GM Paint Failure / Legal Action
Mark Annal
************************************************************************************************************
> Kurt (and anyone else that has been screwed by Chrysler on paint problems), you might have missed my post of
> a week ago. I'm archiving all the responses I get about others who have had this problem. I'd like to know
> more about the details of your problem (when the paint began peeling and did it rapidly take over the car...
> are there signs of poor adheasion on the sides, what the color is, and what your VIN # is). There's strength
> in numbers and facts; maybe we can strengthen our case if all of the paint problems eminate from a common
> quality problem at Chrysler.
Hi,
In reply to your posting, I have a paint problem with my '92 Chevy. This
peeling paint problem appears to be affecting a lot of late '80s and early 90's
Ford, GM and Chrysler vehicles.
My vehicle is a `92 Chevy Corsica (VIN# 1G1LT53T7NY244706) and is light
metallic blue. Up until March of this year the paintwork was fine. However
since then, the paint has been literally jumping from the car.
The paint is peeling away from the body (the primer underneath shows no damage)
along the body countour ridges, the edges of the hood and around the tops of
the doors.
Please e-mail or post information that you find about this situation as the
more knowledge we can share between us, the more likely it is that we can all
get our cars repaired.
I am including an excerpt from a posting I found in rec.autos.marketplace that
certainly gives me hope.
> I had this exact same problem with an '89 Chevy Pickup. After two
> years, the paint started peeling off, first on the hood, eventually on
> every panel. The dealer painted the hood, saying it was probably
> contamination that caused it to peel. After other sections began to
> peel, I began to investigate. To make a long story short: The
> adhesion problem stems from the ELPO primer being baked to long, and
> it gets too hard, The water based paint does not stick properly to
> this overly hard epoxy primer, and then it starts to peel after it
> ages a bit. The peeling usually starts around high stress areas in
> the paint, like countour lines, ridges, and such. It will eventually
> let go completely.
>
> After I discovered the technical reasons why it happened, I demanded
> that GM either completely strip to bare metal and repaint the entire
> truck, or else replace it. They balked, but I stuck to my guns. I
> went to the BBB and filed for arbitration but my vehicle was too old
> (more than two years) and they could only mediate. GM continued to
> brush me off. I got several estimates to have this work done, ranging
> from $3000 to $5000, depending on the quality of the work. I then had
> my lawyer send them a letter inviting them to join us for a little
> chat with a local judge to discuss why they should pay for it. (Read:
> I sued)
>
> The monday morning after the filing, the zone rep called me at work
> and begged me to help them resolve it. They asked me what it would
> take to make me happy, and I told them paint it or, preferably,
> replace it. They gave me Black Book Wholesale clean value for my
> truck, plus $2000, plus my legal costs (about $250) and I ordered a
> new truck. It took six months, and a lawyer, but I finally got it
> resolved. My '91 was painted on an older, more conventional paint
> line, and it has flawless paint. I still have the truck and it has
> been a joy.
>
> The moral is: don't give up just because the dealer says no. Keep
> prodding. Classic case of "The squeaky wheel gets oiled." Time to
> squeak a little louder. First, contact the zone office for your area.
> Tel your dealer you aren't happy with them not fixing it, and that you
> want the number for the zone rep. If that person is no help, contact
> Chrysler's National Customer Service Center. ALso, contact the BBB
> and ask them to mediate on your behalf. Although it may not resolve
> the problem, it demonstrates to Chrysler that you are not happy, and
> you are willing to pursue it further. Document everything you do. If
> all of this gets you nowhere, talk to your lawyer. They will usually
> do the initial filing for a very small fee, and if it goes to trial,
> they work on a percentage. Remember, you are right on this one,
> warranty or not, Don't give up just yet. Good luck.
>
> Tony Staples
> tsta...@piedmont.net
Another interesting post was made by Byron Williams in rec.autos.misc on April
17th 1996 concerning a GM "Technical Service Bulletin" recognizing that a
manufacturing fault had occurred in large numbers of vehicles.
--
Regards and all that,
LittleMark...
GreggT67
GM does have a technical bulletin out on the paint failure. It is 231054
dated June 1995.
Many dealerships do have the capability given to them from GM to satisfy
customers with this problem although their capability is not open ended.
GM has empowered most dealerships with the ability to repair vehicles with
this problem up to 5 years from the original date of delivery. Some
dealers can only authorize up to 4 years from the original date of
delivery. And a scant few have no authorization ability at all in this
situation. If the vehicle is past the guidelines of a dealerships
authorization capability, the situation can be reviewed by the local
District Service Manager or for Chevrolet dealers, the Customer Assistance
Center or the Dealer Assistance Center.
Although dealers do have the authorization capability for a certain length
of time, the situations must be reviewed on an individual basis and can be
denied at the dealers discretion. For the most part Chevrolet stops
covering this problem after 5 years. Some of the other divisions have gone
further past the 5 year mark but this is certainly no hard and fast rule
to follow.
