Red Dwarf Star found NOT guilty of rape
SD. Cox
: Well, I haven't heard it yet, but one wonders what effect, if any, this
: will have on Charles' career, irrespective of verdict
yes its like the policeman recently cleared of rape should the accused
be named in these cases when the alleged victim is not?
Skip
Dave Crowson
>Well, I haven't heard it yet, but one wonders what effect, if any, this
>will have on Charles' career, irrespective of verdict
He did state on the radio that it was unfair that the media had named him
(photo+address), and that the law permits this.
He thinks the law should be changed to protect the innocent in rape cases.
After all, he was named, and she wasn't.
But you're right mud can sometimes stick.
It's not a bad situation to be in, after all everyone now knows he's into
kinky sex, but is harmless ;-)
__________________________________________________________________
David Crowson Oracle Consultant (since '83)
igo...@ombomb.demon.co.uk weir...@cix.compulink.co.uk
'Hit them in the Face, with a Funky Bass, for a Happy Smiling Race'
Janet Graham
: [snip] but one wonders what effect, if any, this
: will have on Charles' career, irrespective of verdict
:
I wonder too.
CC has been held since 8th JULY 1994 for goodness sakes and now we know it
was for no good reason. He was threatened with a knife in Wandsworth prison
and feared for his life and they had to move him. On top of that there is
all the strain placed on his family and friends and his poor fiancee. He
must be crushed beyond belief.
If he decides to leave off Red Dwarf for a while I'll be gutted but I won't
flame him, but I would have thought comedy would be good therapy..?
--
Janet
...[dammit]...
sig imagination bypass this week, sorry
Simon Peach
piece of television. CC explained his feelings re events and
made some observations re. the legal system, (essentially that it
had failed him).
Frost produced a solicitor (sorry I missed the person's
particular speciality) who proceeded to savage everyone in sight.
The lawyer accused CC of being subjective about the whole issue
of rape trials (suprising huh?) and too emotional to draw valid
conclusions.
Frost, usually the most mild mannered of hosts, turned on the
solicitor with a counter accusation of subjectivity. I haven't
done justice to the sparks that flew but, trust me, it was well
worth seeing.
My wife and I concluded that the solicitor must work in the
context that *any* criticism of rape justice is wrong regardless
of the facts. There is merit in the argument - no woman should
feel that seeking justice is a bad decision - but this solicitor
really did come across as something of a zealot.
Interesting, (I think so anyway).
SP
Dave Crowson
> ng...@aber.ac.uk (NEIL GARY DODD) writes:
>According to Radio 1's Newsbeat program, Craig Charles and his friend have
>been found NOT guilty of rape and the associated charges.
It's true , I heard it on Virgin at 1pm.
Hurrah, presumably they can get on with RD7 now :):)
JoeyLemur
of the trial were not release during it...
...but are the details available now? Just the important bits, mind you.
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...I revolve around it." - Ed Powell
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"Meanwhile, Dr. Beckett, finding himself in Data's life, realizes that the
only way to fulfill his life is to give into his burning desires for both
Dr. Bashir and Princess Leia. However, this infuriated Han Solo, so in
his rage he slew Joel. Out of despair at the loss of their friend, the
Bots left the Sattelite of Love to work for Oscar Goldman."
- Part of a post by an...@spdcc.com, found on r.a.s.tv.b5
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
T H I S S P A C E F O R R E N T (email joey...@aol.com)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
L.J. Gretton
Janet Graham <Ja...@louder.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>CC has been held since 8th JULY 1994 for goodness sakes and now we know it
>was for no good reason. He was threatened with a knife in Wandsworth prison
>and feared for his life and they had to move him. On top of that there is
>all the strain placed on his family and friends and his poor fiancee. He
>must be crushed beyond belief.
CC was on Kilroy this morning (sad bugger that I am, I watch this whenever
possible), and the debate was about whether rape defendants should remain
anonymous. He was very emotional, and described having to explain to his young
son why he was in prison.
>If he decides to leave off Red Dwarf for a while I'll be gutted but I won't
>flame him, but I would have thought comedy would be good therapy..?
Quite.
Liam
Robert Nicholson
>Quite.
>Liam
Absolutely, I think they should pass a rule whereby if the press
decide to name you as the rapist and consequently give out your
address then you should have the right to sue if subsequently
found not guilty.
That would make the papers think twice about such an action.
