Aphex Comps - Which are the good ones?
Analogeezer
started thinking about the Apex line.
Geez, Expressor, Compellor, Dominator, it's hard to keep them all
straight. I've heard some of them totally suck and that others are
really cool. Then there is one that supposedly sucks until Jim
Williams mods it, then it's really cool.
Other than staying away from anything that says "Tubessence", can
anybody suggest what the Aphex comps to look for are?
I know the Dominator is more aimed at broadcast apps, but what's the
diff between an expressor and compellor?
Thanks,
Analogeezer
Bryson
release controls. It's got a hi freq expander (HFX) that boosts treble at a a
selected freq and ratio as the compressor vca attenuates, to compenste for high
end lost from compression. There's also a Lo Cut filter in the sidchain that can
be a handy feature. They track fairly well in stereo, but controls on both units
need to be matched (though there may be a way around that using sidechain
inserts, summing the detector signal, in master/slave mode, blah, blah, blah....
I never tried it...just thought about it in bed one night). It's a good, clean
sounding, useful unit. The "Tubessence" (eeew, that term...whenever I see it, I
hear it in my head with a lisp.) model has the addition of an Auto timing
circuit, but I don't know if it's worth going through that deprived tube for.
The Compellor is a slow compressor combined with an even slower leveler (gain
riding), with next to zero (compression) tweakability. I've always thought it
to be more of a broadcast tool to keep overall program levels consistent, though
I know many use it for recording and mixing.
Garthrr
mix bus and hit it very very lightly to prevent overs. Its the only limiter
I've ever used regularly in this app so I have nothing else to compare it to
but I think it sounds pretty transparent and does a good job with any peaks
that hit it. It's not a unit that you would use to color the sound
deliberately. Its a peak limiter only. There are two models: the 720 which is
the standard model and the 722 which has pre-emphasis for broadcast use.
The Compellor is their compressor and is suggested for use with the Dominator.
I have never used a Compellor but I've heard good things about it. Again, I
think it tends toward transparency, not color.
Garth~
In article <bfb37ea9.03091...@posting.google.com>,
analo...@aerosolkings.com (Analogeezer) writes:
>Geez, Expressor, Compellor, Dominator, it's hard to keep them all
>straight. I've heard some of them totally suck and that others are
>really cool. Then there is one that supposedly sucks until Jim
>Williams mods it, then it's really cool.
>
>Other than staying away from anything that says "Tubessence", can
>anybody suggest what the Aphex comps to look for are?
>
>I know the Dominator is more aimed at broadcast apps, but what's the
>diff between an expressor and compellor?
>
>Thanks,
"I think the fact that music can come up a wire is a miracle."
Ed Cherney
ScotFraser
straight. I've heard some of them totally suck and that others are
really cool. Then there is one that supposedly sucks until Jim
Williams mods it, then it's really cool.>>
I have some Expressors here. A string bass player brought over his Jim Williams
modded Expressor & we compared the same passage through each. It's pretty
subtle. The modded unit had ever so slightly less low end, but there wasn't
enough detail-y kind of stuff on the bass to really hear what may have been
different in the mids or high end. The Williams mod may possibly have felt a
little more hi-fi but I'd need to hear some drums & cymbals to make that
opinion. The stock version doesn't suck, though it's no 1176. It's a clean VCA
compressor that does all right, especially for around $200 used.
<<I know the Dominator is more aimed at broadcast apps, but what's the
diff between an expressor and compellor?>>
A Compellor is a leveler. Set a target output level & your meters go up to
there & stay there, though you won't perceive it as being dynamically altered
much. It's very transparent, doesn't sound squashed, but totally doesn't work
as a compressor ought to on individual tracks. Use an Expressor for that. The
Expressor has the usual VCA controls for attack, release, ratio, make up gain,
input level, etc. The Compellor gives you the most basic of controls & they all
operate fairly nonintuitively. It's pretty much a set once & forget device that
does one thing really well. Chances are you want the Expressor for most day to
day audio work.
