How do I convert toe in degrees:minutes:seconds to millimeters or inches?

[Fran Jones]

My 2001 BMW 525i front total toe spec is 0°5'±10' and the rear total
toe is 0°22'±4'

How does one convert that to inches or millimeters?

[idbir...@gmail.com]

You didn't look very hard. Google.

[jim beam]

On 07/10/2013 10:47 PM, Fran Jones wrote:
> My 2001 BMW 525i front total toe spec is 0°5'±10' and the rear total
> toe is 0°22'±4'

those are numbers you use when you have the car on an alignment tool.
even if you had the ability to determine front and rear toe, neither
tell you thrust angle so you need the proper tooling.

>
> How does one convert that to inches or millimeters?

ok, you shouldn't be touching this stuff. take the car to an
experienced professional.


--
fact check required

[Nate Nagel]

Need to know the diameter of your tires to figure it out.

Let's assume you have 235/45R17 (according to Tire Rack that was one of
the two available tire sizes for your car)

so the nominal diameter of your tires is (235)(2)(0.45)(1/25.4) + 17 or
about 25.3" (or you could look up the specs for the exact tire you're
running on Tire Rack or the tire manufacturer's web site.)

so the toe in of each front tire would be 5 minutes or 5/60 degrees

so then the actual toe of one front tire in inches would be sin(5/60) *
25.3 = 0.037"

so your total toe, assuming you're using trammels and measuring the
overall distance between the front and rear of the front tires at the
center of the tread would be twice that or about 0.074"

rear done the same way would be 0.33" total toe

here's an online calculator that will do it for you

http://robrobinette.com/ConvertToeDegreesToInches.htm

but you will need to figure out your tires' diameter if it is
significantly different from what I posted above.

I am also ASSuming that the specs you gave are the normal type e.g.
where you say 5 minutes +/- 10 minutes that that means each front wheel
is toed in 5 minutes from the centerline of the car. The terminology
"total toe spec" is a little confusing as that seems to imply that each
wheel is toed in only 2.5 minutes? If the latter is the case, then
halve the numbers given above.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

[Kevin Bottorff]

jim beam <m...@privacy.net> wrote in news:krmeb7$re0$1...@dont-email.me:

He didn`t say anything about doing it himself, he only asked for some info.
So go stuff your worthless opinion where it belongs. (and your opinion of
yourself is WAYYYYYYYYYYY above any reasonable one.) KB

[Nate Nagel]

all you need is a perfectly level garage floor and a trammel - or even a
good tape measure and a helper - to set the front toe.

I would shy away from messing with the rear toe on a Bimmer because the
rear suspension is kind of complex and you might end up screwing up one
of the other adjustments at the same time, unless you know what you're
doing.

[Eddie Powalski]

Just make the toe 1/8 inch wheel to wheel for both axles
and you won't have to do any calculations.

[Fran Jones]

On Thu, 11 Jul 2013 07:15:30 -0700, jim beam wrote:

> take the car to an experienced professional.

Hi Jim Beam,

I appreciate your plug for the professional, and certainly
they can accurately measure toe ... but I have to then ask:

Do you take your car to a car wash or wash it yourself?
Do you repair your car or do you take it to a mechanic?
Do you change your own oil or do you go to JiffyLube?

This is rec.autos.tech. It's the kind of question that
could/should be asked on rec.autos.tech.

All I want to do is measure my front and rear toe.
Measuring toe, in inches, should be relatively simple.

It's the distance from the center of the tire tread to the
centerline of the vehicle.

What I want to know is how to convert that center-to-center
measurement to the degrees that are listed in the shop manual.

How does this approach look for the conversion?

0. Total front toe = 0°5', so toe to center line is half that
1. Toe to centerline is 1/2 of 0°5' = 0°2.5'
2. 0°2.5' divided by 60' is ~0.0417 decimal degrees
3. 17" diameter rims * tangent ~0.0417° = 0.0124"
4. 0.0124" is roughly about 3/256ths" (or about 0.3mm)

[Nate Nagel]

Traditional way to do this is to measure from the center of the tire
tread not the rim, because the measurement will be larger and therefore
less prone to error. Hopefully your tires have a tread that makes
identifying same easier (or at least one straight circumferential rib
that you can use for a reference.) See my previous post for how to
calculate it that way. I used sine not tangent because I'm considering
the radius of the tire to be the hypotenuse (theoretically your
measurements are going to be taken at right angles to the centerline of
the car, or an imaginary line through the steering axis parallel to
same) not at right angles to the tire centerline; but at these tiny
angles sine and tangent are basically the same anyway so that makes no
significant difference.

