reverse Google search on the image shows that it is similar to silicon
nanowires, a nanostructure that has been used to create batteries with
higher performance though it has yet to be commercialized.

One of the main companies developing the technology is Amprius:

“Developed on a patented technology platform that includes a 100% silicon
nanowire anode, Amprius Technologies batteries provide significantly more
energy and power with less weight and volume than any other lithium-ion
battery technology. Amprius Technologies batteries provide up to 50% higher
energy density than standard lithium ion batteries with carbon anodes”

Interestingly, Amprius is based right next to Tesla’s 901 Page Ave. building
in Fremont, California.

That building is actually where Tesla plans to hold battery day and it is
also home to Tesla’s “Tera battery manufacturing facility” using the
company’s Roadrunner battery manufacturing process.

There’s no other clear link between Tesla and Amprius, but we found out that
Tesla hired Yi-Lei Chow last year from Amprius where he had been a long-time
engineering and manufacturing leader.

Tesla will hold its Battery Day on September 22.

Electrek’s Take
That would be an interesting turn of events. We know that Tesla is planning
to announce its own plan for large-scale battery manufacturing of its own
cells.

We also know that Tesla plans to announce some updated battery chemistry,
but the extent of the improvements Tesla plans to announce is unclear.

If it would be a new battery based on the Amprius technology, it could
potentially mean a massive improvement:


However, I would take all this with a grain of salt for the time being.
There are a lot of moving parts and the links between them, for now, are
weak.

We should know more as we get closer to battery day.

255 Comments
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Bryan McKelvie • a year ago • edited
It's fun to imagine but lets temper expectations. If this turns out it will
be amazing but the more likely scenario it Tesla is going to talk about how
they're making batteries cheaper and faster with fewer problematic minerals.
I sometimes worry that people are letting their imaginations run a little
too wild which inevitably leads to disappointment. Remember, the cells Tesla
already has are already sufficient for their vehicles and they're showing
incremental improvement every year! Driving down cost has got to be goal
number 1!

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CurtisVL Bryan McKelvie • a year ago
It's worth noting that a higher density cell would reduce the need for as
many sells, increasing range in vehicles by lowering weight (less cells for
same pack size), but also (potentially) lowering cost at the same time.
I agree, no one should get too hyped up about the unknown, but it's
certainly interesting to think about. :)

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Bryan McKelvie CurtisVL • a year ago • edited
Yes that's true but only if the a higher density cell can be had for close
to the same cost per watt-hour. If it can't then it needs to find it's niche
in a product that's less price sensitive... such as the roadster or the MS
plaid.

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AlfredEN Bryan McKelvie • a year ago
Or in aircraft. . .

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Musicious AlfredEN • a year ago
or smartphones/laptops/personal electronic devices

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Serge Pavlovsky Bryan McKelvie • a year ago
and if higher density cell can be had for close to the same cost per kg,
then cost per watt-hour will be cheaper

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CurtisVL Bryan McKelvie • a year ago
Totally, that's what I meant by 'probably'. I'm hoping they can though,
would be great. :)

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ntn_labs CurtisVL • a year ago
Since I saw that graph above I am laughing (In a good way, c'mon if this is
only remotely true there we have a non-tesla EV killer right there) :) I
can't imagine it being true, but on the other hand my jaw dropped last time
when Andrej Karpathy and Pete Bannon presented the new FSD and HW. So I'm
gonna keep my happy smile and trust Tesla until someone proves me wrong ;)

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CurtisVL ntn_labs • a year ago
Basically my approach to it too, if Elon says it blows his mind and he knows
about it, then, even if it's not nanowire stuff, it'll be interesting
regardless I hope!

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Lars Pallesen Bryan McKelvie • a year ago
I'm pretty sure that driving down the cost per kWh is precisely what Project
Roadrunner is all about. The higher energy density per cell is simply one
step towards that goal, but I think Project Roadrunner is as much about
manufacturing speed and efficiency as it is about a novel cell chemistry.
Ramping up production volume by an order of magnitude is another way to
drive down cost per kWh.

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EVolution Bryan McKelvie • a year ago
From Amprius' website:

Moving forward, we will continue increasing manufacturing capacity and
energy density. Our high performance 100% Silicon Nanowire batteries will
expand from premium and mission critical applications to EV and consumer
applications in the near future.

Increasing capacity and expanding into EVs in the 'near future.' It's
anyone's guess what near future means to them, and it's highly speculative
that Tesla has any involvement in this company as they're not listed as an
investor as far as I know, but it's certainly a possibility worth
considering.

