Girl Genius 7.8.09
Dorothy J Heydt
.....
.....
Well, we were wondering where she was ........
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at hotmail dot com
Should you wish to email me, you'd better use the hotmail edress.
Kithrup is getting too damn much spam, even with the sysop's filters.
Wayne Throop
: Jryy, jr jrer jbaqrevat jurer fur jnf ........
And of course, this means a scene change on friday.
So we'll get to find out what Klaus has been up to.
Or something. Won't that be nice?
Well. Unless Othar shows up behind her next.
That's possible, too.
Wayne Throop thr...@sheol.org http://sheol.org/throopw
Paul Ciszek
In article <12470...@sheol.org>, Wayne Throop <thr...@sheol.org> wrote:
>: djh...@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt)
>: Jryy, jr jrer jbaqrevat jurer fur jnf ........
>
>And of course, this means a scene change on friday.
>So we'll get to find out what Klaus has been up to.
>Or something. Won't that be nice?
>
>Well. Unless Othar shows up behind her next.
>That's possible, too.
I think the Castle may be capable of dealing with Von Pinn. It hasn't
harmed her yet, because she knows it well and vice versa, but if she
actually posed a threat to The Heterodyne, all bets are off.
Last I knew, VonPinn did not appear to have any loyalty to Agatha.
--
Please reply to: | "Any sufficiently advanced incompetence is
pciszek at panix dot com | indistinguishable from malice."
Autoreply is disabled |
Dorothy J Heydt
Paul Ciszek <nos...@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>In article <12470...@sheol.org>, Wayne Throop <thr...@sheol.org> wrote:
>>: djh...@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt)
>>: Jryy, jr jrer jbaqrevat jurer fur jnf ........
>>
>>And of course, this means a scene change on friday.
>>So we'll get to find out what Klaus has been up to.
>>Or something. Won't that be nice?
>>
>>Well. Unless Othar shows up behind her next.
>>That's possible, too.
>
>I think the Castle may be capable of dealing with Von Pinn. It hasn't
>harmed her yet, because she knows it well and vice versa, but if she
>actually posed a threat to The Heterodyne, all bets are off.
>Last I knew, VonPinn did not appear to have any loyalty to Agatha.
Last *anybody* knew, von Pinn didn't realize Agatha was a
Heterodyne. She knew there was something funny about her (a
Voice of Command); but it's just recently she found out there
was a Heterodyne in the Castle.
http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20081119
She may not know *yet*, just at the moment we first see her,
that Agatha is the Heterodyne. She'll find out. Note the
fourth panel of today's page.
Quadibloc
> And of course, this means a scene change on friday.
> So we'll get to find out what Klaus has been up to.
> Or something. Won't that be nice?
>
> Well. Unless Othar shows up behind her next.
> That's possible, too.
When there is a scene change, it won't be to Klaus until after we've
seen Othar, I would think. After all, Klaus set Othar in motion. If
nothing comes of it before going back to Klaus, that will be sort of
anticlimactic or something.
I suppose a scene change is possible on Friday, since we're now kept
on the edge of our seats, but I am hoping not.
John Savard
Derek Lyons
>Last *anybody* knew, von Pinn didn't realize Agatha was a
>Heterodyne. She knew there was something funny about her (a
>Voice of Command); but it's just recently she found out there
>was a Heterodyne in the Castle.
>
>http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20081119
>
>She may not know *yet*, just at the moment we first see her,
>that Agatha is the Heterodyne. She'll find out. Note the
>fourth panel of today's page.
However, despite the fact she was (presumably) commanded to have
loyalty to a specific (and now dead) Hetrodyne, von Pinn is a
*Mongfish* construct. Lucrezia's construct.
This squares with the fact that we have no evidence to date that she
retains any loyalty to the Heterodyne line - only that she reacted to
Agatha's *Mongfish* derived Voice Of Command.
D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.
http://derekl1963.livejournal.com/
-Resolved: To be more temperate in my postings.
Oct 5th, 2004 JDL
Joel Polowin
> However, despite the fact she was (presumably) commanded to have
> loyalty to a specific (and now dead) Hetrodyne, von Pinn is a
> *Mongfish* construct. Lucrezia's construct.
