Opinions on F150 vs T100
Rictor
I'm not a regular here, but I need advice from the experts.
I'm looking for a full size pick up. I'll be honest, I'm not gonna'
use it for heavy hauling. I need a heavy duty 4x4 as I live in the
mountains (lots o snow) and I recreate a lot and need to haul
light duty stuff. I want a larger truck that can handle the long
climbs up passes without blinking, but I don't need a monster.
I also need a decent xtra cab for hauling the occasional extra pass.
or to keep gear or my dog warm.
Any advice on the following:
1. FordF150 vs. Toyota T100 ?
These two seem to have it hands down over other full size pickups
*on paper* and from reviews I've read. I like everything about the
F150 over the T100, except the f150 may be longer than I need (Want
a short bed). I'm also not thrilled that the T100 does not offer a
pass. side airbag. Is the T100 still worth looking at over the F150 ?
I also know that the T100 only comes in a 3.4 v6 making 190hp while the
F150 offers up the 4.6 and 5.4 v8 making maybe 220/230 hp.
As there appears to be only a minimal diff. in gas milage (both not great)
will I be unhappy with a six. I recall reading that the f150 Triton v8
just provides the same power at 'more useful revs', but not sure what
this transates to.
2. Auto vs manual
I've been driving manual transmissions for years, but wonder if an auto
will make driving these size autos easier. Will I be missing anything
with an automatic tran performance-wise ? Anyone have experience with an
auto climbing high passes in the mountains ?
Thanks all, glad I found this group, and sorry I'm asking
so many questions.
--
Rick Eisenberg
ric...@colorado.net
Muskie
t-100's are selling BELOW invoice right now. Seems alot of people
have gotten wind of the new v-8, and are waiting till next year to
purchase the truck. Many t-100's are sitting on the lots right now.
I saw a brand new t-100 SR5 4x4 extra cab with power everything,
including 6 disc changer, for 20,500.00 I hear people are actually
getting LandCruisers at invoice due to the fact that Cruiser lovers
got wind of the new v8 for next years cruiser model, and are patiently
waiting, so Yota has a Cruiser surplus sitting on the lots.-----Muskie
John Hascall
Rictor <ric...@remove-me.colorado.net> wrote:
}These two seem to have it hands down over other full size pickups
}*on paper* and from reviews I've read. I like everything about the
}F150 over the T100, except the f150 may be longer than I need (Want
}a short bed). I'm also not thrilled that the T100 does not offer a
}pass. side airbag. Is the T100 still worth looking at over the F150 ?
}I also know that the T100 only comes in a 3.4 v6 making 190hp while the
}F150 offers up the 4.6 and 5.4 v8 making maybe 220/230 hp.
}As there appears to be only a minimal diff. in gas milage (both not great)
}will I be unhappy with a six. I recall reading that the f150 Triton v8
}just provides the same power at 'more useful revs', but not sure what
}this transates to.
So far, (just 2.5 weeks) we are very happy with our '98 F150.
Ours is an ext cab, short bed, V8/4.6L, auto, 4x4 off-road. I don't
think we saw any ext cab, long beds (do they even make that combo?).
The off-road package includes 17" wheels for plenty of (snow)
clearance.
Positives:
+ Zero defects (so far, anyway).
+ Passenger side airbag with keyswitch.
+ Nice big mirrors.
+ Plenty of power, can "haul a ton" easy.
+ Rides better than we thought it would.
+ Backseat bigger and more comfortable than we expected.
+ 3rd door standard.
+ Good ergonomics (imo) [see exception below].
+ Good looks.
+ Lots of really nice colors to choose from.
Negatives:
- Our Thunderbird has "reading lights" over the back seat windows,
our son really misses not having these in the F150.
- No in-dash CD player available.
- Wish there was a way to "latch" the passenger side
seatbelt "arm" up to the ceiling for loading/unloading.
- Stupid "off-road" sticker.
- You push to switch lo/hi-beams instead of pull. ?why?
- No 4th door.
- Keyless entry option is useless.
- In-dash cupholders don't hold a terribly big cup.
- I prefer seatbelts you can cinch across your waist.
Not-Sayings:
* It sits so high the mother-in-law has trouble getting in. :)
* I'm now one of those tall-ass vehicles that used to
annoy me so much.
}2. Auto vs manual
}
}I've been driving manual transmissions for years, but wonder if an auto
}will make driving these size autos easier. Will I be missing anything
}with an automatic tran performance-wise ? Anyone have experience with an
}auto climbing high passes in the mountains ?
The auto is rated for more weight than the manual.
The auto can be locked out of overdrive, which I presume
you'd want to do on mountain passes, but I'll find out
about that next Sept. :)
We've had only a 5spd car for the last 12 years, but other
than occasionally annoying my wife by still resting my
hand on the gearshift, the adjustment was no problem.
John
--
John Hascall, Software Engr. Shut up, be happy. The conveniences you
ISU Computation Center demanded are now mandatory. -Jello Biafra
mailto:jo...@iastate.edu
http://www.cc.iastate.edu/staff/systems/john/welcome.html <-- the usual crud
grady wright
Hello,
I'm the gratful and fully satisfied owner of a 1997 F150. I chose
the V-6 because at 205 horsepower and a 355 geared rear end, a simple
power chip has given me 223 horsepower( the exhaust system probably
helped alittle).My point is that this new Ford is the best handling
truck I've ever owned and the standard shift 5 speed lets me blow most
stock V-8s off the road even top end on the interstate. As a Ford owner
I may seem bias but this is a tight light truck, I don't think you will
regret it.Just sign me :Born again Ford lover.
Spencer
P.S. I might recomend an extended warranty as high altitude and extreme
temperature can take it's toll on any vehicle.(7 year 70k)
Steve Winters
Rictor wrote:
>
> I'm not a regular here, but I need advice from the experts.
> I'm looking for a full size pick up. I'll be honest, I'm not gonna'
> use it for heavy hauling. I need a heavy duty 4x4 as I live in the
> mountains (lots o snow) and I recreate a lot and need to haul
> light duty stuff. I want a larger truck that can handle the long
> climbs up passes without blinking, but I don't need a monster.
> I also need a decent xtra cab for hauling the occasional extra pass.
> or to keep gear or my dog warm.
>
> Any advice on the following:
>
> 1. FordF150 vs. Toyota T100 ?
>
> *on paper* and from reviews I've read. I like everything about the
> F150 over the T100, except the f150 may be longer than I need (Want
> a short bed). I'm also not thrilled that the T100 does not offer a
> pass. side airbag. Is the T100 still worth looking at over the F150 ?
> I also know that the T100 only comes in a 3.4 v6 making 190hp while the
> F150 offers up the 4.6 and 5.4 v8 making maybe 220/230 hp.
> As there appears to be only a minimal diff. in gas milage (both not great)
> will I be unhappy with a six. I recall reading that the f150 Triton v8
> just provides the same power at 'more useful revs', but not sure what
> this transates to.
>
>
> I've been driving manual transmissions for years, but wonder if an auto
> will make driving these size autos easier. Will I be missing anything
> with an automatic tran performance-wise ? Anyone have experience with an
> auto climbing high passes in the mountains ?
>
> so many questions.
>
> --
> Rick Eisenberg
> ric...@colorado.net
Rick,
I have a 96 Chevy K1500 SWB 350 5-speed 3.73 gears. This is a great
truck. I've read several reviews of full size trucks lately, and I have
not noticed any of the reviewer's criticizms of the Chevy. Some have
complained that the ride is too bouncy. My truck is a short wheel base
regular cab, short bed. The trucks reviewed were always extended cabs.
Longer wheel base is supposed to provide smoother riding, so who knows?
Chevy brake pedals have come under fire for feeling "spongy", but in my
observation, that allows finer control of the braking force. The ABS
in the GM compact pickups and their derivitives (Blazer/Jimmy) have a
bad reputation for working too well in gravel and snow. On my truck,
the ABS works flawlessly. The action of the ABS is shut off at speeds
under 4 MPH (according to the owner's manual). I've tested the ABS on
dirt and snow in 2WD, 4WD Hi and 4WD Lo and operation is exactly as
expected in all cases. The engine is smooth, quiet, and powerful. I've
driven the San Juan Mountains in Southwest Colorado and only had to
shift out of fifth gear for traffic and winds in the road. I get 15 MPG
in town and 19 on long trips, 16.1 overall in 25K miles. At the time I
bought my truck I shopped all of the big three and Toyota. Similarly
equipped (North) American trucks cost about the same, the T100 was
about $2K more (and did not offer a regular cab in 4WD) or a V8.
My truck was delivered with two minor defects, loose weather stripping
above the doors and a small paint defect, both taken care of by the
dealer. I've had two warentee repairs, a leaky pinion seal and a stuck
tailgate latch.
I realize your question was about F150 vs. T100. Don't eliminate the
other trucks in this decision. Give them all a test drive. And get the
5-speed with a V8. You will love it.
And keep asking questions.
I hope this helps.
--
Cheers,
Steve
82 Z28
96 K1500
The opinions expressed here are mine alone and do not represent those of
my employer or any one else.
Remove "*" from address to reply.
"It riles them to believe that you percieve the web they weave..."
Moody Blues
David Bolman
I would go for the F150 or any full size american truck. there is no
import that can compete with them. I looked at a T100 at an auto show
when they first came out, I was not impressed. the seats are too low and
the cab is smaller than my big GMC. It also had a higher price than a
similarly equipped GM pickup . When I was told it had a 6,000 pound tow
rating, I laughed so hard I nearly puked. This thing has a small engine,
3 liters at that time and I believe it is 3.4 now. I have an 86 buick
regal, a mid size car, with a 3.8 liter engine. Only about 10,000 T100
trucks sold the first year. Toyota knew they had a dog and tried to buy
5 liter v8 engines from GM but GM didnt go for it.If you consider
mountains, altititude, snow and the extra weight and friction of the 4
wheel drive system, you need all the power you can get. You'll rev that
little engiine to death. For a truck there is no substitute for low rpm
torque and no replacement for displacement.
Jim Correia
] If you plan on towing more than 2500lbs up and down mountains REGULARLY,
] I'd look into the F150 with a V-8 or wait until next year when Toyota
] introduces its own V-8 to the T100, or will it be a T150 then?
I've heard it will be called a T150 and be available sometime in the
middle of the model year.
--
Jim Correia Bare Bones Software, Inc.
cor...@barebones.com <http://www.barebones.com>
Muskie
I recall a Field and Stream review of the T-100 with the v6 where
they towed a 5000 pound camper up and down passes in Colorado at
around 10,000 or 11,000 feet. The driver commented that he had to look
behind him several times to make sure the camper was still in place!
He said it felt like he was towing nothing at all. He said the
t-100 "sprinted" up the pass with ease. Important note: The reviewer
was using the manual trans, and he said that the automatic toyota
offers with the 6 "robs" the t-100 of power, and would not have the same
results as the stick at high altitude. He kept the vehicle at 65MPH in
third gear with no problems at all. It was a stock t-100.
He also claimed the truck was more like a sports car, and rocketed
around the mountains. I believe it was in the 96 Field and Stream
4x4 section, in one of the summer months. The reviewer claimed that
the manual/v6 combo was perfectly designed for towing and
good torque. Check it out. -------Muskie
John Hascall
Sven Nathaneil Setterdahl <sven...@prairienet.org> wrote:
}John Hascall (jo...@iastate.edu) wrote:
}: Negatives:
}: - Our Thunderbird has "reading lights" over the back seat windows,
}: our son really misses not having these in the F150.
}: - You push to switch lo/hi-beams instead of pull. ?why?
}What year is your T-bird? I know '93+ have the same type of switch as in
}the F150. It's pretty much a standard thing on all new Fords.
'87 Turbo Coupe.
}: - No 4th door.
}: - Keyless entry option is useless.
