TWELVE (12) volt engine BLOCK heater?
Wm.(Bill) Warning
I park my car outside up here in Minne-SNOW-ta. I do not have
access to a std onetwenty (120) volt elect outlet. However, I could
tote a deep-cycle 12v battery out to the car maybe 15 minutes before
I want to start. Does anybody make a TWELVE (12) volt BLOCK
heater?
TIA
Mark Olson
If you are going to go to the trouble of hauling a battery out to the
car, simply take out the car's battery and heat it up in a bath of
warm water. It will then start the car easily no matter how cold it
is outside, especially if you switch to synthetic oil.
There are propane fired engine block heaters available that plumb into
the cooling system, if you insist on having the engine heated without
access to 120VAC.
Thomas Tornblom
A normal (in Sweden) block heater is over 500W. That would require
about 42A @ 12V, which would probably drain your battery when it is
cold.
You would probably be better off with a real heater like:
http://www.webasto-thermo.com/
>
> TIA
>
>
Thomas
Wm.(Bill) Warning
> A normal (in Sweden) block heater is over 500W. That would require
> about 42A @ 12V, which would probably drain your battery when it is
> cold.
Tom, you did NOT fully understand/read the question. The battery used
to pre-warm the engine is NOT cold; it is a separate DEEP-CYCLE
battery toted out from a WARM townhouse.
*************************************************
> You would probably be better off with a real heater like:
>> http://www.webasto-thermo.com/
I doubt it.
Wm.(Bill) Warning
"Mark Olson" <ols...@tiny.invalid> wrote in message
>
> If you are going to go to the trouble of hauling a battery out to the
> car, simply take out the car's battery and heat it up in a bath of
> warm water.
I think it's a lot easier just carrying and plugging-in a second
battery than removing/replacing the regular duty battery at
minus -30F degrees below zero with a 25mph north wind!
> It will then start the car easily no matter how cold it
> is outside, especially if you switch to synthetic oil.
Yup, that synthetic oil really helps; I use Mobil 0W - 30
>
> There are propane fired engine block heaters available that plumb into
> the cooling system, if you insist on having the engine heated without
> access to 120VAC.
Way cool, I mean hot. Where do I get one of these propane block
heaters?
>
Stephen Bigelow
"Wm.(Bill) Warning" <w.wa...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:aGXmb.36864$Fm2.15360@attbi_s04...
>
>
>
> > A normal (in Sweden) block heater is over 500W. That would require
> > about 42A @ 12V, which would probably drain your battery when it is
> > cold.
>
> Tom, you did NOT fully understand/read the question. The battery used
> to pre-warm the engine is NOT cold; it is a separate DEEP-CYCLE
> battery toted out from a WARM townhouse.
And it will take a couple of hours to nicely pre-heat that engine.
A couple of hours of 42amps? How big a battery are you hauling?
FWIW, I haven't plugged a car in in about 20 years. Modern (ish) ignitions
and oils, etc.....
Steve
Ottawa
COTTP
<w.wa...@comcast.net> says...
It isn't very difficult to add an outdoor outlet. All you need is an
electrician for about $150 or so. Then you can use that electric heater.
Daniel J. Stern
I have lived and driven in very, very, very cold places. While there is no
substitute for a preheated engine, the benefits in a vehicle in proper
repair aren't so much about fast starts, but are more along the lines of
immediate heater output and reduced severity of cold-engine operation side
effects. I was able to get going routinely in subzero weather in vehicles
with carburetors and points-condenser ignition systems; a vehicle with
fuel injection and high-energy electronic ignition usually starts easier
under extreme conditions.
There's no such thing as a 12V engine block heater, that I'm aware of.
Good thing, too -- such a device would take HUGE amounts of current and
would exhaust just about any battery you could "tote" long before bringing
the block to any kind of usefully increased temperature.
An engine heat retention blanket or a propane-fired engine heater is your
best non-120VAC option, or you could simply spend the effort and money on
putting your car into the condition required for reliable starts at
extremely cold ambient temperatures.
DS
Mark Olson
> "Mark Olson" <ols...@tiny.invalid> wrote in message
[snip]
> Yup, that synthetic oil really helps; I use Mobil 0W - 30
Then you've probably already solved your problem. Just install a heavy-duty
battery and start the engine from cold. If your objective is to have a warm
car when you step into it, get a remote engine starter kit and let the engine
warm up for 15 minutes.
