SCOTTY PARADOX/GENERATIONS NOVELIZATION
Timothy A. Povhe
It's been pointed out by several people that if Scotty is on the
E-B when Kirk is sucked into the Nexus (and presumed dead) then
why would he think that Kirk would come looking for him when
the Jenolen disappeared? Obviously the events in the beginning
of Star Trek: Generations happen before Scotty takes off for
Norpin Five.
Since the synopsis of the script in the movie FAQ does not
address this issue, it seems that Ron Moore (who wrote the
script for 'Relics') is apparently going to overlook this rather
large continuity glitch.
On the other hand, Jeanne Dillard, with her penchant for detail,
may attempt to explain this sloppy error when she novelizes the
script for Pocket Books. Maybe in the book's epilogue, we'll
see Picard downing some of that green brandy with Scotty in
a bar at some starbase, telling him the final fate of his former
commanding officer. Scotty will stare at Picard in surprise, s
slap his head, and exclaim, "My God, that's right! How could I
have forgot that he got sucked into that thing? No wonder he
didn't pull the old girl out of mothballs and come looking or me!"
'TITANIC' Tim
The Final Spaceman
"Mentally deranged, and Damn Proud of It!"
Gene
: It's been pointed out by several people that if Scotty is on the
Isn't it also possible that Scotty dissappeared BEFORE Kirk falls into this
Nexus thing... and Scotty's appearance in the Generations movie is from the
time line of The Next Generation? Picard finds Kirk, and Scotty is brought
in for one reason or another, since he knew him personally?
Just another thought in the time travel thing.. :)
-gene
ge...@panix.com
David Lulkin
: Isn't it also possible that Scotty dissappeared BEFORE Kirk falls into this
: Nexus thing... and Scotty's appearance in the Generations movie is from the
: time line of The Next Generation? Picard finds Kirk, and Scotty is brought
: in for one reason or another, since he knew him personally?
No, because in the clip they showed on the frakes-hosted special,
Scotty was on the bridge of the E-B
: Just another thought in the time travel thing.. :)
: -gene
: ge...@panix.com
--
David Lulkin
lulk...@stu.beloit.edu
Captain Roy Burgess, CO, USS Heinlein, "Stranger in a strange land"
Cmdr. Sean Malloy, X0, SB02
Garak, Cardassian Tailor, SB02 (split with GM)
Lt. Sean MacGyver, Chief Ops, SB04
Lt. Ian Lawson, Chief Ops, USS Apache
Lt. Cmdr. Andrew Matzen, Chief Engineer, USS Grainger
Crystal Matzen, Starfleet Protocol Officer, USS Grainger
Jonas Mureika Newt
>Timothy A. Povhe (ef...@cleveland.Freenet.Edu) wrote:
>
>: It's been pointed out by several people that if Scotty is on the
>: E-B when Kirk is sucked into the Nexus (and presumed dead) then
>: why would he think that Kirk would come looking for him when
>: the Jenolen disappeared? Obviously the events in the beginning
>: of Star Trek: Generations happen before Scotty takes off for
>: Norpin Five.
>
>: Since the synopsis of the script in the movie FAQ does not
>: address this issue, it seems that Ron Moore (who wrote the
>: script for 'Relics') is apparently going to overlook this rather
>: large continuity glitch.
>
>Isn't it also possible that Scotty dissappeared BEFORE Kirk falls into this
>Nexus thing... and Scotty's appearance in the Generations movie is from the
>time line of The Next Generation? Picard finds Kirk, and Scotty is brought
>in for one reason or another, since he knew him personally?
>
>
Unfortunately, from what we know already (the "script" and the TNG special
hosted by Frakes, Journey's End), this is not the case. If you look carefully
in the scenes they show from the filming of "Generations", we see Kirk,
Chekov, and Scotty sitting on the bridge of the 1701-B, where Kirk is asked
to give the order to "set sail". It is unlikely that Scotty *couldn't* know
about Kirk's disappearance, in this case. Of course, they may have noticed
this, and changed the script on us, but not too likely.
Jose Pietri
: It's been pointed out by several people that if Scotty is on the
: E-B when Kirk is sucked into the Nexus (and presumed dead) then
: why would he think that Kirk would come looking for him when
: the Jenolen disappeared? Obviously the events in the beginning
: of Star Trek: Generations happen before Scotty takes off for
: Norpin Five.
Now, if you remember that episode with Geordi's mother, in Starfleet,
"missing" persons are NOT considered dead. So it is possible that Scotty
left shortly after Kirk's disappearance thinking that he may still be
alive.
The tone of the scene in the movie, however, suggests that they believe he
is dead, as either Scotty or Chekov say something like "That's no way for
him to go".
Anyway, Scotty might still hope that somehow his captain is still alive.
Jose
(my .sig is cloaked)
Gregg Germain
: It's been pointed out by several people that if Scotty is on the
: E-B when Kirk is sucked into the Nexus (and presumed dead) then
: why would he think that Kirk would come looking for him when
: the Jenolen disappeared? Obviously the events in the beginning
: of Star Trek: Generations happen before Scotty takes off for
: Norpin Five.
