German Jet Engines Used by the USSR Postwar
Rob Arndt
A copy of the German Junkers Jumo 004 engine, developed further at
Kazan as the RD-10 with 910 kg of thrust, 10A 1,000 kg of thrust and
10F with 1,100 kg of thrust. Fitted to the La-150/152/154/156, Su-9
and Yak-15/18/21.
RD-20 (RD-21)
The German BMW 003 axial flow engine, developed at GAZ-17 with a
thrust of 800 kg, RD-20F later designated as the RD-21 with 1,000 kg
of thrust. Fitted to the Mig I-300 and Mig I-301T.
RD-13/D-10 (pulesjet)
A Pulsejet engine making around 400 kg of thrust. Developed from the
German Argus As 014 / 044 pulsejet program.
Junkers Jumo 022
One engine made by 1945, but it's development was continued by the
USSR under the name NK-12
As mounted on Tu-128:
http://tanks45.tripod.com/Jets45/ListOfEngines/img3/NK-12.jpg
Junkers Jumo 226:
A pulse jet with a thrust of 500 kg developed at the end of the war,
similar to the Argus 044. Development continued after the Soviets
occupied Dessau, with twelve engines being completed in Germany end of
August 1946. The engine was tested fitted to a Junkers Ju 88G from the
end of 1946 to 1947, before work was moved to Plant 30 Nr Moscow.
~ Jets45
Rob
Eunometic
These engines had to use inferior soviet alloys, eventually the german
alloy tinidur was put back into production. Ultimately the soviets
switched to a nimonic like alloy however.
German engineers and scientists (at Bohler and Krupp) had developed
more capable alloys but these metalurgists and their companies did not
seem to have gotten into Soviet hands.
Daryl Hunt
> RD-10
>
> A copy of the German Junkers Jumo 004 engine, developed further at
> Kazan as the RD-10 with 910 kg of thrust, 10A 1,000 kg of thrust and
> 10F with 1,100 kg of thrust. Fitted to the La-150/152/154/156, Su-9
> and Yak-15/18/21.
Never put in a production soviet Ac or any kind.
>
> RD-20 (RD-21)
Never put in a production soviet AC of any kind. Even the
Russians couldn't get the German Junk past the turbine and
combustion failures.
>
> The German BMW 003 axial flow engine, developed at GAZ-17 with a
> thrust of 800 kg, RD-20F later designated as the RD-21 with 1,000 kg
> of thrust. Fitted to the Mig I-300 and Mig I-301T.
Neither engine ever went into ANY Soviet or Russian production
AC. They were both deemed to have too little power and their
dependability of only 10 operating hours didn't cut it. The only
decent engine design went to the west from Hienkel and that was
looked at and then discarded as the West had much better engines
already.
>
> RD-13/D-10 (pulesjet)
Never put in one single operational anything.
>
> A Pulsejet engine making around 400 kg of thrust. Developed from the
> German Argus As 014 / 044 pulsejet program.
Yesterdays junk.
>
> Junkers Jumo 022
The Russians may have looked at it but it wasn't used in any
production AC.
>
> One engine made by 1945, but it's development was continued by the
> USSR under the name NK-12
Nope, not even close. The Jumo 022 never worked and was never
finished by Germany. The Soviets made their own home brewed
version of a TP. They already had a good working idea before
WWII ended. They just went ahead with that. Your engine never
happened. It was abandoned when the Nene was "Reverse
Engineered" and that went into the actual engine that was used.
Another abandoned german engine that wasn't that good to begin with.
http://www.airpages.ru/eng/ru/troph3.shtml
In 1948 under V. Ya. Klimov's supervision, the USSR assimilated
production of the British Nene turbojet engine, which began to be
produced under the designation RD-45. It was much more compact
than the German "012B" while retaining practically the same
thrust. However, the key was that its weight was less by a factor
of 1.5. This predetermined the decision to cease work on the
"012B" turbojet.
Bullwinkle, you can't rewrite history.
>
> As mounted on Tu-128:
> http://tanks45.tripod.com/Jets45/ListOfEngines/img3/NK-12.jpg
>
> Junkers Jumo 226:
>
> A pulse jet with a thrust of 500 kg developed at the end of the war,
> similar to the Argus 044. Development continued after the Soviets
> occupied Dessau, with twelve engines being completed in Germany end of
> August 1946. The engine was tested fitted to a Junkers Ju 88G from the
> end of 1946 to 1947, before work was moved to Plant 30 Nr Moscow.
never used in a production anything. The Pulse jets were quickly
passed by by the Turbojet just like the Rocket Planes were.
Hey, Bullwinkle, you keep reporting your cracked history and I'll
keep Rockying you.