}Not after an ice storm that leaves a 1/4" thick layer of ice over your
}doorlocks.
The keyless entry on the turbo coupe has the 5-button pad
on the door, which has saved my bacon a few times...
I mean, where are most people going to put the little
keyless fob -- on their keyring where it'll be hanging
just below the keys when you forget them :(
I don't know if this is true for Fords, but a friend
told me on his Dodge if the key is in the ignition,
the fob refuses to work (even if you were smart enough
to keep them separate!).
Jerry Bransford
Rik Hamm wrote:
>
> I used to think you were right about American trucks until I got tired of
> repairing the drive train on my 96 Jimmy. I thought the 4.3 engine was hot
> and it never gave me any problem. Thought I would lose performance when I
> went with the 3.4 in the 4runner but to my surprise, the 3.4 has better
> pickup and towing power. The 3.4 tows my 3800 pound boat with no strain. The
> 4.3 struggled. I was pleasantly surprised and the 4runner is twice the
> truck. I hate to admit it but the US is losing ground again. The only
> defense we have against better quality is higher tariffs and that is indeed
> sad.
My 4.3L Blazer did a terrible job towing my boat (woefully underpowered)
but then my 4.0L equipped Jeep Cherokee did a great job with plenty of
power, even when driving around the mountains of the Southwest. You
just have to get a vehicle with a good engine like the Jeep's 4.0L.
Japan doesn't make all the world's good vehicles, the US has some good
ones too LOL! By the way, I turned the 3.4L equipped 4Runner down to
tow my boat with. After driving it, I didn't really think it had near
the power of the Cherokee for those long steep climbs I was doing (even
though it was rated to tow the boat ok).
Jerry
--
Jerry Bransford
PP-ASEL, C.A.P., KC6TAY
The Zen hotdog... make me one with everything!
Squash
For mountain towing i would get a 3/4 ton truck. The new Fords and
Chevys will ride better than the dodges in most cases because of their
IFS front suspension. The small price that you will pay to upgrade to a
3/4 ton is well worth peace of mind to me! Also, whatever you get, T100
or whatever, get a manual tranny. I have found manuals to outlast
automatics in almost all cases. Also, the automatic (to the best of my
knowledge) robs you of some power. That is the reason almost all
truck-pullers use manuals over autos.
And for driving in the mountains, any turbocharged diesel will do great,
and sometimes much better than a 454, 460, or v-10 dodge. they also use
much less fuel. But I think that you need to be very careful with
service intervals, because the deisels are more sensitive to oil changes
and such.
And remember, there's no replacement for displacement!
--
Andy Quaas
Mike Muise
Sven Nathaneil Setterdahl <sven...@prairienet.org> wrote:
> John Hascall (jo...@iastate.edu) wrote:
> : - Our Thunderbird has "reading lights" over the back seat windows,
These lights (up front) were a pricey option on my '98 Dakota; I'm
planning to add some after market ones, which should be really easy.
> : - No in-dash CD player available.
Again, easily remedied (and for less than Ford would charge). A CD
head unit + install should be possible for under $300.
> : - Stupid "off-road" sticker.
Take these off with fingernails. Polishing compound will clean the
glue residue.
> : - Keyless entry option is useless.
> Not after an ice storm that leaves a 1/4" thick layer of ice over your
> doorlocks.
In my experience (we get a couple of ice storms per winter here), if the
door locks are covered, the doors are going to be frozen shut anyway.
You need warm (not hot!) water and an ice scraper with a good blade.
*Or*, you need remote start and the foresight to leave the heat on full...
cheers,
mike
--
# mike muise, Unix Guy // mike....@digital.com
perl -e 'print pack"c*",grep{$l=0;$o=96⩝for(split//){$o+=$l=($n=(9..65
,(-15..9,1..6,10)x2)[ord])>$l?$n-2*$l:$n}$_=$o}@R=(X,xxi,xix,xx,I,
xiv,xv,xx,viii,v,ixix,XVI,v,ixix,xii,VIII,i,iii,xi,v,ixix,X7654)'
Sanchopnz
>1. FordF150 vs. Toyota T100 ?
Get the F-150. Wehave several that we use in my company for oilfield service
trucks. We've had very little trouble with them. And they've got a third
door.>2. Auto vs manual
>2. Auto vs manual
Get the auto. No clutch parts to break; the price of an overhaul will be high,
but you may need several clutch replacements(remember, you're going to the
mountains- lots of stop and go).
Good luck - hope I've helped.
Sancho.
Matthew S. Staben
>In article <01bce9f6$5c886300$d694...@rictor.colorado.net>,
Get the T-100. I live in an apartment with a new brick-red F-150
parked next to my '97, two-tone green T-100 SR5. The more you compare
the two, the uglier that ford becomes. It becomes uglier, and uglier,
and I'm not kidding. The bulbuous rear window area that juts over the
bed; the round mirrors; and the bulbuous front. And that's what it
is, a bulbuous monstrosity. The windshield, and rear-seat windows
have this type of tinting made of a mask with holes in it.
All compared to my Toyota ...
The mirrors are chrome, simple, and effective. The body is straight,
and styled with a style one would expect out of Dr. Porsche. (the
ford, on the other hand, was designed by a urinal company) Inside,
there aren't ten fucking cup-holders, just two. (look at the new
Chevy king-kabs; there's four cup holders in various swing-out places
for the rear occupants! There's, four in the dash, two in the console
-- and two more that swing down from top ... or was that a sunglass
holder? [I suspect there are more!] The interior is utilitarian, and
the hidden features are wowzers. Here's one: if you've taken the key
out, but you've not yet opened the door, the electric window continues
to work. Only when you've opened the door, does the window become
de-activated. Another: If the key's still in the ignition, you can't
lock the door. Another: If you're playing the tape, and the end is
reached, the stereo will switch to the radio if you so choose (so you
can listen to your tunes whilst gripping the steering-wheel.)
The Toyota is the most innocuous, but best handling truck I've driven.
And that's another thing. It drives like a car.
>>These two seem to have it hands down over other full size pickups
>>*on paper* and from reviews I've read. I like everything about the
>>F150 over the T100, except the f150 may be longer than I need (Want
>>a short bed). I'm also not thrilled that the T100 does not offer a
>>pass. side airbag. Is the T100 still worth looking at over the F150 ?
Most fatalities involving air-bags are occuring in pickup trucks. The
reason for this is the cab is roomy and one is tempted to sit their
child on the lap (knowing it's hard to stop the truck). To me, the
lack of a passenger air-bag is a blessing -- no ugly square panels,
and a full-sized glovebox. Frankly, airbags in pickups are actually
detrimental simply because most impacts with a pickup will be minimal
but still enough to pop the bags causing injury. And if one's in an
accident where the truck is seriously fucked, I think anyone inside
would be as well whether or not the airbags were there. That's one
thing that bugs me: Airbags are *not* the comprehensive lifesaver
everyone thinks, unless the car is a Gremlin or something like that.
>>I also know that the T100 only comes in a 3.4 v6 making 190hp while the
>>F150 offers up the 4.6 and 5.4 v8 making maybe 220/230 hp.
But those are 190 quick horses. I've yet to push my pedal to the
metal. But, pushing it down causes the engine to immediately
rev to where the power is. I can smoke the tires with my auto.
>>As there appears to be only a minimal diff. in gas milage (both not great)
>>will I be unhappy with a six. I recall reading that the f150 Triton v8
>>just provides the same power at 'more useful revs', but not sure what
>>this transates to.
If you're pulling a large trailer (ie, motorhome), the T-100 is too
small. If you're pulling a bass rig, you can't beat it. The other
day, I took a ride on a logging trail that was too narrow for standard
trucks to get through without scrapes but just wide enough for my
T-100.
>>2. Auto vs manual
>>
>>I've been driving manual transmissions for years, but wonder if an auto
>>will make driving these size autos easier. Will I be missing anything
>>with an automatic tran performance-wise ? Anyone have experience with an
>>auto climbing high passes in the mountains ?
It's known that autos do perform less willingly than a manual, but
this auto is different. To get this truck, I traded in my Turbo Laser
with a manual 5 speed. I've found that with judicial pressing of the
gas pedal, one can get the gears they desire. In fact, towing a boat
up a long hill from Banks Lake (Grand Coulee Dam shunt) the truck was
being "slowed" down but if acceleration was absolutely necessary, I
was able to push the pedal down and "request" the engine to rev into
the red-line. This is the first car with an automatic transmission
I've seen do this. Most just bounce back and forth between gears
based on the torque feedback onto the converter; this one is
electronically controlled. Here's another wowzer: in cruise control,
the control will allow the truck to slow down to a speed so that the
transmission can shift up without jumping into the high revs. So,
going up a hill at 70 pulling a boat in cruise control might cause the
truck to drop to 65. Most cruise controls will simply give the car
more gas so it'll get back up to 70, damn the revs. This one
judiciously waits until I drop to 55, and then attempts to hold it
there until either I nudge it on with my gas pedal whereupon the shift
happens and I accelerate, or the truck slows down enough to allow a
shift into a lower gear without doing heavy revs. You've got to
experience it to understand it.
Matt
mst...@poboxes.com
proud owner of a '97 T-100.
Joe Lukas
The T-100 should be offering the 350 V-8 next year, and with Toyota's
reputation for quality it looks like a winning combination.
--
Joe Lukas
'68 FJ-40
http://www.pcez.com/~lukas/joe.htm
Ken Payne
Joe Lukas <lu...@pcez.com> penned:
That "quality" is bogus. T100s have notoriously weak axles.
http://www.ford-trucks.com - Ford Truck Enthusiasts
-Ken, Admin 1967 Ford F100, 390FE V8
To send me email: webmaster*spam-remove*@ford-trucks.com
Check out the free Ford Truck Enthusiasts Web Site/Email Lists.
Questions, answers, chat and Ford speak. 1300+ members and growing.
F-series, E-series, Rangers, Broncos, Bronco IIs, Rancheros,
Explorers, Expeditions, Econolines and pre-F series are all covered.
Muskie
@@That "quality" is bogus. T100s have notoriously weak axles.
http://www.ford-trucks.com - Ford Truck Enthusiasts
-Ken, Admin 1967 Ford F100, 390FE V8
To send me email: webmaster*spam-remove*@ford-trucks.com
Where is your proof? Please show a few facts to support the above
claim and I may believe your statement. Thanks--------Muskie
Chris Cimakasky
This guy with the t-100 has no idea what he is talking about. All the
options on his little t-100 he said he had, you could find on an 84
Yugo.
The wimpy ass t-100 is only half the truck the F-150 is. If that......
Rick Jones
VBRINDLEY wrote:
>
> >The T-100 should be offering the 350 V-8 next year, and with Toyota's
> >reputation for quality it looks like a winning combination.
>
> V-8, not a 5.7 liter? Has the Toyota/GM thing gone that far? Would GM
> actually sell their most famous and popular engine to the competition?
>
> vince
> '85 S-15 Jimmy
> '68 1/2 ton GMC (2wd -bummer)
> '93 Ford SHO
> Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean everyone's out to get you......
Expect to see a new T-150, yes, I said 150 in 98, it will have a V-8 and
will have 4 doors, rear will be the suicide type and looks real close to
the new Ford F-150's body lines.
--
Rick Jones, Toyota Master/ASE Master/L-1
CHECK OUT MY "NEW" WEBPAGE AT
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Check out the Super Duty F250, it and the F350
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as optional engines.
Rick Jones wrote:
> VBRINDLEY wrote:
> > >The T-100 should be offering the 350 V-8 next year, and with Toyota's
> > >reputation for quality it looks like a winning combination.
> > The last item I read about this was that Toyota was coming out with a 4.7 liter
> > V-8, not a 5.7 liter? Has the Toyota/GM thing gone that far? Would GM
> > actually sell their most famous and popular engine to the competition?
