Help! My wheel bolts won't come off!
me over here
Tried to take my wheels of my 93 vw and the tire people tightened them
so tight they won't come off! Tried an electric impact driver, cross
bar, and a huge ratchet+socket (sheared 3 extensions trying to get the
bolts out). They just won't budge. Is an air impact driver more
powerful than an electric one? Thanks for the help.
michael
Guy
>michael
Micheal
Rusty stuck bolts I soak several times with brake fluid. put it in a
spray bottle makes it easy. Go back several times spray again--let it
work. (brake fluid is about as good as anything else you can buy and
it cleans up with plain old water!) If that doesn't work I heat bolts
or nuts red hot with a torch and try to loosen when hot. May have to
reheat as you go. Things start to seize up as they cool.
If you get the bolts out run a tap in to clean up the threads.
Alot of guys put oil on the bolts when they put them in--good idea.
I use a antiseize compound (never seize etc:) I put it on anything
I think may cause a problem. (use it alot on my boat, even under
water.) No more problem.
Good luck
Guy
Andy Dingley
The moving finger of fl...@ix.netcom.com (me over here) having
written:
>Tried to take my wheels of my 93 vw and the tire people tightened them
>so tight they won't come off!
If you had tyre work done recently, make sure you complain to the head
office of the fitting chain. You might also like to bill them for the
cost of replacing your over-stretched and damaged wheel bolts. It's
not a problem on most cars, but on some (Triumphs ! and older Renaults
or Citroens) it's important to replace any lug bolts that you think
might have been over-tightened.
Buy the 3' long Snap-on breaker bar, and a 6 sided impact-rated
socket. If the bar won't shift it, then slide a 6' length of scaffold
pole over the breaker and try again. NB - You'll need two people to do
this, that length of pole is heavy and hard to control. The Snap-on
bar is expensive, but it DOES NOT BREAK. You won't be able to do this
with a Craftsman - the head will break.
When refitting the nuts, use a torque wrench. If someone else does it,
make sure they use a torque wrench too. In some countries this is a
legal requirement. A torque wrench is a handy thing to have, because
you can stand behind the tyre mechanic with it in a menacing manner.
NB - An air wrench with a torque limiter is not a substitute. Garage
air wrenches are never accurate.
NB - A "torque stick" on an air wrench is not a substitute either.
Torque sticks will over torque fasteners unless the operators knows
how to use them, and most still just hammer away until the lug nut
throws the towel in.
--
Andy Dingley din...@codesmiths.com
If all it takes is an infinite number of monkeys with typewriters,
how come AOL haven't written any Shakespeare yet ?
John Weiss
On 06/01/96 22:25PM, in message <4or8qr$j...@sjx-ixn6.ix.netcom.com>, me over
here <fl...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
> Tried to take my wheels of my 93 vw and the tire people tightened them
> so tight they won't come off! Tried an electric impact driver, cross
> bar, and a huge ratchet+socket (sheared 3 extensions trying to get the
> bolts out). They just won't budge. Is an air impact driver more
> powerful than an electric one? Thanks for the help.
>
Take it back to those tire people and let them loosen them and retighten by
hand.
--
John Weiss
Bare Bones BBS, Seattle, WA
206-368-7672
Woody White
jrw...@seanet.com (John Weiss) wrote:
>
> > Tried to take my wheels of my 93 vw and the tire people tightened them
> > so tight they won't come off! Tried an electric impact driver, cross
> > bar, and a huge ratchet+socket (sheared 3 extensions trying to get the
> > bolts out). They just won't budge. Is an air impact driver more
> > powerful than an electric one? Thanks for the help.
> >
>
This seems to be all too common a problem! An interesting article about this
subject appeared in "Miata Magazine Tech Issue 1996" entitled "Tire Store
Etiquette".
Had words with the local NTW store (they claim they are good- Ha!) asst. mngr.
They do use a torque wrench, but the way they do it here, they may as well not
bother...
