New Points System Posts
v
working pretty well unless you are a Gordon fan. You can always make a set
of statistics suit your predetermined conclusion if you play with them
enough.
Can anybody other than a Jeff Gordon fan explain what is broke before we try
to fix it ?
Dr. Gelakeiwicz
I think I qualify as an "other than a Jeff Gordon fan"
Ditto to it not being broken.. This is the first year in a long time
the championship was sewn up before the final Atlanta race. I think it
works fine, too.
Gives the natives a racing related discussion for the off season...and
it comes up every year.
Next up.
How do they determine the starting positions for the Daytona 500 ?
How do the 125's work ?
How do the provisionals work ?
I'm telling ya, this needs to be in the FAQ, Nick. It's coming, and
will be an hourly question from every newbie starting immediately
after the front row spots are set in regular qualifying.
(I'm going to find NascarWife's answer from last year on Deja and get
it ready. That was short, sweet and to the point)
BTW, I don't care how they start.....as long as I'm there watching ;-)
gloatgloatgloat WOOHOO
Renold Jonsin
"v" <v...@vxy.net> wrote:
> I keep seeing posts about a better points system. The current seems
to be
> working pretty well unless you are a Gordon fan. You can always make
a set
> of statistics suit your predetermined conclusion if you play with them
> enough.
>
> Can anybody other than a Jeff Gordon fan explain what is broke before
we try
> to fix it ?
>
>
How about a grudge holding Rusty Wallace fan?
NASCAR's Scoring system is equivelent to feel good, everyone get's a
trophy, mom's wearing a sweater tied around the neck, Junior fatboys
soccer. Owner's points are even more pathetic. They get points for
NOT making the race. Yeah, that's a great system.
--
Ren
Ren's Fantasy Stats
http://members.xoom.com/RenoldJonsin
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Big Nick
wrote:
>Next up.
>
>How do they determine the starting positions for the Daytona 500 ?
>How do the 125's work ?
>How do the provisionals work ?
>
>I'm telling ya, this needs to be in the FAQ, Nick. It's coming, and
>will be an hourly question from every newbie starting immediately
>after the front row spots are set in regular qualifying.
>
Perhaps I'll add links into Jayski's site that explain these, and other
topics quite well.
-NK
Keeper of the Lake RASN Aquarium
Unofficial r.a.s.n FAQ: http://clamper.com/rasnfaq
"I'd like to thank Viagra for their help in getting
my first pole!!" - Jeff Fuller, #27 Pontiac
Renold Jonsin
Dr. Gelakeiwicz <love...@erols.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 28 Dec 1999 14:40:29 -0500, "v" <v...@vxy.net> wrote:
>
> >I keep seeing posts about a better points system. The current seems
to be
> >working pretty well unless you are a Gordon fan. You can always make
a set
> >of statistics suit your predetermined conclusion if you play with
them
> >enough.
> >
> >Can anybody other than a Jeff Gordon fan explain what is broke
before we try
> >to fix it ?
> >
>
> Ditto to it not being broken.. This is the first year in a long time
> the championship was sewn up before the final Atlanta race. I think it
> works fine, too.
>
Long time being 1998?
1 Jeff Gordon 5328
2 Mark Martin 4964
Of course, Gordon won more races than anyone in '98 also. Usually, the
driver with the most wins will win the championship, however, it
doesn't always happen that way.
Many of the complaints about the present point system don't have to do
with the fact that 2nd can get as many points as many points as 1st but
rather that the point system encourages drivers in unsafe cars (no nose
on a restrictor plate track) to go back out for more points by picking
up a position or two. If Rusty hadn't have moved over at Daytona,
possibly costing him the race, this could have been graphically
illustrated by at least two drooling vegetables (Jeff Gordon & Ricky
Rudd) in adjoining beds at the nursing home.
<snip>
> gloatgloatgloat WOOHOO
Darren King
Cups! The problem with the points system is fully represented this year
by Dale Jarrett. No one had spoken of it while Gordon was winning
titles because he won the most races as well.
The current points system encourages drivers to stroke for points and
owners to get untalented second drivers as teammates (ie...Skinner) just
to get the test time they need. You get bonus points for leading 1 lap but
not for winning a race!
My suggestions:
1. A large bonus for winning the race...maybe 25 to 50 points. Winning is
why they race and when they do, it should be rewarded.
2. Take away the 5 point bonus for leading under yellow. This rule is just
stupid. This is the cheapest way in all sports to score points.
3. Take away all provisionals. If you're not fast enough, go home.
4. Take away qualifying motors. Race with what ya brung.
5. No race can be won under yellow. This rule is successfull in other
NASCAR divisions...bring it up to where it matters.
6. Take away the testing advantage multi-car teams have.
7. Franchise. I'm sick of anyone with a few bucks thinking they can go
racing. It's taking away jobs from guys who try to do it the hard way.
These changes will, IMHO bring home a true champ every year. Jarrett
had a great year, but he stroked for the last 10 races big time.
