Neve 8108/8128
Dominique Grand
section? What troubles should I expect? How does it sound ( I have
6-1073, an old Helios console circa 75, and a
Midas PR05 to beat...)? What's a good price range for 48 inputs? Are
they worth the investment?
Mucho thanks!!
Dominique Grand
WildSky Studio
Neve 8068
Well number one the console is not Rupert designed so you have that if
that is the type of sound you are interested in. The Eq section on the board is
4 band sweepable on all 4 bands. The console does not have as much ofthe bottom
end depth that their other desks do also.
The other thing is there is that peice of shit routing computer that you can't
get parts for
on the desk and when that goes down you are fucked big time thats how that
board routes everything. The switches on that board also kind of blew also man
they also are shit in progress. If the board has been recapped you are in good
shape. If not ask for the firesale deal so you can do it yourself or have
somebody rebuild it for you . I have done a fair amount of work on those boards
though some of the sessions sounded really good at some studios some were just
nightmares in the making at others. The desk does retain some of the Neve V
sound which is pretty good desk and has stood the test of time. I am a very big
fan of the V series desks. But it all comes to maintinece of the board and how
it was taken care of. If the board hasn't been recapped or reswitched within
the last few years. Expect to pay 30% less for one that hasnt been done.
I wouldn't pay more than 50-55k for a recapped one w/o Automation. 32-37k for a
beat one. Hope this helps- Mark
Fast2323
early 80 series ( I have an 8036 with 1064 EQs and it sounds like god.) or get
a Mackie. They are a lot less trouble, do not take up space, sound better than
a Neve 81 and cost almost nothing. By the way, I have a 24x8 for sale for
$1500.
Your Helios and 1073s are the shit! Why would you want the 81? Keep em.
Steve
Fletcher
>
> Could someone give his $.02 about those 2 consoles?
Oh, they're worth more than $.02...
What is the E.Q.
> section?
4 band sweepable, not too bad, not worthy of the "N" word pedigree.
What troubles should I expect?
Early and often, especially in the routing section. First thing you do
after you shut off the deck, prior to disassebly, blow 1/2 a dozen
spares of the 'Zylog' Eprom. Rent an Eprom blower and make
spares....the more the merrier. That chip dies and you have no
replacement, forget about it...just light a match to the place and call
the insurance company.
How does it sound ( I have
> 6-1073, an old Helios console circa 75, and a
> Midas PR05 to beat...)?
It'll beat the Midas Pro5, hands down and easily....depending on the
maintenance of the '75 Helios...could win, could lose...depending on the
maintenance of the 1073's...nah, it'd still lose. How was the
maintenance on the '81' series desks you're looking at. A well
maintained one is still worth 20-30 grand [depending on frame size], it
will sell some time because of the 'N' word, but will sound like a
glorified/blue painted MCI desk of about the same era.
Oh, and if it has the bargraph meters...make sure you carry 'liability'
insurance...
What's a good price range for 48 inputs? Are
> they worth the investment?
>
48 inputs...that's a pretty big one. Depends on the maintenance...and
how much rebuilding/refurbishing you're going to have to do to get it
back to where it started.
--
Fletcher
Mercenary Audio
TEL: 508-543-0069
FAX: 508-543-9670
http://www.mercenary.com
Mixerman
its predecesors. That center section which everything routes through (this
spells trouble) is a royal pain in the ass. Not to mention your clients
won't be able to tell whether you're mixing their record or microwaving
their dinner.
Mixerman
Dominique Grand wrote in message <3834E604...@total.net>...
>Could someone give his $.02 about those 2 consoles? What is the E.Q.
>section? What troubles should I expect? How does it sound ( I have
>6-1073, an old Helios console circa 75, and a
>Midas PR05 to beat...)? What's a good price range for 48 inputs? Are
>they worth the investment?
>
Philip Barrett
Neves were no longer in production and the V-Series was still a long way
off. Pretty sorry boards really. As other replies have noted the
routing is a mess.
If you are looking for a good sounding (dare I say English sounding?)
board at a reasonable price for cutting tracks I might recomend a used
Neotek. Then again for $20K you could buy a great selection of mic
pre's...
Best of luck...Philip
Jsonorous
I have an 8128, I love it. I just re-capped it this year, and the results were
stunning. It was primarily designed by David Pope, who also designed the
V-series consoles (they are called V series because the Vatican had special
ordered two consoles, and well the V of vatican stayed). Yes the bottom end is
not like the 80 series desks I've worked on, but the top end is very, very
clear and open. The routing section on the 8128 is slightly different than the
cursed 8108, my understanding is that the chip for the 8128 is still available.