My suggestions are this for getting your vehicle repainted. If your
vehicle is within the guidelines I stated above, go to your dealer and
have them review the situation. If they deny coverage, try another
dealership, they may be more willing to perform the repairs. I hope this
has helped.
Greg Surratt
Mark Annal <m...@cci.com> wrote:
>Hi,
>
>In reply to your posting, I have a paint problem with my '92 Chevy. This
>peeling paint problem appears to be affecting a lot of late '80s and early 90's
>Ford, GM and Chrysler vehicles.
>
>My vehicle is a `92 Chevy Corsica (VIN# 1G1LT53T7NY244706) and is light
>metallic blue. Up until March of this year the paintwork was fine. However
>since then, the paint has been literally jumping from the car.
>
>The paint is peeling away from the body (the primer underneath shows no damage)
>along the body countour ridges, the edges of the hood and around the tops of
>the doors.
>
>Please e-mail or post information that you find about this situation as the
>more knowledge we can share between us, the more likely it is that we can all
>get our cars repaired.
My '91 Corsica had the peeling paint problem after about 3 years. I
took it to the dealer, they had a zone rep look at it and he made them
strip it to bare metal and repaint the entire vehicle.
The explanation I was given was that the problem is not the paint, it
is the primer and a reaction from UV out in the sun.
Greg
sur...@ix.netcom.com
Rizwan Ahmad
Greg Surratt (sur...@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
: The explanation I was given was that the problem is not the paint, itProper care of a car like waxing every month would take care of things
like that. I would rather a clean good condition factory paint job
rather than a new paint job. The factory paint is stronger and resitsts
scratches better
LiL RiZ
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Dan Roberts
In article <319848c4...@nntp.ix.netcom.com>, sur...@ix.netcom.com wrote:
My 1988 Chvey Caprice with Saffire Blue paint has this problem also..
I am wondering if I can get my car repainted also..eventhough
I bought the car used and never have gone to a Chevy dealer for any
kind of service..>Dan
--
Dan Roberts
BRISTOL-MYERS SQUIBB PHARM. RES. CENTER "Nature is last at Bats"
PRINCETON, NEW JERSEY U.S.A. PLANET EARTH, MILKY-WAY GALAXY
<<<<INTERNET ADDRESS>>>>Roberts_Dani...@MSMAIL.BMS.COM
Rizwan Ahmad
Dan Roberts (Roberts_Dani...@MSMAIL.BMS.COM) wrote:
: In article <319848c4...@nntp.ix.netcom.com>, sur...@ix.netcom.com wrote:
:
: My 1988 Chvey Caprice with Saffire Blue paint has this problem also..
:
: I am wondering if I can get my car repainted also..eventhough
: I bought the car used and never have gone to a Chevy dealer for any
: kind of service..>Dan
Try it. It doesnt hurt to try maybe you might get a free paint job. I
know my friends Ford F150 Had this problem when he bought it. He took it
to the dealer and the painted his car no hassle.
LiL RiZ
:
: --
: Dan Roberts
: BRISTOL-MYERS SQUIBB PHARM. RES. CENTER "Nature is last at Bats"
: PRINCETON, NEW JERSEY U.S.A. PLANET EARTH, MILKY-WAY GALAXY
: <<<<INTERNET ADDRESS>>>>Roberts_Dani...@MSMAIL.BMS.COM
:
Greg Surratt
riza...@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu (Rizwan Ahmad) wrote:
>Greg Surratt (sur...@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
>: The explanation I was given was that the problem is not the paint, it
>: is the primer and a reaction from UV out in the sun.
>: Greg
>: sur...@ix.netcom.com
>Proper care of a car like waxing every month would take care of things
>like that. I would rather a clean good condition factory paint job
>rather than a new paint job. The factory paint is stronger and resitsts
>scratches better
>LiL RiZ
I had a clean good condition factory paint job - as far as looks go -
but if you are following the thread, there was a problem there that
the auto makers (I have seen the big three all mentioned here) have
admitted to. Waxing and washing didn't help.
Greg
sur...@ix.netcom.com
art...@pipeline.com
>: My 1988 Chvey Caprice with Saffire Blue paint has this problem also..
>:
>: I am wondering if I can get my car repainted also..eventhough
>: I bought the car used and never have gone to a Chevy dealer for any
>: kind of service..>Dan
>
>Try it. It doesnt hurt to try maybe you might get a free paint job. I
>know my friends Ford F150 Had this problem when he bought it. He took it
>to the dealer and the painted his car no hassle.
>LiL RiZ
afflicted by "paint literally jumping off" them. This is ridiculous: I have
had washes and waxes regularly but not obsessively (not every month) It
seems a bit much for the paint to be coming off in hunks as mine just did.
