Hendrix preferred 6550's over EL34's!
Dave B.
Ted A. Breaux
Dave B. wrote in message <362EC8...@idirect.com>...
>Jimmy Hendrix re-tubed all his amps with 6550's!
>
>check out http://www.serv.net/~hoff/guitar/index.html
A discussion on another BB revealed that an magazine interview, Roger Mayer
disclosed that he switched some of Hendrix's "higher voltage" Marshalls to
Tung Sol 6550s primarily for reasons of reliability, and it wasn't done
until Hendrix came back around to the states. Regardless, if you've ever
heard a Marshall with 6550s overdriven, you can plainly hear that it ain't
Hendrix! Much of Hendrix's dirty sound comes from the Fuzz Face, etc., so
much of this is academic, as the 6550s give more clean headroom, which is an
advantage only if you play at very high volumes and depend heavily on
effects.
Ted B.
N J Salguero
Dave B. escribió en mensaje <362EC8...@idirect.com>...
>Jimmy Hendrix re-tubed all his amps with 6550's!
>
>check out http://www.serv.net/~hoff/guitar/index.html
Do you think Hendrix really had time to select 6550s for use in his tube
amp? Too many things to do. No wonder he died young.
Regards,
Néstor
N J Salguero
Regards,
Nestor
Kamaruddin escribió en mensaje <362FF3B2...@pacific.net.sg>...
>
>
>Dave B. wrote:
>
>> Jimmy Hendrix re-tubed all his amps with 6550's!
>>
>> check out http://www.serv.net/~hoff/guitar/index.html
>
>But, But, But?....He's using Marshall when he's in England.Marshall in
England
>is using EL34.
>
>One Eye Jack
>
>
Dave B.
>
> > Jimmy Hendrix re-tubed all his amps with 6550's!
> >
> > check out http://www.serv.net/~hoff/guitar/index.html
Ah...I see that U DID NOT check out this website!
Here is an excerpt from the file on the subject:
Carl Fiadino wrote:
> y...@gateway.bbt.com (Yontz Sucre) wrote:
>> Cybermonk (cybe...@cybtrans.com) wrote:
>>: Speaking of crackling distortion, that brings me to. . .
>>:
>>: Hendrix's
>>: Marshalls had EL34's, standard until about the 80s, giving "soft"
>>: breakup.
>>
>> I read an interview a while back from a technician who repaired
>> Hendrix' road gear. It was in a big guitar mag, I can't remember
>> which one now. He said all of Hendrix' amps were retubed with
>> 6550s, which Hendrix preferred.
>>
>> I'll have to go home and find the mag again, because the first time
>> I read this I remember I was shocked. If I find it, I'll post the
>> issue and magazine name.
>>
>> -y-
> I read that too in G.P.
> Don't believe every amp tech that comes out of the woodwork with
> a tall tale. Carl
Guitar Shop Oct. 1996
page 38
Cesar Diaz -- SRV's amp tech
"SRV was trying to sound like Jimi, and I knew exactly what Jimi had
done to get that tone. Jimi had taken the original EL34s out of his
Marshalls and installed 6550s. You can't get any closer to a 6L6 than
that, and at that point, a Marshall sounds very round."
He elaborates further.
...............................................................
> But, But, But?....He's using Marshall when he's in England.Marshall
> in England is using EL34.
>
> One Eye Jack
..............
Kamaruddin
Dave B. wrote:
> Jimmy Hendrix re-tubed all his amps with 6550's!
>
> check out http://www.serv.net/~hoff/guitar/index.html
But, But, But?....He's using Marshall when he's in England.Marshall in England
Ned Carlson
<tabr...@neworleans.com> wrote:
>
>Dave B. wrote in message <362EC8...@idirect.com>...
>>Jimmy Hendrix re-tubed all his amps with 6550's!
>>
>>check out http://www.serv.net/~hoff/guitar/index.html
>
>A discussion on another BB revealed that an magazine interview, Roger Mayer
>disclosed that he switched some of Hendrix's "higher voltage" Marshalls to
>Tung Sol 6550s primarily for reasons of reliability, and it wasn't done
>until Hendrix came back around to the states. Regardless, if you've ever
>heard a Marshall with 6550s overdriven, you can plainly hear that it ain't
>Hendrix!
I remember someone on AGA mentioning that they had pictures of the
backs of Jimi's amps that clearly showed EL34's.
But that thread went on for eons, and I don't remember it all!
From that web page:
>Guitar Shop Oct. 1996
>page 38
>Cesar Diaz -- SRV's amp tech
>"SRV was trying to sound like Jimi, and I knew exactly what Jimi had done to get that tone. Jimi had
>taken the original EL34s out of his Marshalls and installed 6550s. You can't get any closer to a 6L6
>than that, and at that point, a Marshall sounds very round."