Eunometic
> On 2/1/2011 12:26 AM, Rob Arndt wrote:
>
> > RD-10
>
> > A copy of the German Junkers Jumo 004 engine, developed further at
> > Kazan as the RD-10 with 910 kg of thrust, 10A 1,000 kg of thrust and
> > 10F with 1,100 kg of thrust. Fitted to the La-150/152/154/156, Su-9
> > and Yak-15/18/21.
>
> Never put in a production soviet Ac or any kind.
The RD-10 powered the Yakovlev Yak-15
Some 298 were produced. Used in other aircraft as well.
> > RD-20 (RD-21)
>
> Never put in a production soviet AC of any kind. Even the
> Russians couldn't get the German Junk past the turbine and
> combustion failures.
The RD-20 powered the MiG 9. Some 598 MiG 9's were produced. With a
speed of 565mph they were as fast as the P-80C.
Source Wikipedia
>
>
>
> > The German BMW 003 axial flow engine, developed at GAZ-17 with a
> > thrust of 800 kg, RD-20F later designated as the RD-21 with 1,000 kg
> > of thrust. Fitted to the Mig I-300 and Mig I-301T.
>
> Neither engine ever went into ANY Soviet or Russian production
> AC. They were both deemed to have too little power and their
> dependability of only 10 operating hours didn't cut it.
You've been wrong everytime so far.
These engines grew in dependabillity, they went through 3 generations
of them.
These engines could be produced with only 500 manhours. by contrast
the Nene copy required 40,000 hours and took years to get down to
10000 hours. All the BMW 003 required was 2 hours service with the
engine remaining on the wing every 20 hours to replace the turbine
disk and blade.
Daryl Hunt
> On Feb 1, 7:28 pm, Daryl Hunt<dh...@nspami70west.com> wrote:
>> On 2/1/2011 12:26 AM, Rob Arndt wrote:
>>
>>> RD-10
>>
>>> A copy of the German Junkers Jumo 004 engine, developed further at
>>> Kazan as the RD-10 with 910 kg of thrust, 10A 1,000 kg of thrust and
>>> 10F with 1,100 kg of thrust. Fitted to the La-150/152/154/156, Su-9
>>> and Yak-15/18/21.
>>
>> Never put in a production soviet Ac or any kind.
>
>
> The RD-10 powered the Yakovlev Yak-15
> Some 298 were produced. Used in other aircraft as well.
Sure, you can have this one. Here is the writeup. Any number of
WWII prop jobs would have easily run it down.
The series Yak-15 carried an armament of two 23mm NS-23 cannon
and was powered by a Jumo 004B turbojet which had been adapted by
I F Koliesov of the Lyulka bureau for manufacture at Kazan as the
RD-10 with a rating of 892kg. Production gave place late in 1947
to the Yak-17 after completion of 280 Yak-15s. Max speed, 435 mph
(700km/h) at 8,200 ft (2 500 m), 500 mph (805km/h) at 16,405 ft
(5 000 m). Time to 16,405 ft (5 000 m), 4.8 min. Max range,
317mls (510 km). Empty weight, 5,1811b (2 350 kg). Loaded weight,
6,0291b (2 735kg). Span, 30 ft 2V4in (9,20m). Length, 28 ft 6V2
in (8,70 m). Height, 7 ft 5Vs in (2,27m). Wing area, 159.85
(14,85m2).
Series produced Yak-15s, powered by the RD-10 engine (which had
been cleared for 25 flight hours between overhauls) appeared at
the end of 1946.
This was a failure. Sure, you can have it. I doubt if anyone
else will claim it. I never said the Soviets didn't make some
real turkeys in their time. This one of the biggest.
>
>>> RD-20 (RD-21)
>>
>> Never put in a production soviet AC of any kind. Even the
>> Russians couldn't get the German Junk past the turbine and
>> combustion failures.
>
> The RD-20 powered the MiG 9. Some 598 MiG 9's were produced. With a
> speed of 565mph they were as fast as the P-80C.
> Source Wikipedia
A bit better but still equal to a WWII AC. The main gripe was it
was underpowered. Leads me to believe all those vunderveapons
that you and bullwinkle keep presenting would fair not any better.
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>>> The German BMW 003 axial flow engine, developed at GAZ-17 with a
>>> thrust of 800 kg, RD-20F later designated as the RD-21 with 1,000 kg
>>> of thrust. Fitted to the Mig I-300 and Mig I-301T.
>>
>> Neither engine ever went into ANY Soviet or Russian production
>> AC. They were both deemed to have too little power and their
>> dependability of only 10 operating hours didn't cut it.
>
> You've been wrong everytime so far.
Half right, half wrong. Neither was ever put in a Successful AC
by the soviets.
