NCC, NAR, ...
Patrick Kovacs
or Federation starships.
I've heard that NCC stands for Naval Construction Contract, but what do the
others mean?
Jack Bohn
Hey, Ryan! Another FAQ question!
Let's see...
NX - Naval eXperimental, cutting edge designs and Great Experiments
NAR - National Association of Rocketry, ships launched from Earth
NSP - Naval Scientists with Pointed ears, Vulcan ships...
Sorry.
As near as we can figure, NCC means a Federation Starfleet ship. That
it stands for Naval Construction Contract is a "folk etymology." Take
for example some Enterprises that seem to be other ships renamed when
there wasn't time to build new ones from scratch to replace their
predecessors. It is doubtful they were Constructed under Contract
Numbers 1701-A or 1701-E. Or the Excelsior, which was built as
NX-2000 but served in the fleet as NCC-2000 (after it had already
*been* constructed).
Although we cannot say what they *mean*, we can observe how they are
used. To wit:
NCC - Federation Starfleet, most ships you could name
NX - Starfleet experimental. The initial classification of the
Defiant, Excelsior, and -according to the behind-the-scenes guys-
Galaxy.
NAR - Scientific, possibly government related, as they've used ships
that in other conditions could have had NCC (Vico) or have (Raven)
NSP - Vulcan. The T'Pau
NDT - Transport (passengers) Milan
NGL - Transport (freight) Odin
NFT - Transport (passengers) Lakul and (evidently) Robert Fox
BDR - Transport (passengers) Santa Maria
--
-Jack
SPAMblock *sigh*
can be reached through jackbohn at bright dof net
Steve Pugh
>NX, NAR, NCC, NDT, NFT, NGL, NSP, BDR. These are all prefixes of Starfleet
>or Federation starships.
Yup.
>I've heard that NCC stands for Naval Construction Contract,
That was a fandom invention and predates the other prefixes. It seems
highly unlikely in light of the later prefixes.
> but what do the others mean?
Look at
http://www.cs.umanitoba.ca/~djc/startrek/expand/federation2.html for
possible meanings.
N seems to indicate Federation (so BDR wouldn't be a Federation ship,
possible considering the circumstances of it's one use).
Steve
--
"My theories appal you, my heresies outrage you,
I never answer letters and you don't like my tie." - The Doctor
Steve Pugh <st...@pugh.net> <http://steve.pugh.net/>
Travis Offenberger
Auxiliary and Reserve," a collection of second line vessels used for less
important missions. Just a thought.
"Brian Barjenbruch" <bri...@home.com> wrote in message
news:130720002121455459%bri...@home.com...
> > As near as we can figure, NCC means a Federation Starfleet ship. That
> > it stands for Naval Construction Contract is a "folk etymology." Take
> > for example some Enterprises that seem to be other ships renamed when
> > there wasn't time to build new ones from scratch to replace their
> > predecessors. It is doubtful they were Constructed under Contract
> > Numbers 1701-A or 1701-E. Or the Excelsior, which was built as
> > NX-2000 but served in the fleet as NCC-2000 (after it had already
> > *been* constructed).
> >
> > Although we cannot say what they *mean*, we can observe how they are
> > used. To wit:
> >
> > NCC - Federation Starfleet, most ships you could name
> > NX - Starfleet experimental. The initial classification of the
> > Defiant, Excelsior, and -according to the behind-the-scenes guys-
> > Galaxy.
> > NAR - Scientific, possibly government related, as they've used ships
> > that in other conditions could have had NCC (Vico) or have (Raven)
> > NSP - Vulcan. The T'Pau
> > NDT - Transport (passengers) Milan
> > NGL - Transport (freight) Odin
> > NFT - Transport (passengers) Lakul and (evidently) Robert Fox
> > BDR - Transport (passengers) Santa Maria
>
> There's also two more:
>
> NCV - Federation Timeships from the 29th century ("Relativity")
> YLT - Yridian
>
> --
> "Its origin and purpose, still a total mystery."
