Oil filter tightness: 1/4 turn after gasket touches base?
Joel Frahm
the instructions do not lead one to adequately tighten a filter.
Also, I think most shops must tighten filters beyond the spec, as I
often have to use a filter wrench to remove a shop installed filter,
while a filter I install requires only my (mighty) arm to remove. I
think I usually tighen them about 1/2 turn or so, and the last one I
did came loose on me and started dripping. Hand retightening the
filter solved that problem.
I carefully oil my filter gaskets (which is crucial to this
procedure... could this be the step they leave out at quick lubes?) I
admit I use dirty oil to lube the gasket, as my dirty oil isn't too
bad off and it's right there handy.
Anyway it doesn't seem to me that I get enough gasket squish to
prevent the filter from backing off at 1/4 turn after contact.
Comments?
-Joel Frahm
These opinions are mine and not those of my employer or anyone else.
Jonathan A. R. Rall
Don't you fill the new filter with clean oil before you put it on the
car? (Assuming the filter orientation permits this, that is). If you
don't, you should and then you can use clean oil to lube the gasket.
Never did like that rattle sound when starting an engine after an oil
change and waiting for oil pressure to rise and oil to circulate.
Cheers,
Jonathan
py...@texas.next
>
> I'm not a fan of overtightening oil filters, but I have found that IMO
> the instructions do not lead one to adequately tighten a filter.
I've always lubed the gasket and then tightened them 3/4 turn.
eljefino
Jonathan A. R. Rall wrote in message
<3A8C1175...@pop900.gsfc.nasa.gov>...
>Joel,
> Don't you fill the new filter with clean oil before you put it on the
>car? (Assuming the filter orientation permits this, that is). If you
>don't, you should and then you can use clean oil to lube the gasket.
>Never did like that rattle sound when starting an engine after an oil
>change and waiting for oil pressure to rise and oil to circulate.
... and you don't even need to get your finger dirty! Use the receipt
from the bag for the oil filter-- dip a corner in the oil sitting between
the holes of the baseplate before it all falls in. (I've already used the
plastic bag
as a glove for removing the old filter, then turned it inside out with the
filter inside.)
Jeff (who tightens 'em pretty tight)
Dean Dardwin
I think you're on to something. I doubt very many filters get the gasket
oiled at any "quickie-lube" places. And you are right, failure to do so
will cause the gasket to stick in the housing which means it won't come
off with the filter next time. I'm so paranoid about it I dig out the old
gasket from the filter with a cotter pin removal tool just to make 100%
sure.
As far as tightening goes, I've found that if I tighten them by hand , ONE
HAND ONLY, they don't leak and they come off with a wrench very easily. Of
course, that may not work for anyone else but it does work for me.
Dean
billk...@hotmail.com
> procedure... could this be the step they leave out at quick lubes?) I
> admit I use dirty oil to lube the gasket, as my dirty oil isn't too
> bad off and it's right there handy.
I find my new, clean oil handy and use it.
>
> Anyway it doesn't seem to me that I get enough gasket squish to
> prevent the filter from backing off at 1/4 turn after contact.
> Comments?
>
I think it may depend somewhat on what brand filter one uses. I use the
OEM Honda filter, and 1/4 turn seems about right. It's more of a "feel"
thing though. I have no trouble removing the old filter with one hand.
Mark Cravatts
with one hand. IMHO, a properly tightened filter occasionally might come
off using both hands with much effort, but more likely a filter wrench will
need to be employed.
My technique which has worked for over 20 years and on many different
cars is to tighten the filter as tightly as I can only using my hands. I always
clean off the gasket surface and make sure that it is clean. I also always
lubricate the new seal and filter threads using the used oil sitting in the pan right
next to me.
-Mark
Joel Frahm
<jr...@pop900.gsfc.nasa.gov> wrote:
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>Joel,
> Don't you fill the new filter with clean oil before you put it on the
>car? (Assuming the filter orientation permits this, that is).
No, I don't think it's that big a deal. Since oil changes are done
with the engine warm, there is a lot of oil still on the bearings, so
it's not a very dry start. Under no load the couple of seconds it
takes to fill the oil filter while reducing the idle oil pressure is
IMO trivial.
>If you
>don't, you should and then you can use clean oil to lube the gasket.
Why? There is probably 500cc's of dirty oil left in the motor, what's
2cc's on a gasket going to matter? It's not like it has chunks of
crud in it or anything. It's pretty clean oil I could probably run
another 3000 miles anyway.
>Never did like that rattle sound when starting an engine after an oil
>change and waiting for oil pressure to rise and oil to circulate.
>
Ah hell, do some hard cornering and see you oil pressure drop and hear
your lifters rattle a few times, you'll get over it :-)
Seriously, I don't think it's big deal. It's better to prefill the
filter, I'm sure, but I don't know if you could measure the difference
in wear long-term. Barring misadventure, my engines usually outlast
the rest of the car as it is. On my car I don't think it's even
possible to prefill the filter more than 1/4 of the way (if that.) On
my old Jeep the filter was gasket end down, so it was nigh impossible.
If it was a big deal they wouldn't design them that way. Just don't
load the engine with low oil pressure.
Rich
gasket and verifies that the old one came off the motor.