Our old Buicks when I was a kid sat outside all winter long for years in
the Midwest without any such phenomenon.
-April
__________________________________________________________
"To say that Windows 95 is just like the Mac is like finding a potato in
the shape of Jesus and thinking you have witnessed the second coming."
--Guy Kawasaki
bobs...@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca
Rizwan Ahmad (riza...@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu) wrote:
: Greg Surratt (sur...@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
: : The explanation I was given was that the problem is not the paint, it
: : is the primer and a reaction from UV out in the sun.
: : Greg
: : sur...@ix.netcom.com
: Proper care of a car like waxing every month would take care of things
: like that. I would rather a clean good condition factory paint job
: rather than a new paint job. The factory paint is stronger and resitsts
: scratches better
: LiL RiZ
If ignorance is bliss, you must be a happy man. Factory paint is crap,
and is usually a little over one mil. How do I know this, and am not
babbling off the top of my head like you? The shop I work for does
warranty work for Chrysler, Ford and GM dealerships. I repair four or
five of those "scratch resistant" paint jobs a day. Not to mention a
whole whack of those peelers.
--
_______ ______ _______
| _ | | | | _ | bobs...@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca
| |_| | | _ | | |_| |
| _ | | |_| | | _ | ** the fingers that put the
| |_| | | | | |_| | ice in your drinks
|_______| |______| |_______| clean the urinals!
bill nielsen
I have an '88 c1500 (white) experiencing the same paint
problem. I am currently considering replacing it but I am
faced with the fact that the value is severly reduced by the
peeling. I can shame a chevy dealer into a decent trade-in,
but why would I want another GM product when they won't make
the current one right (paint shouldn't peel, not even after 8
years).
Any info on responsible action by GM concerning this problem
is welcome.
Bill
bill nielsen
Barry Kashar
In <4ndij7$4...@masters0.Internex.NET> bill nielsen <bnie...@mdyn.com>
writes:
They haven't noticed that the problem exists for all auto makers. The
latest that I heard was that the base coats were hardened at two high a
temperature, and the clear coat can't stick. Repainting won't help, the
EPA paint regulations changing every 6 months (or earlier) the best
body shops can't learn the right conditions to apply paint to keep it
from peeling.
Of course part of the problem (which its not to the automakers if
you buy a new car) maybe "Planned Obsolesence" US car makers lost
market share to imports by early failure of mechanicals. Now they may
be doing it with cosmetics.
States like California like any thing thats causes you to buy a new
car, and collect ungodly registration fees. Heck they say they came up
with a new gas to cut air pollution. "BULLSHIT" The new gas results in
poorer mileage... RESULT: More Sales tax revenue from increased gas
sales. The gas will degrade the fuel systems of cars with over 100K
miles or over ten years old....RESULT: People will have to buy new
cars, paying high sales taxes and ungodly registration fees, also
higher insurance on new cars, generating even more tax money to the
state. I guess no energy is consumed or pollution generated when
building new cars.
Barry
Russell Smith
On 14-May-96 07:49:32, GreggT67 said about Re: GM Paint Failure / Legal
Action:
Just thought I'd mention that its not just GM in the states, over here in the
uk, Ive been told by a Vauxhall dealer (read GM) that there 6 year anti
corrosion warranty does not cover rust! . Funny thing was I took the car to my
local VW dealer to have a couple of bits of rust sorted out they told me that
I should be able to claim under my warrenty . So after being fobed off by the
dealer I rang the customer care line to complain, they told me rust was
covered, and would speak to the dealer and get back to me either themselfs or
get the dealer to ring me, that was 9th May, today 14th May still no-one has
got back to me. customer care hahahahhaa what a lafff..
|----------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|Amiga ____ | |
| / / / | |
| ____ / / / | Russell Smith - Rus...@form1.demon.co.uk |
| \ \ \/ / / | |
| \ \/\/ / | Halifax West Yorkshire England The White Rose County |
| \/\/\/ 1200 | Amiga 1200 68030 50Mhz 10 Meg Ram 540 HD Scsi CDrom |
|----------------------------------------------------------------------------|
Chris Hash
Rizwan Ahmad (riza...@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu) wrote:
: Dan Roberts (Roberts_Dani...@MSMAIL.BMS.COM) wrote:
: : In article <319848c4...@nntp.ix.netcom.com>,
: : sur...@ix.netcom.com wrote:
: :
: :
: : I am wondering if I can get my car repainted also..eventhough
: : I bought the car used and never have gone to a Chevy dealer for any
: : kind of service..>Dan
: Try it. It doesnt hurt to try maybe you might get a free paint job. I
: know my friends Ford F150 Had this problem when he bought it. He took it
: to the dealer and the painted his car no hassle.
: LiL RiZ
The 88 Caprice is not subject to paint delaminations, however is may be
subject to a condition called cracking/crazing. A few words of advise,
DO NOT Waste your time for these reasons: 1) Your car is too old, 2) You
purchased a used car, 3) Your car does not meet the criteria.