Scott Fraser
EdGerhard
remains very transparent. Definitely worth a look.
Cheers,
Ed
Jim Weld
distribution systems, and for that it's great. Handles a tremendous dynamic
range, and it's (almost) idiot proof . I believe its use in the studio is
extremely limited.
Jim
"Analogeezer" <analo...@aerosolkings.com> wrote in message
news:bfb37ea9.03091...@posting.google.com...
Steve Holt
"Bryson" <red...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:aC58b.953$%G3....@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
I really disagree regarding the Compellor in the studio. It is VERY useful,
but it's really a different bird altogether. It's not like any other
processor. I use it mainly for the 2-buss. It's extremely uncolored, and
useful when you want to really flatten the dynamic range on a mix without
really making it obvious. When I want 2-mix transparancy, I break out the
Compellor. When I want 2-mix glue, I use the Smart. It's nice to have both.
But if you're looking for single channel compression, you may want to look
elsewhere.
The Dominator (Dominatrix?) is just a nice limiter to use as the last
processor in the mix chain. Helps me to get hotter mixes to tape.
BTW for some good references, do a google search.
--
Steve Holt
INNER MUSIC
Music Creation & Production
http://www.inner-music.com
http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/steveholt
dwgriffi
scotf...@aol.com (ScotFraser) wrote:
> I have some Expressors here. A string bass player brought over his Jim
> Williams modded Expressor & we compared the same passage through each.
Y'know, the Jim Williams mod is weird to me, in the sense that it makes it
slightly more hi-fi and/or high quality, as you imply, but that to me isn't the
shortcoming of the unit (not that it's so hi-fi). I've got a pair (well, in
the closet) The first compressors that I actually went out and bought a pair
of, as opposed to using what belonged to the studio (probably the best buy in an
inexpensive quality pair at the time), and while their lack of coloration makes
them good for that role, I always had the feeling that if someone would mod them
to give them some real personality they could make some dough. Now that we all
record to disk and use plug-ins to keep levels safe once inside, who among us
could not use another box to make the sound bloom before it hits the platters??
I know you can't turn it into a Distressor with a few extra parts, but I'd pay
for someone to turn it into something that barks instead of acts transparently.
I know JW does a bunch of other improvements to it (power supply, etc) and it's
a quality mod, but Jim's thing seems to be to clean things up, which isn't what
I'd want out of an Aphex Expressor mod.
Anyone know of someone who mods them into not-transparent, beefy squashers?
--
Raindances always worked because they didn't stop dancing until it rained.
To reply, please remove the 555 from the return address
david
<edge...@aol.com> wrote:
My experience with em was just the opposite. I kept a pair around just
for fucking with sounds, to create interesting tones on things. When I
got a Purple 1176 I found it to be much better at this, and my
Expressors hit the road.
I do keep a stereo Compellor 320 around. As long as you ain't really
whacking it with signal it can be pretty transparent when something
stereo needs a little discipline. But I'd never run one of my mixes
thru it.
David Correia
Celebration Sound
Warren, Rhode Island
Rick Powell
I have a pair of the 651 Expressors (non-tube). They do well for
fairly clean compression, especially for vocals with wide dynamics
that need to be tamed. It can be hit hard with -20 dB of compression
with way less artifacts than, say, a dbx 160X. Nice utility
compressor for the money.
RP
WillStG
<< I am thinking about adding another compressor to my collection and I started
thinking about the Apex line.>>
Umm, I thought Apex was a line of cheap Korean VCRs... <g>
<<Geez, Expressor, Compellor, Dominator, it's hard to keep them all straight.
I've heard some of them totally suck and that others are really cool. >>
The rep of Aphex stuff is based on good sounding VCA's, which are very
transparent. You're thinking about adding another compressor, is it for a
specific appplication? The units you mention all do different things.
