Coming soon, AT & Oktava shoot out
Rob Adelman
Technica at4051 (have wanted one for years).
Still putting them through their paces.
More later.
Rob Adelman
Bouder, CO
(hint: the AT is in the lead, but the race is very tight)
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Rob Adelman
so I haven't had a chance to try cymbols yet. So this is a comparison
done on my Martin M-38 (my it sounds sweet) and on vocals. Test is using
Cardioid capsule on Oktava, AT is cardioid only.
The Oktava was actually quite impressive for the price. It sounds open
and full, and in fact very close to the at4051.
First thing I noticed is that the AT is a hotter mic. On the Oktava
side, I had to turn up the mic gain, and then the output level on the
pre-amp to match the level on the AT side.
I recorded the 2 channels.
On playback, switching between them, the sound was very close, the
Oktava initially sounded slightly warmer, but upon more and more review,
I found the AT has more detail in the upper mid, lower high end area.
This tends to make the Oktava a little smoother initially, but a little
less defined.
My conclusion is that the AT is more accurate, the Oktava slightly
warmer. The bass is very similar between the two. I think with my type
of music, the AT may cut through the mix a little better. For solo,
however, the Oktava would seem a little smoother.
I still need to try the Omni capsule on the Oktava.
Since I want to have a pair of one of them, I just have to decide if I
should get another Oktava, or another Audio Technica.
(b.t.w. the 4051 is more money used, than the Oktava is new)
(also, the Nakamichi's are sold :)
Rob Adelman
(what I lack in gear, I make up for in ear)
David Morgan (MAMS)
Rob Adelman <r...@skihappy.com> wrote in message news:8on67o$7mi$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Recently aquired the Oktava MC012 (no not from GC), and the Audio
> Technica at4051 (have wanted one for years).
>
>
> Still putting them through their paces.
>
>
> More later.
Rob,
If it's still available on Deja.com (I keep terrible records 'cause I'm
not planning to write a book any time soon), I did this with the same
mics but my 012's were purchased from Geetar Sinner. There was
no comparison what-so-ever. The 4051's took the trophy by a mile -
and I posted the results here about a year ago, using both sets on
Grand Piano, as drum overheads and on acoustic guitar. I returned
them to GC within two weeks. Smeared top end and very different
responses on each 012. The 4051s were like mirrors.
I have never tried the Oktavas from the Sound Room. Harvey Gerst has...
and so far seems quite impressed, particularly with the additional Lomo head.
I'd tend to trust him, but up against 4051's, it may be a tough task to give
creedence to the 012's.
--
David Morgan (MAMS)
Morgan Audio Media Service
Dallas, Texas (972) 622-1972
__________________________________________
Main Street Studio, Garland, Texas (972) 487-4045
David Morgan (MAMS)
> Technica at4051 (have wanted one for years).
>
>
> Still putting them through their paces.
>
>
> More later.
Rob,
If it's still available on Deja.com (I keep terrible records 'cause I'm
not planning to write a book any time soon), I did this with the same
mics but my 012's were purchased from Geetar Sinner. There was
no comparison what-so-ever. The 4051's took the trophy by a mile -
and I posted the results here about a year ago, using both sets on
Grand Piano, as drum overheads and on acoustic guitar. I returned
them to GC within two weeks. Smeared top end and very different
responses on each 012. The 4051s were like mirrors.
I have never tried the Oktavas from the Sound Room. Harvey Gerst has...
and so far seems quite impressed, particularly with the additional Lomo head.
I'd tend to trust him, but up against 4051's, it may be a tough task to give
credence to the 012's.
Rob Adelman
a superior microphone to the Oktava MC 012, though the Oktava was
surprisingly close, at a much lower price.
The Oktava sounds best with the Cardiod capsule, the Omni is a little
dark, and hyper is not as natural sounding.
The Audio Technica is Cardiod only, and compared to the Oktava Cardiod
capsule, it is smoother and more detailed. Sounds closer to being there.
AT Bass also has a little more energy, which would explain why the
Oktava has to have a slightly higher level on the pre-amp to match
levels.
Anyone that would like to send me any other mic to put up against the
4051, I would be happy to post an opinion. (mic returned upon
completion, of course.)
Rob Adelman
Boulder, CO
{what I lack in gear, I make up for in ear}
Mark McQuilken
>
> I have completed the testing and I believe the Audio Technica at4051 is
> a superior microphone to the Oktava MC 012, though the Oktava was
> surprisingly close, at a much lower price.
>
> The Oktava sounds best with the Cardiod capsule, the Omni is a little
> dark, and hyper is not as natural sounding.
>
> The Audio Technica is Cardiod only, and compared to the Oktava Cardiod
> capsule, it is smoother and more detailed. Sounds closer to being there.
> AT Bass also has a little more energy, which would explain why the
> Oktava has to have a slightly higher level on the pre-amp to match
> levels.
>
> Anyone that would like to send me any other mic to put up against the
> 4051, I would be happy to post an opinion. (mic returned upon
> completion, of course.)
>
> Rob Adelman
Rob:
Please don't take this as a flame, but why is your take on this
important to us (me)? So...you've declared the '4051 as the winner.
Unfortunately, there's no way for me--or others(?)--to evalute this
(I've never knowingly heard anything that you've recorded), so it's
really quite superfluous. Now, if GM or ARN or one of those guys tells
me the same info, my curiousity is piqued and I'll go out of my way to
demo <fill-in-the-blank>...
BTW, I'd imagine you should have the same response to me if *I* had
posted something like this...If I'm missing something here, please let
me know.
Regards,
McQ
__
Mark McQuilken
FMR Audio
www.fmraudio.com
(800)343-9976 - US Only
(512)280-6557 Voice
(512)280-8627 Fax
Mark McQuilken
>
>
> Rob:
>
> Please don't take this as a flame, but why is your take on this
> important to us (me)? So...you've declared the '4051 as the winner.
> Unfortunately, there's no way for me--or others(?)--to evalute this
> (I've never knowingly heard anything that you've recorded), so it's
> really quite superfluous. Now, if GM or ARN or one of those guys tells
> me the same info, my curiousity is piqued and I'll go out of my way to
> demo <fill-in-the-blank>...
>
> BTW, I'd imagine you should have the same response to me if *I* had
> posted something like this...If I'm missing something here, please let
> me know.
>
> Regards,
> McQ
I just re-read this and it sounds very assholey...but that's not my
intent. Just a question of form: unknown person tests two unknown
devices, draws conclusion. This is useful to me (or others)...how? I
must be missing something (but obviously *NOT* being an asshole--that I
hit right on the money)...
Just another asshole in Austin,
McQ
P.S. - I know one thing that bothers me about this...it reminds me of
other folks here (like lxh2) making pronouncements ("the truth can now
be told", etc.) as though the rest of us are idiots and he's the only
enlightened one. I've *interpreted* similar (albeit, much less)
posturing (or enthusiasm?) in Rob's post...
P.S.S. - Sorry to waste bandwidth...I'll shut-up now.
Rob Adelman
I have completed the testing and I believe the Audio Technica at4051 is
a superior microphone to the
Oktava MC 012, though the Oktava was surprisingly close, at a much
lower price.
The Oktava sounds best with the Cardiod capsule, the Omni is a little
dark, and hyper is not as natural
sounding.
The Audio Technica is Cardiod only, and compared to the Oktava Cardiod
capsule, it is smoother and
more detailed. Sounds closer to being there. AT Bass also has a little
more energy, which would explain
why the Oktava has to have a slightly higher level on the pre-amp to
match levels.
Anyone that would like to send me any other mic to put up against the
4051, I would be happy to post an
opinion. (mic returned upon
completion, of course.)
Rob Adelman
Rob Adelman
It was more that the AT is very hard to come by and I felt blessed by
finding one - > sharing my joy.
Rob
(not to worry, not taking your post personally :)
In article <39B5D6...@fmraudio.com>,
Jim Gilliland
>
> Please don't take this as a flame, but why is your take on this
> important to us (me)? So...you've declared the '4051 as the winner.
Mark, why not just take it as one guy's opinion and leave it at that?
It's more information than you had before. It's not gospel, but mic
comparisons are obviously considered useful - this newsgroup is full of
them, some from well-known pros, some from less-well-known pros, some
from amateurs. Consider the source, consider the content, use it as you
see fit.
I read all of the mic and mic pre threads around here. I get very few
chances to compare microphones personally, so the opinions of others
help me to learn.
(Ironically, the MC012 and AT4051 are among the very few comparisons
that I've had the chance to make myself, and I agree that the 4051 is
the better mic. For what it's worth, now you have two points of
reference, one from a rank amateur (me <g>).)
Fletcher
>
> I have completed the testing and I believe the Audio Technica at4051 is
> a superior microphone to the Oktava MC 012, though the Oktava was
> surprisingly close, at a much lower price.
>
Rob, from the bottom of my heart I would like to thank you for this
comparison. I'm about to start looking for a car...could you perform a
similar test between a 'KIA' and a 'Hyundai'...as you compare mics to
cars, they're all in the same leauge.
--
Fletcher
Mercenary Audio
TEL: 508-543-0069
FAX: 508-543-9670
http://www.mercenary.com
"this is not a problem"
Mark McQuilken
>
>
> Mark, why not just take it as one guy's opinion and leave it at that?
> It's more information than you had before. It's not gospel, but mic
> comparisons are obviously considered useful - this newsgroup is full of
> them, some from well-known pros, some from less-well-known pros, some
> from amateurs. Consider the source, consider the content, use it as you
> see fit.
>
> I read all of the mic and mic pre threads around here. I get very few
> chances to compare microphones personally, so the opinions of others
> help me to learn.
>
> (Ironically, the MC012 and AT4051 are among the very few comparisons
> that I've had the chance to make myself, and I agree that the 4051 is
> the better mic. For what it's worth, now you have two points of
> reference, one from a rank amateur (me <g>).)
Jim:
Point taken. I was really reacting to, what seemed to me, Rob
pontificating. It's a different thing to say "Tried them, liked x
better" and Rob's "shoot-out forthcoming...<implicit drumroll>...here's
some intermediate results...<another drum roll>...ok, finally finished
the shootout and here are the results...<rimshot>". Because of the
presentation, I thought that I was missing something and that this guy
is some new industry guru that I haven't heard of or that (when Rob
speaks, everyone listens), in addition to RAP compilations, we're now
commissioning RAPpers to review gear. Apparently, neither is the case.
Although Rob can do whatever he wants, I'd suggest that such a
presentation is more appropriate for alt.music.4-track, not RAP.
Ironically, I have used both the MC012 and AT4051 extensively and
couldn't disagree more that the AT is a "better" mic...I wouldn't use
them for the same things.