--
Chris Hash
THE INTERCHANGER
Rizwan Ahmad
On Thu, 16 May 1996, Chris Hash wrote:
> In article <4na4iq$c...@uwm.edu> you wrote:
> : Greg Surratt (sur...@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
> : : The explanation I was given was that the problem is not the paint, it
> : : is the primer and a reaction from UV out in the sun.
> : : Greg
> : : sur...@ix.netcom.com
>
> : Proper care of a car like waxing every month would take care of things
> : like that. I would rather a clean good condition factory paint job
> : rather than a new paint job. The factory paint is stronger and resitsts
> : scratches better
> : LiL RiZ
>
> Let me fill in your story. There is nothing that will prevent this paint
> delamination, the story above is correct. You should never use wax on
> clear coat paint systems. A good, no/low abrasive polish is best. Most
> waxes contain a high abrasive content and will cause water beading, this
> is another problem, it will promote acid rain spots in the paint.
I just bought a brand new toyota with a clear coat paint. The dealer and
the owner manulal say you should wwax. Read any car detailing manual.
You must wax your car. Get your facts straight. Read a detailing book
LiL RiZ
>
>
> --
>
> Chris Hash
> THE INTERCHANGER
>
>
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
GreggT67
"Ive been told by a Vauxhall dealer (read GM) that there 6 year
They may just be right. In the US, most of the extended corrosion
warranties are for rust perforation, not just surface rust. I can't
understand this ridicious corrosion warranty when you have to wait for it
to rust thru to get it covered and chances are that you will be out of
warranty before it gets that bad.
Gregg
Rizwan Ahmad
On Thu, 16 May 1996, Rizwan Ahmad wrote:
> > delamination, the story above is correct. You should never use wax on
> > clear coat paint systems. A good, no/low abrasive polish is best. Most
> > waxes contain a high abrasive content and will cause water beading, this
Reading this article again you made one more big mistake. You want your
water to bead on your paint. That is the whole idea of wax.
Wax also prevent uv rays effect on paint
LiL RiZ
Russell Smith
On 17-May-96 08:42:55, GreggT67 said about Re: GM Paint Failure / Legal Action:
> Gregg
Since that I've been told the warranty only applies to the origional owner
and that the rust has occured due to design defect.
So Ive now decide to skip the dealers and take it up directly with
Vauxhall UK.
Ps this car cost 20,000 UK pounds er think thats about $35-40,000
and its only in its second year.
J. Martin
Yeah, my brother out in NM had an '89 Chevy S-10 where the paint
job peeled off the hood and roof in less than two years. He took it back
to the dealer and they repainted it for free. Of course, they didn't fix
everything else on the truck that was broken. I've heard some good
things about the S-10, but this one was a piece...
--
---Hmmmm---
Chris Hash
bill nielsen (bnie...@mdyn.com) wrote:
: I have an '88 c1500 (white) experiencing the same paint
: problem. I am currently considering replacing it but I am
: faced with the fact that the value is severly reduced by the
: peeling. I can shame a chevy dealer into a decent trade-in,
: but why would I want another GM product when they won't make
: the current one right (paint shouldn't peel, not even after 8
: years).
: Any info on responsible action by GM concerning this problem
: is welcome.
: Bill
Look at it this way....
Your truck sits outside, just like your house.
Your truck is exposed to harsh elements, just like your house.
Your truck may have to be painted, just like your house.
What makes your truck any different......
Chris Hash
Rizwan Ahmad (riza...@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu) wrote:
: On Thu, 16 May 1996, Chris Hash wrote:
: > : Proper care of a car like waxing every month would take care of things
: > : like that. I would rather a clean good condition factory paint job
: > : rather than a new paint job. The factory paint is stronger and
: > : resitsts scratches better
: > : LiL RiZ
: >
: > Let me fill in your story. There is nothing that will prevent this paint
: > delamination, the story above is correct. You should never use wax on
: > clear coat paint systems. A good, no/low abrasive polish is best. Most
: > waxes contain a high abrasive content and will cause water beading, this
: > is another problem, it will promote acid rain spots in the paint.
: I just bought a brand new toyota with a clear coat paint. The dealer and
: the owner manulal say you should wwax. Read any car detailing manual.
: You must wax your car. Get your facts straight. Read a detailing book
: LiL RiZ
I will have to laugh when you get swirl marks in your paint. BTW, my
facts are very straight, I am in the automobile business, and have to
deal with this on a daily basis. If you want the best answer, go ask the
painter at a local body shop, i'm sure he will back my story. As for
your swirl marks, don't expect the manufacture to warranty you paint.
Chris Hash
Rizwan Ahmad (riza...@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu) wrote:
: On Thu, 16 May 1996, Rizwan Ahmad wrote:
: > > delamination, the story above is correct. You should never use wax on
: > > clear coat paint systems. A good, no/low abrasive polish is best.
