GL/ The Sonia Satra Thing
Lancebowski
[...]
Ian wrote:
"Total blank. Who are we talking about here? Lucy Cooper?..."
Cory wrote:
"Yes. Hence the 'you'll hear a lot of people...' comment. I won't be
one of them, but the general dislike for Sonia Satra is rampant in
RATSC for whatever reason."
No. There's no grounds for such a sweeping statement.
Using the search term "gl sonia satra lucy" in the gl subgroup for
the years 2002 - 1993 (in sequence), there was NO evidence of general
dislike for the actress.
Isolating on 2002, "anti-Satra and/or 'Lucy'" sentiments were
voiced by Bo and Donna B. A middle ground was taken by
MsLiz, Sarah (sarahlee22), Jeri, and I presume, Cory.
I seemingly was alone in overt positive comments for Sonia.
From "Re: GL: Marina today", 8.14.02:
Cory: "I still can't figure out why all the criticism of Sonia, and
it's been years since it all started."
Sarah: "...I agree with 110% on the Sonia Satra thing and you and I
are not alone. In fact, until I came here, I had NEVER seen a negative
word said about her on the Internet."
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&selm=3D5AE6F0.1174%40juno.com
In fact, Sarah appears to be correct.
I stopped 10 pages deep in a web-wide Google search on "sonia
satra" - no negative comments about the actress (some of her vehicles
didn't fare quite as well). Feel free to keep going.
For the record, Sonia is aging well, too [;)]:
http://www.soniasatra.com/sonia_entry_page.html
http://www.geocities.com/TelevisionCity/Network/5280
Again, there is not, nor has there been, a rampant dislike of Sonia
Satra and/or her acting abilities voiced in the group.
Let the lurkers declare.
[ The gross inaccuracies are starting to add up (yeah, I can give
chapter and verse); either someone checks them, or the sub-group risks
turning into a "poor cousin" of Media Domain. Sue me.]
Lancebowski
http://bios7.tripod.com/bioblog/psychoblog.html#psy
Donna L. Bridges
from the heat, in Msg.# <MPG.17d793f7d...@News.CIS.DFN.DE>,
Cory <reincarna...@yahoo.com> gasped out:
>On 28 Aug 2002 21:17:03 -0700, Lancebowski said the following:
>> [ The gross inaccuracies are starting to add up (yeah, I can give
>> chapter and verse); either someone checks them, or the sub-group risks
>> turning into a "poor cousin" of Media Domain. Sue me.]
>
>--- Cory, thinkin' that with only one more day to go before the strike,
>and only minimal progress made, baseball will be DOA by the time the
>week's over... (get your sh*t in gear guys and wise up!!!)
'The' gross inaccuracies of what?!!! Cory's initial statement? If so,
I imagine that a part of it comes from his view of both RATSa & RATSc
adding in people who didn't care for Sonia Satra as Nurse Barbara on
OLTL. But, even with that, mostly people don't talk about her. When
they do it's rare to find people in the middle, usually finding people
who really really liked her or those of us who who really really
disliked her. And, since she's worked so few times & been hired 2 of
those times by Jill Farren Phelps that stands out.
And, FWIW, I see no sign of MDness here, thank goodness. And, speaking
of checking 'them, whatever them is I suppose is related to what THE
gross inaccuracies of what may mean, did you use all potential
reasonable variations in your Google groups search? And, then, check
each thread fully for posts where she'd have been relegated to a
pronoun?
--
DonnaB <*> shallotpeel/Yahoo Msgr 8^>
"There is always a better way." - Thomas Edison
Ian J. Ball
Cory <reincarna...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On 28 Aug 2002 21:17:03 -0700, Lancebowski said the following:
> >
> > Isolating on 2002, "anti-Satra and/or 'Lucy'" sentiments were
> > voiced by Bo and Donna B.
>
> And Ian, too, IIRC. I'm *not* trying to put words in Ian's mouth,
> either, because Ian has people he does like and people he doesn't like,
> as do we all, and I just remember right now (very early in the morning)
> that Sonia is on one of those "lists". I just can't remember if it's his
> "like" list or his "hate" list that she is on.
For the record, I despised Satra as Lucy Copper, and I believe I stopped
watching for a while when she was on.
