Eddison v. Tolkien

[mimus]

From

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E._R._Eddison

"Tolkien generally approved Eddison's literary style, but found the
underlying philosophy rebarbative; while Eddison in turn thought
Tolkien's views 'soft' "

with the only reference given a letter of Tolkien's, from _ Letters _
(1981), Letter #199 .

Any more on this highly amusing clash?

Tolkien seems to've been fairly orthodox in opinion, while Eddison
actually found a way to make Spinoza's philosophy even more deranged,
by grafting it onto Greco-Roman polytheism, and subordinating it all
to his own dyadic philosophy, but while Tolkien's language is clear
and often beautiful, Eddison's is frequently (and appropriately)
_titanic_.

But both men, in their philosophies and writings, were quite damnably
aristocratic, at least implying the ludicrous philosophy that virtue
is hereditary.

--

Because She is turned virtuous,
shall there be no more blood to suck?

< _ A Fish Dinner in Memison _,
spoken of Aphrodite by Anthea, an oread
who frequently pads around in the form of a lynx

[[tor] Checkmate]

Warning! Always wear ANSI approved safety goggles when reading posts by
Checkmate!

First, check out what mimus said:


>
> From
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E._R._Eddison
>
> "Tolkien generally approved Eddison's literary style, but found the
> underlying philosophy rebarbative; while Eddison in turn thought
> Tolkien's views 'soft' "
>
> with the only reference given a letter of Tolkien's, from _ Letters _
> (1981), Letter #199 .
>
> Any more on this highly amusing clash?
>
> Tolkien seems to've been fairly orthodox in opinion, while Eddison
> actually found a way to make Spinoza's philosophy even more deranged,
> by grafting it onto Greco-Roman polytheism, and subordinating it all
> to his own dyadic philosophy, but while Tolkien's language is clear
> and often beautiful, Eddison's is frequently (and appropriately)
> _titanic_.
>
> But both men, in their philosophies and writings, were quite damnably
> aristocratic, at least implying the ludicrous philosophy that virtue
> is hereditary.

I always suspected that about those two.

--
Checkmate
KotAGoR XXXIV
AUK Hammer of Thor award, Feb. 2012
co-winner, Pierre Salinger Memorial Hook,
Line & Sinker award, May 2001
Copyright © 2012
all rights reserved

____________________________________________________________________

A new revelation from David Keeting the Assworm:

"there's not much you can tell me about the boner that i don't know
already."

Message-ID: <JO6dnTGAR5mq6MPN...@giganews.com>
____________________________________________________________________

Uncle Steve learns about pigs:

<US> How much money have you spent paying off the PIGS?

<CM> The pigs have no use for money. They're content to eat table scraps
and forage for truffles.

<US> I keep forgetting you've been doing this for so long that it's easy
for you. I can't wait to piss on your grave.

Regards,
Uncle Steve

Message-ID: <b18ab6cb2c...@gmail.com>
____________________________________________________________________

[tard] Phoenix swallows the hook, the line, the sinker, and half of the
pole:

<CM> Watch the stupid cunt ask what 1337 means...

<JD> That is exactly what I am expecting.

<CM> ROT 1337... it'll make you dizzy!

<Tard> Did... did you just tell someone to attempt to ROT-13 *numbers*,
you Clueless Newbie of the Month candidate?

BWAHAHAHAHA!!!!!! Even when we warned him first, he still fell for it!

Message-ID: <k3ae35$prb$1...@news.mixmin.net>
_____________________________________________________________________

[mimus]

On Sep 27, 2:43 pm, "[tor] Checkmate" <LunaticFri...@The.Edge> wrote:

> Warning!  Always wear ANSI approved safety goggles when reading posts by
> Checkmate!
>
> First, check out what mimus said:
>
> > From
>
> >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E._R._Eddison
>
> > "Tolkien generally approved Eddison's literary style, but found the
> > underlying philosophy rebarbative; while Eddison in turn thought
> > Tolkien's views 'soft' "
>
> > with the only reference given a letter of Tolkien's, from _ Letters _
> > (1981), Letter #199 .
>
> > Any more on this highly amusing clash?
>
> > Tolkien seems to've been fairly orthodox in opinion, while Eddison
> > actually found a way to make Spinoza's philosophy even more deranged,
> > by grafting it onto Greco-Roman polytheism, and subordinating it all
> > to his own dyadic philosophy, but while Tolkien's language is clear
> > and often beautiful, Eddison's is frequently (and appropriately)
> > _titanic_.
>
> > But both men, in their philosophies and writings, were quite damnably
> > aristocratic, at least implying the ludicrous philosophy that virtue
> > is hereditary.
>
> I always suspected that about those two.

