Why are colour codenames used in UK?

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John Cook (please remove -antispam- to reply.)

ongelezen,
22 mrt. 1999 03:00:0022-03-1999
aan
The UK has a long history of using colours in code names for
equipment, Why colours?.

Green Satin - Doppler Navigation system from V-bombers
Red Snow - Nuclear warhead
Orange Crop - ESM system
Blue Parrot - Nav/attack Radar
Blue Steel - Nuclear missile
Blue Circle - Hardened Radar :-)
Blue Vixen - Sea Harrier Radar
Blue Fox - AI Radar
Red Steer - V-Bomber Tail warning radar
Red Shrimp - Centimetric Jammer

Do the colours denote anything, anyone got any more 'odd' colour
examples and are there any colours not used.

Finally was there a "Black Tower" (not the wine), I seem to dimly
recall it was ground based aircraft detector????.

Thanks.
John Cook

Any spelling mistakes/grammatic errors are there purely to annoy. All
opinions are mine, not TAFE's however much they beg me for them.

Ken Duffey

ongelezen,
23 mrt. 1999 03:00:0023-03-1999
aan
I can't help with the why - but wasn't Blue Circle the nickname for the
concrete blocks used in place of a working radar on early F3 Tornado's
?? - Blue Circle is a well known UK cement manufacturer !! I don't
think it was ever a serious code name.

--
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Ken Duffey - Flanker Freak & Russian Aviation Enthusiast
Flankers - http://www.lindenhillimports.com/flankers.htm
S-37 Model - http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/5634/
Genuine E-mailers - remove the x after uk
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ftrplt

ongelezen,
23 mrt. 1999 03:00:0023-03-1999
aan
I heard there was some serious discussion about saving some money and
leaving the concrete there, as it worked about as well as the Blue Vixen
does!!

Ken Duffey wrote in message <36F759E5...@WPO.NERC.AC.UKX>...

dmb...@my-dejanews.com

ongelezen,
23 mrt. 1999 03:00:0023-03-1999
aan
In article <36f6ad1c...@news.wollongong.hotkey.net.au>,
John.cook@-antispam-tafensw.edu.au (John Cook (please remove "-antispam-" to
reply.)) wrote:

> Red Snow - Nuclear warhead

Yellow Sun - also a nuclear weapon. We are nothing without our
sense of humour.

Yellow Gate - IIRC this is the ESM on our AWACS aircraft.

There are more rockets:

Blue Streak - IRBM
Black Arrow - Satellite Launcher
Black Knight- Sounding Rocket
Black Prince- Europa -1, sort of.

Oh, and in the consistency stakes

Orange Reaper has the same purpose as Orange Crop.

David

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Mary Shafer

ongelezen,
23 mrt. 1999 03:00:0023-03-1999
aan
df <d...@christa.unh.edu> writes:

> Color was often used before & during WWII. Our basic plan for
> fighting Japan was War Plan Orange. The Germans had Case White
> and Case Blue (spelled wrong, of course :) for invasions.

Wasn't the pre-Pearl Harbor diplomatic code named Purple?

> Otherwise folks had a temptation to match the code name to the
> operation, such as Overlord for Normandy, making it easier to
> suss out.

Like Sea Lion?

Supposedly, the modern code names used by the US military are
selected randomly by a computer with a dictionary and names that might
be meaningful are rejected. TACIT BLUE, for example, didn't give me
any clues about the airplane.

It's not a military example and it's older than the computer naming
technique, but the CIA called the A-12 program OXCART. Not exactly
meaningful beforehand, but apropos in hindsight.

--
Mary Shafer NASA Dryden Flight Research Center, Edwards, CA
SR-71 Flying Qualities Lead Engineer Of course I don't speak for NASA
sha...@reseng.dfrc.nasa.gov DoD #362 KotFR
URL http://www.dfrc.nasa.gov/People/Shafer/mary.html
For personal messages, please use sha...@ursa-major.spdcc.com

NicholasH1

ongelezen,
23 mrt. 1999 03:00:0023-03-1999
aan
And Blue Danube - first UK nuclear weapon

Nicholas Hill

Peter Kemp

ongelezen,
23 mrt. 1999 03:00:0023-03-1999
aan
Mary Shafer wrote in message ...