>> There are propane fired engine block heaters available that plumb into
>> the cooling system, if you insist on having the engine heated without
>> access to 120VAC.
>
> Way cool, I mean hot. Where do I get one of these propane block
> heaters?
http://www.cpinternet.com/~hilton/
(A Minnesota company)
Stephen Bigelow
"Daniel J. Stern" <das...@engin.umich> wrote in message
news:Pine.SOL.4.44.031026...@alumni.engin.umich.edu...
> There's no such thing as a 12V engine block heater, that I'm aware of.
> Good thing, too -- such a device would take HUGE amounts of current and
> would exhaust just about any battery you could "tote" long before bringing
> the block to any kind of usefully increased temperature.
No kidding....until you phrased it like that, it hadn't dawned on me.
All the _energy_ he'll need to raise the temperature of a cast iron engine
block, heads and everything else, in a Minnesota winter....he'll have to
*carry*, in one go. Ugh. Hope it isn't icy.
Get some 0W-30, fresh plugs, and clean injectors.
Steve
Ottawa
Gets cold here, too, eh?
Wm.(Bill) Warning
> > Tom, you did NOT fully understand/read the question. The battery used
> > to pre-warm the engine is NOT cold; it is a separate DEEP-CYCLE
> > battery toted out from a WARM townhouse.
>
> And it will take a couple of hours to nicely pre-heat that engine.
> A couple of hours of 42amps? How big a battery are you hauling?
> FWIW, I haven't plugged a car in in about 20 years. Modern (ish) ignitions
> and oils, etc.....
> Steve, Ottawa
Don't need to "nicely" pre-heat the engine, just need to nudge it up a small
amount (10 -15 degrees). The engine is in pretty good shape, but the
operator
will be a car-challenged woman. She can handle a simple plug-in, but jumper
cables is expecting too much.
Ottawa? That's the tropics compared to Minne-SNOW-ta. We are more like
Onterio, dark, 30F below, higher wind.
Bruce Chang
"a car-challenged woman".
It's suggested that you have 150 watts per liter of engine size so assuming
a smaller engine of 2 liters you'll need 300 watts of power and with a 12
volt battery you would be drawing 25 amps. The most expensive NAPA marine
gel battery you can purchase (for $329) has a reserve capacity of 450
minutes. The cheapest deep cycle would be $159 and has a reserve of 175
minutes.
If she can't even hook up jumper cables, how is she going to connect the
battery to heat the car or to charge the battery? It sounds like you're
giving her too much credit. Anyone can plug in a 110 electrical outlet.
Why rule out the easy route? Plus she's going to have to tote this battery
to and from the warm townhouse. If I were her, I'd be pissed at you if you
made me do that every day. Spend the money and save your "car-challenged
woman" a lot of hassle and headache.
-Bruce
Daniel J. Stern
> Don't need to "nicely" pre-heat the engine, just need to nudge it up a
> small amount (10 -15 degrees). The engine is in pretty good shape, but
> the operator will be a car-challenged woman. She can handle a simple
> plug-in, but jumper cables is expecting too much.
I still contend that in proper condition with a good battery and
large-gauge battery cables, and with the proper starting procedure for the
car in question, there should be no problem with the car starting for even
a car-challenged woman on 30-below days,
> Ottawa? That's the tropics compared to Minne-SNOW-ta. We are more like
> Onterio
It's "Ontario", and Ottawa is located there.
DS
Daniel J. Stern
> Wm.(Bill) Warning wrote:
> > Yup, that synthetic oil really helps; I use Mobil 0W - 30
>
> Then you've probably already solved your problem. Just install a heavy-duty
> battery
...and get large-gauge battery cables! 2-gauge or even 1-gauge items are
available from the usual suspects (NAPA/Belden, Whitaker Wire and Cable,
etc.). I found these a tremendous help on super-cold days when the extra
current demand from the frosty engine hit voltage drop problems with the
factory 6-gauge or 4-gauge cables.
DS
Ken Hilson
use electric start but after I could use just pull start to get it
going.
"Wm.\ Warning" (w.wa...@comcast.net) writes: > Hi Group:
Stephen Bigelow
> Ottawa? That's the tropics compared to Minne-SNOW-ta. We are more like
> Onterio, dark, 30F below, higher wind.