Put up ya favorite quote from ERE or shaddap.

--

Everyone always seems to remember, somewhat jumpily,
Anthea . . . .

[[tor] Checkmate]

I can't be assed to do it. I'm a very busy man. Now stop bothering me.

[dave hillstrom]

who?

history is written by the victorious, so im guessing ERE lost.

--
dave hillstrom mhm15x4 meow

[mimus]

On Oct 2, 11:24 pm, dave hillstrom <d...@meow.org> wrote:

He died before he could finish his trilogy.

Not that the third book, _ The Mezentian Gate _, isn't pretty gripping
even unfinished.

--

It's on the web. The _ Fish Dinner _ isn't. Figures.

[art...@yahoo.com]

I need to learn to spell. I was thinking this was Edison Vs Tolkien.
But I suspect Gandalf would have favored Tesla.

[William December Starr]

In article <ccaf294f-6ff8-4a8b...@u19g2000yqo.googlegroups.com>,

"art...@yahoo.com" <art...@yahoo.com> said:

> I need to learn to spell. I was thinking this was Edison Vs
> Tolkien. But I suspect Gandalf would have favored Tesla.

Wouldn't Gandalf have hated them both, under the "Technological
advancement is EVIL!" doctrine?

-- wds

[William Hyde]

On Oct 7, 7:48 pm, wdst...@panix.com (William December Starr) wrote:
> In article <ccaf294f-6ff8-4a8b-9d2d-236033aa3...@u19g2000yqo.googlegroups.com>,

> "art...@yahoo.com" <art...@yahoo.com> said:
>
> > I need to learn to spell. I was thinking this was Edison Vs
> > Tolkien.  But I suspect Gandalf would have favored Tesla.
>
> Wouldn't Gandalf have hated them both, under the "Technological
> advancement is EVIL!" doctrine?

Gandalf did wear one of the three rings. Second highest level of
technology available.

William Hyde

[Carl Dershem]

William Hyde <wthyd...@gmail.com> typed in
news:cca69e67-9995-4316-86a6-
93f301...@u19g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:

Highest level available, just not the best iteration, I'd say.
A magic ring is a magic ring - just without the override
programming that Sauron put into the ones he built/assisted
with.

Of course, it makes me wonder about the unavailable tech. What
level is a Silmaril? A Palantir?

cd

[Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)]

On 10/8/12 12:43 PM, Carl Dershem wrote:
> William Hyde <wthyd...@gmail.com> typed in
> news:cca69e67-9995-4316-86a6-
> 93f301...@u19g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:
>
>> On Oct 7, 7:48 pm, wdst...@panix.com (William December Starr)
> wrote:
>>> In article
>>> <ccaf294f-6ff8-4a8b-9d2d-236033aa3...
> @u19g2000yqo.googlegroups
>> .com>,
>>> "art...@yahoo.com" <art...@yahoo.com> said:
>>>
>>>> I need to learn to spell. I was thinking this was Edison Vs
>>>> Tolkien. But I suspect Gandalf would have favored Tesla.
>>>
>>> Wouldn't Gandalf have hated them both, under the
> "Technological
>>> advancement is EVIL!" doctrine?
>>
>> Gandalf did wear one of the three rings. Second highest level
> of
>> technology available.
>>
>> William Hyde
>
> Highest level available, just not the best iteration, I'd say.

I think they were referring to TECHNOLOGY, not MAGIC. I.e., engines and
mills and explosives and all that; only the bad guys were shown to be
using any such things. Both good guys and bad guys used whatever magic
they could get their hands on (that wasn't poisoned at the well by the
creator, that is).