>df <d...@christa.unh.edu> writes:
>Supposedly, the modern code names used by the US military are
>selected randomly by a computer with a dictionary and names that might
>be meaningful are rejected. TACIT BLUE, for example, didn't give me
>any clues about the airplane.


As long as I've worked with the US (ok, only 3 years, but I've seen a
pattern), I've never understood their code names. The whole point of a code
name is that it is unclassified, and nothing to do with the actual subject,
so you can talk about it freely without giving anything away.
But then we get "Desert Shield/Storm/Sabre/Fox", "Southern Watch", "Provide
Aid".

Admittedly they do sound better than "Granby", "Corporate" "Parakeet" etc
:-)

And what's with this "color" thing. Grr, if you want to use our language,
use it proper!

UK and US, two countries separated by a common language!

Peter Kemp

LesB

ongelezen,
23 mrt. 1999 03:00:0023-03-1999
aan
John Cook (please remove "-antispam-" to reply.) wrote:

>The UK has a long history of using colours in code names for
>equipment, Why colours?.

Why colours? Probably because there is no ambiguity about the name of
colours.

Anyway, ref the UK kit. Here's a pretty definitive list that Vic
Flintham and someone else posted some time back:

Green Cheese Buccaneer anti ship homing bomb
Green Satin Canberra Doppler navigation radar
Green Palm V-bombers VHF freq jammer
Green Silk Canberra Updated Green Satin

Orange Putter Canberra Tail warning radar
Orange Harvest Shackelton Radar warning receiver

Blue Parrot Buccaneer Radar
Blue Danube V bombers Nuclear bomb
Blue Steel V bombers Stand-off nuclear missile
Blue Shadow Canberra SLAR radar
Blue Saga Vulcan ?
Blue Diver Vulcan ?

Red Garter V-bombers Tail warning radar (cancelled)
Red Steer V-bombers Tail warning radar
Red Neck V-bombers Pod mounted SLAR (cancelled)
Red Shrimp Vulcan ?

Vic's List follows:

Black Arrow Satellite launcher
Black Knight Test rocket
Black Maria Radar
Black Prince Satellite launcher (Blue Streak and Black
Knight)

Blue Anchor Radar for Bloodhound II
Blue Boar Standoff nuclear bomb (OR.1059)
Blue Danube Nuclear bomb
Blue Diamond Ground radar
Blue Diver ECM for Vulcan
Blue Duck ASW missile (Ikara)
Blue Envoy SAM (Red Duster development)
Blue Falcon Radar AA
Blue Fox Radar AA (for Sea Harrier)
Blue Jacket Doppler radar (for Buccaneer)
Blue Jay AAM (Firestreak)
Blue Joker EW radar
Blue Kestrel Radar AA
Blue Lagoon IR detection
Blue Moon SSM
Blue Orchid Doppler navigation
Blue Parrot Radar airborne (for Buccaneer)
Blue Ranger Blue Steel transport sorties to Australia
Blue Rapier Tactical SSM
Blue Riband Radar tactical
Blue Sage Passive warning receiver
Blue Sapphire Navigation system
Blue Shadow Radar AA (for Canberra developed as Yellow
Aster)
Blue Shield SAM shipborne (Seaslug)
Blue Silk Doppler radar (for Canberra post Green Satin)
Blue Sky AAM (Fireflash)
Blue Steel Standoff bomb (OR.1132)
Blue Streak IRBM
Blue Study Blind bombing system
Blue Sugar Radio beacon
Blue Vixen Radar (Sea Harrier Mk 2)
Blue Water Tactical SSM
Blue Yeoman Radar tactical (post Orange Yeoman)

Green Apple Drift assessment
Green Archer Ground radar
Green Bamboo Thermonuclear weapon
Green Bottle Homing device
Green Cheese Anti-shipping missile
Green Flax SAM development of Red Shoes - became Yellow
Temple
Green Garland Firestreak control
Green Garlic Ground radar
Green Granite Nuclear bomb (test)
Green Grass Nuclear bomb (test)
Green Hammock Doppler navigation
Green Light SAM (Seacat)
Green Lizard SAM
Green Minnow Radiometer
Green Palm VHF jammer (V-bombers)
Green Salad VHF homer (for Shackleton)
Green Satin Doppler radar (for Canberra and V-bombers)
Green Sparkler Radar weapon
Green Thistle IR homing incorporating Blue Lagoon and Blue
Sapphire
Green Walnut Blind bombing equipment
Green Willow Blind firing Firestreak