The guy who recapped my console is fucking awsome, his name is Steven Laisi,
who was a field tech (and later service manager) during the time these consoles
were manufactured. His company is called Tachion and his number is 860-354-4058
(Connecticut). He knows these things like no one else (except perhaps Dave
Clark who is in LA). With a couple of flavors of tranformer based pre's, you
can make awsome rock recordings (the pre's in the desk are really good too). It
was actually Fletcher who hipped me to the concept of the "N" word, even though
it is not an 80-series, clients love it and it has really been good for my
business!
Jason Orris
The Terrarium
Minneapolis, MN
Jim Green
wondering what's the scoop?
--
=======================================================
Jim Green
jimg...@mysolution.com
=======================================================
"It isn't pollution that's harming the environment.
It's the impurities in our air and water that are
doing it." - VicePresident Al Gore
=======================================================
Geoff Tanner
json...@aol.com (Jsonorous) wrote:
> Hello Folks,
>
> I have an 8128, I love it. I just re-capped it this year, and the
results were
> stunning. It was primarily designed by David Pope, who also designed
the
> V-series consoles (they are called V series because the Vatican had
special
> ordered two consoles, and well the V of vatican stayed).
Aaah! The myths of old Neve's! There was I thinking that the "V" series
title was an "in joke" because David Pope was involved with the design
team and Vatican = V was a play on words . . . I was unaware that the
real "Pope" hsd ordered two consoles!
Still, who knows? I'm always learning new stuff!
Yes the
bottom end is
> not like the 80 series desks I've worked on, but the top end is very,
very
> clear and open. The routing section on the 8128 is slightly different
than the
> cursed 8108, my understanding is that the chip for the 8128 is still
available.
When I ran the spares department it was a constant nightmare trying to
resolve which version of a Z80 processor motherboard a particular
console was fitted with. . . that was back in the early 80's when the
darn things were being built. . . I can well imagine the fun sourcing
chips for them now!
> The guy who recapped my console is fucking awsome, his name is Steven
Laisi,
> who was a field tech (and later service manager) during the time these
consoles
> were manufactured. His company is called Tachion and his number is
860-354-4058
> (Connecticut). He knows these things like no one else (except perhaps
Dave
> Clark who is in LA). With a couple of flavors of tranformer based
pre's, you
> can make awsome rock recordings (the pre's in the desk are really good
too). It
> was actually Fletcher who hipped me to the concept of the "N" word,
even though
> it is not an 80-series, clients love it and it has really been good
for my
> business!
>
> Jason Orris
> The Terrarium
> Minneapolis, MN
>
Actually, I do tend to tease these consoles (spawn of Satan, etc!) but
they were nice sounding consoles and had their place in Neve legacy. I
would imagine that a well maintained 8128 would certainy give some other
consoles a run for their money. The 8108 is a slightly different matter,
especially when we had to change the plastic (ADC?) jacks for Mosses and
Mitchell with O/P amps hanging on sky hooks behind them, but kept in
good shape these consoles can still push out nice sounds.
Recalling our fun supplying parts for these consoles in the 80's, I
think Fletcher's tip of blowing spare EPROMs is very wise!
--
Geoff Tanner
phoeni...@earthlink.net
http://www.phoenixaudio.com
phone: 323 462 4373
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Fletcher
>
> Ok, now how about the 82 series? I have seen a couple on the 'net and was
> wondering what's the scoop?
>
From what I've been able to tell...the centre section had real switches
[as opposed to the membrane switches of the 08/28's]...this made quite a
difference in operation and reliability from what I understand.
Stevaudio
>[as opposed to the membrane switches of the 08/28's]...this made quite a
>difference in operation and reliability from what I understand.
Only the 8232 (32 chs and a 24 buss) had the switches.
Steve
X neve
Interface Audio
Nashville
JC
has standard I/O modules in the last 8 positions instead the line
return only modules, VU instead of the bargraphs and the membrane
switches were replaced with mechanical switches. The one I had was
pretty sweet, very quiet compared to what I was using (a SoundWorkshop
30).
I got mine new in '86 and my ex-partner has since moved it to
Nashville. From what I've heard it's in dire need of maintenance and
most from that era should be checked out thoroughly for noisy pots,
switches, etc...
On Fri, 19 Nov 1999 23:16:36 -0400, Jim Green
<jimg...@mysolution.com> wrote:
>Ok, now how about the 82 series? I have seen a couple on the 'net and was
>wondering what's the scoop?