With measurements these small, if you're going for accuracy (that is,
you're going to set it and drive the car, you're not asking because e.g.
you just replaced the struts and are trying to do a driveway alignment
to get you to the real shop) it is worthwhile to spin the wheels and
observe that they aren't bent and that the tires don't have any lateral
runout in them, because it's entirely possible to have a wobble that
dwarfs a fraction of a millimeter but isn't perceptible while driving
down the road.

I have my doubts that you can do a driveway alignment to plus/minus ten
minutes, but you probably can get it close enough if you are careful
that it will drive well and not wear the tires.

If you lift the car to spin the tires, after lowering it back down
either bounce each corner several times to resettle the suspension, or
drive it around the block before starting for the same reason. Bounce
it again after making any adjustments, or make yourself some turn plates
to position the car on before starting. (some pieces of sheet steel
with grease between them would work fine.)

good luck

[jim beam]

On 07/11/2013 09:52 AM, Nate Nagel wrote:
> On 07/11/2013 12:43 PM, Kevin Bottorff wrote:
>> jim beam <m...@privacy.net> wrote in news:krmeb7$re0$1...@dont-email.me:
>>
>>> On 07/10/2013 10:47 PM, Fran Jones wrote:
>>>> My 2001 BMW 525i front total toe spec is 0°5'±10' and the rear total
>>>> toe is 0°22'±4'
>>>
>>> those are numbers you use when you have the car on an alignment tool.
>>> even if you had the ability to determine front and rear toe, neither
>>> tell you thrust angle so you need the proper tooling.
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> How does one convert that to inches or millimeters?
>>>
>>> ok, you shouldn't be touching this stuff. take the car to an
>>> experienced professional.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> He didn`t say anything about doing it himself, he only asked for some
>> info.
>> So go stuff your worthless opinion where it belongs. (and your opinion of
>> yourself is WAYYYYYYYYYYY above any reasonable one.) KB
>>
>
> all you need is a perfectly level garage floor and a trammel - or even a
> good tape measure and a helper - to set the front toe.

actually, you need a wrench to set the toe - you need a tape to
/measure/ it. well actually, you don't, because unless you know what
you're doing, it'll get screwed up by tire imperfections, gravitational
bow, etc.

>
> I would shy away from messing with the rear toe on a Bimmer because the
> rear suspension is kind of complex and you might end up screwing up one
> of the other adjustments at the same time, unless you know what you're
> doing.

you're such an idiot. "here be dragons" he bleats. granted, it's not a
solid axle, but rear alignment is no harder than front. if you know
what you're doing. which you clearly don't.


--
fact check required

[jim beam]

On 07/11/2013 12:15 PM, Fran Jones wrote:
> On Thu, 11 Jul 2013 07:15:30 -0700, jim beam wrote:
>
>> take the car to an experienced professional.
>
> Hi Jim Beam,
>
> I appreciate your plug for the professional, and certainly
> they can accurately measure toe ... but I have to then ask:
>
> Do you take your car to a car wash or wash it yourself?
> Do you repair your car or do you take it to a mechanic?
> Do you change your own oil or do you go to JiffyLube?

do you know what you don't know?

>
> This is rec.autos.tech. It's the kind of question that
> could/should be asked on rec.autos.tech.

to do this job properly, you need proper tools. if you don't know the
mm's per inch conversion, you're not a likely candidate for being able
to handle this yourself.

>
> All I want to do is measure my front and rear toe.
> Measuring toe, in inches, should be relatively simple.

doing it in mm is easier.