: Since the synopsis of the script in the movie FAQ does not
: address this issue, it seems that Ron Moore (who wrote the
: script for 'Relics') is apparently going to overlook this rather
: large continuity glitch.
Well according to the FAW they are already throwing away the Kirk
klaim of dying alone so what's one more continuity flaw?
Personally, I can't believe Shatner will allow the character to die because
there's still serious money to be made. They'll weasel a way out of it.
After all, Spock dies and was ressurected. Scotty was killed and then brought
back to life (TOS episode), Worf dies and springs back to life....
Certainly Shatner MUST have the chance to die and live again ;^)
--- Gregg
#29 --)-Saville--
gr...@hrc2.harvard.edu "A Mig at your six is better than
Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics no Mig at all."
Phone: (617) 496-7713
Jacob Huebert
In a previous article, lulk...@scooby.beloit.edu (David Lulkin) says:
>Gene (ge...@panix.com) wrote:
>
>: Isn't it also possible that Scotty dissappeared BEFORE Kirk falls into this
>: Nexus thing... and Scotty's appearance in the Generations movie is from the
>: time line of The Next Generation? Picard finds Kirk, and Scotty is brought
>: in for one reason or another, since he knew him personally?
>
> No, because in the clip they showed on the frakes-hosted special,
>Scotty was on the bridge of the E-B
Maybe they'll realize this and cut it.. or it could just be that Scotty
was quite confused... people in strange uniforms claiming to be from
Enterprise, and having just come out of the transporter thing.. I'd say
it's quite likely. After all, he never asks about Kirk's fate after that
point, so it probably came back to him.
--
"What this world needs is more Nazis, ---- Jacob Huebert
Like it needs a hole in the head, ---- aa...@yfn.ysu.edu
Your future is not safe at all, --------------------------
'til this disease is dead." - Roger Taylor, "Nazis 1994"
ane...@charlie.usd.edu
No, Scotty's invited up with Capt. Kirk and Cmdr. Chekov for the E-B's
commissioning. They could get him out of the way by having him beam over to
the U.S.S. JENOLAN (sp) right after the bottle-smashing but before the E-B
leaves Spacedock.
P.A.: "Captain Scott, please report to Transporter Room Three."
SCOTT: "Well, this is where I get off, Captain."
KIRK: "Sorry you can't stay for the maiden voyage, Scotty."
SCOTT: "Aye, sir, but I've got to catch this ship to the retirement colony; my
boat and my liq -- ah, my *luggage* -- have already been loaded."
And so on...
It would be fun to have Scotty appear in the 24th century, too, toward the end
of the movie.
Just think, for a while, at least, Kirk, Scotty, Spock, and McCoy will
all be in the 24th century, even though it doesn't look like they'll find each
other there. (Kirk: Nexus effect. Scotty: transporter stasis. Spock:
secret ambassador to Romulus. McCoy: really, really old Admiral, if he
didn't die since "Encounter at Farpoint".)
Elros F.
No, Scotty's invited up with Capt. Kirk and Cmdr. Chekov for the E-B's
commissioning. They could get him out of the way by having him beam over
to
the U.S.S. JENOLAN (sp) right after the bottle-smashing but before the E-B
leaves Spacedock.
Of course, that doesn't explain why he made the statement he did after
being rematerialized and finding out that the Enterprise had rescued him.
It was something to the effect that 'Jim Kirk probably got the old girl out
of mothballs to come looking for me!'
Can someone give the exact quote, and how that would relate Scotty's
association of the Enterprise with a decommissioned ship, and not a newly
commissioned one?
Jacob Huebert
In a previous article, ef.@pro-smof.cts.com (Elros F.) says:
>Of course, that doesn't explain why he made the statement he did after
>being rematerialized and finding out that the Enterprise had rescued him.
>It was something to the effect that 'Jim Kirk probably got the old girl out
>of mothballs to come looking for me!'
>
>Can someone give the exact quote, and how that would relate Scotty's
>association of the Enterprise with a decommissioned ship, and not a newly
>commissioned one?
Geez, people, he was confused! He had probably gone through **alot**
just before going into the transporter! Besides, he was old anyhow!
His memory temporarily failed him! It's simple.
Burke McCrory
aa...@yfn.ysu.edu (Jacob Huebert) writes:
>
>In a previous article, ef.@pro-smof.cts.com (Elros F.) says:
>
>>Of course, that doesn't explain why he made the statement he did after
>>being rematerialized and finding out that the Enterprise had rescued him.
>>It was something to the effect that 'Jim Kirk probably got the old girl out
>>of mothballs to come looking for me!'
>>
>>Can someone give the exact quote, and how that would relate Scotty's
>>association of the Enterprise with a decommissioned ship, and not a newly
>>commissioned one?