> Expect to see a new T-150, yes, I said 150 in 98, it will have a V-8 and
> will have 4 doors, rear will be the suicide type and looks real close to
> the new Ford F-150's body lines.
--
-Karl Fengler---------------- BRONCO*351 - FXDWG -
---------------------------- karl_f...@hp.com -
-!! You Have Strayed Upon The Motorway To HELL !!-
su...@osws.com
I'm going to have to agree with you here. I own a '97 F150 extended cab,
with the Triton 4.6L V8. It is simply the best truck I have ever driven.
I am upgrading to the 5.4L V8 after the new year (ordered the new truck
2 weeks ago). The 4.6L Triton V8 is not really underpowered...I just made
the mistake of driving a friend's 5.4.
The F150 is a great truck all around. The T100 owner was way off. (My
windows have that stealth feature he touted as well.) Hey, the T100 is
nice, but it is no F150.
In article <659pdg$ag9$1...@newsd-106.bryant.webtv.net>,
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
Jim Janecek
In article <8812732...@dejanews.com>, su...@osws.com wrote:
(snip)
> The F150 is a great truck all around. The T100 owner was way off. (My
> windows have that stealth feature he touted as well.) Hey, the T100 is
> nice, but it is no F150.
>
> In article <659pdg$ag9$1...@newsd-106.bryant.webtv.net>,
> CLC...@webtv.net (Chris Cimakasky) wrote:
(snip)
> > The wimpy ass t-100 is only half the truck the F-150 is. If that......
You're BOTH right
the 1997 Ford F-150 leads the pack this year in official recalls by the NHTSA:
Six of 'em!!!! that's quite impressive. Six extra trips back to the Dealer.
Compare that to the 1997 Toyota T100: NONE!
according to NHTSA web site data as of DEC 5 1997.
--
Jim Janecek 57 BMW Isetta---59 Austin Healey Bugeye Sprite
results of the 97 Microcar & Minicar Club National Meet are at:
http://www.tezcat.com/~janecek/1997micro.html
John Grove
> > The F150 is a great truck all around. The T100 owner was way > > off. Hey, the T100 is nice, but it is no F150.
> > > The wimpy ass t-100 is only half the truck the F-150 is.If that
If either one of you F150 owners wants to tie bumpers together with my
T-100, let me know. I live in Northern Virginia. I'll bet the T-100 can
drag a F150 through the dirt backwards:-) A Toyota truck always was and
still is made to go off-road. How much time does your F150 spend in the
dirt?? Honestly.
This is another point to consider:
> You're BOTH right, the 1997 Ford F-150 leads the pack this year in official recalls by the NHTSA:
> Six of 'em!!!! that's quite impressive. Six extra trips back to the Dealer.
======================================================================
« I intend to live forever...so far, so good.
« It wasn't actually a divorce, I was traded.
« Life in the fast lane is OK but, I prefer oncoming traffic.
« The light at the end of the tunnel may be a muzzle flash.
« The only substitue for good manners is fast reflexes.
« Even if you object, there are no qualifiers to free speech.
======================================================================
JohnG
======================================================================
Jim Janecek
In article <348ABE...@staffnet.com>, nospam@mymail wrote:
>
> If either one of you F150 owners wants to tie bumpers together with my
> T-100, let me know.
They're not home, I think they're in the waiting room at the FORD service dept.
Ken Payne
John Grove <jgr...@staffnet.com> penned:
>> > The F150 is a great truck all around. The T100 owner was way > > off. Hey, the T100 is nice, but it is no F150.
>
>> > > The wimpy ass t-100 is only half the truck the F-150 is.If that
>
>
>If either one of you F150 owners wants to tie bumpers together with my
>T-100, let me know. I live in Northern Virginia.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
It shows, you didn't need to tell us.
http://www.ford-trucks.com - Ford Truck Enthusiasts
-Ken, Admin 1967 Ford F100, 390FE V8
To send me email: webmaster*spam-remove*@ford-trucks.com
Ron Hanson
John Grove <jgr...@staffnet.com> wrote in article
<348ABE...@staffnet.com>...
> > > The F150 is a great truck all around. The T100 owner was way > >
off. Hey, the T100 is nice, but it is no F150.
>
> > > > The wimpy ass t-100 is only half the truck the F-150 is.If that
>
>
> If either one of you F150 owners wants to tie bumpers together with my
> drag a F150 through the dirt backwards:-) A Toyota truck always was and
> still is made to go off-road. How much time does your F150 spend in the
> dirt?? Honestly.
>
i hope you're not serious
Jim Janecek
In article <01bd03fa$81cc5040$6da088c6@beetle>, "Ron Hanson"
<rha...@tiny.net> wrote:
> HAHAHAHA
>
> i hope you're not serious
tiny.net???????????
^^^^^
I hope you're not serious
Jim
Jan...@GiganticTruck.com
--
su...@osws.com
A heck of an offer, but I am going to have to pass on the whole bumper
tied-together deal.
Does this here river go to Aaintreeee?
> If either one of you F150 owners wants to tie bumpers together with my
> T-100, let me know. I live in Northern Virginia. I'll bet the T-100 can
> drag a F150 through the dirt backwards:-) A Toyota truck always was and
> still is made to go off-road. How much time does your F150 spend in the
> dirt?? Honestly.
> ======================================================================
> « I intend to live forever...so far, so good.
>
> « It wasn't actually a divorce, I was traded.
>
> « Life in the fast lane is OK but, I prefer oncoming traffic.
>
> « The light at the end of the tunnel may be a muzzle flash.
>
> « The only substitue for good manners is fast reflexes.
>
> « Even if you object, there are no qualifiers to free speech.
> ======================================================================
> JohnG
> ======================================================================
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
Ron Hanson
Jim Janecek <jan...@GiganticTruck.com> wrote in article
<janecek-0812...@janecek.tezcat.com>...
Ron Hanson
rha...@2storyford.com
*check out www.f150online.com owners gallery page 7*
John Grove
Ron Hanson wrote:
>
> John Grove <jgr...@staffnet.com> wrote in article
> <348ABE...@staffnet.com>...
> > > > The F150 is a great truck all around. The T100 owner was way > >
> off. Hey, the T100 is nice, but it is no F150.
> >
> > > > > The wimpy ass t-100 is only half the truck the F-150 is.If that
> >
> >
> > T-100, let me know. I live in Northern Virginia. I'll bet the T-100 can
> > drag a F150 through the dirt backwards:-) A Toyota truck always was and
> > still is made to go off-road. How much time does your F150 spend in the
> > dirt?? Honestly.
> >
>
> i hope you're not serious
Of course I'm serious. Your truck may be heavier, but that will only
help if you don't let a tire slip. If you start to spin, your bumper is
mine:-) Check the hp/lb rating of the T100 against a standard F150. How
about ground clearance? Or fenderwell clearance? How about 4L gearing?
Or clutch start "cancelling"? Does your F150 have zirk fittings for a
chassis lube after taking the truck for a swim? A F150 is pretty but a
Toyota is made for dirt. Or maybe you don't think Toyota learned
anything while producing a couple of zillion Land Cruisers and small
4x4s?? Please!
And the Ford nut that drives a 67 F100, do you have a new F150 4x4 that
you would like to test?? There's plenty of mud here in Northern VA if
you are game.
--
Richard Gallaher
I just purchased a Ford F150 4x4 Lariot extended cab. The purchase date
was 1 Sept. 1997. From that date this $32,000 F150 has been in the shop
for over 30 days and has operated corectly 10 days from the date of
purchase. I can't talk about off road capabilities because my
transmition will not operate on the road. At present 4x4 low does not
operate and will be returning the truck to ford under GA state LEMON
law. I don't have experiance with the T100 but, will now give it a
try!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ken Payne
John Grove <jgr...@staffnet.com> penned:
Sorry, but such contests are for shouting drunks at monster
truck shows.
Ford has been producing trucks since before Toyota existed... they've
been playing the game far longer than Toyota. The 8", 8.8" and
9" rear axles are all monsterously strong. The Toy's is a carry-over
from the smaller trucks.
You left out something very important: low end torque. That's why my
big block V8 will always out-haul your Toy. When you can bark 1st and
2nd on an automatic with 35" tires let me know, until then stick to
hauling jet ski's and groceries.
Funny, you don't see many 30 year Toyotas (of any model). I guess
their supposed reliability really is a myth.
John Grove
> Sorry, but such contests are for shouting drunks at monster
> truck shows.
>
Nobody shouting or drunk here and I resent the implication, I just
wanted to have some fun in the mud. Of course, it takes a bigger man to
walk away right?? You know that line was invented by a coward don't
you?? I think such contests are for cutting through the bullshit. It's
called "put up or shut up".
> You left out something very important: low end torque. That's why my
> big block V8 will always out-haul your Toy. When you can bark 1st and
> 2nd on an automatic with 35" tires let me know, until then stick to
> hauling jet ski's and groceries.
What *exactly* do you use your old truck to haul? My T100 has been
buried to the door jambs in good VA mud/clay. I hauled 2200lbs of #2b
gravel off road and nothing broke, nothing complained. I bought the
truck to hunt with and I use it hard. I also need the dependability for
driving back and forth to work. The new F150 will not fulfill both
requirements. A full size Dodge with the Cummins will whip my little
Toyota hell west and crooked. A F150 with the modular V8 will not (my
bet). I'm not saying the T100 is the ultimate truck, it's just better
suited to off road than the new F150. And since the original discussion
started on the new F150 vs the T100, you jumping in with your old muscle
truck is perfectly legit. Not! OK, I have a test for you. How about gas
mileage. I drive my T100 about 90 miles a day. Does your big block with
35" tires get 18-20 mpg? No, I didn't think so. That "monsterously
strong" 9" rear is heavy. That big block is heavy. Heavy=lousy gas
mileage. Heavy=poor highway handling. So, I guess I like the Toyota
because it is a good balance. Plus, it is honestly designed for
off-road. Now, about that challenge:-) Still no takers?
Rick Jones
In 98 T-100 will come (mid year) with a V-8, dubbed T-150 (strange
relation here) will be a 32 valve engine should make some HP too...
Landcruiser gets the same, T-150 should be all new sheetmetal as will
the Landbruiser.
Rick Jones
Gee, that cant be true, haven't you emailed Ken yet???
As for Truck on the road that are 30+ years, well, if you look back, how
many Toyotas were imported in the 60's?????
Try this again in 20 years, you'll be suprised!!! A toyota comes into
our shop with 150K, its considered about average mileage, many have much
more, my daughter has an 85 Tercel with 287,000 miles, same engine,
never been overhauled, heading for the half million mile mark now, may
have to O/H it before then, but who knows??
Guess which car whooped the Taurus as #1 in sales, (((booooom))) CAMRY,
but Honda accord just whooped it up in the most stolen category for
97.....
--
Rick Jones
Rick Jones
John Grove wrote:
Tear them up John!!!
--
John Hascall
John Grove <nospam@mymail> wrote:
}What *exactly* do you use your old truck to haul? My T100 has been
}buried to the door jambs in good VA mud/clay. I hauled 2200lbs of #2b
}gravel off road and nothing broke, nothing complained.
Whoop-de-do, fer chrisakes, I've hauled 1/2 ton of building
materials in the trunk of our old T-bird (nothing broke,
but got more than a few what-the-f-are-you-doing stares
about the 4"x4"s hanging 5' out the trunk :)
} I bought the
}truck to hunt with and I use it hard. I also need the dependability for
}driving back and forth to work. The new F150 will not fulfill both
}requirements. A full size Dodge with the Cummins will whip my little
}Toyota hell west and crooked. A F150 with the modular V8 will not (my
}bet).
Oh come now, what's so tough about your huntin or commutin'?
It's not like you live in Belize or Borneo.