> - Dr. Heywood Floyd, "2001: A Space Odyssey"
Shik
models:
VDN
NSD
NPR
LZT
CQD
BBC
RUR
NKC
Hey, if they can use in-jokes, so can I. Liek I said...my creation & therefore
so unbeLIEVEably not canon.
Shik
"What inspiration will today's challenger bring, & how will the Iron Chef fight
back? The heat will be ON!!"
Sanctum Sanitarium--conveniently located at http://shiksworld.iwarp.com
Shane Edman
prototypes e. g. USS Excelsior (STlll); USS Defiant (ST:DS9)
NAR - Don't know this one but I have only seen it on mainly research
vessels. Maybe that clue will help.
As for the rest, NDT, NFT, NGL, NSP, BDR, I have no idea. Sorry
Patrick Kovacs <patrick...@aon.at> wrote in article
<396ca2e8$0$10...@SSP1NO25.highway.telekom.at>...
> NX, NAR, NCC, NDT, NFT, NGL, NSP, BDR. These are all präfixes of
Starfleet
> or Federation starships.
> I've heard that NCC stands for Naval Construction Contract, but what do
the
> others mean?
>
>
>
Timo S Saloniemi
>N seems to indicate Federation (so BDR wouldn't be a Federation ship,
>possible considering the circumstances of it's one use).
Apart from the Blues Brothers reference, I think the ship was intended
to be a Federation one by the writers. But I fully agree that it is
possible for it to have been a non-Federation vessel as well.
IMVHO, the Santa Maria was a smallish colonizer, probably a ship intended
to perform an one-way mission and be dismantled at destination (which
was more or less its eventual fate after Alixus' meddling, too). Are
all colonies founded by such small ships?
I'd guess colonization takes three forms: huge government-sponsored
efforts like the one described in the recent "New Earth" books,
smaller-scale commercial efforts, and ideological escapades of small
isolated groups. The latter two could use small chartered vessels,
going for non-UFP ones if those came cheaper than UFP models.
The huge government-backed shows would be "no-failure-allowed" things
where the colony would *have* to become self-supporting and profitable
on first try, and damn the costs. The Santa Maria doesn't seem to
fit that picture at all. Smaller commercial ventures could hitchhike
on Starfleet ships or charter their flights from assorted civilians,
but might prefer to buy their own ships to avoid Starfleet busybodying
and the rational kind of civilian skipper who waits until clearing UFP
borders, then spaces the colonists, waits a little without unnecessarily
braving the risks of deep space, returns to UFP territory and takes on
the next bunch (such small colonies would probably die out anyway without
ever contacting the UFP again). The Santa Maria could easily be something
that caters for this market. Ideological refugees would probably prefer
ships capable of going into very deep space unmonitored, but the Santa
Maria wasn't really aiming for parts unknown originally, and thus didn't
strike me as a deep-space type at all. And Alixus would probably have
avoided a ship type that was *designed* to disappear, so as not to arouse
suspicions.
The name of the ship is another aspect one might wish to consider. A
non-Fed wouldn't know the reference, but it might be lost on many
Feds as well. If the ship was non-UFP, then the ship probably was
renamed by Alixus and her friends on purchase, but not re-registered
nor re-flagged to UFP. Doesn't sound unbelievable.
And the ship didn't seem to have any obvious crew apart from Alixus and
her technically inadept followers, lending more credence to the idea that
Alixus had actually purchased the vessel and not just chartered (and
hijacked) a flight. Would the Feds sell a ship to a bunch of landlubbers?
There might be UFP laws against equipping these "ships of fools", forcing
the colonists-cum-suicidees to go seeking for the tools of their destruction
from outside the borders of the Federation.
Timo Saloniemi
Jack Bohn
>I'd guess colonization takes three forms: huge government-sponsored
>efforts like the one described in the recent "New Earth" books,
>smaller-scale commercial efforts, and ideological escapades of small
>isolated groups. The latter two could use small chartered vessels,
>going for non-UFP ones if those came cheaper than UFP models.
>
>The huge government-backed shows would be "no-failure-allowed" things
Sounds like the colony that failed at the beginning of TNG:"Silicon
Avatar". Looked like they were already building hospitals and schools
before the colonists even arrived. What was the most advanced colony
we've seen? I would guess Deneva from TOS:"Operation - Annihilate!"