>
> It's the distance from the center of the tire tread to the
> centerline of the vehicle.
>
> What I want to know is how to convert that center-to-center
> measurement to the degrees that are listed in the shop manual.

if the "manual" gives you c-t-c for the tire, you probably need a better
manual. the tire center line is very imprecise, not only because of the
rubber casting itself, but because different brands are all slightly
different sizes. i'm sure you can figure out that tire diameter
differences will give you toe angle differences.

>
> How does this approach look for the conversion?
>
> 0. Total front toe = 0°5', so toe to center line is half that
> 1. Toe to centerline is 1/2 of 0°5' = 0°2.5'
> 2. 0°2.5' divided by 60' is ~0.0417 decimal degrees
> 3. 17" diameter rims * tangent ~0.0417° = 0.0124"
> 4. 0.0124" is roughly about 3/256ths" (or about 0.3mm)
>

you're going to have a real heard time accurately measuring that. 0.3mm
is way smaller than the gravitational bow inaccuracy you'll get in a
tape measure for instance. and on a modern low-slung car, your ability
to get a "straight shot" measurement is practically zero.

again, the best way to do this job is on a modern alignment tool with
the manufacturer angular specs - and a tool that can't be screwed up by
operator error. older alignment tools relied on the wheel gauges being
set right, and they rarely were. these days, with modern gear, even
bent wheels don't matter.

[even i pay someone else to do this - i don't have the tools to do
alignment accurately, and certainly not thrust angle, so i throw a few
bucks at someone with a decent machine who does.]


--
fact check required

[jim beam]

as usual, you're a witless driveling retard. tire imperfections are of
the same order as the entire adjustment here - you'll just compound the
error.

>
> If you lift the car to spin the tires, after lowering it back down
> either bounce each corner several times to resettle the suspension, or
> drive it around the block before starting for the same reason. Bounce
> it again after making any adjustments, or make yourself some turn plates
> to position the car on before starting. (some pieces of sheet steel
> with grease between them would work fine.)

typical - you've clearly never done this, what you should use is plates
with bearing balls spread between, but hey, you never let knowing what
you're talking about get in the way of spreading fabrication and idiocy
all over the net.


>
> good luck

he'll need it if he's reading your bovine effluent.


--
fact check required

[Nate Nagel]

This is one time when I know that I know what I'm talking about and you
don't. Oh, wait, that's all the time. Just changing the obvious twirly
thing to change the toe on the front is safe and will work fine. There
are several adjustments on the rear which will change both toe and
camber when adjusted, so it may turn into an iterative process if the
alignment is way out.

It's still possible to DIY, but requires more care and tools. Here's
what looks like a fairly decent writeup.

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?1666987-1998-528i-REAR-Wheel-Alignment

[Nate Nagel]

Yeah, and on a used car, the runout on the bead surface of the rim -
where your beloved professional alignment equipment is placed - could
easily have 0.3mm of runout as well, if it's been driven in any of a
number of cities with less than billiard-table smooth roads.

If a frog had a glass ass, he could only jump once.

>
>>
>> If you lift the car to spin the tires, after lowering it back down
>> either bounce each corner several times to resettle the suspension, or
>> drive it around the block before starting for the same reason. Bounce
>> it again after making any adjustments, or make yourself some turn plates
>> to position the car on before starting. (some pieces of sheet steel
>> with grease between them would work fine.)
>
> typical - you've clearly never done this, what you should use is plates
> with bearing balls spread between, but hey, you never let knowing what
> you're talking about get in the way of spreading fabrication and idiocy
> all over the net.

No, the *right* tool for the job would be a set of premade turn plates.

But greased steel plates works just fine.

Bearing balls might work slightly better, but do you really want to be
stepping on all the little steel balls you missed for the next two weeks
until you finally pick/vacuum them all up?

>
>>
>> good luck
>
> he'll need it if he's reading your bovine effluent.
>

Cite ONE - just ONE inaccuracy in anything that I posted above, you
drooling retard.

You can't, because I do know what I'm talking about and you're just
playing like you know what you're talking about because you're an
insecure little shit who likes crapping on Usenet and making it a
generally unpleasant place because of your mental issues.

OP, don't let JB run you off please...