} ... OK, I have a test for you. How about gas
}mileage. I drive my T100 about 90 miles a day. Does your big block with
}35" tires get 18-20 mpg?
Well, I've just got the "puny" (220hp) modular V8 and 32" tires,
but, yes, 18 mpg is about right.
}35" tires get 18-20 mpg? No, I didn't think so. That "monsterously
}strong" 9" rear is heavy. That big block is heavy. Heavy=lousy gas
}mileage. Heavy=poor highway handling. So, I guess I like the Toyota
}because it is a good balance. Plus, it is honestly designed for
}off-road. Now, about that challenge:-) Still no takers?
Well, I fail to see what your silly challenge has to do with
real-world, off-road ability, but you're at least 30hp on the
short end of the stick...
John
'98 F150 4x4 "off-road"
--
John Hascall, Software Engr. Shut up, be happy. The conveniences you
ISU Computation Center demanded are now mandatory. -Jello Biafra
mailto:jo...@iastate.edu
http://www.cc.iastate.edu/staff/systems/john/welcome.html <-- the usual crud
Jim Janecek
In article <349301a4...@192.168.10.1>,
kpayne*antispam*@mindspring.com (Ken Payne) wrote:
> Funny, you don't see many 30 year Toyotas (of any model). I guess
> their supposed reliability really is a myth.
Yeah- it is funny isn't it?
Funny how you can twist statistics around to suit your point of view. ;-/
Funny how Toyota wasn't selling trucks in the US in the early 60's isn't it?
that would sort of account for the LACK OF 30year old Toyota trucks...
wouldn't it?
Funny.
Funny, Ha Ha. yeah that's a good one Ken.
The funniest one I've heard lately is the joke you get from NHTSA web site
when you look up the 1997 Ford F150 and discover SIX (6) official recalls
by FORD!
I just think that's a laff riot.
Funny how you can twist those statistics, isn't it? ;-/
Ken Payne
jan...@tezcat.com (Jim Janecek) penned:
Pay better attention next time. I said of ***any*** model!
Not just trucks!
http://www.ford-trucks.com - Ford Truck Enthusiasts
-Ken, Admin 1967 Ford F100, 390FE V8
To send me email: webmaster*spam-remove*@ford-trucks.com
Check out the free Ford Truck Enthusiasts Web Site/Email Lists.
Questions, answers, chat and Ford speak. 1400+ members and growing.
All years of F-series, E-series, Rangers, Broncos, Bronco IIs, Rancheros,
Ken Payne
John Grove <jgr...@staffnet.com> penned:
>> Sorry, but such contests are for shouting drunks at monster
>> truck shows.
>>
>
>Nobody shouting or drunk here and I resent the implication, I just
>wanted to have some fun in the mud.
I didn't imply anything. It just reminds me of the silly contests
the drunks at truck shows have so much fun with. The really bombed
ones seem to get a kick out of the "CHEVY!!!!" / "FORD!!!!" shouting
matches.
>Of course, it takes a bigger man to walk away right?? You know that
>line was invented by a coward don't you??
Is that the best you can do?
>I think such contests are for cutting through the bullshit. It's
>called "put up or shut up".
Its called "get real."
1. Pay for my gas to drive there.
2. Pay for my hotel room.
3. Pay for my meals.
4. Pay a week of my salary.
5. Pay for the contractor to cover my position while I'm away from
work.
I don't think you can afford it.
>
>> You left out something very important: low end torque. That's why my
>> big block V8 will always out-haul your Toy. When you can bark 1st and
>> 2nd on an automatic with 35" tires let me know, until then stick to
>> hauling jet ski's and groceries.
>
>What *exactly* do you use your old truck to haul? My T100 has been
>buried to the door jambs in good VA mud/clay. I hauled 2200lbs of #2b
>gravel off road and nothing broke, nothing complained. I bought the
>truck to hunt with and I use it hard. I also need the dependability for
>driving back and forth to work. The new F150 will not fulfill both
>requirements. A full size Dodge with the Cummins will whip my little
>Toyota hell west and crooked. A F150 with the modular V8 will not (my
>bet). I'm not saying the T100 is the ultimate truck, it's just better
>suited to off road than the new F150. And since the original discussion
>started on the new F150 vs the T100, you jumping in with your old muscle
>truck is perfectly legit. Not! OK, I have a test for you. How about gas
>mileage. I drive my T100 about 90 miles a day. Does your big block with
>35" tires get 18-20 mpg? No, I didn't think so. That "monsterously
>strong" 9" rear is heavy. That big block is heavy. Heavy=lousy gas
>mileage. Heavy=poor highway handling. So, I guess I like the Toyota
>because it is a good balance. Plus, it is honestly designed for
>off-road. Now, about that challenge:-) Still no takers?
>
2200 lbs? So what. I see Fords and Chevys routinely do that and more.
Sounds like the kid who brabs because he got his mother's Civic to
bark the tire.
And gas milage? You really think I care? When I want the high milage
I drive my car. When I want neck-snapping, stump pulling power I
drive the truck.
As to your Dodge Cummins argument, put your Toy up to an F250 someday.
And your challenge.... I always get a laugh when someone posts challenges
on the net. Like someone is really going to drive to VA to run in the mud
with you? Yeah, right.
Jim Janecek
In article <3495953d...@192.168.10.1>,
kpayne*antispam*@mindspring.com (Ken Payne) wrote:
> jan...@tezcat.com (Jim Janecek) penned:
>
( Janecek's stuff snipped)
> Pay better attention next time. I said of ***any*** model!
> Not just trucks!
>
But I'm not using a Pen!!!!!!
Jim Janecek
In article <34969595...@192.168.10.1>,
kpayne*antispam*@mindspring.com (Ken Payne) wrote:
> John Grove <jgr...@staffnet.com> penned:
> >Of course, it takes a bigger man to walk away right?? You know that
> >line was invented by a coward don't you??
>
> Is that the best you can do?
well this is the best line I can come up with at the moment:
:P~~ *Phlbbt*
take THAT!
Ron Hanson
Rick Jones <ssau...@switchboard.net> wrote in article
<349442...@switchboard.net>...
> Guess which car whooped the Taurus as #1 in sales, (((booooom))) CAMRY,
> but Honda accord just whooped it up in the most stolen category for
> 97.....
>
>
>
> --
> Rick Jones
>
Guess whats the best selling vehicle in the world?
Ford F150.
Ron Hanson
Muskie
@@Guess whats the best selling vehicle in the world?
Ford F150.
Ron Hanson@@
Take a look at the world around you........Michael Jackson
sells the most albums in the world. Case closed.-----Muskie
Squash
I guess when you compare NEW full-size trucks to each other, the dodge
has to come out on top for drive-train points. Chevy has the great
engines. Ford's F-250HD and F-350s are great drive-trains and frames,
but the engines leave something to be desired. These are just my
opinions and i would never buy a ford or mopar because i know how to
work on chevies! New F-150 aside, the T100 doesn't compete in any
category except gas mileage to full-size trucks (1/2 ton and up).
--
Andy Quaas
Jim Janecek
> I guess when you compare NEW full-size trucks to each other, the dodge
> has to come out on top for drive-train points. ...
(snip)
Hey! start your own thread buddy!
we're arguing bout F150's, T100's and manhood here.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
Jeff Wynn
Jim Janecek wrote:
>
> In article <34954D...@genevaonline.com>, m...@genevaonline.com wrote:
>
> > I guess when you compare NEW full-size trucks to each other, the dodge
> > has to come out on top for drive-train points. ...
>
> (snip)
>
> Hey! start your own thread buddy!
>
> we're arguing bout F150's, T100's and manhood here.
Hell, a Dakota makes the T-100 look like a wuss, how do you
think an F-150 is gonna make it look? The T-100 has a payload
of a whopping 1550# and can tow 4,400#! My V-8 Dakota (now sold,
sniff, sniff) had an advertised payload of 1850# and towing about
6,000#.
Jim Janecek
In article <349590...@intrepid.net>, " ba...@alksdj90sk.com"
<spambait>, ba...@90sdoi.net wrote:
> Jim Janecek wrote:
> >
> > In article <34954D...@genevaonline.com>, m...@genevaonline.com wrote:
> >
> > > I guess when you compare NEW full-size trucks to each other, the dodge
> > > has to come out on top for drive-train points. ...
> >
> > (snip)
> >
> > Hey! start your own thread buddy!
> >
> > we're arguing bout F150's, T100's and manhood here.
>
> Hell, a Dakota makes the T-100 look like a wuss,......
(snip)
So one day, an Elephant and his friend the Mouse were walking through the
Jungle.
Suddenly, the Elephant hears a faint cry for help and realizes that his
friend the Mouse has fallen into a deep hole in the ground.
"Don't worry" says the Elephant,"I'll get you out!"
The Elephant runs home and jumps into his Big Pickup truck with the
Biggest Winch you've ever seen and Giant Mud Tires and the 454 engine and
races back to the Hole in The Ground and proceeds to lower the winch into
the Hole and pulls out his friend, the Mouse.
"Thanks," says the Mouse.
Later that evening , the two friends Elephant and Mouse, are out walking
throught the Jungle again when suddenly there is a terrible crash and the
Elephant starts to call.."Help, Help, I've fallen into a deep dark hole in
the ground"
The Mouse looks over the edge of the Hole in the Ground at his friend the
Elephant.
"Run back and get my Big Pickup Truck" says the Elephant. "Then you can
use the Winch and the Big Engine and Low-end Torque and the Big Tires to
help me get out of here"
Instead of running back to get the Elephant's Big Pickup Truck, the Mouse
unzips his pants and whips out the biggest dick you've ever seen, it
unrolls all-the-way to the bottom of the hole where the Elephant is.
"Grab On" says the Mouse, and the Elephant does and the Mouse pulls him to
safety.
Moral of the story:
You don't need the Biggest Pickup Truck if you've already got a big dick.
Jeff Wynn
Jim Janecek wrote:
> Instead of running back to get the Elephant's Big Pickup Truck, the Mouse
> unzips his pants and whips out the biggest dick you've ever seen, it
> unrolls all-the-way to the bottom of the hole where the Elephant is.
>
> "Grab On" says the Mouse, and the Elephant does and the Mouse pulls him to
> safety.
>
> Moral of the story:
>
> You don't need the Biggest Pickup Truck if you've already got a big dick.
ROTFL, but your dick won't pull my camper. Just like a Toyota :-).
Bullwinkle
<><> HOG FVR <><>
Muskie stinks like a rottin fish!:
>> @@Guess whats the best selling vehicle in the world?
>> Ford F150.
>> Ron Hanson@@
> Take a look at the world around you........Michael Jackson
> sells the most albums in the world. Case closed.-----Muskie
JOKE:
=====
6 Year Old: "Mommmy, is GOD a man or a woman?"
Mom: No knowing how to answer, says,
"Well, GOD is both a man and woman."
6 Year Old: Still confused he asks, "Mommy is GOD black
or white?"
Mom: Again she has trouble with an answer, but comes up with,
"Well son, GOD is both, black & white!"
6 Year Old: Really confused now asks,
"Mommy is GOD gay or straight?"
Mom: Now really has problems with an answer, so just says,
"Son, GOD is both, gay and straight!"
6 Year Old: Now with a smile on his face, and says,
"Mommy I know who GOD is now, Michael Jackson!"
--
-Karl Fengler---------------- BRONCO*351 - FXDWG -
---------------------------- karl_f...@hp.com -
-!! You Have Strayed Upon The Motorway To HELL !!-
Ken Payne
jan...@tezcat.com (Jim Janecek) penned:
>In article <3495953d...@192.168.10.1>,
>kpayne*antispam*@mindspring.com (Ken Payne) wrote:
>
>> jan...@tezcat.com (Jim Janecek) penned:
>>
>( Janecek's stuff snipped)
>
>> Pay better attention next time. I said of ***any*** model!