Indigo Bracket Radar jamming system
Indigo Corkscrew Mobile radar (for Bloodhound and
Thunderstreak)

Orange Blossom ESM (for Hercules)
Orange Cocktail Radar homing weapon
Orange Crop ESM (for Lynx)
Orange Harvest ECM (for Shackleton)
Orange Herald Nuclear bomb (test)
Orange Nell SAM
Orange Putter Tail warning radar (for Canberra)
Orange Reaper ESM
Orange Tartan Navigation aid
Orange William ATM
Orange Yeoman Ground radar (Type 82)

Purple Granite Nuclear bomb (test)

Red Beard Tactical nuclear bomb (OR.1127)
Red Brick Target illuminating radar (became Indigo
Corkscrew)
Red Cabbage Radar
Red Dean AAM (Vickers 888)
Red Drover Airborne radar (for Avro 730)
Red Duster SAM (Bloodhound)
Red Eye IR homing missile
Red Flannel Developed H2S
Red Garter Tail warning radar (for V-bombers)
Red Hawk AAM (became Blue Sky)
Red Heathen SAM study
Red Hebe AAM (for Javelin)
Red Indian Ground radar
Red Neck Reconnaissance radar (for Victor)
Red Rapier Unmanned bomber; as Blue Rapier
Red Rose Short range ballistic missile (became Blue
Water)
Red Setter Navigation and bombing aid
Red Shoes SAM (Thunderbird)
Red Shrimp Radar jammer (for V-bombers)
Red Snow Nuclear warhead (for Yellow Sun and Blue
Steel)
Red Steer ECM (for V-bombers)
Red Top AAM (for Lightning and Sea Vixen)

Violet Banner Homing head
Violet Club Nuclear bomb
Violet Picture UHF homer (for Whirlwind, Hunter and Sea
Vixen)

Yellow Aster Airborne radar (for V-bombers and Canberra)
Yellow Duckling IR submarine detection
Yellow Fever Ground radar
Yellow Gate ESM system (for Nimrod)
Yellow Lemon Doppler navigation
Yellow River Tracking radar
Yellow Rover Target illuminating radar (for Bloodhound)
Yellow Sun Nuclear bomb (OR.1136) (for Vulcan)
Yellow Temple Thunderbird SAM development
Yellow Tiger Target illuminating radar for Thunderbird
Yellow Veil ESM (for Lynx)

Apologise to the original posters.

LesB
{take out one to mail}
EE Canberra Tribute Site
http://www.netcomuk.co.uk/~lesb/canberra.html

David Lentz

ongelezen,
23 mrt. 1999 03:00:0023-03-1999
aan

Peter Kemp wrote:

<snipped>

> As long as I've worked with the US (ok, only 3 years, but I've seen a
> pattern), I've never understood their code names. The whole point of a code
> name is that it is unclassified, and nothing to do with the actual subject,
> so you can talk about it freely without giving anything away.
> But then we get "Desert Shield/Storm/Sabre/Fox", "Southern Watch", "Provide
> Aid".

There was change in United States policy towards code names, for
which Colin Powell takes some credit. After the random names, it
was decided to select code names that had some political
meaning, which I believe started with operation in Panama, the
name of which I can't recall.

So the Desert Storm, Desert Fox were not random names.

David

Scott MacEachern

ongelezen,
23 mrt. 1999 03:00:0023-03-1999
aan
David Lentz <dlen...@rochester.rr.com//NOSPAM//> wrote:

>It had some political


>meaning, which I believe started with operation in Panama, the
>name of which I can't recall.

Just Cause (which is pretty ambiguous, when you think about it).

Scott

_______________________________________

Scott MacEachern
Department of Sociology and Anthropology
Bowdoin College
Brunswick, ME 04011 smac...@polar.bowdoin.edu

L'obstination et ardeur d'opinion est la plus sure preuve de betise. Est-il rien certain, resolu,
dedaigneux, contemplatif, grave, serieux, comme l'ane? Montaigne

Simon Robbins

ongelezen,
23 mrt. 1999 03:00:0023-03-1999
aan
Colour codenames were first devised in the twenties and thirties when the
whole world was still only black and white (as can be seen in all the movies
of the time.) Imaginative defense ministers of the time longed for an era
of peace and colour and were often heard to mutter things like "I'd really
like to Have Blue" and such.