>
>Jsonorous wrote:
>>
>> Hello Folks,
>>
>> I have an 8128, I love it. I just re-capped it this year, and the results were
>> stunning. It was primarily designed by David Pope, who also designed the
>> V-series consoles (they are called V series because the Vatican had special
>> ordered two consoles, and well the V of vatican stayed). Yes the bottom end is
>> not like the 80 series desks I've worked on, but the top end is very, very
>> clear and open. The routing section on the 8128 is slightly different than the
>> cursed 8108, my understanding is that the chip for the 8128 is still available.
>> The guy who recapped my console is fucking awsome, his name is Steven Laisi,
>> who was a field tech (and later service manager) during the time these consoles
>> were manufactured. His company is called Tachion and his number is 860-354-4058
>> (Connecticut). He knows these things like no one else (except perhaps Dave
>> Clark who is in LA). With a couple of flavors of tranformer based pre's, you
>> can make awsome rock recordings (the pre's in the desk are really good too). It
>> was actually Fletcher who hipped me to the concept of the "N" word, even though
>> it is not an 80-series, clients love it and it has really been good for my
>> business!
>>
>> Jason Orris
>> The Terrarium
>> Minneapolis, MN
Old Chinese Proverb ........
...........Man who run in front of car get tired.
Geoff Tanner
Wasn't that what Fletcher said? The 8232 was a kind of budget version of
the 8128 and those individual switches are easily replaceable compared
to the 81** membrane panels.
I know of a studio with a good, working, spare 8108 membrane panel if
anyone's interested. Give me an email and I'll point you over to them.
Dominique Grand
I also need to know what's the E.Q. on these. Is it close to a 1081? Is it a 33114? I
know there not all class A, but are they at least A/B or all B?
Thanks again!!
Dominique Grand
WildSky Studio
Fletcher
>
> Thanks guys for your input!
> I also need to know what's the E.Q. on these.
They move frequencies around...closer to a Harrison.
Is it close to a 1081?
Only if it's a rather fucked up 1081 that got sweepable.
Is it a 33114?
See 1081 similarities.
I
> know there not all class A, but are they at least A/B or all B?
>
They're just different. There's nothing wrong with A/B, nor B for that
matter, it's just different. It doesn't have the headroom of the
earlier ones, but you can work around that. It does some things, like
percussive tones a bit better than some of the older ones, it does
legato tones, like vocals/guitars differently. They're not bad desks,
just don't sound like the classics that made the 'N' word coveted.
Dennis4JC
What is the E.Q.
>section? What troubles should I expect? How does it sound ( I have
>6-1073, an old Helios console circa 75, and a
>Midas PR05 to beat...)? What's a good price range for 48 inputs? Are
>they worth the investment?
>
>Mucho thanks!!
>
>Dominique Grand
>WildSky Studio
Being the owner of a 48in version of the sometimes maligned 8108, (top secret
code "N78" back in 1978 when the Neve designers plotted to take the audio world
by storm over pints of ale and mortadella sandwiches at the company picnic. Or
somethin like that, eh Geoff? ) I thought I'd toss a few of my thoughts into
the mix....I think the console sounds great. Its strong suit is the very clear
and open summing. The EQ is 4 band sweepable with the high and low bands
switchable bet ween shelving and peak. It includes high and lo pass filters(
sweepable as well) It is very powerful compared to anything else that I have
used (in a console) and is capable of a lot of sizzle if you desire. The low
end eq seems just a bit mushy (Not tight) to me if overused but maybe this is
related to the fact that only part of console has been recapped. The pres are
good. A/b 'ed with the Soundcraft 3200 I had, the pres sounded very similar
dry, but the Neve eq smokes the Soundcraft and the summing is clearer to me as
well. The refurbed 1066's I have sound a bit richer, thicker (eq out), but hey
I got 48 O' these for only.......Well, just never you mind! Track through the
10** modules and mix through the 81 series is a very excellent combination of
thickness and top end clarity. I've not mixed on an 80** series, but I've had
some guys tell me that tracking *and* mixing on one may be a litttle too much
of the same flavor. I know of one top artist that will only mix on 81 series
consoles, and just bought one for himself. Lots of heavy Jazz stuff was done on
these consoles. I have owned a Neotek series one and two, and my friend had a
three. The 8108 whupps every one of these handily, TKO in the first round,
IMO. My friend in town here sold his 32 in to buy a Concept one Otari cause he
needed more inputs (and a break from signal tracing!) and he misses the sonics
and eq of the 8108. His was a particularly troublesome desk that both Fletcher
and Mark (Neve 8068) were familiar with, possibly leaning them a little more
toward the negative in their opinion of the design. I think it was stored in
the basement of a Martha's Vineyard beach house and was completely submerged at
high tide! (kidding....:-) His Dialistat switches would pop like
popcorn...always at the worst possible moment..keep a box 'O toothpicks on hand
to wedge 'em down...Voila! .And Oh Yeah..his eprom was dead too. But you can
track through the insert outs if need be...I like to do that anyway. I haven't
had any trouble with my routing system at all...works fine. I have an
aftermarket touch pad which is better than the original. I have the metal
patch bay. Almost all my switches are still good too...leads me to believe
someone may have sprayed the wrong stuff on some of the consoles that have
excessive problems in this area, dissolving,weakening, the little plastic
mechanism within. Or maybe its just a lot of use.