DCMIX
>comparisons are obviously considered useful - this newsgroup is full of
>them, some from well-known pros, some from less-well-known pros, some
>from amateurs
Jim,
That is the funny thing about this NG. You get crucified if your a Newbie! Oh
and let me define newbie, someone new to this NG. A pro of 25 years could pop
up and ask a question and get Tared and Feathered because no one has heard of
you. A buddy of mine who has mentored me in recording for years now, has never
been to this NG, has little time to scour the WWW, he happens to be too busy
recording! He has never heard of an Octovia mic, or a RNC or many things that
are now all the rave. He is, however, a world class engineer, should he decide
to show up one day, i fear he would get flamed by the old timers in this NG who
play god. I am reluctant to post here any more..... here is why... an
example...
Question...
What color is the sky??
Answers..
1.You fuckin foool dont you know already.
2.I saw your posts on other NG's and it seems you have been at some God NG's
(so let me try and expose you).
3. God, he had nothing to do with the sky!!
4. Darwin was right, bible is wrong.
5 What was darwins fav band.
6 Darwin was a sissy.
7 Sissy, he created evolution.
8 evoloution, wasnt that a beatles song
and , on and on.... Blah blah blah..
Never a direct answer to a quesion.A thread of garbage. Ususally some jaded
have scarcastic remark about nothing.
Heaven forbid you pop up and share an opinion or a sincere question because
here in the Spanish Inquision NG ooops i ment RAP ng you wont normally get a
direct answer. Strait answers are becoming a rare commodity (even more rare
than a Fairchild compressor).
>I get very few
>chances to compare microphones personally, so the opinions of others
>help me to learn.
Amen brother!!
DCMIX
Mark Plancke
Immediately proceed to the airport, get on a plane
with your two mics and come to my studio. Conduct your test and I
guarantee the results will not be the same.
Your shootout (or any shootout) really doesn't mean a whole lot to me
unfortunately. You for instance didn't specify what the source was,
what the intended results where, what your room is like, what mic
pre-amp you were using, what your setup is.... etc. Unfortunately even
if you fill in all these blanks your test still means very little to
anyone else.
It's like saying
"I tested the tuna against the trout and the trout won."
Mark Plancke
SOUNDTECH RECORDING STUDIOS
Windsor, Ontario, Canada
http://SoundTechRecording.com
At A&M (RIP) and many other studios we attempted to work around the
onboard SSL eqs by adding stacks of Pultecs to the room. That's the
main reason why Pultecs cost $3000 today. - Stephen Barncard
Mark McQuilken
DC:
Although I appreciate what you're saying--it must be the reality for
you--that hasn't been my experience at all here. Three years ago, I was
a RAP newbie (comparatively, I still am), and found the only shit I got
was from other newbies (*actual* newbies). The RAP regulars, provided I
showed some decorum, were (and are) always generous with their time and
skills.
With regard to not getting "a direct answer" (again, I grant you your
right to interpret it that way), *I* don't see it that way. There are
usually too many variables in execution of our art to give "recipes" or
definitive one-size-fits-all answers...particularly based-upon the
little data that is usually given by inquiring posters. Skilled
engineering practitioners have to constantly *THINK* from a foundation.
IME, the vast majority of the newbies here dislike thinking. Half the
battle in solving problems, is asking the right question. This, IME, is
rarely done by newbies.
There is definitely a "train on your own time" mentality here that I
fully support (it exists in the studio, why should us leopards change
our spots?). I don't frequent this NG to continually answer dumbass
questions, but to partake of the collective wisdom of the folks here
with much more experience and creativity than I (although, I suppose
*that's* not hard to do). Frankly, the constant newbie bantering takes
away from that for me. That being said, in the aggregate, the new
knowledge that I discover here (98% of it from the folks you take issue
with) is worth putting up with the flamer/newbie noise.
BTW, since you obviously are so reviled, frustrated, offended and
annoyed by this NG's methods, why are you still here?
Best regards,
DCMIX
>BTW, since you obviously are so reviled, frustrated, offended and
>annoyed by this NG's methods, why are you still here?
>
>Best regards,
>McQ
BTW, i love the RNC.
You should refrain from comments though, just good business practice. Strong
opinions are like body oder.
Watch and learn from DB and Winkler on the 103 shockmount thread.
It made me sick to see that...... a truly fine moment in RAP history.
I plan on getting many more of your compressors, so leave me alone! I am also
spreading the word here in town, several folks have borrowed mine and will be
getting their own soon.
Staying Neutral is cool!! It is ok not to battle every post you see. Let folks
post comparisons of oxygen in the control room if it make them happy.
This NG is great if you can sift through the jaded crap. I have gained much
from some folks, and seen the ass of others.
FMR makes a great product. Dont taint it by trashing potential customers or on
lookers who may also be customers.
Become an Unengineer for a moment and remember what they taught you in business
class. You should have told him that the octavia would have sounded mo-betta by
using a RNC.
Best regards/hugs & kisses/sincerely
PEACE
DCMIX
Paul Jenner
If you think the statement he made is incomplete / wrong / not much in debt
/ etc., why don't you just ask for more details ? Like on which instruments
and under what circumstances he performed his tests. Rob could learn
something from it , like enhancing his testing procedures, you (we'll, let's
make that me, and a few others...) could learn from it, like placing his
findings in perspective and so forth.
Or is your post just your own sarcastic way to encourage Rob to be more
specific ?
As for the car part, everyone knows that any Hyundai is the better car of
the two, about exactly the same quality as a Mercedes or a Lexus at a
substantially lower price :)
Regards,
Paul.
--
A splendid time is guaranteed for all ...
Fletcher <Flet...@mercenary.com> schreef in berichtnieuws
39B65B...@mercenary.com...
the_...@my-deja.com
Rob Adelman <r...@skihappy.com> wrote:
>
>
> I have completed the testing and I believe the Audio Technica at4051
is
> a superior microphone to the
> Oktava MC 012,
Superior at what? Where did you get the Oktava from?
though the Oktava was surprisingly close, at a much
> lower price.
>
> The Oktava sounds best with the Cardiod capsule,
Best for what application?
the Omni is a little
> dark,
Compared to your AT? --another omni? --the Oktava cardioid cap?
and hyper is not as natural
> sounding.
As what--the cardioid cap? --Shouldn't be. Why would it?
>
> The Audio Technica is Cardiod only, and compared to the Oktava
Cardiod
> capsule, it is smoother and
> more detailed.
Smooth in what frequency range? What do you mean by smooth? Do you
mean a flat response? Do you mean a mellow and even transition from
midrange to treble?
>Sounds closer to being there.
Being where? Right up on an acoustic guitar in a dead room--or 9 feet
in the air, hanging over a drum kit in a warehouse? (I would use
different mics in these situations to make it sound like "you're
there".)
>AT Bass also has a little
> more energy,
Aaah... so it is not as flat as the Oktava?
>which would explain
> why the Oktava has to have a slightly higher level on the pre-amp to
> match levels.
>
> Anyone that would like to send me any other mic to put up against the
> 4051, I would be happy to post an
> opinion. (mic returned upon
> completion, of course.)
Yeah sure! You wanna fuck my girlfriend too? Just be sure to return
her when you're done?
>
> Rob Adelman
> Boulder, CO
>
> {what I lack in gear, I make up for in ear}
Oh, so you lack gear! What preamp were you using? What'cha monitoring
on? What is your listening environment like? What amp? What kinds of
recordings do you like? Just what the fuck were you recording?
Look dude, I'm just busting your balls, but user-reviews of equipment
are misleading enough when someone covers all the details they can. I
ain't expecting scientific analysis, but we gotta get more outta ya
than this.
--
Jim "The Kooch" Kuczkowski
Not enough memory to complete all overviews
Mothra666
forward question. Nobody likes a braggart shooting their mouth off based on
little experience, nor does anyone enjoy ridiculous questions along the lines
of "How do I record a record?". That's where the trouble seems to start. If the
mood is a little acerbic on any given day, well, that's just part of the fun.
You can't take the group too seriously. Just be happy there are internet
resources like this around. It balances the porn well.
Philip Stevenson
Http://members.aol.com/mothra666/chris.htm
"I'm too fucking busy and vice-versa"
- Dorothy Parker
Mark McQuilken
>
> BTW, i love the RNC.
> You should refrain from comments though, just good business practice. Strong
> opinions are like body oder.
Thanks for your concern, DC! So...where do I draw the line? I'm a user
myself (both of this group and recording gear) and, as such, have
definite opinions. I've contributed some stuff on this group that was
quite sincere and innocuous, yet people have taken offense. I have *no
way* of judging that! So, unless I decide to complete shut-up, there's
always a risk.
> Watch and learn from DB and Winkler on the 103 shockmount thread.
> It made me sick to see that...... a truly fine moment in RAP history.
True enough. You're actually comparing my response to Rob in the same
category?? Wow...
> I plan on getting many more of your compressors, so leave me alone!
I'm glad that you like 'em and need more. If they do the job, that's
what they are there for. If they don't, there's plenty of other great
product out there (if you haven't checked out alternatives, then do!).
>I am also
> spreading the word here in town, several folks have borrowed mine and will be
> getting their own soon.
Thank you!
>
> Staying Neutral is cool!!
I disagree. Stated my view, popular or not, is another way of folks to
learn (myself included). If I wanted to play politics, I'd have stayed
in corporate America...
> It is ok not to battle every post you see.
Check my posting history in dejanews. I *don't* battle /every/ post I
see...in fact, until very recently, I'd given up trying to convey
/helpful/ info here, 'cause of the tirades that some newbies have had to
what I've said...
> Let folks
> post comparisons of oxygen in the control room if it make them happy.
Me commenting on it doesn't keep them from doing it. If you saw a
friend/associate/acquaintance shooting themselves in the foot, would you
say something? I would, even if it's not popular or doesn't sell
equipment...
>
> This NG is great if you can sift through the jaded crap. I have gained much
> from some folks, and seen the ass of others.
> FMR makes a great product.
Thanks...
>Dont taint it by trashing potential customers or on
> lookers who may also be customers.
Again, unless I'm completely quiet (which *AIN'T* gonna happen) there's
always someone that'll take offense. Know what? Some people have even
taken exception to that too...
BTW, it's interesting that you considered what I said as "trashing
potential customers"! Actually sort of makes my point...
> Become an Unengineer for a moment and remember what they taught you in business
> class.
What they taught in business school is *NOT* what I'm interested in...if
it were, you'd be paying a helluva lot more than I'm selling my
equipment for. With regard to customer service, ask around and see how
many customers I've abused...