Howeever, unlike Donna, I thought Satra was much better when she was on
OLTL. She played a needy, psycho character who was annoying, but she did
that well.
So, Ian: anti-GL Satra, somewhat pro-OLTL Satra.
--
Ian J. Ball | "Do you know why I left you to die? - Because you're
TV lover, and | just so uncompromisingly *inferior*!" - Tyr Anasazi,
Usenet slacker | from the "Andromeda" episode "Exit Strategies"
ib...@san.rr.com | http://members.aol.com/IJBall/WWW/TV.html
Donna L. Bridges
from the heat, in Msg.#
"Ian J. Ball" <iball***SPAM-No***@san.rr.com> gasped out:
>For the record, I despised Satra as Lucy Copper, and I believe I stopped
>watching for a while when she was on.
>
>Howeever, unlike Donna, I thought Satra was much better when she was on
>OLTL. She played a needy, psycho character who was annoying, but she did
>that well.
>
>So, Ian: anti-GL Satra, somewhat pro-OLTL Satra.
FTR, I was somewhat on the fence about Sonia Satra when she played
Lucy Cooper on GL but when she was amazingly one-note, again, on OLTL
then I made up my mind. And, the OLTL role made her even worse looking
back at GL. But, no, she never made me stop watching anything in the
past, yet I would have a hard time deciding whether to stick it out if
she were cast on anything I was watching now.
And, I hear that she's a very nice person, a very good interview,
speaks very highly of her time at GL, plus, she also has considerable
incentive & initiative in being a part of getting an indi movie off
the ground.
--
DonnaB <*> shallotpeel/Yahoo Msgr 8^>
"While moral rules may be propounded by authority the fact that these
were so propounded would not validate them." - A. J. Ayer (1910-1989),
British philosopher: title essay in The Meaning of Life and Other
Essays, (1990)
Dave
I suppose I qualify as a lurker, as I took a several-year hiatus from
RATSC. I had to search through old posts to find out if I ever
commented on Satra, and was shocked to see some positive comments I
made around the time of Lucy's rape. As her romance with A-M
developed, my opinion of the character and actress steadily declined,
though I think I must have posted most of my negative thoughts on the
GLDiscuss list.
To be fair, McTavish and Laibson weren't kind to most of the cast of
GL, or to the show itself. But I think other actors were better at
transcending the dreck than Satra was. By the time she left, her
final scene couldn't arrive soon enough for me. It's probably best
that the character be left behind, but if she returns with A-M (if he
actually ever returns), I'd pray for a recast.
Of course, my enhanced negativity toward Ms. Satra's performance
coincided with increased correspondence with Bo, so perhaps I was
corrupted. <g> (Hi Bo!)
Dave
Bo
wrote:
>> Isolating on 2002, "anti-Satra and/or 'Lucy'" sentiments were
>>voiced by Bo and Donna B.
This is what I wrote:
"As much as I detested Lucy Cooper and Sonia
Satra's acting (in general), the scenes of Lucy's
rape by Brent Lawrence...and especially the
scenes immediately following the rape...were
like high art compared to what we saw today."
I guess that does come off as a criticism of Sonia Satra, but it was
actually a backhanded compliment [I think Sonia can act circles around
this current Marah, whatever her name is, and she (Sonia) did do
really really well with the rape aftermath].
And just to clarify my position on Sonia: I think she does have a
modicum of talent; I just didn't want the character of Lucy paired
with Matt, which is the way TPTB seemed to be headed when Matt first
blew into town. I was a huge Mattessa fan from the get-go, and Lucy
seemed a threat to that pairing. I remember eveyone thinking that
Matt & Lucy would be so gosh-darned cute together, while I thought
they would be vomitocious and boring and just plain wrong.
So there was that...plus the fact that Sonia Satra's voice is
extremely annoying. ;) But I agree with the sentiment that Buzz's
other daughter should at least be mentioned from time to time, if not
recast and brought back to town.
(Those of you who knew me when are probably shaking their heads since
I've done a 180 on the Cooper family over the past 6-7 years or so. I
actually dig Frank now. <g>)
By the way...can anyone tell me why Buzz's other kid(s?) is(are?)
living in England now?