: > > Most waxes contain a high abrasive content and will cause water
: > > beading.
: Reading this article again you made one more big mistake. You want your
: water to bead on your paint. That is the whole idea of wax.
: Wax also prevent uv rays effect on paint
: LiL RiZ
YOU ARE WRONG AGAIN, that is the old school way of thinking. On older
paint systems beading water ment that the wax was working, when the water
did not bead, it needed waxing again. On newer clear-coat systems, you
do not want water to bead. Beading water will leave spots on the paint
when it is left in sunlight. This is caused by dirt and the acid content
of the water. A high quality polish that protects the finish and does
not bead is the best.
Rizwan Ahmad
Chris Hash (cah...@dmv.com) wrote:
: Rizwan Ahmad (riza...@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu) wrote:
: : On Thu, 16 May 1996, Chris Hash wrote:
:
: : > : Proper care of a car like waxing every month would take care of things
: : > : like that. I would rather a clean good condition factory paint job
: : > : rather than a new paint job. The factory paint is stronger and
: : > : resitsts scratches better
: : > : LiL RiZ
: : >
: : > Let me fill in your story. There is nothing that will prevent this paint
:
: : I just bought a brand new toyota with a clear coat paint. The dealer and
: : the owner manulal say you should wwax. Read any car detailing manual.
: : You must wax your car. Get your facts straight. Read a detailing book
: : LiL RiZ
:
: I will have to laugh when you get swirl marks in your paint. BTW, my
: facts are very straight, I am in the automobile business, and have to
: deal with this on a daily basis. If you want the best answer, go ask the
: painter at a local body shop, i'm sure he will back my story. As for
: your swirl marks, don't expect the manufacture to warranty you paint.
I have yet to get swirls on my car. I tripple waxed it today and still
no swirls. I follow my owners manual and I have read many car detailing
books I like to take care of my car for a hobby. Try it it wont harm
anything. However I only use maguires wax. They guraantee against
swirls. But sill I would never use anything like rubbing compund on my
car. That is too abrasive. But still if you do get swirls theres
maguires swirl remover it works great. Iv used it on my truck which
doesn't have a clear coat. Swirls are caused when you drag dirt across
your finsish when washing and not making sure your spongue is clean every
stroke.
--
bwysocki
In article <4njegd$b...@eagle.dmv.com>, cah...@dmv.com says...
>
>Rizwan Ahmad (riza...@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu) wrote:
>: On Thu, 16 May 1996, Rizwan Ahmad wrote:
>
>: > > delamination, the story above is correct. You should never use wax on
>: > > clear coat paint systems. A good, no/low abrasive polish is best.
>: > > Most waxes contain a high abrasive content and will cause water
>
>: Reading this article again you made one more big mistake. You want your
>: water to bead on your paint. That is the whole idea of wax.
>: Wax also prevent uv rays effect on paint
>: LiL RiZ
>
>YOU ARE WRONG AGAIN, that is the old school way of thinking. On older
>paint systems beading water ment that the wax was working, when the water
>did not bead, it needed waxing again. On newer clear-coat systems, you
>do not want water to bead. Beading water will leave spots on the paint
>when it is left in sunlight. This is caused by dirt and the acid content
>of the water. A high quality polish that protects the finish and does
>not bead is the best.
>
>
>--
>
>THE INTERCHANGER
I also found this to be true. A wax like the new Turtle wax non-beading type
or the one I use, Durashield works the best on clearcoat.
I almost never see water spots on my black car since I started using
Durasheild, the water basically 'streams off of it without beading'
BW
Craig Cressey
I too am exsperiancing the same problem with paint peeling off. I have a
1990 GMC Suburban. I noticed this spring the paint starting to flake off
the hood and roof in quarter size chunks. I have contacted the area
service rep. in writing. He informed me because the vehicle`s warranty
exspired after 5 years there was nothing he could do. Don`t you know the
warranty ran out in Sept. 95.I plan on taking this to the next level in
the corporate ladder to try and get some satifaction. I would be
interested in hearing from anyone out there that is going though this or
has gone though this same thing.
Looking for Justice in N.H.
Craig Cressey
Chris Hash
Craig Cressey (c...@three-girls.mv.com) wrote:
: I too am exsperiancing the same problem with paint peeling off. I have a
The warranty on a 1990 vehicle was 3 years or 50,000 miles, GM has
offered to paint vehicles that suffer from paint delamination upto 5
years or 100,000 miles which ever comes first. They are doing this as a
goodwill and as long as they are paying the bill, they can do what they
want to. I can tell you that you will barking up the wrong tree. The
policy is as stands. There are no exceptions that I have found to this rule.
If they bend the rules for you, they would have to bend the rules for
everyone, that is why they have established the policy of 5/100, there
are NO EXCEPTIONS!