(However, I think one could argue that regardless
of guilt it should not be necessary to divulge personal details such
as address to the public)
Kilroy showed that it wasn't a simple matter in deciding when an
accused rapist should be given anonimity and raise some good points.
--
"Mary had a little lamb and punk rock isn't dead"
(PGP key: send email with Subject: request pgp key)
DS CHASE
: >If he decides to leave off Red Dwarf for a while I'll be gutted but I won't
: >flame him, but I would have thought comedy would be good therapy..?
In one of the Sunday papers he said that he was 'looking forward
to getting back to the Dwarf', presumably he wants to get on with his
career as soon as possible.
Dyl.
Andrew Wong
him, he apparently talked about how the rape victim couldn't stop asking
for sex with him.
Dunno about you, but this doesn't exactly paint him in a favourable
light...
--
Andrew Wong Internet: ach...@bradford.ac.uk
-----x----- WWW: http://www.brad.ac.uk/%7Eachwong/index.html
The Americans have OJ Simpson. We had Craig Charles.
Jim Miller
your sanctimonious horse until you read his report of the trial. (Yank RDwarf
fans can go on happily believing the sun shines out of Charles' arse forever).
The article's been held back a week because TO were scared of libel writs, but
is definitely on it's way. Ronson sat in on the whole trial and has some
interesting angles on proceedings.
On a personal note I find these messages of the type "CC is innocent of all
vileness, this woman set him up, can we have the next series of RD NOW please
?", revolting. Be ashamed of yourselves, you selfish student tarts
Jim
--
Jim Miller
London
Uk
The man of independent mind, he looks and laughs at a' that
Peter Timothy Jackson
In article <3j95ja$q...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, joey...@aol.com (JoeyLemur) writes...
>I'm not sure how the British court system works...I imagine that details
>of the trial were not release during it...
>
Reports of the trial have appeared here. The only bit that must remain secret
is what happened in the jury room, including what the jury really thought of
the woman's evidence.
Peter
Alternative email address - p...@uvo.dec.com
C Speed
>In one of the Sunday papers which trumpeted an exclusive interview with
>him, he apparently talked about how the rape victim couldn't stop asking
>for sex with him.
>Dunno about you, but this doesn't exactly paint him in a favourable
>light...
If it is true then how can it possibly paint him in an unfavourable light?
It would, more likely, offer some background as to why the rape charge was
brought in the first place. If it is not true he is hardly being an
untypical bloke in bragging about his sexual magnetism *&)
He's just this bloke, y'know?
> The Americans have OJ Simpson. We had Craig Charles.
Yeh, but we gave Craig Charles a fair trial...
Claire
*******************************************************************************
* "And though we say all information should be free it is not. *
* Information is power and currency of the virtual world we inhabit." *
*******************************************************************************
* C.Speed - <spe...@cs.man.ac.uk> <http://www.cs.man.ac.uk/~speedc/> *
*******************************************************************************
Ian Tomkinson (CM42-1)
: I'm not sure how the British court system works...I imagine that details
: of the trial were not release during it...
:
: ...but are the details available now? Just the important bits, mind you.
the details of the case were printed in all the papers every day throughout the trial. So everyone knew what was going on.
Ian Tomkinson<itom...@pine.shu.ac.uk> not teak!
L.J. Gretton
Jim Miller <10012...@CompuServe.COM> wrote:
[blah blah blah blah]
>?", revolting. Be ashamed of yourselves, you selfish student tarts
Charming.
Liam
L.I. Morzov
well, joked about the trial and accusation, and kept his demur bright. If he
suffered mantally, you can see he has worked through it, and seems relitively
happy. Anyhow, his performance on the Word proved to be just as hillarious as
his past appearances, and he kept his Red Dwarf aire about him. CC is doing
well, and I'm sure glad the scandal is over.
Keith Clatworthy
> With rape, the accused is guilty until proven innocent (and then maybe still
> guilty because the police didn't prosecute him properly - note the number of
> people who say that Craig Charles "got off", rather than "didn't do it").
I totally agree with you, unfortunately we always seem to focus on the negative and the phrase
MUD STICKS is oh so true. I know a prison warder who says 10% of all inmates are innocent, sad
to say he's probably correct. What a warped world we live in :-(
--
Keith Clatworthy
We're all in the gutter...but some of us are looking at the stars...