[jim beam]

ygtbfsm - that's NOT complicated. clearly you've never done it.

oh, and you spewing some b.s. about what you say someone else says is
just like your b.s. about staking marsden nuts - completely bogus idiocy.

--
fact check required

[jim beam]

clueless retard. you clearly don't know how a modern alignment machine
works, let alone bother to watch it being used.

>
> If a frog had a glass ass, he could only jump once.

if you had a brain cell, you could... oh, wait, scratch that.

>
>>
>>>
>>> If you lift the car to spin the tires, after lowering it back down
>>> either bounce each corner several times to resettle the suspension, or
>>> drive it around the block before starting for the same reason. Bounce
>>> it again after making any adjustments, or make yourself some turn plates
>>> to position the car on before starting. (some pieces of sheet steel
>>> with grease between them would work fine.)
>>
>> typical - you've clearly never done this, what you should use is plates
>> with bearing balls spread between, but hey, you never let knowing what
>> you're talking about get in the way of spreading fabrication and idiocy
>> all over the net.
>
> No, the *right* tool for the job would be a set of premade turn plates.

which is what you'd have if you used an alignment tool in the first
place, retard.

>
> But greased steel plates works just fine.

no they don't - you've clearly never tried!

>
> Bearing balls might work slightly better, but do you really want to be
> stepping on all the little steel balls you missed for the next two weeks
> until you finally pick/vacuum them all up?

only if you're a retard. the rest of us put grease on the plates to
hold the balls - they stay in place just fine. idiot.

>
>>
>>>
>>> good luck
>>
>> he'll need it if he's reading your bovine effluent.
>>
>
> Cite ONE - just ONE inaccuracy in anything that I posted above, you
> drooling retard.

??? i just have, retard. repeatedly.

>
> You can't, because I do know what I'm talking about and you're just
> playing like you know what you're talking about because you're an
> insecure little shit who likes crapping on Usenet and making it a
> generally unpleasant place because of your mental issues.
>
> OP, don't let JB run you off please...

"marsden nuts need to be staked" he bleats. "i can't find a picture of
the tool that does it" he bleats. "i can't find a good explanation of
how they work" he bleats. so i come along and cram your own inadequacy
up your ass and you don't even have the sense to keep your retarded
mouth shut about it. well, kiss my hairy yellow ass.


--
fact check required

[Nate Nagel]

Um, actually, I just watched some mechanics being trained on a new
alignment machine the other day. The targets get placed on the rims.

>>
>> If a frog had a glass ass, he could only jump once.
>
> if you had a brain cell, you could... oh, wait, scratch that.

Yeah, the mirror is cruel, isn't it?

>
>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> If you lift the car to spin the tires, after lowering it back down
>>>> either bounce each corner several times to resettle the suspension, or
>>>> drive it around the block before starting for the same reason. Bounce
>>>> it again after making any adjustments, or make yourself some turn
>>>> plates
>>>> to position the car on before starting. (some pieces of sheet steel
>>>> with grease between them would work fine.)
>>>
>>> typical - you've clearly never done this, what you should use is plates
>>> with bearing balls spread between, but hey, you never let knowing what
>>> you're talking about get in the way of spreading fabrication and idiocy
>>> all over the net.
>>
>> No, the *right* tool for the job would be a set of premade turn plates.
>
> which is what you'd have if you used an alignment tool in the first
> place, retard.

Well, clearly, the OP doesn't have an alignment rack so that is
completely fucking irrelevant, now, isn't it?

>
>
>>
>> But greased steel plates works just fine.
>
> no they don't - you've clearly never tried!

Much like everything else, you clearly haven't a clue what I have and
haven't done, nor do you know enough about the subject being discussed
to evaluate anyone's opinions or experiences.

>
>>
>> Bearing balls might work slightly better, but do you really want to be
>> stepping on all the little steel balls you missed for the next two weeks
>> until you finally pick/vacuum them all up?
>
> only if you're a retard. the rest of us put grease on the plates to
> hold the balls - they stay in place just fine. idiot.
>
>
>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> good luck
>>>
>>> he'll need it if he's reading your bovine effluent.
>>>
>>
>> Cite ONE - just ONE inaccuracy in anything that I posted above, you
>> drooling retard.
>
> ??? i just have, retard. repeatedly.
>

No, no you haven't.