>
>Geez, people, he was confused! He had probably gone through **alot**
>just before going into the transporter! Besides, he was old anyhow!
>His memory temporarily failed him! It's simple.
>
Sorry, don't bye it. Scotty was very lucid as soon as he came out
of the transporter. He didn't have any problem operating the controls
of the transporter when he tried to get Franklin out. Something so
profound as the death of Kirk would stay with Scotty forever.
Face it, it is a writers screw up!!!
>--
> "What this world needs is more Nazis, ---- Jacob Huebert
> Like it needs a hole in the head, ---- aa...@yfn.ysu.edu
> Your future is not safe at all, --------------------------
> 'til this disease is dead." - Roger Taylor, "Nazis 1994"
--
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Burke McCrory |
| UOT...@DSIBM.OKLADOT.STATE.OK.US |
+-------------------------------------------------------------------+
ane...@charlie.usd.edu
That's pretty close to what he said.
***"GENERATIONS" SPOILERS BELOW***
The ENTERPRISE-B will be *seriously* damaged in the movie, so it's probable
that at the time Scotty leaves on the JENOLAN, the ENTERPRISE-A would be the
only ship of that name in operating condition. (Of course, if Scotty
remembered that the "B" was down for the count, he'd have remembered that Kirk
was equally unavailable, one would think.)
bo...@bbs.iquest.com
in genarations will kirk die or is that
just a rumour tell me what ships will be used enterprise a and d???
interQuest: Fuel for the Mind Data (205) 464-8240
Bringing the Internet to the Tennessee Valley Voice (205) 464-8280
John Bafford
> just a rumour tell me what ships will be used enterprise a and d???
Spoiler Alert...
Kirk dies, and it's the -B and -D.
Derek Emehiser
shown in a theater to a general audience it should not be considered
"cannon". At my count Star Trek Generations still has FIVE months to go
until its theatrical release. So it is nearly useless to argue over the
supposed "Scotty Paradox" until someone actually sees it on the screen.
Just because a script says Final Draft at the top does not mean it will not
be changed. One must consider the fact that if we noticed this oversight
someone at Paramount has also.
This is just my opinion, but I have not seen anyone else ponit out
this quite obvious fact.
ane...@charlie.usd.edu
Supposedly Paramount caught the idiotic error in STVI in which the Excelsior's
special equipment for cataloging gaseous anomolies miraculously ends up on the
Enterprise in time to save the day, but they decided it wasn't worth fixing.
Worried, very worried,
Allen
ane...@charlie.usd.edu
President Mitterand
>Supposedly Paramount caught the idiotic error in STVI in which the Excelsior's
>special equipment for cataloging gaseous anomolies miraculously ends up on the
>Enterprise in time to save the day, but they decided it wasn't worth fixing.
I hope I'm not regurgitating old ideas or news, but my guess is that
it was the *Enterprise* that first got hit by the Praxis shock wave
in an earlier draft of the film, and that it was changed later on,
but no one noticed the implications of the switch until it was too
late. Hmmm? Maybe Sulu transported it over in an underhand sort of
'here Jimmy boy you might find these useful, know what I mean
wink wink nudge nudge'?
Juan
Dennis Bailey
>From: ane...@charlie.usd.edu
>Date: Fri, 24 Jun 1994 06:37:48 GMT
>Supposedly Paramount caught the idiotic error in STVI in which the Excelsior's
>special equipment for cataloging gaseous anomolies miraculously ends up on the
>Enterprise in time to save the day, but they decided it wasn't worth fixing.
>Worried, very worried,
>Allen
>ane...@charlie.usd.edu
No, rather the script for the movie established that _all_ Starfleet ships
were carrying that equipment as part of a big research project. The
explanation came during a tour of the Enterprise Kirk gave Gorkon before the
"dinner" scene. When the tour scene was cut, so was the explanation.
This isn't speculation; I have the script.
Ansu Mittra
to chart gaseous anomolies??
Ansu Mittra
ansum...@delphi.com
est...@delphi.com
undertaking, like the Human Genome Project.
Nah!
Thanks for pointing out this whole thing. It's been kicking around in the back
of my head, bugging me for a long time!
Kenneth Jubal DeMonn
:Maybe somebody had, like, a really big government grant and this was a huge
:undertaking, like the Human Genome Project.
*Sigh* No, we biologists only *wish* it was a huge undertaking, instead of
amounting to all of a hundredth of a percent of the Federal budget. We're
never going to get to the world of Star Trek this way, what with the
greedy geezers sucking the future dry.
--
Kenneth Jubal DeMonn | "Graduate students are narrowly focused
kde...@vela.acs.oakland.edu | on some rather unimportant problems,
csc_st...@emuvax.emich.edu | and they just don't seem to enjoy life
73250,20...@compuserve.com | very much." --Freeman Dyson
ane...@charlie.usd.edu
Thanks for clearing that up! Too bad they didn't put it back for the video.
Still worried,
Allen
ane...@charlie.usd.edu