Darren
R a p p y
"Dr. Gelakeiwicz" <love...@erols.com> wrote in message news:rq4i6sch40to982fo...@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 28 Dec 1999 14:40:29 -0500, "v" <v...@vxy.net> wrote:
>
> >I keep seeing posts about a better points system. The current seems to be
> >working pretty well unless you are a Gordon fan. You can always make a set
> >of statistics suit your predetermined conclusion if you play with them
> >enough.
> >
> >Can anybody other than a Jeff Gordon fan explain what is broke before we try
> >to fix it ?
> >
> I think I qualify as an "other than a Jeff Gordon fan"
>
> Ditto to it not being broken.. This is the first year in a long time
> the championship was sewn up before the final Atlanta race. I think it
> works fine, too.
Try last year too..............
gee ....how fast we forget.
I don't think the whole points system needs to be redone........ but i do
think they should reward winning the race with more points.
Perhaps something for the pole too...........
It would be nice to see them give these guys a reason to hang it out more,
and to try to win instead of settling for second or third like they do sometimes.
BTW..........as Gordon fan the points system has served him well so that's not why i
wouldn't mind some changes........ i think it would produce better racing.
Tony
--
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Big Nick <ra...@NOF-ingSPAMclamper.com> wrote in message
news:3869248c....@news.sonic.net...
> On Tue, 28 Dec 1999 14:53:53 -0500, Dr. Gelakeiwicz <love...@erols.com>
> wrote:
>
> >Next up.
> >
> >How do they determine the starting positions for the Daytona 500 ?
Qualifying is completed and the two fastest cars on 1st round qualifying
start 1st & 2nd.
> >How do the 125's work ?
The Twin 125's determine positions 2 thru 36 (I think). The winner of the
1st Twin 125 starts 3rd and each finisher in the 1st twin 125 gets the odd
number starting spot back to 35th. The 2nd Twin 125 winner starts 4th and
each finisher in the 2nd Twin 125 starts in the even number starting spots
back to 36th.
> >How do the provisionals work ?
Provisionals for the Daytona 500 are based on owner points from 1999.
Positions 36th (I think) thru 42nd are provisionals and 43rd is the honorary
Darrell Waltrip starting spot.
I "believe" that's how things are done for the Daytona 500.
Tony
Brian P. Sweeney
> I keep seeing posts about a better points system. The current seems to be
> working pretty well unless you are a Gordon fan. You can always make a set
> of statistics suit your predetermined conclusion if you play with them
> enough.
>
> Can anybody other than a Jeff Gordon fan explain what is broke before we try
> to fix it ?
Under no points system would Gordon have won the Championship this year.
By all that's right, Bobby Labonte had the best year and deserved the
Championship.
Gordon did, however, get robbed in '97, and it sounds like Rusty got
ripped off in '94 and '93.
Brian P. Sweeney
<Renold...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Owner's points are even more pathetic. They get points for
> NOT making the race. Yeah, that's a great system.
You have got to be kidding.
Brian P. Sweeney
<dar...@pathcom.com> wrote:
> 1. A large bonus for winning the race...maybe 25 to 50 points. Winning is
> why they race and when they do, it should be rewarded.
Yeah!
>
> 2. Take away the 5 point bonus for leading under yellow. This rule is just
> stupid. This is the cheapest way in all sports to score points.
Yes, but sometimes a heated battle on pit row is pretty thrilling, no?
>
> 3. Take away all provisionals. If you're not fast enough, go home.
Yeah!
>
> 4. Take away qualifying motors. Race with what ya brung.
You're on a roll.
>
> 5. No race can be won under yellow. This rule is successfull in other
> NASCAR divisions...bring it up to where it matters.
Nope. Yellow, for better or worse, is a legitimate part of the race. If I
plan my fuel strategy just right, and some morons wreck each other on the
penultimate lap, then I might not have enough fuel to last out the yellow
laps and the restart.
A guy might bring out a yellow if he knows the leader is playing such a
strategy.
Yellows suck, but I respect them just the same.
>
> 6. Take away the testing advantage multi-car teams have.
Yeah, by letting everyone test whatever they want, whenever they want.
>
> 7. Franchise. I'm sick of anyone with a few bucks thinking they can go
> racing. It's taking away jobs from guys who try to do it the hard way.
Who cares? Let the market sort it out.
>
> These changes will, IMHO bring home a true champ every year. Jarrett
> had a great year, but he stroked for the last 10 races big time.
Yep.
Gummy
>I keep seeing posts about a better points system. The current seems to be
>working pretty well unless you are a Gordon fan. You can always make a set
>of statistics suit your predetermined conclusion if you play with them
>enough.
>
>Can anybody other than a Jeff Gordon fan explain what is broke before we try
>to fix it ?
>
>
Perhaps there should be two Winston Cups. One would be the
"Consistency/reliability" Winston Cup. The other would be the
"Racer's" Winston Cup.