-Bo
Email: b...@bodacia.com
Personal Site: http://www.bodacia.com
Professional Site: http://www.envirocal.com
Murray Fox
cabr...@hotmail.com wrote on 8/29/02 12:17 AM:
> Cory wrote:
> "Yes. Hence the 'you'll hear a lot of people...' comment. I won't be
> one of them, but the general dislike for Sonia Satra is rampant in
> RATSC for whatever reason."
>
>
>
> No. There's no grounds for such a sweeping statement.
>
> Using the search term "gl sonia satra lucy" in the gl subgroup for
> the years 2002 - 1993 (in sequence), there was NO evidence of general
> dislike for the actress.
>
> Isolating on 2002, "anti-Satra and/or 'Lucy'" sentiments were
> voiced by Bo and Donna B. A middle ground was taken by
> MsLiz, Sarah (sarahlee22), Jeri, and I presume, Cory.
> I seemingly was alone in overt positive comments for Sonia.
How come you didn't include my anti-Lucy Sonia comments? I posted one or
two or three messages this summer about that topic specifically. And if you
couldn't find my messages (or didn't bother to include them in your count),
I'm guessing that there are lots of other anti-Satra posters out there.
> Again, there is not, nor has there been, a rampant dislike of Sonia
> Satra and/or her acting abilities voiced in the group.
>
> Let the lurkers declare.
There's no need for the lurkers to jump out of the woodwork until all the
people who actually posted negative commetns are included in your survey.
:)
Bo
>Of course, my enhanced negativity toward Ms. Satra's performance
>coincided with increased correspondence with Bo, so perhaps I was
>corrupted. <g> (Hi Bo!)
Now, Dave...you're going to get me in trouble here. ;)
As I said in my other post, the Coopers have definitely grown on me
(well, except for Harley, who's on my last nerve lately). Back in the
mid-90s, as you WELL know (<g>), I detested the entire Cooper family
(ironic since it was Justin Deas who attracted me to GL in the first
place).
But, now, after coming back to GL following a 4-year viewing hiatus, I
am really enjoying this family...like I said, with the exception of
Harley who has turned into a shrewish cartoon-character. Marina is a
delight to watch, and I actually like this current version of Frank --
not so much the bellowing blue-collar macho, but more sort of the
bewildered, but loving, single father. Frank's a cop, but he has no
idea how to handle the pistol that his teenage daughter has become.
What can I say? I'm enjoying it.
Lancebowski
"How come you didn't include my anti-Lucy Sonia comments? I posted one
or two or three messages this summer about that topic specifically."
Because it didn't pop out yesterday.
For 2002, I even checked Googles' (linked) message: "In order to
show you the most relevant results, we have omitted some entries
similar to the ones displayed...". Again, you didn't pop out.
TODAY, searching by your name +sonia, I found:
"Re: GL: Marina today and Lucy from long ago yesterday"
Murray Fox (8.15.02):
"Why criticize Sonia Satra? Because she garbled any line she spoke and
couldn't ennunciate to save her life. But that's a personal
complaint..."
[ I should preface my following remarks by noting that I was
pleasantly surprised that Cory understood where I was coming from in
commenting on "his" statement. Because it wasn't really "his", but an
inaccuracy that had popped up several times. ]
Murray, let me make myself perfectly clear to you: in order to
challenge an unsupported, sweeping statement, it is in NO way
incumbent upon me to do an _exhaustive_ check of all possibly relevant
posts in the sub-group from the time Satra joined GL to the present.
[If I spend that much time at a minor endeavor, I expect to get paid
for it - which I can in "Google Answers". ;) ]
Taking an overview/sampling from 1993 to 2002 is sufficient to
establish, _within reason_, if there was any merit at ALL to the
apparent misconception that there was "a _general_ dislike for
Satra/'Lucy'...".
So far I appear to be on-point.
Understand the goal; I'm not trying to be "right" - I'm trying to
determine relative merit of a statement.
[BTW, the search was self-limiting, since the initial declaration was
"...in r.a.t.s.c.". 99% of the returns from the cbs group on "sonia
satra lucy" as a whole are GL posts...]
Murray continues:
"And if you couldn't find my messages (or didn't bother to include
them in your count), I'm guessing that there are lots of other
anti-Satra posters out there."