>You should have told him that the octavia would have sounded mo-betta by
> using a RNC.
Maybe, but I don't believe that. That's also contrary to standard
business/marketing...
>
> Best regards/hugs & kisses/sincerely
> PEACE
> DCMIX
Cheers!
the_...@my-deja.com
moth...@aol.com (Mothra666) wrote:
Just be happy there are internet
> resources like this around. It balances the porn well.
LOL....Let's see...15,999,999,999 porn sites to every one useful bit of
info. Hmmmmm....Good balance!
Jim Gilliland
>
> Jim Gilliland wrote:
> >
> > Mark, why not just take it as one guy's opinion and leave it at that?
>
> pontificating. It's a different thing to say "Tried them, liked x
> better" and Rob's "shoot-out forthcoming...<implicit drumroll>...here's
> some intermediate results...<another drum roll>...ok, finally finished
> the shootout and here are the results...<rimshot>".
Yeah, he did get a bit overly dramatic, didn't he? <g> No big deal, not
to me anyway, though I liked Fletcher's response <g>.
> > (Ironically, the MC012 and AT4051 are among the very few comparisons
> > that I've had the chance to make myself, and I agree that the 4051 is
> > the better mic. For what it's worth, now you have two points of
> > reference, one from a rank amateur (me <g>).)
> Ironically, I have used both the MC012 and AT4051 extensively and
> couldn't disagree more that the AT is a "better" mic...I wouldn't use
> them for the same things.
Excellent, that gets interesting. I compared them on acoustic guitar,
and the comparison was flawed anyway because they weren't positioned
identically (though very close). But the AT was both less boomy and
cleaner (less grainy) on two different acoustic guitars.
Could you characterize the differences in the way you'd use them? They
would seem to me to fill a similar niche.
Jim Gilliland
>
> >It's not gospel, but mic
> >comparisons are obviously considered useful - this newsgroup is full of
> >them, some from well-known pros, some from less-well-known pros, some
> >from amateurs
>
> Jim,
> That is the funny thing about this NG. You get crucified if your a Newbie! Oh
> and let me define newbie, someone new to this NG. A pro of 25 years could pop
> up and ask a question and get Tared and Feathered because no one has heard of
> you.
I've seen that happen often enough, yet I can't recall ever being really
flamed here myself, and I definitely qualify as a newbie - I've been
here for about a year, and I'm definitely an amateur with no pretense of
being more.
There are probably several reasons for that:
1) I've been around Usenet and other nets before that long enough to
know how to avoid triggering flames. (I was the moderator of one of the
busiest conferences on Fidonet (remember Fidonet? It was the OS/2
conference) for about five years. I learned a LOT about online
communications.)
2) I don't get overly sensitive. (Maybe I've been flamed and just
haven't noticed <g>.)
3) I try to keep my mouth shut unless I have something of value to add.
(Like anyone else, though, I don't always succeed.)
Bottom line, though, is that I've gotten a lot of helpful responses to
my queries, and I've learned a lot from reading selected threads as a
lurker. Sometimes I don't get any response at all (like my recent TDIF
query). Oh well.
>I am reluctant to post here any more..... here is why... an example...
>
> Question...
> What color is the sky??
> Answers..
> 1.You fuckin foool dont you know already.
> 2.I saw your posts on other NG's and it seems you have been at some God NG's
> (so let me try and expose you).
> 3. God, he had nothing to do with the sky!!
> 4. Darwin was right, bible is wrong.
> 5 What was darwins fav band.
> 6 Darwin was a sissy.
> 7 Sissy, he created evolution.
> 8 evoloution, wasnt that a beatles song
Oh, yeah, I remember that thread. <g>
> Never a direct answer to a quesion.A thread of garbage. Ususally some jaded
> have scarcastic remark about nothing.
Well, welcome to Usenet. You've got to know how to filter this stuff
<g>.
BTW, I'm not disagreeing with you, just taking a different approach to
the same situation.
Mothra666
>info. Hmmmmm....Good balance!
further supporting my theory that while there's only so much you want to know
about 1272's; a naked girl is endlessly fascinating.
redwood
Mothra666 wrote:
John Penovich
peno...@rfaSPAMX.org
remove SPAMX to reply
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Tell you one thing, when your solid state parts wear out you can't play
rocket ship with any of them."
-> Twang, in a discussion about tubes vs transistors
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Harvey Gerst
>That is the funny thing about this NG. You get crucified if your a Newbie! Oh
>and let me define newbie, someone new to this NG. A pro of 25 years could pop
>up and ask a question and get Tared and Feathered because no one has heard of
>you. A buddy of mine who has mentored me in recording for years now, has never
>been to this NG, has little time to scour the WWW, he happens to be too busy
>recording! He has never heard of an Octovia mic, or a RNC or many things that
>are now all the rave. He is, however, a world class engineer, should he decide
>to show up one day, i fear he would get flamed by the old timers in this NG who
>play god.
DC,
I don't think it has so much to do with being crucified as a newbie as being a "NWA", to
paraphrase a group name. It's usually the newbies who are quickest to yell, "Oh yeah?
What makes you so hot shit?". A couple of incidents I recall off hand:
A newbie was asking about miking a guitar amp. One of our older members suggested that he
try putting the amp up on a chair, then mic it. The newbie replied, "Well, duh - I came
here looking for real answers, not dumb shit obvious stuff". That touched off a round of
real flame wars, because newbie or not, you just don't talk to George Massenburg like
that.
Second incident:
Someone was asking about how to get that old Motown sound and the poster received a wide
variety of answers from a lot of people - all different. Included was a quiet post from
Bob Ohllson with a different approach, and when someone challenged why his answer should
carry any more credence than the others, he replied thathe was the engineer at Motown
during that period.
>I am reluctant to post here any more..... here is why... an example...
>
>Question...
>What color is the sky??
>Answers..
>1.You fuckin foool dont you know already.
>2.I saw your posts on other NG's and it seems you have been at some God NG's
>(so let me try and expose you).
>3. God, he had nothing to do with the sky!!
>4. Darwin was right, bible is wrong.
>5 What was darwins fav band.
>6 Darwin was a sissy.
>7 Sissy, he created evolution.
>8 evoloution, wasnt that a beatles song
>
>and , on and on.... Blah blah blah..
>Never a direct answer to a quesion.A thread of garbage. Ususally some jaded
>have scarcastic remark about nothing.
Yes, a lot of us use the newsgroup to burn off steam, but usually you'll find the right
answers buried somewhere in the thread if you know where to look and who's answer to look
for.
>Heaven forbid you pop up and share an opinion or a sincere question because
>here in the Spanish Inquision NG ooops i meant RAP ng you won't normally get a
>direct answer. Straight answers are becoming a rare commodity (even more rare
>than a Fairchild compressor).
Asking questions (without the attitude) will usually get you a fast accurate answer from
almost everybody here. Asking a question (with a preconceived answer already) will get
you into trouble. Stating something here as absolute fact, without the experience to back
it up, will also get you into trouble fast. Stating an opinion as fact will also not work
well here.
>>I get very few chances to compare microphones personally, so the opinions of others
>>help me to learn.
As long as they're stated as "opinions", not "facts". In Rob's room, under his recording
conditions, the AT4051 sounded "better" than the Oktava MC012, but that doesn't really
help me, since I don't know what those conditions were, or how familiar Rob is with doing
mic testing and evaluation. What else has he heard? How many other mics does he own?
What kind of system does he have? What kind of room?
If I comment on a microphone here, I usually add a number of cautions about the testing
conditions and I try to quantify my opinions with supporting numbers like "so many dB at x
frequency", and where the mic I'm commenting on might be used to good advantage. If a mic
has so much coloration as to be unusable in a wide range of applications, that will
usually turn me off to it. In my humble opinion, the AT4051 may be a great choice for
Rob's needs, but I believe the Oktava has a very wide range of uses, making it a good
value for a number of people here - but that's just my opinion.
I trust Ty Ford's opinions about mics, as well as Myles Bosen, or Monte McGuire, or
Fletcher, or David Butler, but even there, they all have some bias, which I hafta weigh
against my own experiences when making any decision about choosing a mic. As Bruce
Sweiden proved a few years back, sometimes a Shure SM-7 will "beat" a Neumann U47 - in a
particular situation.
When you talk about a "shootout", it implies that at the end, there will be only one unit
left, which "beats" all the others. When it comes to choosing a microphone, that position
is kinda silly for a person to take, isn't it? Just ONE "best" mic? For everything?
Harvey Gerst
Indian Trail Recording Studio
http://www.ITRstudio.com/
Mark McQuilken
>
> Mark McQuilken wrote:
>
> > Ironically, I have used both the MC012 and AT4051 extensively and
> > couldn't disagree more that the AT is a "better" mic...I wouldn't use
> > them for the same things.
>
> Excellent, that gets interesting. I compared them on acoustic guitar,
> and the comparison was flawed anyway because they weren't positioned
> identically (though very close). But the AT was both less boomy and
> cleaner (less grainy) on two different acoustic guitars.
>
> Could you characterize the differences in the way you'd use them? They
> would seem to me to fill a similar niche.
Jim:
I generally don't like either one on acoustic guitar, although I have
produced some decent-sounding acoustic tracks with the 4051 (my choice
for acoustic guitar tracks with some articulation and body would be
QTC-1s or the Wrights). I like the MC012s on percussion and sometimes
drum overheads...wouldn't use the 4051 there unless I didn't have any
other choice. MC012 sounds okee-dokee on mandolin, the 4051 just doesn't
"do it" for me there. The MC012, in combo with the LOMO head sounds
*GREAT* on acoustic bass (upright), I don't think I'd reach for the 4051
for that. Either one would work for jazz snare. I like having the three
patterns on the MC012 to help shape the sound...
How 'bout you? Have you used the MC012s on anything else? The 4051?
Lyle Caldwell
Try the MC012 on toms. Pretty nifty.
I use them a lot on acoustic guitar, and am pleased. I liked the Wrights
better on acoustic, but they were unusable on drum OHs and kinda too peaky
on piano, so I switched out for the MC012s (I need versatility out of
economic necessity).
--
Lyle Caldwell
Psionic Media, Inc
"Mark McQuilken" <ma...@fmraudio.com> wrote in message
news:39B6CB...@fmraudio.com...
Jay Kahrs
>example...
>
>Question...
>What color is the sky??
>Answers..
>1.You fuckin foool dont you know already.
>2.I saw your posts on other NG's and it seems you have been at some God NG's
>(so let me try and expose you).
>3. God, he had nothing to do with the sky!!
>4. Darwin was right, bible is wrong.