Geez, this thread could go on for eons too, if we bring SRV
into the discussion. But I know SRV had Marshall Majors with 6550..
but Majors *can't* use EL34. Maybe Mr. Breaux would know
what other Marshall amps SRV might have used.
I think Stevie's Dumble Silver String Singers had 6550,
but I ain't no Dumble expert.
Ned Carlson Triode Electronics "where da tubes are!"
2225 W Roscoe Chicago, IL, 60618 USA
ph 773-871-7459 fax 773-871-7938
12:30 to 8 PM CT, (1830-0200 UTC) 12:30-5 Sat, Closed Wed & Sun
http://www.triodeel.com
Your Start Page for Tube and Tube Amp info on the net...
http://www.triodeel.com/tlinks.htm
Ted A. Breaux
It really academic, as if you play a Marshall equipped with 6550s, it sounds
crappy, and nothing at all like Hendrix. If Hendrix did in fact prefer them
for reasons of more clean headroom, well that doesn't really matter much.
Furthermore, on a separate note, I understood that Stevie Ray was into GECs
KT88s (not 6550s) and would go to great lengths to get them. Awhile back,
on another board, someone hinted that Diaz had a reason for touting 6550s.
Perhaps he had some to sell, or wanted to stir up some business. There is
much more between the lines here that isn't obvious from reading the
article.
Ted B.
BIZZY BEE
his first guitar was made from a broom stick & he played it upside down &
backwards. His only virtue is that he was left handed....Perhaps I should
listen to that 6550 voltage regulator tube again...I'm also a lefty!
Mr. Bee (the EL-34 pusher man)
N J Salguero wrote:
> Dave B. escribió en mensaje <362EC8...@idirect.com>...
> >Jimmy Hendrix re-tubed all his amps with 6550's!
> >
> >check out http://www.serv.net/~hoff/guitar/index.html
>
Ernst C.Land, Jr.
BIZZY BEE wrote in message <3630CCA5...@xnet.com>...
He died young because of drugs. Damn shame, and a waste of a good man and
good talent.
-A6
Ned Carlson
wrote:
>> > Dave B. wrote:
>>
>> > Jimmy Hendrix re-tubed all his amps with 6550's!
>> >
>> > check out http://www.serv.net/~hoff/guitar/index.html
>...........................................................
>Ah...I see that U DID NOT check out this website!
I did. Posted my reply to the Vintage Guitar Amp
email list....probably 500 years of combined guitar amp tech
experience there.
Got the following back:
Rich Koerner wrote:
>Hardly!
>The Tung Sol 6550 was a Great tube for its time. Like the the 427 was
>to the 327 Chevy engines, so is the 6550 to the EL-34. You have to
>reallize that each does its own thing when pushed HARD!! Both sound
>the same at low volume like both engines will do the same thing going to
>the corner store. Now,drag racing them will let you in on what each is
>all about.
>Now, I find all this talk about high power GUITAR RACING is mostly done
>by those who never put their foot on the floor, and went for a ride in a
>Maxed out 427 Vett of Marshall stacks.
>Till you've been there, where is the true meaning to the discussion to
>relate to in the first place? It just turns out to be meaningless talk
>to the clueless!
>Then there is the architectural acoustics of the venue where Jimi was
>recorded. THIS Played more of a part to the sound than the differences
>quoted by most between EL-34's and 6550's. Sometimes the acoustics are
>soooo bad that any LOUD amps will sound that way. 6550 or not!
>> >From that web page:
>> >Guitar Shop Oct. 1996
>> >page 38
>> >Cesar Diaz -- SRV's amp tech
>> >"SRV was trying to sound like Jimi, and I knew exactly what Jimi had done to get that tone. Jimi had
>> >taken the original EL34s out of his Marshalls and installed 6550s
>Hardly.
>Jimi didn't take them out. Nither did anyone else. Marshall's People
>put *in* those Tung Sols, at Marshall USA, before Jimi Got them, from
>Marshall England! He received them with the 6550's already in them.
>That is how this started!
>Jimi's amps went to him through Bob Harrison and Ken Frank here in the
>states. Other dudes are getting the credit for what Bob and Ken did.
>Others picked up on what they did, and later, they got the magazine
>interviews. These men didn't get that interview. They just worked a 9
>to 5 job and had other things to do in their lives when they went home.
>But then, how does a mear magazine interview become the truth to an
>event. Even Clinton_________, (fill in your own choice) on the TV with
>all of America watching.
