LPG for ROTARY ?

[Fred Snerk]

I have a RX4 I think that a rotary on gas would have a lot of advantages as
well in my case of the tank being able too fit where the petrol tank
currently is behind the back seat.

Instead of the carby manifold I could run the fuel injection one and easily
find a gas system with enough flow for the 13b at high revs which would
greatly inprove flow with no difficulty at low revs as the gas will not form
droplets on the manifold as petrol could do and runs from cold without
choke, a wilder port with good manners and very low maintenence would be
possible and

the rotary fuel induction includes oil injection in to the motor to keep
sliding surfaces lubricated. Petrol disolves oil from these surfaces making
constant replenishment necessary ( although in an old and worn motor like
mine, enough oil leaks through the o rings and my injection doesnt work and
it doesnt matter ) With gas the surfaces will stay more evenly and cleanly
in the motor. There will not be carbon build up because once ignited gas
always burns completely. So Reduced friction, greater performance, and
vastly increased engine life due to better surface lubrication and the
absence of abrasive carbon Piston engines and the spark plugs and exhausts
on them are always expected to last longer in piston engines and I think the
well known lubrication advantage to the valves and cylinder valves in them
would be even more of an advantage in the rotary where a reduction in
friction would tend to increase compression by letting the seals follow any
variations more freely thus sealing better and

the cost of getting fuel injection to get the inlet manifold it (or gas)
allows (much better flow than a carby manifold which needs high flow to keep
petrol droplets in suspension and not wetting the manifold wall and
therefore restrictive diameter) would not be a lot different to installing
the tank and other bits (about $2000 Australian for a good system fitted and
certified for registration) and then the gas costs less than half than the
petrol one to run.

So what do you all think?

[Mike Gray]

Fred Snerk wrote:

> I have a RX4 I think that a rotary on gas would have a lot of advantages as
> well in my case of the tank being able too fit where the petrol tank
> currently is behind the back seat.
>
> Instead of the carby manifold I could run the fuel injection one and easily
> find a gas system with enough flow for the 13b at high revs which would
> greatly inprove flow with no difficulty at low revs as the gas will not form
> droplets on the manifold as petrol could do and runs from cold without
> choke, a wilder port with good manners and very low maintenence would be
> possible and
>
> the rotary fuel induction includes oil injection in to the motor to keep
> sliding surfaces lubricated. Petrol disolves oil from these surfaces making
> constant replenishment necessary ( although in an old and worn motor like
> mine, enough oil leaks through the o rings and my injection doesnt work and
> it doesnt matter ) With gas the surfaces will stay more evenly and cleanly
> in the motor. There will not be carbon build up because once ignited gas
> always burns completely.

Actually, (and depending on the gas) you can get condensation of the gas
throughout the system. No fuel burns "completely" although if the fuel/air ratio
is perfect you minimize (not eliminate) nasty stuff, and that's as true of
petrol as of propane etc. To achieve what you say you want, you need
extraordinary fuel metering capability, which is only marginally easier with
natural gas/propane etc. This is why modern "clean" engines are constantly
monitoring the quality of burn and telling the induction system to adjust mix,
induction air temp, etc.

> and then the gas costs less than half than the
> petrol one to run.

If you can get aay with it. As soon as you use gas for fuel, you have to pay the
motor fuel taxes on it and yer back where you started.

> So what do you all think?

Wonderful project. Waiting to see the dyno data. No kidding.

regards
m

[Wim Vanhoeck]

Australia seems to have several shops offering LPG conversions.
I have seen a 13b turbo/LPG powered Rx-3 somewhere. Maztech or Selectmaz ??

Fred Snerk <sn...@wr.com.au> wrote in message
news:7m7l02$elc$1...@the-fly.zip.com.au...

[Dave]

In Oz,
LPG cost approximately 26 to 31 cents per litre, and Unleaded 60 to 80
cents per litre depending on which state you're in. This makes LPG a
viable fuel for price.

Mike Gray wrote:

>
> Fred Snerk wrote:
>
> > I have a RX4 I think that a rotary on gas would have a lot of advantages as
> > well in my case of the tank being able too fit where the petrol tank
> > currently is behind the back seat.
> >

--
Dave

****

It's all just a load of Klatchian to me...

****

[Mike Gray]

Dave wrote:

> In Oz,
> LPG cost approximately 26 to 31 cents per litre, and Unleaded 60 to 80
> cents per litre depending on which state you're in. This makes LPG a
> viable fuel for price.

In the US, if you use it for motor vehicle fuel, you have to pay the motor vehicle
fuel taxes and yer right back where you started.

regards
m

[Alan Marr]

Yes, SelectMaz in Australia does conversions, for example an RX-5.
http://www.selectmaz.com.au

American conversions:
http://atkinsrotary.com/

Eco-Max sells a one-rotor engine that runs on LPG or CNG.

Alternative Fuels and Rotaries:
http://www.monito.com/wankel/alterfuel.html

--
Rotary Engines http://www.monito.com/wankel 105 pages, demos, 86K words
"Television? The word is half Latin and half Greek. No good can come
of it." attr. C.P. Scott (1846-1932).

[Wayne Ward]

How does it compare to gasoline for energy? I know that one liter of
alcohol does not equal one liter of gasoline. I think in the U.S. propane
costs nearly as much per gallon as gasoline as well.
WW

[Paul Ratcliffe]

Found a nice pic of a gas 13B:

http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/1309/mg_rx3.html

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In article <378DCDD0...@uq.net.au>, Dave <d.bu...@uq.net.au> wrote:

> In Oz,
> LPG cost approximately 26 to 31 cents per litre, and Unleaded 60 to 80
> cents per litre depending on which state you're in. This makes LPG a
> viable fuel for price.
>

>> If you can get aay with it. As soon as you use gas for fuel, you have to pay
the

[David]

Check onerotor.com, they build LPG powered Mazda engines for generators.
Propane(HD-5 grade) has about 92,000 BTU/gallon, compared to roughly 130,000
BTU/gallon for gasoline. Benefits of propane are long engine life, smooth running,
and can cost less than gasoline. The federal road tax was lowered on propane so it
could compete more favorably with gasoline.
David Hast, Alto LP Gas Co.