>
>>
>> You can't, because I do know what I'm talking about and you're just
>> playing like you know what you're talking about because you're an
>> insecure little shit who likes crapping on Usenet and making it a
>> generally unpleasant place because of your mental issues.
>>
>> OP, don't let JB run you off please...
>
> "marsden nuts need to be staked" he bleats. "i can't find a picture of
> the tool that does it" he bleats. "i can't find a good explanation of
> how they work" he bleats. so i come along and cram your own inadequacy
> up your ass and you don't even have the sense to keep your retarded
> mouth shut about it. well, kiss my hairy yellow ass.
>
>

In other words, because I have seen something that you haven't, you get
all abusive about it and have no ability to believe that I might know
something that you don't.

I know what I've seen with my own fucking eyes.

I also know that even in the rare instances that you may accidentally
give accurate advice, you're still an asshole about it. In fact that is
the one thing that you're spectacularly good at.

[jim beam]

yeah, and???? there's one vital part you're missing...

>
>>>
>>> If a frog had a glass ass, he could only jump once.
>>
>> if you had a brain cell, you could... oh, wait, scratch that.
>
>
> Yeah, the mirror is cruel, isn't it?

you should know.

>
>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> If you lift the car to spin the tires, after lowering it back down
>>>>> either bounce each corner several times to resettle the suspension, or
>>>>> drive it around the block before starting for the same reason. Bounce
>>>>> it again after making any adjustments, or make yourself some turn
>>>>> plates
>>>>> to position the car on before starting. (some pieces of sheet steel
>>>>> with grease between them would work fine.)
>>>>
>>>> typical - you've clearly never done this, what you should use is
>>>> plates
>>>> with bearing balls spread between, but hey, you never let knowing what
>>>> you're talking about get in the way of spreading fabrication and idiocy
>>>> all over the net.
>>>
>>> No, the *right* tool for the job would be a set of premade turn plates.
>>
>> which is what you'd have if you used an alignment tool in the first
>> place, retard.
>
> Well, clearly, the OP doesn't have an alignment rack so that is
> completely fucking irrelevant, now, isn't it?

so go use one, idiot.

>
>>
>>
>>>
>>> But greased steel plates works just fine.
>>
>> no they don't - you've clearly never tried!
>
> Much like everything else, you clearly haven't a clue what I have and
> haven't done, nor do you know enough about the subject being discussed
> to evaluate anyone's opinions or experiences.

this is too easy - i /know/ you haven't done this or you wouldn't be
suggesting it - because it doesn't work! idiot.

>
>>
>>>
>>> Bearing balls might work slightly better, but do you really want to be
>>> stepping on all the little steel balls you missed for the next two weeks
>>> until you finally pick/vacuum them all up?
>>
>> only if you're a retard. the rest of us put grease on the plates to
>> hold the balls - they stay in place just fine. idiot.
>>
>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> good luck
>>>>
>>>> he'll need it if he's reading your bovine effluent.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Cite ONE - just ONE inaccuracy in anything that I posted above, you
>>> drooling retard.
>>
>> ??? i just have, retard. repeatedly.
>>
>
> No, no you haven't.

then you're functionally illiterate. but we already knew that.

>
>>
>>>
>>> You can't, because I do know what I'm talking about and you're just
>>> playing like you know what you're talking about because you're an
>>> insecure little shit who likes crapping on Usenet and making it a
>>> generally unpleasant place because of your mental issues.
>>>
>>> OP, don't let JB run you off please...
>>
>> "marsden nuts need to be staked" he bleats. "i can't find a picture of
>> the tool that does it" he bleats. "i can't find a good explanation of
>> how they work" he bleats. so i come along and cram your own inadequacy
>> up your ass and you don't even have the sense to keep your retarded
>> mouth shut about it. well, kiss my hairy yellow ass.
>>
>>
>
> In other words, because I have seen something that you haven't, you get
> all abusive about it and have no ability to believe that I might know
> something that you don't.

in other words, i cite the patent you can't find and haven't been able
to find in 6+ years, but i'm at fault for doing so - i should be
regurgitating your made-up bullshit just because it strokes your tiny
little brain cell. what a clueless retard.