Its kind of like a woman with an alcoholic for a husband tho...if you fall in
love with one of these desks...the people are out there who can straighten all
this stuff out..your "support group" if you will...kinda like Alanon. Ex- Neve
guys who were around when they were buildin' 'em. If you need any contacts,
email me and I can provide 'em. Burn an extra eprom or two...and find a good
tech cause these are hard to work on. But how else can you get 48 channels 'O
Neve which approximates the modern Neve sound for only..........Oh, there's the
door bell...Gotta go! . ;^)
Dennis Garapic
The Lions Den
Cleveland
216-265-8254ph
216-267-8660fax
Fletcher
>
>
> Being the owner of a 48in version of the sometimes maligned 8108, (top secret
> code "N78" back in 1978 when the Neve designers plotted to take the audio world
> by storm over pints of ale and mortadella sandwiches at the company picnic. Or
> somethin like that, eh Geoff? ) I thought I'd toss a few of my thoughts into
> the mix....I think the console sounds great. Its strong suit is the very clear
> and open summing. The EQ is 4 band sweepable with the high and low bands
> switchable bet ween shelving and peak. It includes high and lo pass filters(
> sweepable as well) It is very powerful compared to anything else that I have
> used (in a console) and is capable of a lot of sizzle if you desire. The low
> end eq seems just a bit mushy (Not tight) to me if overused but maybe this is
> related to the fact that only part of console has been recapped.
That sounds about right...it just doesn't sound like an '80' series by
any stretch of the imagination...not that that is necessarily a bad
thing, just a different thing.
The pres are
> good. A/b 'ed with the Soundcraft 3200 I had, the pres sounded very similar
> dry, but the Neve eq smokes the Soundcraft and the summing is clearer to me as
> well. The refurbed 1066's I have sound a bit richer, thicker (eq out), but hey
> I got 48 O' these for only.......Well, just never you mind! Track through the
> 10** modules and mix through the 81 series is a very excellent combination of
> thickness and top end clarity. I've not mixed on an 80** series, but I've had
> some guys tell me that tracking *and* mixing on one may be a litttle too much
> of the same flavor. I know of one top artist that will only mix on 81 series
> consoles, and just bought one for himself. Lots of heavy Jazz stuff was done on
> these consoles. I have owned a Neotek series one and two, and my friend had a
> three. The 8108 whupps every one of these handily, TKO in the first round,
> IMO.
So far there's not a single point I could argue with you about.
My friend in town here sold his 32 in to buy a Concept one Otari cause
he
> needed more inputs (and a break from signal tracing!) and he misses the sonics
> and eq of the 8108. His was a particularly troublesome desk that both Fletcher
> and Mark (Neve 8068) were familiar with, possibly leaning them a little more
> toward the negative in their opinion of the design. I think it was stored in
> the basement of a Martha's Vineyard beach house and was completely submerged at
> high tide! (kidding....:-) His Dialistat switches would pop like
> popcorn...always at the worst possible moment..keep a box 'O toothpicks on hand
> to wedge 'em down...Voila! .And Oh Yeah..his eprom was dead too. But you can
> track through the insert outs if need be...I like to do that anyway. I haven't
> had any trouble with my routing system at all...works fine.
And the new owner of that particular desk while he's had a small problem
here or there, overall is *very* happy with it. If you ever want the
full history of that desk, I'll be more than happy to share it with you.
You're probably about 150 miles off, but seaside it did reside for a few
years.
I have an
> aftermarket touch pad which is better than the original. I have the metal
> patch bay. Almost all my switches are still good too...leads me to believe
> someone may have sprayed the wrong stuff on some of the consoles that have
> excessive problems in this area, dissolving,weakening, the little plastic
> mechanism within. Or maybe its just a lot of use.