>> Not just trucks!
>>
>
>
>But I'm not using a Pen!!!!!!
>
>--
>Jim Janecek 57 BMW Isetta---59 Austin Healey Bugeye Sprite
>
>results of the 97 Microcar & Minicar Club National Meet are at:
>http://www.tezcat.com/~janecek/1997micro.html
I think we can safely end this thread. None of us is going to
convince anyone to believe anything different then he/she
already believes. We've already gotten near the "oh yeah,
your mother wears combat boots" stage so maybe we ought draw
the line there.
Cheers,
Ken
Muskie
//ROTFL, but your dick won't pull my camper. Just like a Toyota :-).//
What does your camper weigh? ----Muskie
Jeff Wynn
Muskie steps up to the plate:
> What does your camper weigh? ----Muskie
Just over 5,500#, empty. I'm guessing just over 6,000# with
water, food and gear. My old Dakota pulled it OK, but not with
confidence. So the wife and I got a full sized truck.
Rick Jones
Cant be heavier than an Elephant!
Rick Jones
> >
> > @@Guess whats the best selling vehicle in the world?
> > Ford F150.
Now add reliability, and then it changes the outcome!
Squash
I just figured since comparing apples to oranges (T100 to f-150) i'd
stick with that trend
--
Andy
Squash
yeah, almost
--
Andy
Jeff Wynn
Rick Jones added to his BI and wrote:
>
> Jeff Wynn wrote:
> >
> > Muskie steps up to the plate:
> >
> > > What does your camper weigh? ----Muskie
> >
> > Just over 5,500#, empty. I'm guessing just over 6,000# with
> > water, food and gear. My old Dakota pulled it OK, but not with
> > confidence. So the wife and I got a full sized truck.
>
> Cant be heavier than an Elephant!
Elephants weigh in between 6,000 and 10,000 pounds, an amount I am
not willing to tow with my shlong nor a Toyota.
Liquid
Think about it. Phord could market a turd with a blue oval on it and folks
would buy it. I think that if the new F-150 was so great they could have used
it to make the heavy duty models. It's taken too long to get a "new style"
heavy duty truck out. That kinda tells me it's too weak in the chassis. Power
is okay, reliability may or may not be there, and the confidence is
definately not!
As for the Toyota, I doubt seriously it is capable of doing the same work as
the real full size trucks out there. It's a feeble attempt at gobbling up
some of the vast light truck market. Toyota makes a reliable very light duty
truck. Seeing "one ton" written on teh tailgate of the older models sure puts
the fear of God into my Cummins....
Ahhh... listen to the diesel growl....
To think that I let some poor schmuck take the hit on initial depreciation
and sell it to me cheap...
Buy the new twucks. I'll still come out ahead.
Ron Hanson wrote:
> Rick Jones <ssau...@switchboard.net> wrote in article
> <349442...@switchboard.net>...
>
> > Guess which car whooped the Taurus as #1 in sales, (((booooom))) CAMRY,
> > but Honda accord just whooped it up in the most stolen category for
> > 97.....
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Rick Jones
> >
> Guess whats the best selling vehicle in the world?
> Ford F150.
>
> Ron Hanson
Jim Janecek
In article <34969D...@intrepid.net>, " ba...@alksdj90sk.com"
<spambait>, ba...@90sdoi.net wrote:
Then.....I guess you need ...a "Big Pickup Truck".... ;-/
John Grove
John Hascall wrote:
> Whoop-de-do, fer chrisakes, I've hauled 1/2 ton of building
> materials in the trunk of our old T-bird (nothing broke,
> but got more than a few what-the-f-are-you-doing stares
> about the 4"x4"s hanging 5' out the trunk :)
So you have a 98 F150 and you have to use a T-bird to haul lumber??
> Oh come now, what's so tough about your huntin or commutin'?
> It's not like you live in Belize or Borneo.
I fail to see your point. Stuck in mud is stuck in mud, I don't care
what language the tow truck driver speaks.
> Well, I fail to see what your silly challenge
Why do some people think it's silly to tie 4x4 bumpers together and go
for it?? Seems perfectly reasonable to me, let's see which truck puts
its power to the ground better. What's a bumper cost? $200? I can afford
that, hell the truck was more than 100 times that. How many F150 owners
live in Northern VA?? (a couple of thousand anyhow?) How many have
stepped up to the plate?? Exactly zero:-) Must be because they are so
much more sophisticated and UNSILLY:-) No, I'm sure none of those
computer nerd, defense contractors read this newsgroup:-) (before the
flames begin, I are one!!!)
> has to do with
> real-world, off-road ability, but you're at least 30hp on the
> short end of the stick...
30hp is exactly correct; the 24 valve 3.4L v6 only has 190hp
(56hp/L) compared to your "modular V8" with *all those* 16valves and
220hp (47hp/L, oops). No really, that OHV Ford is really high tech:-)
My truck weighs exactly 4005 lbs (4x4 ext cab, 5sp). What does your Ford
weigh?? Numbers are not published by Ford, I wonder why?? So you expect
us to believe that your heavier (safe bet?), less efficient (see hp/L
numbers above) Ford gets the same gas mileage??
I decided to check some other numbers while I was looking for the
(elusive) F150 weight:
How about towing capacity of 4x4 ext cab??
Toyota = 5000lbs STANDARD, Ford = 1700lbs STANDARD (Ouch!)
How about payload? That 30 hp has to benefit you somewhere I'm sure:-)
Toyota = 1995lbs STANDARD, Ford = 1520lbs STANDARD (Sorry:-)
I'd love to take this further but I am out of numbers (for now). How
about suspension travel? Or ground clearance? Or approach and departure
angle? Or residual value? Or MTBF? Or cost index? Shall we continue?? Or
have you had enough?
JohnG
'95 T100 4x4
John Grove, Unix Systems Integration
======================================================================
« I intend to live forever...so far, so good.
« It wasn't actually a divorce, I was traded.
« Life in the fast lane is OK but, I prefer oncoming traffic.
« The light at the end of the tunnel may be a muzzle flash.
« The only substitue for good manners is fast reflexes.
« Even if you object, there are no qualifiers to free speech.
======================================================================
Rick Jones
Hey John, you forgot reliability and resale value, bet the Toyota is way
up there! :-)
Jim Janecek
> John Grove wrote:
> >
> > John Hascall wrote:
> >
> > > Whoop-de-do, fer chrisakes,
> > I fail to see your point.
> > Shall we continue??
Yeah, sure this is great, anybody need a beer? I'm going to the fridge.
Ken Payne
mi...@mail.ntsource.com (Muskie) penned:
>
>@@Guess whats the best selling vehicle in the world?
> Ford F150.
> Ron Hanson@@
>
> Take a look at the world around you........Michael Jackson
> sells the most albums in the world. Case closed.-----Muskie
>
Actually Garth Brooks has outsold Jackson that last couple of
years.
John Hascall
}> materials in the trunk of our old T-bird (nothing broke,
}> but got more than a few what-the-f-are-you-doing stares
}> about the 4"x4"s hanging 5' out the trunk :)
}So you have a 98 F150 and you have to use a T-bird to haul lumber??
Ummm, it's a '98 (i.e., pretty recent), this is Iowa,
building season is pretty much over -- this was before
we bought this truck, duh?
}> has to do with
}> real-world, off-road ability, but you're at least 30hp on the
}> short end of the stick...
}
}30hp is exactly correct; the 24 valve 3.4L v6 only has 190hp
}(56hp/L) compared to your "modular V8" with *all those* 16valves and
}220hp (47hp/L, oops). No really, that OHV Ford is really high tech:-)
Yeah, so? A .047 model airplane engine puts'em both
to shame in hp/L, doesn't mean its good for pullin stumps.
The Ford V8 is designed with a very flat torque curve
(basically at least 90% of peak torque all the way up
from just above idle).
}My truck weighs exactly 4005 lbs (4x4 ext cab, 5sp). What does your Ford
}weigh?? Numbers are not published by Ford, I wonder why??
4340 if I recall correctly (4x4 ext cab, auto, off-road, etc, etc)
} So you expect
}us to believe that your heavier (safe bet?), less efficient (see hp/L
}numbers above) Ford gets the same gas mileage??
hp/L != less efficient fuel use
A top fuel car gets say 250 hp/L and about .1 mpg, for example.
}I decided to check some other numbers while I was looking for the
}(elusive) F150 weight:
}
}How about towing capacity of 4x4 ext cab??
}Toyota = 5000lbs STANDARD, Ford = 1700lbs STANDARD (Ouch!)
Dunno where you got that number, mine is 6600lbs
}How about payload? That 30 hp has to benefit you somewhere I'm sure:-)
}Toyota = 1995lbs STANDARD, Ford = 1520lbs STANDARD (Sorry:-)
That number is correct (but largely political, because it
is just 6000 lbs payload - weight of truck, so the truck
can be registered as 3tons).
}I'd love to take this further but I am out of numbers (for now). How
}about suspension travel? Or ground clearance? Or approach and departure
}angle? Or residual value? Or MTBF? Or cost index? Shall we continue?? Or
}have you had enough?
ground clearance is 9.3" (again, IIRC),
other numbers I don't have on hand either.
John
--
John Hascall, Software Engr. Shut up, be happy. The conveniences you
ISU Computation Center demanded are now mandatory. -Jello Biafra
mailto:jo...@iastate.edu
http://www.cc.iastate.edu/staff/systems/john/welcome.html <-- the usual crud
Dave
In article <34972E...@staffnet.com>,
JGR...@STAFFNET.COM wrote:
>
> Why do some people think it's silly to tie 4x4 bumpers together and go
> for it?? Seems perfectly reasonable to me, let's see which truck puts
> its power to the ground better. What's a bumper cost? $200? I can afford
> that, hell the truck was more than 100 times that. How many F150 owners
> live in Northern VA?? (a couple of thousand anyhow?) How many have
> stepped up to the plate?? Exactly zero:-) Must be because they are so
> much more sophisticated and UNSILLY:-) No, I'm sure none of those
> computer nerd, defense contractors read this newsgroup:-) (before the
> flames begin, I are one!!!)
At best all this is going to accomplish is two wrecked bumpers, at worst a
bumper will come flying through one of the trucks and kill its driver.
I think this is a more 'real world' challenge:
1000 lbs. of cargo in the bed and tow 5000 lbs.
Time 0-60 ( so we'll have an idea of how it'll merge on the highway) Take
both trucks (with above load) to some mountainous roadway and see how it
will handle steep grades, mark off a route and time it. Do some braking
distances also (on flat land, loaded).
More people will take you up on this one.
> 30hp is exactly correct; the 24 valve 3.4L v6 only has 190hp
> (56hp/L) compared to your "modular V8" with *all those* 16valves and
> 220hp (47hp/L, oops). No really, that OHV Ford is really high tech:-)
What does this prove? efficiency i suppose. What are the lb-ft/L numbers
for each motor. The discontinued 351 (f250) makes 210hp (36hp/L) and
325lb-ft (56lb-ft/L) and it handles a fully loaded (maybe a little over
loaded :) bed just fine. With around 3800-4000lbs of gravel it still has
plenty of gitup n' go, it feels like it stops in the same distance
(compared to unloaded), the steering feels a little light, for obvious
reason :-)
Just for reference The 3 cylinder Geo motor makes 50-60 hp and it's 1
liter in displacement.
Dave
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
Ron Hanson
John Grove <jgr...@staffnet.com> wrote in article
<34972E...@staffnet.com>...
> John Hascall wrote:
>
> > Whoop-de-do, fer chrisakes, I've hauled 1/2 ton of building
> > materials in the trunk of our old T-bird (nothing broke,
> > but got more than a few what-the-f-are-you-doing stares
> > about the 4"x4"s hanging 5' out the trunk :)
>
> So you have a 98 F150 and you have to use a T-bird to haul lumber??