--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Website: http://www.grandcentralarena.com Blog:
http://seawasp.livejournal.com

[mimus]

On Oct 7, 7:48 pm, wdst...@panix.com (William December Starr) wrote:

> In article <ccaf294f-6ff8-4a8b-9d2d-236033aa3...@u19g2000yqo.googlegroups.com>,

> "art...@yahoo.com" <art...@yahoo.com> said:
>
> > I need to learn to spell. I was thinking this was Edison Vs
> > Tolkien.  But I suspect Gandalf would have favored Tesla.
>
> Wouldn't Gandalf have hated them both, under the "Technological
> advancement is EVIL!" doctrine?

Funny how swords were cool but mines and foundries were evil in that
world.

--

It apparently made it OK if dwarves and elves did the work.

[William Hyde]

On Oct 8, 12:46 pm, "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)"

<seaw...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote:
> On 10/8/12 12:43 PM, Carl Dershem wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

> > William Hyde <wthyde1...@gmail.com> typed in
> > news:cca69e67-9995-4316-86a6-
> > 93f301446...@u19g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:

>
> >> On Oct 7, 7:48 pm, wdst...@panix.com (William December Starr)
> > wrote:
> >>> In article
> >>> <ccaf294f-6ff8-4a8b-9d2d-236033aa3...
> > @u19g2000yqo.googlegroups
> >> .com>,
> >>> "art...@yahoo.com" <art...@yahoo.com> said:
>
> >>>> I need to learn to spell. I was thinking this was Edison Vs
> >>>> Tolkien.  But I suspect Gandalf would have favored Tesla.
>
> >>> Wouldn't Gandalf have hated them both, under the
> > "Technological
> >>> advancement is EVIL!" doctrine?
>
> >> Gandalf did wear one of the three rings.  Second highest level
> > of
> >> technology available.
>
> >> William Hyde
>
> > Highest level available, just not the best iteration, I'd say.
>
>         I think they were referring to TECHNOLOGY, not MAGIC. I.e., engines and
> mills and explosives and all that; only the bad guys were shown to be
> using any such things. Both good guys and bad guys used whatever magic
> they could get their hands on (that wasn't poisoned at the well by the
> creator, that is).

Ring making isn't technology that produces smokes, stinks, and the
cutting down of trees, but Tolkein is still on the whole against it.

I think that in the letters Tolkein said that the Ring symbolized the
machine. It makes you stronger, but you become dependent on it, and
if you lose it you are weaker than ever.

The Noldor were always running into trouble with their newfangled
technology. Much more virtuous were those elves who sat at the feet
of Manwe singing hosannas forever. But even Tolkein thought they
were a bore.

William Hyde

[David DeLaney]

Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor) <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote:
>Carl Dershem wrote:
>> William Hyde <wthyd...@gmail.com> typed in

>>> Gandalf did wear one of the three rings. Second highest level of
>>> technology available.
>>>
>>> William Hyde
>>
>> Highest level available, just not the best iteration, I'd say.
>
> I think they were referring to TECHNOLOGY, not MAGIC. I.e., engines and
>mills and explosives and all that; only the bad guys were shown to be
>using any such things.

The Rings were _designed and made_. That makes them technology. Magical
technology to be sure, but they're in a different category from the two Lights
sung into existence from the last flower and fruit of the Two Trees. The Rings
were made; the Silmarils were made (and were irreproducible, so Feanor may have
been an elf gadgeteer...)

Sauron even designed backdoors, and hidden control structures, into most of
them...

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from d...@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.

[Kurt Busiek]

On 2012-10-08 19:31:37 +0000, d...@gatekeeper.vic.com (David DeLaney) said:

> Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor) <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote:
>> Carl Dershem wrote:
>>> William Hyde <wthyd...@gmail.com> typed in
>>>> Gandalf did wear one of the three rings. Second highest level of
>>>> technology available.
>>>

>>> Highest level available, just not the best iteration, I'd say.
>>
>> I think they were referring to TECHNOLOGY, not MAGIC. I.e., engines and
>> mills and explosives and all that; only the bad guys were shown to be
>> using any such things.
>
> The Rings were _designed and made_. That makes them technology. Magical
> technology to be sure,

When someone says "technology, not magic," it's pretty obvious they
mean non-magical technology.

kdb
--
Visit http://www.busiek.com -- for all your Busiek needs!

[Robert Bannister]

Perhaps not the jewellery aspect of ring making, but the smelting of
gold and the whole mining process of gold and gemstones involves a lot
of nasty chemicals and generally produces a big mess. I used to work in
a gold-crushing plant where we handled the mercury amalgam tables and
the cyanide solution with our bare hands.