Ottawa, Ontario.
Dark doesn't matter.
30C below.
Wind doesn't matter either.
walt woytowich
I hate to spoil the fun but this subject was discussed in this group
last Jan 28. The heading is " Use a battery and inverter to run
block heater?" I found it on page 41.
In my opinion the idea should work but I saw no mention of an actual
test.
best wishes to the first to try the approach.
Walt in Chalk River ON
Christian
Oil in my car and it starts OK at
-25 degrees. If you have room try it, my second battery I put in the truck.
Batteries and cables for less than US $150. You might try this. Oh I ground
the battery in the truck and ran the two gage cable to the plus terminal in
the engine bay, this gives 1600 cold amps to start with.
"Wm.(Bill) Warning" <w.wa...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:NLVmb.25090$mZ5.106031@attbi_s54...
Jim
Wasn't this newsgroup.. was alt.trucks.ford.
Let's think about this though.. the OP would carry a battery out
approx 15 minutes before they wanted to start the vehicle. I don't
think 15 minutes would be enough time using a 600w heater; might have
to double the heater size.
If they had more time, they could run the 600w heater for 30-60
minutes.. the inverters I've measured are about +90% efficient, so
600w on 120 output would be about 60 amps input on 12v. Conveniently
enough, Interstate Batteries rates some of its commercial/industrial
at a 75 amp rate..
Keep in mind that the inverter will stop operating at approx 10.5v,
and that the higher the discharge rate on the battery the less it will
be able to provide.
Interstate's U1850HC has a reserve of 110 minutes at 75 amp draw..
sounds like the battery to use. It also weighs 116 lbs. And would have
to be recharged each day.
It looks like it would work, but there's probably a better way.
regards,
Jim
David Reid
degrees F) wouldn't that prevent having to have any type of block
heater? I live in the south and have been fascinated to up to the
Twin Cites or Duluth and see people plugging in their cars. Can't
this be avoided?
David
Jasper Janssen
wrote:
>If she can't even hook up jumper cables, how is she going to connect the
>battery to heat the car or to charge the battery? It sounds like you're
>giving her too much credit. Anyone can plug in a 110 electrical outlet.
>Why rule out the easy route? Plus she's going to have to tote this battery
>to and from the warm townhouse. If I were her, I'd be pissed at you if you
>made me do that every day. Spend the money and save your "car-challenged
>woman" a lot of hassle and headache.
Like the man said, sometimes electrical outlet just isn't an option. Not
everyone gets to park their car in their driveway or even on the street in
front of their house, you know.
Jasper
Larry Smith
news:x0ad7nl...@Hax.SE.remove-to-reply
>
> You would probably be better off with a real heater like:
>
> http://www.webasto-thermo.com/
>
I had a similar heating system on my SAAB 900, but it used gasoline.
Worked like a charm.
--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG
Larry Smith
news:b8dff5d7.03110...@posting.google.com
I don't know about the original poster, but in my case, the problem
wasn't
starting the engine. My engines always started just fine.
My ass would freeze to the bone sometimes, the grease in the door locks
would solidify, and ice crystals from breath condensation inside the
car were almost as annoying as the 40 centimeters of snow.
The ideal solution was a coupee warmer along with a block warmer.
Whether
electrical or fueled, they add a lot of quality of life in the far
north.
Mike Romain
You are replying to a thread from last October man....
Slow News server?
;-)
Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
Jasper Janssen
wrote:
>Jasper Janssen wrote:
>> Like the man said, sometimes electrical outlet just isn't an option. Not
>> everyone gets to park their car in their driveway or even on the street in
>> front of their house, you know.
>You are replying to a thread from last October man....
>Slow News server?
>;-)
Nope, it's just me that's slow.
...
Okay, real reason: I'm working through the archive of unread messages
seeing if there's anything interesting there, and my newsserver has a
truly unholy retention span.
Jasper
Mike Romain
LOL!
I got used to opening the messages up as one thread each because I got 8
month old ones as new all the time when I was on the Rogers@Home cable
system and would get caught like that when everything caught up late.
I went DSL and have recent stuff now....
Refinish King
Like mine has and got me in trouble like that!
LOL
Refinish King
"Jasper Janssen" <jas...@jjanssen.org> wrote in message
news:b9s87010m83ebe8ar...@4ax.com...