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Ed EVolution • a year ago
Here's a photomicrograph of their nanowire structure from 2018:

https://uploads.disquscdn.c...

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Lars Pallesen Bryan McKelvie • a year ago • edited
People do let their imaginations run wild when they start talking about
ridiculous things like a 500Wh/kg jump in energy density. It ain't gonna
happen! No Li-Ion cell chemistry with a liquid electrolyte allows for it -
not even theoretically. It's really annoying that a great announcement of
say a 20% improvement in energy density/cost gets destroyed by these
completely unrealistic and ill-informed expectations that can only serve to
set people up for a disappointment when it's "only" a 20-25% improvement and
not a 100% improvement. People simply haven't got a clue how much it takes
to improve Li-Ion chemistry by just 10% when they start spouting this
nonsense about going from 247Wh/kg to 500Wh/kg in one step.

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Richard Lars Pallesen • a year ago • edited
I think you are underselling them. Sure, it is small scale niche market
right now. But they claim to be expanding to EV and consumer in the near
future. And, we have no idea what Tesla has been working on at the skunk
works right next door to Amprius. Interesting that they have been working on
high volume manufacturing equipment since 2016 and there top manufacturing
engineer now works across the parking lot at Tesla.

From the Amprius website:-

Manufacturing Technology-
In 2016, Amprius Technologies introduced new equipment for high
volume manufacturing of Amprius Technologies 100% silicon nanowire
anodes. This equipment employs inline, continuous, and roll-to-roll
production methods to produce the three-dimensional silicon nanowires on
a moving thin foil. Based on a multi-step Chemical Vapor Deposition
(CVD) process, this manufacturing method represents a significant
advance toward high-volume production.

Our Ecosystem-
Amprius Technologies has developed a fully comprehensive technology
platform that represents a complete battery ecosystem. Our manufacturing
process includes standard battery assembly processes combined with our
unique anode manufacturing. Our full platform includes cell design and
product development, quality and abuse testing, anode manufacturing and
high capacity cathode development, prelithiation, high voltage
electrolyte formulation, and battery packaging.

Applications Currently Using Amprius Technologies Batteries-
Energy Cells for High Altitude Pseudo Satellites (HAPS)
Cells for Conformal-Wearable Battery Packs
Power Cells for Quadcopters
Power Cells for Electric Vertical Take Off and Landing (e-VTOL) Vehicles

Our Roadmap – The Future of Batteries-
Going forward, Amprius Technologies has developed an extensive
product roadmap that includes further research and development in 100%
Silicon Nanowire anodes. We are also working diligently on development
of silicon anode manufacturing technologies that will make it possible
for more industries to take advantage of our technology. Additionally,
we are working on new cathode materials that will further increase the
energy density and power of our batteries. Our high performance
lithium-ion batteries containing 100% silicon nanowire anodes are
currently being used in premium and mission critical applications and
are expected to expand to EV and consumer applications in the near
future

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Quantaca Lars Pallesen • a year ago • edited
thing is 20% improvement in energy density from 247wh/kg would only put them
on the same lvl as the best thats out there now (CATL NCM811 is rumoured to
be at 304wh/kg with a path to ~325 in 1-2 year, LG is at 280/285), and elon
has talked about a 30 maybe even 40% increase...
now energy density obviously isn't the end all, as you also need the cycle
life and (dis)charge rating to be up to "tesla spec" and then there's also
price and ease of manufacturing, as in is it worth adding a few % to energy
density if it increases your costs and/or decreases your yield rate ? i
don't think so. and for the likes of LG and CATL thats different as they can
also make cells for other needs where cost or cycle life isnt a big
consideration, for instance tesla can't make a inhouse cell speciffic for
the roadster as those costs would be too high but someone like CATL could
because they can not only potentially sell to everyone looking to make a
high powered car but other industries as well

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Lars Pallesen Quantaca • a year ago
Okay, maybe I should have made myself clearer. There's no problem in making
cells in the lab with super high energy densities, even small scale
production of cells with energy densities of 400Wh/kg and 500Wh/kg for
special purposes. In fact Amprius did that years ago when they built a
record setting solar powered plane. But when we're talking about Tesla it's
understood that we're talking about batteries for EVs and we're talking
Gigawatt-hours of batteries, not just a tiny button cell for a pacemaker or
a battery for a NASA space probe. It's no use to Tesla if that super high
energy density comes at a price of $1200/kWh or it only has a cycle life of
25 deep cycles before it's toast. Nor will it work for Tesla if it uses some
exotic Unobtanium material for the cathode and has to be hand made one at a
time. And that's basically the price you have to pay for these exotic
lab-cells with 500Wh/kg. The whole point of Tesla's Roadrunner Project is to
make cells cheaper, longer lasting and find a way to make tons of them
24/7-365.