Murray, I _expected_ to miss posts!! The attempt was in no way
fashioned as definitive.
The idea was to start the ball rolling in _some_ sort of
quantitative direction.
If the thread continues for any length of time, there will surely
be "flux" --- which I'm guessing will balance out to support my
challenge.
For example, Bo has modified her past posture and declared her 2002
comments (which she acknowledged were easily interpreted as "anti"
<smile>) as being "a backhanded compliment".
Dave noted that he was "shocked" to go back and find positive
comments he had written about Satra/Lucy.
[So even though your negative comment was skipped, Bo's remarks
balance it, from a practical standpoint. (chuckle) ]
Murray continues:
"There's no need for the lurkers to jump out of the woodwork until all
the people who actually posted negative comments are included in your
survey."
You couldn't be more wrong.
It's the lurkers who help flesh out the position(s)!
Let me put it to you another way, Murray:
even if you try to turn this into a pure math contest --- on balance,
I'm positive my initial contention will hold.
There is not, nor has there been, a _rampant_ (or general) dislike
of Sonia Satra and/or her acting abilities voiced in the group.
Lancebowski
http://bios7.tripod.com/bioblog/psychoblog.html#psy
Ian J. Ball
Bo <b...@bodacia.com> wrote:
> On 28 Aug 2002 21:17:03 -0700, cabr...@hotmail.com (Lancebowski)
> wrote:
>
> >> Isolating on 2002, "anti-Satra and/or 'Lucy'" sentiments were
> >>voiced by Bo and Donna B.
>
> This is what I wrote:
>
> "As much as I detested Lucy Cooper and Sonia
> Satra's acting (in general), the scenes of Lucy's
> rape by Brent Lawrence...and especially the
> scenes immediately following the rape...were
> like high art compared to what we saw today."
>
> I guess that does come off as a criticism of Sonia Satra, but it was
> actually a backhanded compliment [I think Sonia can act circles around
> this current Marah, whatever her name is, and she (Sonia) did do
> really really well with the rape aftermath].
I really don't agree with this.
I've *seen* McKeon be effective (just not on GL).
I've only ever seen Satra be semi-effective...
Dana Carpender
Bo wrote:
>
> By the way...can anyone tell me why Buzz's other kid(s?) is(are?)
> living in England now?
So the writers don't have to work around two more kids, I suspect.
Supposely they're with Jenna's family, which completely contradicts
history, since the whole reason Jenna was desperate for Henry to be her
father was that she was completely without family.
--
Dana W. Carpender
Author, How I Gave Up My Low Fat Diet -- And Lost Forty Pounds!
http://www.holdthetoast.com
Check out our FREE Low Carb Ezine!
Murray Fox
> Murray, let me make myself perfectly clear to you: in order to
> challenge an unsupported, sweeping statement, it is in NO way
> incumbent upon me to do an _exhaustive_ check of all possibly relevant
> posts in the sub-group from the time Satra joined GL to the present.
>
> [If I spend that much time at a minor endeavor, I expect to get paid
> for it - which I can in "Google Answers". ;) ]
>
>
> Taking an overview/sampling from 1993 to 2002 is sufficient to
> establish, _within reason_, if there was any merit at ALL to the
> apparent misconception that there was "a _general_ dislike for
> Satra/'Lucy'...".
> So far I appear to be on-point.
Okay. I'm hardly the person to be challenging or using statistics and
numbers... but from where I'm sitting, I'm not convinced that the sample is
all that reliable.
I mean, it might very well be reliable... but I've yet to be convinced. And
I probably can't be convinced so we'll have to just agree to disagree.
And as you say, there's not a lot of point in spending that much time on
such a minor endeavour. Let's just leave it at there being a "general
dislike for Satra/Lucy" and we're good as gold. :)
> Let me put it to you another way, Murray:
> even if you try to turn this into a pure math contest
Oh there's very little chance of THAT. Math and me... we're not compatable.
:)
> There is not, nor has there been, a _rampant_ (or general) dislike
> of Sonia Satra and/or her acting abilities voiced in the group.
Okay, well then it's time we changed that. Let's hear from the anti-Lucy
brigade and bump those numbers up into the hundreds. :)