> Its kind of like a woman with an alcoholic for a husband tho...if you fall in
> love with one of these desks...the people are out there who can straighten all
> this stuff out..your "support group" if you will...kinda like Alanon. Ex- Neve
> guys who were around when they were buildin' 'em. If you need any contacts,
> email me and I can provide 'em. Burn an extra eprom or two...and find a good
> tech cause these are hard to work on. But how else can you get 48 channels 'O
> Neve which approximates the modern Neve sound for only..........Oh, there's the
> door bell...Gotta go! . ;^)
>
> Dennis Garapic
Those are my two largest problems with them...they have the 'N' word,
but not the real pedigree. Personally, I think they sound vastly
superior to the modern 'N' word stuff...but that's not all that hard to
do.
Geoff Tanner
denn...@aol.com (Dennis4JC) wrote:
> Dominique Grand inquires:>Could someone give his $.02 about those 2
consoles?
> What is the E.Q.
> >section? What troubles should I expect? How does it sound ( I have
> >6-1073, an old Helios console circa 75, and a
> >Midas PR05 to beat...)? What's a good price range for 48 inputs? Are
> >they worth the investment?
> >
> >Mucho thanks!!
> >
> >Dominique Grand
> >WildSky Studio
>
secret
> code "N78" back in 1978 when the Neve designers plotted to take the
audio world
> by storm over pints of ale and mortadella sandwiches at the company
picnic. Or
> somethin like that, eh Geoff? ) I thought I'd toss a few of my
thoughts into
> the mix....I think the console sounds great.
Hi Dennis
That's a pretty fair appraisal you've given there! I've met engineers in
8108 studios who have told me that the EQ's were the best they had ever
used. . . they certainly are pretty powerful with all that sweepin'!
I dunno about mortadella sandwiches. . . the ones I ate were cheese and
tomato with the white bread a little squigy from the tomato juices! The
cans of beer were OK too and saved the necessity of tearing over to the
Queen's Head at Fowlmere or the Dolphin in Melbourn (if you could get
near the bar) plus all the dashing around to make sure I was back at my
desk microseconds before my crew arrived back and I could tap my watch
and look scornfully managerial!
Mind you, with all the beer and food (in a conference room. . . no
picnics!), I can't remember much about the ideas that were discussed but
just looking at the console demonstrates the broad concepts!
Anyone still owning an original 8108 brochure should look very hard at
the bar graph meters. . . they are actually pieces of orange sticky tape
against a black painted backing! The 250v dc bar graph displays arrived
too late for the photo session!
John O'Donnell
I'm posting to see if anyone has any advice for me.
I semi-recently purchased a replacement bus card for my 8128 from www.81series.com.
The stock computer in my desk works perfectly - all busses and routing are functional. However, the new replacement card is stuck in 32 track/40 channel frame size and doesn't respond to setting the frame size (the stock computer does, and allows 32, 40, and 48 tracks no problem). My desk is 56 channel, 48 bus.
I've tried seeking help from 81series (a man named Louis) but have subsequently been ignored for the past 10 months, blocked on social media, and as I live across the country from them I'm limited in my ability to rectify.
Primarily I'd love for this to work, and all of my communications have been pleading for help or troubleshooting. Short of this, I'd love for them to stand by their product as I currently have a $1,200 paper weight.
Does anyone have thoughts or suggestions on how I may proceed? I found a 3rd party that I'm assuming are the original creators of the card (http://www.larione10.it/matrix/index.htm) but also have had no luck contacting them. I have some friends in New York that are able to swing by their studio as well as the 81series workshop if need be.
thanks for any input.
Scott Dorsey
been around here since the Death of Usenet. Might be worth looking up,
however.
>I semi-recently purchased a replacement bus card for my 8128 from www.81ser=
>ies.com.=20
>The stock computer in my desk works perfectly - all busses and routing are =
>functional. However, the new replacement card is stuck in 32 track/40 chann=
>el frame size and doesn't respond to setting the frame size (the stock comp=
>uter does, and allows 32, 40, and 48 tracks no problem). My desk is 56 chan=
>nel, 48 bus.
Okay, I have not touched one of those consoles in many years, but first of
all what does the service manual say and secondly why did you replace the
card in the first place? Did you buy it just to have a spare?
Pull the working card and the non-working card and look for differences.
Is there a jumper on one and not the other, a trace-jumper cut, an extra
diode or resistor? I wouldn't expect proms on a bus card, but are there
proms and if so do they have stickers on them with version numbers?
>I've tried seeking help from 81series (a man named Louis) but have subseque=
>ntly been ignored for the past 10 months, blocked on social media, and as I=
> pleading for help or troubleshooting. Short of this, I'd love for them to =
that console exists. There's a Facebook group for users of the older Neve
consoles but I think this is likely too new to ask there.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."