>5 What was darwins fav band.
>6 Darwin was a sissy.
>7 Sissy, he created evolution.
>8 evoloution, wasnt that a beatles song
>
>and , on and on.... Blah blah blah..
>Never a direct answer to a quesion.A thread of garbage. Ususally some jaded
>have scarcastic remark about nothing.
>
>Heaven forbid you pop up and share an opinion or a sincere question because
>here in the Spanish Inquision NG ooops i ment RAP ng you wont normally get a
>direct answer. Strait answers are becoming a rare commodity (even more rare
>than a Fairchild compressor).
>
Good point. A lot of threads do go way off topic but that isn't such a bad
thing. As far as posting a real question, I did last night and have gotten 12
responses and a few leads on some of the different monitors I was looking at. I
dunno, maybe I got lucky.
FWIW, I'd like to have someone compare the AT4051 and a 451 CK/1.
---
-Jay Kahrs
BrownSound Studios
Morris Plains, NJ
http://members.tripod.com/~BrownSoundStudios
Green Grass Goblin
Lyle Caldwell wrote in message ...
>Mark,
>Try the MC012 on toms. Pretty nifty.
>I use them a lot on acoustic guitar, and am pleased. I liked the Wrights
>better on acoustic, but they were unusable on drum OHs and kinda too peaky
>on piano, so I switched out for the MC012s (I need versatility out of
>economic necessity).
Ahhh, Mr. Lyle. You like miking drums don't you? I've only got 1 MC012
which I used on the hi-hat, and Rode NT1's overhead. Ideally, I'd like to
put 2 oktava's above, one on hats, and the Rode's on toms. There's nothing
like big condensors on toms, IMHO. Last time, I had to use an AKG3000 on
the floor tom. That sucked.
I notice a lot of TV broadcasts are using what looks to be MC012's as
overheads, so I figured I must be on the right track. So, what do you think
of these as overheads? Should I get another 1 and not worry about a hihat
track? Seems a lot of dicking around to get a "good" sound on hats and then
you don't need it 'cause it's in the overheads. What's your take on this?
Cheers
Brendon
Lyle Caldwell
more can go wrong, but I've found the MC012s to be very nice overheads. I
go back and forth between the MC012s and a pair of TLM103s, depending on
what the song needs.
--
Lyle Caldwell
Psionic Media, Inc
"Green Grass Goblin" <greengra...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:J7At5.3678$eZ8a.1...@news.xtra.co.nz...
Rob Adelman
brown...@aol.com (Jay Kahrs) wrote:
> I am reluctant to post here any more..... here is why... an
> >example...
> >
Yes, I would like to see that comparison as well.
Rob
Green Grass Goblin
>you--that hasn't been my experience at all here. Three years ago, I was
>a RAP newbie (comparatively, I still am), and found the only shit I got
>was from other newbies (*actual* newbies). The RAP regulars, provided I
>showed some decorum, were (and are) always generous with their time and
>skills.
That's been my experience too - I'm always asking dumb questions and stuff
that's been asked before, but I'm yet to be told to shut up or piss off. I
actually like this thread because it's actually given quite a few people's
impressions of these 2 mics (although I don't know why people compare apples
and oranges)
>the vast majority of the newbies here dislike thinking. Half the
>battle in solving problems, is asking the right question. This, IME, is
>rarely done by newbies.
Yeah, you're right there. It's pure laziness. I see this group as access
to a better knowledge base than any other. I don't have "friends" in the
industry, cause this is New Zealand. But here, I'm actually communicating
with people who have achieved what I can only dream of. There's no human
interaction reading books.
>I don't frequent this NG to continually answer dumbass
>questions,
How many cans can a canner can if a canner can can cans? ;-)
>but to partake of the collective wisdom of the folks here
>with much more experience and creativity than I (although, I suppose
>*that's* not hard to do).
Give yourself some credit Mark! I'm still trying to figure out how to use a
compressor and you're designing and building your own!
> Frankly, the constant newbie bantering takes
>away from that for me.
Ooops. I'll shut up now.
> That being said, in the aggregate, the new
>knowledge that I discover here (98% of it from the folks you take issue
>with) is worth putting up with the flamer/newbie noise.
I'd like to think if I stay here long enough, I'll actually get to a point
where I can dish out useful advice. I'm like an apprentice. Maybe Harvey
can come up with a recognised engineering certificate - "Hi, Brendon
Hamblyn, qualified by R.A.P."
CU
Daily Zen: "Don't worry, it only seems kinky the first time."
Green Grass Goblin
Harvey Gerst wrote:
>Second incident:
>Someone was asking about how to get that old Motown sound and the poster
received a wide
>variety of answers from a lot of people - all different. Included was a
quiet post from
>Bob Ohllson with a different approach, and when someone challenged why his
answer should
>carry any more credence than the others, he replied thathe was the engineer
at Motown
>during that period.
HAHA! Daily Zen: "23. A closed mouth gathers no feet."
>Asking questions (without the attitude) will usually get you a fast
accurate answer from
>almost everybody here. Asking a question (with a preconceived answer
already) will get
>you into trouble. Stating something here as absolute fact, without the
experience to back
>it up, will also get you into trouble fast. Stating an opinion as fact
will also not work
>well here.
I also find that treating people with respect and being polite and well
mannered also helps. Don't say anything you wouldn't say to someones face,
basically. (What ever happened to David (Dr.) James............?)
...and lastly, spending a little time to edit your posts so they look nice
and are understandable will make people more inclined to read them.
Brendon
Peace, love and mungbeans
Daily Zen: "9. It is far more impressive when others discover your good
qualities without your help."
http://greengrassgoblins.iuma.com
Harvey Gerst
>I'd like to think if I stay here long enough, I'll actually get to a point
>where I can dish out useful advice. I'm like an apprentice. Maybe Harvey
>can come up with a recognised engineering certificate - "Hi, Brendon
>Hamblyn, qualified by R.A.P."
<g> You're asking ME to design a certificate that I can't qualify for?
Jim Gilliland
>
> I generally don't like either one on acoustic guitar, although I have
> produced some decent-sounding acoustic tracks with the 4051 (my choice
> for acoustic guitar tracks with some articulation and body would be
> QTC-1s or the Wrights). I like the MC012s on percussion and sometimes
> drum overheads...wouldn't use the 4051 there unless I didn't have any
> other choice. MC012 sounds okee-dokee on mandolin, the 4051 just doesn't
> "do it" for me there. The MC012, in combo with the LOMO head sounds
> *GREAT* on acoustic bass (upright), I don't think I'd reach for the 4051
> for that. Either one would work for jazz snare. I like having the three
> patterns on the MC012 to help shape the sound...
Thanks. I'd love to have a pair of the Earthworks, but it's not in the
budget at this point. Of coures, that's based on reputation, not
experience. But I've heard good things about them from several people
that I trust.
> How 'bout you? Have you used the MC012s on anything else? The 4051?
The 4051s aren't mine - they belong to a venue where I often record.
We've often used them on acoustic guitar with good results. This is in
a stage environment. (Pretty much everything I record is in an "on
stage" environment.)
The MC012s are mine - and I'll embarrass myself by admitting that I
bought them at GC. Unfortunately, it was LONG before I had the chance
to learn here about the issues that surrounded that decision. Still,
I'm either lucky or deaf, because they seem to be reasonably well
matched and sound better than most mics in that price range.
However, I haven't used them often. I used them to record a flute just
for fun and they were OK for that. And, as I mentioned here a couple of
weeks ago, I used them in the church bell tower with very good results.
Of course, to say I haven't used them often doesn't really say anything
- I typically only record a half dozen or so shows per year. So they
will get used.
(Right now I'm mixing a show that I recorded last Christmas. That's the
problem with having to do this stuff as a hobby - my day job still has
to take priority. And I'm not good enough to work quickly, so it takes
me a long time to mix a 75 minute concert.)
With respect to your mandolin comment, I'd expect them to be a good
match for pretty much any string instrument that didn't have a
pronounced low end. They should be good on violin, mandolin, banjo,
dulcimer, bazouki (maybe), etc. I'd like to try the omni heads on
acoustic guitar to see if that would eliminate their boominess, but
omnis would probably get vetoed by the FOH guy, so I doubt that I'll get
the chance anytime soon.
I don't own a Lomo head, but it's one of the many purchases that I've
given thought to. I still think my next purchase should be a KMS105.
Stage vocals is where I seem to have the most trouble. I'm always
fighting with post processing trying to fix something that I wish the
mic would have gotten right in the first place. What I really need is
about three mics that are capable of sounding good even when the singer
is right on top of them.
Scott Dorsey
>here in the Spanish Inquision NG ooops i ment RAP ng you wont normally get a
>direct answer. Strait answers are becoming a rare commodity (even more rare
>than a Fairchild compressor).
Well, you posted a question. I posted a reply, asking you a couple more
questions and trying to qualify what your question really was. And then
you immediately jumped on me and complained about people not giving you
straight answers. And so now I basically don't reply to your posts, because
I have better things to do than get yelled at for trying to help someone.
Maybe other folks whom you have behaved the same way toward are doing
the same thing and that's why you feel like you're being ignored.
This is a discussion group. People discuss things here. This isn't a
place for people to magically come for answers to all their questions.
I don't know if you treat it that way, but a lot of new folks do, and
when they do, they tend to get flamed out of existance.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Fletcher
>
> >
> >BTW, since you obviously are so reviled, frustrated, offended and
> >annoyed by this NG's methods, why are you still here?
> >
> >Best regards,
> >McQ
>
> BTW, i love the RNC.
Really, why? In what applications? For what purposes. I know why I
love my RNC, but how does it help you in your work? That's the purpose
of this forum, to share our experiences. How did the RNC help you? Did
it get you out of a jam? Did it enhance a particular track within a
mix? Did you find it to assist by running your 2 mix buss through it?
The fact that you love it doesn't contribute to the common good, nor the
collective knowledge of the group. You talk about folks not sharing
their experiences, step up and share yours. Be a leader!!
> You should refrain from comments though, just good business practice. Strong
> opinions are like body oder.
DC, can I call you DC? Mr. MIX? At any rate, annoynomous bretheren,
guys like Mark and I don't come here to sell shit. Mark doesn't come
here as a manufacturer, I don't come here as a sales weasel. Yes, Mark
does make shit for a living. Yes, I sell shit for a living. However, I
come here as 'Fletcher; Recording Engineer' not as 'Fletcher; Sales
Associate'. There is actually a difference.
> Watch and learn from DB and Winkler on the 103 shockmount thread.
> It made me sick to see that...... a truly fine moment in RAP history.