First the nuts are run on with an air impact wrench then torqued. While getting
new rubber there, I watched the process... Air impact wrench used to run on nuts,
then torque wrench applied. Trouble is, the air wrench was obviously set well over
the value of the torque wrench on the several cars I observed. No movement of the
torque wrench occured before it "clicked". I asked the asst. mngr. what the
air wrench torque was set to... He said it couldn't be adjusted and admitted
to not knowing what the torque was, but assured me that they were using the
correct torque! Kinda like those investigative reports on TV where they show
a someone doing something wrong, then ask them about it. Standard reply:
I didn't do that! Yeah, right!
Nathan J Nagel
also sprach Guy:
> Rusty stuck bolts I soak several times with brake fluid. put it in a
> spray bottle makes it easy. Go back several times spray again--let it
> work. (brake fluid is about as good as anything else you can buy and
> it cleans up with plain old water!) If that doesn't work I heat bolts
> or nuts red hot with a torch and try to loosen when hot. May have to
> reheat as you go. Things start to seize up as they cool.
> If you get the bolts out run a tap in to clean up the threads.
> Alot of guys put oil on the bolts when they put them in--good idea.
> I use a antiseize compound (never seize etc:) I put it on anything
> I think may cause a problem. (use it alot on my boat, even under
> water.) No more problem.
Just a note here... brake fluid makes a damn good paint remover so if
you have painted or clearcoated wheels this isn't really a good idea,
stick with the common penetrating oils. I've heard good things about
Kroil (sp?) but never tried it. Make sure no matter what you do that
you clean the discs off well with some kind of solvent so as not to get
your pads all oily. Oil or anti-sieze is a great idea, also,
overtorquing is kind of pointless and can cause problems down the road
with rotor warpage, so don't do it! and bitch out the garage guys too.
Nate
David Allen
gu...@ix.netcom.com (Guy ) wrote:
>fl...@ix.netcom.com (me over here) wrote:
>>Tried to take my wheels of my 93 vw and the tire people tightened them
>>so tight they won't come off!
[snip]
>I use a antiseize compound (never seize etc:) I put it on anything
>I think may cause a problem. (use it alot on my boat, even under
>water.) No more problem.
> Good luck
> Guy
I use this on everything also, and it is great stuff that really pays
when you need to remove a fastener. There are various kinds of
anti-sieze. Try to make sure it has a fairly high molydolem disulfate
(sp?) content. I find the Permatex automotive variety to be more
liquid and less suitable than "Never-Seez -- the anti-sieze compound
with a million ball bearings" manufactured by the Never-Seez Compound
Corp. of Broadview, IL. I also understand that most industrial supply
distributors carry variations for stainless steel, etc. There is even
a spray can available -- but messy!
The local tire chain ham-handed claimed that using this stuff causes
the decorative or closed style lug-nuts to snap off when they run them
on with the air-wrench set to full torque! This happened to me, and
he said I would have to take the car to a machine shop (!) to have the
remnants of nut removed from the stud. I was able to reach down and
turn the thing off with my fingers thanks to the anti-sieze.
I supose there are some instances or applications where you wouln't
want to use AS compound (say in place of loctite), but they are few
and far between. I've used it on everything from spark plugs to
exhaust nuts and bolts with great success.
Rudy Hiebert
--
Rudy Hiebert <Rudy_H...@mindlink.bc.ca>
Independent Dealer for AMSOIL Inc.
http://www.gastown.com/amsoil
I just used a miniscual amount of grease. It is risky because
of the tendancy to loosen. The anti-seize product sounds good
because it sounds like it won't let the bolt turn off while
driving.
Guy
all...@mnsinc.com (David Allen) wrote:
>I supose there are some instances or applications where you wouln't
>want to use AS compound (say in place of loctite), but they are few
>and far between. I've used it on everything from spark plugs to
>exhaust nuts and bolts with great success.
David
Ahh. but I did use it in place of loctite. Bought a Place diverter
for my boat and all the screws had loctite. Even tried heat on some of
them (heat helps break down loctite) didn't help--broke most off. Had
to drill out and retap. Now it's never seez.
Other than my special problem. Your right not a good sub. for loctite.