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Quantaca Lars Pallesen • a year ago
Just to be clear, the CATL ncm 811 (gr+si) 304wh/kg is not a labscale
battery its for automotive and supposed to appear in a chinese car around
the end of the year. Same with LGs NMC811 280/285wh/kg its a mass market
battery its just that most contracts are still for NMC712 tech.

But on all the other points i thoroughly agree with you. Energy density
alone is not the end all, its also about scale, cost, charge rate, cycle
life.

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Syrophenikan Blackmetal Bryan McKelvie • a year ago
Elon started it, lol. "We're super deep on cells", "blows my mind... and I
know it!", "350kW charging = child's toy." Etc.

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Bill Johnson Syrophenikan Blackmetal • a year ago
Yep, it's gonna be a lot of something incredible.

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Ed Bill Johnson • a year ago
I've keeping my own list of what I expect to Tesla to declare:

1. Increase energy/weight density by 20%
2. Reduce internal resistance heating by 30% (Tabless concept)
3. Reduce 20-90% charging time by 50% via reduced taper (Tabless concept)
4. Guarantee 7500 cycles and one million miles of operation
5. Improve low temperature performance
6. Eliminate cobalt
7. Put battery technology on a learning curve to $55/kWh

Longer range is crucial until 1) charging is available everywhere and 2)
charging times are short (10-15 minutes max), so I expect Tesla has a goal
of 500 miles for all of its premium vehicles.

Excited about 22SEP20

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Michael Bryan McKelvie • a year ago
Tesla is a very unusual company. Obviously they have a very effective
engineering org. But they've also attracted passionate fans, many of which
don't seem to know much about how technology R&D works. The history of
battery technology is almost entirely one of steady incremental improvement,
and only very rarely rapid advances. Lab research has huge hurdles getting
to commercialization, as the standards for battery manufacturability, cost,
lifetime, reliability, and safety are extremely high. I only expect Tesla to
continue making slow but steady battery improvements, and then I'll be
happily surprised on the rare occasions that they do better than that.

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Focus Michael • a year ago
But *IF* silicon nanowire really is any part of this, it was first announced
well over 10 years ago - plenty of time to iron out the snags before proper
production. Typically R&D will bring up a promising candidate - say far
better energy density - but coming at a cost in other attributes such as
cost, lifespan etc. It may enjoy limited sales for specialist applications
at first, then move into the mainstream as further research gets over the
disadvantages.

I'd be more suspicious if there was talk of a hitherto completely unknown
technology feted for full commercialisation straight away, but silicon
nanowire has been looked at for quite a while now.

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Michael Focus • a year ago
Perhaps. But drawing conclusions based on trying to read the "tea leaves" in
the background image (as this article does) is saying more about the high
expectations of Tesla fans (and the need for constant clicks by the media)
than it does about what's likely to be announced by the company.

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80 degrees.. Michael • a year ago
To be fair Tesla teased the Cybertruck for like two frames in a long intro
vid, and no one in the world saw it so they had to release a picture. Musk
seemed pissed about people all missing it lol

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Syrophenikan Blackmetal Michael • a year ago
idk - Elon hyped up battery day pretty big... I'm sure he wouldn't say
things like "super deep on cells" and "blows my mind, and I know it" if
there was only a minor incremental improvement. In order for Tesla to be
successful in their execution, they need something big soon.

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Bill Johnson Syrophenikan Blackmetal • a year ago
Putting a touch screen together with a small computer and a cell phone was
really only an incremental move until it "shook" the world. Before that,
nobody thought there's be a market for it. Tech does what tech does....blast
into the future.

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František Kubiš, jr. Syrophenikan Blackmetal • a year ago
Elon also said that silicon anode, nickel cathode works great...

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Bill Johnson František Kubiš, jr. • a year ago
I really think they are going to be developing at least 3-4 different
"cells". Different chems, different production means and different uses.

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Lars Pallesen Michael • a year ago
Would you describe a 20% improvement in energy density and cost as
incremental or a rapid advance?

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Bill Johnson Lars Pallesen • a year ago
In the history of the world? Maybe incremental. In the transition to EV's
and RE's...."mindboggling"!