>
> This squares with the fact that we have no evidence to date that she
> retains any loyalty to the Heterodyne line - only that she reacted to
> Agatha's *Mongfish* derived Voice Of Command.
I wonder if von Pinn's behaviour is partly due to having been given
Orders which she hated having to follow, during the Other's attack
on the Castle.
Wayne Throop
: Last *anybody* knew, von Pinn didn't realize Agatha was a
: Heterodyne. She knew there was something funny about her (a
: Voice of Command); but it's just recently she found out there
: was a Heterodyne in the Castle.
:
: http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20081119
:
: She may not know *yet*, just at the moment we first see her,
: that Agatha is the Heterodyne. She'll find out. Note the
: fourth panel of today's page.
Von Pinn has been aware that Agatha is Lucrezia and Bill's
daughter ever since she minced Punch and Judy. There has been
speculation about just what she meant by "she is MINE!", and
her protest when Judy threw Agatha to safety.
Here she consciously realizes Agatha is Lucrezia's daughter,
and Klaus opines she is either Bill or Barry's daughter:
http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20040802
here Judy mentions that "Barry came back"
http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20040809
and therefore, Von Pinn is aware Punch and Judy was raising her
on assignment from actual Heterodynes. Her information is considerably
more solid than just "something funny". On the other hand, she
is only recently aware there is a Heterodyne *in* *residence*,
but I fully expect she realized there had to be a Heterodyne in
residence when the Torchmen attacked Castle Wulfenbach, and she
hitched a ride fully expecting to find Agatha there.
So the real question at this point is, what did Von Pinn mean by
"she is MINE!", and is she a conscious Lucrezia minion (or has
sophisticated programming and/or recent information), so will she
a) attack Agatha
b) join Agatha as a minion
c) respond to her programing, explicit recent orders, or
general background information about Lucrezia's plans
(perhaps as conscious sleeper-agent), and remove the locket
d) other
And so, I conclude the scene will now change.
Just out of the Principle of Maximum Frustration that the Foglios
seem to follow when plotting such things out.
Lord Vetinari
news:KMG3F...@kithrup.com...
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> Well, we were wondering where she was ........
I've somehow managed to get some years behind. Dhamn. How did THAT happen?
Dorothy J Heydt
Well, we haven't seen her in action since the end of Book
Three, when she and Bang did each other some noticeable
damage and Klaus knocked 'em both out. Bang reappeared not
much later, thoroughly mended (the _Castle Wulfenbach_ has good
medics), but we didn't see von Pinn again till the end of
Book Eight,
http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20081117
http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20081119
when she somehow escaped from the _Wulfenbach,_ hitched a
ride down with a couple of Torchmen, and returned to Castle
Heterodyne. We haven't seen her since, till now.
Wayne Throop
: I've somehow managed to get some years behind.
Common problem. One day you find ten years have got behind you.
The problem of course is that no one told you when to run.
Joy Beeson
wrote:
> so will she
>
> a) attack Agatha
> b) join Agatha as a minion
> c) respond to her programing, explicit recent orders, or
> general background information about Lucrezia's plans
> (perhaps as conscious sleeper-agent), and remove the locket
> d) other
Friday's installment reveals that her intentions are worse than all of
those put together.
--
Joy Beeson
joy beeson at comcast dot net
Dorothy J Heydt
However, von Pinn probably knows that Gil's been spending the
intervening time putting Punch and Judy back together. If
she has the humanity (or pseudo-humanity) to tell Agatha
that, they might come to an agreement.
Joy Beeson
Heydt) wrote:
> However, von Pinn probably knows that Gil's been spending the
> intervening time putting Punch and Judy back together. If
> she has the humanity (or pseudo-humanity) to tell Agatha
> that, they might come to an agreement.
What gave me the shudders was Von Pinn's declaration that she'd come
to keep Agatha SAFE.
Perhaps she can be distracted by pointing out that if she wants babies
to nursemaid, Gil has to survive his wounds.
Quadibloc
> However, von Pinn probably knows that Gil's been spending the
> intervening time putting Punch and Judy back together. If
> she has the humanity (or pseudo-humanity) to tell Agatha
> that, they might come to an agreement.