(and I imagine it recovered well from the parasites) but I may be
prejudiced because we got into the city. On the other extreme (not
counting pre-Fed "lost colonies" like the Mariposans) would be the
guys from TOS:"This Side of Paradise", even if the spores hadn't
convinced them to take it easy they couldn't do much with the small
number (how many?) they had. The Mars Colony is still called, well,
colony, in the 24th cent. Does this indicate a lack of
self-sufficiency, or a lack of self-governance (or tradition)?
>The name of the ship is another aspect one might wish to consider. A
>non-Fed wouldn't know the reference, but it might be lost on many
>Feds as well. If the ship was non-UFP, then the ship probably was
>renamed by Alixus and her friends on purchase, but not re-registered
>nor re-flagged to UFP. Doesn't sound unbelievable.
The ship's class is Erewhon, which is an Earth literary reference. On
the other hand, the Ency spells it "Erewon", which may be an alien
word.
>And the ship didn't seem to have any obvious crew apart from Alixus and
>her technically inadept followers, lending more credence to the idea that
>Alixus had actually purchased the vessel and not just chartered (and
>hijacked) a flight. Would the Feds sell a ship to a bunch of landlubbers?
>There might be UFP laws against equipping these "ships of fools", forcing
>the colonists-cum-suicidees to go seeking for the tools of their destruction
>from outside the borders of the Federation.
The only other colonizing ship I can think of is the Jenolan, a
Starfleet ship, taking Scotty (or a whole shipload?) to the retirement
colony. (What is a retirement colony? Something like at the beginning
of "Silicon Avatar", so cushy that old folk can go there to relax?)
Timo S Saloniemi
>Timo S Saloniemi wrote:
>
>
>>I'd guess colonization takes three forms: huge government-sponsored
>>efforts like the one described in the recent "New Earth" books,
>>smaller-scale commercial efforts, and ideological escapades of small
>>isolated groups. The latter two could use small chartered vessels,
>>going for non-UFP ones if those came cheaper than UFP models.
>>The huge government-backed shows would be "no-failure-allowed" things
>Sounds like the colony that failed at the beginning of TNG:"Silicon
>Avatar". Looked like they were already building hospitals and schools
>before the colonists even arrived.
That might be standard stuff for any colonization mission that hitchhikes
aboard Starfleet ships - Starfleet requires the colonists to accept a
govenmentally built, directive-meeting basic infrastructure before allowing
them to settle. Not all might be happy with that, especially if part of the
expenses were taken from the colonists' pockets.
>What was the most advanced colony we've seen? I would guess Deneva
>from TOS:"Operation - Annihilate!" (and I imagine it recovered well
>from the parasites) but I may be prejudiced because we got into the city.
Also, it was the only UFP colony with some sort of industrial-commercial
racket going on (if we ignore the Janusian mining outpost which didn't seem
to really be a colony as much as a facility, and the tiny Rigel XII mining
community, population four to six at the last count). The others seem like
farming-oriented communities concentrating in survival in isolation.
Then again, the surface views of some starbases have been pretty impressive.
Is that all just governmental facilities, or is there an actual colony
around, say, SB 515? Or is the starbase in the middle of a native city?
>On the other extreme (not counting pre-Fed "lost colonies" like the
>Mariposans) would be the guys from TOS:"This Side of Paradise", even
>if the spores hadn't convinced them to take it easy they couldn't do
>much with the small number (how many?) they had.
And they seemed to fall under Starfleet jurisdiction somehow, so that
Kirk could simply go and tell "You live all wrong - stop being happy
and get back home with us, now! Move it!".
Then again, these people seemed to be wearing a uniform that differed
from Roger Korby's supposedly government-issue uniform only in
their color patterns (and I believe that green jumpsuit was originally
used in "Where No Man.." already, aboard the Enterprise, before being
modified for "What Are Little Girls.."). Perhaps the Omicron Ceti
colonists were government or even Starfleet personnel to begin with?
>The Mars Colony is still called, well, colony, in the 24th cent.