>
> These engines grew in dependabillity, they went through 3 generations
> of them.
Yes, grew from less than 10 hours to less than 25 hours.
Meanwhile, the West was getting many times that out of their
engines. Something with a broke engine is just a ground target.
>
> These engines could be produced with only 500 manhours. by contrast
> the Nene copy required 40,000 hours and took years to get down to
> 10000 hours. All the BMW 003 required was 2 hours service with the
> engine remaining on the wing every 20 hours to replace the turbine
> disk and blade.
And in the end, you are going to have to put many more hours
trying to keep them flying. Better to do it right than put out
something that is a maintenance hog in the field.
There are some very stark reasons Germany lost.
?
was. The Superior Weapons of The Third Reich! I will agree that there was
good technology, but at the end of the day, it wasn't superior.
The fact is with all this so called superior technology, Germany LOST!!!
Rob Arndt
... and changed the entire postwar military world with weapons that
trace their histories the entire way back to the Second and Third
Reichs!!!
Worse, the US claims new weapons that were German like stealth
technology, rail guns, non-lethal acoustic weapons, advanced small
arms, nerve gas tech, and aerospace designs...
History has proven that German arms have changed the world and even
the way we fight in battle.
Now the Germans are coming up with Elektronische Krieg- total
integrated electronic warfare with future German soldier capability to
control every single German weapon system to achieve a goal. If the
first one fails then the nearest, next weapon system then assumes the
role and so on. German generals we be able to watch in real-time the
progress and damage assessment. Soldiers will have sight-recorders
built into their helmet displays and rifles with uplink to the helmet.
Any German commander can follow what is happening all the time. Every
German weapon system will communicate with another in achieving a
victory. This is being pioneered by EADS and firms like Rheinmetall AG
and KMW.
The US nor anyone else has any such program... but another generation
of Germans do ;)
Rob
Daryl Hunt
> On Feb 1, 9:04 am, "?"<n...@none.invalid> wrote:
>> Several on this newsgroup keep posting on how superior German technology
>> was. The Superior Weapons of The Third Reich! I will agree that there was
>> good technology, but at the end of the day, it wasn't superior.
>>
>> The fact is with all this so called superior technology, Germany LOST!!!
>
> ... and changed the entire postwar military world with weapons that
> trace their histories the entire way back to the Second and Third
> Reichs!!!
>
> Worse, the US claims new weapons that were German like stealth
> technology, rail guns, non-lethal acoustic weapons, advanced small
> arms, nerve gas tech, and aerospace designs...
Here we go again There was NOTHING non lethal about any weapon
the 2nd or 3rd Rieche (luv that splknk).
>
> History has proven that German arms have changed the world and even
> the way we fight in battle.
Yes, but mostly don't do what they did. Obviously, Saddam didn't
listen to the lessons and we all know what became of him.
>
> Now the Germans are coming up with Elektronische Krieg- total
> integrated electronic warfare with future German soldier capability to
> control every single German weapon system to achieve a goal. If the
> first one fails then the nearest, next weapon system then assumes the
> role and so on. German generals we be able to watch in real-time the
> progress and damage assessment. Soldiers will have sight-recorders
> built into their helmet displays and rifles with uplink to the helmet.
> Any German commander can follow what is happening all the time. Every
> German weapon system will communicate with another in achieving a
> victory. This is being pioneered by EADS and firms like Rheinmetall AG
> and KMW.
>
> The US nor anyone else has any such program... but another generation
> of Germans do ;)
And neither does the Germans. Wishful thinking at this point by
you at this time.
Get over it. Your Sooper Race of Beings are just human, nothing
more, nothing less.
hcarchitec...@gmail.com
Halmyre
--
Halmyre
Daryl
their jet engine. It only had a maximum of 25 hours before it blew up,
siezed up, cracked up, etc.. Many times, it didn't make more than 4
hours.
The Soviets played around with it since the capture more than a few of
them. The US played around with them as did Britain. Not a single one
has been licensed airworthy. Even with the T-Wheel changed, it's one
very dangerous engine. Just strap a suicide vest on with a timer that
you have no idea when it's going to go off.
--
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Keith Willshaw
Meteor prototype flew with Metvick axial flow turbines. The RAF went
with centrifugal flow engines because they could be made reliable and
produced cheaply in large numbers while development continued on the
axial flow designs.
The REAL problem with the German jet engines was that when they were
struggling to run for 25 hours when the RR Derwent had already passed
its 2000 hour test.
Technology that is reliable and available always trumps the superior but
unreliable and unavalable. See MkV Panther versus T-34 or Sherman.
The German aircraft designers had some great technology but didnt
understand mass production in the way the Brits, Americans and Soviets did.
Keith