--
Si.

John Cook (please remove "-antispam-" to reply.) wrote in message
<36f6ad1c...@news.wollongong.hotkey.net.au>...


>The UK has a long history of using colours in code names for
>equipment, Why colours?.
>

>Green Satin - Doppler Navigation system from V-bombers

>Red Snow - Nuclear warhead

KEV OF BBA

ongelezen,
24 mrt. 1999 03:00:0024-03-1999
aan
You forgot Green Butter AKA 'the Black Twat' in reality ARI 18228 passive
warning system[Vulcan fit only}
Kev

Thomas Schoene

ongelezen,
24 mrt. 1999 03:00:0024-03-1999
aan
Peter Kemp <Peter...@is-a-nasty.demon.co.uk> wrote in article
<922218341.19416.3...@news.demon.co.uk>...
[sorry, not sure whose this is. Mary?]

> >Supposedly, the modern code names used by the US military are
> >selected randomly by a computer with a dictionary and names that
might
> >be meaningful are rejected. TACIT BLUE, for example, didn't give
me
> >any clues about the airplane.

There's actually some method to this madness. "Tacit" refers to some
common feature of the programs (there was a Tacit Rainbow, for
example, and some others I forget.) I don't recall what the common
thread is though, perhaps its the resource sponsor? "Blue" seems to
have been used for several stealth programs (Have Blue, for example.)



>
> As long as I've worked with the US (ok, only 3 years, but I've seen
a
> pattern), I've never understood their code names. The whole point
of a code
> name is that it is unclassified, and nothing to do with the actual
subject,
> so you can talk about it freely without giving anything away.
> But then we get "Desert Shield/Storm/Sabre/Fox", "Southern Watch",
"Provide
> Aid".

With operations that public, it's hardly worth using a random code
name. Specific operations within Desert Storm did use cryptic code
names, but there would hardly be any point in using one for the whole
operation, because the broad outlines were being published at the
time.

--
--------------------------------------------------
TomSc...@worldnet.att.net
*Insert pithy quote here*

dmb...@my-dejanews.com

ongelezen,
24 mrt. 1999 03:00:0024-03-1999
aan
In article <7d7vra$376$1...@terrace.netexcel.net.au>,

"ftrplt" <msj...@netexcel.ent.au> wrote:
> I heard there was some serious discussion about saving some money and
> leaving the concrete there, as it worked about as well as the Blue Vixen
> does!!
>

Except that the Tornado F.3 radar is called Fox Hunter. (Foxhunter?)

Dweezil Dwarftosser

ongelezen,
24 mrt. 1999 03:00:0024-03-1999
aan
On Tue, 23 Mar 1999 19:19:22 -0000, "Peter Kemp"
<Peter...@is-a-nasty.demon.co.uk> wrote:


>And what's with this "color" thing. Grr, if you want to use our language,
>use it proper!

For some, it's a matter of (linguistic) national honor !
<G>

- John T.

Carl Crosby

ongelezen,
24 mrt. 1999 03:00:0024-03-1999
aan
Scott MacEachern wrote:
>
> David Lentz <dlen...@rochester.rr.com//NOSPAM//> wrote:
>
> >It had some political
> >meaning, which I believe started with operation in Panama, the
> >name of which I can't recall.
>
> Just Cause (which is pretty ambiguous, when you think about it).
>
> Scott
>
> _______________________________________
>
> Scott MacEachern
> Department of Sociology and Anthropology
> Bowdoin College
> Brunswick, ME 04011 smac...@polar.bowdoin.edu


To sort of get back on thread, the computer generated code name for
Panama was Blue Spoon.

Paul J. Adam

ongelezen,
25 mrt. 1999 03:00:0025-03-1999
aan
In article <01be75a8$72da0980$LocalHost@default>, Thomas Schoene
<TomSc...@worldnet.att.net> writes

>There's actually some method to this madness. "Tacit" refers to some
>common feature of the programs (there was a Tacit Rainbow, for
>example, and some others I forget.) I don't recall what the common
>thread is though, perhaps its the resource sponsor? "Blue" seems to
>have been used for several stealth programs (Have Blue, for example.)