I have no reason to think that von Pinn has any knowledge of that. Gil
tried to keep it a secret from Klaus and failed, yes, but that doesn't
mean that it was general knowledge. So presumably Gil kept it a
secret; Klaus managed to find out, but that means that only Klaus, and
whoever acted as Klaus' eyes and ears, knows aside from Gil and his
confederates like Wooster.
It would have been hard for Gil to think he had kept the secret from
Klaus if von Pinn was pounding on the heavily barred door of his
medical lab, screaming to get in, so she could complete her work...
John Savard
Dorothy J Heydt
Quadibloc <jsa...@ecn.ab.ca> wrote:
>On Jul 10, 12:01�am, djhe...@kithrup.com (Dorothy J Heydt) wrote:
>
>> However, von Pinn probably knows that Gil's been spending the
>> intervening time putting Punch and Judy back together. �If
>> she has the humanity (or pseudo-humanity) to tell Agatha
>> that, they might come to an agreement.
>
>I have no reason to think that von Pinn has any knowledge of that. Gil
>tried to keep it a secret from Klaus and failed, yes, but that doesn't
>mean that it was general knowledge. So presumably Gil kept it a
>secret; Klaus managed to find out, but that means that only Klaus, and
>whoever acted as Klaus' eyes and ears,
Which group may include von Pinn.
knows aside from Gil and his
>confederates like Wooster.
>
>It would have been hard for Gil to think he had kept the secret from
>Klaus if von Pinn was pounding on the heavily barred door of his
>medical lab, screaming to get in, so she could complete her work...
Maybe.
Wayne Throop
:: Klaus if von Pinn was pounding on the heavily barred door of his
:: medical lab, screaming to get in, so she could complete her work...
: Maybe.
Yeah, maybe. But I suspect Von Pinn wouldn't have done anything to them
if they hadn't been trying to keep her away from Agatha. So after Agatha
left, she has no particular motive to seek them out to attack them, hence
no motive to pound on the door. And Klaus has no particular motive not
to tell Von Pinn (or at least not that one), and might even inform her,
either as a general information resource, or specifically to keep tabs on
them in case they did recovered enough to take up anti-Klaus activities,
to contain them (since she's demonstrated that she's more able to contain
them than anybody else who's tried).
So. One could argue either way. It's entirely possible that Klaus never
told her (and of course, I expect Gil never told anybody but Wooster,
if he could help it... Klaus is perfectly capable of deducing Gil's
working on Punch and Judy by what medical supplies he requisitions, as
he deduced Beetle had a Hive Engine). But it's equally possible that,
as he told Dupree offhandedly, he might have told Von Pinn somewhat more
on-handedly, as a check-and-balance.
Of course, it's also entirely possible that "keep you... SAFE",
means she has to preserve her body for Lucrezia to use presently.
"Safe" is sucn an ambiguous word, in such a context...
as is "you".
Paul Ciszek
In article <9fle55liakbrfs5is...@4ax.com>,
Not really. Other possible sperm donors exist, and in any case, the
castle has plenty of bio-labs--the relevant parts could be preserved
if needed.
Wayne Throop
:: babies to nursemaid, Gil has to survive his wounds.
: nos...@nospam.com (Paul Ciszek)
: Not really. Other possible sperm donors exist, and in any case, the
: castle has plenty of bio-labs--the relevant parts could be preserved
: if needed.
Then too, Agatha really ought to keep in mind that Zeetha, Theo,
Slepinir, Violetta, Moloch, and Tarvek (and misc others) are somwhere
in the castle... and we can hope not somewhere that happens to be in
the incandescent tunnel she just cut to some rather large depth *into*
the castle. Lest (wrt, say, Tarvek) she run out of sperm donors.
Not to mention the castle itself, of course.
On the other hand, wrt Von Pinn's "I see I must also teach you manners",
I think Agatha can reasonably ask what kind of manners Von Pinn herself
exemplifies. Was it really polite to shred her parents right in front
of her?
"Time to clean the caaaaaaaaa-stle!" --- Dave the Barbarian
Brenda Clough
> However, von Pinn probably knows that Gil's been spending the
> intervening time putting Punch and Judy back together.
>
Reference?