--
Robert Bannister

[Robert Bannister]

On 9/10/12 3:31 AM, David DeLaney wrote:
> Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor) <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> wrote:
>> Carl Dershem wrote:
>>> William Hyde <wthyd...@gmail.com> typed in
>>>> Gandalf did wear one of the three rings. Second highest level of
>>>> technology available.
>>>>
>>>> William Hyde
>>>
>>> Highest level available, just not the best iteration, I'd say.
>>
>> I think they were referring to TECHNOLOGY, not MAGIC. I.e., engines and
>> mills and explosives and all that; only the bad guys were shown to be
>> using any such things.
>
> The Rings were _designed and made_. That makes them technology. Magical
> technology to be sure, but they're in a different category from the two Lights
> sung into existence from the last flower and fruit of the Two Trees. The Rings
> were made; the Silmarils were made (and were irreproducible, so Feanor may have
> been an elf gadgeteer...)

Moreover, a number of trades were involved in magic. Smithing in
general, especially the making of carbon steel a.k.a. magic swords, but
I think there was magic in wood-carving, weaving and even pottery. It
was clear to me in woodwork lessons at school that some evil magic was
at work.

--
Robert Bannister

[Rod Speed]

"Robert Bannister" <rob...@clubtelco.com> wrote in message
news:adhlg5...@mid.individual.net...

Not necessarily with the simpler forms of gold extraction.

> and generally produces a big mess. I used to work in a gold-crushing plant
> where we handled the mercury amalgam tables and the cyanide solution with
> our bare hands.

Sure, but not all gold extraction is done like that.

[Howard Brazee]

On Tue, 09 Oct 2012 11:57:48 +0800, Robert Bannister
<rob...@clubtelco.com> wrote:

>> The Rings were _designed and made_. That makes them technology. Magical
>> technology to be sure, but they're in a different category from the two Lights
>> sung into existence from the last flower and fruit of the Two Trees. The Rings
>> were made; the Silmarils were made (and were irreproducible, so Feanor may have
>> been an elf gadgeteer...)
>
>Moreover, a number of trades were involved in magic. Smithing in
>general, especially the making of carbon steel a.k.a. magic swords, but
>I think there was magic in wood-carving, weaving and even pottery. It
>was clear to me in woodwork lessons at school that some evil magic was
>at work.

The movies had big cities way in the middle of deserts - able to feed
themselves. So there had to be some significant trade to get the
food into them. What they had to offer for that food was not
obvious.

--
"In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found,
than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace
to the legislature, and not to the executive department."

- James Madison

[david.sh...@ymail.com]

On Oct 9, 12:16 pm, Howard Brazee <how...@brazee.net> wrote:
> The movies had big cities way in the middle of deserts - able to feed
> themselves.   So there had to be some significant trade to get the
> food into them.    What they had to offer for that food was not
> obvious.

I really don't recall the movies that well.
What cities were these?
Which definition of "desert" are you thinking of?
The only living city of men that appears on-scene
in the book LotR is Minas Tirith.

[Michael Stemper]

In article <k4v01q$jh4$1...@dont-email.me>, "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> writes:
>On 10/8/12 12:43 PM, Carl Dershem wrote:
>> William Hyde <wthyd...@gmail.com> typed in news:cca69e67-9995-4316-86a6- 93f301...@u19g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:
>>> On Oct 7, 7:48 pm, wdst...@panix.com (William December Starr) wrote:
>>>> In article <ccaf294f-6ff8-4a8b-9d2d-236033aa3... @u19g2000yqo.googlegroups .com>, "art...@yahoo.com" <art...@yahoo.com> said:

>>>>> I need to learn to spell. I was thinking this was Edison Vs
>>>>> Tolkien. But I suspect Gandalf would have favored Tesla.
>>>>
>>>> Wouldn't Gandalf have hated them both, under the
>> "Technological
>>>> advancement is EVIL!" doctrine?
>>>
>>> Gandalf did wear one of the three rings. Second highest level of
>>> technology available.
>>

>> Highest level available, just not the best iteration, I'd say.
>
> I think they were referring to TECHNOLOGY, not MAGIC. I.e., engines and
>mills and explosives and all that; only the bad guys were shown to be
>using any such things.

