Schild's ladder
Jan Irigi Olsina
finished yet, but I want to ask you something: how did this 'Slowdown'
work? I mean, whole planet was waiting for anyone who'd traveled until
he got back. People changed their perception of the world so it didn't
look strange to them, but how did they managed not to starve to death
or not to get old in meantime? Were some unsentient robots fedeng
them? (I probably just missed it, it had to be explained there.)
Thank you!
Irigi.
Andrew Plotkin
It's been years since I read it, but as I recall -- these are people
who have complete technological control over their bodies. If they
slow down, they use less energy. Or maybe they have backup nuclear
reactors in their spleens, I don't remember. And ageing is voluntary.
--Z
--
"And Aholibamah bare Jeush, and Jaalam, and Korah: these were the borogoves..."
*
Bush's biggest lie is his claim that it's okay to disagree with him. As soon as
you *actually* disagree with him, he sadly explains that you're undermining
America, that you're giving comfort to the enemy. That you need to be silent.
Jon Schild
I only got it because I very rarely see my name on anything. I read the
book, but didn't find that it made a whole lot of sense.
Jon Schild
Phillip SanMiguel
_Schild's Ladder_ takes place thousands of years in the future. The
majority of the characters are trans-human. Their bodies, "exo-selves",
apparently top-down redesigns of the human form with completely
programmable metabolisms. I don't remember whether anyone eats at all,
but in any case their metabolisms slow to lower the amount of energy
they need during slowdown.
Jan Irigi Olsina
really like Egan's ideas.
Irigi.
Elf M. Sternberg
With very rare exceptions, *everyone* in Schild's Ladder is a
robot-- their minds are uploaded into datacores, and only an affectionate
attachment to their biological origins has them running their
experiential platforms on meat. They have more or less complete
control over the biolgy they do use, and they treat it like just
another technology.
ELf
--
Elf M. Sternberg, Immanentizing the Eschaton since 1988
http://www.pendorwright.com/
Elf's latest stories are available in paperback! Buy
the genderbending novel _Sterlings_, available
now from http://stores.lulu.com/elfsternberg
Jan Irigi Olsina
> With very rare exceptions, *everyone* in Schild's Ladder is a
> robot-- their minds are uploaded into datacores, and only an affectionate
> attachment to their biological origins has them running their
> experiential platforms on meat. They have more or less complete
> control over the biolgy they do use, and they treat it like just
> another technology.
>
> ELf
OK, but even if they have really big technical control over their
bodies, it seems bit strange to me that they wouldn't have to eat
during whole centuries they live in Slowdown, their bodies are still
out of flesh after all.
Irigi.
Phillip SanMiguel
What is eating for? For energy and building materials to replace tissue
damaged or "used up". During slowdown they would burn much less energy
and wear and tear on their bodies would be much lower.
Also there is no reason to think that they are still "flesh" in the
sense you probably mean it. Our "flesh" is pretty poorly designed. Run
out of oxygen for just a few minutes and your flesh will fill with
enough metabolic toxins that you will almost certainly be beyond
recovery. Here is a particularly embarrassing one: if you fail to eat
foods containing Vitamin C for a few months, you will die from scurvy!
Yes, an easily synthesized biomolecule for almost any other animal
(except guinea pigs and apes)--we are incapable of living without it.
I don't think the "humans" in _SL_ suffer from these same design flaws.
Ralph Hummel
<pmi...@purdue.edu> wrote:
[SNIP]
>What is eating for? For energy and building materials to replace tissue
>damaged or "used up". During slowdown they would burn much less energy
>and wear and tear on their bodies would be much lower.
>
>Also there is no reason to think that they are still "flesh" in the
>sense you probably mean it. Our "flesh" is pretty poorly designed. Run
>out of oxygen for just a few minutes and your flesh will fill with
>enough metabolic toxins that you will almost certainly be beyond
>recovery. Here is a particularly embarrassing one: if you fail to eat
>foods containing Vitamin C for a few months, you will die from scurvy!
>Yes, an easily synthesized biomolecule for almost any other animal
>(except guinea pigs and apes)--we are incapable of living without it.
>
>I don't think the "humans" in _SL_ suffer from these same design flaws.
Hmm, sound like an extrapolated version of hybernation to me, major
difference being that the energy consumption slow-down is not achieved
by sleep and reduced body functions but by some other means...
Mind over matter? Just kidding :) I am getting curious to read this
one, but have not been convinced yet totally, maybe I'll try to pick
up a used paperback on the net somewhere.
Happy reading
Ralph Hummel
Challonges, France
Phillip SanMiguel
> On Tue, 22 Jul 2008 00:36:04 GMT, Phillip SanMiguel
> <pmi...@purdue.edu> wrote:
>
> [SNIP]
> one, but have not been convinced yet totally, maybe I'll try to pick
> up a used paperback on the net somewhere.
>
> Happy reading
>
> Ralph Hummel
> Challonges, France
Egan seems to garner more praise for his short stories than his novels.
Among the hardest of the hard SF writers, his stories are nevertheless
often wildly inventive--verging on the bizarre. Arguably this plays
better in a shorter work where deep characterization and pacing issues
won't tend to come into play. And, I've seen it written in this group
that characterization is not Egan's strong suite.
But I've a lot of affection for his novels and think his characters may
not be aesthetes nor drawn in a flowery fashion, but many of them ring
true enough for me. _Distress_ is a good example. Where, okay, the main
character is probably afflicted with Asperger's syndrome -- or at least
nearly so. For the wildest ride, though, you would want to check out
_Diaspora_. But _Schild's Ladder_ is up there.
Anyway, if you are thinking about reading him, be sure to check out his
web page:
http://gregegan.customer.netspace.net.au/
for a couple of reasons. There are some free stories there. Eg:
http://gregegan.customer.netspace.net.au/MISC/SINGLETON/Singleton.html
This one is a useful (if distant) prequel to _Schild's Ladder_ in that
it explains the origin of the quantum singleton processor or "Qusp",
Egan's wacky solution to a philosophical problem I've never been able to
see as a problem. But Egan, or at least his characters, seems wracked by it.
The second reason to check out the site are to see Egan's entrancing
Java applets. My favorite is at the top of this page:
http://gregegan.customer.netspace.net.au/BIBLIOGRAPHY/Online.html#Stories
Jan Irigi Olsina
> Egan seems to garner more praise for his short stories than his novels.
> Among the hardest of the hard SF writers, his stories are nevertheless
> often wildly inventive--verging on the bizarre. Arguably this plays
> better in a shorter work where deep characterization and pacing issues
> won't tend to come into play. And, I've seen it written in this group
> that characterization is not Egan's strong suite.
>
> But I've a lot of affection for his novels and think his characters may
> not be aesthetes nor drawn in a flowery fashion, but many of them ring
> true enough for me. _Distress_ is a good example. Where, okay, the main
> character is probably afflicted with Asperger's syndrome -- or at least
> nearly so. For the wildest ride, though, you would want to check out
> _Diaspora_. But _Schild's Ladder_ is up there.
According to my opinion you are right, but only from partly - real
people Egan describes doesn't often seem real to me in some aspects -
e.g. in Teranesia is Prabir very passionate person, but when comes to
discussion, he very sophistically and thoroughly argues about almost
anything. So does almost every Egan's character. When talking about
real people, it seems improbable to me, but if talking about
transhumans, I take it just like part of their nature. For example
Tchicaya from Schild's ladder is IMHO described very well. (I just had
a bit problem with motives of extremists who blow up Rindler, but they
were just minor characters.)