>
> I know what I've seen with my own fucking eyes.

no you don't - just like you can't read. just like you "watch" someone
use an alignment machine, but end up just as ignorant as before because
evidently you didn't see see what they did that calibrates it.

>
> I also know that even in the rare instances that you may accidentally
> give accurate advice, you're still an asshole about it. In fact that is
> the one thing that you're spectacularly good at.

pucker up and kiss my ass, retard.


--
fact check required

[Scott Dorsey]

Fran Jones <Fran...@is.invalid> wrote:
>
>All I want to do is measure my front and rear toe.
>Measuring toe, in inches, should be relatively simple.

The problem is that the tire isn't very large, and the angle is very
small, so a pretty miniscule difference in distance with the tape measure
translates to a fairly large portion of the angle.

>
>0. Total front toe = 0°5', so toe to center line is half that
>1. Toe to centerline is 1/2 of 0°5' = 0°2.5'
>2. 0°2.5' divided by 60' is ~0.0417 decimal degrees
>3. 17" diameter rims * tangent ~0.0417° = 0.0124"
>4. 0.0124" is roughly about 3/256ths" (or about 0.3mm)

Do you care about the rim diameter or the full tire diameter? If you measure
at the outer diameter of the tire, you have more lever arm to work with. But,
tires are soft and flexible so your measurement is less accurate too.

Alignment _is_ a job for specialists, more than nearly anything else on the
car. But, those specialists are becoming harder and harder to find and are
being replaced by kids with automated machinery that can do the job just as
well when everything is good, but often are totally useless when unusual
conditions are encountered. So knowing something about the alignment
geometry is a good thing just so you can make basic sanity checks.
--scott


--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[jim beam]

+1

[checked all the boxes with that one.]


--
fact check required

[Alan Baker]

In article <pan.2013.07...@is.invalid>,

Fran Jones <Fran...@is.invalid> wrote:

> On Thu, 11 Jul 2013 07:15:30 -0700, jim beam wrote:
>
> > take the car to an experienced professional.
>
> Hi Jim Beam,
>
> I appreciate your plug for the professional, and certainly
> they can accurately measure toe ... but I have to then ask:
>
> Do you take your car to a car wash or wash it yourself?
> Do you repair your car or do you take it to a mechanic?
> Do you change your own oil or do you go to JiffyLube?
>
> This is rec.autos.tech. It's the kind of question that
> could/should be asked on rec.autos.tech.
>
> All I want to do is measure my front and rear toe.
> Measuring toe, in inches, should be relatively simple.
>
> It's the distance from the center of the tire tread to the
> centerline of the vehicle.
>
> What I want to know is how to convert that center-to-center
> measurement to the degrees that are listed in the shop manual.
>
> How does this approach look for the conversion?
>
> 0. Total front toe = 0°5', so toe to center line is half that
> 1. Toe to centerline is 1/2 of 0°5' = 0°2.5'

OK. That's wrong. When toe on a car is measured in degrees, it's the
same figure whether you measure from rim to rim, or centre to rim.

> 2. 0°2.5' divided by 60' is ~0.0417 decimal degrees
> 3. 17" diameter rims * tangent ~0.0417° = 0.0124"
> 4. 0.0124" is roughly about 3/256ths" (or about 0.3mm)

--
Alan Baker
Vancouver, British Columbia
"If you raise the ceiling four feet, move the fireplace from that wall
to that wall, you'll still only get the full stereophonic effect if you
sit in the bottom of that cupboard."

[Tegger]

Nate Nagel <njn...@roosters.net> wrote in
news:krnn0...@news6.newsguy.com:

> On 07/11/2013 09:09 PM, jim beam wrote:

>>
>> he'll need it if he's reading your bovine effluent.
>>
>

> ...you're an insecure little shit who likes crapping on Usenet and

> making it a generally unpleasant place because of your mental issues.
>

I've had "jim beam" killfiled for at least a year; maybe more, I'm not sure
now. I only see his posts when people like Nate respond to them.