The Compellor is more of a leveling device than a compressor as most people
think of compressors. It actually brings up low level program towards where
you want it to be rather than merely squashing down loud levels and then adding
gain. And the way it responds to program isn't like a lot of compressors
either, where at a certain bass frequency point the compressor reacts
more(typical DBX thing), it's more evenly tuned, and sometimes it seems the
middle range of what you send it comes out just a tad more "forward" sounding
than it went in. If you wish to squash the dynamic range of acoustic or
classical music for broadcasting a Compellor is a pretty nice way to do it.
Film guys love to run dialog through them, and I have worked in broadcast
joints where the studio/gear combos sounded way bad until a compellor was put
on the 2 mix. Great for applications where other kinds of dynamics devices
have too many drawbacks. I like them.
The Dominator is a brick wall limiter. I have seen them used in
Cablecasting to prevent overs in audio transmission, in PA applications to
prevent people from blowing up a PA system and in studios (covertly inserted
inline) to prevent clients who love certain bass heavy material from blowing up
the good monitors. I would probably feel better about an in-ear monitor system
knowing there was a Dominator between the program source and my ears.
Never used an Expressor.
Will Miho
NY Music & TV Audio Guy
Fox And Friends/Fox News
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits
Ty Ford
The SD is not necessarily a broadcast piece. I have a Compellor and Studio
Dominator. I think I still have reviews of them on my site.
Regards,
Ty Ford
For Ty Ford V/O demos, audio services and equipment reviews,
click on http://www.jagunet.com/~tford
Ty Ford
<red...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>The Expressor is their "real" compressor, with the ratio, thresh, attack,
>release controls. It's got a hi freq expander (HFX) that boosts treble at a a
>selected freq and ratio as the compressor vca attenuates, to compenste for high
>end lost from compression. There's also a Lo Cut filter in the sidchain that
can
>be a handy feature. They track fairly well in stereo, but controls on both
units
>need to be matched (though there may be a way around that using sidechain
>inserts, summing the detector signal, in master/slave mode, blah, blah,
blah....
>I never tried it...just thought about it in bed one night). It's a good, clean
>sounding, useful unit. The "Tubessence" (eeew, that term...whenever I see it,
I
>hear it in my head with a lisp.) model has the addition of an Auto timing
>circuit, but I don't know if it's worth going through that deprived tube for.
>
>
>The Compellor is a slow compressor combined with an even slower leveler (gain
>riding), with next to zero (compression) tweakability. I've always thought it
>to be more of a broadcast tool to keep overall program levels consistent,
though
>I know many use it for recording and mixing.
Not so. The Compellor is just so fucking transparent that you can't hear it
unless you push the crap out of it.
Want artifacts? get a DBX (or many other makes) Don't want to know it's
there, try a Compellor.
Scott Dorsey
>I've used the Compellor to send live and pre-recorded feeds to ceiling
>distribution systems, and for that it's great. Handles a tremendous dynamic
>range, and it's (almost) idiot proof . I believe its use in the studio is
>extremely limited.
I like it a lot in the studio on the stereo buss... brings up average levels
without mucking anything else up and it's pretty transparent in the process.
Also handy just for automated gain riding, when you don't have enough hands.
But it's definitely not something you can use as an effect.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Rob Reedijk
> I am thinking about adding another compressor to my collection and I
> started thinking about the Apex line.
> Geez, Expressor, Compellor, Dominator, it's hard to keep them all
> straight. I've heard some of them totally suck and that others are
> really cool. Then there is one that supposedly sucks until Jim
> Williams mods it, then it's really cool.
> I know the Dominator is more aimed at broadcast apps, but what's the
> diff between an expressor and compellor?
What's the difference between a compellor and a compellor?
Keep in mind there are a few flavours. The older ones are stereo
only while the newer 320s are also dual mono. I have one of the original
ones. Very nice, but I wish I could also use it dual mono.
Rob R.
Jim Williams
You can mod the old 300 compellors into dual mono by cutting some
wires on a ribbon connector and some other stuff. It's all layed out
in the manual on how to do it.
Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades
Rob Reedijk
> Rob Reedijk <ree...@hera.med.utoronto.ca> wrote in message news:<bjsur1$a76$1...@news1.chem.utoronto.ca>...
>>
>> Keep in mind there are a few flavours. The older ones are stereo
>> only while the newer 320s are also dual mono. I have one of the original
>> ones. Very nice, but I wish I could also use it dual mono.
>>
>> Rob R.
> You can mod the old 300 compellors into dual mono by cutting some
> wires on a ribbon connector and some other stuff. It's all layed out
> in the manual on how to do it.
> Jim Williams
> Audio Upgrades
I still haven't managed to find a manual. Plus, mine isn't even a
300, mine just says "Compellor". I was never able to find out if
the original and 300 models are one and the same. If you know,
I would appreciate it.
Rob R.
Chris Del Faro
My understanding (feel free to correct it), is that the tubessence is
more like a mild enhancer than anything remotely resembling a "real"
tube stage.
Wonder how much was marketing hype vs. tangible benefits...
Chris
P.S. Jim, in your mod's, do you tend to prefer the sound of "cleaner"
gear,
like a non-tubesscent Aphex or Symetrix for general usage?
david
<ree...@hera.med.utoronto.ca> wrote:
> I still haven't managed to find a manual. Plus, mine isn't even a
> 300, mine just says "Compellor". I was never able to find out if
> the original and 300 models are one and the same. If you know,
> I would appreciate it.
>
> Rob R.
If it's stereo the answer is yup.
David Morgan (MAMS)
"Rob Reedijk" <ree...@hera.med.utoronto.ca> wrote in message
> > You can mod the old 300 compellors into dual mono by cutting some
> > wires on a ribbon connector and some other stuff. It's all layed out
> > in the manual on how to do it.
> > Jim Williams
> > Audio Upgrades
>
> I still haven't managed to find a manual. Plus, mine isn't even a
> 300, mine just says "Compellor". I was never able to find out if
> the original and 300 models are one and the same. If you know,
> I would appreciate it.
>
> Rob R.
Unfortunately, Aphex can no longer support the model 300. Some of
the parts just aren't there any more. If you need a manual for the 300...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=23793&item=2556992497
--
David Morgan (MAMS)
http://www.m-a-m-s.com
http://www.artisan-recordingstudio.com
David Morgan (MAMS)
"Chris Del Faro" <cdel...@homesoc.com> wrote in message news:63b53f9b.03091...@posting.google.com...
> Anybody here ever met a "toobessence" model they liked? <g>
No
Scott Dorsey
>Anybody here ever met a "toobessence" model they liked? <g>
No.
>My understanding (feel free to correct it), is that the tubessence is
>more like a mild enhancer than anything remotely resembling a "real"
>tube stage.
Yes... get the patent. It's freely available from the uspto patent
server and it's a very enlightening read. There's basically a control
in there to adjust the operating point of the device and they set it
for a given distortion level.
>Wonder how much was marketing hype vs. tangible benefits...
I dunno, some people seem to like how it sounds. I don't, but it's a sound.
WillStG
no longer support the model 300. Some of the parts just aren't there any more.
>>
They do however support the current model which is the 320A, and they
still make a mono version as well, the 324.
WWW.Aphex.com
"Not a compressor or limiter, the Compellor is a an incredibly intelligent
leveler. It automatically gives you dynamic control over your mix, letting you
maintain optimum average levels at all times. Your recordings will sound
louder, fatter, fuller and punchier - without sounding squished, squashed, flat
or lifeless (the usual compressor artifacts) because the transients still get
through, and your mix still has room to breathe."
Roger W. Norman
assessments. Compellor is pretty good and quite transparent across the 2
bus unless you simply are looking for a fucked up sound. Expressor does a
fairly good job taming some tracks that could use a little umph without
going overboard. As always, nothing serves every scenario, and if dollars
aren't a problem for a little more, you shouldn't have too much of a problem
with either one.