><footnote side track>
>Look at how much has been made of EVH's Magical Marshall. I'm long time
>friends with a man who worked on that very amp for EVH. Everything,
>except for one cap, is Completely STOCK!!! We laughed so hard. Well,
>so much for the truth in the written media, or for those in this
>industry. EVH wasn't the first, nor will he be the last musician, to
>put other musicians on, when given the chance.
><back to topic>
>Do you really think that these men, Marshalls People, didn't play a
>major part in all this??? You mean to tell me that in the days of the
>POWER TRIOS, When Loud Stacks Were KING, that the people at Marshall
>didn't know how to do such things? They were the ones out in front of
>everyone. Everyone else was just playing catch up. I had talked to Bob
>& Ken through the late 60's and they told me what the deal was with
>6550's and KT-88's.
>Did you know that Marshall had 300 watt amps with the real KT-88's in
>them that were not shipped here in the states. Ken sent me the prints
>on them. I have the originals he sent packed away. One day I'll have
>someone scan them and put them on my site along, with other things.
>Maybe, a book to set the record straight will bring in some money one
>day too.
>I just get tired of all this mis-information!
>That 6550 Tung Sol was designed by Ed Jahns when he worked for Tung
>Sol. He later worked for Fender, and He, brought me in on the design
>project on the GE-6550-A's with the GE people. These people brought me
>up to speed on what real power was from tubes. Now, "there's" more
>stuff I can find for the site, or the book one day when I have nothing
>to do.
>This InterNet sure has become the MUSICIAN'S Mis-Information Super
>Hy-watt! :)
>Sorry for the rant. Just having a bad hair day.
>Regards,
>Rich Koerner,
>Time Electronics.
>http://www.timeelect.com
These aren't my words, but Mr. Koerner really seems to know
his stuff.
His comments ref GE jive with those I've heard that
GE consulted with guitar amp folk when designing
the 6550-A...
Mats Wiklander
> good talent.
"If you wanna run cool, you got to run on heavy, heavy fuel"
Ernst C.Land, Jr.
Mats Wiklander wrote in message ...
And if you wanna die young, do plenty o' drugs.
AMitch9448
his lead
in selecting tubes?
Al Mitchell
NYC
Wilfred
Ned Carlson heeft geschreven in bericht
<3630134c....@news1.newscene.com>...
>
>Geez, this thread could go on for eons too, if we bring SRV
>into the discussion. But I know SRV had Marshall Majors with 6550..
>but Majors *can't* use EL34. Maybe Mr. Breaux would know
>what other Marshall amps SRV might have used.
>
>Ned Carlson
It is possible to use EL34's in a Major. At least, I've seen one with EL34's
in a small vintage guitar shop in Amsterdam. When I tried to explain to the
shopkeeper that it was the wrong type for the amp, he looked at me as if I
were crazy. 'EL34's have always been the type for Marshalls. Who's the
expert here?'. He continues to look at me like I was an inferior species
from another galaxy and said: 'are you going to buy something or talk about
tubes?'
The only thing I ever bought there was an old GEC KT88 for about 5 bucks.
Cheers,
Wilfred
Todd Warnke
Ah ... because he had incredible ears and a sonic imagination that was and
remains unequaled. Because he understood and used tone in ways that only
genius can. Because he knew what he was doing. That's why, and should be
the only reasons that matter. Clothes and recreational drug use do not
(AFAIK) affect tube sound. Oh, BTW, his immediate cause of death was not
drug abuse but mis-prescribed and administered sleeping pills.
Todd Warnke
Tube999
own personal recollections,
1. The first JTM 45s were designed with 5881s, (basically a copy of the '59
Fender Bassman). Later on the switched to KT66s. They even used US made 6L6GCs!
pp 154
2. Marshall initially used the 5881s in their 100W amps too! later they
switched to EL34s (and/or KT77s) for domestic (UK) production.
3. They also deisgned 100s with 88s. 66s and 6550s.
4. The first Super Leads imported to USA had the EL34 setup. (I know because a
friend of mine had one. And I was warned (in 1968) against buying a newer one
because of the 6550 change over).
5. The US importer asked for a design with 6550s as they were easier to get
over here. They switched back to EL34s when the US started making 6CA7s!
6. See pp 116 and 117, for photos of a 100 that "...is reputedly one actually
used by him." (sic Jimmy Hendrix). the photo of the back of the amp has the
rear cover removed to reveal the EL34s and a "lay down" transformer (it looks
just like my '68 Plexi which also has EL34s).