For a long time I have/had been corresponding with "jim", both online and
privately. Long ago, he gave me some great help and information for my
website, help for which I am still grateful.

However, I do not know what has happened between 2005 and 2013. Either the
2005 "jim" was a different person than the 2013 "jim", or "jim" has gone
quietly and steadily insane over the past eight years.

"jim", if you're the same person who helped me with the igniter section of
may website, I have to ask: what has happened to you? I still have all the
emails (I keep everything). Your tone of voice was very different before;
much more...human.


--
Tegger

[jim beam]

you mealy-mouthed hypocrite. you came sucking up to me for help and
advice, which i gave free and for nothing, but when i [later] asked for
advice, you wouldn't give it unless i kissed your ass*. well, i don't
play that game. and you can kill-file me to "punish" me for it all you
want. passive-aggressive nonsense.


* when i did finally wring something out of you, it turned out to be
wrong. flat out wrong.


--
fact check required

[Tegger]

jim beam <m...@privacy.net> wrote in news:ks4q8e$41n$6...@dont-email.me:

>
> you mealy-mouthed hypocrite. you came sucking up to me for help and
> advice, which i gave free and for nothing, but when i [later] asked
> for advice, you wouldn't give it unless i kissed your ass*.

Whaaat? Where on earth did THAT come from?

> well, i
> don't play that game. and you can kill-file me to "punish" me for it
> all you want. passive-aggressive nonsense.

Killfiling you wasn't to "punish" you, but to spare me your invective
(which I see hasn't changed). I un-killfiled you now in order to see any
responses to my post.

>
>
> * when i did finally wring something out of you, it turned out to be
> wrong. flat out wrong.
>
>

What was that? Was it private or online? I don't remember you saying
anything like this at any time during any conversations. I can assure you
that anything I told you would have been said with sincerity; any errors
were certainly inadvertent.

Your belligerent behavior has GOT to be an act; it HAS to be. You like
seeing what kind of rise you can get out of people under cover of Usenet
anonymity.


--
Tegger

[Tegger]

Tegger <inv...@example.com> wrote in
news:XnsA2008F4...@208.90.168.18:

>
> Your belligerent behavior has GOT to be an act; it HAS to be. You like
> seeing what kind of rise you can get out of people under cover of
> Usenet anonymity.
>
>

On second thought, I have another theory.

Around where I live, a respected university professor was recently arrested
for alleged kiddie porn; he is married with children; his students
apparently like him. On the surface he appears to be a normal, upstanding
citizen. But then it seems he got caught in the cops' kiddie-porn dragnet.
It thus appears as though he has a dark, private side that nobody in his
normal life knew about.

Maybe "jim beam's" online obnoxiousness and belligerence is his dark,
private side. The people in his real life probably have no idea he does
anything like this.


--
Tegger

[Kevin Bottorff]

Tegger <inv...@example.com> wrote in
news:XnsA20066F6...@208.90.168.18:

Wow, if he can be that big of dink on line, it is unlikely he can control
all that nonsense elsewhere. He is probably not well liked anywhere! KB

[Some Guy]

Tegger wrote:

> Around where I live, a respected university professor was recently
> arrested for alleged kiddie porn;

Ok, I know who you're talking about. Physiology prof.

> Around where I live

Speaking of around here, can you believe how hot it's been the past few
days?

[Virgil]

In article <pan.2013.07...@is.invalid>,
Fran Jones <Fran...@is.invalid> wrote:

> My 2001 BMW 525i front total toe spec is 0°5'±10' and the rear total
> toe is 0°22'±4'
>

> How does one convert that to inches or millimeters?

On merely the information given, one doesn't.

To convert such small angles to distances, or vice versa, one also must
at least also have the distance from the vertex of the angle being
measured to the points at which the distance between the angle's sides
is being measured.
A
/\
/ \
/ \
B C
For a given angle at A, the distance between B and C is proportion to
the supposedly equal distances AB and AC, so knowing only angle A by
itself is not enough to determine any distance BC.
--
Virgil
"Mit der Dummheit kampfen Gotter selbst vergebens." (Schiller)