> I plan on getting many more of your compressors, so leave me alone! I am also
> spreading the word here in town, several folks have borrowed mine and will be
> getting their own soon.
I found that an interesting exchange, but I like highway carnage as
well. The difference between the db/Karl thing and a guy like Mark
having an opinion on something, is Mark comes here as an engineer. Karl
comes here as a representative of Neumann. db comes here to hawk his
wares [though recently has come up with some stuff that could pass as an
informational/assistive type post]. The fact of the matter is that you
had two sides of a business matter slugging out 'business affairs' on
this NG. This was a matter of commerce, whereas Mark's comments were
comments based on experience as an engineer. In case you didn't notice
he doesn't sell Octava nor A-T microphones...he had nothing to gain, nor
lose from his comments.
Mark, isn't hawking RNC's here either. His interest in Rob's
Octava/Audio Dreknica comparison has less than zero bearing on the use
or sale of an RNC. Mark was relaying his experience as an engineer.
Now, as I'm pretty sure you've noticed, from time to time CD
compilations that include the work of some members of this NG are
released. These CD comilations are released for the purpose of gaining
an idea who you're talking to by listening to their product. I've read
*several* of Rob's posts, and it appears to me that the brother has the
experience of a second year intern, or a 'rekordin' skool gradiate'. I
indeed look forward to hearing Rob's contribution to the RAP-CD set, so
I can be proven quite wrong with that observation.
>
> Staying Neutral is cool!! It is ok not to battle every post you see. Let folks
> post comparisons of oxygen in the control room if it make them happy.
>
Fair enough.
> This NG is great if you can sift through the jaded crap. I have gained much
> from some folks, and seen the ass of others.
You ain't kiddin'.
> FMR makes a great product. Dont taint it by trashing potential customers or on
> lookers who may also be customers.
> Become an Unengineer for a moment and remember what they taught you in business
> class. You should have told him that the octavia would have sounded mo-betta by
> using a RNC.
Just curious, exactly when the fuck did you become a 'marketing
consultant' to FMR Audio? You seem to be under the impression that just
because Mark is a manufacturer, he is required to kiss ass and suck
dick. Sorry, I've read the FAQ and there is no such requirement for
manufacturers.
If someone is a potential client of FMR Audio, they are a potential
client because the company makes a superior product, not because Mark
tucked them in and read them a bedtime story. If someone decides to be
a client of Mercenary Audio it's because we offer quality products, at
reasonable prices, with some exceptionally liberal return/satisfaction
policies, as well as product knowledge and first hand experience, not
because I blew smoke up their ass...by the same token, if someone has
chosen to not be a client of Mercenary Audio because of something I've
said on this forum [and I'm sure there are more than a few of those],
that's their loss.
DM
>FMR makes a great product. Dont taint it by trashing potential customers or on
>lookers who may also be customers.
mark. please continue to be yourself. neutral is boring. trash
anyone who deserves trashing. send me some barbecue.
don morrell
Gendelta
the truth.
>From: Harvey Gerst har...@ITRstudio.com
>When you talk about a "shootout", it implies that at the end, there will be
>only one unit
>left, which "beats" all the others. When it comes to choosing a microphone,
>that position
>is kinda silly for a person to take, isn't it? Just ONE "best" mic? For
>everything?
Absolutely. I'm putting the finishing touches on just such a design right now.
Of course, the secret international consortium of microphone manufacturers
(ICMM) will do their best to block distribution of this mic, which would
undoubtedly put them all out of business. (If you don't hear from me for a
while, you'll know what happened.)
>> have completed the testing and I believe the Audio Technica at4051 is
> a superior microphone to the Oktava MC 012,
>>From: Fletcher Flet...@mercenary.com
>>...could you perform a
similar test between a 'KIA' and a 'Hyundai'.
No problem, the KIA is vastly superior on acoustic guitar, but the Hyundai is
useful on kick. (Or is that: when kicked?)
>>From: klu...@panix.com (Scott Dorsey)
>>This isn't a
place for people to magically come<<
Why not? pretty much anytime I come, it's magical... at least for me.
>> for answers to all their questions.
I don't know if you treat it that way, but a lot of new folks do, and
when they do, they tend to get flamed out of existance.>>
It should be clear by now that I have the answers to all the questions.
For the answer to _your_ question, send $20 & SASE to "The Folk Bastard" at the
e-address lissted above.
Hope you all have learned something.
-glenn
Dave Martin
"Fletcher" <Flet...@mercenary.com> wrote in message
news:39B6E8...@mercenary.com...
> DCMIX wrote:
> >
> > BTW, i love the RNC.
>
> Really, why? In what applications? For what purposes. I know why I
> love my RNC, but how does it help you in your work?
Mine keeps me from leaving coffee cup rings on my TCL-2. And since the
majority of my guitars (both electric and acoustic) are tracked stereo, the
RNC is a great way to control the more exuberant passes without screwing up
the tone of those tracks.
--
Dave Martin
DMA, Inc.
Nashville, TN
Jay Kahrs
>track? Seems a lot of dicking around to get a "good" sound on hats and then
>you don't need it 'cause it's in the overheads. What's your take on this?
I like my MC012's on overheads. I never mic the hi-hat unless someone holds a
gun to my head. I usually get enough of it in the snare and overheads to make
everyone happy. When I do mic the hat it's usually with a 421 or 57. I'll use a
451 if I need a crisper sound rather then something trashy.
My MC012's sound pretty good even though I got them from GeetarMart. I had a
friend (client actually) who worked there and owed me about $300 so he bought
me two multi-pattern kits and a cardiod kit. I did return one of the multis
after picking my favorite capsules.
Mark McQuilken
>
> >
> > Really, why? In what applications? For what purposes. I know why I
> > love my RNC, but how does it help you in your work?
>
> Mine keeps me from leaving coffee cup rings on my TCL-2.
>
> --
> Dave Martin
Dave:
You've been holdin' out on us...we need to add this to the RNC
applications section on the website!
Mark McQuilken
>
>
> mark. please continue to be yourself. neutral is boring. trash
> anyone who deserves trashing. send me some barbecue.
>
> don morrell
SHUT THE HELL UP DON!!! Get back in yer ig-a-loo and make some of that
damn eskimo music! And mind your own fucking business...
:>)
McQ
P.S. So how's it goin up there? Made enough to retire yet? Email or
call...
DM
wrote:
>DM wrote:
>>
>>
>> mark. please continue to be yourself. neutral is boring. trash
>> anyone who deserves trashing. send me some barbecue.
>>
>> don morrell
>
>SHUT THE HELL UP DON!!! Get back in yer ig-a-loo and make some of that
>damn eskimo music! And mind your own fucking business...
up yours, punk.
>:>)
>McQ
>
>P.S. So how's it goin up there? Made enough to retire yet? Email or
>call...
going good. fedex loves me. retire? ouch. i feel retired...
slower pace here.
i thought i DID e-mail this. real e-mail follows.
and... i was serious about the barbecue.
don
Green Grass Goblin
>Jay Kahrs <snippity doodah>
Wow, small world - I just printed a "How to tune drums" thing that you
wrote - and here you are! Freaky. Thanks for the tips.
David Morgan (MAMS)
Jay Kahrs <brown...@aol.com> wrote in message ...
> FWIW, I'd like to have someone compare the AT4051 and a 451 CK/1.
I've got the 4051's, so just send me a nicely maintained pair of C-451's
(preferably B/T's) with CK-1 caps (a 10dB pad for each would be cool)
in nice wooden boxes and we'll talk about it.
Of course, it might take longer to get an accurate assessment than it
did with my Geetar Senter 012's..... say, a year or so should do - and
I promise to be very detailed.
I'll even put some of the results in a 28.8 kbps streaming format so everyone
can truly appreciate my use... er, comparison of them.
;-)
--
David Morgan (MAMS)
Morgan Audio Media Service
Dallas, Texas (972) 622-1972
__________________________________________
Main Street Studio, Garland, Texas (972) 487-4045
Ty Ford
<4AD96AC3613A1DF1.536CE92F...@lp.airnews.net>, Harvey
Gerst <har...@ITRstudio.com> wrote:
>I trust Ty Ford's opinions about mics, as well as Myles Bosen, or Monte
McGuire, or
>Fletcher, or David Butler, but even there, they all have some bias, which I
hafta weigh
>against my own experiences when making any decision about choosing a mic. As
Bruce
>Sweiden proved a few years back, sometimes a Shure SM-7 will "beat" a Neumann
U47 - in a
>particular situation.
Harv,
Thanks. I sent him some flame-off notes on what he might add next time.
There are entirely too many mics on the market right now. We need all the
help we can get to wade through the crap. Wanna make it go away? I suggest a
six month moratorium on buying any mic under $995 list, just to let the
market slow down enough for the crap to fall out. (It's not a perfect idea,
but I's still like to see what happens.)
Regards,
Ty
Ty Ford does narration, production and location audio. His equipment reviews and
V/O files can be found at http://www.jagunet.com/~tford
Harvey Gerst
>> <g> You're asking ME to design a certificate that I can't qualify for?
>
>
>
>1969 - Dude, I wasn't even born! (Hey, I liked the subliminal advertising!)
>I guess I used you as an example of expertise 'cause your da Pope. Of
>course I have the same respect for all the pro's available, I only wish I
>knew who was who. The unsung heroes like Bob Olhsson and Henry Paul whose
>names I wouldn't have known if it wasn't for this newsgroup. Modesty goes a
>long way, but come on! I'll still respect you guys, even if you are the one
>responsible for recording Britney. My world won't be shattered if it turns
>out Mixerman mixed Cher!
>
>(hehehe - that's how rumours start)
Brendon,
For starters, you should keep a browser bookmark, pointing to http://www.allmusic.com -
you'll find a lot of the people (who post here) listed there. Just enter the poster's
name and his credits will appear. Sometimes the credits are incomplete (or wrong), but
it's the best indicator of who's who that I've found so far.
the_...@my-deja.com
dc...@aol.com (DCMIX) wrote:
>Let me say this,
> Mark's comments were not extreme,
>
Yes. Your reaction to his comments were more extreme than his own
words. That is what seems weird here.
The original poster just got touchy. That's his problem. He was
not attacked. There were no fightin' words used. Mark stated what
many here have said before--that mic comparisons/opinions do little
unless the statements come from someone who's work we know. I (and
others) simply pointed out that if you are going to report a shootout
you have to do more than list your results. You gotta tell us every
detail about the testing. He mentioned nothing about his set-up or his
methodology.
Like I said in my response to him--I don't expect scientific
testing from a layman. But without telling us his preamp, monitoring,
acoustic environment, what was recorded, the abilities of the player,
and every detail possible--he told us nothing!