As always, fun to see Jim Williams is still paying attention. I'd thought
we lost him 6 months ago! <g>
--
Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio
Purchase your copy of the Fifth of RAP CD set at www.recaudiopro.net.
See how far $20 really goes.
"Analogeezer" <analo...@aerosolkings.com> wrote in message
news:bfb37ea9.03091...@posting.google.com...
David Morgan (MAMS)
"WillStG" <wil...@aol.com> quoted Aphex as such...
> "Your recordings will sound louder, fatter, fuller and punchier - without
> sounding squished, squashed, flat or lifeless (the usual compressor
> artifacts) because the transients still get through, and your mix still
> has room to breathe."
Thus enters the Aphex Dominator.... shave those transients smooth
that the Compellor lets through.
;-)
DM
David Morgan (MAMS)
"Roger W. Norman" <rno...@starpower.net> wrote in message ...
> As always, fun to see Jim Williams is still paying attention. I'd thought
> we lost him 6 months ago! <g>
Wasn't there a rumor of possible war or something back then?
Scott Dorsey
>Thanks. Good thread. Of the products I've used, I agree with most of the
>assessments. Compellor is pretty good and quite transparent across the 2
>bus unless you simply are looking for a fucked up sound.
Oh, yeah... Compellor on the drum overheads. Doesn't give you a huge drum
sound. Doesn't exaggerate the reverb tail. Doesn't make things more
punchy. But it does smooth out the sound of a drummer who doesn't hit
consistently, without doing anything to the overall tone.
Jim Williams
I almost always prefer uncolored, only 'cause the folk's I like to
work with don't need any aural excitement from the gear, they provide
enough on their own. I don't have any "black boxes" that can make them
better than they really are... besides, you can always fuck it up
later during the mix.
The Tube-essence expressor has a tube bypass jumper on the pcb that
begs to be wired to a front panel switch. Best (or worst) of both
worlds.
Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades
http://www.audioupgrades.com
Chris Del Faro
Chris
David Morgan (MAMS)
"Jim Williams" <jwill...@audioupgrades.com> wrote in message news:a377f4b9.03091...@posting.google.com...
>
> The Tube-essence expressor has a tube bypass jumper on the pcb that
> begs to be wired to a front panel switch. Best (or worst) of both
> worlds.
> Jim Williams
> Audio Upgrades
> http://www.audioupgrades.com
Excellent bit of information. Thank you!
Bryson
I tend not to use the leveler side much (not that I've put in much time to find
it's ideal use).
Scott Dorsey
>Is this with the leveler dialed in, or just compression only?
Depends on whether it helps any. I find it's handy for levels that change
slowly.
>I tend not to use the leveler side much (not that I've put in much time to find
>it's ideal use).
It's a thing for levels that change gradually over time. It's like a little
guy inside with his hand on a level control, and basically is there to replace
manual gainriding.
Mike Rivers
> The Compellor is just so fucking transparent that you can't hear it
> unless you push the crap out of it.
And there's something wrong with that? I guess so, if you're looking
for a change in tone.
--
I'm really Mike Rivers (mri...@d-and-d.com)
Mike Rivers
In article <WK98b.3776$Nx6.5...@news20.bellglobal.com> st...@inner-musicNOSPAM.com writes:
> The Dominator (Dominatrix?) is just a nice limiter to use as the last
> processor in the mix chain. Helps me to get hotter mixes to tape.
I remember one AES show (pre Javitts Center days) when Aphex had the
Compellor, Exciter, and Dominator on display and they were handing out
buttons and T-shirts which said "Compel, Excite, Dominate." Laurel
Cash (Jones), a media person who's quite the babe walked out of the
show on a warm evening wearing one of those Aphex T-shirts and ducked
into a hotel bathroom to change shirts after realizing why she was
geting more than the usual amount of stares.