Not so. At least not in the case of mills. The Sandyman family had been
millers for generations.

> Both good guys and bad guys used whatever magic
>they could get their hands on (that wasn't poisoned at the well by the
>creator, that is).

And sometimes even if it was.

--
Michael F. Stemper
#include <Standard_Disclaimer>
Life's too important to take seriously.

[Michael Stemper]

In article <81be76f6-cf27-45ac...@i14g2000yqe.googlegroups.com>, david.sh...@ymail.com writes:

>On Oct 9, 12:16=A0pm, Howard Brazee <how...@brazee.net> wrote:

>> The movies had big cities way in the middle of deserts - able to feed

>> themselves. =A0 So there had to be some significant trade to get the
>> food into them. =A0 =A0What they had to offer for that food was not

>> obvious.
>
>I really don't recall the movies that well.

I watched _The Return of the King_ last night.

>What cities were these?
>Which definition of "desert" are you thinking of?

I was wondering those as well.

>The only living city of men that appears on-scene
>in the book LotR is Minas Tirith.

What about Edoras? It wasn't big, but it was the only city of any type
for many leagues.

[Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)]

On 10/9/12 1:31 PM, Michael Stemper wrote:
> In article <k4v01q$jh4$1...@dont-email.me>, "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> writes:
>> On 10/8/12 12:43 PM, Carl Dershem wrote:
>>> William Hyde <wthyd...@gmail.com> typed in news:cca69e67-9995-4316-86a6- 93f301...@u19g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:
>>>> On Oct 7, 7:48 pm, wdst...@panix.com (William December Starr) wrote:
>>>>> In article <ccaf294f-6ff8-4a8b-9d2d-236033aa3... @u19g2000yqo.googlegroups .com>, "art...@yahoo.com" <art...@yahoo.com> said:
>
>>>>>> I need to learn to spell. I was thinking this was Edison Vs
>>>>>> Tolkien. But I suspect Gandalf would have favored Tesla.
>>>>>
>>>>> Wouldn't Gandalf have hated them both, under the
>>> "Technological
>>>>> advancement is EVIL!" doctrine?
>>>>
>>>> Gandalf did wear one of the three rings. Second highest level of
>>>> technology available.
>>>
>>> Highest level available, just not the best iteration, I'd say.
>>
>> I think they were referring to TECHNOLOGY, not MAGIC. I.e., engines and
>> mills and explosives and all that; only the bad guys were shown to be
>> using any such things.
>
> Not so. At least not in the case of mills. The Sandyman family had been
> millers for generations.
>

But that was a nice ordinary mill, not the (steam powered?) Evil Mill
that Sharkey and his mates installed.

>> Both good guys and bad guys used whatever magic
>> they could get their hands on (that wasn't poisoned at the well by the
>> creator, that is).
>
> And sometimes even if it was.
>

Fortunately they avoided using the really poisoned one. Barely.

[david.sh...@ymail.com]

On Oct 9, 1:56 pm, mstem...@walkabout.empros.com (Michael Stemper)
wrote:

> In article <81be76f6-cf27-45ac-a0d6-ca5648cb7...@i14g2000yqe.googlegroups.com>, david.shallcr...@ymail.com writes:
>
> >The only living city of men that appears on-scene
> >in the book LotR is Minas Tirith.
>
> What about Edoras? It wasn't big, but it was the only city of any type
> for many leagues.

You're right. We don't get anywhere near as much of
a feeling of civic life in Edoras as in Minas Tirith,
but it was a city. I guess I was being influenced
by Wormtongue, there.

[Kurt Busiek]

Edoras is a hill fort, pretty much. Not a city so much as a big
house/estate with support buildings.

And it's not in a desert, but in grasslands, prairie, steppe.

[david.sh...@ymail.com]

On Oct 9, 3:36 pm, Kurt Busiek <k...@busiek.com> wrote:

> On 2012-10-09 19:20:00 +0000, david.shallcr...@ymail.com said:
>
> > On Oct 9, 1:56 pm, mstem...@walkabout.empros.com (Michael Stemper)
> > wrote:
> >> In article <81be76f6-cf27-45ac-a0d6-ca5648cb7...@i14g2000yqe.googlegroups
> > .com>, david.shallcr...@ymail.com writes:
>
> >>> The only living city of men that appears on-scene
> >>> in the book LotR is Minas Tirith.
>
> >> What about Edoras? It wasn't big, but it was the only city of any type
> >> for many leagues.
>
> > You're right.  We don't get anywhere near as much of
> > a feeling of civic life in Edoras as in Minas Tirith,
> > but it was a city.  I guess I was being influenced
> > by Wormtongue, there.
>
> Edoras is a hill fort, pretty much. Not a city so much as a big
> house/estate with support buildings.