Chris Hash
THE INTERCHANGER
C & K Claxton
My buddy had a problem with paint chipping off on his '91 Chevy truck. He asked the
dealer (not even the one he bought the truck from!) and they gave him a date to bring it
in. 2 days later the whole truck was painted, and even a few dings were pulled out -
all under warrantee!
abdullah mujib
MUST SALE. MOVING TO LONDON. EXCELL CONDITION. HIGH RESALE VALUE.
*** '94 ACURA INTEGRA LS, 4DR
*** P/W, P/D, P/ANTENNA, P/MIRROR, P/STEARING, ABS, DUAL AIRBAG
*** CRUSE CONTROL, V-TECH,
*** VIPER ALARM
*** ONLY 28K MILES, EXCELLENT CONDITION
*** LOW MPG
*** COLOR: BROWN/SAND, LOOKS GREAT
***
*** ONLY $14,100 (NEG)
CALL ABDUL AT (516)946-2983 OR (516)357-9060 (preferred)
E-MAIL amu...@ic.sunysb.edu
NOTE: ONLY SIRIOUS BYERS CONTACT ASAP.
Andrew Lavigne
>*** '94 ACURA INTEGRA LS, 4DR
>*** P/W, P/D, P/ANTENNA, P/MIRROR, P/STEARING, ABS, DUAL AIRBAG
>*** CRUSE CONTROL, V-TECH,
^^^^^^
There is no *V-TEC* on the LS.
fox mulder
On 24 May 1996 16:42:43 GMT, alav...@bcarhe42.bnr.ca (Andrew Lavigne)
wrote:
>
>
>>*** '94 ACURA INTEGRA LS, 4DR
>>*** P/W, P/D, P/ANTENNA, P/MIRROR, P/STEARING, ABS, DUAL AIRBAG
>>*** CRUSE CONTROL, V-TECH,
> ^^^^^^
> There is no *V-TEC* on the LS.
>
>>*** VIPER ALARM
>>*** ONLY 28K MILES, EXCELLENT CONDITION
>>*** LOW MPG
Since when did Integras get low MPG?
Unless you compare it to a Moped
>>*** COLOR: BROWN/SAND, LOOKS GREAT
>>***
>>*** ONLY $14,100 (NEG)
>>CALL ABDUL AT (516)946-2983 OR (516)357-9060 (preferred)
>>E-MAIL amu...@ic.sunysb.edu
>>NOTE: ONLY SIRIOUS BYERS CONTACT ASAP.
Rurrly? I don't want to bye!
>
>
Chris Korff
In article <31acab57...@news.earthlink.net> tho...@earthlink.net (fox mulder) writes:
>Path: magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!math.ohio-state.edu!uwm.edu!spool.mu.edu!usenet.eel.ufl.edu!bofh.dot!newsfeed.internetmci.com!nntp.earthlink.net!usenet
>From: tho...@earthlink.net (fox mulder)
>Newsgroups: rec.autos.misc,rec.autos.tech,rec.autos.marketplace
>Subject: Re: FS: '94 ACURA INTEGRA LS
>Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 19:55:51 GMT
>Organization: Earthlink Network, Inc.
>Lines: 32
>Message-ID: <31acab57...@news.earthlink.net>
>References: <DrCtp...@sunsrvr6.cci.com> <4ndigl$3...@masters0.Internex.NET> <Pine.SUN.3.91.96052...@mathlab.sunysb.edu> <ALAVIGNE.96...@bcarhe42.bnr.ca>
>NNTP-Posting-Host: pool031.maxa.gardena.ca.us.dynip.earthlink.net
>X-Newsreader: Forte Agent .99d/32.182
>Xref: magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu rec.autos.misc:102145 rec.autos.tech:180693 rec.autos.marketplace:49619
>>
>>
I think he meant Marv Byer, recently seen (with Elvis) orbiting a star with
magnitude -1.42.
Tracey McCartney
greg...@aol.com (GreggT67) wrote:
>GM does have a technical bulletin out on the paint failure. It is 231054
>dated June 1995.
I am about to sue GM over this problem with my 1990 Olds Cutlass
Supreme. Where can I get a copy of this bulletin?
Tracey McCartney
Charles Prichard
> >GM does have a technical bulletin out on the paint failure. It is 231054
> >dated June 1995.
>
> I am about to sue GM over this problem with my 1990 Olds Cutlass
> Supreme. Where can I get a copy of this bulletin?
ALL Data offers this. Look at: http://www.alldata.tsb.com/
Also, perhaps a local INDEPENDENT repair shop would have a copy of the Olds TSBs.
--
Charles Prichard, Maitland FL
pric...@worldnet.att.net
Chris Hash
Tracey McCartney (tra...@mont.mindspring.com) wrote:
: greg...@aol.com (GreggT67) wrote:
: >GM does have a technical bulletin out on the paint failure. It is 231054
: >dated June 1995.