7. in this same book are reproduction spec sheets dated 1981 for the model
"1959 100W Standard Lead Amp" pp 206 and "2203 100w Master Volume Lead Amp 2103
100W Master Volume Lead Amp) pp 207 in the section for Tube Compliment reads:
"Output Power tubes V4, 5, 6, 7: 6550 for USA (EL34, KT77 elsewhere)".
8. It is both naive and an over-simplifing to say that Marshalls with 6550s
have a singular tone given the tonal differences between Tung-Sol 6550s and GE
6550s let alone the MOV/GEC KT88.
9. the same can be said for a EL34 driven 100 considering the use of
EL34s,KT77s, and US made 6CA7s, let alone the German and dutch varieties!
10 JH may have actually prefered (at one time or another), the sound of a 6550
in (one or another) of the Marshalls he used (at some particular venue) in his
too short career, but then he might have changed his mind at some other time,
or some other place or in some other amp too.
Kamaruddin
Todd Warnke wrote:
Dear Todd,
I thought he choked on his own vomit. I guess we'll never know for sure how he
died, Just like Jim Morrison, Marilyn Monroe and Bruce Lee. Too many versions
and reasons.
One "Confused" Eye Jack
Todd Warnke
>
>I thought he choked on his own vomit. I guess we'll never know for sure how
he
>died, Just like Jim Morrison, Marilyn Monroe and Bruce Lee. Too many
versions
>and reasons.
>
>One "Confused" Eye Jack
Dear OEJ -
The most consistent story I see says that the sleeping pills he was taking,
by US prescription, called for a standard dosage of 4 pills. In the UK the
same prescription came at 4x the US strength per pill, allowing for a dosage
of 1 pill. After his US prescription ran out he had a new prescription
filled in the UK. What followed is obvious. Forgetting the dosage change
(or, perhaps, being entirely unaware of it), he took 4 pills, or 4x the
correct dosage, went to sleep, later vomited and choked to death. I've read
this story many places and with several different sources which makes me
think it is more than just a spin to preserve a legacy. But you're right,
like so many of the famous, death is tragic and often without neat ends to
tie it all together. In Jimi's case the real tragedy is that later that
week he was scheduled to go into the studio with Miles! Now that would have
been something to hear. We were this close to hearing the Alpha and Omega
of Jazz/Blues/Rock.
Todd
AMitch9448
Hendrix was, in fact a good rock n' roll musician."Hey, Joe" remains one of my
favorites; cool menace personified.
But I do disagree with some of your opinions.
Genius? The word is thrown around so much these days I think its gotten
cheapened. I personally would call Hendrix innovative, and leave it at that.
Dylan, for a couple of years displayed some genius [1961-66?] Lennon
maybe , for a month or two.
I shrink from lowering the crossbar any further. You want a snootful of real
genius?
Try the Beethoven 9th. Its the voice of God.
Clothes don't make the man, and dont effect sound, right you are.
But drugs do, most certainly. I disagree also with your BTW. Sleeping pills are
drugs, and taking it a few steps further, I suspect Mr. Hendrix was pulling the
same kind of shit that
the rest of us were in the 60's: mixing,using and abusing. Example: a favorite
combination
I remember from way back when was "3 and 2" three Doridens and two ouncesof
Robitusin
AC. Tack that on to a little smack, and you probably die.I think it a bit
innocent to expect Hendrix to carefully read the perscription label.
As far as recrearional drugs, mainlining smack is hardly for the recreational
among us.
The guy was a junkie. A good gutarist, But a junkie that killed himself. Don't
blame his doctor.
Al Mitchell
NYC
Ned Carlson
<Wilfred....@inter.nl.net> wrote:
>It is possible to use EL34's in a Major. At least, I've seen one with EL34's
>in a small vintage guitar shop in Amsterdam.
Probably had it hooked up on 240V tap intsead of the 220V.
That would give the amp around 560V of B+, instead of about 620V.
In the US, you only get a choice of 110 or 120V taps, which gives,
depending on your line voltage, between 620 to 700V of HT.
I'd say EL34's would have to biased awful lean to survive very long
run UL at those voltages.
> When I tried to explain to the
>shopkeeper that it was the wrong type for the amp, he looked at me as if I
>were crazy. 'EL34's have always been the type for Marshalls. Who's the
>expert here?'.
He might want to look at a Marshall schematic,it shows KT88's
in Majors..
Todd Warnke
AMitch9448 wrote in message
<19981026125513...@ng-fd1.aol.com>...
Hi Al -
First, I agree, Jimi was a junkie. But being a junkie who killed himself
also has the same effect on his music as we know it as his clothes did.
None. I don't need to take drugs to hear his recorded legacy. It stands by
itself.