>Does this indicate a lack of self-sufficiency, or a lack of
>self-governance (or tradition)?
Well, I doubt many are interested in roughing it on non-class M planets
when the class M ones can be pretty demanding already. And Mars may
turn out to be just as uninteresting as the Moon, but more inconveniently
located (you need almost a full starship from Runabout size up, or at least
an impulse ship, to get there from Earth practically, while I guess a
simple transatmospheric vehicle with thruster-type propulsion is
enough to reach the Moon - plus there could be a transporter link
to the Moon with the help of a relay station or ten).
OTOH, the Fundamental Declarations of the Martian Colonies speak of
some sort of determination if not of self-determination. And those
are *old* documents: Kim's references to the founding of the colonies,
and possibly also Paris' holoscene, could also be taken as historical
references instead of assessments of current status. Perhaps Martian
settlements are no longer considered colonies at all, and Mars as of
the 2370s is a member of the UFP or part of the Human membership billet?
Where does the 24th century reference come from?
>The ship's class is Erewhon, which is an Earth literary reference. On
>the other hand, the Ency spells it "Erewon", which may be an alien
>word.
Even "Constitution" may be an alien word in a Federation with at least
150 member planets, hopefully most of them roughly as multicultural
and multilinguistic as Earth. But that aside, need I mention Antares
class? :-) Or are we to assume that all those races named their ship
classes after the star we call Antares, and their native names for that
star just get mangled into "Antares" by the UT?
>The only other colonizing ship I can think of is the Jenolan, a
>Starfleet ship, taking Scotty (or a whole shipload?) to the retirement
>colony. (What is a retirement colony? Something like at the beginning
>of "Silicon Avatar", so cushy that old folk can go there to relax?)
I took the Jenolan to have been a regular cargo and passenger liner
running between Earth and Norpin and possibly other places, not
usually tasked with actually founding a colony. At least Norpin was
already founded by the time Scotty embarked on the ship. I imagine
the Jenolan may have had relatively luxurious accommodation below
the spartan utility spaces we saw. The ship class could probably be
assigned colonization duty if needed, though. It would be a big mother
to land on a planet, and especially to take off again, but if the Voyager
can do it...
Timo Saloniemi
Jack Bohn
>> The ship's class is Erewhon, which is an Earth literary reference.
>
>Yeah--"nowhere" spelled backward...
Also (according to the SF reference book, _Anatomy of Wonder_) the
title of an 1872 book by a Samuel Butler about a utopia "which has
rejected the use of the machine because the machine will supersede
man, and which lives in an agrarian culture" (is the irony thick
enough to cut with a knife, yet?)
Jack Bohn
>I first saw what NCC stood for in the original Star Trek blueprints.
>I think they are fairly official. I think that's a bit better than
>"folk etymology" (whatever you mean by that).
That's where I first saw it, too. I believe Franz Joseph made it up,
much like the head off the bridge. I've been happily accepting it for
15-20 years when I got on this group and heard arguments against it.
Nevertheless, these blueprints, like the animated series, have gone
from having the approval of the Trek gods to becoming rather ignored.
"Folk etymology"? Did I err? No, entomology is the study of insects,
I got it write. Folk etymology is plausible stories for the origin of
words made by people guessing, with a historical basis. I'm drawing
a blank for words, but take the corresponding example from "folk
physics" about a thrown object traveling in a straight line for a
while before gravity takes over and pulls it to the ground.
(rather borderline case here as NCC was created for the show without
any specific meaning, but we can try to find its "historical" meaning
from use in Starfleet.)
Michael Morrell
> As near as we can figure, NCC means a Federation Starfleet ship. That
> it stands for Naval Construction Contract is a "folk etymology."
I first saw what NCC stood for in the original Star Trek blueprints.
I think they are fairly official. I think that's a bit better than
"folk etymology" (whatever you mean by that).
Michael
Admiral Korel
>
>Yeah--"nowhere" spelled backward...
No, "nowhere" spelt backward is "Erehwon".
Morgan McEvoy, morg...@esatclear.ie
"It's like the laws of physics just went out the window."