I was hoping the guy was going to come back with a detailed
posting of this nature. Instead he got overly-sensitive. Go figure.
--
Jim "The Kooch" Kuczkowski
Not enough memory to complete all overviews
DCMIX
>only one unit
>left, which "beats" all the others. When it comes to choosing a microphone,
>that position
>is kinda silly for a person to take, isn't it? Just ONE "best" mic? For
>everything?
Agreed, there is no one best mic. Thank you for the reply. It was well thought
out, and well ive even tried micing a gtr cabniet thru a heater core to try and
get a sound so a gtr cabnet on a chair is not at all out of the question. The
heater core thing did not work well but it was worth a try anyhoo!
Later
Dennis
DCMIX
Dave Martin
> Dave Martin wrote:
> > > Really, why? In what applications? For what purposes. I know why I
> > > love my RNC, but how does it help you in your work?
> >
> > Mine keeps me from leaving coffee cup rings on my TCL-2.
> (snip)
> You've been holdin' out on us...we need to add this to the RNC
> applications section on the website!
>
> McQ
> __
Cool - do you need detailed instructions (I usually put the RNC directly
behind me so I can turn around and pick up the cup with either hand My usual
method of picking up a coffee cup is to insert two fingers into the handle
with the third curled under the handle for support, though if I'm in a
hurry, of if the handle is not in the optimum position, I sometimes grasp
the whole cup, with my thumb on one side and all of my fingers on the
other - my typical coffee cup is either from Manley Laboratories or from
Gear For Days), or will a simple conceptual explanation work for your users?
(Don't put a coffee cup on the expensive gear - get a couple of RNC's to use
for coasters...)
Inquiring minds want to know in Nashville,
Paolo Tramannoni
<6BFEA87586B90EA5.BD62C369...@lp.airnews.net>,
tf...@jagunet.com (Ty Ford) wrote:
> I suggest a
> six month moratorium on buying any mic under $995 list, just to let the
> market slow down enough for the crap to fall out. (It's not a perfect
> idea, but I's still like to see what happens.)
Ty,
This would cut out the MG M930. Not totally a cheapo mic, isn't it?
paolo
--
Paolo Tramannoni
Porto Recanati, Italy
p.t...@fastnet.it
ScotFraser
>I'd like to think if I stay here long enough, I'll actually get to a point
>where I can dish out useful advice. I'm like an apprentice.>>
If you hand out advice based on what you pick up here it will be second hand
hearsay. If you put the ideas you find here into actual practice & come up with
your own conclusions, which may refute what us old farts say, then you'll have
some real knowledge that's worth something.
Scott Fraser
DCMIX
>> using a RNC.
>
>something that Mark doesn't do, much to his own credit, in my opinion.
>
>Besides, Mark knows damn well that throwing a piece of gear at
>something, any piece of gear, doesn't guarantee mo' better sound.
>
My commet was sprinkled with a generous amount of Groucho sarcasm.
Better take a triple dose of that medicine you quote.
Dennis
ScotFraser
>here in the Spanish Inquision NG ooops i ment RAP ng you wont normally get a
>direct answer. Strait answers are becoming a rare commodity>>
What this is here, is an unmoderated discussion group. Buncha people get
together & discuss. If you've ever been in a discussion you'll notice some
people ramble, some rant, some pontificate, some irritate, some don't say much,
some misapprehend, some talk straight. This is not a reference library, &
people here are not your research assistants. This is a democratic unruly
discussion. Get used to it.
Scott Fraser
ScotFraser
gun to my head. I usually get enough of it in the snare and overheads to make
everyone happy.>>
I might have miked a hat once in the last 5 years. With a KM84.
Scott Fraser
Mark McQuilken
>
> Cool - do you need detailed instructions (I usually put the RNC directly
Yes...and please type more slowly next time, you know I don't read very
fast!
> My usual
> method of picking up a coffee cup is to insert two fingers into the handle
> with the third curled under the handle for support, though if I'm in a
> hurry, of if the handle is not in the optimum position, I sometimes grasp
> the whole cup, with my thumb on one side and all of my fingers on the
> other - my typical coffee cup is either from Manley Laboratories or from
> Gear For Days), or will a simple conceptual explanation work for your users?
Gotta get a Mercenary cup (or three)...it adds vintage coffee rings to
the RNC...
> (Don't put a coffee cup on the expensive gear - get a couple of RNC's to use
> for coasters...)
AMEN! Everybody hear that?!?! Get those piece-of-shit "compressors" out
of your signal path and get them supporting (and I do mean /supporting/)
your caffiene habit!! Right on, Dave!!
>
> Inquiring minds want to know in Nashville,
>
> --
> Dave Martin
Er...what was the question?
Harvey Gerst
>Dave Martin wrote:
>>
>> Cool - do you need detailed instructions (I usually put the RNC directly
>> behind me so I can turn around and pick up the cup with either hand)
>
>Yes...and please type more slowly next time, you know I don't read very
>fast!
>
>> My usual
>> method of picking up a coffee cup is to insert two fingers into the handle
>> with the third curled under the handle for support, though if I'm in a
>> hurry, of if the handle is not in the optimum position, I sometimes grasp
>> the whole cup, with my thumb on one side and all of my fingers on the
>> other - my typical coffee cup is either from Manley Laboratories or from
>> Gear For Days), or will a simple conceptual explanation work for your users?
>
>Gotta get a Mercenary cup (or three)...it adds vintage coffee rings to
>the RNC...
Er... Mark,
Have you considered coming out with a "Really Nice Cup"? No testing or assembly, instant
profit, free advertising, and zero returns. Think about it!! Seriously.
Mark McQuilken
>
>
> Er... Mark,
>
> Have you considered coming out with a "Really Nice Cup"? No testing or assembly, instant
> profit, free advertising, and zero returns. Think about it!! Seriously.
>
> Harvey Gerst
Well...I was going to...UNTIL YOU PUBLICLY CAME UP WITH THE IDEA SO THAT
NOW I HAVE TO PAY YOU ROYALTIES!!
Sheesh,
McQ
P.S. - Cool idea...what do I do for the "Super Nice" part of it?
Green Grass Goblin
You'll need to define what effect the RNC has on the coffee, what brand of
coffee, instant or brewed, if it is more effective with or without milk, and
how it can increase your profits. Perhaps follow up with a test on tea for
the European market.
Harvey Gerst
>Harvey Gerst wrote:
>> Er... Mark,
>> Have you considered coming out with a "Really Nice Cup"? No testing or assembly, instant
>> profit, free advertising, and zero returns. Think about it!! Seriously.
>Well...I was going to...UNTIL YOU PUBLICLY CAME UP WITH THE IDEA SO THAT
>NOW I HAVE TO PAY YOU ROYALTIES!!
>
>Sheesh,
>McQ
>
>P.S. - Cool idea...what do I do for the "Super Nice" part of it?
Mark,
Like Fletcher's cup, you need useful information on it. Popular web sites, typical
equipment settings, drum mic positioning tips, mics to consider, a picture of you, wait,
that's for the RNDB (really nice dart board), an XLR pin-out picture, clever audio
sayings, anything that would raise the perceived value of the cup and make it a cool thing
to own. I've got one very cool idea for a cup, but I'll email you privately about it.
Green Grass Goblin
>The heater core thing did not work well but it was worth a try anyhoo!
Explaining what a transducer is, I demonstrated by miking a kick drum with a
15" Peavey Black Widow. Sounded better than a D112! I was amazed at just
how much it picked up. If you're short on talkback mics, it's a good idea.
Large Diaphragm Neumanns! PAH! 15", Now THAT's a large diaphragm!
Cheers
Brendon
http://listen.to/goblins
Green Grass Goblin
say much,
> some misapprehend, some talk straight.
...and some just drink to much Scotch and ask:
"farfle farfle pupick?"
Dave Martin
> Harvey Gerst wrote:
> >
> >
> > Er... Mark,
> >
> > Have you considered coming out with a "Really Nice Cup"? No testing or
assembly, instant
> > profit, free advertising, and zero returns. Think about it!!
Seriously.
> >
> > Harvey Gerst
>
> Well...I was going to...UNTIL YOU PUBLICLY CAME UP WITH THE IDEA SO THAT
> NOW I HAVE TO PAY YOU ROYALTIES!!
>
> Sheesh,
> McQ
>
> P.S. - Cool idea...what do I do for the "Super Nice" part of it?
> __
Dave Martin
"Green Grass Goblin" <greengra...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:968371446.760544@news...
generate enough heat to actually be a warmer. The Millennia, Manley and
Cranesong stuff works better as coffee warmers (and room warmers, but that's
another story). Coffee is generally whole bean Colombian, fresh ground and
made with filtered water. I use milk, mostly because I drink 3-5 pots a day,
and that way I feel like I'm getting a health benefit from the calcium. And
tea is for sissies - the European market should be able to do quite well
with a fine cup of German coffee.
Wisch
of the RNEQ on it!
Wisch
"Harvey Gerst" <har...@ITRstudio.com> wrote in message
news:0D9D907631034B85.EFC86704...@lp.airnews.net...
Bob Olhsson
<dave....@nashville.com> wrote:
>How about a stash of Jamaican Blue Mountain or Kona?
Beware of counterfeit JBM. Kona's more reliable.
--
Bob Olhsson Audio Mastery Recording Project Design and Consulting
Box 555, Novato CA 94948 Tracking, Mixing and Mastering
415.457.2620 FAX 415.456.1496 Mix Evaluation and Quality Control
38 years of making people sound better than they thought possible!
Jay Kahrs
>(preferably B/T's) with CK-1 caps (a 10dB pad for each would be cool)
>in nice wooden boxes and we'll talk about it.
I'd consider parting with my 451EB CK/1 but I can't for a few reasons.
1. It's not mine. It's on a really extended loan from a friend.
2. I use it all the time.
3. I don't have a pad for it.
---
-Jay Kahrs
BrownSound Studios
Morris Plains, NJ
http://members.tripod.com/~BrownSoundStudios
David Morgan (MAMS)
ScotFraser <scotf...@aol.com> wrote in message
> This is a democratic unruly
> discussion. Get used to it.
Motion made and seconded.
the_...@my-deja.com
Bob Olhsson <o...@hyperback.com> wrote:
> In article <srgdf2c...@corp.supernews.com>, Dave Martin
> <dave....@nashville.com> wrote:
>
> >How about a stash of Jamaican Blue Mountain or Kona?
>
> Beware of counterfeit JBM. Kona's more reliable.
>
crop to themselves. If you go to Jamaica they only let you take a
pound or two home. That stuff---the real stuff--is absolutely
delicious!