A bit more than that. From the chapter
?The King of the Golden Hall":

"The dark gates were swung open. The travellers
entered, walking in file behind their guide. They
found a broad path, paved with hewn stones, now
winding upward, now climbing in short flights of
well-laid steps. Many houses built of wood and
many dark doors they passed. Beside the way in
a stone channel a stream of clear water flowed,
sparkling and chattering. At length they came to
the crown of the hill."

Later in this chapter Edoras is called a town
several times. So, not a city, but more than
a hill fort. Winding the thread back a bit,
Edoras is not a city in a desert -- it's a
bit small to be a city, and on the border
between the foothills of the White Mountains,
populated with hamlets and more isolated
homesteads, and the open grasslands of the
plain, so not in a desert in either sense.
(I'm agreeing with Kurt here.)
Economically it can get by as a seat of
government, i.e., on taxes and user fees,
and as a market town for the nearby farmers
and stock-herders. No need to develop
an electric power infrastructure, neither
AC nor DC. (Getting back to Edison and Tesla.)

[Michael Stemper]

In article <k51qcs$epd$1...@dont-email.me>, "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> writes:
>On 10/9/12 1:31 PM, Michael Stemper wrote:
>> In article <k4v01q$jh4$1...@dont-email.me>, "Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)" <sea...@sgeinc.invalid.com> writes:
>>> On 10/8/12 12:43 PM, Carl Dershem wrote:
>>>> William Hyde <wthyd...@gmail.com> typed in news:cca69e67-9995-4316-86a6- 93f301...@u19g2000yqo.googlegroups.com:

>>>>> Gandalf did wear one of the three rings. Second highest level of
>>>>> technology available.
>>>>
>>>> Highest level available, just not the best iteration, I'd say.
>>>
>>> I think they were referring to TECHNOLOGY, not MAGIC. I.e., engines and
>>> mills and explosives and all that; only the bad guys were shown to be
>>> using any such things.
>>
>> Not so. At least not in the case of mills. The Sandyman family had been
>> millers for generations.
>
> But that was a nice ordinary mill, not the (steam powered?) Evil Mill
>that Sharkey and his mates installed.

The mill that they put in was not described as anything but bigger. Since
there wasn't any more grain to grind, this was pointless, and Sandyman
was portrayed as a fool for giving up the autonomy of his father, in
order to be somebody's flunky at a bigger mill.

[Walter Bushell]

In article
<851fe5a2-a8a7-4c10...@m5g2000yql.googlegroups.com>,

We started becoming dependent on technology when we started chipping
stone.

--
This space unintentionally left blank.

[Titus G]

And started becoming dependent on religion when we justified stoning Chip.

[mimus]

On Oct 13, 5:44 pm, Walter Bushell <pr...@panix.com> wrote:

> In article
> <851fe5a2-a8a7-4c10-b5f1-51af9a6bf...@m5g2000yql.googlegroups.com>,

>
>  mimus <mimu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Oct 7, 7:48 pm, wdst...@panix.com (William December Starr) wrote:
>
> > > In article
> > > <ccaf294f-6ff8-4a8b-9d2d-236033aa3...@u19g2000yqo.googlegroups.com>,
> > > "art...@yahoo.com" <art...@yahoo.com> said:
>
> > > > I need to learn to spell. I was thinking this was Edison Vs
> > > > Tolkien. But I suspect Gandalf would have favored Tesla.
>
> > > Wouldn't Gandalf have hated them both, under the "Technological
> > > advancement is EVIL!" doctrine?
>
> > Funny how swords were cool but mines and foundries were evil in that
> > world.
>

> > It apparently made it OK if dwarves and elves did the work.
>
> We started becoming dependent on technology when we started chipping
> stone.

Things started going downhill after the Eolithic, eh?

--

Leaning to talk but not how to stop was bad, too.