>
>
> > It's not like you live in Belize or Borneo.
>
> I fail to see your point. Stuck in mud is stuck in mud, I don't care
> what language the tow truck driver speaks.
>
>
> > Well, I fail to see what your silly challenge
>
> for it?? Seems perfectly reasonable to me, let's see which truck puts
> its power to the ground better. What's a bumper cost? $200? I can afford
> that, hell the truck was more than 100 times that. How many F150 owners
> live in Northern VA?? (a couple of thousand anyhow?) How many have
> stepped up to the plate?? Exactly zero:-) Must be because they are so
> much more sophisticated and UNSILLY:-) No, I'm sure none of those
> computer nerd, defense contractors read this newsgroup:-) (before the
> flames begin, I are one!!!)
>
> > real-world, off-road ability, but you're at least 30hp on the
> > short end of the stick...
>
> (56hp/L) compared to your "modular V8" with *all those* 16valves and
> 220hp (47hp/L, oops). No really, that OHV Ford is really high tech:-)
>
> us to believe that your heavier (safe bet?), less efficient (see hp/L
> numbers above) Ford gets the same gas mileage??
>
> (elusive) F150 weight:
>
> How about towing capacity of 4x4 ext cab??
> Toyota = 5000lbs STANDARD, Ford = 1700lbs STANDARD (Ouch!)
>
> Toyota = 1995lbs STANDARD, Ford = 1520lbs STANDARD (Sorry:-)
>
> about suspension travel? Or ground clearance? Or approach and departure
> angle? Or residual value? Or MTBF? Or cost index? Shall we continue?? Or
> have you had enough?
>
> '95 T100 4x4
> John Grove, Unix Systems Integration
John,
get ready for some enlightenment. The t-100 should be compared
to a dakota (it would lose there too) rather than a full size.
We'll get to the specs later.
Lets talk fully loaded vehicles for each side since the price is close.
First some comments.
You better hook frames together if you want a pull-off.
That little tin bumper on the t-100 wont last long. :) Thats why its $200
Im sure all the F150 owners in VA have seen your posts and are shaking
in their boots. Looks like theres only 5or 6 ppl following this.
I hope Toyota offers a limited slip rearend. Ford does.
Ford offers P265/70/R17 tires on theres. What about Toyota? 31"
The ford v8 engines are overhead cam not overhead valve. The v-6 is ohv
(4.2L 205hp, 255lbft).
The best engine toyota offers is a 3.4L 190hp,220lb-ft.
The best engine ford offers is a 5.4L 235hp, 330lb-ft.
It looks like you're way short on power, 45hp and 110lb-ft. Dont do a
pull-off on pavement.
But you like mud. Even if you equip the toy with a limited slip
rear end and the same tires expect slippage. There isnt anything that
can make the toyota put more power to the ground.
How do you expect to come out on top
because of the extra mass of the ford? Physics boy.
You say your toy weighs 4005 lbs. A 2wd reg cab ford weighs 3850. A 4x4 ext
cab
weighs in at 4850. The ford has much less of your t-100 to pull through
the mud.
Plus has more contact force with the ground.
4wheelers ramp travel index: http://www.fourwheeler.com/newtrucks/rti.html
F150= 441 higher is better
T100 = 369
Ground clearence
F150 =8.9 minimum 9.4 on my truck
T100 = 8.3
Sorry you lose.
Lets talk specs now for these 2 trucks, loaded the best we can.
Minus leather since its not available in the toyota (is it?).
These number come from www.dealernet.com/testdrive/97/pickup
and www.fourwheeler.com
and a 97 f150 manual
F150 T-100
4x4 ext cab 4x4 ext cab
off road sr5
Price 28,200 29,822
Engine 5.4L ohc v8 3.4L doch V6
hp 235 190
Torque 330 220
Economy 16.5avg(observed) 18avg? (probably not since my 94 4cyl sr5 got 17)
Max payload 2435lb (1700std) 2150lb (1680standard)
Towing cap 6600lbs 4000lbs auto (dont know where you got 5000, manuals
are lower)
Curb weight 4650 4005
Clearence 8.9in 8.3in
Warranty 3/36 3/36
Features Electronic shift auto,4wheel abs
4wd, std 3rd door, power windows,lock mirrors
auto, 4wheel abs AM/FM cassette, driver airbag
limited slip, dual
airbags, AM/fm
cassette, 6 disc cd
changer, 6-way power
seats, remote entry,
Anti theft, autolamp
Toyota doesnt offer many of the features available on the ford.
The 5.4L ford has failsafe cooling. If there is coolant loss it
sequentially pumps
air through each cylinder so you can limp to a repair station. What about
toyota?
Coil on every plug? 100,000 miles between tuneups?
The only item that can be argued in the toyotas favor is reliability. Not
value,
not power, not features.
For the extra money I save i can purchase a 7/75 warranty to offset this.
Wow, this almost felt like a waste of time. If you ever get to minnesota
ill take
you and your t-100 for a spin. :)
Ron Hanson
Dynamic Air, Inc
Mechanical Engineer
WWW.f150online.com Owners gallery, page 7, meet your maker.
Steve Winters
John Grove wrote:
>
<< big snip >>
Looking at your numbers got me to thinking how my truck stacks up
against the F150 and T100. 1996 Chevy K1500 SWB 350, 5-speed 3.73
axles, Z71 off-road.
> I decided to check some other numbers while I was looking for the
> (elusive) F150 weight:
According to Edmund's, the Chevy weighs 4275 lbs. No weight listed for
the Ford, curious. I can't imagine they'd be hiding anything.
>
> How about towing capacity of 4x4 ext cab??
> Toyota = 5000lbs STANDARD, Ford = 1700lbs STANDARD (Ouch!)
>
Standard towing capacity for the Chevy with 350 and 3.73 axles, manual
transmission is 7000 lbs, 7500 for '98.
> How about payload? That 30 hp has to benefit you somewhere I'm sure:-)
> Toyota = 1995lbs STANDARD, Ford = 1520lbs STANDARD (Sorry:-)
>
Payload for the Chevy is 1825 lbs.
> I'd love to take this further but I am out of numbers (for now). How
> about suspension travel? Or ground clearance? Or approach and departure
> angle? Or residual value? Or MTBF? Or cost index? Shall we continue?? Or
> have you had enough?
>
> JohnG
> '95 T100 4x4
> John Grove, Unix Systems Integration
> =
When I was shopping for my truck, I considered the T100, briefly. Seems
Toyota doesn't offer regular cab short bed four wheel drive T100's. I
need the short wheel base to fit the truck in my garage and wanted the
enhanced off-road capability that comes with a shorter wheel base.
Similarly equiped (ignoring the lack of a V8), the T100 invoiced about
$2K more than the Chevy. The price for my truck was $350 over invoice.
How many Toy dealers will match that? 255 vs. 190 HP is very noticable
in daily driving, especially at higher altitudes. I don't tow, so
that's really not an issue, although I know I can if need be. After
reading this thread for some days now, I'm glad I got the Chevy.
I checked one of the on-line services for resale of a 96 K1500 with
24K miles. The retail price was just what I paid. I'd call that
pretty good residual value.
I don't know what the ground clearence is, I've not measured it or seen
the figures published. But looking underneath, it is pretty good. I've
scratched the TC case skid plate a few times, but never hung up the
rear axle (I did scrape the spare once).
--
Cheers,
Steve
82 Z28
96 K1500
The opinions expressed here are mine alone and do not represent those of
my employer or any one else.
Remove "*" from address to reply.
"It riles them to believe that you percieve the web they weave..."
Moody Blues
Jeff Wynn
John Grove wrote:
> How about towing capacity of 4x4 ext cab??
> Toyota = 5000lbs STANDARD, Ford = 1700lbs STANDARD (Ouch!)
Umm, but IIRC the Ford's towing is what it can tow
from the bumper hitch, rather than a reese type.
How much do you suppose you can tow from your bumper?
How many gear ratios did you say were available on the
Toy? How many spring options? A plow? Suspensions
for campers (assuming and would fit in the bed)? Gear
ratio offerings?
How about dump beds? Second fuel tanks? PTOs? Aftermarket
equipment, air lockers, suspensions and gear
swaps? Tool boxes, caps and lift kits...and a partridge
in a pear tree?
Jeff "Jim, I'll take a beer while you're up" Wynn
Spam received at this address will be evaluated with the assistance
of the sender's postmaster, root@, everone listed under the sender's
ISP's
Whois, the ISP's upstream provider and a 320 pound German dominatrix
named Hilde who punishes for spelling errors in unique ways. Have a
nice day!
Steve Zinski
I'd like to put my 2-cents in.
First, I'd like to state that in the past I have totally avoided
"American" built automobiles. I presently own a Mazda RX-7, Honda Accord,
and a brand new Ford F-150.
"Japanese" vehicles (my Honda was built in Ohio) have historically been
better built, more dependable, and ergonomic than most American cars. I
love my RX-7 and Accord.
Unfortunately, my RX-7 is now 15-years old and I'd like to restore it and
drive a new vehicle. I needed something to tow our 4,000-lb. boat/trailer
and something to haul and get around in during bad weather. We also have
a 4-year old son and another on the way. We ruled out mini vans (can't
tow) and SUVs (no real cargo room). We settled on a pickup truck.
Now, we test drove everything that's out there, including the T-100. I
originally wanted to stick with a Japanese vehicle and get the 4-Runner,
but we ruled out SUVs. Naturally, I was then convinced that the T-100 was
it.
The T-100 is too small. The dashboard layout and interior smacked of the
1970's. It had a rough, stiff ride and would not *easily* tow the boat.
Getting our kids in and out would be a chore. It was ruled out.
After that fiasco, we decided we needed a full-sized truck. This left us
with only American made vehicles to consider.
Dodge: Very "truck-like" ride; stiff and awkward. No "third-door"
available on the 97. Ruled out.
Chevy/GMC: Better ride, although still truck-like. Ugly/old appearance,
dashboard and interior looked and felt chintzy. Gauges hard to read.
Ruled out.
Ford: New design, attractive vehicle. As soon as my wife and I laid eyes
on the third-door we were sold. Getting people in and out of the extended
cab's back seat was easy as 1-2-3. The ride was absolutely unbelievable
for a 4x4 truck -- very car-like. Interior was spacious, dashboard was
clean and modern. Very quiet, solid construction. The 5.4-liter with 4x4
3.55 limited-slip rear could tow 7,800 pounds. My only *fear* was that it
was "American".
We bought the Ford.
$25,000 (negotiated price) bought me a 1998 XLT, 5.4-Liter SOHC engine,
automatic O/D transmission (essential for towing), 4x4 package, 3.55
limited slip rear, towing package (class III frame mounted hitch, heavy
duty alternator/battery/cooling system), front bucket seats, A/C, Power
doors/windows/locks, AM/FM Cassette Stereo w/6-disc CD changer, bedliner,
keyless entry, color-keyed carpeted mats, fog lamps, running boards,
aluminum wheels with 16" OWL tires, and more.
My reasoning was that I've got a 3/36K warranty to decide. If it's a
lemon, I'll sell it and keep looking. I've put almost 4,000 miles on it
(daily commute). No problems. It looks and feels "Japanese". A friend has
the older-style F-150. It's a totally different beast. Nothing at all
like what I own. I would not own one.
Now, I do not plan to sink my truck in 3-feet of mud. The only off-
roading I plan to do with it might be a run through the sand at the
beach. However, if I was truly an off-roading type of person, I would not
be doing it in a pickup truck -- I'd have myself a Jeep Wrangler.
You like your T-100. Great. I love my F-150. Different strokes for
different folks. Now, please stop *bashing* my truck. I suggest that you
actually test-drive one with an open mind. That's what I did. I haven't
regretted it.