ScotFraser
tea is for sissies ->>
Tell that to the Brits.
<< the European market should be able to do quite well
with a fine cup of German coffee.>>
What do they know about coffee? Now the Italians, they do coffee, mmmm, they
really do coffee.
Scott Fraser
Dave Martin
> <<And
> tea is for sissies ->>
>
> Tell that to the Brits.
I have...
>
> << the European market should be able to do quite well
> with a fine cup of German coffee.>>
>
> What do they know about coffee? Now the Italians, they do coffee, mmmm,
they
> really do coffee.
>
That's not coffee - that's espresso, cappuccino, etc; real coffee is what
you drink first think in the morning to get your heart started, and then for
the rest of the day to keep it humming along at a high rate of speed. Most
of the coffee I've had in Germany is strong enough to dissolve a spoon if
it's left in the cup for too long, but with a fresh taste. That's the way
coffee supposed to be - strong enough to be a mood altering substance,
especially when drunk by the pot.
My only real complaint with coffee in Europe is that you don't get free
refills in the restaurants.
Tonebarge
the cup's doing.
<g>
TB
--
4F6E65204F5320746F2072756C65207468656D20616C6C2C204F6E65204F5320746
F2066696E64207468656D2CDA4F6E65204F5320746F206272696E67207468656D20
616C6C20616E6420696E20746865206461726B6E6573732062696E64207468656D
Mike Rivers
> That's not coffee - that's espresso, cappuccino, etc; real coffee is what
> you drink first think in the morning to get your heart started, and then for
> the rest of the day to keep it humming along at a high rate of speed.
Here in Seattle, that's when (and why) we drink our espresso. I just
drive through residential neighborhoods on the way to work and there are
at least four drive-by espresso stands along the 5 mile route.
--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mri...@d-and-d.com)
Dave Martin
"Mike Rivers" <mri...@d-and-d.com> wrote in message
news:znr968455974k@trad...
roast Columbian...
hank alrich
> "I tested the tuna against the trout and the trout won."
Probably tested 'em in fresh water, hunh? Sheeeeesh...
Poor tuna never had a chance.
--
hank alrich * secret__mountain
audio recording * music production * sound reinforcement
"If laughter is the best medicine let's take a double dose"
hank alrich
> Well...I was going to...UNTIL YOU PUBLICLY CAME UP WITH THE IDEA SO THAT
> NOW I HAVE TO PAY YOU ROYALTIES!!
Fuck 'im, Markus; just snag it wid Knabster while he's takin' a nap.
hank alrich
> Bet Mark will still get some returns from people who can't "taste" what
> the cup's doing.
In that case maybe it should have an aroma enhancer, so folks can wake
up and smell the cup.
hank alrich
> You were right about one
> thing, fletcher, it does eat my TL for Bfast.
Sexy l'il bastard, ain't it?!?
hank alrich
> Better take a triple dose of that medicine you quote.
Say something funny.
hank alrich
> I suggest a
> six month moratorium on buying any mic under $995 list, just to let the
> market slow down enough for the crap to fall out.
But sometimes I _like_ a dynamic mic. <g>
hank alrich
> I don't know why people compare apples
> and oranges
It's the amateur producer thing. "Should we make pie or juice?" "I
dunno; what do you think?"
Andrew P. Mullhaupt
> Dave Martin wrote:
> >
> > Mine keeps me from leaving coffee cup rings on my TCL-2.
>
> You've been holdin' out on us...we need to add this to the RNC
> applications section on the website!
Odd coincidence. I was just thinking when Fletcher asked how the RNC helps,
that I keep mine on top of a 2290 and they prevent stuff from getting
spilled down there. Then I saw Dave's quote, and decided not to post it.
The other thing about the RNCs is that no matter what other stuff I may have
lent out to friends who are tracking or mixing, they never ask for the RNCs,
and I always have those for myself. If you were from Delaware, I'd bet
they'd get borrowed, though.
Later,
Andrew Mullhaupt
Dave Martin
"Andrew P. Mullhaupt" <smul...@home.com> wrote in message
news:050v5.57467$e11.4...@news1.rdc1.nj.home.com...
>
>
> The other thing about the RNCs is that no matter what other stuff I may
have
> lent out to friends who are tracking or mixing, they never ask for the
RNCs,
> and I always have those for myself. If you were from Delaware, I'd bet
> they'd get borrowed, though.
>
borrow the RNC than any other piece of equipment here. And I wouldn't get it
back until they'd bought their own (which they all put off until I
threatened to kick their ass if they didn't bring it back...).
Mark McQuilken
>
>
> Odd coincidence. I was just thinking when Fletcher asked how the RNC helps,
> that I keep mine on top of a 2290 and they prevent stuff from getting
> spilled down there.
If you were really taking advantage of this "new" technology, you'd
remove the lid and allow it (the RNC) to catch and /hold/ this
spillings. There's actually a hole in the PCB (it was put there as a
drainage channel) to allow the liquid to run off the top of the PCB...
> Then I saw Dave's quote, and decided not to post it.
>
> The other thing about the RNCs is that no matter what other stuff I may have
> lent out to friends who are tracking or mixing, they never ask for the RNCs,
> and I always have those for myself.
By now, I assume, you've used the RNCs extensively. If so, I'm glad that
people aren't asking to borrow 'em...it'd be a real pain to have your
doors closing, books falling off the book shelves, your dining room
table wobbling back-and-forth, your girl getting pregnant (RNCs make
excellent birth-control devices...just have your girl hold one between
her knees), etc.
> If you were from Delaware, I'd bet
> they'd get borrowed, though.
>
> Later,
> Andrew Mullhaupt
Me thinks that both Delaware and I are glad this isn't the case...
Regards,
McQ
__
Mark McQuilken
FMR Audio
www.fmraudio.com
(800)343-9976 - US Only
(512)280-6557 Voice
(512)280-8627 Fax
Mark McQuilken
>
(snip)
>(which they all put off until I
> threatened to kick their ass if they didn't bring it back...).
>
> --
> Dave Martin
Even without knowing where you are, Dave, I'd know you were from the
south after this comment...
Dave Martin
> Dave Martin wrote:
> >
> (snip)
> >(which they all put off until I
> > threatened to kick their ass if they didn't bring it back...).
> >
> > --
> > Dave Martin
>
> Even without knowing where you are, Dave, I'd know you were from the
> south after this comment...
> __
> Mark McQuilken
Well, if I were still living in Texas, I'd have had to say, "...threatened
to whup their asses...", but we're a little more genteel these days. But I'm
still thinking of flying the Lone Star flag with a banner that says, "Texas
Refugees" in the new studio.
Still looking for good brisket in Tennessee,
Andrew P. Mullhaupt
"Dave Martin" <dave....@nashville.com> wrote in message
news:srpqde8...@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "Andrew P. Mullhaupt" <smul...@home.com> wrote in message
> news:050v5.57467$e11.4...@news1.rdc1.nj.home.com...
> >
> >
> > The other thing about the RNCs is that no matter what other stuff I may
> have
> > lent out to friends who are tracking or mixing, they never ask for the
> RNCs,
> > and I always have those for myself. If you were from Delaware, I'd bet
> > they'd get borrowed, though.
> >
> My experience is different from yours - more of my players have asked to
> borrow the RNC than any other piece of equipment here.
I'm not surprised. There are only two people that normally borrow gear from
me - one of them is a studio owner who only borrows stuff that might impress
his clients (like my Lexicons) or was built by people we know, and the other
guy borrows stuff that fits in with his long experience in New York style
rock and roll production (he was trying to borrow an LA-2A but I don't have
one) or was built by people we know. Since we have sort of coincidentally
ended up knowing a lot of people from Delaware, Distressors and Dakings are
the compressors of that sort. I recently retired Ken McKim's Squeeze Box
from lending on account of I know one of my friend's producer clients has
been making increasingly desperate noises about needing one.
It's kind of weird what people do not borrow - nobody wants to borrow the
Focusrite ISA stuff. Well, along with the RNCs, _I_ like 'em.
> And I wouldn't get it
> back until they'd bought their own (which they all put off until I
> threatened to kick their ass if they didn't bring it back...).
Yeah. That doesn't really fly to high when you have to enforce return of the
loan.
Later,
Andrew Mullhaupt
Andrew P. Mullhaupt
> Andrew P. Mullhaupt wrote:
>
> > Odd coincidence. I was just thinking when Fletcher asked how the RNC
helps,
> > that I keep mine on top of a 2290 and they prevent stuff from getting
> > spilled down there.
>
> If you were really taking advantage of this "new" technology, you'd
> remove the lid and allow it (the RNC) to catch and /hold/ this
> spillings. There's actually a hole in the PCB (it was put there as a
> drainage channel) to allow the liquid to run off the top of the PCB...
> > The other thing about the RNCs is that no matter what other stuff I may
have
> > lent out to friends who are tracking or mixing, they never ask for the
RNCs,
> > and I always have those for myself.
>
> By now, I assume, you've used the RNCs extensively. If so, I'm glad that
> people aren't asking to borrow 'em...
The weird thing is that I don't know if they even know about them; certainly
not about all this versatility.
> it'd be a real pain to have your
> doors closing, books falling off the book shelves, your dining room
> table wobbling back-and-forth, your girl getting pregnant (RNCs make
> excellent birth-control devices...just have your girl hold one between
> her knees), etc.
All these applications should get into the next revision of the manual. I
mean, try doing this stuff with an LA-2A.
> > If you were from Delaware, I'd bet
> > they'd get borrowed, though.
>
> Me thinks that both Delaware and I are glad this isn't the case...
I suppose. It just never ceases to amaze me how much music biz per capita
comes out of Delaware.
Later,
Andrew Mullhaupt
Mark McQuilken
>
(snippage)
>
> > it'd be a real pain to have your
> > doors closing, books falling off the book shelves, your dining room
> > table wobbling back-and-forth, your girl getting pregnant (RNCs make
> > excellent birth-control devices...just have your girl hold one between
> > her knees), etc.
>
> All these applications should get into the next revision of the manual. I
> mean, try doing this stuff with an LA-2A.
Note taken...I just wish I could consider that piece of shit I ship with
the RNC as a manual! I'd like to take the time to write a *real*
manual...
>
> > > If you were from Delaware, I'd bet
> > > they'd get borrowed, though.
> >
> > Me thinks that both Delaware and I are glad this isn't the case...
>
> I suppose. It just never ceases to amaze me how much music biz per capita
> comes out of Delaware.
>
> Later,
> Andrew Mullhaupt
Is there really?!?! Although I spent years in Penn and South Jersey, I
never heard of musical goings-on in Del. Lots of country and hip-hop?