[Rod Speed]

Walter Bushell <pr...@panix.com> wrote
> mimus <mim...@gmail.com> wrote

>> wdst...@panix.com (William December Starr) wrote

>>> art...@yahoo.com <art...@yahoo.com> wrote

>>>> I need to learn to spell. I was thinking this was Edison Vs
>>>> Tolkien. But I suspect Gandalf would have favored Tesla.

>>> Wouldn't Gandalf have hated them both, under
>>> the "Technological advancement is EVIL!" doctrine?

>> Funny how swords were cool but mines and foundries were evil in that
>> world.

>> It apparently made it OK if dwarves and elves did the work.

> We started becoming dependent on technology when we started chipping
> stone.

Way before that in fact, when we started to use digging sticks and wood for
weapons etc.

[Christopher J. Henrich]

In article
<2893ae51-ca56-4c32...@q16g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>,

mimus <mim...@gmail.com> wrote:

> >
> > We started becoming dependent on technology when we started chipping
> > stone.
>
> Things started going downhill after the Eolithic, eh?
>

That had to wait for the invention of the wheel.

--
Chris Henrich
http://www.mathinteract.com
The total lack of evidence is the surest sign that the conspiracy is working.

[mimus]

On Oct 15, 11:53 pm, "Christopher J. Henrich" <chenr...@monmouth.com>
wrote:

> In article
> <2893ae51-ca56-4c32-83eb-98841c3e5...@q16g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>,

> mimus <mimu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > We started becoming dependent on technology when we started chipping
> > > stone.
>
> > Things started going downhill after the Eolithic, eh?
>
> That had to wait for the invention of the wheel.

I wonder how many people got hurt during _that_ R&D project?

--

"OK, guys, do not stand in front of the log . . . ."

[Walter Bushell]

In article
<009b818d-1d26-4e52...@b8g2000yqh.googlegroups.com>,

First we tried square wheels. Then because we wanted to avoid the
bumps caused by the corners we tried triangular wheels. Progress
stopped while we changed the size of the triangles. Finally I came up
with the idea of pentagonal wheels. This was a great improvement, and
I was promoted to executive and spent all my time handling the budget.
Therefore I lost contact with the project, but only a few hundred
years later the wheel was finally developed.

[art...@yahoo.com]

On Oct 16, 8:05 am, Walter Bushell <pr...@panix.com> wrote:
> In article

> <009b818d-1d26-4e52-a05e-a689b0f98...@b8g2000yqh.googlegroups.com>,

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  mimus <mimu...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Oct 15, 11:53 pm, "Christopher J. Henrich" <chenr...@monmouth.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > In article
> > > <2893ae51-ca56-4c32-83eb-98841c3e5...@q16g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>,
> > > mimus <mimu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > We started becoming dependent on technology when we started chipping
> > > > > stone.
>
> > > > Things started going downhill after the Eolithic, eh?
>
> > > That had to wait for the invention of the wheel.
>
> > I wonder how many people got hurt during _that_ R&D project?
>
> > --
>
> > "OK, guys, do not stand in front of the log . . . ."
>
> First we tried square wheels. Then because we wanted to avoid the
> bumps caused by the corners we tried triangular wheels. Progress
> stopped while we changed the size of the triangles. Finally I came up
> with the idea of pentagonal wheels. This was a great improvement, and
> I was promoted to executive and spent all my time handling the budget.
> Therefore I lost contact with the project, but only a few hundred
> years later the wheel was finally developed.

They just needed to get a round tuit?

[Robert Bannister]

On 14/10/12 5:44 AM, Walter Bushell wrote:

>
> We started becoming dependent on technology when we started chipping
> stone.
>

The later change to potatoes was a great improvement especially with
fish or chicken.

--
Robert Bannister

[meowmix]

On Mon, 15 Oct 2012 23:53:49 -0400, "Christopher J. Henrich"
<chen...@monmouth.com> wrote:

>In article
><2893ae51-ca56-4c32...@q16g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>,
>mimus <mim...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> >
>> > We started becoming dependent on technology when we started chipping
>> > stone.
>>
>> Things started going downhill after the Eolithic, eh?
>>
>That had to wait for the invention of the wheel.

invention or invasion?