I also agree that the LvB 9th is God-like. But it is a distinctly different
form from that in which Hendrix worked. Comparing Voodoo Chile to the 9th
is like comparing haiku to a play by Shakespeare. The jewel like haiku
cannot contain the breadth of a play, nor is it meant to. But that lack
does not diminish the art and genius of haiku. Little Wing or The Star
Spangled Banner or Purple Haze are not long form, but as experiments in tone
and harmony are as revolutionary and inventive as Debussy's experiments 50
years earlier. Virtually every guitarist that has followed has copied,
stolen or in some fundamental way dealt with Jimi. Inventive? In the fast
changing and adapting world of popular music the fact that he has yet to
even be equaled is testament to his unique genius. - Just so you know, in
the category of popular song in the late 20th century I'd put 61-66 Dylan in
the genius category, add several months of Lennon, the odd hour or two of
Van Morrison and Joni Mitchell, and allow Neil Young and Pete Townsend
several seconds of celestial vision.
Happy Listening
Todd Warnke
AMitch9448
narcotics have an effect on ones thinking, and therefore one's music. A
profound effect.
Not always "bad", I might add.
You are right about the difference in genre.
The form that Hendricx worked in was far less complex than Beethoven, however I
think that an advance of a form [to the extent that JH advanced Rock N' Roll]
as simple as R&R does not neccessasarily confer the laurel of genius . So I
stand on my opinion . Innovative.
I don't pretend to know just what seperates the two, but my guess is that sort
of head snapping realization one gets when confronted by a work of true genius.
Its sort of like the difference between art and crafts.
Somehow there's a boundary, and to me at least, Hendricks never crossed it.
Regards,
Al Mitchell
NYC
Wilfred
Ned Carlson heeft geschreven in bericht
>On Sun, 25 Oct 1998 14:09:14 +0100, "Wilfred"
><Wilfred....@inter.nl.net> wrote:
>>It is possible to use EL34's in a Major. At least, I've seen one with
EL34's
>>in a small vintage guitar shop in Amsterdam.
>
>Probably had it hooked up on 240V tap intsead of the 220V.
>That would give the amp around 560V of B+, instead of about 620V.
>In the US, you only get a choice of 110 or 120V taps, which gives,
>depending on your line voltage, between 620 to 700V of HT.
With the line voltage being raised over here from 220 to 230V, you now would
get a choice between 595V or 650V. I know what my choice would be (esp. with
modern KT88's).
>I'd say EL34's would have to biased awful lean to survive very long
>run UL at those voltages.
That amp is way too loud anyway, so I doubt if it has been run anywhere near
full output.
Philips EL34's apparently can take an awful lot of beating; but they don't
quit.
They did look a bit funny though: like a big portion of the black paint
faded. What's that? They're not supposed to have any? How come they're black
all over then? ;-)
>> When I tried to explain to the
>>shopkeeper that it was the wrong type for the amp, he looked at me as if I
>>were crazy. 'EL34's have always been the type for Marshalls. Who's the
>>expert here?'.
>
>He might want to look at a Marshall schematic,it shows KT88's
>in Majors..
(No, he don't. He knows it all...)
I kinda feel sorry for the guy that ended up with the amp. I hope he knew
what was supposed to be in the sockets. I hate to think of the scenario
where 'those worthless worn out OLD EL34's' have been replaced with NEW
'premium matched EL34Super's (made in China)'... Oh, the horror!
Cheers,
Wilfred
Kamaruddin
AMitch9448 wrote:
> I don't pretend to know just what seperates the two, but my guess is that sort
> of head snapping realization one gets when confronted by a work of true genius.
> Its sort of like the difference between art and crafts.
> Somehow there's a boundary, and to me at least, Hendricks never crossed it.
> Regards,
> Al Mitchell
> NYC
Dear Al,
What about Jim Morrison? Did he crossed the line? From what I believe, he did.
One "Clean" Eye Jack
Alan Thompson
Hendrix using heroin. He did dabble in the recreational drugs of the day, as many
others did. What killed him was basically the pressures of stardom and the music
industry, helped by his strange management.
A.T.
AMitch9448
Al Mitchell
NYC
jackm...@gmail.com
But I don't care what you say Jimi was a human driven by greedy people to an exhuastive blur of fame.He was a genius because of his fine sense of musical inovation he started a whole a new sound never to be forgotten in rock his contemporaries praised his talent and they know more than we can ever expect to.DONE WITH PICKING ON THE MOST RESPECTED ROCK GUITARIST EVER. SORRY FOR POOR GRAMER AND SPELLING.R.I.P JIMI