What drives the level of business? Big advert biz?
McQ
P.S. - My crack about Delaware was merely flippant, no disrepect
intended toward Delaware or its inhabitants...however, you're definitely
better off with me living elsewhere! :>)
Dave Martin
> I'm not surprised. There are only two people that normally borrow gear
from
> me - one of them is a studio owner who only borrows stuff that might
impress
> his clients (like my Lexicons) or was built by people we know, and the
other
> guy borrows stuff that fits in with his long experience in New York style
> rock and roll production (he was trying to borrow an LA-2A but I don't
have
> one) or was built by people we know. Since we have sort of coincidentally
> ended up knowing a lot of people from Delaware, Distressors and Dakings
are
> the compressors of that sort. I recently retired Ken McKim's Squeeze Box
> from lending on account of I know one of my friend's producer clients has
> been making increasingly desperate noises about needing one.
And all of my guys (Well, except a couple) are musicians who want to add a
little something to their sound. The two exceptions are guys who do
sequencing work for me and who heard it here and wanted to borrow it. to try
at their own places.
>
> It's kind of weird what people do not borrow - nobody wants to borrow the
> Focusrite ISA stuff. Well, along with the RNCs, _I_ like 'em.
It is surprising, based on why they're wanting them (to impress clients) -
I'd love to play with some of the ISA stuff, but I'd hate to actually ask
someone if I could keep them for a week or so.
>
> > And I wouldn't get it
> > back until they'd bought their own (which they all put off until I
> > threatened to kick their ass if they didn't bring it back...).
>
> Yeah. That doesn't really fly to high when you have to enforce return of
the
> loan.
>
Well, all of them work for me all the time, so it's not really as bad as I
painted it. I know that Mark has sold four of them, anyway because of my
loaning mine out. Unfortunately, considering the profit margin on those
things, I'm not to the point that he can afford to pick up the barbecue tab
the next time I'm in Austin...
jpste...@my-deja.com
mug. You barely notice it's there and it passes coffee cleanly onto
your lap with no g.i. tract mucking up the flow.
jp
In article
<0D9D907631034B85.EFC86704...@lp.airnews.net>,
Harvey Gerst <har...@ITRstudio.com> wrote:
> Mark McQuilken <ma...@fmraudio.com> wrote:
>
> >Harvey Gerst wrote:
>
> >> Er... Mark,
> >> Have you considered coming out with a "Really Nice Cup"? No
testing or assembly, instant
> >> profit, free advertising, and zero returns. Think about it!!
Seriously.
>
> >Well...I was going to...UNTIL YOU PUBLICLY CAME UP WITH THE IDEA SO
THAT
> >NOW I HAVE TO PAY YOU ROYALTIES!!
> >
> >Sheesh,
> >McQ
> >
> >P.S. - Cool idea...what do I do for the "Super Nice" part of it?
>
> Mark,
>
> Like Fletcher's cup, you need useful information on it. Popular web
sites, typical
> equipment settings, drum mic positioning tips, mics to consider, a
picture of you, wait,
> that's for the RNDB (really nice dart board), an XLR pin-out picture,
clever audio
> sayings, anything that would raise the perceived value of the cup and
make it a cool thing
> to own. I've got one very cool idea for a cup, but I'll email you
privately about it.
>
> Harvey Gerst
> Indian Trail Recording Studio
> http://www.ITRstudio.com/
Andrew P. Mullhaupt
> Andrew P. Mullhaupt wrote:
> > All these applications should get into the next revision of the manual.
I
> > mean, try doing this stuff with an LA-2A.
>
> Note taken...I just wish I could consider that piece of shit I ship with
> the RNC as a manual! I'd like to take the time to write a *real*
> manual...
> >
> > > > If you were from Delaware, I'd bet
> > > > they'd get borrowed, though.
> > >
> > > Me thinks that both Delaware and I are glad this isn't the case...
> >
> > I suppose. It just never ceases to amaze me how much music biz per
capita
> > comes out of Delaware.
>
> Is there really?!?!
Sort of.
> Although I spent years in Penn and South Jersey, I
> never heard of musical goings-on in Del.
There was. Most of the gigs there are ghastly/hilarious but when I was
playing, there were some people coming from there.
> Lots of country and hip-hop?
I was more in the way of the pop stuff. There were long established regional
bands (such as Jack of Diamonds) which broke up, from which Andy King went
on to the Hooters, Dave Derr went on to Eventide (now he has his own
company - Empirical Labs), Ed Shockley came up to New York and joined our
band, although he survived that and went on to do voiceover work. His
brother Michael later joined too, then went on to be in one of the more
interesting groups I know of ("Ritual Tension").
Another band from Delaware at the same time was "Eighth Day". I'm not too
clear on whose band that was, but Keith Mack went from that to Scandal, and
from that to our band. He survived that mistake, too.
One of the people that mixed these guys, Craig Melvin, went on to have some
national success as a live engineer (Gloria Estefan, Yes, etc.). He mixed
our band, and was not scarred for life. At the time, it was felt that his
mixing got us signed to BMG, and that was probably true.
There were other musicians that oscillated between New York and Delaware.
One of the few to "countercommute" was Robert Kasper, who had left our band
(and Keith Mack took the lead guitar spot he vacated). He had come up with
the Paradise Garage house band the "Peech Boys" and was very New York
oriented (toward the end of his life he was living in Pittsburgh and someone
mentioned his lack of "ego" - he replied "I used to have an ego back in New
York where it would do me some good....") but he played with some Delaware
bands (Kim Parent Band for one - I'm not sure but I think Kim is doing a lot
of session vocals these days).
I don't know where or when this bunch of people came into contact with Geoff
Daking, but they did, which is how I heard of him.
This is not a lot of people, but it's everyone I've ever come across from
Delaware.
> What drives the level of business? Big advert biz?
Thin air? I really don't know about it now.
The gigs tapered off sharply away from the Delaware shore, such as playing
in what looked like a ballroom converted into a Cantonese restaurant, or
this place that you didn't get return bookings for when owner was in prison.
I think it's mostly an offshoot of Philadelphia sort of scene. We always
booked something in Philly or the Jersey shore in between New York and
Delaware.
Later,
Andrew Mullhaupt
Dave Martin
(Kim Parent Band for one - I'm not sure but I think Kim is doing a lot
> of session vocals these days).
>
lot of session work.
Andrew P. Mullhaupt
> "Andrew P. Mullhaupt" <smul...@home.com> wrote in message
> news:0gfv5.60658$e11.4...@news1.rdc1.nj.home.com...
> (Kim Parent Band for one - I'm not sure but I think Kim is doing a lot
> > of session vocals these days).
> >
> If that's the Kim Parent that moved to Nashville, then yeah she is doing a
> lot of session work.
I don't know if it's the same one, although it wouldn't surprise me. If it
is, I'm glad to hear she's still singing.
If she's down your way and you want to know for sure, just ask if she worked
with Robert Kasper. Not that many people did, and nobody who did would
likely forget.
Later,
Andrew Mullhaupt
hank alrich
> Note taken...I just wish I could consider that piece of shit I ship with
> the RNC as a manual! I'd like to take the time to write a *real*
> manual...
I just knew there was a real reason the RNC is so "affordable".
hank alrich
> In article <20000906153248...@ng-ca1.aol.com>,
> moth...@aol.com (Mothra666) wrote:
> Just be happy there are internet
> > resources like this around. It balances the porn well.
>
> LOL....Let's see...15,999,999,999 porn sites to every one useful bit of
> info. Hmmmmm....Good balance!
We can keep it up longer 'cause our work is harder.
Victor Kruger
leave it for what it's worth...obviously nothing to you.
<the_...@my-deja.com> wrote in message news:8p64r4$7ao$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In article <8p4m07$gh0$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> Rob Adelman <r...@skihappy.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> > I have completed the testing and I believe the Audio Technica at4051
> is
> > a superior microphone to the
> > Oktava MC 012,
>
> Superior at what? Where did you get the Oktava from?
>
> though the Oktava was surprisingly close, at a much
> > lower price.
> >
> > The Oktava sounds best with the Cardiod capsule,
>
> Best for what application?
>
> the Omni is a little
> > dark,
>
> Compared to your AT? --another omni? --the Oktava cardioid cap?
>
> and hyper is not as natural
> > sounding.
>
> As what--the cardioid cap? --Shouldn't be. Why would it?
>
> >
> > The Audio Technica is Cardiod only, and compared to the Oktava
> Cardiod
> > capsule, it is smoother and
> > more detailed.
>
> Smooth in what frequency range? What do you mean by smooth? Do you
> mean a flat response? Do you mean a mellow and even transition from
> midrange to treble?
>
> >Sounds closer to being there.
>
> Being where? Right up on an acoustic guitar in a dead room--or 9 feet
> in the air, hanging over a drum kit in a warehouse? (I would use
> different mics in these situations to make it sound like "you're
> there".)
>
> >AT Bass also has a little
> > more energy,
>
> Aaah... so it is not as flat as the Oktava?
>
> >which would explain
> > why the Oktava has to have a slightly higher level on the pre-amp to
> > match levels.
> >
> > Anyone that would like to send me any other mic to put up against the
> > 4051, I would be happy to post an
> > opinion. (mic returned upon
> > completion, of course.)
>
> Yeah sure! You wanna fuck my girlfriend too? Just be sure to return
> her when you're done?
>
>
> >
> > Rob Adelman
> > Boulder, CO
> >
> > {what I lack in gear, I make up for in ear}
>
> Oh, so you lack gear! What preamp were you using? What'cha monitoring
> on? What is your listening environment like? What amp? What kinds of
> recordings do you like? Just what the fuck were you recording?
>
> Look dude, I'm just busting your balls, but user-reviews of equipment
> are misleading enough when someone covers all the details they can. I
> ain't expecting scientific analysis, but we gotta get more outta ya
> than this.
>
> --
> Jim "The Kooch" Kuczkowski
> Not enough memory to complete all overviews
Bob Olhsson
>the real stuff--is absolutely
>delicious!
I used to buy it all the time in the mid '70s but then got into
espresso until I got together with my wife around 1990. She likes
filter coffee in the morning so I tried what they sell now as JBM and
was shocked by how bad it was.
We went to a 50-50 mix of Sumatra and French Roast but that has been
replaced by Kona blends.
--
Bob Olhsson Audio Mastery Recording Project Design and Consulting
Box 555, Novato CA 94948 Tracking, Mixing and Mastering
415.457.2620 FAX 415.456.1496 Mix Evaluation and Quality Control
38 years of making people sound better than they thought possible!