Seriously, outside of motor racing, what other sport gears their top
prize toward consistency, not necessarily winning? I'm not asking
this because I think there are none, I just cannot think of any.
Drop the 5 point bonus for leading a lap. It means nothing most of
the time except for the last and most difficult lap, and for that
there is no bonus. Seems odd.
Gummy
Lloyd R. Parker
: I keep seeing posts about a better points system. The current seems to be
: working pretty well unless you are a Gordon fan. You can always make a set
: of statistics suit your predetermined conclusion if you play with them
: enough.
:
: Can anybody other than a Jeff Gordon fan explain what is broke before we try
: to fix it ?
:
You can win the championship without winning any races.
You can win the championship while winning fewer races than other drivers.
You're encouraged to run around in duct-tape cars at slow speeds,
interfering with others who are racing, to pick up a few points.
You're rewarded for losing.
v
Darren King <dar...@pathcom.com> wrote in message
news:84bhg0$9o5$1...@newsmaster.pathcom.com...
> 1. A large bonus for winning the race...maybe 25 to 50 points. Winning is
> why they race and when they do, it should be rewarded.
Ok but how about a negative bonus for not finishing any race you start?
> 2. Take away the 5 point bonus for leading under yellow. This rule is
just
> stupid. This is the cheapest way in all sports to score points.
no
> 3. Take away all provisionals. If you're not fast enough, go home.
yes
> 4. Take away qualifying motors. Race with what ya brung.
yes
> 5. No race can be won under yellow. This rule is successfull in other
> NASCAR divisions...bring it up to where it matters.
no
> 6. Take away the testing advantage multi-car teams have.
Let anybody test when they want.
> 7. Franchise. I'm sick of anyone with a few bucks thinking they can go
> racing. It's taking away jobs from guys who try to do it the hard way
Who's going to decide who can have a team?
Anybody that can pay for a team that can qualify on the track should be
able to run.
James Ferguson
Brian P. Sweeney <rascpro...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:rascproponents-...@208.208.57.211...
> In article <84bhg0$9o5$1...@newsmaster.pathcom.com>, "Darren King"
> <dar...@pathcom.com> wrote:
>
> >
just
> > stupid. This is the cheapest way in all sports to score points.
>
>
>
There will *always* be a heated battle on pit road for track position. The
part thats stupid is when people just wait and pit a lap late to gain the 5
points by leading before they pit under caution.
bobb
now THAT'S interesting.
hmmm.
"v" <v...@vxy.net> wrote in message news:386a6...@news1.prserv.net...
>
> Darren King <dar...@pathcom.com> wrote in message
> news:84bhg0$9o5$1...@newsmaster.pathcom.com...
> > 1. A large bonus for winning the race...maybe 25 to 50 points. Winning
is
> > why they race and when they do, it should be rewarded.
>
> Ok but how about a negative bonus for not finishing any race you start?
>
> just
> > stupid. This is the cheapest way in all sports to score points.
>
NORMA
Seems like I remember that last year Jeff Gordon had the championship
sewed up before the last race at Atlanta.
Darren King
is
> > why they race and when they do, it should be rewarded.
>
> Ok but how about a negative bonus for not finishing any race you start?
Why? You just finish were you finish. If you're 1st to wreck, you're last.
I
don't understand your point.
>
> > 2. Take away the 5 point bonus for leading under yellow. This rule is
> just
> > stupid. This is the cheapest way in all sports to score points.
>
> no
What are you talking about. To equate this rule to another sport, this
would be the same as shooting the puck into the net during a commercial
break and getting credit for a goal (that's hockey for you southerners!).
> > 3. Take away all provisionals. If you're not fast enough, go home.
>
> yes
>
> > 4. Take away qualifying motors. Race with what ya brung.
>
> yes
>
> > 5. No race can be won under yellow. This rule is successfull in other
> > NASCAR divisions...bring it up to where it matters.
>
> no
Again, a cheap way to win. This has never happened to me at a Cup race
but if I paid money (and it's a LOT of money to go to a cup race) and the
race
ended under yellow, I'd be furious...it's a rip-off to fans...not unlike a
tie.
> > 6. Take away the testing advantage multi-car teams have.
>
> Let anybody test when they want.
>
> > 7. Franchise. I'm sick of anyone with a few bucks thinking they can go
> > racing. It's taking away jobs from guys who try to do it the hard way
>
> Who's going to decide who can have a team?
> Anybody that can pay for a team that can qualify on the track should be
> able to run.
NASCAR should. They are the governing body. How did you feel when
Elliot lost his sponsor to someone who's never raced before? How about
Rudd? These people built the sport. Keep bringing CART owners and
CART drivers over and this sport will be about as exciting as CART. Wait
until one of these owners' cars get's tagged...the owner will be screaming
blue
murder for a rule change! They only came over because NASCAR is way
more lucrative than CART or IRL. Do they really think Scott Pruett or
Robby Gordon will win a race? Then why bother.
Darren