: I am about to sue GM over this problem with my 1990 Olds Cutlass
: Supreme. Where can I get a copy of this bulletin?
: Tracey McCartney
What will you do when you house paint peels, sue the painter and the
paint company? The warranty on the paint of your car was 1 year or
12,000 miles, GM offered, as a goodwill to customers, to repaint
cars upto 5 years or 100,000 miles whichever comes first.
Quit crying and get a life.
bill nielsen
I have posted in this group with the same problem on an '88
C1500 pickup.
I quit crying and bought a Toyota, thanks chevy for forcing me
to not buy another GM product like I would have if you had
repainted my truck. The Toyota stands head and shoulders
above the chevy (and might last more than 10/100000).
BN
Robert Dillmeier
In <4ov4cg$4...@masters0.Internex.NET> bill nielsen <bnie...@mdyn.com>
writes:
Where did GM announce that they were repainting the cars
as an act of goodwill? I never heard of this?
Can someone post the TSB's or announcement regarding this?
Or point me in the right direction of where to find this?
Thanks!
-BD
Gordon M. Fauth, Jr.
>What will you do when you house paint peels, sue the painter and the
>paint company? The warranty on the paint of your car was 1 year or
>12,000 miles, GM offered, as a goodwill to customers, to repaint
>cars upto 5 years or 100,000 miles whichever comes first.
>
>Quit crying and get a life.
Really, going to bat for GM?!!
GM's experiements with water laquer paints during the late 80s do not
deserve thaaat much sympathy. True, environmentalists and various
types of pcniks were pushing them to use "safer" paints. Still,
without telling consumers (who, based on their previous experience,
expected the paint job to last a bit longer than the warranty), GM
began using some pretty awful paints, that were almost programmed to
degrade instantly upon exposure to sunlight. And, even after GM
knew it had a problem, it kept on using some of those paints...
For your information, its not the length of the warranty that
determines whether a product is defective. One important prong
is the "consumer expectation test"--and I'd say the paint fails.
And, yes, if my house peeled a week after the paint job, I'd
probably think I'd been had...
Robert Dillmeier
In <4p0e44$s...@agate.berkeley.edu> fa...@uclink2.berkeley.edu (Gordon
Where can I get more information about the "Consumer Information Test",
and information about this whole paint issue? I really have a problem
with my car and this paint.
I called Pontiac yesterday, and they were the rudest people I have
ever dealt with. They didn't want to even address the situation,
they denied any problems with the paint, and I even mentioned to
them that there are two TSB's addressing paint problems, and they
told me that "They don't mean anything". Yeah, right.
I'm going to push this issue until I get some satisfaction. I
don't expect a new car, but I wouldn't mind if GM / Pontiac at
least split the cost of repairing it with me. I feel that that's fair.
If anyone else is having any problems or has had any problems
with the paint on their GM car "peeling", "chalking" or "flaking",
please email me @ dilg...@ix.netcom.com.
I will be pushing this issue for us car owners, and I would like
to compile a list of people who have or have had this problem.
I really think a class action suit may need to be pursued here.
-Pete
Also, if anyone has copies of the TSB's with regard to the paint,
or information about GM's policy to repaint the cars, please let me
know.
Scott A. Green
cah...@dmv.com (Chris Hash) wrote:
>Tracey McCartney (tra...@mont.mindspring.com) wrote:
>: greg...@aol.com (GreggT67) wrote:
>: >GM does have a technical bulletin out on the paint failure. It is 231054
>: >dated June 1995.
>: I am about to sue GM over this problem with my 1990 Olds Cutlass
>: Supreme. Where can I get a copy of this bulletin?
>: Tracey McCartney
>What will you do when you house paint peels, sue the painter and the
>paint company? The warranty on the paint of your car was 1 year or
>12,000 miles, GM offered, as a goodwill to customers, to repaint
>cars upto 5 years or 100,000 miles whichever comes first.
>Quit crying and get a life.
>--
>Chris Hash
>THE INTERCHANGER
Where and how do I get technical and service bullitins? GM does not
want to release them at the dealers.
Thanx, sco...@ag.net
Robert Dillmeier
In <4pbsvi$4...@agis.ag.net> sco...@agis.ag.net (Scott A. Green)
writes:
What year / make / model is your car, and the color? Email me if you
want some more details about this paint problem.
-Pete
emyle...@gmail.com
> ************************************************************************************************************
> > Kurt (and anyone else that has been screwed by Chrysler on paint problems), you might have missed my post of
> > a week ago. I'm archiving all the responses I get about others who have had this problem. I'd like to know
> > more about the details of your problem (when the paint began peeling and did it rapidly take over the car...
> > are there signs of poor adheasion on the sides, what the color is, and what your VIN # is). There's strength
> > in numbers and facts; maybe we can strengthen our case if all of the paint problems eminate from a common
> > quality problem at Chrysler.