--Steve
--
===========================================================
To reply via email, remove 'nospam.' from my address:
szi...@nospam.richmond.edu
John Grove
Jeff Wynn wrote:
>
> John Grove wrote:
> > How about towing capacity of 4x4 ext cab??
> > Toyota = 5000lbs STANDARD, Ford = 1700lbs STANDARD (Ouch!)
>
> Umm, but IIRC the Ford's towing is what it can tow
> from the bumper hitch, rather than a reese type.
> How much do you suppose you can tow from your bumper?
Hey great, another contestant:-) Yes, that is the bumper rating of the
Toyota against the bumper rating of the new F150.
>
> How many gear ratios did you say were available on the
> Toy? How many spring options? A plow? Suspensions
> for campers (assuming and would fit in the bed)? Gear
> ratio offerings?
>
> How about dump beds? Second fuel tanks? PTOs? Aftermarket
> equipment, air lockers, suspensions and gear
> swaps? Tool boxes, caps and lift kits...and a partridge
> in a pear tree?
>
>
All good points but, are all of these available for the latest F150
model? I do not need any of these attachments for my uses although one
can make a quick buck with a snowplow:-) As far a dumpbeds, Toyotas have
been used for years as small dump trucks. The payload is more than any
of the other small trucks. I expect someone has made a dump kit for the
T100 by now. Caps are available from Leer and a few others. The Leer is
nicest. Lift kits available from Performance Products as are different
gears, winches, etc.
JohnG
======================================================================
« I intend to live forever...so far, so good.
« It wasn't actually a divorce, I was traded.
« Life in the fast lane is OK but, I prefer oncoming traffic.
« The light at the end of the tunnel may be a muzzle flash.
« The only substitue for good manners is fast reflexes.
« Even if you object, there are no qualifiers to free speech.
======================================================================
JohnG
======================================================================
Pat Palermo
Steve Zinski wrote:
>
>
>
>
> You like your T-100. Great. I love my F-150. Different strokes for
> different folks. Now, please stop *bashing* my truck. I suggest that
> you
> actually test-drive one with an open mind. That's what I did. I
> haven't
> regretted it.
>
>
The ride on the Ford sold me. I bought a 1997 f-150 short box "off-road"
package loaded with all the goodies. Have put on 30,000 on it so far
without a trip back to the dealer for even a rattle. I don't consider
the T-100 full size and wouldn't even put them in the same catergory. As
you said: to each his own!
rutledge
Pat Palermo wrote:
>
> The ride on the Ford sold me. I bought a 1997 f-150 short box "off-road"
> package loaded with all the goodies. Have put on 30,000 on it so far
> without a trip back to the dealer for even a rattle. I don't consider
> the T-100 full size and wouldn't even put them in the same catergory. As
> you said: to each his own!
Pat -
to be really honest, I don't consider even the new F150s "full sized".
Park one along side my dad's '89 and it looks about half way between his
and an imported mini-truck. Not that different, size wise, than your
F150.
The only thing the T100 needs to be considered in the same class as the
F150, IMHO, is a 300+ cubic inch V8 option.
Given the absolute aweful luck dad's having with his '89 F150 4x4, I
wouldn't buy a Ford. He's replaced the front brakes 2-3 times, had to
have the front end rebuilt as well as having the front ... CV joints,
I'd like to call them, rebuilt a couple times. It isn't like he's
tearing it up .. he's too old for that. He just drives it on the
pavement, a few well maintained gravelled roads, and to and from his
boat ... a little dirt road that I *think* I could get my grandma's Ford
Tempo down, though it'd be an interesting ride. Oh, yeah ... he's had
to have the seat redone and the paint is falling off. He's got about
50,000 miles on it total.
Tom
Ken Payne
szi...@nospam.richmond.edu (Steve Zinski) penned:
>You like your T-100. Great. I love my F-150. Different strokes for
>different folks. Now, please stop *bashing* my truck. I suggest that you
>actually test-drive one with an open mind. That's what I did. I haven't
>regretted it.
>
> --Steve
>
>--
>===========================================================
> To reply via email, remove 'nospam.' from my address:
> szi...@nospam.richmond.edu
I will consider buying American before Japanese - not visa-versa.
The quality is there, the price can't be beat and it keeps Americans
working and puts dividends in the pockets of mostly Americans.
Some people call me a bigot or racist for feeling the way I do...
I suggest those people take a long hard look in the mirror because
their anti-American attitude is about as bigoted as it gets. And
what does that say about the quality of their work if they think
American goods/services suck so much?
I'm glad you purchased an American truck, its just a shame that
you did it as last resort. Our Fords have been very good to
us. We're a 2 Ford family, have had other Fords in the past
and will be getting another one soon as our family is growing and
a pickup bench seat and an Escort aren't very comfortable with
4 people, especially when one is in a large child car seat.
Sorry if it comes across as a slam but I've never been very P.C.
and its not intended as a slam.
Pat Palermo
> to be really honest, I don't consider even the new F150s "full sized".
>
> Park one along side my dad's '89 and it looks about half way between
> his
> and an imported mini-truck. Not that different, size wise, than your
> F150.
>
> .
I have parked mine beside many early model F150's and have yet to
find one (stock- other than an F250
4X4) that stood as high or wide. The round body lines are deceiving. The
off-road package gives it about 3-4" height over a non 4X4 model. I'm
not kicking your dad's 89 - I still like the look of the truck, and in
some respects, I do believe they do look more like a truck than mine,
but times change.
Are you shure you're not comparing it to a ranger?
Pat:
88 5L mustang
95 Taurus SHO
97 F150 "off road"
65 mustang coupe
(yes I am a Ford man)
Squash
that's phunny...the chevy 3rd door option was out 6 months before the
f-150 had its 3rd door. Maybe u didn't check all of the options, eh?
--
Andy Quaas
Jim Janecek
In article <349e8a42....@192.168.10.1>,
kpayne*antispam*@mindspring.com (Ken Payne) wrote:
> I will consider buying American before Japanese - not visa-versa.
> The quality is there, the price can't be beat and it keeps Americans
> working and puts dividends in the pockets of mostly Americans.
> Some people call me a bigot or racist for feeling the way I do...
Who? I wouldn't, buy what you want...that's what great about America, we
have a choice. How does that make you a bigot or a racist?
Actually your point of view is more Socialist, I really should just call
you a Communist, but you probably wouldn't get it.
no slam intended, that's just the way it is when you live in a Country
where you can only purchase items built in that County by their workers.
John Hascall
Squash <m...@genevaonline.com> wrote:
}that's phunny...the chevy 3rd door option was out 6 months before the
}f-150 had its 3rd door. Maybe u didn't check all of the options, eh?
The 3rd door is not an option on the F150, it is standard.
In any event, the original poster said:
Chevy/GMC: Better ride [than Dodge], although still truck-like.
Ugly/old appearance, dashboard and interior looked and felt
chintzy. Gauges hard to read. Ruled out.
nothing there about 'no 3rd door'. And who cares when it came
out? Do I care who had A/C first? Nope, not in the least,
all that matters is if you can get what you want when you want it.
I drove a Chevy before we looked at (and bought) the F150 and I
would agree with everything in the paragraph I quoted above.
The Chevy was OK, and perhaps had a little more room in the
back seat, but overall didn't measure up, IMO.
Heck, if the truth be told, my father's clunky old Isuzu Pup
would handle all our *needs*, but it's noisy, ugly, cheap
looking, has zilch for features, and you're scared to death
to go above 60mph in it. The difference is it is my parent's
2nd vehicle, so it sees a few thousand miles a year, while
our F150 is our vehicle (although excepting vacations it'll
only see a few thou a year too -- but no way would I take
the Pup on a 3, or 5, or 7,000 mile trip.
Ron Hanson
Actually Chevy pays a small royalty to ford for every third door truck
it sells. Ford patented something (not sure what) with the third door setup
first.
Fords door is standard, plus has an interior lever for the rear passenger to
open the door
themselves.
Ron Hanson
Squash wrote in message <349EB5...@genevaonline.com>...
>that's phunny...the chevy 3rd door option was out 6 months before the
>f-150 had its 3rd door. Maybe u didn't check all of the options, eh?
>--
>Andy Quaas
Rick Jones
Oh oh, so now if I buy a Chev, Ford or Dodge, and its built in (nothing
against Mexican/Canadian labor) Mexico or Canada, or do I get a Toyota
Tacoma, designed and built in the US, which is helping America.
Assembling them here helps the average middle class, where as assembly
in other parts, ie Canada and Mexico (still American though, remember
the American continent is divided into north, central and south) send
the $$$$$$ to the CEO's in the top. If your really interested, I guess,
just make sure its built in America by looking at the VIN or door jamb
sticker, manufacturers name isnt much help anymore, and as for PC, I'am
politically incorrect as one can get!
***Rick Jones, Toyota Master Tech/ASE Master Tech/L-1***
******************
mailto:ssau...@switchboard.net
Personel Web Page http://www2.netcom.com/~ssauer40/webpage.html
******************************
Our government thinks like this:
If it grows, TAX IT!, If it moves, REGULATE IT!, if
it's sucessful, INVESTIGATE IT!
====================================================================
Chuck Yeager sais:
for original equipment parts:They don't just fit, they match!
====================================================================
Rick Jones sais for original equipment parts:
They don't just fit, they work!
====================================================================
1989 Toyota PU
1997 Toyota Tercel "Blackhawk"
hidda
John Grove wrote:
<Snipped>
>
> How about towing capacity of 4x4 ext cab??
> Toyota = 5000lbs STANDARD, Ford = 1700lbs STANDARD (Ouch!)
>
> Toyota = 1995lbs STANDARD, Ford = 1520lbs STANDARD (Sorry:-)
>
> about suspension travel? Or ground clearance? Or approach and departure
> angle? Or residual value? Or MTBF? Or cost index? Shall we continue?? Or
> have you had enough?
>
> JohnG
> '95 T100 4x4
> John Grove, Unix Systems Integration
Straight from my 1997 Owner's Manual:
F-150 4x4 automatic transmission
Regular Cab F-150
4.6L 3.55 Rear 6,800 lbs Max trailer weight
5.4L 3.55 Rear 7,700 lbs Max trailer weight
SuperCab F-150
4.6L 3.55 Rear 6,600 lbs Max trailer weight
5.4L 3.55 Rear 7,700 lbs Max trailer weight
F-250 4x4 automatic transmission
Regular Cab F-250
4.6L 3.73 Rear 6,900 lbs Max trailer weight
5.4L 3.73 Rear 8,300 lbs Max trailer weight
SuperCab F-250
4.6L 3.73 Rear 6,900 lbs Max trailer weight
5.4L 3.73 Rear 8,300 lbs Max trailer weight
I've had my F-150 for about a year now and it has never broken down.
Warranty repairs consisted of replacing the door seals on the passenger
side to solve a wind noise problem. Repair was excellent and there's
absolutely no wind noise in this truck at 60 mph. I can carry on a
conversation at 60 mph without shouting.
On short trips, it gets approx. 13 mpg. On long trips, about 16.
The ride is excellent on paved roads. On dirt roads, the suspension
soaks up the bumps and it doesn't feel like it's going to bounce off and
slide down a cliff.
The Triton engine doesn't need a tune-up for 100,000 miles and fail-safe
cooling won't leave you stranded if you blow your radiator hose.
With the front bench seat, there's room for 6 adults in the SuperCab.
Shifting in and out of 4 wheel drive is simple and there's no grinding
of gears. Even when going in and out of 4 low.
I tow a 7,000 lb. boat at 55 mph without problem. I leave my friend in
the dust and he has a T-100 and tows a much smaller and lighter boat.
His Toyota struggles when he pulls his boat up the ramp. My Ford
practically pulls my 7,000 lb. load up the ramp in idle.