"And why shouldn't they? They're so inconvenient!"
CAPT Apathy
>> The ship's class is Erewhon, which is an Earth literary reference.
> Yeah--"nowhere" spelled backward...
Jack Bohn responded:
>Also (according to the SF reference book, _Anatomy of Wonder_) the
>title of an 1872 book by a Samuel Butler about a utopia "which has
>rejected the use of the machine because the machine will supersede
>man, and which lives in an agrarian culture" (is the irony thick
>enough to cut with a knife, yet?)
I chose to interject:
I think that Jack's is a lot more likely to be the intended. Its clever,
but also Erewhon, if so spelled, does not spell 'nowhere' backwards, but
'nohwere.' That is more likely to be a coincidence in similarity and
closeness, while Butler's book reflects the situation.
CAPT Apathy
Jack Bohn
>Brian Barjenbruch wrote:
>>> The ship's class is Erewhon, which is an Earth literary reference.
>> Yeah--"nowhere" spelled backward...
>
>Jack Bohn responded:
>>Also (according to the SF reference book, _Anatomy of Wonder_) the
>>title of an 1872 book by a Samuel Butler about a utopia "which has
>>rejected the use of the machine because the machine will supersede
>>man, and which lives in an agrarian culture" (is the irony thick
>>enough to cut with a knife, yet?)
>
>I think that Jack's is a lot more likely to be the intended. Its clever,
>but also Erewhon, if so spelled, does not spell 'nowhere' backwards, but
>'nohwere.' That is more likely to be a coincidence in similarity and
>closeness, while Butler's book reflects the situation.
Well, call it an anagram. (Or, as an old advertising character, Libby
the Kid used to say, "It's 'Billy' spelled ... sideways")
Butler certainly meant to imply "nowhere" -"utopia", coined by Thomas
More, translates (I think from the Greek) as "no place".
"wh" just seems better English than "hw"
RdWaryer
>More, translates (I think from the Greek) as "no place".
There is still some debate about the "correct" translations. Some put it as "no
place" while others say it means "good place." Of course, More might have been
playing with just that ambiguity.
David
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----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Art is not Truth. Art is a lie that makes us realize Truth.
-- Picasso
Timo S Saloniemi
>>> The ship's class is Erewhon, which is an Earth literary reference.
>>Yeah--"nowhere" spelled backward...
>No, "nowhere" spelt backward is "Erehwon".
...Witch just goes to prove that Samuel Butler didnt now how to spell.
Then again, anybody remember the fun little explanation concoted by the
Reeves-Stevenses for these strangely Earthly ship names? Alien races
may have found the concept of giving ships proper names such a weird one
that they didn't really know how to proceed, except by literally copying
what the Earthlings had already done. Thus we get, say, Orion ships named
not only "Antares" or "Cygnus" but also "Queen Elizabeth 2" and "Monkey
Business"...
Timo Saloniemi
BRADLEY :|
On the subject of interesting ship names, anyone read much of Ian M Banks'
Culture stories? Now there were some interesting names!
The Idirans (an anti-AI race, for religious reasons) had pretty boring ship
names,
like The Hand of God 137. But Culture ships had names that seemed to get
more off the wall as the ship profile got more military and covert.
Some featured names are;
Clear Air Turbulence
The Ends of Invention
Prosthetic Conscience
No More Mr Nice Guy
Fate Amenable to Change
Honest Mistake
Grey Area
I actually found it easier to keep these names straight that the more
mundane
naming conventions. Another place for nifty ship names is Roger Zelazny's
Alien Speedway (Like Slippery Cat, and Wild Weekend)
--
BRADLEY :|
Now what? Do we just stand here or should we
start running around in circles?
-Thomas Covenant, The Unbeliever
Jack Bohn
>On the subject of interesting ship names, anyone read much of Ian M Banks'
>Culture stories? Now there were some interesting names!
I'm thinking John Varley came up with some interesting names
(privately owned ships). Durned if I can think of any now! Must have
done I memory delete when he disavowed all knowledge of Rocky Jones:
Space Ranger when naming one of his captains Sirocco Jones.