--

mhm x v i x i i i

[mimus]

On Nov 16, 11:07 am, meowmix <meow.mix@FUCK_OFF_SPAMMER_meow.org>
wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Oct 2012 23:53:49 -0400, "Christopher J. Henrich"
>

> <chenr...@monmouth.com> wrote:
>
> > In article
> > <2893ae51-ca56-4c32-83eb-98841c3e5...@q16g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>,

> > mimus <mimu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > We started becoming dependent on technology when we started chipping
> >> > stone.
>
> >> Things started going downhill after the Eolithic, eh?
>
> >That had to wait for the invention of the wheel.
>
> invention or invasion?

_ The Goblin Reservation _? only one-a Simak's I try to keep around.

--

Laumer had bugs on wheels too.

[meowmix]

On Mon, 19 Nov 2012 07:39:12 -0800 (PST), mimus <mim...@gmail.com>
wrote:

i have a copy and quite liked it.

[mimus]

On Nov 20, 3:03 pm, meowmix <meow.mix@FUCK_OFF_SPAMMER_meow.org>
wrote:

> On Mon, 19 Nov 2012 07:39:12 -0800 (PST), mimus <mimu...@gmail.com>

It's a total frolic on Simak's part, and I believe satirizes in a
number of its characters other SF writers, editors and fandom-figures
of the time it was written, although I wouldn't of course be able to
say who was supposed to be whom.

--

Shakespeare and his ghost were straight cameos, though.

[meowmix]

On Tue, 20 Nov 2012 13:06:03 -0800 (PST), mimus <mim...@gmail.com>
wrote:

i wouldn't have a clue, it was writen the year i was thrust upon this
god forsaken planet.

[mimus]

On Nov 21, 11:14 am, meowmix <meow.mix@FUCK_OFF_SPAMMER_meow.org>
wrote:

> On Tue, 20 Nov 2012 13:06:03 -0800 (PST), mimus <mimu...@gmail.com>

What did you do to deserve that?

--

Raw deal in any case.

[meowmix]

On Wed, 21 Nov 2012 08:17:58 -0800 (PST), mimus <mim...@gmail.com>
wrote:

wrong place at the wrong time would be my guess.

[Robert Carnegie]

On Tuesday, 20 November 2012 21:06:03 UTC, mimus wrote:
> On Nov 20, 3:03 pm, meowmix <meow.mix@****_OFF_SPAMMER_meow.org>
> wrote:

Er - since that unbashful malediction is liable to be seen by everybody,
wouldn't it be better to use something milder?
<meow...@despises.spam.meow.org> for example.
After all, I suppose you chose the address to have it be seen.

[Brian M. Scott]

On Thu, 22 Nov 2012 19:21:02 -0800 (PST), Robert Carnegie
<rja.ca...@excite.com> wrote in
<news:a66932c7-1311-4e32...@googlegroups.com>
in rec.arts.sf.written:

And, one assumes, to make the forceful statement that it
makes. I doubt very much that anything milder is wanted.

Brian

[Robert Carnegie]

On Friday, 23 November 2012 04:20:17 UTC, Brian M. Scott wrote:
> On Thu, 22 Nov 2012 19:21:02 -0800 (PST), Robert Carnegie <rja.ca...@excite.com>
> wrote in <news:a66932c7-1311-4e32...@googlegroups.com>
> in rec.arts.sf.written:

> > Er - since that unbashful malediction is liable to be seen by everybody,
> > wouldn't it be better to use something milder?
> > <meow...@despises.spam.meow.org> for example.
> > After all, I suppose you chose the address to have it be seen.
>
> And, one assumes, to make the forceful statement that it makes.
> I doubt very much that anything milder is wanted.

But it'll only rarely be actually seen by a spammer. On reflection,
the (evident) /real/ reason is to distort the e-mail address so that
as it stands, it can't be used to send spam e-mail; you'll need to
un-distort it to get back the original address, and that's relatively
difficult for a spammer to do, given that they want to send to thousands
of e-mail addresses to find someone to be taken in by their nasty scheme.

[meowmix]

On Wed, 21 Nov 2012 08:17:58 -0800 (PST), mimus <mim...@gmail.com>
wrote:

i wasn't able to travel back in time and stop them rutting.

now that's made me think of domonic hide. i think i'll go watch it
again. if you've not seen it, i thoroughly recomend it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Flipside_of_Dominick_Hide
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0082390/