>
> Hi,
>
> In reply to your posting, I have a paint problem with my '92 Chevy. This
> peeling paint problem appears to be affecting a lot of late '80s and early 90's
> Ford, GM and Chrysler vehicles.
>
> My vehicle is a `92 Chevy Corsica (VIN# 1G1LT53T7NY244706) and is light
> metallic blue. Up until March of this year the paintwork was fine. However
> since then, the paint has been literally jumping from the car.
>
> The paint is peeling away from the body (the primer underneath shows no damage)
> along the body countour ridges, the edges of the hood and around the tops of
> the doors.
>
> Please e-mail or post information that you find about this situation as the
> more knowledge we can share between us, the more likely it is that we can all
> get our cars repaired.
>
> I am including an excerpt from a posting I found in rec.autos.marketplace that
> certainly gives me hope.
>
> > I had this exact same problem with an '89 Chevy Pickup. After two
> > years, the paint started peeling off, first on the hood, eventually on
> > every panel. The dealer painted the hood, saying it was probably
> > contamination that caused it to peel. After other sections began to
> > peel, I began to investigate. To make a long story short: The
> > adhesion problem stems from the ELPO primer being baked to long, and
> > it gets too hard, The water based paint does not stick properly to
> > this overly hard epoxy primer, and then it starts to peel after it
> > ages a bit. The peeling usually starts around high stress areas in
> > the paint, like countour lines, ridges, and such. It will eventually
> > let go completely.
> >
> > After I discovered the technical reasons why it happened, I demanded
> > that GM either completely strip to bare metal and repaint the entire
> > truck, or else replace it. They balked, but I stuck to my guns. I
> > went to the BBB and filed for arbitration but my vehicle was too old
> > (more than two years) and they could only mediate. GM continued to
> > brush me off. I got several estimates to have this work done, ranging
> > from $3000 to $5000, depending on the quality of the work. I then had
> > my lawyer send them a letter inviting them to join us for a little
> > chat with a local judge to discuss why they should pay for it. (Read:
> > I sued)
> >
> > The monday morning after the filing, the zone rep called me at work
> > and begged me to help them resolve it. They asked me what it would
> > take to make me happy, and I told them paint it or, preferably,
> > replace it. They gave me Black Book Wholesale clean value for my
> > truck, plus $2000, plus my legal costs (about $250) and I ordered a
> > new truck. It took six months, and a lawyer, but I finally got it
> > resolved. My '91 was painted on an older, more conventional paint
> > line, and it has flawless paint. I still have the truck and it has
> > been a joy.
> >
> > The moral is: don't give up just because the dealer says no. Keep
> > prodding. Classic case of "The squeaky wheel gets oiled." Time to
> > squeak a little louder. First, contact the zone office for your area.
> > Tel your dealer you aren't happy with them not fixing it, and that you
> > want the number for the zone rep. If that person is no help, contact
> > Chrysler's National Customer Service Center. ALso, contact the BBB
> > and ask them to mediate on your behalf. Although it may not resolve
> > the problem, it demonstrates to Chrysler that you are not happy, and
> > you are willing to pursue it further. Document everything you do. If
> > all of this gets you nowhere, talk to your lawyer. They will usually
> > do the initial filing for a very small fee, and if it goes to trial,
> > they work on a percentage. Remember, you are right on this one,
> > warranty or not, Don't give up just yet. Good luck.
> >
> > Tony Staples
> > tsta...@piedmont.net
>
> Another interesting post was made by Byron Williams in rec.autos.misc on April
> 17th 1996 concerning a GM "Technical Service Bulletin" recognizing that a
> manufacturing fault had occurred in large numbers of vehicles.
> --
> Regards and all
HELLO WELL I BROUGHT A 2004 GMC 10 FOOT BOX TRUCK WHICH IS A SAVANNA VAN THAT GMC MADE INTO A BOX TRUCK FOR U-HUAL WHICH I BROUGHT
THE FRONT AND SIDE OF THE EXTERIOR HAS THE PAINT PEELING OFF EVERYWHERE
THIS IS A COMMON ISSUE THE PRIMER THEY USED WAS THE WRONG MATERIAL AND SO IT JUST PEELS AWAY IN SHEETS
I HAVE TALKED TO MANY WITH THE SAME ISSUE
I TALKED TO A PGE EMPLOLYEE AND HE SAID 90 PERCENT OF THE GMC TRUCKS HAVE THE PAINT PEELING OFF
THIS IS A HUGE MONEY ISSUE MILLIONS TO FIX AND THOUSANDS OF GMC VANS TRUCKS NEED TO BE STRIPED DOWN TO THE METAL AND RE PAINTED
THE QUOTE I GOT FROM MACCO WAS FOR 1400.OO TO DO THE CAB
ANYWAY THAT IS WHAT I KNOW