Kevin Tapperson
In <4or8qr$j...@sjx-ixn6.ix.netcom.com>, fl...@ix.netcom.com (me over here) writes:
]Tried to take my wheels of my 93 vw and the tire people tightened them
]so tight they won't come off! Tried an electric impact driver, cross
]bar, and a huge ratchet+socket (sheared 3 extensions trying to get the
]bolts out). They just won't budge. Is an air impact driver more
]powerful than an electric one? Thanks for the help.
The best advice I can offer is to get one of those 4 way lug wrenches, and
2 ~1ft long sections of aluminum fence pole. Put the fence pole sections over
the two ends of the lug wrench, and turn.
Kevin Tapperson
kevi...@mail.utexas.edu
Kevin Tapperson
In <4otkls$b...@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net>, Woody White <woody...@worldnet.att.net> writes:
]Had words with the local NTW store (they claim they are good- Ha!) asst. mngr.
]They do use a torque wrench, but the way they do it here, they may as well not
]bother...
]First the nuts are run on with an air impact wrench then torqued. While getting
]new rubber there, I watched the process... Air impact wrench used to run on nuts,
]then torque wrench applied. Trouble is, the air wrench was obviously set well over
]the value of the torque wrench on the several cars I observed. No movement of the
]torque wrench occured before it "clicked". I asked the asst. mngr. what the
]air wrench torque was set to... He said it couldn't be adjusted and admitted
]to not knowing what the torque was, but assured me that they were using the
]correct torque! Kinda like those investigative reports on TV where they show
]a someone doing something wrong, then ask them about it. Standard reply:
]I didn't do that! Yeah, right!
I don't want to be argumentative, but I had a good experience last week at
NTW. They torqued my lugs to 100ft-lbs with a torque wrench without me
even asking. Judging by the amount of tightening actually done by the torque
wrench, the impact wrench looked to be set to about 85ft-lbs.
Kevin Tapperson
kevi...@mail.utexas.edu
Kevin Tapperson
In <4or8qr$j...@sjx-ixn6.ix.netcom.com>, fl...@ix.netcom.com (me over here) writes:
]Tried to take my wheels of my 93 vw and the tire people tightened them
]so tight they won't come off! Tried an electric impact driver, cross
]bar, and a huge ratchet+socket (sheared 3 extensions trying to get the
]bolts out). They just won't budge. Is an air impact driver more
]powerful than an electric one? Thanks for the help.
Let me also add to my earlier post about the 4-way lug wrench...
Turn slowly with an even force, do not try to jerk it loose.
Good luck,
Kevin Tapperson
kevi...@mail.utexas.edu
Martyn Uttley
>so tight they won't come off! Tried an electric impact driver, cross
>bar, and a huge ratchet+socket (sheared 3 extensions trying to get the
>bolts out). They just won't budge. Is an air impact driver more
>powerful than an electric one? Thanks for the help.
Michael,
I had a similar problem some years back which I managed to solve with a
blow torch. Be careful with the heat though. Too much heat for too long
might cause other problems. Just try to expand the nuts slightly. You
can also try fitting a SECURE wrench and putting the car jack under it.
If the jack lifts the wheel clear of the ground you have a very tight nut
indeed.
!!!!!
(O O)
+-----------------oOO------(_)-------------------------+
! Martyn C. Uttley Hong Kong !
! Fax (852) 2873 3342 e-mail mut...@hk.super.net !
+-----------------------------------oOO----------------+
|__|__|
|| ||
ooO Ooo
Walter F. Dexter
In article <4or8qr$j...@sjx-ixn6.ix.netcom.com>, fl...@ix.netcom.com says...
>
>Tried to take my wheels of my 93 vw and the tire people tightened them
>so tight they won't come off! Tried an electric impact driver, cross
>bar, and a huge ratchet+socket (sheared 3 extensions trying to get the
>bolts out). They just won't budge. Is an air impact driver more
>powerful than an electric one? Thanks for the help.
>
>
How about the obvious solution: go back to the "tire people" and tell you
expect them to take the darn things back off and put them back torqued to an
appropriate level. I sure have people come in every day with much LESS
reasonable requests.
(And yes, an air impact gun can be much more powerful than an electric,
especially if cranked all the way open and hooked to a high-pressure air
line. Did you do something to really piss off the "tire people?")
Walt