Rich
ralph
1-8 around theirs so you can see. I find I can't do 7/8, even with a
wrench, so mine are like 3/4. comes off OK. I tried to do them to the
torque spec given on a previous car, but that was realllllllly tight.
--
The first rule of fart club is:
you don't talk about fart club.
Tim Blanchard
"Joel Frahm" <fr...@jila.colorado.edu> wrote in message
news:3a8bfcea...@news.colorado.edu...
> I'm not a fan of overtightening oil filters, but I have found that
IMO
> the instructions do not lead one to adequately tighten a filter.
I always lube the gasket with some of the used oil which is which is
in the nearby drain pan. I also usually use the filter wrench to
tighten the filter slightly. When I worked for Toyota dealer I
found I could tighten the filters by hand, due to their position and
size, but when I work under a car without a hoist as I usually do now,
it's just a bit awkward to tighten fully by hand so I use the wrench.
.
Kirk
> You don't tighten the filter enough if you can remove your filter easily
> with one hand. IMHO, a properly tightened filter occasionally might come
> off using both hands with much effort, but more likely a filter wrench will
> need to be employed.
>
I agree. I wish they'd give specs more objective. "Hand tighten" is
very vague--it depends on one's hand strength, the position of the
filter, the amount of elbow room, the size of the filter, the
greasiness of one's palms, etc.
For that matter, even "contacting the surface is rather vague." Does
that mean "when you feel contact" or "when you see contact" which can
be a bit different.
> My technique which has worked for over 20 years and on many different
> cars is to tighten the filter as tightly as I can only using my hands. I always
> clean off the gasket surface and make sure that it is clean. I also always
> lubricate the new seal and filter threads using the used oil sitting in the pan right
> next to me.
Yes, this is my technique as well--and I use both hands. It works on
my truck and on sedans with easy-to-reach filters. In cramped
quarters I may have to carefully use a wide-band filter wrench.
--
Kirk
Experience is the best teacher...
But her pop quizzes can be mighty tough.
Roy Schmaus
<MPG.14f8fef8e...@news.mindspring.com>:
>
>I agree. I wish they'd give specs more objective. "Hand tighten" is
>very vague--it depends on one's hand strength, the position of the
>filter, the amount of elbow room, the size of the filter, the
>greasiness of one's palms, etc.
>
>
Here's a hint cribbed from 'Highway's' magazine..:
A product called 'Scoot Guard', sold through RV dealers for placing on
shelves in cabinets to prevent things from sliding around, works very
well at increasing your grip on a hard to reach oil filter. Just wrap a
sheet of the stuff around the filter and the 'Armstrong Method' of
tightening the filter gets much easier.
--
Roy Schmaus
y_p_w
Roy Schmaus wrote:
I personally hand tighten as much as I can - often with a paper
towel over the filter. I've never had a filter leak yet. Honda
OEM filters come with a tightening torque spec. The also print
numbers from 1 to 8 around the circumference to help determine how
much it's been tightened. It would take a filter cap wrench and a
torque wrench to use the torque specs. I'm not sure who would go
through that much trouble. I certainly can't find enough of an
angle to maneuver a 3/8in beam torque wrench in installing an oil
filter on my car. It might be easier with one of those ratcheting
torque wrenches with a dial setting that disengages the wrench once
the desired torque has been reached.
Tom Staresinic
Roy Schmaus <schmaus+...@ee.ualberta.ca> wrote in message
news:90508328Dschma...@129.128.98.67...
> kirkdarlin...@mindspring.com (Kirk) wrote in
> <MPG.14f8fef8e...@news.mindspring.com>:
>
> >
> >I agree. I wish they'd give specs more objective. "Hand tighten" is
> >very vague--it depends on one's hand strength, the position of the
> >filter, the amount of elbow room, the size of the filter, the
> >greasiness of one's palms, etc.
> >
> >
>
> Here's a hint cribbed from 'Highway's' magazine..:
>
> A product called 'Scoot Guard', sold through RV dealers for placing on
> shelves in cabinets to prevent things from sliding around, works very
I use my bare hand to tighten the oil filter. I find a wide rubber band very
good for opening tight food containers; I suppose a rubber band cold be
temporarily be put on the oil filter to get good grip.
If the filter is easily accessible (i.e. do not have to hoist up the car--
as is my case) why not just hand-tighten 'lightly' and if it leaks a bit
then then tighten it a bit more?
Joel Frahm
Staresinic) wrote:
>
>I use my bare hand to tighten the oil filter. I find a wide rubber band very
>good for opening tight food containers; I suppose a rubber band cold be
>temporarily be put on the oil filter to get good grip.
>
>If the filter is easily accessible (i.e. do not have to hoist up the car--
>as is my case) why not just hand-tighten 'lightly' and if it leaks a bit
>then then tighten it a bit more?
When oil filters leak, sometimes they make rather a large mess. The
last one I did didn't start leaking for a week or so either.
I've never had a problem with hand tightening a filter 'pretty tight.'
With a lubed gasket I can usually get them off with my bare hand as
well, though it's not easy. I have no idea how much 'pretty tight'
is, probably 25-30 foot pounds. The last one I did that leaked, I
think I'd reread the instructions, and tightened the filter with less
than my usual zeal. I won't make that mistake again :-)