(Oscar Wilde)
Mr Peter Marsden
|> In article: <D5Kxn...@cee.hw.ac.uk> adr...@cee.hw.ac.uk (Adrian Hurt) writes:
|>
|> > With rape, the accused is guilty until proven innocent (and then maybe still
|> > guilty because the police didn't prosecute him properly - note the number of
|> > people who say that Craig Charles "got off", rather than "didn't do it").
|>
|> I totally agree with you, unfortunately we always seem to focus on the negative and the phrase
|> MUD STICKS is oh so true. I know a prison warder who says 10% of all inmates are innocent, sad
|> to say he's probably correct. What a warped world we live in :-(
|> --
|>
|> Keith Clatworthy
do it just that it could not be proved to a star-struck jury. Ditto Craig
Charles if the police had got a doctor to that woman quicker he might be
in the slammer now.
Richard vine
(Mr Peter Marsden) writes:
>Oh yes , well O.J. might be found not guilty that does not mean he did not
>do it just that it could not be proved to a star-struck jury. Ditto Craig
>Charles if the police had got a doctor to that woman quicker he might be
>in the slammer now.
I find this intolerable. Craig Charles went through months of imprisonment on
remand, faced a jury, and was found NOT GUILTY.
Ignorant speculation like your "if the police had got a doctor to that woman
quicker he might be in the slammer now" does nothing but slander the innocent.
Are you aware that the police offered to take the woman to a different Rape
Crisis Centre where there _was_ a doctor available, but she declined (because
it meant a car ride of 30 minutes)? Have you read the trial transcripts? Did
you sit through the trial?
Or are you just going on the impression of the trial gained from the media?
In which case you are speaking from TOTAL ignorance.
/Richard V.
====================================================================
The views expressed are mine. The blame for them belongs to society.
====================================================================
Gareth M. Evans
I know rap isn't a crime (it should be) but I never realised Craig
Charles had been accused of shouting incomprehensible lyrics to a
tedious backbeat.
You learn something new....
--
----
"Darling I've missed you" She said, and fired again.
Gareth M. Evans, TEL: +44 1223 428245
Tadpole Technology PLC, FAX: +44 1223 428201
Cambridge Science Park, EMAIL: g...@tadpole.co.uk
Cambridge, CB4 4WQ
David Shepherd
: The thing that i do not understand is that in rape cases the judge has the
: ability to disallow the press to publish the identity of the raper or rapee (I
: think but I am not sure). this is due to a number of legal reasons but
: appears to mainly reside within the therums of defammation. However, I have
: always wondered why they did not keep the identity of CC anonymous until there
: was either a conviction or an acquittal?
: Just a thought,
The reason is that a rape victim is guaranteed anonymity as otherwise
they were reluctant to come forward and make an accusation. Similar
anonymity was given to an unconvicted defendant but this was lifted as
it causes problems with police operations searching for a rapist. After
the Ealing Vicarage case the victims anonymity was increased as previously
anonymity was only guaranteed once the case came to court and this case
highlighted a loophole were tabloids could identify the victim before
anyone was arrested - corresponding protection for an accused person
then would mean that police could not display photofits of a suspect
+ if someone was arrested but name was protected then no-one else who
had been attacked by the same person could come forward and add evidence.
Interestingly Germaine Greer has just moved into the controversy by
taking the line that the anonymity laws makes rape into a special
category of crime that is seen as being worse than all others and thus
indirectly may harm the victim as pschologically they feel much
more harmed than if it were treated more as a very serious form
of physical assault.
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
david shepherd
SGS-THOMSON Microelectronics Ltd, 1000 aztec west, bristol bs12 4sq, u.k.
tel/fax: +44 1454 611638/617910 email: d...@bristol.st.com
www: http://www.inmos.co.uk/~des/welcome.html
"whatever you don't want, you don't want negative advertising"
Andrew Wong
: Or are you just going on the impression of the trial gained from the media?
: In which case you are speaking from TOTAL ignorance.
Erm... hang on. There aren't many people who would know about news like
this if it weren't for the media. So what you're saying is that anyone
who listens to the media is speaking from TOTAL ignorance. Hmmm....
btw, I was reading the Craig Charles interviews on the Sunday paper,
where he was basically saying that the 'accuser' was continually pestering
him for sex. Whether he was guilty or not, this isn't going to help raise
his public profile.
--
Andrew Wong Internet: ach...@bradford.ac.uk
-----x----- WWW: http://www.brad.ac.uk/%7Eachwong/index.html
"I don't know about the super-highways - it's Ask me for the
a load of techno-wank, frankly..." - Ben Elton Ben Elton FAQ...