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Lars Pallesen Bill Johnson • a year ago • edited
I think it's important to quantify our expectations of Battery Day before it
makes sense to debate whether it will be "just an incremental improvement"
or it will be "mind boggling" and "revolutionary". I'm of the opinion that a
20% improvement in energy density and cost would be a game changer because
it would break the coveted $100/kWh limit at the pack level where BEVs can
compete directly with ICE cars with no subsidies. Something nobody else is
close to, despite VW's claims to the contrary. But other people seem to
think that anything less than a doubling of the energy density (halving of
the price) will be a disappointment.

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Bill Johnson Lars Pallesen • a year ago
To me 20% now with a path to greater gains is "mind boggling".
Nobody/nothing else is even doing better than 5% annual improvements and
even Panasonic is now expecting that at Giga Nevada.

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Lars Pallesen Bill Johnson • a year ago
I tend to agree with you. I for one will be jumping for joy if Tesla has
managed to improve energy density and/or cost per kWh by 20% in one go. That
would put them well ahead of even their own in-house battery supplier
Panasonic and of course miles ahead of competitors in the car industry. In
other terms it would make a 300-mile, $25K Tesla begin to look realistic.

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EVPaddy Bryan McKelvie • a year ago
Yeah I remember how I got berated for pointing out the Model 3 won't get a
HUD. Only a hater would say so... It would surely get the greatest HUD ever…
later… who needs a HUD. Here, of course, it's a different case and the share
price could suffer…

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sreams EVPaddy • a year ago
I was excited about the idea of a HUD initially. After the car came out and
I actually experienced it, I was fine without one.

Thing is... anybody can pass judgment on what they think an upcoming car
might need before they ever experience that car.

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EVPaddy Guest • a year ago
How would you change my mind. Only Tesla can change my mind by delivering
better products.
And now I'll return the favour and put you into my filter.

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EVPaddy sreams • a year ago
Well, I would miss it. Of course I could live without it, but why should I?

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sreams EVPaddy • a year ago
Why should you live without anything?

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Richard Bryan McKelvie • a year ago • edited
Remember Elon's "alien technology" and "I'm mind blown by it and I know
about it" statements. There is no way he would be
making those statements on incremental improvements to battery chemistry or
manufacturing processes. This is a paradigm shift in battery technology that
Tesla is about to announce, for sure!

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Lars Pallesen Richard • a year ago • edited
You still haven't defined what you consider an incremental improvement and
what you consider "mind blowing", so how can we debate whether it will be
one or the other? Personally I would find a 20% improvement in energy
density/cost pretty mind blowing since that would mean Tesla, a car
manufacturer, has outdone every big battery manufacturer and every
university battery research team in the world.

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Richard Lars Pallesen • a year ago
“We’re going to talk about this on Battery Day,” he continues, “which is
probably April. And then a lot of these questions will be answered. I
think it’s going to be a very compelling story. I think it’s going to
actually blow people’s minds — it blew my mind and I know it. So it’s
going to be pretty cool.”

It has to be something bigger than a 20% improvement in cell density, imo.

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Lars Pallesen Richard • a year ago
It is not going to be a 50% or a 100% improvement in energy density. Sorry
to burst your bubble, but it just isn't. It will be something in the 20-30%
range at best. Again, "alien technology" is fascinating and all if you're a
tech nerd, but we should keep in mind what Tesla's objective is here. It's
not just to dazzle tech nerds but to increase cell manufacturing by an order
of magnitude AND bring down the cell cost. If you're expecting a 50-100%
improvement in energy density, you're only setting yourself up for
disappointment - and that would be completely misplaced if they have
actually managed to improve energy density by 20-30%.

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Richard Lars Pallesen • a year ago
30% would be more interesting than 20%.
I’m not expecting anything other than to be “blown away” by something on
battery day. I’m expecting a paradigm shift of some sort.

And stop pretending you know more than anyone else about what will be
announced.

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Lars Pallesen Richard • a year ago
I'm simply trying to tell you what's realistic to expect and what's not.
Believe me, I've spent a long time researching this stuff. If you want to
believe that Tesla will increase energy density by 50-100%, then be my
guest. But there's simply no good reason to think so and plenty of reasons
why that is highly unlikely.

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Richard Lars Pallesen • a year ago
I think Elon confirmed that was 4 years away with his comments on aviation
batteries.

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Lars Pallesen Richard • a year ago
Indeed he did, which should tell you that the cells he'll be talking about
at Battery Day this month wont be 400 or 500Wh/kg. Which is exactly what
I've been trying to tell you the whole time :-) Expect something in the
300-350Wh/kg range.