Brenda
--
---------
Brenda W. Clough
http://www.sff.net/people/Brenda/
My novel REVISE THE WORLD is now appearing at
www.bookviewcafe.com
Dorothy J Heydt
Brenda Clough <clo...@erols.com> wrote:
>Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>
>> However, von Pinn probably knows that Gil's been spending the
>> intervening time putting Punch and Judy back together.
>>
>
>
>Reference?
Indicating that she *does* know? None. But she's been
hanging around the Castle Wulfenbach ever since Klaus put
*her* back together, and she doesn't have children to care
for any more. She's had a lot of time on her hands. Time
for snooping around. Note, I said *probably.*
Wayne Throop
:: intervening time putting Punch and Judy back together.
: Brenda Clough <clo...@erols.com>
: Reference?
Well afaik, Von Pinn was offscreen, and unmentioned, since before
Gil took up that task, until she arrived at Castle Heterodyne.
And so the only hint that she "probably knows" is that she was
on Castle Wulfenbach during Gil's entire project, up to the
point when Gil left for the Mechanicsburg hospital to see Klaus.
Near as I can tell.
Well... Von Pinn was *mentioned*, I suppose, wrt her activities
from 19 or so years ago, during the Other's alleged attack on
Castele Heterodyne. Oh... and that "Klaus always did know the right
monster for the right job" crack of Von Mekkhan's, but again that is a mention
of her assignment prior to Gil's project. No mention of what
she was doing between Agatha's leaving CW and reaching CH.
Again, naict.
Derek Lyons
>:: It would have been hard for Gil to think he had kept the secret from
>:: Klaus if von Pinn was pounding on the heavily barred door of his
>:: medical lab, screaming to get in, so she could complete her work...
>
>: Maybe.
>
>Yeah, maybe. But I suspect Von Pinn wouldn't have done anything to them
>if they hadn't been trying to keep her away from Agatha. So after Agatha
>left, she has no particular motive to seek them out to attack them, hence
>no motive to pound on the door. And Klaus has no particular motive not
>to tell Von Pinn (or at least not that one), and might even inform her,
>either as a general information resource, or specifically to keep tabs on
>them in case they did recovered enough to take up anti-Klaus activities,
>to contain them (since she's demonstrated that she's more able to contain
>them than anybody else who's tried).
I rather suspect Klaus wants to play the whole thing close to the vest
in order to keep the knowledge of Punch and Judy, as well as Agatha's
true identity, from the Jaegers.
>So. One could argue either way. It's entirely possible that Klaus never
>told her (and of course, I expect Gil never told anybody but Wooster,
>if he could help it... Klaus is perfectly capable of deducing Gil's
>working on Punch and Judy by what medical supplies he requisitions, as
>he deduced Beetle had a Hive Engine). But it's equally possible that,
>as he told Dupree offhandedly, he might have told Von Pinn somewhat more
>on-handedly, as a check-and-balance.
Assuming he keeps as close a tab on Gil as he does one someone already
under suspicion.
Wayne Throop
: Assuming he keeps as close a tab on Gil as he does one someone already
: under suspicion.
I expect he kept very very close track of Gil.
He has been evaluating Gil as his successor, right up until the
bit in the hospital when he says "no more tests, my son,
the time for such things is over". That being the case,
until recently I expect he spent quite a lot of time trying
to get inside Gil's head, and had him under close surveillance.
Derek Lyons
>: fair...@gmail.com (Derek Lyons)
>: Assuming he keeps as close a tab on Gil as he does one someone already
>: under suspicion.
>
>I expect he kept very very close track of Gil.
>He has been evaluating Gil as his successor, right up until the
>bit in the hospital when he says "no more tests, my son,
>the time for such things is over". That being the case,
>until recently I expect he spent quite a lot of time trying
>to get inside Gil's head, and had him under close surveillance.
I expect it too, but we've seen no evidence of it - witness Klaus's
suprise over Gil mooning over Agatha as evidence otherwise.
Brenda Clough
> thr...@sheol.org (Wayne Throop) wrote:
>
>> : fair...@gmail.com (Derek Lyons)
>> : Assuming he keeps as close a tab on Gil as he does one someone already
>> : under suspicion.