The 'Pave' series of electrooptics, too. Pave Knife, Pave Spike, Pave
Penny, and of course Pave Way :)


--
There are four kinds of homicide: felonious, excusable, justifiable and
praiseworthy...

Paul J. Adam pa...@jrwlynch.demon.co.uk

Paul J. Adam

ongelezen,
25 mrt. 1999 03:00:0025-03-1999
aan
In article <7d84tq$prt$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>, dmb...@my-dejanews.com
writes

>Yellow Sun - also a nuclear weapon. We are nothing without our
> sense of humour.
>
>Yellow Gate - IIRC this is the ESM on our AWACS aircraft.

Yellow Veil - active jammer carried by RN helicopters

Peter Kemp

ongelezen,
25 mrt. 1999 03:00:0025-03-1999
aan
Paul J. Adam wrote in message <5uA6NWAx...@jrwlynch.demon.co.uk>...

>In article <01be75a8$72da0980$LocalHost@default>, Thomas Schoene
><TomSc...@worldnet.att.net> writes
>The 'Pave' series of electrooptics, too. Pave Knife, Pave Spike, Pave
>Penny, and of course Pave Way :)


I though PAVE was an acronym "Precision Avionics Vectoring Equipment".

Doh! I think I got that from Clancy (Sight gag :- Spit). Can anyone confirm
if this is true, or is it just a nice word?

Cheers

Peter Kemp

dmb...@my-dejanews.com

ongelezen,
26 mrt. 1999 03:00:0026-03-1999
aan
In article <5uA6NWAx...@jrwlynch.demon.co.uk>,

"Paul J. Adam" <ne...@jrwlynch.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> The 'Pave' series of electrooptics, too. Pave Knife, Pave Spike, Pave
> Penny, and of course Pave Way :)
>

Pave Tack and Pave Low as well, IIRC.

dmb...@my-dejanews.com

ongelezen,
26 mrt. 1999 03:00:0026-03-1999
aan
In article <7er6xYAe$m+2...@jrwlynch.demon.co.uk>,

"Paul J. Adam" <ne...@jrwlynch.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> Yellow Veil - active jammer carried by RN helicopters
>

RF?

Anyway - I wonder if perhaps the naming is deliberatelty
designed to confuse.

Imagine that you, as a foreign spy hear a code name for the
first time. You have to try to pick out whether "Orange Knave"
is an ESM piece of kit (Orange) or a rocket (Knave from Prince,
Knight etc.)

There's just enough correlation to make you think you
know the answer, but not enough to know where to start looking.

Paul J. Adam

ongelezen,
26 mrt. 1999 03:00:0026-03-1999
aan
In article <7dg1bf$l9d$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>, dmb...@my-dejanews.com
writes

>In article <7er6xYAe$m+2...@jrwlynch.demon.co.uk>,
> "Paul J. Adam" <ne...@jrwlynch.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>> Yellow Veil - active jammer carried by RN helicopters
>
>RF?

Yep. Standoff jamming protection for ships. Heard it was a modified ALQ-
167.

David Lentz

ongelezen,
26 mrt. 1999 03:00:0026-03-1999
aan

Jim Eagle wrote:

<snip>

> Does anyone remember Pave Paws, on Cape Cod?
> Was told it stood for:
> Precision Acquisition of Vehicle Entry Phased Array Warning System.
> Looking for sub launched ICBMs

See story at:
http://www.fas.org/spp/military/program/track/pavepaws.htm

DRL

Jim Eagle

ongelezen,
27 mrt. 1999 03:00:0027-03-1999
aan
On Fri, 26 Mar 1999 13:09:40 GMT, dmb...@my-dejanews.com wrote:

=>In article <5uA6NWAx...@jrwlynch.demon.co.uk>,
=> "Paul J. Adam" <ne...@jrwlynch.demon.co.uk> wrote:
=>>
=>> The 'Pave' series of electrooptics, too. Pave Knife, Pave Spike, Pave
=>> Penny, and of course Pave Way :)
=>>
=>
=>Pave Tack and Pave Low as well, IIRC.
=>
=>David
=>
=>-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
=>http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own


Does anyone remember Pave Paws, on Cape Cod?
Was told it stood for:
Precision Acquisition of Vehicle Entry Phased Array Warning System.
Looking for sub launched ICBMs

Jim
__________________________________
Jim Eagle
South Amboy, NJ USA
<jime...@bellatlantic.net>
__________________________________

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