Mr M D Warren
Hmmm...I think you will find that The major defence argument was that the
women refused herself , to be examined...NOT that the police were slow..
Mike Warren.
Richard vine
>These were Richard vine's words of wisdom:
>: Or are you just going on the impression of the trial gained from the media?
>: In which case you are speaking from TOTAL ignorance.
>
>Erm... hang on. There aren't many people who would know about news like
>this if it weren't for the media. So what you're saying is that anyone
>who listens to the media is speaking from TOTAL ignorance. Hmmm....
>
>btw, I was reading the Craig Charles interviews on the Sunday paper,
>where he was basically saying that the 'accuser' was continually pestering
>him for sex. Whether he was guilty or not, this isn't going to help raise
>his public profile.
The details that I mentioned in my post did _NOT_ come out in the mass media.
Their coverage was typically sensationalist, and was quite quiet about CC's
part of the story because it did not make for good headlines ("She's making
it all up" cannot compete with "I was raped by TV star"). I got these details
from posts (on the net) by someone who went to the trial and sat in the gallery.
Lest you think that indicates a bias, the person went there because they wanted
to KNOW what was going on, not read about it second hand.
I was objecting to the original poster's assertion that "if the police had got
a doctor to the woman in time then CC might be in jail now". I found that
assumption to be intolerable. And if you continue with the "whether he was
guilty or not" language, then you are also introducing doubt into a case where
none exists. He was found NOT GUILTY by a jury who spent 2 weeks listening to
the evidence. Please do NOT assume that you know more about the case from
reading about it in the papers than they do from listening to ALL the evidence.
Mr Brian Williams
up at an ex-girlfriend's house, Stoned out of his head on booze and cocaine who he claims is obsessed with him,
and He just wants a 'bacon butty' . Pull the other one you Scouse rapist.
Tony McAlinden
: In article 13...@zippy.dct.ac.uk, mab...@mathssun5lancs.ac.uk
: (Mr Peter Marsden) writes:
:
: >Oh yes , well O.J. might be found not guilty that does not mean he did not
: >do it just that it could not be proved to a star-struck jury. Ditto Craig
: >Charles if the police had got a doctor to that woman quicker he might be
: >in the slammer now.
: I find this intolerable. Craig Charles went through months of imprisonment on
: remand, faced a jury, and was found NOT GUILTY.
: Ignorant speculation like your "if the police had got a doctor to that woman
: quicker he might be in the slammer now" does nothing but slander the innocent.
I don't suppose you've watched any of the documentaries recently showing how
it's next to impossible for the Crown to get a conviction for date rape in
this country? As long as the woman's spoken to the defendent the defence
usually claim she was "asking for it...."
I don't think you can say that Craig Charles exactly came out of this smelling
of roses. He was quite happy to admit that he taken cocaine, and engaged in a
few other activities that might have surprised some of his fans.
: Are you aware that the police offered to take the woman to a different Rape
: Crisis Centre where there _was_ a doctor available, but she declined (because
: it meant a car ride of 30 minutes)? Have you read the trial transcripts? Did
: you sit through the trial?
Did you? Don't you have a job to go to? ;-)
I never usually write this, but since I'm possibly being slanderous :
My opinions, not those of my employers. Allegedly.
Cheers.
Tony.
--
Tony McAlinden Email : to...@hpsqf.sqf.hp.com
Hewlett-Packard Ltd Phone : +44 (0)131 331 7268
Barrie Dunbavin
scouser is not.
so calm down....calm down....calm down.
Simon Newman
I tend to believe him, to the extent that he wasn't found guilty of rape.
It all sounded rather dubious to start with, and the jury didn't seem to
have much trouble reaching their verdict. Then again, I may just be
biased against the alleged victim cos she was supposed to have slagged him
off for going with a "white woman" - being white myself (albeit male)
I'd say he had excellent taste...
- Simon (I'm drunk - ignore me.)
Gaz
You really do talk utter bollocks, I hope you realize what you said is slander, it
is just as easy to sue you as it is to sue the SUN.
I mean we cant all be Wankastrian wankers, so get a life, and yeah those
people from birmingham really were part of the IRA afterall. Of course.
Gaz.
Mike Cowgill
If he sees this, then I hope you have a good lawyer......
Mike.