My Ford has 4 wheel ABS and Driver and Passenger side air bags with a
cut out switch for the passenger side bag. The locking tailgate makes
it harder to steal and the third door makes it easier to use the back
seat.
The ergonomics in this truck is excellent. The only thing I have to
reach for is the rear view mirror. Everything else is within easy
reach.
The bad things about the truck? Very few. Probably the worst was the
price. $30k. The gas pedal and the power took some getting used to.
Sometimes, I still hit the pedal too hard from a standstill and I'll
hear the tires chirp and sometimes downright squeal. Otherwise, it's
been a great truck.
BTW, it replaced a 1987 F-150 that was also a good truck.
In summary, the 1997 F-150 is a pleasure to drive. It's dependable and
comfortable.
hidda
rutledge wrote:
>
> Pat Palermo wrote:
> >
> > The ride on the Ford sold me. I bought a 1997 f-150 short box "off-road"
> > package loaded with all the goodies. Have put on 30,000 on it so far
> > without a trip back to the dealer for even a rattle. I don't consider
> > the T-100 full size and wouldn't even put them in the same catergory. As
> > you said: to each his own!
>
> Pat -
>
> Park one along side my dad's '89 and it looks about half way between his
> and an imported mini-truck. Not that different, size wise, than your
> F150.
>
> F150, IMHO, is a 300+ cubic inch V8 option.
>
> Given the absolute aweful luck dad's having with his '89 F150 4x4, I
> wouldn't buy a Ford. He's replaced the front brakes 2-3 times, had to
> have the front end rebuilt as well as having the front ... CV joints,
> I'd like to call them, rebuilt a couple times. It isn't like he's
> tearing it up .. he's too old for that. He just drives it on the
> pavement, a few well maintained gravelled roads, and to and from his
> boat ... a little dirt road that I *think* I could get my grandma's Ford
> Tempo down, though it'd be an interesting ride. Oh, yeah ... he's had
> to have the seat redone and the paint is falling off. He's got about
> 50,000 miles on it total.
>
> Tom
Very interesting. I had a 1987 F-150 with over 70,000 miles on it and
never had the kind of problems your dad is having. In that time, I had
the rear brakes done twice and the front done once. I rebuilt the
u-joints in the rear drive shaft at about 50,000 miles. Changed the
belts and hoses once.
In comparison to the '87, my '97 is way bigger. It's definitely taller,
wider, and longer (no biggie here since the old was standard cab and the
new is a SuperCab).
As for your dad's truck, I'm amazed that the front cv joints failed.
Doesn't he unlock the hubs? Or are they auto hubs and he doesn't know
how to disengage them (usually by backing up). My '87 had manual hubs
and they hardly had any wear. I think they went to auto hubs in '88 or
'89. Or does he drive it in 4wd on pavement? Just seems strange to
hear about this kind of failure in an F-150.
===============
To email, remove the "s" from mauigateways.com.
===============
Squash
all that i was saying was that the fact that the chevy didn't have a 3rd
door was false. And id i remember corectly the ford with the standard
3rd door means jack shit. if the chevy with the 3rd door option is
cheaper than a ford with the 3rd door standard than you can't use that
as an advantage for a ford! And by the way, since everyone is saying
what they like and don't, i hate the ford's appearance more than
anything on the market! and the seats are very uncomfortable, too! And
the 4.6 and 5.4 have less torque than a 350 vortech and a 360 mopar.
Ugly and unproven.
--
Andy Quaas
Ken Payne
On Mon, 22 Dec 1997 13:30:30 -0500, jan...@tezcat.com (Jim Janecek)
wrote:
>In article <349e8a42....@192.168.10.1>,
>kpayne*antispam*@mindspring.com (Ken Payne) wrote:
>
>
>> I will consider buying American before Japanese - not visa-versa.
>> The quality is there, the price can't be beat and it keeps Americans
>> working and puts dividends in the pockets of mostly Americans.
>> Some people call me a bigot or racist for feeling the way I do...
>
>
>
>Who? I wouldn't, buy what you want...that's what great about America, we
>have a choice. How does that make you a bigot or a racist?
>
>Actually your point of view is more Socialist, I really should just call
>you a Communist, but you probably wouldn't get it.
>
>no slam intended, that's just the way it is when you live in a Country
>where you can only purchase items built in that County by their workers.
>
No, its not communist. I have the option, I am not forced. And you
missed the vital part: I said the quality and price were good.
Ken Payne
>In article <349e8a42....@192.168.10.1>,
>kpayne*antispam*@mindspring.com (Ken Payne) wrote:
>
>
>> I will consider buying American before Japanese - not visa-versa.
>> The quality is there, the price can't be beat and it keeps Americans
>> working and puts dividends in the pockets of mostly Americans.
>> Some people call me a bigot or racist for feeling the way I do...
>
>
>
>Who? I wouldn't, buy what you want...that's what great about America, we
>have a choice. How does that make you a bigot or a racist?
>
>Actually your point of view is more Socialist, I really should just call
>you a Communist, but you probably wouldn't get it.
Ha ha. There are no true Communists except in monastaries and they
barely fit the description. Your lowly attempt at a Political Science
slam has been noted. You need to "get it."
>
>no slam intended, that's just the way it is when you live in a Country
>where you can only purchase items built in that County by their workers.
You obviously don't have a clue as to what Socialism is.
And no, its not socialist. I have the option, I am not forced. And
you missed the vital part: I said the quality and price were good.
And I never said I **only** purchase American goods. In your haste
you've put words in my mouth that I never uttered.
Get real and please.... read only what I write.
Ken Payne
Did you miss the sentence about dividends? I'm quite sure that the
majority of Ford stock holders don't speak Japanese. And the majority
of Toyota employees don't work in the USA.
But then again, I can't win this arguement with you as you work for
Toyota and your honor is at stake.
Phil Holt
Jeff Wynn wrote:
> Hell, a Dakota makes the T-100 look like a wuss, how do you
> think an F-150 is gonna make it look? The T-100 has a payload
> of a whopping 1550# and can tow 4,400#! My V-8 Dakota (now sold,
> sniff, sniff) had an advertised payload of 1850# and towing about
> 6,000#.
Get your facts straight, dude. My '95 T100 SR5 Xtracabhas an advertised
1,960# payload and 5,000# towing capacity using the bumper without a special
hitch. The lowest '95 payload for a T100 was 1,650# for the 4 cylinder 2WD
"standard".What's the margin of ignorance on the "about 6,000#"?
bubba
well I dont really know but I work for a major auto parts supply warehouse
and we sure do sell a lot of parts for f-150's compared to the number of
T-100 parts we sell, now Im sure that some of that is attributed to the
mass of people that have fords and work on them all the time but it does
say something for the quality of Toyota, and as an owner of a T-100 that I
use hard every day Ive had far less problems from my Toyotas than I did
from the fords. And guess what people, even when I had the fords as a rule
the payloads that are advertised are the maximum weight and any of the
trucks will not last if stressed to the maximum very long. The average
person drives the truck mostly empty all the time anyway dont they?
Steve Zinski
In article <349EB5...@genevaonline.com>, m...@genevaonline.com says...
> that's phunny...the chevy 3rd door option was out 6 months before the
> f-150 had its 3rd door. Maybe u didn't check all of the options, eh?
You just said it -- it is an option.
The F-150's third-door is standard.
Anyway, we test drove the Chevy and GMC and weren't impressed; third-door
or not. Same goes for the Dodge Ram -- the 98's have an optional four-
door extended cab but we didn't care for the harsh ride.
--Steve
--
===============================================================
To reply via email, remove the 'nospam.' from my address:
szi...@nospam.richmond.edu
Jeff Wynn
The figures were from 1997 model as referenced by edmunds.
Go argue with them if you don't like their figures. My "margin
of ignorance" is that the truck is no longer in my driveway, so I
can't go look in the handy-dandy manual, but we *did* order the
HD rear springs (1850#) as an option.
Please let us know how towing 5000 pounds with the bumper hitch
turns out.
JW
Steve Zinski
In article <349F27...@switchboard.net>, ssau...@switchboard.net
says...
> Oh oh, so now if I buy a Chev, Ford or Dodge, and its built in (nothing
> against Mexican/Canadian labor) Mexico or Canada, or do I get a Toyota
> Tacoma, designed and built in the US, which is helping America.
My F-150 came with a sticker on the rear window stating that it was
proudly built/assembled by the UAW in Norfolk, Virginia.
--Steve
--
===============================================================
To reply via email, remove the 'nospam.' from my address:
szi...@nospam.richmond.edu
Don Diamant
It's a truck. If you want road isolation buy a car.
Don
Steve Zinski wrote:
<snip>
> Same goes for the Dodge Ram -- the 98's have an optional four-
> door extended cab but we didn't care for the harsh ride.
<snip>
John Hascall
Steve Zinski <szi...@nospam.richmond.edu> wrote:
}ssau...@switchboard.net says...
}> Oh oh, so now if I buy a Chev, Ford or Dodge, and its built in (nothing
}> against Mexican/Canadian labor) Mexico or Canada, or do I get a Toyota
}> Tacoma, designed and built in the US, which is helping America.
}My F-150 came with a sticker on the rear window stating that it was
}proudly built/assembled by the UAW in Norfolk, Virginia.
And ours from Kansas City.
nos...@cp.duluth.mn.us
The Dodge, Chevy, and GMC are trucks that are *supposed* to ride like trucks.
The F150 is basically just a tall car. It was designed to fill a chic market
niche ("trucks" in suburbia); the Dodge and GMs were designed to be used for
*work*.
IMHO, the new F150 is a joke.
Steve Zinski wrote:
> Anyway, we test drove the Chevy and GMC and weren't impressed; third-door
> or not. Same goes for the Dodge Ram -- the 98's have an optional four-
> door extended cab but we didn't care for the harsh ride.
>
Ron Hanson
nos...@cp.duluth.mn.us wrote in message
<34A1599F...@cp.duluth.mn.us>...
Lay off the egg nog :)
Ron Hanson
John Hascall
}Steve Zinski wrote:
}> Anyway, we test drove the Chevy and GMC and weren't impressed; third-door
}> or not. Same goes for the Dodge Ram -- the 98's have an optional four-
}> door extended cab but we didn't care for the harsh ride.
<nos...@cp.duluth.mn.us> wrote:
}The Dodge, Chevy, and GMC are trucks that are *supposed* to ride like trucks.
}The F150 is basically just a tall car. It was designed to fill a chic market
}niche ("trucks" in suburbia); the Dodge and GMs were designed to be used for
}*work*.
}IMHO, the new F150 is a joke.
As much as "us macho real truck guys" might dislike it,
the vast majority of trucks will never see real work,
what you call the niche *IS* the market.
Our F150 ext-cab meets all of our needs, and yes, that
includes grocery-getting as well as being comfortable
enough for that 1000 mile ride to get to an off-road
vacation and hauling building materials and such.
I'm not about to throw a bunch of my money at a
vehicle dedicated to each particular purpose,
THAT would be a joke.
Steve Zinski
In article <349FF8...@genevaonline.com>, m...@genevaonline.com says...
> And by the way, since everyone is saying what they like and don't, i
> hate the ford's appearance more than anything on the market! and the
> seats are very uncomfortable, too! And the 4.6 and 5.4 have less
> torque than a 350 vortech and a 360 mopar. Ugly and unproven.
As for torque; the 4.6-liter is 281 cubic inches. The 5.4-liter is 330
cubic inches. Why would you expect a 281 or 330 cubic inch engine to have
more torque than a 350 or 360 cubic inch engine?
As for beauty; beauty is in the eye of the beholder. You are entitled to
your opinion.
Rick Dusch
>
> IMHO, the new F150 is a joke.
>
Frank & Sharon Morales
Such language, on X-Mas eve no less. Santas gonna' be mad!!!
Frank