>>
>> I expect he kept very very close track of Gil.
>> He has been evaluating Gil as his successor, right up until the
>> bit in the hospital when he says "no more tests, my son,
>> the time for such things is over". That being the case,
>> until recently I expect he spent quite a lot of time trying
>> to get inside Gil's head, and had him under close surveillance.
>
> I expect it too, but we've seen no evidence of it - witness Klaus's
> suprise over Gil mooning over Agatha as evidence otherwise.
>
> D.
And, as with Barack Obama, it's not like Klaus doesn't have other things
to do.
Wayne Throop
:: head, and had him under close surveillance.
: fair...@gmail.com (Derek Lyons)
: I expect it too, but we've seen no evidence of it - witness Klaus's
: suprise over Gil mooning over Agatha as evidence otherwise.
I tenatively conclude that only indicates Klaus doesnt understand romance
very well (or at least has a skewed view of it), and thus misinterprets
things in that context. There's some evidence of this, eg, the "every
girl I've known with the spark has tried to kill me" scene.
This is probably not as much of a handicap in term of understanding
the sorts of situations he normally is dealing with. How often does
True Love come up as a crucial factor in high stakes powermongering,
anyways?
Dorothy J Heydt
Seldom. Till now. If Agatha can ever get things (de Kessel,
Mechanicsburg, Klaus, Europa) sufficiently stabilized that
she has a chance to rest, EAT, take a shower, get her minor
wounds bandaged, and catch her breath, then the first
opportunity for the tender sentiments to take a part in
Weltpolitik may arrive.
Derek Lyons
Robert Carnegie
> In article <vSP5m.1892$P5....@nwrddc02.gnilink.net>,
> Brenda Clough <clo...@erols.com> wrote:
>
> >Dorothy J Heydt wrote:
>
> >> However, von Pinn probably knows that Gil's been spending the
> >> intervening time putting Punch and Judy back together.
>
> >Reference?
>
> Indicating that she *does* know? None. But she's been
> hanging around the Castle Wulfenbach ever since Klaus put
> *her* back together, and she doesn't have children to care
> for any more. She's had a lot of time on her hands. Time
> for snooping around. Note, I said *probably.*
It's not common knowledge, or Gil would have known through /his/ spies
that his secret wasn't secret. On the other hand, maybe he did know.
We only know that Klaus told Dupree that Gil thought that he - Klaus -
didn't know. Maybe Gil was happy with the situation as long as he was
being allowed to continue the project.
By the way, I don't remember Von Pinn needing put back together,
unless Dupree chopped her after the business with Zulenna (I should
remember how that scene went) or unless she had some repairs done to
herself (she's a construct of course) when she did join up.
I don't recall whether Punch and Judy knew Von Pinn. They retired
from working for the Heterodynes and adventuring with them, but I
assume they were all at the wedding?
Some of this is half-remembered from "Secret Blueprints", which isn't
quite canon.
Wayne Throop
: By the way, I don't remember Von Pinn needing put back together,
: unless Dupree chopped her after the business with Zulenna (I should
: remember how that scene went) or unless she had some repairs done to
: herself (she's a construct of course) when she did join up.
Dupree stuck her sword straight through Von Pinn's hand. Or rather,
Von Pinn pinned Dupree's sword hand by impaling *her* hand onto
Dupree's sword. It is not clear, however, whether that would need
*repair*, or whether Von Pinn is self-repairing to that extent.
Dupree also cut Von Pinn's shoulder, though not too badly since that's
the same hand she used to pinn Dupree's sword.
Dupree, of course, needed some broken bones fixed; probably sparkishly
repaired, rather than healed, since healing would take a long time.
She seemed fully recovered when menacing the townspeople. Oh, of course!
Her zappy thing was on that hand, and Gil said it was a medical device!
Well duh.
But anyways, seems Dupree's hand was more damanged than Von Pinn's,
given that the one is a through-and-through slice, vs crushed bones.
"I live with pain. I use it. *Cultivate* it. *Shape* it."
--- Von Pinn to Dupree
http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20040903
"That is a *medical* device, not a weapon!"
"So I tweaked it a bit. I like it *better* this way."
--- Gil and Dupree
http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20041231